Ask Ubuntu General Room

Zacharee1

8:00 PM

@RolandiXor let's not get too ahead of ourselves now :p

Seth

@RolandiXor I thought I added a comment to that!

RolandiXor

@Seth lol

Seth

@RolandiXor all the comments are disappearing from your post.

RolandiXor

It's hilarious (but infuriating at the same time) how human beings are able to get so entrenched in camp mentality and group think that we fail to see problems that are right in front of our faces.

@Seth That's good! :)

Seth

@RolandiXor tell me about it. One of my professors is ex-NSA. He really does not like Edward Snowden. Like a good "brainwashed" military person.

RolandiXor

8:04 PM

@Seth Oh wait, you have to expand comments to see it

@Seth lol :D

Seth

@RolandiXor I don't see a button for that?

RolandiXor

"Captain, we appear to be approaching a small sun."
"Full speed ahead!"

@Seth scroll down to the bottom of the page and "load more comments"

It's a second comment I made

TheXed

hi

Jacob Vlijm

He!

Seth

@RolandiXor I still don't see any of them.

chaskes

8:08 PM

@RolandiXor I also just loaded the additional comments. I'm still going to say your overall point is not really wrong (if too pessimistic) but the later thing about being a joke is way too far, I think.

RolandiXor

@TheXed ha!

Seth

Jo-Erlend Schinstad is really good at trolling though.

RolandiXor

@chaskes what later thing about being a joke O_o?

chaskes

Ubu has lost direction and become...

RolandiXor

@chaskes oh...

Well it's true.

If you step outside of the "ubuntu" community for a while - you will find out that's how most others see "us" right now.

And I have to be honest... they do have a point.

chaskes

8:12 PM

@RolandiXor Well, I respect your opinion but I disagree with that point. I do my best to stay up with linux in general and what's going on in other distros and regularly also use Debian, Fedora (and Korora), and OpenSuse. Things sometimes get tricky with Ubuntu questions since Canonical is a commercial company.

TheXed

@RolandiXor gonna go to a Harlem Globetrotters game...

Seth

@chaskes I'm not sure how anything you just said ties into what Roland is saying?

Byte Commander

Another candidate for the great question titles award:

0

Q: Ubuntu newby needs help

I want to install ubuntu on my Windows 7 laptop. I downloaded the files to a disc and changed the boot options in the bios but still Windows 7 boots up

system-installation

RolandiXor

@TheXed football?

Rinzwind

@RolandiXor basketball ;-)

RolandiXor

8:13 PM

@ByteCommander he/she does.

Seth

ubuntu/canonical decided we need to write unity, and mir, and do snaps, and phones. They divided all their resources into 5 different places and now we have a bunch of half written stuff lying around while the desktop stagnates.

chaskes

@Seth I meant: 1) I don't agree Ubuntu is a joke; 2) Roloand suggested looking outside the Ubu community and I pointed out that I do that already.

TheXed

@RolandiXor yes basketball

RolandiXor

@chaskes I'm talking about the people - not the code/software.

@TheXed lol I am so bad with sports :D

chaskes

@RolandiXor Oh, ok. Point taken. Still, that's bound to bring a strong response from Canonical employees. But again, I don't disagree with your larger concern about what's happening.

Seth

8:17 PM

@chaskes maybe Jorge knows something we don't, but he really does have a tendency to blindly defend everything :/

Jacob Vlijm

@RolandiXor silly question, but is your name, used on the linked page?

RolandiXor

@chaskes I've run into that territory before :)

Seth

And the thing is, none of the decisions ubuntu/canonical have made were wrong, they were just wrong all together. I mean, unity is great. Snaps are great. Ubuntu touch is great. Mir is.. at least ok. But all together? You've got 4 half written buggy apps now. Do you agree @RolandiXor? Alone, one at a time, they would probably have been fine.

