@EliahKagan I must make that Q&A I promised to do...

[ Natty | Sentinel ] drive Hex editor for open drives By: ext2diver 4.0;

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, potentially bad ns for domain in answer, blacklisted user (157): 16.04 - How do I install Canon Pixma MG3620 driver? by will smith on askubuntu.com

[ Natty | Sentinel ] 16.04 16.04 - How do I install Canon Pixma MG3620 driver? By: will smith 3.5;

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, potentially bad ns for domain in answer, potentially bad keyword in answer, blacklisted user (158): How to get Canon Pixma MG3660 to scan? by will smith on askubuntu.com

[ Natty | Sentinel ] networking Internet not working on Ubunto18.04 with Virtualbox on Windows By: Vis 5.0;

[ Natty | Sentinel ] password How to decode the hash password in /etc/shadow By: LaraFlow 3.5;

[ Natty | Sentinel ] virtualization VT-x is enabled, but ubuntu 18.04 doesn't show it By: Wonk Edhan 4.5;

@Natty report askubuntu.com/a/1165585/22949

[ Natty | Sentinel ] Link to Post Low Length; No Code Block; One Line only; Low Rep; 3.0;

unclear (or too broad, or off-topic)

@Natty report askubuntu.com/a/1165612/22949

[ Natty | Sentinel ] Link to Post Low Length; No Code Block; Low Rep; Unregistered User; 3.0;

That's actually a post where the VLQ flag would apply!

But I flagged NAA. Darn. Well, maybe I'll have another opportunity to flag something VLQ in a few more years. :)

I flagged VLQ and then cast the third delete vote, thus scoring a helpful VLQ flag

and yet... cheating is just unsatisfying

I don't think it's cheating if the flag is correct.

Although one might argue that the VLQ flag is absurd and any usage of it that ends up being approved as helpful is cheating.

haha yes

except for LMGTFY posts

@Zanna If I saw an answer that existed for the sole purpose of delivering an LMGTFY link, I think I'd flag that "rude or abusive."

@EliahKagan If there was something else in the answer then I'd edit the answer.

@EliahKagan fair

→ 5 messages moved to Island of castaway thoughts

@Natty tp

I further clarified What version of the Realtek Audio driver is my system using? (as it's now titled) with an edit in addition to the edit the OP made. I recommend reopening it.

@Natty report askubuntu.com/a/1165693/22949

[ Natty | Sentinel ] Link to Post Low Length; No Code Block; Low Rep; Unregistered User; 2.5;

Is this question clear enough to answer?

I don't think this question is off-topic. The information the OP gave, including information that was provided by running commands in Ubuntu to gather information, indicated that it was a hardware problem. Based on that, an answer was posted.

As far as I am aware, we do not in general consider questions about what turns out to be a hardware problem off-topic. I think it has to either be "not about Ubuntu" (which doesn't apply here because the question is about how to use diagnostic information from Ubuntu) or "no repro" (which doesn't apply here because the connection between the information that was given and the conclusion that it's a hardware problem may help other Ubuntu users).

I'm not sure what we have, policy-wise, for this, other than just none of the close reasons actually covering problems just because they turn out to be in hardware.

We have Are questions about problems later revealed to be common hardware issues “too localized”? which I'd be inclined to support my view on this (at least weakly)... but that's old and we don't have "too localized" anymore.

Also, I think the particular question I had used as an example is one that we would consider no repro these days.

I see no reason why this question would be no-repro.

I think it's broad instead of being off-topic

I agree. It's not actually off-topic, because the OP is asking how to find out how much RAM the VM is by running commands in the VM, which they can totally do. I think the best thing to do at this point is close it as too broad or unclear, though Ic could see an argument for leaving it open. Also, maybe it's somehow related to their other question.

I picked too broad. I don't want it closed as off-topic, and I think it's reasonable to close it. If they clarify or narrow it, it can be reopened. If it's closed as off-topic, that's way less likely to happen, because of the wrong perception that what they're asking for can't or shouldn't be done in the Ubuntu guest system.

