English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Robusto

00:01

See? Means nothing to me, but likely it does to others in your field.

Dannyu NDos

@Robusto And it's not exactly a math statement because math employs classical logic.

Robusto

@DannyuNDos See Bertrand Russel v. Wittgenstein on whether logic is mathematics or not.

Dannyu NDos

(And I've just noticed my typo there)

Mitch

@DannyuNDos is 'demanded' the word they use in linear logic? It sounds very unfamiliar to me. Like @Xanne said, you probably want to replace 'demand' everywhere with a form of 'necessary' if you're dealing with a modal and/or proof logic

Dannyu NDos

It's actually how I intuitively understood negation in linear logic.

Mitch

00:05

@DannyuNDos 'math' -> 'most traditional mathematics'

@DannyuNDos 'demanded' is probably not the usual term to use in English, either informal presentation or as a mathematically defined term

Robusto

@Mitch That's, like, way too logical. Be cool, man.

Dannyu NDos

I mean... If a customer orders for the item A, they're waiting the item A to be supplied. And vice versa.

Xanne

Biden spoke just now. It sounded to me like he said “battlebox” (twice) instead of ballotbox. CNN finally admitting that, and the “former Trump” instead of “former president.”

Oh Freud, where are you when we need you?

tchrist

00:24

@Xanne Mrs Freud is busy spoonerisming out Mrs Malaprop's new slip.

I am in love with the sound of your voice. — Yosef Baskin 2 hours ago

@Xanne Put what? I have no quarrel with what McCabe wrote. I am in vociferous agreement with it. I cannot understand how a world-class security service forgot to secure all possible sight lines leading to the protectee. Sure, they'll give their lives to interpose themselves in harm's way, but with secure sight lines they would never have had to do that. Plus it was far too little too late—they had nothing. An inch different over 170 yards, just a bit of air turbulence, and they'd've lost him.

@Xanne I do my best to prefer simple explanations of incompetence over those of complicated conspiracies involving strategic malice whether inside or outside.

Robusto

00:39

@tchrist Whoa, are you saying there is no Q-anon? No Democratic pizza parlor pedophilia dens? No "plandemic"? No 2000 mules?

Next you'll be trying to tell us the Earth is round. Pfft.

alphabet

01:06

@Xanne tchrist doesn't see my messages, so he thought your statement ("How would you put it?") was a response to him rather than to me.

tchrist

> A State Department agent tasked with the personal security of high-ranking diplomats said the snipers were in the right place but that the building Mr. Crooks shot from should have been secured given its height and short distance from Mr. Trump. The agent, who wasn’t directly involved in security for the Trump rally on Saturday, spoke on the condition of anonymity since he was not authorized to speak to the media.

> Investigations into the sniper shooting that injured Donald Trump and killed a local firefighter must focus on whether several key Secret Service protocols were violated, current and former law enforcement officials said Sunday. Chief among them: Why wasn't a building well within 1,000 yards of the former president locked down enough to prevent the shooter from nearly assassinating the presumptive GOP presidential nominee?

> In an exclusive interview, former Secret Service Director Julia Pierson told USA TODAY that maintaining such a sniper security perimeter is part of the agency's responsibility for safeguarding "protectees" like Trump from harm. Yet the man identified as the sniper, 20-year-old Thomas Matthew Crooks, fired off numerous rounds from a building top about 150 yards from Trump's lectern at Saturday's rally in Butler, Pennsylvania.

> “I think 1,000 yards is the sniper capability that we have a concern about for the President. So anything that's within that range, that is a professional, makable shot... and you want to know about it,” Pierson said. “When you think about it, it's a football field and a half … and that is a makeable shot by an individual. And obviously an inch would have made a difference in this case and Trump wouldn't be with us,” said Pierson.

Certainly the counter-snipers were set up with the equipment needed to deal threats from as far as a thousand yards away.

Robusto

@tchrist Fine, but "a football field and a half" is 150 yards, not 1,000 yards.

tchrist

No, she's saying the kid was about 150 yards away!

An untrained shooter can make a hundred-fifty yard shot.

Robusto

@tchrist Apparently not.

tchrist

He rather nearly did so.

She's admitting that they worry about anything a thousand yards out. Somehow this time they missed all that.

