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00:07
@Mitch I feel like you're trying to tell me something
#WhenTaken #136 (12.07.2024)

I scored 840/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 215 km - 🗓️ 3 yrs - ⚡ 189 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 32 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 196 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 116 km - 🗓️ 22 yrs - ⚡ 142 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 460.2 metres - 🗓️ 30 yrs - ⚡ 115 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 6 km - 🗓️ 2 yrs - ⚡ 198 / 200

https://whentaken.com
 
1 hour later…
01:16
@CowperKettle The resulting 500-page NTSB report blamed "the lion's poor airmanship" for the crash.
01:37
@M.A.R. @jlliagre @MetaEd what are the guesses and what is the solution?
01:58
Special rapporteur (or independent expert) is the title given to independent human rights experts whose expertise is called upon by the United Nations (UN) to report or advise on human rights from a thematic or country-specific perspective. Depending on the specific mandate, there can also be working groups composed of an independent expert from each of the five UN regional groupings: Africa, Asia, Latin America and the Caribbean, Eastern Europe, and the Western group. Their work falls within the scope of "special procedure" mechanisms under the United Nations Human Rights Council, and thei...
"Rapporteur"? Do they have to be French? :)
> 1653 The Crackarades of balists or stone-throwing Engines, contrepate Clerks, Scriveners, Brief-writers, Rapporters [French référendaires], and Papal Bull-dispatchers lately compiled by Regis. —T. Urquhart, translation of F. Rabelais, 2nd Book of Works vii. 40
I don't know the difference between a reporter and rapporter. :)
> 2. 1653– A person who prepares an account of the proceedings of a committee, session, etc., for a higher body; (also) one who presents a report on the current state of a problem, policy, or issue to a commissioning body. Cf. reporter n. I.1b.
So, we should blame Rabelais? Or his traductor? :)
At least Rabelais, I know how to say. Urquhart, not so much.
02:32
Joint of the day: diarthrodial joint (freely movable joint, as opposed to synanthrodial and amphiarthrodial)
02:58
The problem with Kamala Harris, according to black women being interviewed by CNN, is that they’ve never seen her “bring it.” So they’ll go with Biden. “Don’t rock the boat,” they say, “if you don’t have a way to get me back to shore.”
03:32
@Xanne I can imagine no survey methodology more rigorous than "according to black women interviewed by CNN."
Best there is. Getting down with the people.
(I was being sarcastic, if it wasn't obvious.)
In the field. On the ground.
I imagine that, every time they need one of these anecdotes, they call up five random phone numbers from their Official List of Black Women.
I mean, it's possible they rigorously chose a representative, 100-person sample of Black women in key swing states.
Or it's possible that the reporter just talked to three of their friends.
No, it was reporters’ video. My interest was in the expression “I’ve never seen her bring it.”
03:42
Oh, sorry, I thought that that entire sentence was supposed to be a quote from CNN.
Bring it on—that I’ve heard.
That said, I somehow doubt it was a completely random and representative sample.
I've heard it before. Dunno if it's rising in popularity
@alphabet, school books aside polling these days is really difficult. It is devilishly difficult to get a representative sample.
"To determine what White men think of Joe Biden, CNN interviewed a bunch of White guys found on the streets of Boston. Most thought he was OK, though a few expressed a wish that he would be more racist."
04:10
 
3 hours later…
07:02
> Everyone agrees that feelings and actions are intertwined, but cannot agree how. According to dominant models, actions are directed by estimates of value, and these values shape or are shaped by affect. I propose instead that affect is the only form of value that drives actions. osf.io/preprints/psyarxiv/68yta
> es actions. Our mind constantly represents potential future states and how they would make us feel. These states collectively form a gradient reflecting feelings we could experience depending on actions we take. Motivated behavior reflects the process of traversing this affective gradient, towards desirable states and away from undesirable ones.
07:44
I’ve always wondered about that.
 
