English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

KitFox

12:00

So today I think I will finish off my consulting work while I'm at my real job.

Matt Эллен

:D

-2

Q: human thesaurus time: what are some *novel* synonymous words & phrases for e.g. a radar "link-up"?

just as i say - what are some novel synonyms, along the lines of old Cold War terms, or space fiction, or James Bond films, that are similar to a "(radar) link-up"? i am naming a human-computer interface, but "human-computer interface" is almost COMPUTER language haha. so is "human readable" for ...

word-choice

KitFox

Also, I may read the newest chapter of HP:MoR.

Matt Эллен

I feel like we need to get this guy into writers chat or something

the question is wrong for here, but he might get help from them

RegDwight Ѭſ道

> please don't change my syntax, btw, as a note to editors. the formatting/typography/etc is sic.

KitFox

I was just going to paste that.

Matt Эллен

12:03

but if he really has an aphasia, we should try to help him

KitFox

If he has aphasia, we can't help him.

Matt Эллен

probably not

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@MattЭллен the Writers chat is deserted. Or do you mean he would keep it alive all by himself?

Matt Эллен

but I feel bad just kicking him out onto the street

@RegDwightѬſ道 :D probably

KitFox

I don't, but you could invite him in here.

The question just isn't appropriate for the site.

Matt Эллен

12:04

he can't chat with so little reps

KitFox

Well, then I guess he better contribute before he asks us to free associate.

Matt Эллен

anyway, it was just a thought

KitFox

It was a nice thought.

A thoughtful thought.

I don't believe for a second that he has aphasia though.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I have Aphasia on DVD.

KitFox

Oh. Haha. I forgot about that one. I've not seen it.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

12:15

Morning, all.

Matt Эллен

hi @MrShinyandNew

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Do you ever get a sense of impending doom?

Robusto

Network problems this morning. My WiFi works on my laptop, but the wired connection on my desktop doesn't seem to work even though I can ping my router. Any thoughts, ye network gurus?

Matt Эллен

@MrShinyandNew安宇 how doomy do you mean? I often get a sense that something is about to go wrong

but I don't think I've felt that the world is about to end, not for a long time - if ever

KitFox

@Robusto Did you refresh-renew your wired adapter?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

12:18

@MattЭллен Mainly I'm thinking of work-related doominess. Impending deadlines that cannot be moved and yet will not be missed. Like, a Y2K-ish problem, but affecting only us.

KitFox

Morning @MrShiny.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto So your wifi reaches the interent from the router? But the desktop cannot, though it can reach the router?

Robusto

@KitFox I recycled the modem, the router, and restarted the computer. Also unplugged and replugged the Ethernet cables several times.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Correct.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto Can your desktop reach your notebook?

KitFox

Hmm. Maybe your card shit the bed.

Robusto

12:20

@KitFox But how could I ping the router?

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Lemme see.

KitFox

@Robusto Ah, true.

Robusto

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I can log onto my desktop server from my notebook. WTF?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto So your desktop can access the local network but can't reach the internet. Sounds like a routing or firewall issue: packets are being dropped because they are disallowed, or being sent in the wrong direction.

Robusto

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I hate network issues.

Matt Эллен

have you checked the "allow my desktop online" box?

Robusto

12:25

Like, ages ago. Everything was working when I went to bed. Now it's not.

Matt Эллен

I had a similar problem. The tyre on my bike was inflated when I went to bed, when I went to ride to work this morning it was flat. I need to find the "allow Matt to ride to work" box.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

When was the last time you changed something on the desktop or the router?

Robusto

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Like, never ago. Two years?

Matt Эллен

Microsoft just released a patch to the remote desktop assistance stuff

maybe that's caused you an issue?

KitFox

That's what I was thinking.

Update your drivers and recheck your settings?

Robusto

12:29

FFFFUUUUUU...

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I would look at the Windows Firewall and the routing table first. Do you know how to read the routing table?

