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9:00 PM
@Downgoat I've been using it on very large projects
@quartata because I don't want to install java
@Οurous ...you don't have Java installed?
@orlp Windows 10 is A) Not bad and B) supports DX12
@Pavel windows 10 is very, very bad
it's not an operating system
@quartata meaning like giant JSONs etc.
9:01 PM
it's a "service"
@quartata what would I need it for? I don't like the language, and I don't have anything that needs the runtime.
@Downgoat yes
it's basically adware as a service
posing as an os
@Οurous I can't imagine how you wouldn't have at least one app that needs JRE
@orlp Nice FUD
9:01 PM
Jelly's docs don't explain quicks >_<
it's not fud
although not having the JRE does not preclude using Eclipse or NetBeans
@moonheart08 Do you a question about a specific one? I'm no jelly expert, but I could explain some of it
@quartata have used, don't like them.
this laptop came with windows 10 installed
9:02 PM
@moonheart08 Check the 'Quicks' page in the wiki
Or ask me, Xcoder or DJ :P
during installation I was prompted for a microsoft account
I'm looking at the quicks page.
`For now this is just a list of quicks, an explanation will be added later.`
Ooh new language @cairdcoinheringaahing?
(Caird would be able to answer better :P)
which data I'd like to send to microsoft
9:03 PM
@Mr.Xcoder TAW? Yep :D
if I wanted personalized ads
You can turn all that off though
if I said no it still said I'd see ads but they'd just not be personalized
@cairdcoinheringaahing Nice, you already included plenty of code I see
why the fuck
is there even an 'ad' option in an operating system
I want to own my operating system and not have it serve me fucking ads
9:03 PM
@orlp where do you even see ads in win10?
Wow, calm down there
@orlp Yeah, I like win 10 overall, but it endlessly drives me crazy that they have to tie everything to microsoft accounts instead of local accounts
I have been using Win10 since launch and have never seen an ad.
(except that candy crush bullshit that happened at some point)
@Mr.Xcoder Yeah, I only uploaded it to GH because my sister kicked me of the computer I was writing it on :(
9:04 PM
Group policy is your friend.
@DJMcMayhem that.
what I do is just make a new MS account for everything and don't bother remembering passwords at all :p
@cairdcoinheringaahing Sometimes I like the fact that I don't have bros/sys. But sometimes I'd like some company when I am writing up esoteric answers in esoteric languages :P
It's worse when you try to set up parental controls. You have to give the child account an email, and then they have to choose to accept it in order for you to set up parental controls on that account. And in order for you to "invite them to your family", you are charged a couple bucks.
everything about windows 10 screams that you're not in control of your system and your system runs as a microsoft service
@Mr.Xcoder Nah, siblings are awful (at least at our age) :P
9:06 PM
@orlp thats why i use linux
ಠ_ಠ Someone flagged "Frozen" linked from YT lol
Year Of The Linux Desktop! (pls arrive)
@Mr.Xcoder Elsagate? :P
@DJMcMayhem They charge you a dollar to verify you have a working credit card to make sure you're actually an adult, and then they refund the dollar, iirc.
@orlp I just use win10 as a container for whatever I run in it, I don't touch anything of it :p
9:06 PM
I'm pretty sure Ubuntu did the whole ad thing first by the way
@dzaima that sounds super flawed to me though
why start your base insecure
orlp ... you and I have had very different experiences related to Windows 10
@Pavel Why should I need to go through with that to add restrictions to a non administrator account?
actually, os doesn't matter when our hardware is backdoored
Just make everything local
9:07 PM
@orlp true, but that's still better than switching in-and-out
@Mr.Xcoder Here's something to make anyone here feel old: Frozen came out 5 years ago
@DJMcMayhem you can't sell information to advertisers or agencies if it's local
o_O Holy crap
@cairdcoinheringaahing that makes me feel young :)
9:07 PM
@Pavel huh that's stupid, as a couple of my (15-year-old) friends have credit cards :p
that's the whole point of the 'service', control
Question: Does Jelly use bounded or unbounded integers, if unbounded, how does a bitwise operation on two integers even work
@moonheart08 Bitwise not is monadic, it only uses one integer
@cairdcoinheringaahing I was 9 back then and I went to the cinema to see it but I got so bored that I left the room after ~20 minutes.