1 hour later…
08:57
Korean idiom of the day: Headbutting the ground — means trying so desperately.
09:51
> "Can we teach Transformers Causal Reasoning? We propose Axiomatic Framework, a new paradigm for training LMs. Our 67M-param model, trained from scratch on simple causal chains, outperforms billion-scale LLMs and rivals GPT-4 in inferring cause-effect relations over complex graphs." arxiv.org/abs/2407.07612v1
What did the cupcake say to the frosting?
I'm muffin without you.
 
4 hours later…
13:38
Hoosier Daddy
Disguise really a Cajun.
13:51
beige, rouge, mirage, collage, barrage, fuselage, sabotage, espionage, camouflage, fuselage, dressage, décolletage, garage, homage. But these aren't all stable across all utterances and dialects; some become affricated.
In that some people rhyme garage with cabbage and homage, while others say cabbage differently from how they say garage and homage.
Montage.
I haven't found any example that isn't French.
Phage rhymes with stage not with beige.
Nothing rhymes with cazh, not with sloughing.
Occasionally portage but never cottage
But could a Cajun put the beige in? Probably not.
ratissage
Not an especially common term in English.
badinage
Older, but still not all that common.
Words there are which we say but cannot write: I'll take the yoozh.
Might get you something less customary than huge.
Sondage.
zhuzh
It's passing strange that we should have an orthographic gap where we do not have a phonologic gap.
I blame the Romans.
14:24
When in Rome.
Bruges rhymes with rouge!?!!
!?😲‼️
> 1976 Quantities of cantelet lace, crewel fringe and yarn, Bruges thread, caddas and incle were sent to Canterbury by land. —T. S. Willan, Inland Trade i. 9
So many words you've never heardz.
cantelet, crewel, caddas, and incle.
2
:-/
😕
It's no wonder why vocabulary has always been such a bread and butter subject in grade schools.
When in Rome we must speak like the Romans or fear being thrown to the lions for the entertainment of the emperor.
14:42
No, it's because we are cursed to use their alphabet, one created to describe their language's sounds, not those of our own: a curse that lasts millennia.
Old English bettered it as needed, but the continental Roman Catholic clerical scribes erased their efforts, leaving us impoverished.
No more ash or ezh, edh or thorn or yogh.
For French lacked these. As did Italian. Because they're just Romans by any other name.
Gutenberg cooked our goose.
Romani ite domum.
Kreat Kaesar's sinnez are never uaʃt klean.
Okay, the language of the conqueror.
His letters.
But not his tongue.
Better than we should render unto Kaesar nought but the θɪŋz which are his, and unto ourselves our own.
14:58
The "whole language" vs "phonetic" approach to teaching reading is deeply divided over this issue.
Riven forever.
Have you heard of "miscue analysis"?
They do not let me teach their children.
What twisted paths we must lay down in our wetware to produce fluency in reading.
Once upon a time, not too long ago really, the man who could read silently without slowly mouthing out the words sotto voce was considered a wonder to behold.
Cleric perhaps I should say, not man. For only the clergy could read.
During those dark ages when literacy was lost to the common man.
Once Rome fell.
The alphabet remains.
Because it was preserved by the Roman church.
The middle class could not exist so long as only the hierophants alone were able to be bookkeepers.
Under Rome the Britons had a well-fed literate middle class to feed the Imperial bureaucracy. When she left, that all collapsed.
And only the abbey's ivory towers provided refugia of learning, or at least of transcribing the wisdom of the ancients.
15:17
"Eye movement analysis" shows exactly what beginner readers look at.
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Few unique characters in answer, mostly punctuation marks in answer (125): "Meet me" VS "Meet you" ✏️‭ by user521582‭ on english.SE
I wonder whether those analyses differ when comparing its results of our children versus those of languages with a more "transparent" orthography like Spanish or Italian or those with a less transparent one like non-Pinyin Chinese.
Their results transfer to all languages.
Including to people who were born completely deaf.
How would one explain letter-sound correspondence to somebody who has never heard sound.
15:35
Thanks for sharing 🙏
Sadly, The Society for the Scientific Study of Reading has only
811 likes • 848 followers
on FB.
15:49
Yet, Truth Social has 1M+ downloads at the play store.
16:18
@CowperKettle Is there something wrong with being judgmental?
Wordle 1,120 3/6

⬛🟩⬛🟨🟩
⬛🟩🟨⬛🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Daily Octordle #901
6️⃣5️⃣
🔟🕚
4️⃣9️⃣
8️⃣7️⃣
Score: 60
Daily Sequence Octordle #901
4️⃣5️⃣
6️⃣7️⃣
8️⃣9️⃣
🔟🕚
Score: 60
Twins!
 
