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12:16 AM
Q: Add a "Review posts with reopen votes" review task?

NikoWhen a question is closed because it is considered to be "not constructive" or "not a real question", the text explicitly includes a hint that the question might be reopened after it has been improved/clarified, e.g. For help clarifying this question so that it can be reopened, see the FAQ. ...

Ta DA! For all of you who have been waiting—Status Completed.
ya, loving that ;p
So a question needs to already have reopen votes cast before it appears in the queue?
Seems odd. It should be automatically queued after edits are made on the closed question
harrumph That's gratitude for you.
Wow, zapping 4-voters is very gratifying!
But I even resisted one 4!
Aren't you proud of me?
12:27 AM
@Cerberus pats heads, scratches ears
@KitFox Well, it solves the problem part-way but doesn't go far enough, I guess. Getting the attention drawn to the edit is the hard part. The user has no way of knowing how to do that.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Well, true enough. Maybe you ought to post a request to modify the reopen queue?
Well, I'm off. Later!
@KitFox Every time I post a feature request TPTB spit on me. So no thanks.
puts mod umbrella over @Mr. Shiny
12:31 AM
thanks :)
Maybe wait a few days anyway so the developer doesn't get pissed.
Now really, see you tomorrow.
I stopped ping-replying to you so that you can go
12:47 AM
I have no idea what to do with this edit: english.stackexchange.com/review/suggested-edits/10587
Too long.
On one hand, someone could post that answer and we couldn't really stop them. On the other hand, it takes a bad answer and adds meaningless speculation and pointless elaborations and not a shred of evidence.
1:28 AM
So I just went through a bunch of questions in the "reopen" review queue
I found that exercise completely pointless
Almost none of the questions had been edited after closing
Yet determining that information was laborious and tedious
Yes, me too.
I cast a scant handful of reopen votes based on the newfound knowledge that ELL questions may be topical, and the rest were "leave closed"
Out of all 66 or whatever it is, or some smaller number?
It was so boring a task that I doubt I'll do it again.
I only made it through 25 or so
I haven't found any to open in the first 20.
I wonder what the Don’t vote does. I think it does nothing. There or in the Close queue.
1:31 AM
yeah most of them were pretty dubious reopen votes. example, I tend to answer "which preposition" questions
Just like I don’t think suggest deletion does anything.
Please don’t reopen Norty’s.
@tchrist Yeah it probably does nothing except remove it from my queue.
@tchrist No, those must be closed on principle.
And pray deleted.
But prepositions are hard for people to understand sometimes. Or they ask a preposition question and they need to be told that the different prepositions actually mean different things.
On SO, the highrep users regularly go through the delete queues. Here, nobody but me does.
So the last 50 things on the queue have me as a voter.
1:33 AM
I'll be honest, I was only barely aware of this feature at all until a few days ago.
But I also go through the closed queue.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 It’s ok.
Set it for last 30 days. That’s usually the best way.
Well, sometimes I feel like I should use my10k powers for good instead of nothing. But there is no real reward for doing so.
Although in the last day can be interesting.
What sort of good do you mean?
@tchrist well, like deleting things that need deleting, etc.
I know it isn’t actually true, but sometimes I feel like Reg does most of the work around here. I feel bad for him.
1:35 AM
I actually put effort into reaching 10k. It's hard because it takes time and there's such a long slog from 3k to 10k. I got bored lots of times and let it slide. But you need to post constantly in order to keep getting rep.
So I try to help out as I can.
Yes, that’s right.
@tchrist Well, he does do a lot of work. It's totally obvious when he goes on vacation.
Your rep graph looks totally different from mine.
You did a lot a long time ago,
I did nothing for like more than a year.
Oh wait, I’m looking at your SO account.
Well, it still doesn’t look like mine, but I see what you mean now.
Mine is still a lot more bunched up than yours, and still empty at the beginning.
Anyway, now that I've reached 10k I feel demoralized about using the site. I get no satisfaction about answering questions because most of the questions are so bad, or off-topic, or whatever. I spend all my time just voting to close. That gets dull, so then I don't visit the site.
So the review queues are useful in a way if I can easily find places that I need to act. But actually doing all that work just feels like work. And I don't need no stinkin' badges.
Yes, I know quite what you mean.
1:41 AM
esp when all my better answers get no attention whatsoever.
And I take it as a matter of principle to not rep-whore. Usually.
But enough bitching. I have to get going.
At SO, I get about 1000–1500 of passive rep per month just out of existing. Here, not so much.
See ya.
I should think about supper, I suppose.
The only way we are ever going to get a huge whole lot of high rep users is by getting rid of GR closevotes.
1:56 AM
Q: If a question ends in the abbreviation of et cetera, do you still add the period before the question mark?

