The Nineteenth Byte

Matthew Daniels

21:00

PPCCCG SE. lmao

Programming Puzzles, Coding Challenges and Code Golf.

hyper-neutrino

why not PPCGCC

our old abbreviation was PPCG, our new one is CGCC

Matthew Daniels

oh.

okay then.

PPCGCC SE. lmao

user

Relevant codidact post

Alex bries

@hyper-neutrino doesn't coding challenges basically include code golf

CC SE should be sufficient

Matthew Daniels

fine then.

hyper-neutrino

21:04

@Alexbries yes, but not vice versa, and the majority of our site is about code-golf (and that's what we're known for)

Matthew Daniels

PPCC SE. lmao

>:(

PPCGCC SE. lmao

user

Yeah, just PP and CC would technically be correct

Wezl

just CC, programming puzzles ⊂ CC

Alex bries

yeah i guess visibillity is important

user

@MatthewDaniels If all your messages were fed into a Markov chain, it'd probably say "lmao" every other word :P

Matthew Daniels

21:04

highly furious

user

(I was making a joke. I was not JoKing)

Matthew Daniels

PP SE. lmao

no, not you.

talking about PP being the same as CC.

user

Oh ok

caird coinheringaahing

I'm tempted to set up a "I just listen and log" chatbot for TNB and do some analysis on the data :P

Matthew Daniels

I think everyone wouldn't like PP SE.

user

21:05

That'd actually be cool

Apr 27 at 12:48, by rak1507

I wonder what would happen if you trained gpt-3 on the entirety of TNB's logs

^ I really want to try this but never get around to starting on it

Matthew Daniels

which would you prefer?

PP SE or CC SE?

caird coinheringaahing

CGCC

Alex bries

guys what is the hello world of ai, if i wanted to get started?

Matthew Daniels

@caird no SE?

caird coinheringaahing

@MatthewDaniels Nah, we're basically not part of SE :P

Wezl

21:07

We([zx]l|lz)'s world!

caird coinheringaahing

They ignore us, we abuse their software. Win-win-lose-lose :P

hyper-neutrino

the SE is necessary for some things. Code Golf and Coding Challenges is pretty distinct. CGCC is enough to identify us. Math is not enough to identify Math.SE (some call it MSE but I use that to refer to Meta)

Matthew Daniels

lmao is now my character, I guess. lmao

or my avatar.

you guys know any more basic challenges?

on the main site.

caird coinheringaahing

We have lots, lemme grab my list :p

gist.github.com/cairdcoinheringaahing/…

hyper-neutrino

oh

caird coinheringaahing

21:10

@RedwolfPrograms:

> Uncaught (in promise) TypeError: Failed to execute 'appendChild' on 'Node': parameter 1 is not of type 'Node'.
at FORMAT_QUESTION (userscript.html?name=New%20Posts.user.js&id=adf68785-5515-49e1-8154-1c69a3c876da:67)
at WebSocket.ws.onmessage (userscript.html?name=New%20Posts.user.js&id=adf68785-5515-49e1-8154-1c69a3c876da:291)

hyper-neutrino

thanks that'll be very helpful for implementing my language

caird coinheringaahing

From the new challenge, New Post errored

Wezl

takes it as a compliment

800 rep for the fifth time :)

user

That's a lot of bounties (or downvotes :P)

Redwolf Programs

21:28

@cairdcoinheringaahing Did you update to 0.8.6

New Main Posts

4

Q: Guide my eyes in the right direction

Inspired by this: http://nolandc.com/smalljs/mouse_reveal/ (source). A valid answer: Takes a number \$w\$ and (assumed non-negative) integer \$x\$. Starts with an integer list with a length of \$2^w\$, initially filled with zeroes. For each number \$n\$ from \$0\$ to \$w-1\$ (inclusive), divides...

caird coinheringaahing

I think so, lemme just try updating again

Ok, I'm for sure on 0.8.6, I'll see what happens when the next question is posted

Matthew Daniels

doing fine right now. I answered 2 of those questions already.

Redwolf Programs

@cairdcoinheringaahing You'll have to reload the New Posts page too

Wezl

asking the experts

user

21:41

Looks like you can't use a personally owned Chromebook for school testing by design (@RedwolfPrograms)

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Distance between vowels Objective Given two vowels represented in single IPA characters, calculate the distance between them. Vowels Vowels are characterized by three factors: Height, backness, and roundedness. Here, all vowels have the three characteristics as integers. Unrounded vowels (z = 0) ...