Robusto

I fucking hate network problems.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 My desktop is a Mac. And don't anybody start with me about that this morning. I'm in no mood.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto Well, I personally don't care if you use a mac. But: I have no clue how they do their stuff there. Maybe @Cerb can help? ;)

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Hahahahaha.

Sorry.

Robusto

Laugh it up.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

12:35

So, basics then: I assume the Mac has a software firewall of some kind. Can you turn it off?

Robusto

Yeah, I can turn it off.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

The other thing you might try: In Windows there are network "connections"; they sorta associate a network card and a particular network. Windows assigns default settings to the connection based on what kind of network it is. Sometimes, if those settings get screwed up, the easiest thing to do is delete the connection and re-create it. I don't know if your Mac has any similar analog.

Robusto

OK, now this is weird. When I try to connect to the router's access page, my Mac thinks I am still using a Linksys E4200, which I haven't used for years. But it won't connect to the Cisco router with the proper credentials.

KitFox

Well, there's your problem right there then.

Or maybe not.

Robusto

I think I'll try to zap the PRAM and reboot.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

12:46

Hey @Reg, did I ask you already what kind of Lego-themed software you think your life is missing?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I don't think so.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Like, a part-lookup, or an instructions tool, or anything you can imagine?

Robusto

No joy. Damn this sucks.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I only ever tried that design tool available from the LEGO website. It was nice, but only had like a couple hundred different pieces, and most importantly it required a minimum screen resolution of over 9000. Seriously, I could only see one half of it at a time. On my 82-cm monitor.

Matt Эллен

software that turns all non-living things I touch into Lego

KitFox

12:50

I can't believe I forgot Rob has a Mac.

Robusto

Hah, I didn't realize it but my Cisco router is actually a Linksys E4200. So at least that is correct. But my credentials don't work anymore. Hmm ...

KitFox

Is your caps lock on?

Robusto

Time for router recycle? I hate doing that, because it means I have to redo everything in the house.

@KitFox NO ITS NOT.

KitFox

Are you facing the monitor?

Robusto

What's a monitor?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

12:52

The thing you're not facing.

KitFox

Is your computer turned on?

Matt Эллен

the thing that checks that your heart is still beating

Robusto

Speaking of beatings ...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Hall monitors do that?

KitFox

Sorry.

Is this your home router, @Rob?

Matt Эллен

12:53

@RegDwightѬſ道 Heach and hevery one

Robusto

@KitFox Yes.

KitFox

Did you do a hard reset?

Robusto

I unplugged it for 30 seconds.

KitFox

On ours, we can do a soft or a hard reset. The hard reset puts everything back to factory default, including erasing our password and username.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I suspect the problem is the PC

KitFox

12:54

But I don't think unplugging it would've done that.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

otherwise, wouldn't the wifi also stop working?

KitFox

They are separate systems, right? So the wireless can work even if the wired doesn't?

I don't know much about this stuff though.

Can you plug in your laptop?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Within the router, they are probably combined into one system. The router basically has three network cards, a routing table, and a firewall. It merges the traffic from two cards and sends it out the third.

KitFox

I mean, switch off its wireless, and use the wired connection? Does that work?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Can you ping 8.8.8.8? that's the Google DNS server

KitFox

12:57

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Right, so you could have the wired card go bad, but the wireless still be fine, right?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox Well, yes. Except there IS traffic, so I don't think it's that.

KitFox

Is there? I thought he could only ping the router.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox The notebook can log into the pc

Robusto

I can ping 8.8.8.8 as well

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

that means you have outside access from the desktop.

KitFox

12:58

You know what? I'm not being helpful. Sorry. sits down and stays quiet

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

so the routing tables are good

Robusto

And I can ping "google.com" as well. But not "amazon.com"

WTF? This is very strange.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

can you ping shinyandnew.ca?

Matt Эллен

amazon might block pings

Robusto

Yep, shinyandnew.ca works.

Matt Эллен

13:00

yeah, I can't ping amazon either

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

so DNS works, routing works.