RolandiXor

@JacobVlijm yep

@chaskes I'm accustomed to "swimming with sharks" all the time. (Meaning, saying things that others will not like).

chaskes

@Seth I agree with your comment and the larger point you just made as well. but I'd argue there's no stopping the move to cloud/mobile and the question is how to bring the desktop along. I think the problem is both more difficult and more expensive than MS, Canonical, and Apple have thought it would be so far. But the half-started then semi-abandoned projects (from MS as well) is absolutely a huge problem.

RolandiXor

8:19 PM

@Seth exactly!

chaskes

@Seth @RolandiXor Points about Canonical people and prior experiences well taken. :)

Jacob Vlijm

@RolandiXor Ah, I meant what is your name....

...used in the linked page...

Nathan Osman

I think we need a name for the "start something then abandon it" syndrome.

RolandiXor

@JacobVlijm Roland Taylor

Jacob Vlijm

Thanks.

RolandiXor

8:20 PM

np

@NathanOsman I have that syndrome except I don't have a huge company or an OS with millions of users ;P

Nathan Osman

I have it too but I'm fighting it.

Seth

@chaskes you're not wrong, there was no stopping it, but the way canonical dived right into both at once, while also trying to tackle mir, snaps, unity 8, etc, put ubuntu into a nose dive that anyone could have predicted.

RolandiXor

@chaskes the desktop was coming alone fine... until people (in all three companies) panicked, thinking that they needed to make the desktop "evolve" in order to stay relevant.

Seth

but yeah, they definitely underestimated the cost of all this. the strange thing is, most of the users seemed to be able to tell that, but not themselves?

chaskes

@Seth Agreed. And I suspect everyone greatly underestimated the amount of money they would need to spend.

Seth

8:22 PM

You don't just write a display server on a whim. Or a mobile operating system. heck, even a packaging system.

chaskes

@Seth Well said! That's the failure of groupthink, inside the box, etc

RolandiXor

Cloud: integrate cloud services with the desktop.
Mobile: integrate mobile + desktop through systems of the ilk of KDE Connect. Nothing to panic about.

Seth

but they did that. Along with other projects they wanted to tackle. at once :(

RolandiXor

@NathanOsman I am as well, but I fear it might be winning :D

TheXed

it is special basketball thought. Look them up on youtube @RolandiXor

Seth

8:23 PM

@chaskes yeah. I don't know much how other communities are organized (you probably know more about that) but the ubuntu system seems to be collapsing.

RolandiXor

@TheXed special as in special olympics? or special as in bells whistles and rocket ships?

Seth

Oh and don't even get me started on the many long time and valuable contributors this mess has burnt out so bad they aren't coming back..

TheXed

bells whitles and rocket ships

and a circus act that happens to be really good basketball players too...

chaskes

@Seth They need investment capital, which probably explains Ubu on Win. And part of the problem is the inherent conflict between Canonical and the Community (as part of larger open source).

RolandiXor

I can't say I know much about other communities either, but one thing that I know has never worked, is having a big company mothership hovering over the heads of an open source city.

Look at Novell. Look at Red Hat (out of it came CentOS - and it is a success). Look at Cyanogen (it isn't just that they couldn't compete with Google).

Not saying having a company behind you is bad, but a company that basically has their hand on your head telling you where to turn is going to cause issues in a *community*.

@TheXed ohhh

Seth

8:26 PM

@RolandiXor Exactly!

Everyone says Canonical is just part of "the community" (I've even said it) but it has become much more than that.

RolandiXor

It has never been.

Remember when we complained that window controls being on the left was a bad move?

Zacharee1

don't let Mark see you guys talking

RolandiXor

"Our way or the highway."

Remember when we wanted to minimize apps on click?
"Our way or the highway."

(Eventually they let us have it - when Unity7 was about to be abandoned and they didn't care anymore).

chaskes

Redhat/Fedora have a different relationship than Canonical/Ubuntu (I'm agreeing with your point here). But Cyanogen needs cash and is now letting MS call the shots in return for investment.

RolandiXor

@Zacharee1 lol

@chaskes I haven't heard anything about MS being involved - link?

Zacharee1

8:29 PM

@chaskes while completely shutting down the projects that allowed for its success

chaskes

@RolandiXor There's a lot of links, just google it please. There's was a flurry of articles 4-6 mos ago?