Well, they set up counter-snipers who could deal with that distance. But there's no way the exposed sight line barely 150 yards away should have ever happened. Something egregious fell through the cracks.

Robusto

01:21

@tchrist "Nearly" only counts in horseshoes and hydrogen bombs.

tchrist

> The rooftop where a gunman shot at former President Donald Trump during a campaign rally was identified by the Secret Service as a potential vulnerability in the days before the event.

Apparently the kid was rushed. A local law enforcement officer responding to a citizen's warning about an intruder with a rifle peaked up over the roof and saw him, but he was holding on to the roof with both hands and so had no weapon in his hand, so when the kid aimed at him he dropped to the ground. The kid opened fire at the lectern right away after that.

CowperKettle

02:10

Why Machines Don't Think Like Us

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CowperKettle

02:22

> hello, I think I can hear you, buts I cannot see you, I'm blinded by despair

The Fall Of Eve - Forgotten

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At 01:55

Probably the singer is a non-native speaker

Xanne

@tchrist I agree with all of that. The failure to secure the siteline is puzzling. Someone presented the concept of a “dead” zone where no one is permitted to be, which can be cleared and monitored. Maybe it would take too many people.

Mitch

@Robusto I challenge anyone to an explanation that the earth is round, appealing to the unaided senses.

tchrist

@Mitch Look at the edge of the earth's shadow on the moon during a lunar eclipse. That's how the ancients knew.

CowperKettle

" Nothing more true than not to trust your senses;
And yet what are your other evidences?"

> For me, I know nought; nothing I deny,
Admit, reject, contemn; and what know you,
Except perhaps that you were born to die?
And both may after all turn out untrue.
An age may come, Font of Eternity,
When nothing shall be either old or new.
Death, so call'd, is a thing which makes men weep,
And yet a third of life is pass'd in sleep.

tchrist

> In the 5th century B.C., Empedocles and Anaxagoras offered arguments for the spherical nature of the Earth. During a lunar eclipse, when the Earth is between the sun and the moon, they identified the shadow of the Earth on the moon. As the shadow moves across the moon it is clearly round.

Courtesy of the Library of Congress: loc.gov/collections/….

They also knew how big the earth was.

The ship argument also works. And for both.

What they did not know is that the earth is very, very subtly not a perfect sphere but an oblate spheroid.

CowperKettle

02:42

The ancients knew the Earth was round,
The ancients knew the Earth was big,
Without any ultrasound, or MRI, or WYSIWYG

tchrist

But oblate spheroids are also round, so it doesn't matter.

Xanne

Coins are round and flat.

tchrist

Ships.

The surface falls away.

Gradually.

Columbus never convinced the people who really knew their geometry. His figures were unsupportable and they knew it. But he had other goals.

Never underestimate the Ancient Greeks' reasoning skills.

CowperKettle

Oh, what a bunch of cunning guys!
They twigged it all with naked eyes.

> The ancients knew the Earth was round,
The ancients knew the Earth was big,
Without any ultrasound, or MRI, or WYSIWYG
Oh, what a bunch of cunning guys!
They twigged it all with naked eyes.

tchrist

Plato's Cave didn't come from nowhere, utopian though it were. :)

They were very good at watching shadows.

Xanne

02:48

Another critique of the USSS that didn’t in fact matter on this occasion is that one of the agents who formed the shield around Trump was too small to protect him. Just. DIE problem. Okay to have 30% women if your protectees are petite. We’ll just have to elect little women.

CowperKettle

> The ancients knew the Earth was round,
The ancients knew the Earth was big,
Without any ultrasound, or MRI, or WYSIWYG
Oh, what a bunch of cunning guys!
They twigged it all with naked eyes.
Never think light of Ancient Greeks,
Those guys were quite insightful geeks.

tchrist

We don't know anything like enough about them from before their Dark Ages following the Late Bronze Age collapse. There simply isn't enough Linear B left to investigate their civilization. And many other Bronze Age writing systems we know nothing whatsoever about.

But the Egyptians and Mesopotamians, we can study their texts.

It's still very little compared with what we retain from the Greek Golden Age.