LunaExample: How do I pay for the bananas, oranges, etc.? or How do I pay for the bananas, oranges, etc?

Before you go ...
Clean-up on aisle "Not that again!"
I was listening to the "debates".
2:15 AM
I haven't been around much lately, and now I find out that ELL has been closed?
crosses arms, glares at RC
You can look at the mumbles about it over in the other room.
The summit room?
2:44 AM
@tchrist: I was earlier ;p
Listening to the debates
A: US English — "primary grains being produced" vs. "major cereals being produced"

user28548First, the grains are a back door input to the front door output of cereal produce, albeit that it is indirect as respects livestock feed. So, to highlight statistically significant produce output most concisely, be it Spanish or English, the descriptive coupling of adjective to noun--viz, "cerea...

Boggle. It is really unreadable.
3:16 AM
Back so soon?
5 hours later…
7:47 AM
english.blogoverflow.com/2012/10/… is closed to comments, and it was posted only two days ago. Are blog posts not open to comments at all?
I assumed "begging the question" in english.blogoverflow.com/2012/10/… was meant to be an example of bad English. Apparently not?
8:19 AM
Oh right, I was meant to look into that.
@AndrewGrimm I've activated comments. I'm not sure how they got turned off.
@AndrewGrimm I'm not sure what you're getting at
also, if you wish to discuss the blog:

 EL&U Blog

Discussion for the EL&U Blog. For more info see meta.english.s...
8:48 AM
@MattЭллен begthequestion.info
right... so you're a prescriptivist then ;)
9:35 AM
@MattЭллен It's not called being a prescriptivist; it's called being right. I'm with @Andrew on this one; I feel you've used that phrase incorrectly.
a) I published it, and agree with it, but did not write it. b) prescriptivism vs descriptivism has as much to do with semantics as with syntax and grammar.
Oh sorry, I thought you were the author.
no worries :)
@DavidWallace I have enabled comments on it, should you want to discuss it with Cameron. He might actually have made a mistake. It seems OK to me.
OK, thanks.
1 hour later…
11:08 AM
@AndrewGrimm Oh, I had thought that too.
I was going to point it out, but I wasn't sure if it was a joke.
Does anyone outside india use language like that? ;p
Like what?
'begging the question'
seems very... wren and martin
I use the phrase occasionally. Correctly, I might add.
@JourneymanGeek People trying to look impressive.
11:11 AM
What you mean, trying?
I might also mention that I use it when I'm trying to look impressive.
I always just look impressive.
Well, naturally. You're an owl. Comes with the feathers.
Right now is but one instance.
I use it subject to being in the presence of beggars
11:12 AM
Bag your pardon.
paper or plastic?
plastique, but it will take some time to cook.
@KitFox And he dosen't give a hoot.
I'll give it a try, but don't blame me if it kills us all
11:32 AM
and yet, there is a precedent for this pattern within the network already: mathoverflow.net is for graduate level and above math problems, and math.stackexchange.com is for everything else. Math seems as basic and fundamental a topic as English to me, and can support a similar split. — Jeff Atwood 2 hours ago
Check it out. We are getting support from an odd quarter.
At first I was like,
But then I was like,
I even shaved myself, so much surprised I was.
Just thought I would say hello from a newcomer to your site
Could 'that' be omitted if I was to say 'the court established (that?) his rights were violated'?
11:48 AM
@Hmobius hi and welcome.
@Chris yes.
Q: Are there rules about using "that" to join two clauses?

kiamlaluno He will understand that I was not joking. He will understand I was not joking. Which of the sentences is correct? Are there any specific rules about the use of "that" in the sentences I reported as example?