2 hours later…
18:19
@tchrist There's a headline but no article there. I'd very much like to read this. No warning about paywall.
19:06
#WhenTaken #137 (13.07.2024)

I scored 716/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 1110 km - 🗓️ 14 yrs - ⚡ 141 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 4 km - 🗓️ 22 yrs - ⚡ 147 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 743.2 metres - 🗓️ 5 yrs - ⚡ 195 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 1 km - 🗓️ 13 yrs - ⚡ 176 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 1979 km - 🗓️ 32 yrs - ⚡ 57 / 200

https://whentaken.com
@jlliagre Wow. Worst in a while.
19:18
Daily Octordle #901
4️⃣9️⃣
5️⃣6️⃣
7️⃣🔟
🕚8️⃣
Score: 60
Daily Sequence Octordle #901
4️⃣5️⃣
6️⃣7️⃣
8️⃣9️⃣
🔟🕚
Score: 60
@Robusto Quadruplets!
#WhenTaken #137 (13.07.2024)

I scored 714/1000 🎉

1️⃣ 📍 1115 km - 🗓️ 1 yrs - ⚡ 167 / 200
2️⃣ 📍 3 km - 🗓️ 23 yrs - ⚡ 143 / 200
3️⃣ 📍 88.0 metres - 🗓️ 8 yrs - ⚡ 189 / 200
4️⃣ 📍 668.7 metres - 🗓️ 18 yrs - ⚡ 161 / 200
5️⃣ 📍 1797 km - 🗓️ 45 yrs - ⚡ 54 / 200

https://whentaken.com
@Robusto Statistically identical. Same mistakes apparently too.
and same hits.
Funny we both confused I and II.
> In 18th-century Europe, the then new practice of reading alone in bed was, for a time, considered dangerous and immoral.
@jlliagre Yes. A weird outcome.
@CowperKettle I couldn't sleep without that.
19:44
@jlliagre What bugs me is how far off in years we were on some clues. LIke, there were simply no reliable clues you could use to date the pictures.
19:57
@Robusto Clouds, scrubland, wooden electrical poles, cowboys, horses and cattle do not change a lot their look with time. There are a few vehicles in the distance but too blurred to help.
20:21
@jlliagre And another thing: those things you mentioned could be anywhere within 1000+ km of the center of where Tom lives. Maybe 1500+
@Robusto Sure it wasn't Manhattan :-)
nor Tokyo, nor New Orleans, nor London, nor Chichén Itzá. We had clues!
@jlliagre SPOILER
@jlliagre They run their greatest hits way too often. Let's see some deep tracks for a change, ne?
@Robusto Is that 'ne' a ね?
@jlliagre 勿論
Or maybe you prefer もちろん?
@Robusto Ha ha. Both are fine. I'm lucky search engines exist.
20:37
@jlliagre I'm lucky I have a Japanese keyboard (also German & Spanish) that I can switch to with no trouble. If I'd had this when learning Japanese ...
@Robusto I understand how can be a katakana/hiragana keyboard but I have no idea about how you are supposed to enter kanji ideograms with a keyboard.
I ... have ... the POWER!
@jlliagre You write in hiragana (unless katakana is called for) and a lookahead suggests possible kanji combinations in a dropdown list. You choose one or move on to a more complete spelling.
It's really easy.
And the kicker is, you write the hiragana using Eigo alphabet. I typed mo + chi + ro + n and the hiragana just appeared. Also the kanji in a list. I could have left it at that, but I was just showing off.
@Robusto That wasn't great when typewriters were what we had to use then.
@jlliagre Tell me about it. I had cardboard flash cards for learning the kanji, 2100 of them. I would take a dozen or so wherever I went to study them. But that was 40 years ago. Now you can just have a little app on your phone.
Educational psychology nowadays frowns upon flashcards with best selling books called Einstein Never Used Flashcards.
20:51
@user85795 Einstein never learned kanji either, did he?
Don't know.
@user85795 That's a no.
In any case your remark was not useful. I can't go back in time 40 years (and neither could Einstein, IIRC) and go through those years of learning again.
He never learned to drive a car.
@user85795 How dumb he was!
My remarks were meant as an exceptional anecdote.
21:07
@jlliagre what a loser.
He failed high school math.
@Mitch I hear he was involved with motorcycles and drugs too.
Couldn't tie his shoes until he was 18 and the army beat it into him
@Robusto gasp
The wrong sort of crowd.
Let me stop typing for a moment and wring my hands.
However there -is- an app powered by an LLM, that does allow you to go back in time.
What I'm saying is you don't have that excuse anymore.
OMG instead of a pinyin entry to get ideographs you use to know katakana or kendo fencing moves or shooting arrows through a tea ceremony to get characters
Have you ever noticed in both Star Wars -and- Star Trek there is no writing whatsoever?
In both hyper tech galactic civilizations everyone is illiterate.
I mean any lame-o can turn a knob, press an unlabeled button or say 'make it so'
You don't even have to know details bout what 'it' is. Just ... waves hands in that direction
Everytime someone in the future is looking at a screen it is just a vid of a pug riding a skateboard.
@Mitch Or it's showing some planets that are impossibly close.
Anecdotes ≠ statistically significant evidence.
21:22
I remember in one Star Trek episode they made too sharp a turn and went shooting out of the galaxy. That's like a toddler on a tricycle in Omaha making a tight turn on his street and careening into the Pacific Ocean.
0
A: What's quasi-modal be?