CowperKettle

> O blinding hour, O holy, terrible day,
When first the shaft into his vision shone
Of light anatomized! Euclid alone
Has looked on Beauty bare. Fortunate they
Who, though once only and then but far away,
Have heard her massive sandal set on stone.

tchrist

@CowperKettle Wonderful!

CowperKettle

Millay is.

tchrist

02:52

I know.

11

A: Why did Columbus think the Earth was much smaller than it is?

Answering the earlier version of the question first (on Columbus mistakes). There were two main sources of mistakes: exaggerating the size of Asia and underestimating the size of the Earth. Columbus was relying on the work of his contemporary geographer Toscanelli, with whom he corresponded (some...

Read the other answers, too.

One notes that things wash up on the Canary Islands, still alive, that could not have survived the ocean trip from China. The error lay in assuming they had to come from China, and not from a new place, but he was, at least, correct in thinking that there had to be a land relatively close to allow that. — Mary Jun 6, 2022 at 0:16

The Europeans had various sorts of evidence that there was something reasonably close. They just didn't really know what it was.

It's not like Leif Erikson brought back silken kimonos from Vinland.

CowperKettle

04:46

@M.A.R. - Iranian meta-analysis of saffron vs SSRI in depression: pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38913392

CowperKettle

05:01

CowperKettle

06:24

pajeet

Pajeet An invented Indian-sounding given name, originating from the "Pajeet, my son" meme created on the 4chan message board /int/ in July 2015, mocking Indians' supposed propensity for open-air defecation. This was itself inspired by the "Mehmet, my son" meme, popularized on /int/ in late 2014, which mocked Turkish people. The term acquired wider online usage in the early 2020s, with large increases after 2023. Although the name does not exist in South Asia, similar-sounding names exist, especially in the Indian state of Punjab. The -jeet part is most likely derived from Punjabi male name...

Ethnic slur of the day. I've just come across this on Twitter and reported it as slur.

But first I had to look up the meaning.

> A campaign to build toilets in urban and rural areas achieved a significant reduction in open defecation between 2014 and 2019. In September 2019, the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation honored Indian leader Narendra Modi for his efforts in improving sanitation in the country.[48] According to UNICEF, the number of people without a toilet was reduced from 550 million to 50 million.

SmokeDetector

08:03

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Potentially bad asn for hostname in answer, username similar to website in answer (74): What is a proper word for (almost) identical products?‭ by 8171 passgov‭ on english.SE

M.A.R.

08:39

> Saffron could be a potential SSRI alternative to reduce depressive and anxiety symptoms with fewer adverse events

This unforgiveable lie renders the whole thing worthless.

CowperKettle

@M.A.R. I don't know, I've never tried taking saffron at therapeutic doses

M.A.R.

It's a common line spewed even in medical circles, of course, that herbal remedies have the same efficacy with fewer side effects. But I can't take anyone seriously who hasn't critically thought about this statement and repeats it.

CowperKettle

Maybe they will come up with a pill based on saffron-derived nutrients.

Of course there would be side effects, I know

M.A.R.

@CowperKettle every drug that works will have side effects mirroring that efficacy. But equally important is the lack of actual data about herbal medicine -- proper toxicologic studies, investigating a drug's mechanism of action, a drug's pharmacokinetics etc etc. Not knowing these means advocating something is a disservice to patients.

If they propose that saffron contains something that's an SSRI, how on Earth would it not have the side effects of an SSRI? How would it overcome the pitfalls of SSRIs, such as low efficacy in some subsets or people? It might as well, actually, and if someone properly investigates that, they might find out: Oh, the reason this SSRI-like molecule in saffron doesn't cause serotonin syndrome is this functional group here. So let's try modifying sertraline, see what we come up with.

CowperKettle

nods

M.A.R.

08:48

Of course, members of a "student research committee" would lack the budget to do that, but just padding their resume by settling for a lie, which WILL mislead people and even doctors in the future, is ethically dubious.

CowperKettle

I feel so much better on leucovorin. Now at 20 mg/day. I started at 10 mg/day exactly a month ago.

M.A.R.

@CowperKettle it's pretty safe, so I prefer it much more to your injecting insulin. I just hope it doesn't cost too much.

CowperKettle

It's only 260 rubles per a 50 mg vial, so it's quite cheap

Cancer patients take it to avoid some side effects of chemotherapy

M.A.R.