11:59 AM
@Chris Informally and in simple sentences, yes, but if you want to be absolutely clear, as in a legal document, do not omit the that.
@RegDwighт Hirsute yourself. Or not.
"Or not" has always been my strongest hirsute.
It is pure gold. Or not.
Note how fromage is gold backwards. Plus some random letters. It's really not pure at all.
Note how fromage is a portmanteau: from and age stuck together. The French were trying to express how fine cheese must be aged, obviously.
So...we should have an englishoverflow.com?
12:04 PM
Just call it Pineapple Express. Catchier.
What's that, maybe glossolalia.com?
Pineapple Express is a 2008 American stoner action comedy directed by David Gordon Green, written by Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg and starring Rogen and James Franco. Producer Judd Apatow, who previously worked with Rogen and Goldberg on Knocked Up and Superbad, assisted in developing the story, which was partially inspired by the buddy comedy subgenre. The film was released on August 6, 2008. Franco was nominated for a Golden Globe award for his performance in the film. Plot Dale Denton (Seth Rogen) is a 25-year-old process server who witnesses the dangerous drug lord, Ted Jones (Gary Co...
claps hands because she got to use glossolalia in a sentence
You don't use glossolalia. Glossolalia uses you.
I love that word. It's one of my favorites.
12:06 PM
But you'll agree it's bigger than any one person. You need help to heft it.
Hey, someone needs to suspend Norton for low quality...oh. Never mind.
@Robusto Oh, sure.
And coffee.
@Robusto nonono. "Fromm" is German for "pious, docile". With fromage, the French really wanted to convey that they are old, submissive, and can't spell German correctly.
@KitFox Norton Antivirus has already been suspended. From my machines, anyway.
I hate that garbage.
Always messing with my stuffs.
12:08 PM
are you dressed appropriately to get coffee today, @Kit?
Yes! Uh, except for my slippers.
But if I don't notice them no one else will.
makes note to steal more sugar packets
really brb
@Robusto express? Shirley you jest. A regional train at best.
Don't call me Shirley.
12:09 PM
Too late.
too unfinisher
The name is taken.
Off it goes.
But it is precisely the kind of train I envisioned.
What do you call these anyhow?
@Robusto Thank you!
@RegDwighт trains? we call them locomotives
12:15 PM
ohh ... nice photos :D
Nah, I mean precisely this kind of toy train an adult barely fits in.
This one at least has tracks, but they often actually have tires and run on regular roads.
A tram, maybe?
A tram is a regular city train to me.
Street car.
yeah, SF has trams
12:16 PM
@RegDwighт My son called it a train when he was three. Also, choo-choo.
Sheffield has trams
@Robusto yeah, something like that, a choo-choo. Exactly.
park locomotive? :)
I think a tram is open like that.
12:17 PM
This is a tram.
A tram is a combination of a train and a pram. Poifect for kids.
@rbdev they do mainly drive around parks, yes. And if it's around an actual city, it's for tourist entertainment only.
Damn. I can't think of the word for that. Surface-level subway cars. LV...something.
tranana - a combination of train and banana. perfect for monkeys
@RegDwighт ohh, this is city transport from my country :)) this is tramcar/ or trolley car
12:19 PM
hm, pram... I wonder if that's a good candidate for @Zairja 's elided words with new spellings
@rbdev трамвай.
@KitFox Streetcars.
@RegDwighт i doesn't see any city with rail-roud around hole city area :(
@RegDwighт yeap, трамвай )
Sheffield super tram!
@Robusto No, there's a different word. In Toronto.
@Mr.Shiny probably knows it.
12:20 PM
@KitFox Try Quebecois.SE
Light transit?
@MattЭллен wow, "Sheffield" and "super" in one sentence. My hat is off to you, sire.
@Robusto Toronto is in Ontario.
The bus?
@RegDwighт lol
12:21 PM
@KitFox Ah, I thought you said Montreal. Wevs.
I used to go to Toronto a lot, when I was Yonge.
I used to go when I was Freud
Ach. It's probably just streetcar. But in any case, my brain has "tram" firmly set as something with open sides.
@KitFox A Streetcar Named "Retire"
Toronto would have been so much better if I had been there with someone who wasn't an asshole.
San Francisco tram
12:23 PM
@MattЭллен That. Trolley, streetcar. Like a tram.
They were installing the light transit routes when I lived there. Light transit? Rapid transit? Gah! It was a electric car, and ran like above ground subway.
And it had some sort of acronym that was painted in the crossing lanes.
deep breath Let it go.
OK. Brain's OK now.
@KitFox In Toronto we call our street trais "streetcars" because it's a train-car that runs on the street. We also have new trains that are multi-car, which we call "Light Rail Transit". We also have an elevated light rail train called "Scarborough Rapid Transit". And we have subway trains.
@KitFox so it doesn't fit the train in question. It looks completely different. Nobody would think of that choo-choo if they heard "tram".
@MattЭллен lies. SF trams are tilt like 25 degrees!
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Yes! Light Rail Transit. LRT.
@RegDwighт clearly the camera is at an angle
@RegDwighт I'd call your pineapple train a "train". The fact that it's kid-size or skeumorphic doesn't matter much.
12:27 PM
@RegDwighт Um, yeah.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 of course I can call it many things. I'm not asking how to get from that picture to a name. I am asking how to get from a name to that picture.
Grand scale railway?
A ridable miniature railway (USA: 'riding railroad' or 'grand scale railroad') is a ground-level, large scale model railway that hauls passengers using locomotives that are models of full-sized railway locomotives (powered by diesel or petrol engines, live steam engines or electric motors). Overview Typically they have a rail track gauge between and , though both larger and smaller gauges are used. These large model railroads are most often seen in urban parks or in commercial settings, such as amusement park rides. The major distinction between a miniature railway and a narrow gau...
Pineapple RMR. That has a ringer ring to it than ELL.
Yes. Yes!
12:31 PM
Frig. Meeting prep. Laters.
A rack-and-pinion railway (also rack railway, cog railway) is a railway with a toothed rack rail, usually between the running rails. The trains are fitted with one or more cog wheels or pinions that mesh with this rack rail. This allows the trains to operate on steep grades above 7%, which is the maximum for adhesion-based rail. Most rack railways are mountain railways, although a few are transit railways or tramways built to overcome a steep gradient in an urban environment. The first cog railway was the Middleton Railway between Middleton and Leeds in West Yorkshire, England, UK, ...
Q: Prices Start From, At