@moonheart08 It uses python integers which start bounded and then gets promoted to long integers if they get too large
9:08 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing Toy Story came out 22 years ago
don't get me wrong, I'm not stallman where everything has to be fully open and free (although that would be nice)
@betseg uh the appearance
no clue what it means
@DJMcMayhem Ah. So how does a bitwise operation on long integers operate?
huh "famous'?
but I really despise the new trend to move everything as a service so that you own nothing and they get all the data on you
9:09 PM
55 secs ago, by caird coinheringaahing
@moonheart08 Bitwise not is monadic, it only uses one integer
@mudkip201 Wow. Toy Story is significantly older than me :/
@mudkip201 Wait, what‽ I remember that!
@orlp yeah, that sucks.
@Adám Came out in '95
@Mr.Xcoder "sys"
9:09 PM
@mudkip201 I was 10.
ikr I hate device drivers
@Adám Adam, what are we doing here in this kindergarten chat? :)
lol. And I was around 1
@ngn I work here.
@mudkip201 #feelsoldman
9:10 PM
@Mr.Xcoder I basically wasted the money on the tickets...
What did you expect?
Hey, I love Frozen! :D
@Adám The Little Mermaid is ~28 years old
If you want to see a movie similar to Frozen but better in every way imaginable, go watch Tangled
checks python docs
pretends this is IRC, and then goes to edit his messages
9:10 PM
@DJMcMayhem Nothing, I was 9, what could I expect?
@AdmBorkBork oh and during the install of windows 10 it literally had checked by default that the microphone would always be on and listening an data sent to microsoft to improve their voice service
like that doesn't bother you?
lol @moonheart08 I'm so used to IRC too
that's checked by default?
@DJMcMayhem watches a Disney battle ensue :P
@moonheart08 tho dear god editing is nice
9:11 PM
@mudkip201 Disney's, you mean?
@Riker agreed, but IRC <3
@Adám Yeah probably. 'Cause the story is much, much older
yes but editing :p
@mudkip201 the lion king is ~24
@Mr.Xcoder Yup, Danish story from 1837.
and it's much better
9:13 PM
@Riker That I remember when it came out. I even had a LK backpack before its release in Denmark.
Wow there are literally over 3 conversations in TNB taking place at the same time, about: Little Mermaid, Frozen, Computers, Operating system's (lack of) features, etc. so replies are really needed lol
@Adám LOL
@mudkip201 I'm not sure I remember its release, but I certainly remember it being new.
@orlp I don't recall seeing that when I went through my Win10 install on my laptop. A couple quick Google searches aren't coming up with anything. Do you have a source?
9:13 PM
@Riker Hakoona matata!
misread and thought you said reptiles are needed
@betseg psh that's backscroll
@Blue cc flawr
Is it just me or iPhone headphones are terrible? If I plug them into my laptop and throw them on the couch ~1 and 1/2 meters away I can still clearly hear the music.
@Riker also vowel
@orlp did you enable cortana or something? cause that's stupid if you want privacy
9:15 PM
@Mr.Xcoder I can't stand apple earbuds. They sound terrible, they hurt my ears and they don't fit right
^^^^ homonyms
again holy crap @ATaco fix yo userscript
@dzaima no, I had to disable it, because it was on with the most ridiculous privacy settings by default
@AdmBorkBork yes, the source is me
your encoding is borked
9:16 PM
@DJMcMayhem It's the thing I like least about Apple products too. (the new ones that come with newer iphones that don't have a jack are actually a bit better)
I was tempted to write a Jelly JIT as an exercise, then i realised i'd have to write a python interpreter for that.
@moonheart08 JIT?
that's ataco's userscript doing /shrug
Just In Time compiler
works on my device
9:17 PM
@AdmBorkBork asking for sources for first hand experiences doesn't really make sense
@betseg firefox for macos no-repro
Well, like I said, my first-hand experience is different.
@orlp yeah, ridiculous privacy settings are the default, but many can be turned off.
Speaking of old animated movies:
9:19 PM
Time to find some other (non brainfuck) esolang to potentially make a JIT compiler for. (I'm doing this as an exercise in x86 assembly and JIT compiler design)
Also, if you say befunge, i will get you :P
@Adám 1 polygon per second
@moonheart08 is there any benefit in jit compared to compilation to elf?
@Adám ooh yeah the original tron is good
@orlp hardware was the limiting factor, I guess.