Yeah, MTX rescue, it's called.

MTX antagonizes the folate-creating enzymes. Folate is essential for DNA replication, so cancer cells can't divide. But for some unknown reason, injecting leucovorin (which is the active form of folate) protects normal cells from MTX's toxicity more than cancer cells.

Whoops. Leucovorin rescue, not MTX rescue. My brain's not fully functional yet

CowperKettle

10:15

Positive life experiences correlate with better-functioning mitochondria in the brain: pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2317673121

A postmortem study, and the techniques are all beyond my comprehension, so take with a grain of salt

Dannyu NDos

12:06

Korean idiom of the day: There is tomorrow even after killing the rooster ― means that everything goes as it should be.

jlliagre

@DannyuNDos Similar ot this one:

0

Q: The sun will rise even if the rooster doesn't crow

In my mother tongue, there is an idiom which is roughly translated as: The sun will rise even if the rooster doesn't crow. It is a lesson that one shouldn't be arrogant in one's ability, because even though they think that they are doing something important, in reality, it might be somethin...

phrase-request

Vikas

Controversial headline in Indian newspaper.

jlliagre

@Vikas A pun to increase sales :-)

CowperKettle

12:22

@DannyuNDos Reminded me of this one: en.wiktionary.org/wiki/there_is_reason_in_the_roasting_of_eggs

I started that entry in Wiktionary in 2012

@Vikas A good pun

> Researchers created an AI model capable of predicting whether a person with mild cognitive impairment will develop Alzheimer’s disease within 6 years, based solely on their speech. This model has shown an accuracy rate of 78.5%

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, potentially bad ns for domain in body, potentially bad keyword in body (194): why Master NURS FPX 4000 Assessments?‭ by Sharlet Diana‭ on english.SE

CowperKettle

12:38

> After experiencing a self-described "revelation", he proclaimed that he was in direct communication with God, and that God told him the operating system was for God's third temple.

TempleOS

TempleOS (formerly J Operating System, LoseThos, and SparrowOS) is a biblical-themed lightweight operating system (OS) designed to be the Third Temple prophesied in the Bible. It was created by American programmer Terry A. Davis, who developed it alone over the course of a decade after a series of manic episodes that he later described as a revelation from God. The system was characterized as a modern x86-64 Commodore 64, using an interface similar to a mixture of DOS and Turbo C. Davis proclaimed that the system's features, such as its 640x480 resolution, 16-color display, and single-voice audio...

> Holy C ( formerly C+) is a variant of the C and C++ programming Languages designed by Terry A. Davis[12] specifically for the TempleOS. It functions as both a general-purpose language for application development and a scripting language for automating tasks within TempleOS.

Mitch

13:40

@tchrist Not in favor 1) the image of the earth's shadow is not very clear (it's not sharp at all and of pictures I've seen, not particularly ... telling (even if not sharp). 2) the only lunar eclipses -I- have seen they've just been a bit orange all over or maybe an imbalance, but that's about it.

In favor: I expect that pre-20th c, people were outside at night without interfering artificial light more, and had more chance to see things like a clear lunar eclipse.

But that's just based on hearsay.

Robusto

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user 85795

in This Is Fine, 6 mins ago, by User1865345

https://x.com/dc_draino/status/1812642041391915384?s=46&t=5d0289ex1Xv47-d5NoPIhQ

Mitch

Supposing I -had- seen a clear lunar eclipse with sharp (-er) edges... ie a full moon but with a (fuzzy edged) dark circle moving over it. Then @xanne's example comes up (there's an obvious alternate explanation (Earth is a flat disk) that fits the other data better.

user 85795

None of the cops, secret service etc. did anything.

Robusto

Aristarchus of Samos

Aristarchus of Samos (; Greek: Ἀρίσταρχος ὁ Σάμιος, Aristarkhos ho Samios; c. 310 – c. 230 BC) was an ancient Greek astronomer and mathematician who presented the first known heliocentric model that placed the Sun at the center of the universe, with the Earth revolving around the Sun once a year and rotating about its axis once a day. He likely moved to Alexandria, and he was a student of Strato of Lampsacus, who later became the third head of the Peripatetic School in Greece. According to Ptolemy, he observed the summer solstice of 280 BC. Along with his contributions to the heliocentric model...