KitFox

Amazon is special.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

and I take it your web browser can reach your router,... can your web browser reach shinyandnew.ca?

Robusto

OK, I'm now accessing ELU chat from my desktop. I guess it got tired of being a little bitch.

Matt Эллен

yay!

Robusto

13:03

39 mins ago, by Robusto

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I hate network issues.

Seriously. Networks have this thing where you can't get something to work to save your life, and then it just suddenly starts working again.

KitFox

Caches.

Robusto

Cache-22.

KitFox

They lend a certain caché.

To your cacheism.

Robusto

That is a catachresis.

KitFox

Did I spell that wrong? wrinkles nose

Stupid technology day.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

13:11

No, the problem was only solved when you tried to access my website. I recommend you set it as your home-page to prevent future problems.

Matt Эллен

toodles!

Robusto

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Good idea. That virus you downloaded to me really did the trick.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto For best results also add my blog to your feed-reader.

KitFox

Huh. Catechism is the word I was trying to produce. Weird.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox caché? or cachet?

Robusto

13:13

@KitFox Lord Baltimore would have your guts for garters.

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Ah HA! Now I know your real name!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox what? who?

you already knew my real name

KitFox

Oh, right.

It's on your site.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Oh, where it says "Email Mark"? That could be some other Mark, who admins the website.

KitFox

I forget the things I know all the time.

Some other mark?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

13:15

I mean, some other, uh.. person? or something.

KitFox

I also frequently forget that you are younger than me.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Much, MUCH younger.

KitFox

Two years or so younger. A babe in the woods.

Anonymous

In programming - code is countable or uncountable?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox That's what my wife calls me too. She's also older than me.

Anonymous

13:17

I guess it's uncountable but I am not sure.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Anonymous depends

KitFox

I am writing code.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

source code is uncountable, I think.

KitFox

I think countable would sound funny.

Anonymous

I agree with that :)

KitFox

13:18

I have four codes collected in my application.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

code like a mapping code would have code points, which people refer to as "codes"

KitFox

Yeah, that sounds odd.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Oh true. I hadn't thought of that.

Secret codes.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

like barcodes, for example.

But "in programming" code usually means program code, like source or binary code, and it's uncountable.

Though the processor has instruction codes.

KitFox

Except in lolspeak.

Anonymous

Ahh, I mean source code. Do all of you agree it's uncountable?

KitFox

13:19

Yes.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Anonymous yes.

Anonymous

Thank you :)

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Hm, if you're writing assembly code, do you do it with assembly codes? hmmmmm

KitFox

Hmm.

Let's just sweep that under the rug.

Anonymous

I think assembly codes are things that we refer like MOV means move.

Like keywords

Robusto

13:23

@KitFox Computer code is an uncountable noun. Computer access codes are countable.

Anonymous

My two cents from non-native speaker, lol.

Robusto

Code, like water, seeks its own level.

Anonymous

English language is fun to learn. Especially English phrases. :)

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Anonymous yes, precisely. But that means for some programmers, "code" is made up of "codes".

Robusto

Here's a thought: The word "pussy" is both a countable noun and an uncountable noun.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

13:31

@Robusto like "chicken"

Anonymous

I know chicken but not pussy.

Robusto

How old are you again?

Anonymous

I just searched it on google, pussy are porn related.

I am 26.

KitFox

sighs

Robusto

Moving on, I notice that ME3 gets a 94 rating on metacritics. Yet everyone talks about how disappointing it is.

The User Score is only 4.9!!

Anonymous

13:33

I know what does it mean now, lol. Seems like it's rude word.

KitFox

I hear that it is because they are returning players who felt that the endings weren't as choosable as in ME2

@Anonymous Yes. It sure is.

Except you'd say "I know what it means now."

Or "I know what it does mean now" maybe.

Robusto

10) "ending is really bad in Mass Effect 3"

20) Day 1 DLC! WHY?! I already paid $60 for it and it's still not the full game?

