Zendo

Sp3000

3:00 PM

Wait I mean true sorry (your question was negated)

Rubio

wth

John Dvorak

@Rubio I'll pay more on coffee alone :P

Sp3000

To clarify: no arithmetic/calculations

ASCII-only

Wait it's my turn right

Sp3000

Continuing on, I guess. Yep your turn

ASCII-only

3:01 PM

master: hope

Sp3000

hope is true (but not as obvious as to why)

dcfyj

Those questions didn't help me in the least lol

Rubio

as4 didn't use a question, btw

ppperry

nor did I

Sp3000

(feel free to ask whenever ready)

Rubio

3:02 PM

true

ASCII-only

<- not even trying to give positive examples :/

Also: ate/tea are a bit of a clue I think

Sp3000

ASCII-only - guessing/passing?

dcfyj

@ASCII-only Clearly not

ASCII-only

Because it means anagrams are not used

pass

John Dvorak

Ooh i have a good question in mind

dcfyj

3:06 PM

Which you sadly can't ask

Rubio

but someone could ask for him

John Dvorak

I can suggest someone to ask it

ASCII-only

Hmm of the asterisk works only one has no anagram

Deusovi

Oh interesting, an Sp rule.

Sp3000

fabric
missy
slingshot
tweeted
hooted
sissy
book +
starvation
weird
arpeggiation
leak
speak
prompts
peak
wee
anger +
hissy
loud +
slate +
ate +
tea
guilt
sweat
steadfastness
siss
impatient
silly
hope +

cloth
roost *+
pizza
abacus
rubric
onomatopoeia
mastic
fibre
cacophonous
tanked
brr
noun *
trombone
tacked
hummer
random
catapult
bookkeeper
twitter
lily
fingerplate
yearbook
leek
painful
car
ignorance
out
denial
wax
stab
seek
steal *+
stolen
idiotic
bargaining
sting
berate
sate *+
depression
sis

dcfyj

3:10 PM

put us out of our misery, please

Sp3000

Summary for Deus

ASCII-only

@Deusovi interesting is an extreme understatement

Business Cat

inb4 Deus gets it right on first guess

John Dvorak

May I suggest the question?

dcfyj

We've been at it for 2+ hours, probably closer to 3.5 now

ASCII-only

3:10 PM

@dcfyj why do you want this to stop when Deus is here

dcfyj

@ASCII-only I'm telling Deus to put us out of our misery

ASCII-only

@dcfyj oh right

@dcfyj you might need to wait like half an hour though

dcfyj

lol

Who's turn is it

Sp3000

(John: Feel free to pose a T/F question - spectators are allowed to ask as well if it helps)

Rubio

FALSE - The rule is based on the letters and their ordering within the word, and/or within the alphabet, only; no A1Z26 scores, no semantic meaning of the word, etc.
FALSE - The letters can be grouped into a small set of categories (max. 5) and the rule then decided based on the letter categories alone
FALSE - A1Z26 scores are involved
TRUE - This koan does not involve arithmetic/calculation

Sp3000

3:12 PM

ASCII-only just passed, so it's John's turn

John Dvorak

@Deusovi I've paid $0.6 to finish this game. You're responsible for making it worth it.

master slither pass

Sp3000

slither is false

dcfyj

I'm right way too often...

ASCII-only

@dcfyj Here in the Zendo the psychic powers of the mods don't work sadly

Sp3000

(and as4 is out, so Rubio's turn)

dcfyj

3:14 PM

@ASCII-only Neither do mine, clearly

Sp3000

(Deus - planning on slotting in the order?)

Rubio

master: scheme

Deusovi

(sure, apparently I've been put in already)

Rubio

I stuck Deus on the end. :)

Sp3000

scheme is true

dcfyj

3:15 PM

@Deusovi That's because you're playing ( you just didn't know it at the time)

John Dvorak

I'm on mobile, and don't expect to do much actual thinking. Sorry

pass

mondo: an false

guess false

@JohnDvorak D: noooooo

John Dvorak

3:15 PM

False

false

guess false

false

I believe that's everyone?

dcfyj

except as4, but he hasn't peeped in a bit

ASCII-only

3:16 PM

@Sp3000 wat noun has no plus

Sp3000

an is false

ASCII-only

@dcfyj he? :P

dcfyj

meh, I assume every one unless otherwise told usually

(online only obviously)