@Mitch Plenty smart people back then. Not only knowing that the earth is "round" but how big, how far, and the planets in order.

Mitch

13:46

So most of the 'Earth is a globe' truth is based on trusting what other people have said. Of course, if I didn't trust what these other people have said, a whole bunch of explanation of stuff (ie science) would be untrustworthy too. It is trustworthy, ergo, the Earth is very likely a globe.

Carl Sagan explains how Eratosthenes calculated circumference of the Earth

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Robusto

@Mitch As I said, "plenty smart people back then."

Mitch

I personally can't compare the shadows at Alexandria and Cyene.

Robusto

@Mitch If you cared enough, you could.

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Mitch

They are days apart by walking.

Robusto

You have the advantage of flying vehicles.

So let's face it: you're just too lazy and you don't care.

Mitch

13:50

@Robusto A lot of those people were just 'philosophizing' (= guessing).

They had too much time on their hands.

user 85795

Caring is sharing.

Mitch

Because they had a slave based economy.

Robusto

@Mitch You could say that about any pursuit.

Mitch

@Robusto except literally 'pursuit'

Robusto

"Those people have beautiful lawns because they have too much time on their hands. Or slaves."

user 85795

13:53

Or both.

Robusto

@Mitch AI is a pursuit. There, I said it.

Mitch

That poor 'helper' (= slave) or Eratosthenes that he 'hired' (=forced) to pace out the distance from the two towns, was probably not particularly reliable. He went to visit some family, had to make a detour to Luxor to collect on a bet he made with that guy about that horse, had to backtrack because he took a left turn at Albuquerque.

@Robusto By saying so little you've said a lot.

I will finish by saying nothing.

.

But I digress.

Robusto

@Mitch You just said "period."

Mitch

full stop

@Robusto NOU

Robusto

snicker

tchrist

13:58

@Mitch ships

It's all horsey.

whicker

Mitch

@tchrist my eyes aren't good enough to see the masts of ships sink below the horizon

tchrist

@Mitch Accountants' disease?

Robusto

Ships? What are these "ships"? I live inland.

Mitch

I suppose if really liked walking, and could walk a thousand miles directly north, and had some primitive sextant type thing that I could record the latitude... that might be convincing.

But again... a lot of work.

I don't have time for that.

Netflix ain't gonna watch itself.

Ooh... that'd be a good Black Mirror episode.

Robusto

Don't quit your day job.

user 85795

14:04

Look for a night gig.

Mitch

@Robusto well, this -is- an attempt finding some sort of way to convince a farmer, when it's not particularly relevant.

@Robusto well duh you'd have to film at night

Anyway if we got it to star Miley Cyrus and Selma Hayek and ... and... we never actually see the screen, just the people watching the screen and their expressions, like that 'reaction' video in the corner of all those Japanese reality game shows. Except the reaction video is of Netfliz itself reacting to the reactions of people... I mean Netflix... watching itself.

Or better, the 'reaction' video in the corner is the actual plot-filled show, and the main sow is the reaction video itself.

Wow this stuff just writes itself

Robusto

waits

Mitch

I wonder if it should have advertisements.

user 85795

Coming soon.

Mitch

@Robusto look man I'm just the idea guy. execution is for the employees (=slaves).

Robusto

14:11

@Mitch What, there's more than one sow?

Lotsa little piglets?

Maybe this could be a good show.

Mitch

@Robusto That's the side-sow.

Robusto

How about a Big Bad Wolf too?

Mitch

@Robusto I think there's already a Black Mirror episode about that.

Robusto

I'm just spitballing here, but ... how about spitballs?

Mitch

There are things I've l've learned about anatomy there that I couldn't have learned anywhere else.

user 85795

14:13

Can we replace black with mirror of color?

Mitch

@Robusto I remember an afternoon in ninth grade at study hall (or was it detention) where kids were trying to see who could make the biggest spitball.

TLDR no one won.

Robusto

@Mitch See? This could work. Lotta resonance, lotta recognition.

Mitch

but I was impressed by the amount of paper people could stuff into their mouths.

It was -a lot-

And produce a sloppy mess about as big as an apple.