Seth

@RolandiXor no, because that's where they need to be :P

RolandiXor

What I do know from what I've read is that Cyanogen seems to have had a similar problem to Ubuntu - vibrant community + (at odds with a) + vibrant company.

Seth

locking them there was a bad move, however..

RolandiXor

@chaskes lol

Nathan Osman

8:30 PM

Of the three (Unity, Touch, and snaps), I wish they would have just taken on snaps.

Seth

@NathanOsman well, unity needed an overhaul, but yes.

One at a time.

RolandiXor

@Seth oh yeah, because "innovations that will never exist require them to be on the left"

Nathan Osman

Debian packaging is... a bit overly-complex.

Seth

@RolandiXor no it's just better than the right :p

Nathan Osman

And prone to breakage.

So snaps are a good idea.

Seth

8:31 PM

@NathanOsman Have you tried snaps? It's not much better. I've utterly failed to snap anything useful.

Nathan Osman

Unity is okay although it has stagnated a bit.

Seth

And the multiple times I've gone to the snap people and asked what I was doing wrong, they told me I needed to modify my app to fit the snap format.

Nathan Osman

@Seth in principle they are awesome.

The tooling is poor right now.

Seth

@NathanOsman principles alone don't get you very far..

chaskes

@RolandiXor Here's the original ones (almost a year ago it turns out):

http://www.techtimes.com/articles/30110/20150201/microsoft-invest-cyanogenmod-what-mean-google.htm

https://cyngn.com/press/cyanogen-announces-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft

RolandiXor

8:32 PM

@Seth lol because Mac?

@chaskes thanks!

Nathan Osman

Oh what the heck. Run everything in Docker :D

Seth

@RolandiXor right because Windows?

Nathan Osman

I already do that on my server.

Seth

I like the left better. No need to mock me about it.

RolandiXor

@NathanOsman Qt Unity sans Mir would have been a good solution.

@Seth haha

Nathan Osman

8:33 PM

Yeah.

Or even just cleaning up KDE.

RolandiXor

I'm just giving the reasons that seem to have come out of our benevolent overlords (though not in those exact words).

If we're honest - Ubuntu has been evolving into Mac for a while.

And when the community complained we were always given the vague "It's for a reason (which doesn't exist)" excuse :)

Nathan Osman

I'm really tempted to give Arch a shot.

RolandiXor

@NathanOsman it has crossed my mind too, but I'd have too much risk :(

Nathan Osman

Yeah, I already borked one Arch install.

But then again, I was compiling a custom kernel.

chaskes

@Seth Right now, I need to re-learn hardcore Java for work and don't have much time for other things; but even apart from that, the Canonical Churn long ago caused me to stop wanting to hack Unity, learn Scopes, learn Snap or anything Ubuntu specific. I'll wait for all of that to settle down.

RolandiXor

8:36 PM

Seth

@chaskes yeah. I'm learning the hard way.

@NathanOsman pacman is so awful though... and I need a system that works.

RolandiXor

I've stopped reporting bugs since most of them ended up going in circles.

@Seth it is?

@NathanOsman yeah

How come?

8:37 PM

@chaskes if our local educational system weren't a mess, I'd have continued on studying computer science and who knows... maybe I'd have contributed too or come up with my own something.

Nathan Osman

NitroShare will be inviting new contributors as soon as I get the next version out.

Have to finish rewriting it first though.

New plugin system :)

RolandiXor

Nice!

Nathan Osman

Best part is that it runs on nearly any Linux distro.

Seth

@NathanOsman the syntax is extremely confusing.

Nathan Osman

@Seth ah.

Seth

8:39 PM

@NathanOsman do I remember correctly that you were rewriting it in Go?

Nathan Osman

So what it really needs is a new front-end.

@Seth yes and I changed my mind due to technical issues.

Edity

morning

Seth

@NathanOsman Ah. So back to Qt and C++?

chaskes

@Seth And it's the same with WPF and lots of similar issues with MS tech.