Rubio

(stones updated)

dcfyj

pass

John Dvorak

3:17 PM

@dcfyj But, we were told

dcfyj

@JohnDvorak I was not

Sp3000

@ASCII-only I'd argue that "noun" is more obvious than the other plussed words (and yes, the + is subjective here)

dcfyj

lol, it's your turn ppperry

ppperry

this is because racecar apparently isn't a word in the dictionary

Sp3000

... oh, so it isn't. Didn't check properly there

dcfyj

3:19 PM

huh

ASCII-only

@as4s4hetic wait what. When

Deusovi

master: arpeggio

John Dvorak

Good to know the dictionary doesn't figure in the actual rule

Sp3000

ppperry can go for another word first, but if racecar was allowed it'd be false

Deusovi

(I see no reason not to allow it)

dcfyj

3:20 PM

@Deusovi He did say "word in SOWPODS"

Deusovi

ah

ppperry

master: level

dcfyj

You really wanted to use a palindrome

Sp3000

level is true (but probably not as obvious as to why)

ppperry

interesting

yah, I did

dcfyj

3:22 PM

guess/pass?

ppperry

pass

Deusovi

master: arpeggio

Sp3000

arpeggio is true (but probably not as obvious as to why, and less obvious than "arpeggiation")

ASCII-only

Just to confirm: autopass so it's my turn right?

Deusovi

oh, right. yeah

Rubio

3:24 PM

deus has a stone

dcfyj

@ASCII-only He has a token

Rubio

no autopass

Deusovi

pass

dcfyj

I mondo'd earlier so he'd have one

ASCII-only

Right lol too much text, forgot he had a stone

master: acceptance

Rubio

3:25 PM

stone counts are pinned ... :)

Sp3000

acceptance is false

John Dvorak

Can't see pins on mobile

dcfyj

Welcome back sid :P

(yes same game)

I'll be back in a bit

John Dvorak

Pass?

Sid

Whoa.

John Dvorak

3:28 PM

@ASCII-only

Sid

I was in club meeting 3 hours back. I have come back to dorm and am going to take my supper and still that game is on?

ASCII-only

@JohnDvorak yes

John Dvorak

Mondo stale true pass

Sid

You guys are stubborn

ASCII-only

@Sid yes

true

Deusovi

3:30 PM

guess false

ppperry

I'm not going to guess on this one

John Dvorak

@ppperry but thou must

ppperry

oh

guess true

Rubio

true

Sp3000

dc's out for a bit and has too many stones, so should I just say?

Rubio

3:32 PM

I'm inclined at this point to think we're not going to get this

more stones aren't going to matter :)

Sp3000

stale is true (but not as obvious as to why)

Deusovi

...huh.

ASCII-only

@Sp3000 no

Rubio

(stones updated)

master: syzygy

pass

Sp3000

John technically still needs to guess/pass

But in advance: syzygy is false

ppperry

3:36 PM

no, he said "pass' after his mondo

Business Cat

I'm not sure what could be left after it doesn't care about order of letters, doesn't care about A1Z26, and doesn't involve calculations

Sp3000

Oh right, missed that

Business Cat

And anagrams and pronunciation are out

ASCII-only

@BusinessCat pure word based

Business Cat

So, just the meaning of the word?

ASCII-only

3:37 PM

@BusinessCat not sure

ppperry

except that can't be it because fabric and cloth are practically synonims

ASCII-only

I was thinking more like substrings

Business Cat

I can't see any discernible pattern among the meanings, but that's just me...

dcfyj

back

ppperry

your turn

dcfyj

3:40 PM

master: satiation

Sp3000

(anyone who hasn't asked a true/false is still free to ask a true/false question, if that helps)

satiation is true

John Dvorak

May I suggest what question that be?

Rubio

(which is as4, ppperry, and Deus, plus spectators)

ppperry

master: nun

dcfyj

pass

ppperry

3:41 PM

oh, sorry, I forgot to wait for you to guess or pass

Sp3000

nun is false

(I thought dc had it for a sec there :P)

Had what?

the rule, I'd assume

But he does

The rule, yeah

3:42 PM

I've been guessing correctly on the rule regularly for a while now...

Sp3000

(ppperry: guess/pass?)

ppperry

pass

John Dvorak

Does that mean my meta-guess is correct now?

dcfyj

lol

Deusovi

master: ration, then pass

Sp3000

3:44 PM

ration is true (but not as obvious as to why)

dcfyj

Obviously my brain knows the rule, it just refuses to tell me

Sp3000

@ASCII-only Your turn - still around?

(And yeah, I don't intend to stay up all night either, oops :( )

John Dvorak

Afk in ten minutes for cca five minutes

Deusovi

doesn't seem to be around

JD?

John Dvorak

Master stellar pass

Sp3000

3:51 PM

stellar is false

(@Rubio's turn if around)

Rubio

master: ascend

pass

keep forgetting as4 is gone

Sp3000

ascend is true (but not as obvious as to why)

dcfyj

master: journey (true is my guess for it :P)

Sp3000

journey is true

dcfyj

guess: The rule is something only you know

Sp3000

3:54 PM

Well I mean, technically, as of this second... yeah?

dcfyj

:P

John Dvorak

Yay!!!