@Robusto I don't recall ever seeing this in any kind of media.

I hesitate to search youtube though.

ugh

I am more than 12 years old and what is this

Robusto

Butt Quacks & The Best Dad Jokes - Episode 110 - Spitballers Comedy Show

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Vikas

When people already saw that shooter and probably told some authorities there, doesn't it mean it was security flaw and should have been prevented?

Robusto

14:32

What would you suppose
If the liquor in your toes
Migrated to your nose
Spewed from there with blows
Is that what you'd have chose?
Wait ... I'm about to doze ...

Daily Octordle #903
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Score: 55

Daily Sequence Octordle #903
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Eerily similar to yesterday.

jlliagre

15:13

Wordle 1,122 5/6

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@Robusto Again similar grids :-)

Daily Octordle #903
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#WhenTaken #139 (15.07.2024)

I scored 902/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 917 km - 🗓️ 9 yrs - ⚡ 160 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 3 km - 🗓️ 11 yrs - ⚡ 182 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 955 km - 🗓️ 0 yrs - ⚡ 171 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 266 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 189 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 6 km - 🗓️ 0 yrs - ⚡ 200 / 200

https://whentaken.com

CowperKettle

15:33

Oncology of the day: abscopal effect - a controversial effect in the treatment of metastatic cancer whereby shrinkage of untreated tumors reportedly occurs concurrently with shrinkage of tumors within the area of the localized treatment

> R.H. Mole proposed the term “abscopal” (‘ab’ - away from, ‘scopus’ - target) in 1953 to refer to effects of ionizing radiation “at a distance from the irradiated volume but within the same organism.”

Robusto

16:02

#WhenTaken #139 (15.07.2024)

I scored 810/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 580.8 metres - 🗓️ 11 yrs - ⚡ 182 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 2196 km - 🗓️ 21 yrs - ⚡ 99 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 964 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 169 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 1192 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 164 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 7 km - 🗓️ 4 yrs - ⚡ 196 / 200

https://whentaken.com

@jlliagre I should have known the location of #3. I've been there and commingled with the residents.

jlliagre

Googles 'commingle'

jlliagre

16:25

@Robusto Nice.

Bonne fête aux Donald et aux Vladimir... :-/

MetaEd

16:54

Wordle 1,122 4/6

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Wordle 1,123 3/6

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@Mitch what are you asking?

alphabet

17:12

Wordle 1,122 4/6

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Mitch

@MetaEd I'm just wondering what possible word guesses and solution are possible (if any) for such color patterns. Like maybe just the pattern could give something away of the solution.

Wordle 1,124 6/6

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...is impossible because there are 26 letters in the English language, and if you get 25 totally wrong, there aren't 5 leftover to get right.

MetaEd

@Mitch not sure that pattern is impossible

Mitch

I suspect the first one I gave above is doable in English...in fact the degrees of freedom for a solution are large enough to choose that there are 6 legal English legal words that will fit

but I couldn't think of one.

@MetaEd 5 -totally- wrong. only 1 letter left, and there are no 5 letter words in English all of the same letter.

unless you really like what you just had for lunch.

mmmmm

MetaEd

mmmmm isn't in the game's lexicon

I'm trying to think how to solve the problem

Mitch

how bout...
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

MetaEd

17:21

I haven't tried: will the game let you repeat a guess?

Mitch

You get all the right letters but none in the right place...for 5 tries. It doesn't force the answer (combinatorially) but maybe the choice of solution word in English will make it work.

@MetaEd hmm...I think that is against the spirit of the game.

if it checks if it is a legal English word, then I suspect it checks if you tried already.

MetaEd

@Mitch games have their rules, anything that obeys the rules is fair

Mitch

STEAL
STEAL
LEAST
SLATE
TALES
TEALS?

some permutation?

Nope.

If the solution is LEAST you get the least number of 🟩 (2)

🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟩🟨🟨
🟨🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟨🟩🟨🟨🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

How about solve in 5? That's combinatorially possible...
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Eliminate 20 letters.

all words can only use 1 vowel each

it's possible but unlikely

Robusto

18:31

@Mitch TESLA?