Zacharee1

I'm going to break up the negativity by saying if you have an Android, you should really try Pulse SMS

Nathan Osman

8:40 PM

@Seth yup.

Seth

@chaskes totally, but MS has the manpower to push through anyway if they want.

Nathan Osman

@Zacharee1 Y THO?

Seth

@Zacharee1 sorry, I encrypt my SMS.

Edity

@Zacharee1 ????

Zacharee1

@NathanOsman lel

Nathan Osman

8:41 PM

Signal FTW.

Seth

waits for zach to mock privacy

Zacharee1

@Seth Pulse encrypts and syncs it

Seth

@Zacharee1 not e2e

@NathanOsman I haven't been able to get anyone to use that yet :/

Zacharee1

@Seth no, but carrier SMS doesn't do that anyway

Edity

i'm curious about what Signal and Pulse SMS is...

chaskes

8:42 PM

@Seth Excellent point...yet they still seem to start and abandon tech projects regularly. In fact the extra cash might exacerbate the problem with them: just when you think, "It's been 18 months, this is sticking around" and start digging in...they end up killing it too.

Seth

@Zacharee1 and yet all my SMS to family and close friends is e2e encrypted with the signal protocol.

Nathan Osman

@Edity Signal isn't SMS.

Edity

opens up google play

Seth

@chaskes fair point.

Zacharee1

@Seth but you need to use the Signal app, which isn't SMS

Edity

8:43 PM

ik

Seth

@Zacharee1 no, I don't. It's called OSS ;)

Edity

ah so signal is a private messager..

Zacharee1

@Seth sigh

Seth

@Zacharee1 silence.im ftw

Edity

and pulse sms is something I don't know and care about, although it has watch compatability, so great with my watch

Zacharee1

8:45 PM

@Seth "all messages are ecnrypted locally"

it only does e2e if the other person uses Silence

chaskes

@Seth @NathanOsman Btw, an I the only one thinking: Ah, robust, informed, polite discussions in AU chat, just like old times? This is a good day to be hanging around.

RolandiXor

Does anyone use Telegram?

Edity

oh dear lord no

Seth

@Zacharee1 I'm not stupid..

(that stupid)

Zacharee1

@Seth nubcake

Edity

8:48 PM

@RolandiXor no to the no to the no no no

Seth

@RolandiXor yeah. it's not that secure, but it is very convenient.

more secure than hangouts tho

Zacharee1

Hangouts is secure?

Seth

@Zacharee1 I don't mind as long as you don't use it as an insult. Like that.

@Zacharee1 that's the point :P

Zacharee1

@Seth iz never insult

RolandiXor

@Edity LOOOL

I have it but I don't use it.

Edity

8:51 PM

XDDDDDDDDDDD

I basically like android apps that has cross-compatability with Wear.

Seth

I wanted a pebble 2 :(

Nathan Osman

@chaskes we try to be civil here :)

2

Zacharee1

@Seth rip

@NathanOsman haha

Nathan Osman

@Seth yeah, that one's quite sad.

@Zacharee1 huehue.

Zacharee1

hue

Edity

8:55 PM

color hue?

No, huehue hue.

hue

hehehehheheheheheh

Le hue.

@NathanOsman try.

xD

Edity

8:57 PM

heheheehheheehehhhehehe

Seth

@chaskes :D

Nathan Osman

3

David Foerster

@Fabby: you can remove askubuntu.com/questions/833275/… now

Hizqeel

soo much hoihoihoi :D

Edity

hats die off tommorow

towc

9:08 PM

urgh, still having issues

0

Q: Ubuntu won't play videos on either browser or native client

I have a standard Ubuntu 16.04 laptop (recent install), which just won't play videos at all. If I went on youtube, the video would load, and I can jump from various places in the timeline and see the frames, but the video just won't play. No errors in the console. I then look for examples of html5 <

firefox google-chrome video flash i3-wm

RolandiXor

Okay I'm black now.

@TheXed I didn't realize you meant circus show literally :D

Zacharee1

@RolandiXor wat

RolandiXor

@Zacharee1 I'm black again :)

Zacharee1

again?