Redwolf Programs

@user By design? Why's that?

user

idk, but on this presentation they showed us about digital testing, it says that they explicitly disallow personally owned Chromebooks, phones, and tablets

caird coinheringaahing

@MatthewDaniels Please check to see if there's already Python answers before posting. You've posted multiple duplicate answers

Wezl

Can someone (1), preferably with /1$/ rep, please downvote this answer?

Matthew Daniels

21:46

oh.

I feel like they're all duplicates, so I deleted them all.

hyper-neutrino

You can submit a function as an answer, btw

so for add two numbers, lambda x,y:x+y is shorter

user

You don't have to delete them - we do allow duplicates, but please try to avoid that in the future

hyper-neutrino

^

@hyper-neutrino although if it's just ints then int.__add__ is shorter

user

And if you have a shorter Python answer than the pre-existing ones, you should certainly post it

hyper-neutrino

argh. sum is better. i'm bad at this

user

21:51

@hyper-neutrino Huh, Java's Long::sum is actually shorter than Python here

caird coinheringaahing

@user sum

Matthew Daniels

@caird I don't think I'll be able to answer them without making a dupe.

I guess I'll let my answer be. :|

caird coinheringaahing

@MatthewDaniels Try finding a different language then. Here's 600+ :P

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing Didn't see HN's message :\

hyper-neutrino

well, there are new challenges every very often :P

caird coinheringaahing

21:53

Not often enough :/

user

@MatthewDaniels Vyxal's language of the month, so if you have enough answers in it, you get a bounty

caird coinheringaahing

We need more [decision-problem], [array-manipulation] and [number-theory] challenges :(

user

We probably have one of the highest answer:question ratio on SE

caird coinheringaahing

165k : 12k

user

CMC: decision-problem Should I eat vanilla or strawberry yogurt rn?

caird coinheringaahing

21:54

Yes

hyper-neutrino

cheese

Redwolf Programs

Vanilla

Save the strawberry

user

Vanilla it is

Redwolf Programs

Eat the boring one first

user

Only 1/3 of the populace voted properly

@RedwolfPrograms Wait what

Wezl

21:55

@user ~~ew not vegan~~

user

How is vanilla boring?

hyper-neutrino

vanilla is boring?

banned

Redwolf Programs

They're...basically synonyms lol

user

@Wezl :(

caird coinheringaahing

strawberry is boring

user

21:55

No

hyper-neutrino

no, vanilla is a synonym for plain, or the original

Wezl

^^^

user

Both are good

Redwolf Programs

Yeah, true. Eat strawberry, save the vanilla.

user

Or I could just eat both at once

caird coinheringaahing

21:56

everything's strawberry nowadays, and none of it tastes like actual strawberries

user

^

hyper-neutrino

very true

Matthew Daniels

vanilla's best for me. I really like it, and I'm not used to strawberry flavors.

Wezl

put the strawberry back in the ~~cow~~ tree, eat the vanilla because you can't not

caird coinheringaahing

"It's red, that mean strawberry" "But this tastes like feet" "I said strawberry"

user

21:56

Also mangoes. I love real mangoes when they're nice and sweet, but mango smoothies just feel weird

hyper-neutrino

@Wezl excuse me?

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing How do you know what feet taste like? Kinda sus ngl

Redwolf Programs

Strawberry doesn't come from cows

caird coinheringaahing

@user TNB is a kink-shame-free room :P

4

user

@hyper-neutrino "Put the strawberry back in the cow" = "Feed the cow a strawberry"

hyper-neutrino

21:57

back implies it came from the cow in the first place though...

user

@user Can anyone clear the star on this? I feel ashamed of this message

Matthew Daniels

lmao

user

@hyper-neutrino I guess the cow laughed so hard at a joke that it spat out the strawberry?

hyper-neutrino

*stars it again*

Matthew Daniels

I can't find Vyxal in TIO.

caird coinheringaahing

21:58

@user The trick is to have no shame :P

hyper-neutrino

@MatthewDaniels lyxal.pythonanywhere.com

Redwolf Programs

@user There's other options

user

@user I'm struggling to make that message make sense

hyper-neutrino

vyxal postdates when TIO was last updated, I believe

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing ಠ_ಠ

(thanks for clearing the star btw)

Matthew Daniels

21:59

is there a tutorial or something?

user

There's a github repo

caird coinheringaahing

@user I joke, but that attitude is why I no longer give a crap what other people think abut things that I enjoy (e.g. music, fashion etc.)

