The Nineteenth Byte

@ManishKundu I forgot Python is a bit odd... https://tio.run/##DchBCoAgEADAe68IT7sRXromvsVkQcFc2Yyyz5tznNJq4Lz1Hs/CUmehqUjMFY‌T0RU58AAV2N@7wqBew5m0fqlUFSolHBn6c0MjGt0Ls/Qc

Adám

@Dennis Oh, my bad. Too tired, I guess. My chat activity diagram says its time to go to bed…

Pavel

2:19 AM

Do other character classes work in []?

Dennis

Yes, [\s\S] works.

Anonymous

@Pavel Yes

Zacharý

2:35 AM

Should I declare a winner to my polyglot challenge?

MD XF

@Zacharý yeah go check Jo King's, I think I'm done with it

Anonymous

@Zacharý Do you want it to end?

MD XF

@Mego it's already pretty much inactive

Zacharý

I'd add a note that I can redeclare a winner

MD XF

Did I discover this (aka this) method of generating the Fibonacci sequence?

Or has someone else already used it?

I can't find it anywhere else but it seems so simple, I doubt I was the first to come up with it

Anonymous

2:39 AM

@MDXF No...? That's the standard iterative implementation with an extra variable

MD XF

@Mego Oh then I just failed to recognize it. Can you link another answer that uses the same implementation?

Anonymous

@MDXF rosettacode.org/wiki/Fibonacci_sequence#Iterative_13

MD XF

@Mego Ah thanks

Christopher

3:11 AM

My consecutive visits reset

despite the fact I joined over the app

im done

Zacharý

Just try again

Christopher

Vote for your PPCG moderators!

@RO pin? ^

Anonymous

@Christopher There's already an election message pinned

Anonymous

Though it should probably be edited

Christopher

for the Q&A/nominations

Anonymous

3:16 AM

@trichoplax Wanna edit your pinned message to mention that it's election time and not nomination time anymore?

Anonymous

cc @Dennis

Christopher

rip

removes vote for mego

</joke>

Anonymous

We could pin a new message, but we already have something election-related pinned, so we might as well just edit the already-pinned message

Christopher

but that takes longer

you can remove the pin and pin a new message

Anonymous

@Christopher It's not really a time-sensitive thing

Anonymous

3:18 AM

Anyway I need to go to bed so I'll let someone else decide :P

Christopher

@Mego rip my chance to be pinned :P

night guin

Anonymous

@Christopher Fighter of the dayguin

Christopher

@Mego :|

Zacharý

._.

Christopher

@Mego Then everything changed when the dayguin Nation attacked. Only the Penguin, master of all two guins, could stop them. But when the world needed him most, he vanished. A hundred years passed and my brother and I discovered the new Penguin, an nightguin named Mego.

Dennis

3:31 AM

Cast your votes in the 2018 Moderator Election!

11

Christopher

:|

just :|

Dennis

wtf (why the face)

Christopher

lol

19 mins ago, by Christopher

Vote for your PPCG moderators!

ATaco

Best of luck to everyone up for election!

Dennis

Ah, sorry. I only read the transcript up to the ping.

Christopher

3:35 AM

all good :P

ATaco

This is a rather tough decision this time 'round.

Christopher

mego didn't want to pin it

@ATaco I know right

Conor O'Brien

4:24 AM

I have no words

New Main Posts

0

Q: Print Pascal's Triangle

Overview Pascal's triangle is the series of rows of numbers, starting with 1, where each cell is formed by summing the two above it. Here's an example. Challenge and Scoring The challenge is simple: given a number, print that many rows of Pascal's Triangle in as few characters as possible. Low...

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Largest output with smallest code: Using any language you prefer, output the most text you can with the shortest amount of code. (You are not allowed to use loops) All output characters should be english letters, punctuation marks or symbols found on common keyboards (Note that this does allow ...

Esolanging Fruit

4:40 AM

Woohoo just got one rep from an undownvote \o/

DJMcMayhem

@ConorO'Brien Looks like Dr Seuss

MD XF

4:58 AM

Attention: In under 24 hours two answers (1, 2) by Esolanging Fruit are about to become the first safe submissions to the new Programming Language Quiz. If anyone can crack them, please do!