jobof Prices start (from / at) $1000. Should it be from or at?

The first photo is of the one on Pike's Peak above Colorado Springs, Colorado.
People who live with several kinds of "rail" car normally assign separate names to each kind of line, while people who do not live with more than one type around them seem to call all of them the same thing.
"rmr" looks like a description, not a short understandable name :)
Understandable was never a requirement that was allowed to enter the building.
12:35 PM
As I have found out the hard way, taking the wrong sort because my names didn't map to their names.
And not just once. :(
It even happened in other countries, not just in North America — although it happened there, too.
Damned YANCkees.
@MattЭллен Why doesn't he get tired of it?
@KitFox good question. maybe because he knows we are?
I don't exactly like ridable. Sounds like it's meant to be gotten rid of.
Not meant to, just able to.
@KitFox Isn’t it the mark of a nutter to keep doing the same things over and over again, but expecting to get a different answer?
12:39 PM
@tchrist I don't think that applies here.
@KitFox You’re right; perhaps we’re his science experiment. :)
That IP-to-Google-Maps thingamajig is really handy. Perhaps I should ask my daddy to nuke him from orbit. Anybody care about California?
@tchrist don't worry about this, i live in russia and i'm natively russian guy, but i also can't map some words with easy description :D
@RegDwighт hmmm. california... I can't think of any important Internet resources there. Got for it!
@RegDwighт Plate tectonics obviously doesn’t.
12:42 PM
@tchrist and sometimes i can't understand description, or word :D it's okay
@rbdev It’s a problem of local usage being, well, local.
@tchrist it's St. Andrea's fault.
The bitch.
that awkward moment when you're alone at the water cooler, doing a little dance and someone comes into view
... and stuffs a $20 in your belt
12:44 PM
Moment? I like my shows to last.
We had an earthquake here last night. It shook the house for about 10 seconds.
hi @cornbreadninja
@skullpatrol howdy
@Robusto no serious damage, I hope?
12:47 PM
@KitFox: The quake's epicenter was in Maine. Did you feel it?
@MattЭллен None at all. Only about a 4.0. But it sounded like a huge truck going by and everything shook.
@RegDwighт What's the rationale for closing “Prices start from” vs. “prices start at”
Does anybody find that question tags are far, far less useful for making favorites or ignoreds here on ELU compared with SO or most other SE sites?
@Robusto Are you by the coast or up in the “hills”?
yes, I don't have any (with the exception of so that I don't get any selected for me by the system)
12:51 PM
@tchrist I'm about 2 miles from "the rude bridge that arched the flood."
most of our tags are not that useful.
About 5 miles from Walden Pond.
Oh, that’s nice, then.
Or was.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Why is that?
@Robusto Good to hear.
My open question on tag usefulness is genuinely inquisitive.
I don’t have any answers to it myself.
And I wonder.
12:59 PM
@tchrist Because askers have no clue how to tag a system. On SO the bar for even asking a useful question is higher, and anyway people at least know the programming language they are discussing. Here that language is "english"; that's the obvious tag to tag everything with. Half the time they don't know the parts of speech, not even the basic ones, and anyway what good would a tag called "nouns" be?
We have a "words" tag, for crying out loud.
855 uses, I'm not sure if uses is proportional to usefulness
@FumbleFingers people flagged the shit out of it asking for prompt closure and deletion. Plus we delete all stuff of Nortonn's that doesn't have upvoted answers.
Don't look at me, I have left a lot of his crap open after editing it into shape.
But it got closed and/or deleted anyway.
And I'm too busy now to keep checking on flags every three minutes.
@tchrist That's true, isn't it?
Just wait till you get Generalist, then you can ignore all tags.
Actually go ignore all tags right now because you'll be getting Generalist anyway.
6 tags to go and we get the badge!
well, those who are eligible
1:20 PM
@RegDwighт Hmm, why I not have that badge? Why no one has it?
Because the top 40 tags must have 200+ questions each.
I already did some heavy searching and retagging last week. We're very close now.
Well, well, well.
Wellity wellity wellity
Q: Islam: Would foreign-language questions be permissible?