9:24 PM
@Adám :o tha'ts super cool
@ngn sometimes. JIT is good for portable code, lets the code get compiled on the client's machine instead of precompiled by the creator. (i.e. Java is JIT). Another advantage is it can be used for code that self optimizes during runtime, which Java also does (partially, first pass is interpreted to generate a tree and perform optimization), using a tracing JIT compiler.
Note that i do not advocate for java, it's just an excellent example
(Seriously, java is sucky in so many ways)
@moonheart08 makes sense, but then your jit compiler must have several versions - one for each arch?
@moonheart08 of course, bytecode would still be portable... I guess that's the goal
That's the goal, portable bytecode
@Riker APL was also used in manufacturing the Buran Space Shuttle:
A: What software programming languages were used by the Soviet Union's space program?

K LettowI came across this article in ACM quote quad a few years ago, "A History of APL in the USSR". It was written by Andrei Kondrashev (Computing Center of the Russian Academy of Sciences) and Oleg Luksha (The Obninsk Educational Center). An interesting quote from the article: It may be of in...

Altho, you do have LLVM, which has a JIT module, so it can make LLVM IR into code on the fly and run it in place.
And we all know LLVM supports like a dozen architectures
9:27 PM
@moonheart08 I'm experimenting with a "k" interpreter ("k" is the name of the programming language) and I'm looking for ways to optimise it
@ngn Didn't somebody buy it?
A JIT may be one way. Probably the best way if the langauge isn't very suitable for compiling directly
@Adám no but they offered me to use it for free :)
@ngn ?
@ngn Hm, three days ago, Nic wrote: Some time after leaving Dyalog, Nick Nickolov pushed a minimal subset of a K interpreter onto the web, retaining all the rights. Within a few months someone bought the code and hired him and he withdrew the code from the web.
9:29 PM
wait, @ngn you work/ed for dyalog too?
@Adám Nobody bought it. I withrew it :)
@Riker I did, yes
also is it just me or is the dyalog wobsite slow
@ngn Then the rest of his email is based on false pretences ⍥
@Adám I was temporarily busy with more interesting (and profitable) stuff
or actually is it down
9:31 PM
@Riker At least slow. We have all kinds of issues with it lately.
@Adám isup.me thinks i'ts down :p
but :/
@Adám ...which reminds me - I have an objection to the results form the 2017 Dyalog challenge
@Riker how did you download the userscript? I think I might know the cause
Also, what browser/device
@Adám I should be the sole winner :)
@Riker It needs to be kicked in the groin every once in a while. More frequently lately, though. I've notified the people who can fix it (temporarily). CEO is now ready to nuke it.
9:33 PM
@ATaco the website via greasemonkey, FF on macos
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

BeefsterUsername Fuzzy Matcher code-challenge string data-science Internet forums often have hundreds or even thousands of active users that are often referred by abbreviations, acronyms, misspellings, etc... Humans are pretty good at figuring out which user an abbreviation would refer to, but this i...

@Downgoat Not too long ago, there was a major update regarding the performance of large files.
CMC: Given an integer list a and a pure function f that takes an integer and returns a boolean, return two lists where one contains elements of a where f(a) is true and the other contains elements of a where f(b) is false. E.G: [1,2,3,4,5], (i=>even?(i)) would give [2, 4] and [1, 3, 5].
The values in the resulting arrays do not have to be ordered in any particular way.
9:49 PM
@Pavel I've been thinking that I often need that built-in in APL.
@Adám I've been thinking that I often need that built-in in like, everything.
def g(a,f):
 for i in a:(x if f(i)else y).push(i)
 return x,y
@Riker it appears to be defaulting to a strange encoding, I’ll patch it when I’m at a computer
@Pavel Haskell: import Data.List;partition
haskell bringing in the builtins
@Adám no comment about the competition? the published answers for 9 and 25 don't comply with the rules
@ngn It is up to Fiona. She says she'll get around to answering.
@Pavel Can it be an iterable instead of a list?
@Pavel Actually, the space can be removed (if the function is scalar, otherwise it needs to be a ¨)
@DJMcMayhem It can be any sort of collection, iterable, etc.
9:56 PM
@Pavel Python, 37 bytes: lambda l,f:[p(f,l),p(lambda i:not f(i),l)];p=filter
@DJMcMayhem You can golf not<space>
@DJMcMayhem :-; can't return tuples from lambda without parens
@Mr.Xcoder notf( or with some trick like 1-f( ?