MD XF

5:09 AM

(nvm only the second one, I just cracked the first one)

HyperNeutrino

why does this not work? :1 doesn't match L("1") so since it's OPTIONAL shouldn't it skip and try to match the separator?

quartata

@MDXF second one might be 123 but interperter is written in visual basic

MD XF

@quartata trying it out, do you want credit if it works?

quartata

eh

if it is 123 it's been deliberately obfuscated

the other digits are no ops

MD XF

Interpreter is still running

quartata

5:17 AM

That Underload one is pretty nice

MD XF

As soon as I noticed all matching [] and () I tried Underload

quartata

@MDXF probably stuck in a loop then

MD XF

It was waiting for input. It's not 123

quartata

Golunar?

MD XF

I think I tried that already but I'll check again

quartata

5:18 AM

hm hm hm

MD XF

I can't find an interpreter

nor do I have the motivation to write one

quartata

use the bash script to convert it to unary

er sorry brainfuck

MD XF

The bash script converts Brainfuck to Golunar

not the other way around

quartata

hm there has to be one out there since I've seen it in answers

MD XF

@quartata answerers have just been manually converting it

Eh, I'll just be happy that I cracked the Underload one, ping me if this is indeed Golunar

gn o/

HyperNeutrino

5:21 AM

I think Golunar -> Brainfuck is just convert decimal number to binary, lpad zeroes, chunk into 3s

quartata

Yeah

HyperNeutrino

It becomes

<-],],++].-..[<]]<>[+..],[>.,][<.<.<[].++-.,]--<<.,>[,><][<<<.]>>],[[]+<,<->-,+--‌+..<,-<],[+>-<-]>.<+[->[,,>->][],],+].<],[[>,>+.[.],-]-.[>++>-<+.+><<+<.>,<<]+[--]‌+[-<..+>,<]<-<[<[+,<>[,+>,>[[]+-[<[][+<]>><.,..-><>>],>]<<<>+,[]<.-<[],++,[.[.,->‌[>]+-.-++[-,[[.+],>++[-[+-<,-->,,,.-,..][--<++<[.]<.>,,,<[,[-,.].<[+,>[>->,-<<]-[<[‌,<..[>+,]->].+-<.

which isn't valid Brainfuck

wait nvm I forgot about the significant 1

ATaco

I want to do a blog post about bootstrappin' brainfuck

quartata

@HyperNeutrino even with it's no good

Which surprised me because it was padded correctly

Oh wait it wasn't actually

one extra digit

Wait wait

It was

Forgot that bin starts with a 0b

unary spec is a little vague on whether it's big or little endian, that could make a difference

sample golunar program is big endian

so I guess that's that

dylnan

6:22 AM

Does the second half of this comment appear backwards to anyone else?

ATaco

Yes

dylnan

What is going on there?

Οurous

the link doesn't jump to a comment for me

lol

Can we do a challenge about 'long language, short interpreter'

Οurous

6:45 AM

that sounds familiar

Pavel

Does anyone know if Windows comes with a C# compiler by default?

lol

I don't think it does

but you can get a redistributable package

nvm just get a compiler

Οurous

@Pavel IIRC MSBuild comes with the .NET framework, which current versions of windows come with

Pavel

\o/

lol

do we have a standalone msbuild tho

Οurous

6:53 AM

@Pavel Yeah they do, just checked. Find it under C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework%ARCHITECTURE%\%VERSION%\MSBuild.exe

lol

oh we do

visualstudio.com/ko/downloads there's build tools down there :D

nevermind the locale

Οurous

@lol didn't even notice tbh, it changed to the right one when I loaded it

lol

Οurous

8:05 AM

Is there a unicode character for an arrow with heads in all four cardinal directions?

trichoplax

@Mego Good idea. I see Dennis has dealt with it.

Fatalize

@Οurous Seems like no

Adám

9:03 AM

@Οurous No, but some are close: 🕂✢⧾🜊✣

Solver

10:04 AM

@Downgoat haha same - I didn't know how much I would like C++

What development IDE(s) do you use regularly? -> strawpoll.me/15064026

flawr

@Οurous 🟇 ?

user202729

@Christopher Are you sure that it's UTC time?