Wezl

@MatthewDaniels for vyxal? github.com/Lyxal/Vyxal/blob/master/docs/Tutorial.md

Redwolf Programs

1. Feed cow strawberry
2. Tell joke about SQL
3. Pick up strawberry once the cow spits it out
4. ???
5. Profit

user

@MatthewDaniels You can ask Lyxal for help here

hyper-neutrino

22:00

to quote razetime, half of the specs are in lyxal's brain and scattered around Australia, so even the docs are kinda incomplete :P

user

@RedwolfPrograms There's nothing funny about SQL

Redwolf Programs

It's funny to anyone who hasn't had to use it

caird coinheringaahing

I realised a long time that I really don't care if someone changes their view of me because I like Call Me Maybe, or watching Mamma Mia, so I should just do those things and be damned with other people

Wezl

@user that's why it's vomited

caird coinheringaahing

Although I will fight anyone who doesn't like Call Me Maybe. That shit slaps :P

user

22:01

@cairdcoinheringaahing There was an SO answer about it, so now I like it :P

caird coinheringaahing

@user I'm sorry, what?

Matthew Daniels

yeah, I'm going.

Redwolf Programs

The next BMG is May 27 at 08:00, right? I'm going to go ahead and schedule it.

Feeds

Redwolf Programs has added an event to this room's schedule.

Redwolf Programs

I set that one up to run every 12 weeks

I'll add the other 5 as necessary

hyper-neutrino

22:05

should be 12 weeks

Redwolf Programs

What should be?

You saw nothing

hyper-neutrino

wait why did i say should be 12 weeks

sorry must've fallen asleep at my keyboard and accidentally typed "should be 12 weeks"

Redwolf Programs

Happens to the best of us

hyper-neutrino

and as I've demonstrated, the worst of us too

Wezl

lol

caird coinheringaahing

22:07

yesterday, by rak1507

some people sleepwalk, you sleepbrowse se

Redwolf Programs

Nov 23 '20 at 5:45, by Redwolf Programs

Hate when I accidentally fall out of my bed and land on my keyboard, typing perfectly coherent text related to the current conversation :p

user

1395

A: What is a callback?

I just met you, And this is crazy, But here's my number (delegate), So if something happens (event), Call me, maybe (callback)?

@cairdcoinheringaahing I need to learn to be like that - I do one silly thing and my mind keeps coming back to it for the rest of the day, sometimes even weeks later

Redwolf Programs

^

lyxal

22:25

CMQ: If y'all had to summarise the last 10 hours of chat, how would you do so?

Neil

@NewMainPosts sorry, I don't understand what this question is asking for (and the answers shed no light either sadly)

@user the real problem is why do you even have vanilla or strawberry yoghurt when you should have hazelnut or black cherry

Redwolf Programs

@lyxal It was totally interesting and worth reading

Lots of relevant and useful discussion

Just kidding, this is TNB

caird coinheringaahing

@lyxal Shitposts

But that's my summary of TNB for more or less any given time period so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

lyxal

So nothing out of the ordinary

caird coinheringaahing

Well, rak did manage to solve the halting problem, and Adám devised an APL dialect that will never lose at code golf, while still being usable as a practical langauge, but nah, nothing unusual

user

22:29

@lyxal user was very funny and charming and stuff, everyone else was shitposting

@Neil Because Giant didn't have those, I don't like hazelnut, and I've never heard of black cherry

caird coinheringaahing

@user Black cherry is pretty solid ngl

Banana's usually my favourite tho

user

Solid as in it tastes great, or solid as in the state of matter? :P

caird coinheringaahing

First one, then th'other

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing I like real bananas, but banana yogurt is disgusting (at least Trader Joe's)

Matthew Daniels

soup.

gravy.

user

22:33

I'm hungry now, and I'm all out of strawberry yogurt :(

Matthew Daniels

a little fun fact: my siblings and I say that gravy is the best dip. wanna know why?

user

Why?

Matthew Daniels

it's too tasty, we dip our pizza in it as well.

yes, dipping pizza in gravy.

user

ಠ_ಠ

Redwolf Programs

I don't know how to feel about that

Wait yeah I do

N O

user

22:35

BURN THE HERETIC!

Matthew Daniels

try it. might as well change your mind.

user

This is beyond pineapple

Matthew Daniels

lmao

user

@MatthewDaniels Ha, you cannot tempt me, devil-spawn!

Matthew Daniels

am I a devil for 3 things now?

user

22:36

What are the other 2 things?