30) EA has just gone down hill anything they touch turns into poo.

40) GOTO 10

Anonymous

I know what it means now. :)

KitFox

Perfect.

Anonymous

I am going to have dinner, be right back. :)

KitFox

13:38

We'll have you speaking like a filthy-mouthed native in no time.

Speaking of filthy, I should probably go shower.

BRB

RegDwight Ѭſ道

2

Q: What's the right possessive pronoun for "nobody"?

Should it be his or their here: A: Why did you put on that baseball cap? B: Because I want to take shower A: Nobody takes shower with his cap on.

pronouns

Way to disguise yet another question about a gender-neutral pronoun.

56

Q: Is there a correct gender-neutral, singular pronoun ("his" versus "her" versus "their")?

Is there a pronoun I can use as a gender-neutral pronoun? Each student should save his questions until the end. Each student should save her questions until the end.

word-choice pronouns personal-pronouns gender-neutral

Robusto

13:54

@RegDwightѬſ道 The answer to that is obviously nobody's business.

KitFox

Ahh. Squeaky clean.

Robusto

Squeaking does not make you clean. If it does, ~~mouses~~ mice are the cleanest creatures around.

Seriously, I wrote "mouses" ... I think I need to go to the ER.

The Internet has ruined my brain! Wah!

KitFox

There, there.

Speaking of mouses, I think I can hear one in the wall.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox I didn't see you in there!

KitFox

Well, did you see Megan Fox?

Matt Эллен

14:09

Surprisingly, I did

KitFox

That was me in disguise.

Matt Эллен

(0_0)

KitFox

Huh. I feel like that was wrong for me to say.

Matt Эллен

you foxes are wily

Robusto

@Reg: Wars are too hard. I can't beat anybody.

KitFox

14:10

Oh shit. WMT. I forgot.

Oh, sorry. Should I even try now?

Or just wait?

Robusto

I'm waiting. I just got my ass handed to me five times, so I don't think I'm going to close the gap for us.

KitFox

Well, I've still got the prior missions to finish up before I get to the new stuff, which is already getting old.

I guess I can do that for a bit.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Haha, and now Tim has marked it as a dupe of this:

8

Q: None as plural indefinite pronoun

In my grammar book (English Grammar, HarperCollins Publishers), I read that none is occasionally treated as plural, but it is usually regarded as singular. Can you give me an example of sentence where none is used as plural pronoun?

grammar grammatical-number pronouns mass-nouns

Nice trolling, Tim.

@Robusto Yeah same here. I'm waiting for the next one.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox nah, Megan Fox doesn't mind! She likes the publicity

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Jun 20 '11 at 15:13, by RegDwight

Am I the only person to think that Megan Fox is a rather hideous moron?

KitFox

14:16

No, you're not.

But the shape of her body makes me wish I were twenty pounds lighter and twenty years younger.

And could ride a motorcycle.

And crush walnuts with my thighs.

Maybe not twenty years younger. That was a bit poetic.

Maybe just ten years younger.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Jun 20 '11 at 15:24, by RegDwight

I'd rather eat a walnut. And be ten years older.

Matt Эллен

Nah, I like her. she seems alright in the interviews I've watched

plus she said no to transformers 3, so +1

KitFox

When's she doing porn?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

You've watched the wrong interviews. Plus she said yes to transformers 1 and 2, so -9000.

KitFox

With Keira Knightley?

Ach. You tweened me.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

14:20

If you are into Keira Knightley, just go watch Sasha Grey.

Robusto

Is it a sin to know absolutely nothing about the Kardashians? Is there anything to know?

KitFox

makes notes

@Robusto They believe in the sanctity of marriage.

Matt Эллен

didn't they used to run Bajor?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto Who is that?

aedia λ

@MattЭллен Yeah, I'm still bitter about that

Matt Эллен

14:23

@aediaλ have you been planting bombs on their TV show?