I'm hoping for a third too-broad vote. We'll see what happens.

@EliahKagan The question is more like "What can I do with Ubuntu in VM? What are its limitations?"

How would we define "Native Ubuntu" by the way?

@Kulfy I don't know. They probably read that somewhere.

@Kulfy Yeah, that seems to be part of what they want to know. I've commented but I understand you might not agree with my reasoning regarding how the question could be made adequately narrow.

Anyway, what an Ubuntu virtual machine can do is still about Ubuntu, so that makes it more overly broad, but still doesn't make it off-topic. I definitely think you're right to have picked the "too broad" reason. (I had at first been leaning toward "unclear" but "too broad" is better here.)

Closed as too broad

Excellent.

> it also asks "Is Ubuntu VM capable of creating Yocto Project?" I think this question is too-broad

This looks little odd to me.

How so?

(I can delete and replace the comment if it's unclear or wrong.)

Or do you just mean the bad hyphen?

It's like "Is Ubuntu capable of creating Java Projects?".

Or, you mean that part of their question.

The part of your comment, I'm not sure how can we say that supporting something is too broad?

Oh.

The question is too broad because it's asking multiple questions that aren't tightly connected in any clear way.

I see what you mean though in that the way I phrased it is ambiguous and could give the impression that I think that other question is itself too broad. But I think the second half of my comment clarifies what I think is wrong with the post and why I think it's too broad.

Anyway, I think they might want to know if an Ubuntu VM has enough memory for what they want to do. They seem unaware that you can adjust the memory. Perhaps that's part of why people wanted to closed it as off-topic (though that wasn't mentioned).

@EliahKagan Agreed. That's why I mentioned only that line here.

Yeah.

If you think that line makes the whole comment too confusing, I'll delete and replace the comment. (Since you're not me, you automatically have a better perspective than mine about how people who are not me will understand my comment. :) ) Otherwise, I'll just try to write clearer in the future when I'm saying why I think things are too broad.

@EliahKagan Well that depends on the fact that how much memory they have provided in VM. Wouldn't that make it unclear?

@EliahKagan IMO it isn't needed if guiverc don't point out that line.

I mean deletion the comment isn't needed. :)

@Kulfy Maybe. I don't know.

@Kulfy Yes, I understand.

Melebius's comment is good.

Yeah.

Sometimes choosing close reason is tough :(

Yes. I was actually writing a message here asking what should be done with that question, when your message appeared.

Well I found this after googling "Native Ubuntu". But not sure if this is relevant.

@EliahKagan Leave it as it as?

@Kulfy I meant about whether or not it should be closed (because it was open at the time) and with what close reason. Yeah, now I wouldn't do any further actions on it.

Oh I see.

@EliahKagan it seems fine indeed, but could it have a more descriptive title? I just edited it fairly superficially, but I don't know what title to use

Sorry for confusing myself :P

@Zanna I suspect it could, but I'm not sure what title would be better either.

ok

[ Natty | Sentinel ] 14.04 Pac ssh manager on Ubuntu 14.04 does not work By: Marcio Roberto Geraldo 4.5;

@Natty tp

^^^ It's a thanks post.

gkovacs deserve an upvote then. :-D

@EliahKagan yes. That's often the case :)

[ Natty | Sentinel ] atom How to open a terminal from within Atom? By: Joe Giusti 5.0;

[ Natty | Sentinel ] apache2 PHP not working after updating from 5 to 7 By: Dalila Giovana Pagnoncelli Lap 6.5;

@Natty tp

[ Natty | Sentinel ] touchpad Touchpad mysteries By: J Christoffersen 4.5;

@Natty report askubuntu.com/a/1165729/816190

[ Natty | Sentinel ] Link to Post Low Length; No Code Block; Low Rep; 2.5;

@Natty tp

@Kulfy Isn't that recommending a specific course of action intended to solve the problem described in the question?