tchristThe key thing to remember about “modal” constructions is that modality refers to operating in both the epistemic mode of predictions and possibilities as well as the deontic mode of obligations and permissions. Anything modal can always go either way. The modal verbs in English are will, would, s...

I'm not sure whether "The winner was to be John" and "The winner was to have been John" differ enough to bother mentioning.
@user85795 Stop being such a fault finder. Nobody's paying you for that.
The winner had been going to be John.
@tchrist I'd recast the sentence before writing that.
21:28
@Robusto Indeed!
John was s'posed ta be the winner.
John should have won.
should've
@Robusto you may have thought you were trying to do one thing with that analogy but what I got out of it is that I now understand physics -and- toddlers
Surely, you must be joking.
21:31
@Robusto Catenating more and more periphrastic combos each with their own properties becomes too tedious to contemplate in real life. People just don't spontaneously say such horrors, even if they may write them.
@tchrist Depending on context, you might get away with "John didn't win!"
Wait...John didn't win?
No. Can you believe it?
Loser!
I find it hard to believe.
He was doing so well.
21:32
Dick won.
And Jill came tumbling after.
@tchrist Just like Einstein.
E=mc² wins
@Mitch He didn't lose her, he swapped her out for his cousin.
@tchrist What a dick.
Quoth his first wife.
And his second.
21:34
Baby Einsteins win.
I've heard he wasn't the best of husbands either
Yeah. His first wife deserves all the credit for his theories, anyway.
While he was out catting around, she was burning the midnight oil.
I mean you're revolutionizing all of physics since Newton...how do you have the time or ener... Oh. I get it now
At this very moment I'm staring laser beams at the head of a squirrel who is contemplating how to access the bird feeder.
I'm a bit miffed at his obliviousness to my distaste
12 hours ago, by CowperKettle
What did the cupcake say to the frosting?
I'm muffin without you.
@Robusto I don't think she did -everything-. She probably did figure out some things before him.
21:38
So I've been reading the latest novel by Tana French (quite good, highly recommended) and there's a lot of Irish dialect in it. Things like ending sentences strangely, such as "We'll all be round in the morning, sure," and "He's a fine strappin' lad, just." I'm wondering what the name for these appendices is.
Well you can be vague for the moment and call them Irishisms.
Fragments?
But they seem functionally to be simply ... particles?
@user85795 Don't you mean the "more preferable fragments"?
@Mitch Yeah, maybe. Discourse particles?
Like they do in German (doch, even, je)
21:41
@Mitch doch is a chameleon word.
comma comma chameleon
Or at the end of sentences in Chinese. (Ba= let's, ma = right? (making it a question), a = 'we all know this')
@Robusto I don't know exactly what a particle is but they're words that are not very...lexical? Like it's hard to pin down a definition of the word, but you know what it means in context?
@Mitch Except it's kinda different from that. Japanese ne and wa and ka are particles, but "just" and "sure" and a few others seem harder to pin down. It's kinda like they just want the musical phrase to be balanced or something.
'sure' and 'just' are fairly lexical but in those instances ... I don't know
Maybe we should call them codas.
21:45
I'm sure some.linguists had an entire conference on this.
