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5:00 AM
i fricking did it again
wondering how to delete a variable from a list in Python.
if you know the index, del a[i] works (it's a statement)
okay @hyper-neutrino it works now
a.remove(x) removes all occurrences but is in-place
thanks :D
@Razetime does this involve a modification on this or is there a better approach i should be taking?
or would that give away the solution
5:04 AM
yeah, I quit. lmao
i'm missing a built-in, aren't I
i'm using j because outputting a list was said to be acceptable
so j is to just format it nicer for the output
look at the flags/string digraphs closelt
i do ÇY in jelly all the time for similar reasons lol
@hyper-neutrino there's a flag/string digraph that centers a list
5:07 AM
lol wtf.
with C, why doesn't ‡ḢṪ↔ work?
because it doesn't like the empty item at the end
the 5 byter shows how to use the flag
i can just to get rid of the empty element then right
also i'm not clicking the link cuz if i see the solution it's not as good as trying to find stuff myself lol
You just got it though
5:09 AM
thinking about how to solve things in vyxal is very different than jelly which is my main difficulty using new languages
anyway. am now a flag abuser. :c
about time too
i haven't decided if i want to add flags to yuno or just have some basic flags to get around silly I/O
i don't want to move any of the core logic out of the bytecount into flags but stuff like "join on newlines" isn't particularly interesting or worth a byte IMO
centering a list is different IMO. but that becomes kind of arbitrary too so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ like where does one draw the line
okay I figured out why centering was utterly bad on generators.
there was a map which was iterating through the generator, leaving it at the end
@Ausername why
5:18 AM
Read it
i can understand where OP is coming from though
do keep in mind that this question was asked when code-golf was a tag on SO
so an SO user might be wondering why people are asking and answering questions making a bunch of short and totally unreadable / impractical code, when SO is about programming help
@hyper-neutrino you can now get 4 bytes
dw about spoilers
it's the result of a bug fic
ah. thank :D
Having a custom Generator wrapper is both a blessing and a real pain simultaneously
it makes custom type shenanigans easier to manage, but makes dealing with generators annoying at times
Sup everyone
Ah I missed the contest
5:22 AM
@lyxal yo wtf
i am suffering
@Razetime <insert photoshop flowey troll face here>
i have become the very thing i swore to destroy
@lyxal do you have normal lists, or do you use your generator for everything?
i have both lists and sequences, which may come to haunt me later in dev
@hyper-neutrino I have normal lists and generators
5:23 AM
dang maybe I should make lists generatorz
What are the use of generators in vyxal
They speed things up a lot
before v1, I used a custom stack class, which converted generators/itertools stuff/FP stuff into lists
can generators be infinite
5:24 AM
how else do you think I have infinite lists
that's the main point of what i'm using sequences for
The generator class is simply a way to do type cohesion with all sorts of generators (e.g. making lists and itertools play nice)
AOC inspired me to roll my own generator class
speaking of AOC
i should make a python template for that
maybe i will make one. i won't use it either way but i want to see if i can make a decent one
5:26 AM
I want to try and use Vyxal for AOC hence my push for a somewhat more efficient interpreter
:o JoKing is here
hey there @JoKing!
the one person who can actually say "i'm joking"
i'm completely serious
You're not completely serious, you're JoKing
i'm also missed the contest oops
Where is the transcript for the contest?
5:28 AM
someone should bookmark it
give me a bit; you can only attempt to bookmark every 30s

First Mini-Golf

6 hours ago, 1 hour 31 minutes total – 400 messages, 15 users, 11 stars

Bookmarked just now by hyper-neutrino

starts at the start, ends at the maximum allowed bookmark length
it keeps going a bit after that but i can only bookmark 400 messages
Oh, a bookmark has message count limit?
TIL ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Now we've got yet another thing we push SE system to the limits :P
5:32 AM
wdym another, this is clearly one of the first, we totally don't do that on a regular basis :P
*glances at 8246 answers on the sandbox*
What 8246?
including deleted
Maybe we will get to see the hard limit of the number of answers on a single question... someday...
maybe the sandbox will become reprotected one day, who knows
meta never got protection removed, just that shog set our relevant threshold to 10,000
and one day we may hit that
Is it including deleted or not?
...I guess no one really knows
5:41 AM
> I've disabled auto-protection on this meta site.

Or rather, set the relevant thresholds (answers from new users) to 10,000.