Yeah, 1-f or ~-f
10:00 PM
notf is not a thing
49 bytes: lambda l,f:[p(f,l),p(lambda i:1-f(i),l)];p=filter
Also, my byte count was waaaay off lol
I was looking at the wrong buffer haha
@betseg Can't see ≡ at all now.
@Mr.Xcoder Or maybe 0=f ?
@Adám You need ==
@Mr.Xcoder Oh =-(
@Adám It actually looks perfect for me know, everything is centered and clickable
10:03 PM
@Mr.Xcoder I can only see the ≡ when the entire page flashes white when I click where it should be.
ok since we were talking about earlier
the one thing that pisses me off beyond belief about VS Code
@quartata nice.
is that it is so slow to respond to control-cs
and you can't kill processes running inside the terminal for some reason
maybe it already died and it's just that slow at showing the output
@quartata There's a kill button you have to click
for instance, I control-c'd a hexdump I did by accident on a 500 MB file a little under 5 minutes ago
@Pavel last I remember that left the process as a zombie
10:07 PM
@quartata Not anymore, it kills it, waits a bit, then kill -9s it.
oh, ok
@Adám device, browser?
@betseg FFQ/Win10/PC
The hamburger shouldn't be visible on desktops anyways, just a sidebar
@betseg OK, but I can still click "on" it. Which causes the menu to re-animate.
10:18 PM
Display:none doesn't work?
Can you just send a screenshot I cant English when it's late
@betseg Never mind.
@betseg I guess it is just that when I click on it, the page reloads.
Oh right, Firefox does that. My joke thing borks on FF too
@betseg Uh.
@betseg Would be fun to track if people actually put info in.
10:34 PM
hey, i just encountered a perfectly valid quine that got deleted for cheating
it's a bf one that uses ! after the program for "input", which makes it part of the source, but that doesn't count as reading the source code any more than using quotes reads the source code
Yeah, I'd call that valid
Voted to undelete, it stores it as data, not reading it from the program. Even if it did, it doesn't make it much more convenient to quine.
Btw, how are the JS functions that read themselves valid
Stringifying a function isn't reading the source code, due to shinanigains.
It's essentially equivalent to storing a string and evaling it.
10:48 PM
I made a similar thing to the "invalid" program for a quine that i didn't publish yet i think
The call needs to be part of the program.
It's a function?
f=@print`f=[f]f()`f() is similarly my tiny Funky quine.
@betseg If so, then {⎕←∇} should be a valid APL quine: Try it online! or anonymous: Try it online!
10:50 PM
brb, g2g.
Quines are always full programs
@ATaco What about functional languages?
@ATaco then
@ATaco Valid?
10:54 PM
@Adám Haskell's quine is a full program
@betseg That looks valid to me
Posting, then
Oh no chrome app crashed
Too many answers
I provide no guarantee that it's valid
> trap -- trap EXIT
Golfier zsh quine from the quine challenge
CMP: is this a valid quine
why can I not find quicks or whatever they're called (like for example invariance) anywhere in Husk's wiki page
@betseg no, reads it's own source
11:05 PM
I can only seem to find the atoms in the command list
Why do you think Husk has invariance?
was that another language then?
It be reproduced by S= I think Pyth has it
what's invariance?
I know Pyth has it but I'm pretty sure there's another language with it
@totallyhuman lambda a: lambda b: a(b) == b
11:06 PM
ah ok
why'd you curry that though
hm was it actually just pyth
Also, Husks "quicks" are no different from normal functions, and are in the command list
@totallyhuman because it's a function that takes a function returns a function that returns the invariant of the function
in other words it's a quick
Oh okay. And yeah, it was just Pyth, I'm dumb lol
there were other quicks from Husk that Xcoder suggested in the Enlist/Neutrino chat lol. I got them mixed up
anyway gtg o/
11:21 PM
Is there any way to search for Unicode text in chat?
11:37 PM
@Solver Atom/Sublime/Brackets are text editors btw not ides
@Downgoat I just found out about brackets, and it appears to be electron based. I have to wonder what it does that VSCode and Atom don't.
@Pavel I used brackets for a bit and I'd say it is for really basic HTML/CSS work
So it's just far more stripped down.

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