The h Bar

6:00 PM

@Sid It really depends. There have been posts that personally attack other users. Don't you think it's ok for a mod to nuke that?

@DavidZ Interesting. I tend to prefer less information about the OP's state of mind and more just getting to the physics.

Everyone has their own style.

Sid

Absolutely. There isn't much of a second opinion in that case. My point is, closure of border-line questions should be left to the community rather than mods.

DanielSank

I would agree.

Obviously, the issue remains that what is "borderline" to you or to me may not be to a particular moderator.

It is of interest to discuss with the moderators how they view certain issues. They all have different opinions.

David Z

@DanielSank Yeah, I mean, that's just my off-the-cuff attempt to come up with an introduction that links the previous question in line. You could just as well do "[ask the question]? This came up [in previous question](link) because..."

DanielSank

@DavidZ Yup. So many ways to ask a thing.

Sid

Exactly. Having 5 community members chipping in with close votes is much better than a single mod hammering it for closure.

David Z

6:03 PM

It's not the stuff about the user's state of mind that I really care about, it's about having descriptive link text and also about having the question written in a way that makes sense even if the link weren't there

DanielSank

The fraction of {possible ways to word a question} that are {not terrible} is pretty low...

@Sid It depends on the question.

In general, I agree.

That was actually one of the reasons I didn't want to run for moderator some time ago. The ironic thing in my case is that I've stopped working on the close queue anyway, lol.

It's weird that mods can't cast non-binding close votes.

Sid

Their close votes being binding, if they close too much, it makes them look dictatorial IMO.

But, Physics SE has much sterner rules.

So, I guess it is fine if mods close questions which violate policy.

DanielSank

So, my personal take on this is that it's much, much better to edit a question to make it better rather than close it.

David Z

@Sid The advantage of mods unilaterally closing questions is that they get closed more quickly - that is, quicker feedback for the asker and a more effective disincentive to ask off-topic/unclear/etc questions. Our view is that, if a question would definitely get closed anyway, it might as well happen quickly rather than slowly. (Plus, if we do make a mistake the question can be reopened by the community, it's not like it's irreversible)

@DanielSank Of course those aren't mutually exclusive options - it's supposed to be close, then edit, then reopen.

Although I guess if you can immediately see how to edit the question into shape, it is best to just do that.

DanielSank

@DavidZ That's interesting. One effect that could be in play there is that if a n00b's question is closed by a mod, they see that as one jerk closing their question instead of a whole community.

@DavidZ Yeah I sometimes wonder whether newish users get that.

David Z

6:08 PM

@DanielSank Hm, good point

DanielSank

Having a question closed feels crappy.

@DavidZ Yup.

That's how I'd feel, anyway.

If a community closes a question I am waaaaay more likely to think "oh, I should learn the rules here".

If a mod closes it, I'm focused on that one name. That one guy who ruined my day and is keeping me from doing my homework or whatever.

David Z

@DanielSank Probably not. It's an unusual system. Clearing that up was the point of calling it "on hold" for the first seven days; I would assume that helps a bit, but I'm not sure how much.

DanielSank

@DavidZ Yeah, hard to know.

This, by the way, is why I think the right way to think about close reasons is "what do I want to convey to newer users about how they can write better questions", rather than "how do I logically explain the criteria by which this question is unacceptable".

It's like, if your math homework is wrong, and the teacher writes "Wrong, matrices are commutative" that's less useful than "Matrices aren't commutative. Take a look at the commutator to make this work out".

I think we do a reasonably good job at this in the homework close reason, actually!

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