@MDXF Have you tried not giving any input ('</dev/null')?

Adám

10:20 AM

@Solver What about Other?

user202729

Anyone try Headsecks?

(ref implementation link broken now)

( for codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/155090 )

I tried 7, doesn't work.

Adám

@Solver Notepad? Notepad++?

Fatalize

@Solver IntelliJ IDEA?

flawr

@Solver MATLAB? :)

Adám

@Solver Dyalog IDE, and sometimes RIDE.

Οurous

10:54 AM

@Solver CleanIDE, and (already mentioned) NP++

Solver

haha - shows you my inexperience with development IDE's

Οurous

@Solver you'll get so many IDEs as a response here that most developers won't ever hear of, let alone use.

Oh yeah and Xamarin

Adám

@Solver There certainly are a lot of them out there:

Comparison of integrated development environments

The following tables list notable software packages that are nominal IDEs; standalone tools such as source code editors and GUI builders are not included. These IDEs are listed in alphabetical order of the supported language. == ActionScript == == Ada == == Assembly == == BASIC == == C/C++ == == C# == == Common Lisp == == Component Pascal == == D == == Eiffel == == Fortran == == Groovy == == Haskell == == Haxe == Go to this page: Comparison of IDE choices for Haxe programmers == Java == Java has strong IDE support, due not only to its historical and economic ...

Solver

@Οurous probably a natural side-effect of the kinds of language used here

btw, is there an IDE for Jelly :D

user202729

11:15 AM

Esoteric IDE? Does it have Jelly?

Martin Ender

no

totallyhuman

lol a golfing ide would be great

Adám

@Solver That would be so cool. Imaging stepping though Jelly's built-ins and inspecting arguments as you go along…

user202729

Can anyone try some of the (lowest numbered) languages codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/40562/… ? (Again, for this)

totallyhuman

@Adám and a proper way to go through documentation

Adám

11:28 AM

@totallyhuman I'd like to hover the mouse over any built-in and get a tooltip. Also, when stepping through the code, atom-by-atom, it should display all arguments and description of current atom.

New Main Posts

0

Q: Magic square variation

I am reposting this from maths.stackexchage - maybe someone can find a solution using programming! https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/2640001/magic-square-variation The reason I post it here is because I think it is impossible to solve!

arithmetic

totallyhuman

I think this is intended to be PHP, but it is missing a starting <?php tag. — totallyhuman 1 min ago

php programs need that right?

...or not

Blue

11:56 AM

They do?

New Main Posts

12:13 PM

1

Q: Can you outgolf Bill Gates?

Pancake sorting is the colloquial term for the mathematical problem of sorting a disordered stack of pancakes in order of size when a spatula can be inserted at any point in the stack and used to flip all pancakes above it. A pancake number P(n) is the minimum number of flips required ...

code-golf number sorting optimization stack

Mr. Xcoder

1:09 PM

@HyperNeutrino I actually gave up on the idea, because after refining my formula, I could do it in 2 bytes of Jelly ;-;

HyperNeutrino

oh lol

Mr. Xcoder

Because I noticed that the nth layer is, in fact, a multiplication table of the nth row in Pascal's triangle with itself

And therefore getting the element on the nth layer, on the rth row and cth column is literally just binom(n, r) * binom(n, c)...

HyperNeutrino

oh lol :/ that makes it a bit less of an interesting challenge than I originally thought :P interesting idea though

Mr. Xcoder

Thanks... I liked the idea a lot, but it is definitely pointless to post now that I found this...

My history teacher cannot teach this week so we left school earlier today :)

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder Don't worry; history repeats itself.

Mr. Xcoder

1:15 PM

I hate history nonetheless.

HyperNeutrino

wait you don't have a concept of substitute teachers, you just leave class? o_O

Mr. Xcoder

We do have substitute teachers, but they won't come unless it's in the middle of the day. It was the last class so they thought they better let us go home :P

HyperNeutrino

oh wow lucky D:

i wish i could leave school early lol

Mr. Xcoder

All the classes today sucked (except for maths): Chemistry (we haven't done anything today :|), Latin (ಠ_ಠ), Biology (ಠ_ಠ), German (ಠ_ಠ_ಠ)

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder Latin‽

HyperNeutrino

1:26 PM

CMP: What should array[] mean in Proton? Currently it doesn't parse.