That should keep things under control for a few weeks.
only answers from new users
so we're not even close to hitting it, in theory at least
Oh. Then yeah
Hopefully "a few weeks" means 6-8 weeks. — Addison Crump Mar 28 '16 at 20:37
But then I think someone mentioned that there's a hard limit of 16384 (answers on a single question, I believe)
well guess we'll be the first to put that into practical testing! :D (probably)
6:13 AM
Sounds fun, love breaking SE!
@lyxal is there a specific reason your link/SE post format buttons point to http:// even though you have an SSL certificate?
I have an SSL certificate?
That's news to me
As in I didn't know pythonanywhere gave out ssls
Oh I see it's for all subdomains of pythonanywhere
I'll update that when I'm next at my computer
@lyxal Redirect to HTTPS, then use a HSTS header.
It's an esolang interpreter not a banking site
lol i have that on my personal site which literally serves a few static pages and could just be full HTTP and it wouldn't matter
6:41 AM
Oh my god what is this kerning
Thinking about making a brainfuck work with int instead of chr
@pxeger Well it's the greatest title sequence Tom Scott has ever seen
chat event idea: TNB poker game
and you buy-in using rep
winner gets a massive bounty
Sounds like a bad idea. I'm in!
@lyxal Yes rep bet, I will lose all my rep in mere seconds
Spam isn't spam if
it's a haiku, just because
haikus are so cool
6:48 AM
idk how we'd run it but I'd easily drop 10k rep in losses
@Ausername markdown doesn't work in multiline messages
How should we handle people that refuse to pay?
@Bubbler That's why.
@okie chat suspension
6:49 AM
or get Hyper to delete their accounts
high stakes code golf poker. a terrible idea that's fun for the whole family
You're mean.
alternatively, you only get chips after paying a bounty
Imagine the bounty reason
"I lost to <person> because they had a full house with pocket kings while I had pocket queens. So unfair."
He cheated! (50 reps)
6:51 AM
Badges? Like I can give Lyxal two bronze and one silver
or more realistically "<person> rigged the game! There's no way they were that lucky to get JQ two pair when I had pocket 7s. Now I have to give them a bounty" (spoiler: how I lost 15mil)
Hyper will be super rich after that
I mean the concept would probably break SE TOS, but eh
who care about SE TOS, give me the rep
Well, if you're determined enough to cheat, then better have a full deck in your pocket
6:55 AM
Moderators should be able to force-accept answers (for when a user does something like this)
@lyxal Drop python, use jQuery.
@Ausername jokes on you I already do
KotH idea: two players are given a full deck to cheat, and they play a repeated game of poker where they can replace part of their hands with the cheat cards
@Ausername did you link the wrong answer, or did you mean to link to a post that specifically says in large text at the top to not use it?
Yeah, use jQuery for the backend
6:58 AM
@Ausername I can't be bothered to port a multi-file interpreter
HTML is not allowed, use Jquery.
No, because I piggy-back off python for some things (read: abuse python).
@hyper-neutrino Real one
@Bubbler Or you can simluate a real casino with everyone having set amount of money, richest win, those who broke are out
okay. i'll edit that into your original message
6:59 AM
@lyxal Stop using github, use jQuery.
frick jQuery.
you can do that with jQuery
@hyper-neutrino ...
Who uses TNB anymore? jQuery is so much better.
lmfao at CVE 2021 32471: Insufficient input validation in the Marvin Minsky 1967 implementation of the Universal Turing Machine allows program users to execute arbitrary code via crafted data
7:32 AM
mmm vs code really do be screwing up right now
someone's downvoting my answer
@StackMeter whomst and h'what?
@lyxal the empty scrabble board answer, and they didn't even leave a comment
well it is horribly ungolfed
but they didn't even tell me how to do it better
just DVed and left
7:38 AM
well it wasn't me
because I've spent the last 10 hours bug-fixing a golfing suggestion
I hate people who downvote for no reason
@lyxal also why not 21
or BlackJack
I am better at BJ than poker
7:58 AM
hello all!
stuck on a seemingly simple problem again :)
8:32 AM
sup everyone
i accidentally thought StackMeter was saying sup
@Anush hi
8:47 AM
well, I'm going to start building up the wiki for my new lang while I wait for my bounties to roll in
@StackMeter your esolang is ready???!!!!!
@Wasif hi
A: List of bounties with no deadline

Razetime200 rep for a 2D Language answer to Rotation-safe quine What it says on the tin. You can use any language which uses two-dimensional syntax (Fish, Befunge, Klein, Labyrinth, etc) to create it. It must be a proper, valid quine and the language must not have been made before this bounty offer had b...