RolandiXor

xD

It's an inside joke ;) (between me and someone not even in this room)

(or on AU)

Zacharee1

9:20 PM

o_O

RolandiXor

but anyone can join in haha

Zacharee1

join in to what though?

the joke

but idk the joke

it's a pun

9:20 PM

back?

RolandiXor

yep

Zacharee1

sigh

and you say you aren't crazy

RolandiXor

I said I'm not in sane.

Never said I wasn't crazy }:>

I left sane ages ago.

Zacharee1

1 hour ago, by RolandiXor

So maybe I'm not insane (or foolish) after all!

RolandiXor

@Zacharee1 see, no mention of crazy :)

Zacharee1

9:23 PM

they're synonyms lol

RolandiXor

@Zacharee1 not always ;)

Zacharee1

5 mins ago, by Zacharee1

sigh

you're more troll than @KazWolfe

edwinksl

zach is biggest troll pls

towc

@RolandiXor any ideas?

RolandiXor

@Zacharee1 I'm the best troll. The best.

Zacharee1

9:31 PM

oh noes

RolandiXor

@towc I'm thinking it might be that you need to enable va-api acceleration but I could be wrong.

I don't know much about the Atoms off hand.

towc

you know anyone I could ask?

RolandiXor

@towc not really, but I'm sure someone will come along soon.

towc

ok

thanks

RolandiXor

have you tried VLC btw?

towc

9:38 PM

tried installing through ubuntu-software, but for some reason it wasn't installing it right away so I gave up on that

oh, vlc plays local videos just fine

RolandiXor

@towc oh?

Did you just install it?

yup

Try Gnome-MPV now.

wtf it works

:)

9:44 PM

and youtube works as well

RolandiXor

You were missing libraries.

towc

-_-

damn, thanks

RolandiXor

I figured it might be that once you said VLC worked.

towc

but it's weird that sometimes it half-worked before I installed vlc

RolandiXor

Sometimes installing 3rd party codecs fails for some unknown reason. I've never figured it out myself.

Half worked?

towc

9:45 PM

as in, after reboot I could play a few seconds of youtube, then it would stop working

which is why I thought it was some kind of memory saturation issue

RolandiXor

That is mighty weird.

towc

anyway, wanna post it as an answer?

RolandiXor

Sure

towc

and now still having problems with enabling a2dp sound...

sigh

RolandiXor

@towc a2dp?

towc

9:48 PM

bluetooth headset

RolandiXor

ahh

What issue are you having specifically?

towc

oh, kinda works now

RolandiXor

kinda works?

towc

I got it working by some blueman magic...

RolandiXor

oh

towc

9:50 PM

and it was fine for a few seconds

then youtube stopped working again

lemme check vlc

RolandiXor

@towc it? You mean video playback, right?

(You need to be a bit clearer ;))

towc

it = everything

video playback AND a2dp

ok, vlc works

youtube and gnome-mpv no longer do

Kaz Wolfe

Oh, it was only @Zacharee1 pinging me. I thought for a second it was someone important.

Zacharee1

no one's important enough for you @KazWolfe

towc

youtube started randomly working again

Kaz Wolfe

9:54 PM

False. There are only three people important to wake me from a nap. You are not on that list.

RolandiXor

@towc O_o

towc

I AM SO CONFUSED

Zacharee1

@KazWolfe well why are you up?

Kaz Wolfe

Because I thought you were someone relevant

towc

let me try rebooting, maybe those libs still need a bit more settling?

Zacharee1

9:56 PM

SE is not relevant @KazWolfe

edwinksl

how can zach become important enough

Seth

in other news at CES: RF blocking underwear.

Zacharee1

yup

RolandiXor

@Seth um.... o.o

@towc shouldn't be the case but rebooting never hurt anyone lol

(except for me, it has hurt me badly)

Byte Commander

@Seth And then you walk through a metal detector at an airport and have to explain why your pants are beeping...

towc

9:59 PM

youtube is working as expected

still having issues with a2dp

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