goldPseudoProposal: Islam Given that a large portion of the site's target demographic probably do not speak English as a first language, would questions/answers in other languages (e.g., Urdu, Hindi, Arabic) be accepted?

Impermissible? Heresy, I say!
Is this how one should answer GR questions?
A: Difference between "opacity" and "opaqueness"

tchristThe difference between the two is more one of actual use than one of nuance. For simple meaning, the OED provides: opaqueness — the quality of being opaque; opacity. opacity — The quality or fact of being opaque; opaqueness. The earliest citation given for opaqueness in English is...

Or should I have close- and/or down-voted it instead?
1:26 PM
That's one way.
@Robusto That <ISLAMOCENSORED> don’t hunt.
@Robusto Does it make ELU “better”, either in content or friendliness? Yes and yes. Is it wrong? I don’t know. Is it going to happen very often? Absolutely not: it takes about 1000× more work than negavoting.
1:43 PM
@tchrist This question is a good example of something that's both GR and not GR. On one hand, there are dictionary definitions that position the two words as synonyms. So the answer is "there is no difference". Or "Opacity is a synonym for opaqueness" but not necessarily vice-versa. But then the real difference is usage, which isn't clear from the dictionary.
People are lazy.
So in that case your answer is worth posting and beneficial to the user beyond the simple dictionary GR answer.
Both querents, and respondents.
The querent doesn’t do any research.
you could say the opaqueness of the dictionary definition obscures the real usage of the words
The respondents don’t do any writing.
And so like calls to like.
1:45 PM
So what's your position? questions like that one should be answered? or closed? or ignored, if you're lazy?
Did you answer it as an experiment in site psychology? :)
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Absolutely.
The thing is, your answer demonstrates that it isn't exactly GR. The main point of your answer is about something that's not in a dictionary.
All of this is very subjective. And will always remain so. It is challenging to present a subjective position as more “right” than some other one.
But ngrams certainly help. :)
Just a popularity contest, really, which proves nothing.
Just looks flashy.
I feel somewhat unclean.
I believe it would be better to distinguish between the suffixes of -ness and -ity.
and -tude
1:49 PM
-city is not a suffix.
-ity is the suffix.
That’s like saying -ked is a suffix.
panicked, picnicked, havockers, bivouacked, musicked, demosaïcked, magicked
@skullpatrol That would be a different question. Anyway the supposed meaning of an affix doesn't necessarily reflect on the current meaning and usage of a word.
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Not much, at least. Down that road may (or may not) lie the Etymological Fallacy.
Which may or may not lie.
Well there is a dog and there is dogness.
mimicked, physicked, frolicked, politicked, shellacked, trafficked
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 this is not the first time we are having this discussion, or perhaps observation. Whether or not a question is GR can change depending on what kind of answers it gets.
1:55 PM
@RegDwighт autostuns
speak of the demon dog
Hablando del rey de Roma
@RegDwighт I don't think the question's GR-ness changes because of how it was answered. I think it was always non-GR, only, it looks GR. And crucially, non-expert users might not know that it isn't GR, and vote to close.
why have they been doing that! I knew you couldn't trust security "researchers"
@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Well, yeah. But you can say that about any question. I myself have tried to turn despite vs. despite of, pricey vs. pricy, alright vs. all right into non-GR. But again, I did that not by editing the question. The questions, at face value, are all still GR.
The OPs did zero research themselves. Zilch.
1:59 PM
@MattЭллен Is it the demonity or the demoness of the the dog?
Well done.
@MattЭллен Speak of the demon head.

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