Mitch

19:14

@Robusto I don't think proper names are allowed, and also it hits too many of the others with the exactly correct placement of letters.

jlliagre

20:09

PARES
PARSE
PEARS
REAPS
SPEAR

That's the best I can do.

alphabet

20:31

Raccoons protest Elon Musk after Trump endorsement

Cerberus

I've always said that Musk was crazy.

And fucking annoying.

Robusto

@jlliagre SPARE?

RAPES?

@Cerberus He's a gigantic asshole.

alphabet

I hear that his planned colony on Mars will not include any raccoons.

Cerberus

@Robusto Quite.

@alphabet As long as it includes him.

alphabet

Jul 12 at 0:23, by alphabet

> Mr. Musk has volunteered his sperm to help seed a colony [on Mars], two people familiar with his comments said.

jlliagre

20:43

@Robusto RAPES, yes, SPARE clashes with SPEAR.

alphabet

Jul 12 at 0:24, by alphabet

Was this a joke or a repressed sexual fantasy?

(That was a reply to Cerberus, not jlliagre!)

jlliagre

I hope so.

Cerberus

Ugh.

alphabet

I hope the women involved will at least get paid to pump out mini-Elons.

Robusto

@alphabet They'd be paid better to pump out mini-eclairs.

alphabet

20:49

And that he doesn't plan to inseminate them the natural way.

Cerberus

It is unnatural, I say.

Straight sex.

jlliagre

Funny that 'tonneau' usage.

and the British use 'bonnet' on the other side of the car.

Don't try that in France.

Robusto

@jlliagre Trunk and hood ftw

alphabet

@Cerberus Sorry to Make You Think About Elon Musk’s Sex Life

> Finally, Musk said, bragging (?), “Haven’t even had sex in ages (sigh).” [...] And also, of course, he has offered a window into his worldview as a social Darwinist, saying that he is here to help the “underpopulation crisis.” Okay, that’s enough thinking about this topic for at least a week!

Cerberus

21:06

@alphabet I am glad that you are sorry!

Imagine if you had to have sex with him.

Robusto

@Cerberus Let's all avoid dredging up such ugly visions in chat, shall we?

Mitch

@jlliagre nice. that works.

OK next problem... P!=NP, can you do that one?

@jlliagre but also RAPES clashes with PEARS and REAPS on the last letter.

jlliagre

21:21

@Mitch That's not an issue.

Mitch

@Robusto I'd try one of those.

@jlliagre Sure it is. It'd get a green box instead of plain yellow, right?

@Robusto We need some poop jokes to ... um... cleanse our mental palate.

jlliagre

@Mitch The target word is the last one, 'SPEAR'.

Robusto

@Mitch I think it will take more than that. Try autoclaving.

Mitch

@jlliagre Oh. Right.

I forgot the rules.

@Robusto I'm imagining stuffing my brain into one and having it -just- fit.

It's a -very- large autoclave.

Robusto

Steve Martin 1974

►

Cerberus

21:26

@Robusto Let's!

Mitch

@Robusto pfft... mother-in-law jokes.

Robusto

@Mitch Yo mama (-in-law).

Mitch

@Robusto a personal friend of mine

How does he have so much energy to just throw at that kind of performance?

Robusto

@Mitch I don't think he does anymore. Hey, we were all in our 20s once upon a time.

Mitch

21:47

@Robusto I'm reading this now: Terri Gross NPR interview with Steve Martin

jlliagre

That one ?

⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Mitch

@jlliagre Sure.

jlliagre

What are the rules? It seems very easy if you are free to reuse letters.

Mitch

Oh. Hm. Yes, I see that now.

But then you'd also have to allow then repeating entire words which doesn't seem right at all.

ok let's say 'no repeated letters at all'

maybe that's just an extra rule for this one problem.

That's an OK meta-rule, that you can put mild restrictions on the rules for each puzzle, you know, to make it more interesting.

Also the meta-meta-rule is that we're really trying to solve P!=NP.

There's a million dollars in it.

But don't worry about that. It's just something to keep in the back of the back of your mind.

Also I need that money.

But no worries.

Just the puzzle.

No pressure.

A small child in a hospital bed whispers "promise me you'll..."