Adám

@HyperNeutrino I wish I could go back to school.

HyperNeutrino

lol

Mr. Xcoder

@Adám Yes, this thing

HyperNeutrino

Well actually I wish I could just finish all of high school in the next year ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I don't really learn that much especially from science and math class lol.

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder I guessed that it wasn't a dance class. They teach you to read (or speak) Latin?

Mr. Xcoder

1:27 PM

Same...

dzaima

@HyperNeutrino are arrays mutable? if so, create a new copy of the items

HyperNeutrino

They are. That's what I was thinking. So a[] == a[:]?

Mr. Xcoder

@Adám Reading mostly, pronunciation rules, and the history of the Roman Empire :S

(sorry for the pings)

Adám

@HyperNeutrino I felt stupid spending three years in high school even though I took a University entry test during my second year — and passed with a higher score than my final HS score.

@Mr.Xcoder I like pings.

Mr. Xcoder

@HyperNeutrino Ugh...

dzaima

1:29 PM

@HyperNeutrino seems so. IMO [:] is unintuitive.

or maybe deep copy? That'd get confusing quick though

Mr. Xcoder

I just realised array{} doesn't parse in Physica either lol

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder Latin Pronunciation? That doesn't exist.

HyperNeutrino

@Adám lol I have to spend 4 whole years here and I'm not really even learning much from most of my courses lol. I started learning uni-year-1 level math stuff in grade 8 and understood it all and scored like 80%-tile among actual university students on the same test ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Mr. Xcoder

@Adám Yes, there are some rules: ae -> æ -> e for example

I hate the fact that our system (the one in Romania) discourages independent learning...

Like I know how to derive some types of functions and at the same time they teach us what a function is ;-;

HyperNeutrino

our system seems to discourage that quite a bit as well. it also seems to discourage individual thinking styles lol. i got a ton of math marks taken off just because i didn't do it the teacher's way (which, mind you, wasn't even the proper way half the time)

Mr. Xcoder

1:32 PM

And professors that say When you enter that door you only know what I taught yet and don't accept questions about topics we haven't reached yet

HyperNeutrino

(teachers seem to not understand the concept of students knowing things that they weren't ~~forced to memorize~~ taught yet)

dzaima

@HyperNeutrino yeah, I've just gotten used to do school the teacher way, not caring about correctness :p

Mr. Xcoder

@HyperNeutrino The only thing our system doesn't discourage (apart from laziness lol) is individual thinking, and I am very happy about that. All the grading sheets include a note saying that Any other correct solution should be awarded full marks

HyperNeutrino

@dzaima the thing is like i'd rather my math mark drop 1-2% than me lose my form and forget how to do it properly

@Mr.Xcoder oo that's nice. that was mostly just my math teacher from last year and the year before; this year it's a lot better because my math teacher is an actual mathematician

dzaima

@HyperNeutrino well then don't forget the proper way if the subject is important to you, and if anyone notices, blame school :p

HyperNeutrino

1:36 PM

lol

dzaima

@HyperNeutrino my maths teacher just tells me to stay quiet in math lessons, I know way too much :p

mudkip201

lol

HyperNeutrino

well my math mark dropped from 98-99 to 97 and it's grade 10 math so the mark really doesn't matter that much

Mr. Xcoder

And now I hate the Romanian ministry of education because they've scheduled the national stage of both the Chemistry and the Physics olympiad in the same ~~day~~ week (they both last 1 week)!

Fatalize

@HyperNeutrino I don't want to be unsensitive, but students also often do not understand the value of following a well-constructed teaching program

HyperNeutrino

1:37 PM

@Fatalize I agree with you, but I also think "well-constructed teaching program" doesn't suit the teaching program here :P

dzaima

@Fatalize it's just very annoying to have the teacher tell you that you can't take a square root of a negative number :p

HyperNeutrino

Of course, this is all based on my opinion, and I'm ~~slightly~~ very biased against the school system because it doesn't let me move quickly enough through the content to match my pace and also because they almost didn't let me skip grade 9 math

Fatalize

@dzaima Well in |R you can't, so most likely the teacher is right

Mr. Xcoder

@HyperNeutrino We are not allowed to skip grades under any circumstance.