9:05 AM
I just saw the snowball KOtH
What snowball koth
There's no such kotH
Introducing my new library: Cquery - like Jquery but for C!
What else:
(Bquery is for brainfrick)
@lyxal Don't use Java, use Jquery!
9:30 AM
gonna make a glass cannon
9:53 AM
@Ausername As a JS programmer this hurts physically
10:19 AM
@Ausername Aquery for APL, and Kquery for K. But actually, Kquery is called Q.
Meh, APL's query language should be called AQL.
(In fact, we have something called SQAPL.)
10:38 AM
@EnderShadow8 Have you not seen the meme
11:05 AM
APl really needs its own JQuery tbh
Jul 14 '16 at 15:49, by quartata
I mean, really. do we have to enforce everything with a mod hammer. Why can't we all just get along
I always forget how lawless TNB was for a significant part of 2015 and 2016 :/
that musta been fun
I mean, TNB being so bad was one of the primary reasons behind closing, then locking, the memes page
11:16 AM
> 7 frick, only 10/10 not 69/420? I failed as a crewmate, hella sus. Let me just go commit frick and die? I think it still has problems...
I... I'm not a problem though am I?
@lyxal You're fine.
Except the quote you linked is a typical representation of me
@Ausername Take a look at some of the meta posts tagged with from 2016 and earlier to see what I mean :P
If bad behaviour leaks onto meta, you know there's a problem
That must've been chaos.
@lyxal Sorry.
I thought TNB was always called TNB...
11:26 AM
First page of the transcript - The room used to be called just "Code Golf"
You were not here in 2016.
I tried writing an answer, but couldn't think of the best thing to say, but I do have this: I joined after you 'went dark' and so never really knew you as a mod. However as I read about the history of PPCG more and more (I cannot tell you how many forgotten chat transcripts I've read), I came to realise just how active you were, and I think that you stepping down as a mod is a great shame. I really hope you keep golfing and stay active here (come join us back in TNB when you can!) — caird coinheringaahing Feb 21 '18 at 23:02
I kill time here by digging through old chat transcripts, meta discussions and challenges :P
Same, a bit.
The past of CGCC (or PPCG) is surprising.
I've always found it interesting that you can more or less break it up into 4 or 5 "eras" that have generally been pretty different from one another, and pretty distinctively defined
Tell us these eras
11:34 AM
There's the beta era, (something), the Dennis era, and the one we're in now, which has problems.
Site definition (2011-2013), Growth and (2014), The "Activity Boom" (2015-2016), The Stable Period (2017-2018), The Post-Monica Exodus (2019) and now
That makes 6
I'm bad at counting :P
What do we call now?
The rickroll era?
11:36 AM
We just call it now
Currently, I'm calling it the New Wave era :P
No, call it now so when future TNB historians come, they'll say "now (2020-whenever)"
(also, hello future TNB historians)
Most of the active users are new (accounts < 2 years old) and y'all are establishing a different kind of CGCC (different vibe, challenge ideas, power users, etc.) than the past
We had another boom last year when people were stuck at home...
@cairdcoinheringaahing I'm 5 months old.
The exodus should also cover part of 2020
Because that was our moderatorless period
11:39 AM
What about doorknob
Those were the days where when I went to sleep, there wasn't 5 pages worth of transcript to log read
Back when getting 10+ stars on a good message wasn't uncommon :P
I actually can't remember the last time that happened tbh
Wow imagine getting 10 stars on a message
Made by my best is 9 (prove me wrong lol) gang
Looks like the most recent message with 10+ stars was
Sep 30 '20 at 3:40, by Razetime
congrats to our new mods!
The best so far that I've found is 8 on razetime bullying adam
11:50 AM
that's not razetime
@lyxal My best is 22 23 :P
Sep 26 '17 at 20:26, by caird coinheringaahing
ಠ_ಠ I hate what Jelly has made me do. I just copy pasted the character W
@cairdcoinheringaahing hey that was on the last day people used the word "I'm" freely
@cairdcoinheringaahing but 10172 is 4 times a prime...
also, in font news, I prefer the font now used in the rep badge over the old one
Doesn't look like much has changed on Android lol
There are 5 active users here right now, +12 who have it open in background
11:55 AM
And the mobile site looks really bad after having used desktop version pretty much every day
@Ausername I count 4 active and 13 in the background
@lyxal What about yourself?
@Ausername okay there's you, me, caird and neil
Thats 4 people
And EnderShadow8.
This looks promising
i mean, can i be both?
11:59 AM
JourneyMan's post about the job openings might have actually struck a chord with SE
@Ausername ofc i have
@cairdcoinheringaahing If only we could get a code golfer to get the job