Actually I think that might even work, because it appears the script is using su to attempt to elevate to root to do its work. If it starts as root, it should either not bother doing that, or use su but trivially succeed because it's already running as root.

Yeah but I think question looks more about su:Authetication failure. I think it looks more like a dupe of this

Any idea?

@Kulfy The OP can only run sudo instead of su if they're running su in the first place. If the script is doing it then, short of editing the script, they'll have to run the script in a different way, like with sudo, like that answer says to do. If they are using su, then they should use sudo instead, which that answer also makes clear how to do. Either way, I think that answer is definitely not NAA. Even if it's wrong (which I don't think it is), it's not NAA.

But you've reported it to Natty as NAA. Am I missing something that would make it NAA? Alternatively, had you meant to paste in a different link in your @Natty report message?

@Natty report askubuntu.com/a/1165751/22949

@EliahKagan Post already reported

@EliahKagan The one thing that is wrong with that answer is the bit about "in root mode." I've commented.

[ Natty | Sentinel ] server Using scp betweeen two machines with same PEM key By: Martin 4.0;

@EliahKagan Makes sense. Is their a way to invalidate the report?

@Natty fp

Invalidated the previous feedback on askubuntu.com/a/1165729

@Kulfy Yes. :)

I wasn't actually sure if users could invalidate their own feedback until recently, but it's totally supported.

(I don't know if a report is technically "feedback" or not but I would've been quite surprised if it hadn't worked.)

I think this question about how to install word lists should be reopened.

(The answer makes especially clear that the question is in practice a question about Ubuntu.)

@EliahKagan Casted my reopen vote. Not sure what I was thinking when that appeared in review queue.

How do I report a Natty's bug?

Did you find a bug in Natty, or are you just wondering in general? (It doesn't matter that much, as the answer for how to report a bug will be the same either way.)

There's some information about Natty including resources for it and contact people at:

There's a GitHub repo for it which isn't directly linked there. I think the GitHub issue tracker is used for bugs. Let me check.

There's more links in this room that are relevant:

This is the GitHub repo for Natty:

github.com/SOBotics/Natty

(Huh, I expected that one to onebox. A handful of non-SE sites' pages do.)

See whenever a post is reported it creates a feedback page on Sentinel regarding that, for example, this. Although the name of the user who gave feedback is right but the link is incorrect. It links to chat.stackoverflow instead of chat.stackexchange, thus linking to the chat profile of somebody else whose chat id is same as yours in SE chat..

Oh, interesting.

Yeah, I agree that's a bug.

It should, at minimum, not link to an account that belongs to a different user.

For example your SE chat id is 26825. But Natty links to Dave. Note that their user id on SO chat is also 26825

I don't know if that bug is in Natty or in something else related to Sentinel.

Is it worth reporting or may be we should invite Bhargav?

Either way or both seems reasonable to me. :)

I don't know if the bug is in Natty or Sentinel but the repo for Sentinel, which also tracks issues through GitHub, is:

github.com/ArtOfCode-/Sentinel

(Info from github.com/SOBotics/Natty/blob/…)

(unrelated) This is cool:

@karel I think it may be best to have them both open. I've posted a "Related:" comment on each one linking to the other.

Btw, I recall you're active in SOBotics. Do you happen to know whether the bug Kulfy found is a bug in Natty or in Sentinel?

Not too many people flag comments I think.

I'm waiting for karel to reply before taking any action like reporting that bug.

Okay.

@Zanna That was a strangely worded promise. :)

Not OT

Agreed. I'm out out CV reviews for the day, though, so I can't click Leave Open on it as yet.

Waits for 5 hours and 36 minutes

:)

Is segmentation fault always a bug?

No, but usually. The circumstances where it's not a bug are rare. It's possible to have a misconfiguration with a mismatched library version cause it... though often that's a combination of a bug and a misconfiguration.