Rubio

someone get out the ruler

Sp3000

It's not reliant on knowledge only I know though - quadplex/SOWPODS acts as the authoritative source here

John Dvorak

defenestrates sp

Deusovi

3:56 PM

quadplex?

dcfyj

pass

ppperry

master: descend pass

Sp3000

(quadplex = the site I linked to check against SOWPODS online, just in case the SOWPODS list I have locally differs)

descend is false

Deusovi

master: slings

Sp3000

slings is false

Deusovi

3:59 PM

pass

John Dvorak

Afk

Sp3000

ASCII-only's probably out - so John's turn unless you're also out now?

Deusovi

he just said he was afk

@as4?

Rubio

word dump?

Sp3000

fabric
missy
slingshot
tweeted
hooted
sissy
book +
starvation
weird
arpeggiation
leak
speak
prompts
peak
wee
anger +
hissy
loud +
slate +
ate +
tea
guilt
sweat
steadfastness
siss
impatient
silly
hope +
scheme
level +
arpeggio +
stale +
satiation
ration +
ascend +
journey

cloth
roost *+
pizza
abacus
rubric
onomatopoeia
mastic
fibre
cacophonous
tanked
brr
noun *
trombone
tacked
hummer
random
catapult
bookkeeper
twitter
lily
fingerplate
yearbook
leek
painful
car
ignorance
out
denial
wax
stab
seek

Deusovi

4:02 PM

...yeah, I've got nothing

dcfyj

We've got too many people on that boat, get your own!

Sp3000

as4's asleep fyi, so I guess Rubio's turn?

Rubio

i'm thinking

deus, it's apparently extrinsic to the letters in the word and their order in either the word and/or the alphabet, and the extrinsicness is not A1Z26 related (nor, given "leek" and "leak", pronunciation related). any idea on a T/F question to help give definition to what it might depend on?

master: hearty pass

Sp3000

Slight clarification:

1 hour ago, by Rubio

@Sp3000 The rule is based on the letters and their ordering within the word, and/or within the alphabet, only; no A1Z26 scores, no semantic meaning of the word, etc.

Emphasis on "only"

John Dvorak

Pronunciation might still have a role

Sp3000

4:06 PM

hearty is true

(yeah, 1-letter words aren't valid in SOWPODS because, well, Scrabble)

ppperry

that wasn't meant to be a guess; I pressed enter by mistake

Sp3000

... oh right, should have noticed it wasn't your turn anyway oops :P

dcfyj

yeah, i've no clue

ppperry

I'm leaving this now

dcfyj

I'm not leaving, but feel free to skip me, I have zero ideas

Rubio

4:11 PM

goes to Deus then

Sp3000

You can always guess randomly, or else I guess Deus is up

Deusovi

ideas are not happening for me

dcfyj

@Sp3000 I've been doing that...

Deusovi

master: week

Sp3000

week is true

Rubio

4:14 PM

i think it's to me?

Deusovi

pass

Rubio

master: maintain

Sp3000

maintain is true (but not as obvious as to why)

Rubio

that makes me grin every time.

none of them are obvious as to why

pass

Sp3000

I think it's fairer if I point out which ones are less helpful than the others

Deusovi

4:18 PM

right now none of them are helpful :P

Business Cat

The game has been going for 4 hours

Deusovi

wait, is it just me and Rubio now?

Rubio

dc is here but not here

everyone else but you and me are gone

Business Cat

I don't particularly feel like entering this world of headaches and suffering

dcfyj

pretty much, I've given up on this

Deusovi

4:18 PM

welp.

Sp3000

I want to give hints, but I'm not sure what would help :P

Rubio

almost anything? ;)

dcfyj

apparently nothing lol

Deusovi

^ ^^

John Dvorak

I'm watching

Deusovi

4:21 PM

master: hot

Sp3000

hot is false

Deusovi

hm, so a true word can be made up of two false ones. interesting

Business Cat

I've thought about the "word-within-word" line but couldn't quite get it

Sid

Huh.

Business Cat

As in something like a true word contains another legal word inside it

But that particular case fails for a lot of words

Sp3000

4:24 PM

True (type 1):
--------------
slingshot
hooted
book +
leak
prompts
peak
wee
slate +
ate +
tea
guilt
sweat
steadfastness
silly
stale +
satiation
hearty
week


True (type 2):
--------------
fabric
missy
tweeted
sissy
starvation
weird
arpeggiation
speak
anger +
hissy
loud +
siss
impatient
hope +
scheme
level +
arpeggio +
ration +
ascend +
journey
maintain +


False:
------
cloth
roost *+
pizza
abacus
rubric
onomatopoeia
mastic
fibre
cacophonous
tanked
brr
noun *
trombone
tacked
hummer
random
catapult

^ Additional hint

Business Cat

Like random contains and

Deusovi

...huh.