Matthew Daniels

my posting schedules, lmao, then gravy is the best dip.

user

Depends on what kind of gravy it is, I guess

Matthew Daniels

let the other TNBers know about this. lmao

user

And I don't see anything wrong with your posting schedules, unless you're talking about announcing it when you leave

Matthew Daniels

the gravy we use is the gravy from the same place the pizza is from.

yes, KFC's is the best, but they don't serve pizza.

well, except for Chizza.

not sure if it's still available here.

user

22:38

@MatthewDaniels It's confirmed, Matthew Daniels is just an elaborate plot by KFC to promote their chicken :P

Matthew Daniels

lmao

user

Frick, green is looking kinda sus

lyxal

@user you're stuff?!

user

@lyxal Yes, we all are.

I'm unique because I'm also funny, whereas y'all are just...stuff

lyxal

:o

Stuff lives on

user

22:42

Getting kinda stuffy in here

Matthew Daniels

yeah, can't seem to find the Chizza on the main site.

lyxal

I mean this kind of stuff

user

@lyxal I've seen the meme, but I don't get what that has to do with stuff :|

lyxal

@user Context: knowyourmeme.com/memes/im-stuff

user

@lyxal Yeah, not that stuff :P

hyper-neutrino

22:48

→ 18 messages moved to Sandbox

lyxal

So what's everyone doing today/for the rest of your day/while you're still awake

caird coinheringaahing

Waiting for HN to post his challenge so I can FGITW it :P

hyper-neutrino

Waiting for caird to go to sleep so I can post my challenge

lyxal

this one?

hyper-neutrino

yes

lyxal

23:03

~~Looks like I have a few hours to add oddly specific built-ins to a certain golfing language to trivially win~~

hyper-neutrino

@hyper-neutrino *waiting for Lyxal to go to sleep so I can post my challenge so someone else can FGITW it from him

lyxal

yeah you'll be waiting a while

it's 9am for me

hyper-neutrino

well if I want to avoid both you and caird FGITWing it...

doesn't look like I have an option, really

lyxal

exactly

hyper-neutrino

~~looks like i won't be posting it~~

lyxal

23:05

when I'm asleep, caird is awake. When caird is asleep, I'm awake

checkmate

caird coinheringaahing

Lyxal is clearly awake, meaning that I am 100% asleep. I hope HN doesn't post now :P

user

@hyper-neutrino Easy, ban both of them

caird coinheringaahing

Oh, CM activity on meta

Info box has been updated

5

hyper-neutrino

\o/

lyxal

oh wow I forgot I had this image on my computer:

redsus programs

hyper-neutrino

23:10

well, that was a pretty fast change :D 3 weeks from when I posted (which is a bit earlier than when I actually status-review'd it) is pretty good

caird coinheringaahing

@lyxal @hyper-neutrino Is this enough justification to kick-mute Lyxal, or is that abuse?

lyxal

@cairdcoinheringaahing this you? chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/57947233#57947233

caird coinheringaahing

@lyxal No, that's me pretending to be you :P

Aka caird coinlyxaling

lyxal

that looks cursed

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing It is abuse. Do it. :P

caird coinheringaahing

23:21

Any feedback? I'd like to post it either today or tomorrow, unless there are any big issues

Redwolf Programs

Wait, if caird kick-mutes lyxal then caird is abusing their power so caird gets removed so we need an RO so we default to lyxal so caird kicks lyxal so hard they become an RO

user

caird won't get removed if y'all don't do anything

Wezl

@lyxal staring at GNU Smalltalk and adding two more languages to my review list (smalltalk (again) and Vyxal (again))

user

Have you tried Pharo?

Wezl

@user no, can't, but I want to

caird coinheringaahing

23:22

> maybe it would be hard to find "good" languages near the end?

@hyper-neutrino Remember that being an issue with One OEIS after another? :P

Wezl

I can't really do anything graphical that's not browser-based

user

Smalltalk's one of the languages I want to learn, but the reliance on a GUI kinda turned me off

Wezl

so when I saw gst doesn't need X I wanted to look at it

it's one of the many languages that are super cool but need minor adjustments

user

Pharo feels more modern, and I'd recommend trying it if you ever can

Time to go download it again and relearn it

Wezl

(jq, k, smalltalk, scheme, befunge, prolog)

user

23:26

You have a free k implementation?

Wezl

and I have a git repo trying to fix each and every one of those

@user yeah I have kona

github.com/kevinlawler/kona

user

Thanks

Wezl

there's also ngn/k ( codeberg.org/ngn/k ), but I haven't been able to build it

user

Oh, it's k3

Matthew Daniels

breakfast is good. :)

okie

23:28

anyone have idea about mathematical brainfuck

Adám

@user ngn.bitbucket.io/k.html

Wezl

and oK ( github.com/johnearnest/ok ) online

user

@Wezl That's on TIO or someplace, right?

okie

i want to make one

user

@Adám Thanks

Matthew Daniels

23:29

why is the language's name like that?