Or semiotic softeners.
Or stool softeners?
And the decision they came up with was...
That there were a number of labels for it but none were very satisfactory so no consensus was made.
@Robusto to help ease out any blockage in meaning
Ahhh ... the infamous ELU rule: every conversation long enough eventually converges in a poop joke.
It only took us 10 minutes!
I suppose they're equivalent to "you know" in American English, ya know?
Huh
@Mitch Word.
21:50
Right?
Doncha know.
Ya feel me?
Dunno.
Hmm
Nuh-uh.
Nuh-huh
Ya durn tootin
Uh-uh.
Eh.
21:53
Don't Cha
I really find it annoying when, instead of saying '..., right?' people say '..., no?'
It's like they're daring you to contradict them.
Trollin
It also sounds like they're trying to be French.
So it's this flavor of arrogance with an aftertaste of hoity-toity.
Or maybe Spanish? Italian?
21:56
Just saw this sentence in a news article:
Singlish has all sorts of sentence ending particles with specific meanings la.
> when they noticed there were strangers on the ship, you would never see that baby face the same way again.
This perplexed me until I realized face was a noun, not a verb.
No I don't know what that means. Probably insulted your grandmother.
@Mitch Chinga tu abuelita.
@alphabet I like the verb version better.
@Robusto that's ... kind of a lot.
Have you met my grandmother?
Let me tell you about my grandmother.
21:59
@Mitch No to both statements.
@Robusto just as well. She's probably never met you either
Anyway, gotta go. Water for noodles is boiling and it's my turn to make dinner. Later.
Does Spanish have particles? Or those little vague no words that change a sentence from a warm heartfelt congratulations to a gauntlet throwing impertinence?
Or something in between?
There's always pasta soup if you let it go too long
22:19
@Mitch That "no" is similar to English question tags, no?
22:34
Me, trying to be French.
@Robusto Look at the news.
And I don't mean Richard Simmons RIP, either.
Remind me, is the current year evenly divisible by twenty? :(
1968 was not a good year.
23:34
@tchrist Awww, you mean they missed? In Texas? Some cowboys they got there.
@Robusto No, Pittsburgh. The place we aren't holding an all-hands company meeting this year because there's too much violence.
Pretty sure this wasn't supposed to have been possible.
@tchrist Pittsburgh. Meh. I wonder if it was stage-managed.
@Robusto With two dead and multiple injuries not yet fatal, I highly doubt it. But I don't know how they smuggled a firearm in.
@tchrist Fuck.
@tchrist Don't forget, the Supreme Court refused to let us ban ghost guns.
The Secret Service is pretty careful about all this since they lost RFK in 1968.
@Robusto Those are just ones without serial numbers, no?
Not plastic bits, I thought.
23:39
@tchrist No, they're ones that don't contain metal. Or something like that.
I don't know. I'm not a fan of firearms anyway.
Yes, I know next to nothing about them, and hope to keep it that way. In all senses.
I have zero idea how this all works with 3D printing.
> A 2021 Department of Justice audit of the federal government’s monitoring of 3D-printed firearms highlighted 3D-gun blueprints that could hypothetically be undetectable. But such a technology still requires the 3D-printed weapon to have its metal firing pins removed, be disassembled, and smuggled through security in a piecemeal form.
I think they still have no way around the firing pin being metal.
@tchrist Ceramic?

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