In this case, the segfault happens in a script run by APT. I think that's almost certainly a bug.

I wonder then how GUI was able to update that.

My guess is that they could just have run apt upgrade and it would have worked. Probably everything, or enough, from the apt update, finished before the crash.

They ran:

apt update && apt upgrade

[ Natty | Sentinel ] ppa How do I install Pinta? By: channel unknown 3.5;

@EliahKagan Since apt update crashed, it had nonzero exit status (the more common way that happens is to return a nonzero exit code, but abnormal program termination where the program is killed by a signal, i.e., a crash, will also do it), which is "false" for boolean logic purposes (because Bourne-style shells treat zero as true and nonzero as false), and && is short-circuiting, so apt upgrade was never run.

@Natty tp

@EliahKagan I'll comment on their answer about that.

I've posted a comment. I'm not sure if it should be an answer (after all, I'm not flagging the OP's answer as NAA). I could post a CW answer or something. But I did vote to close the question... it would be odd to post an answer to a question I've voted to close (without retracting the vote), and they don't seem to have actually asked about how to continue with the upgrade.

Yeah. That's a pro and con at the same time of using boolean operators

Well, I'd say it's just a question of what you want to happen. Personally, I generally don't want to proceed to use the upgrade action if update fails (not without inspecting the output), so I run sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade for that reason. One can use ; instead of && if one wants the subsequent command to run regardless of the exit status of the first.

[ Natty | Sentinel ] printing Can't Detect HP Printer with HPLIP By: FalcoGer 3.5;

@EliahKagan Yeah. otherwise it'll report failed to fetch bla bla. If package info was updated long back.

@Natty fp

Is it really off-topic?

May be I'm biased here

@Kulfy Your review there is good. "Why is Python 2.7 still the default Python version in Ubuntu?" is not a duplicate of "How do I install a different Python version using apt-get?" They're at best related. And they're not all that related. A more closely related question might be one with an answer that says to just install the python3 package.

Actually, I think the question should have an answer suggesting that. I don't know if you feel that your answer would benefit from mentioning it.

Anyway, the super-short answer "Why is Python 2.7 still the default Python version in Ubuntu?" is "It's not." Not "Use this weird PPA." So it's not a duplicate of the proposed original from review.

@Kulfy I think it's on-topic. Either way, though, it would not be welcome on Stack Overflow as it is currently written. It's not a programming question. If it were interpreted as a programming question, then as written it would be a "gimme the codez" question and it would be rapidly downvoted and closed.

As a programing question on Stack Overflow, it would need to ask specific design questions that could be answered (and even that might be iffy), or it would need to show self-contained code being used to work on the problem and ask about it.

I don't think it will get closed, though, at least not based on the existing comment.

[ Natty | Sentinel ] firefox Firefox is freezing Ubuntu, how should I go about debugging it? By: Pulkownik 4.5;

@Natty ne

[ Natty | Sentinel ] migration How do I move Both Ubuntu 19.04 and Windows 10 from one hard disk to another? By: Andrea Manzi 4.5;

@Natty tp

^^^ I think that's spam. I've asked what people in Charcoal HQ think.

@EliahKagan Python 3 is installed by default. IMO installing Python 3 would be of no use since Python 3 is an essential part of the OS. Moreover if someone in future get inspired from the part which tells how to install that, might end up using some PPA to "upgrade" to the latest version updating the alternatives. And then posting something like "APT isn't working. I'm getting syntax error", etc.

If you feel such thing is important for the answer there, feel free to edit or consider posting a new answer :)

@EliahKagan IMO the below statement made it on topic

[ Natty | Sentinel ] 16.04 Configuring Bluetooth Codecs By: Telmo Felgueira 6.0;

@Kulfy You're right. Actually installing the python3 package will not be useful. It may be useful to know about how one should run the python3 command for Python 3, though.

@Natty tp