English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Monica

1:00 PM

Yes, I forgot about the quotes

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I disagree. "Do you yourself joke around?" more like.

Monica

So 'I joked that' ............ is wrong

KitFox

@Monica indignant No it isn't!

Mitch

yes

er correct

Monica

'I joked when I said..........' is right

Mitch

1:00 PM

oh

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox "Do you yourself joke around" has a totally different meaning to me than "do you joke yourself". In the latter, "yourself" is the object of "joke" while in the former it's an intensifier on "you"

Monica

I am confused now

Mitch

sorry..I'll be quiet now and let @KitFox say stuff

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Would read it as an intensifier in both cases.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox I would read it as an intensifier only if it was "Do you joke, yourself?"

KitFox

1:02 PM

The man asked what he should call me. I joked that he could call me whatever he wanted, just as long it wasn't late for dinner.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox You joked "that", you didn't joke "him"

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 pfft Commas.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yes. I know.

That's why I would read "Do you joke yourself?" as intensified. Otherwise it doesn't make sense.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Especially in a question like "Do you X yourself", it really seems like "you" are doing something to "yourself"

@KitFox when someone is asking a question about "is this phrase correct" I usually assume that it might not make sense :)

KitFox

You think a comma is really required there?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox "Do you hit yourself?" vs "Do you hit, yourself?"

KitFox

1:04 PM

@Monica "I joked that" but "I was joking when."

@MrShinyandNew安宇 "Do you cook yourself?"

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

So Monica, can you rephrase the question "Do you joke yourself" without using the word "joke"?

@KitFox exactly: that's a better example

Monica

Hmmm

I am thinking

KitFox

26 mins ago, by KitFox

I am quite irascible.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 How about "Don't kid yourself" just to make it interesting?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

It doesn't make much sense to cook oneself but in a context of "does this sentence work?" I think we have to be sure of the intended meaning

@KitFox But you can kid yourself, and you can yourself kid (others)

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Precisely.

Monica

1:06 PM

I will show you the context where I found it

KitFox

That's what makes it interesting.

Monica

'Any doctor is a good psychologist.'

"That means you are also a doctor'.

'No'.

'But you said you are.'

'Hw often do you hear jokes? And joke yourself?'

Maybe the context is stupid :D, but this is where I found it

KitFox

"And joke yourself?" = "And make jokes yourself?"

I think.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Ah. In this case, "and joke yourself" means "and make jokes, yourself"

jinx

user19161

Indeed.

Monica

1:11 PM

So was that correct or not?

KitFox

Or you could say "And joke around, yourself?" (that comma still feels awkward to me)

@Monica It is correct.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

It is correct. But when you strip it down from "How often do you hear jokes? and joke yourself?" to "... do you ... joke yourself?" it becomes harder to understand.

user19161

@KitFox Yeah, I think it shouldn't be there.

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Right. And it ought to be "And joke, yourself?" then?

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…