And then a monster truck bursts through the retaining wall, flames shooting in all directions. The brake-line has come unloose and the engineer is crawling upside down along the chassis, inches from razor sharp rocks speeding past. Dune buggies and motorcycles are racing the truck on all sides, multiple shaved-head proud boy warriors with exploding spears and axes, throwing them underneath the raging truck, to stop the repairs.

The mechanic bobbles the screwdriver in one hand trying to get a hold of it to tighten the line.

It pops out of his hand, it sparks backwards in the dust trail.

A distant explosion. A low rumbling. Then silence.

So... did yiu solve the problem yet?

jlliagre

22:38

I'm afraid not.

Even with relaxing the rules (duplicated letters allowed in a word.)

Oh, yes, with 5 rows.

MELEE
GRIFF
POTTO
WYNNS
KAPPA

I found that in the Internet:
WALTZ
VIBEX
CHUNK
FJORD
GYMPS

Mitch

@jlliagre nice

Note that any of those words in those sets could be a solution.

I think repeated letters is ok within a word

jlliagre

@Mitch Great. How will I get my million dollar?

Mitch

23:01

@jlliagre oh

About that

Uh

First you gotta write it up

Then submit it to a journal

Then hope it gets accepted by them

jlliagre

Hmm, ça sent l'arnaque.

Mitch

And then submit the (published) article to the prize award committee.

But I'd suggest a hidden-marketing strategy (academics look down on overt self promotion)

jlliagre

@Mitch and give them my bank account details and credentials for the transfer to be done ?

Mitch

But I suppose just publishing directly in arxiv would be difficult for the award committee

I mean conference proceedings are probably too slow at this point.

@jlliagre I avoided going in to such details but I suppose that is one of the last steps.

Probably declaring it on your taxes is the very last step.

All this talk is making me think that a lot of Nobel prize nominees are self-submitted.

Řídící

0

Q: How to pronounce Türkiye in English?

So, for a few years now, the country that was formerly known as Turkey wants the be known as Türkiye. International organisations like the United Nations, the OECD, and the World Bank Group seem to oblige. Suppose we also oblige, how are we supposed to pronounce Türkiye in English? (Does it happe...

pronunciation proper-nouns

Mitch

23:09

I'm now wondering about Médecins Sans Frontières's real motives

Řídící

Why close a question on pronunciation due to "opinion based"?

I can read an English UN, OECD, etc. website, but I can't ask how to pronounce it?

Mitch

@Řídící I noticed that you haven't voted to reopen yet

Řídící

@Mitch I wasn't aware I could. Let me try.

Mitch

(you can vote to reopen your own question)

But yes it is insane to close this question.

I had to hold back in my use of profanity in my comment to that effect

@Řídící yay! That worked!

alphabet

Reopened. The usual overzealous people closing questions for no reasons. Guess who.

Mitch

23:17

In addition to stifling profanity, I held back from naming names.

I'm also holding back from making denigrating jabs at their names.

Not that one guy's real name though.

It's hard to stop intrusive thoughts from happening, but you can definitely control what you do with them.

But when the 'mentia hits, it's going to be goddammit f*** this s*** mother f****er all the time. And that's when the light turns green a moment too late.

@alphabet thanks!

Dannyu NDos

23:41

@Řídící In Korean, the name officially changed from 터키 /tʰʌ kʰi/ to 튀르키예 /tʰy ɾɯ kʰi je/.

tchrist

@Mitch snickering will get you in trouble

@Řídící Presumably because Türkiye is not written in English. English has no rules for foreign letters like ü which do not occur in its alphabet. Therefore it can have no pronunciation in English that isn't mere opinion, and whatever that opinion is somebody else will have another one.

There's also the small matter that English had exactly zero words ending -iye, so nobody knows how to say that and never will.

Dannyu NDos

Eswatini, North Macedonia, and Türkiye ― What country would be the next to change its (English) name?

Cerberus

Just ignore that stuff and call it as you have always done.

It is not up to a government to decide how foreigners in a foreign language may use their own words.

Dannyu NDos

I mean, I'm just respecting their preferences.

And I never called their names when they were Swaziland and (just) Macedonia.

Of course, I knew Turkey, but the Korean phonology can accommodate "Türkiye".

Cerberus

23:57

The heart of the matter is that organisations cannot tell you how to speak.

Even less so than people.

What they call their own things in their own language is completely separate from what you call it in yours.

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