Imagine that. We could finally make the changes we need to break free of the Q&A template we are forced into
@lyxal They typically open CM positions to the mod pool, I'd support Doorknob going for it (probably has the best chance of all the mods tbh) :P
Nothing against the other 3 mods, more that Doorknob has more than a year of experience as a mod
In other news, none of y'all are coming here until mid next year apparently
JoKing, Ascii-only, (possibly) A username and a few others excepted
would i even want to be hired though
12:05 PM
@JoKing Good question, would you?
@lyxal wait what
Travel bubble with NZ
We're good to come to you and you're good to come to us
I believe that new stars should go to that room (please don't star spam to test this)
@lyxal Oh yes
Wait where is JoKing?
A bit south of me
And by bit I mean 154km give or take a few tens worth of km
12:14 PM
looks at map of Australia So somewhere in Victoria?
Somewhere in syd
Yes I really couldn't be bothered to edit that message
So you're in... Newcastle?
How far away are you from me?
And somewhat relatable
12:18 PM
@lyxal It's hard to tell.
It's at least 2k km
Hmm that sounds redundant
2Km maybe
2 megameters
@k km would be 2 million metres.
@Ausername how'd you manage to press shift while pressing a number?!?
@lyxal Um what
12:21 PM
@k km
The @ is supposed to be a 2 no?
Oops. Idk.
@Ausername's a normal human typing with his normal human hands
(i had that in my clipboard ready for such a moment)
@lyxal relevant typo
How did you hit a "7" in the middle there?
12:25 PM
By carefully copying it from the xkcd
Greetings fellow hu7mans with normal human hands
I wondered if anyone had 2 minutes to help with a code challenge I'm preparing.
@AJFaraday Su7re
I'm implementing Terry Pratchett's board game, Thud in JS. All interactions with the game will be via a controller. I've written out the interface here... github.com/AJFaraday/Thud/blob/main/docs/…
Does that make sense? Am I missing any7hing that you'd need to play the game?
12:30 PM
Context for the game please?
It's a chess-like board game described in a fantasy novel
I could summarise the plot for you if you like :p
@AJFaraday Ok, what's the aim of the game?
Or, probably more helpful, here's a page describing the game: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Games_of_the_Discworld#Thud
The gameplay section has everything you need
@AJFaraday Thanks, will have a quick look
Thank you! I think I've got everything you'd want, but it's good to have a second pair of eyes
12:34 PM
@AJFaraday Is this a style game?
@AJFaraday Yup, looks good! Maybe include the wiki for context just in case.
@cairdcoinheringaahing Yes
I'll definitely include the wiki, the ticket would get very long if i didn't.
@cairdcoinheringaahing Well, it's an asymmetrical game, so it'll be cops and robbers.
But yes, it'll be code v code
@AJFaraday You can combine the two (recent meta discussion), which seems like it'll be more appropriate
@AJFaraday See this
Fine with that for tagging, presumably it'd still be two questions?
12:40 PM
You'd have a robbers thread and a cops thread like a CnR
Good, it'd be a real pain importing clients for the two sides otherwise.
@cairdcoinheringaahing they do. just like a week or two ago they opened one which is also related to journey's post
The font change announcement is slowly gathering downvotes...the answers saying to revert the changes will start overtaking it soon :p
I just want arial back, honestly. Segeo UI literally looks like a cartoon comic font. I have a pretty big monitor (not 4k). — 10 Rep 20 hours ago
That's my biggest complaint with the fonts - Segeo looks downright silly
The first time I saw a screenshot of Segeo (after the change), I burst out laughing. It's just comic sans lol
Who on earth thought that'd be more readable?
I think the site's font is part of its appearance and identity, and messing with that (not to mention making it different for different users) is unnecessarily messing that up.
Arial is probably one of the more readable fonts, aside from a few very specific issues with certain letter combinations, and certainly more readable than comic-sans-prime
12:53 PM
Just use monospaced comic sans
Problem solved
why was this changed anyway
readability? i've seen so many people complain that ubuntu is unreadable for them
i can't tell what font i have on windows but it looks alright. tbh a bit less readable but i like how it looks so i probably won't use custom fonts on it
I think the reason they gave was that by not loading their own fonts, it made browsing SO faster and less bloated
But honestly, I don't see any difference in speed
that's fair i guess? i haven't personally noticed but maybe someone with slow internet might?

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