Redwolf Programs

Yuck, jq looks awful

Wezl

why? ( I enjoy it, it's like APL but a bit worse )

Matthew Daniels

Brainfuck.

okie

@Wezl If I use ok, I will be more okie-ish

2

Matthew Daniels

lmao

caird coinheringaahing

23:30

@okie What's a "mathematical" brainfuck?

Matthew Daniels

it's like a 3rd grader learning about negative numbers.

a mathematical brainfuck. lmao

lyxal

holy heck that worked

i like these new userscripts

Redwolf Programs

what worked?

lyxal

i starred a message using /star <id>

Redwolf Programs

That sounds painful

Matthew Daniels

23:45

would you like gravy as a pizza dip?

caird coinheringaahing

I'd try it at least once

Matthew Daniels

if you like it, might as well stick with it.

Redwolf Programs

It's probably not super healthy though lol

lyxal

@MatthewDaniels sure

Matthew Daniels

seems like it, but it's still fricking delicious.

caird coinheringaahing

23:47

@RedwolfPrograms I don't have pizza often enough to have to worry about the health concerns :P

Matthew Daniels

I don't wanna fully swear here. lmao

caird coinheringaahing

Good instinct :P

We're pretty lax on swearing, so long as it isn't directed at a user, but not doing so makes the room a more pleasant palce

Matthew Daniels

I'd rather swear at my room. lmao

@cairdcoinheringaahing "palce"? how much of my language have you been learning?

I made up a language. lmao

oh no, a mod.

hyper-neutrino

@cairdcoinheringaahing pain

caird coinheringaahing

Apr 15 at 13:58, by caird coinheringaahing

Nah, I just can't type :P

Matthew Daniels

23:50

lmao

how do you guys do such messages?

hyper-neutrino

throwback to asking dennis to add like python 1

caird coinheringaahing

@MatthewDaniels SwordRage is a CGCC (among other sites) user, they're here fairly often :P

@MatthewDaniels What do you mean?

Matthew Daniels

ah, okay.

Redwolf Programs

@MatthewDaniels You can quote someone's message by pasting the link

If that's what you meant

Matthew Daniels

ok.

I remember something.

Redwolf Programs

23:52

You can get the link by clicking on the dropdown on the port side, and there should be a link labeled permalink

Matthew Daniels

3 hours ago, by Matthew Daniels

I think everyone wouldn't like PP SE.

lmao

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino I never knew there were so many different Pythons before that :P

hyper-neutrino

@cairdcoinheringaahing python 2 and python 3 exist, is it really that much of a surprise that python 1 (and python 0 though i don't think i resorted to that) exist ಠ_ಠ ;P

user

@MatthewDaniels Have you not seen HN's diamond? :P

lyxal

@MatthewDaniels frick is an acceptable word here

I know this for a fact

user

23:54

Yeah, it's not. :P

Matthew Daniels

I see it, but seeing another mod kind of scares me.

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino Python 1 was a surprise, but not that bad. The 15 different "Cython", "Jython", "PyPy", etc. for every version, that was fun :P

hyper-neutrino

@cairdcoinheringaahing wait, did that count for different versions?

@MatthewDaniels why? we don't bite that often :)

caird coinheringaahing

@MatthewDaniels Despite their username, AncientSwordRage generally uses axes when angry

user

@cairdcoinheringaahing Does PyPy have different semantics, other than performance?

Matthew Daniels

23:55

lmao

caird coinheringaahing

:P

hyper-neutrino

also Jython isn't an implementation of python

user

^

Matthew Daniels

see you guys later.

hyper-neutrino

and cython and pypy are implementations of the same core language. arguably, python isn't a language, it's a spec

Matthew Daniels

23:55

there's something I'll do.

user

@hyper-neutrino Isn't that really every language?

Neil

at last, I've finally worked out what that question is asking for

user

They're all specs, it's just on CGCC that we define them by their implementation

@Neil Too late to FGITW it, Arnauld has a 61-byter ⍨

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino I can't remember, it was 4 years ago :P

hyper-neutrino

@cairdcoinheringaahing wait what o.O

caird coinheringaahing

23:58

July 21st, 2017

Lasted until Feb 28, 2018

hyper-neutrino

wow

i remember contacting the creator of one of the sequences himself to figure out how to implement it :P

i found his email on OEIS and he even answered me on Math.SE lmao

caird coinheringaahing

This one :P

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