Robusto

I keep hearing the Kardashians mentioned, but even though I've googled and read things about them, I still don't understand why they are the topic of anybody's conversations or interest.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

They are famous for being famous.

Like Paris Hilton.

aedia λ

@MattЭллен Shh! We don't talk about being Maqui sympathizers!

KitFox

Famous for having money and sex.

Matt Эллен

oop!

KitFox

14:25

With the sex part being on tape.

Well, recorded in some fashion and then broadcast.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 A celebrity is someone who is famous for being well known.

@KitFox Errrr ... how much money and how much sex?

KitFox

Kardashian

Kardashian () is an Armenian surname. "Kardash" means 'stone' ("kar") + 'carver' ("dashogh" - "dash") in Armenian and patronymic suffix (ending) "-ian". The most notable people with the surname Kardashian come from one family: First generation: * Robert Kardashian (1944-2003), lawyer who represented O. J. Simpson. * Kris Jenner (formerly Kris Kardashian née Houghton), American television personality who was married to Robert Kardashian from 1978 to 1990. Second generation (all children of Robert and Kris); all of whom are American television personalities: * Kourtney Kardashian, busines...

Hahaha.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Well, one of them Kardashians has achieved a whopping two things so far: having celulitis and trying to shop it away. Arguably, that's one thing more than some of the other people on this planet have achieved so far.

KitFox

> Distinguish from Cardassian (Star Trek alien species)

RegDwight Ѭſ道

The rest of them just happen to have the same name.

Matt Эллен

14:32

> This article is about a fictional species. For the real-world Armenian surname, see Kardashian.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1

Q: Words with multiple uses

I was posed a question the other day: "Can you think of a word that can be used as a Noun, Verb or an Adjective?" One such word would be "light". Is there a rule for identifying such words? (See also: What word can fulfill the most parts of speech?) Along a similar line, is there any rule (...

word-usage multiple-meanings

This question is kind of pointless.

Matt Эллен

I smell a conspiracy

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I let it be until now, but seeing the kind of answers it gets... meh.

I mean, the default situation in English is that theoretically any word can be used as a noun, verb, or adjective. It's flexible like that.

KitFox

I remember answering "polysemy" to a question before. Maybe it is a dupe.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

So if anything, he should be asking the opposite thing: are there words that can't be these things under any circumstances ever.

KitFox

14:40

OMG. Gramma D! I forgot to give her breakfast! BBL.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

My goodness.

Mahnax

Hi.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Hmm I don't know. In the first place, there are funds to write to that can help you battle against the copyright trolls. So they may win. Secondly, even if they lose, it would be very bad publicity for Zaentz. You can see how much the current publicity (is it big in the UK? I believe it was on the BBC?) bothers them...it is basically a lose-lose for them, so announcing that you will go to court may force them to drop it.

KitFox

14:55

phew She was still sleeping anyway.

I think that has got to be the most perfect fried egg that I have ever made.

user19161

@KitFox She will wake up when she smells it.

KitFox

She woke up when I brought it in.

She is deaf as a post, so I couldn't rouse her.

user19161

Exactly.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus They do seem to be rattled, since they're willing to settle for a nominal amount, but I doubt they'd give up so easily.

Cerberus

You are a good dil.

KitFox

14:56

I didn't want to shake her too roughly.

@Cerberus gdil.

user19161

I like Megan Fox. I did not watch Transformers 3.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Maybe not...it would be interesting to see what would happen if the Hobbits firmly entrenched themselves.

They have sturdy feet, you know.

@KitFox Ah right.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus :D I bet it would look like Bag End

KitFox

What about hobbits?

user19161

@MattЭллен That reads like Bad Eng.

Matt Эллен

14:59

@KitFox the company that owns all the Tolkien trademarks are threatening every where in the UK that uses their trademarks with law suits. We're talking specifically about a Southampton Pub called The Hobbit

user19161

@Mahnax Boo! I have a feeling I got some presents on another site.

KitFox

What a bunch of jackasses.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Like this?:

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…