HyperNeutrino

ooh rip

Fatalize

1:40 PM

Sure it's fun dealing with i² = -1 and all, but if you don't properly teach what complex numbers are, what roots are, etc., it's just something you'll know that will ultimately be useless in your future work

The valuable part is understanding how these things are defined and why

dzaima

@HyperNeutrino (related) for the 9th grade exams coming up my speech part is about why I think school is horrible :p

HyperNeutrino

lol :P

Mr. Xcoder

\o/ It's my first Jelly answer I've written in less than 1 minute since I started

Erik the Outgolfer

where I live, they won't let us take any root of a negative number, for example the third root of -8 doesn't exist, but the negative of the third root of 8 does

Mr. Xcoder

Same...

Erik the Outgolfer

1:43 PM

also ŒḂÐf -> fU$

HyperNeutrino

we haven't done third roots \o/

Adám

@dzaima I taught my 5yo that + and × are commutative while – and ÷ are not. Wonder what happens if he starts asking questions in school…

New Main Posts

1

Q: Length of the Longest Palindromic Substring

A palindrome is a string which is the same when read forwards and backwards. For example "racecar" is a palindrome, but "Racecar" is not. A substring is a contiguous set of characters in a larger string. Your task is to write a program or method which takes a string or character array as input an...

code-golf string palindrome

Mr. Xcoder

@HyperNeutrino Nor have I... BAH

We haven't even defined non-natural-number powers.

Solver

@dzaima my primary school teacher once said that 1 is prime.

HyperNeutrino

1:45 PM

neither have we lol

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder In Denmark, normal school is 10 or 11 years + 3 years high school. I went to school a total of 9 years before going to University.

Solver

I've been in school for 8 years now

on my 9th year right now

Mr. Xcoder

@Adám o_O Here there's a new thing called "Grade 0", then 8 mandatory years + highschool, which is split in two parts: 2 mandatory years + 2 optional ones (which everyone does because otherwise you lose certain privileges)

ngn

@Adám he'll discover lied to him when he learns about matrix multiplication - it's not commutative :)

HyperNeutrino

I think Grade 0 is similar to kindergarten here (german based term)

Solver

1:47 PM

@Mr.Xcoder Our grade zero is called reception in the UK

dzaima

@Adám I remember some post somewhere in which a student was subtracted marks because they illustrated something like 3×5 as 5 lots of 3 things instead of 3 lots of 5 things.......

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder Yeah, 0, 1…9, 10 is optional, then 11–13.

Mr. Xcoder

@HyperNeutrino Oh there 4 years of kindergarten here before Grade 0.

Solver

@dzaima kinda depressing

Erik the Outgolfer

@Mr.Xcoder how many years old until you go to kindergarten?

HyperNeutrino

1:49 PM

well that makes sense, because multiplication is only commutative in certain fields(/rings? idk), but I doubt that's the reason the teacher did it

Mr. Xcoder

And I hate 0/0 doesn't make sense instead of explaining why it doesn't make sense.

@EriktheOutgolfer 3.

Adám

@ngn Or quaternions/octonion math…

dzaima

@Solver as illustrated by the ellipsisessieses at the end of the sentence :p

Solver

@Adám what are quaternions :(

Mr. Xcoder

An extension to complex numbers

Solver

1:50 PM

oh

Adám

@Solver Like complex numbers but 4D instead of 2D.

Solver

I haven't reached your heights of education yet :)

dzaima

@Solver I haven't either but I've seen some youtube videos about quaternions :p

Anonymous

@HyperNeutrino That's a BS reason, and I doubt that any math teacher that would mark off points for such a stupid reason would even consider the non-commutativity of multiplication in certain fields

Mr. Xcoder

@Solver Shh, you're in grade 9, i'm in grade 8.

Solver

1:51 PM

how old are people in grade 8?