Sid

What is type 1 and type 2?

Deusovi

we don't know

Sid

By this time, I would have already given up and begged Sp3000 for the answer

Rubio

4:26 PM

I'm about there.

passing, Deus?

Deusovi

oh, yeah

John Dvorak

Hypothesis: type 1 and type 2 refer to two distinct subrules, and "too true" match both

Deusovi

that's what I was thinking too

Business Cat

But then like half of them aren't obvious why so they don't even help

Rubio

master: cab

Sp3000

4:28 PM

cab is false

Bonus hint: "collude" is * (too true) but not +

hm.

pass

master: cluelessness

aka us

yup

4:32 PM

cluelessness doesn't seem to be in SOWPODS

Deusovi

then pass

oh

just clueless then

Sp3000

clueless is true (and probably deserves a +)

er... type 2

John Dvorak

It's interesting that the match quality is subjective...

Sp3000

Well the + is just subjectivity as to whether I think it'll be as obvious that it matches at a glance

Whether it matches the rule or not though is objective

John Dvorak

Prepare to be lynched

Deusovi

4:35 PM

hm?

Rubio

I'm all out of ideas

Deusovi

I'm trying to figure out what the two criteria could be

but not getting anything from it

Sp3000

Hint: type 1 and type 2 are only slightly different.

John Dvorak

I propose ignoring turn order at this point

Rubio

master: meek & pass

Sp3000

4:38 PM

meek is true (type 1)

(and yeah, feel free to ditch turn order)

Rubio

master: reek

Sp3000

reek is true (type 1)

master: wreak

wreak is false

master: startling

4:40 PM

startling is false

John Dvorak

My observation is that consonants are sorta but not wholly interchangeable

Deusovi

master: in

Sp3000

in is false

Deusovi

(neither are false due to being too true?)

Sp3000

(if they are, I'll say so)

Rubio

4:41 PM

i don't get why meek and reek are true(1) but leek is false

master: seek

John Dvorak

L seems to be special

Sp3000

seek is false

Rubio

master: peek

Sp3000

peek is true (type 1, but probably not as obvious why)

Business Cat

So leak is true, leek is false, peak is true, peek is true

I give up

John Dvorak

4:44 PM

Lovely, eh?

Rubio

[mprw]eek are true(1). [ls]eek are false.

master: geek

geek is false

Master teak

master deek

(it's apparently a word)

Sp3000

4:46 PM

teak is true (type 1)

Rubio

master: beak

Sp3000

deek is true (type 1, probably not as obvious why)

Rubio

[dmprw]eek are true(1). [gls]eek are false.

Business Cat

What on earth is deek

Sp3000

beak is true (type 1, probably not as obvious why)

Deusovi

4:48 PM

ooh

John Dvorak

DMPRW vs LS. Just in case uppercase is better.

Deusovi

no, uppercase is not better

John Dvorak

Oh?

Rubio

@Deusovi that had the hint of enlightenment to it

Deusovi

dpb are all the same shape, and all make it hard to see why it's type-1 true

(I'd guess beek and qeek if they were words :P )

that's all I've figured out

Sp3000

4:50 PM

I would answer that but... nah maybe not now :P

Rubio

maybe a good use for a T/F question now is if letter shapes are relevant

Deusovi

Maybe not just yet.

Rubio

annoyingly: "collude" is * (too true) but not +

Deusovi

unfortunately, type 2 doesn't have any good word bases that we can switch letters out from

John Dvorak

Linear/nonlinear letter shapes?

Sp3000

4:53 PM

Bonus hint: "calliopes" is * (too true) but not +

John Dvorak

l/s are both simple curves

Deusovi

master: sling

Sp3000

sling is false

Business Cat

Are we just guessing every word in the dictionary

Deusovi

master: shot

Sp3000

4:55 PM

shot is true

(type 1)

interesting

master: weak

weak is false

Master slot, master scot

Sp3000

slot, scot are both true (type 1)

Rubio

4:56 PM

master: spot

Sp3000

spot is true (type 1)

John Dvorak

Master snot

Sp3000

snot is true (type 1)

Rubio

master: soot

Sp3000

soot is true (type 1)

Rubio

4:57 PM

master: swot

Sp3000

swot is true (type 1)

John Dvorak

What's that?

Master shot

Deusovi

3 mins ago, by Sp3000

shot is true

Rubio

shot's been d one

Mike Q

master: slow

Rubio

4:59 PM

i think we have all the s_ot words, and all are type 1

Sp3000

slow is true (type 1)

Mike Q

master: shoe

Sp3000

shoe is false (too true)

John Dvorak

Master sort

Rubio

master: hoe

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