Adám

@dzaima What is the plural of ellipsis…… ellipses is the plural of ellipse…

Mr. Xcoder

@Solver ~14 yo.

dzaima

14

Q: How to pluralize ellipsis?

It's obviously ellipsisessieses. Inspired by a chat message. Your challenge Given a list or space or comma-separated string of words, ellipsisessiesesify them. To ellipsisessieses-ify a word: Start with the word. Add the first letter of the original word to the end. Add 2 of the last letter...

code-golf string

Adám

@dzaima NARS APL has built-in support.

Fatalize

@Solver Quartenions are used in 3D engines and things like this. Octonions are mostly useless afaik

Solver

1:52 PM

@Mr.Xcoder so I'm in grade 7 :D

i'm 13

HyperNeutrino

@Mego yeah I certainly agree that the teacher's just being dumb removing those marks ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I think I was docked marks for that once so I just did it the way the teacher wanted to get marks lol

Anonymous

In my experience, such teachers are there to fill a seat, not because they are good at math

4

Adám

Ellipses

Ellipses is the plural form of two different English words: Ellipse, a type of conic section in geometry Ellipsis, a three-dot punctuation mark (…) Ellipses may also refer to: Ellipses, a French publication under the direction of Aymeric Chauprade == See also == Ellipse (disambiguation) Ellipsis (disambiguation)...

HyperNeutrino

well people actually good at math wouldn't go teach high school grade <10 math lol

Mr. Xcoder

CMP: What is your dream job?

Solver

1:53 PM

@Mego My school is known for being selective, so we have some decent teachers in maths and science

Fatalize

@Mr.Xcoder Explaining why requires way more knowledge than necessary to deal with simple fractions. Attempting to explain every detail is impossible and unnecessary

Mr. Xcoder

We have some of the best science teachers in the country (except for biology), but the maths ones aren't as good :)

HyperNeutrino

@Mr.Xcoder probably freelance programmer because that way I can do things at my own pace and I don't have to work with people ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Erik the Outgolfer

@Adám that's why the j is case-sensitive there :P

dzaima

@Adám I know there is a correct pluralization, I just wanted to say that for the challange :p

Mr. Xcoder

1:54 PM

@Fatalize I know what explaining requires.

Adám

@Mr.Xcoder Full time APL teacher, I think.

Fatalize

Otherwise you'd have to teach set theory to 6yo children so that they can use integers

Solver

@Mr.Xcoder software engineer/maybe some form of manager

Fatalize

@Mr.Xcoder So you'd also know why it's not a good idea to explain it to 14 year olds, most of whose don't have the tools to understand any of it

@Mr.Xcoder What should we answer if we have a job?

Mr. Xcoder

@Fatalize Your job isn't necessarily your dream job.

Adám

1:57 PM

@EriktheOutgolfer Apparently to distinguish 1J2 which is 1i2 and 1j2 which is 1i0j2.

Erik the Outgolfer

@Adám exactly

sacrifices...

Solver

@Fatalize Yes, but I think that a teacher should know the fuzzy outlines of the future, or at least be able to google them.

ngn

@Fatalize I wish I was taught (axiomatic) set theory when I was 14

HyperNeutrino

> Imagine that you have zero cookies and you split them evenly among zero friends. How many cookies does each person get? See? It doesn't make sense. And Cookie Monster is sad that there are no cookies. And you are sad that you have no friends.

Fatalize

@Mr.Xcoder Rentier with many assets then, so that I can do whatever the hell I want

dzaima

1:58 PM

@Fatalize IMO it's better to have heard why it's impossible rather than just know that it's impossible. Explaining extraneous things for those that can comprehend it is one of the reasons my chemistry teacher is awesome

HyperNeutrino

no fancy math stuff required, just cookies and cookie monster \o/

Adám

@HyperNeutrino IIRC, my son said one because every number divided by itself is 1.

Fatalize

@dzaima Most of the time people will not be able to understand the real reason why it's impossible

Mr. Xcoder

^^^^, but it's not technically impossible

HyperNeutrino

hm that would make sense for first thought

ngn

1:59 PM

@Fatalize many users of APL still don't understand it :)

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