English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

tchrist

02:19

Here ya go:

15

A: Why is there no "autumntime" or "falltime"?

TL;DR: Unlike most dictionaries, the OED does include autumn-time as a word. It is quite rare in comparison with the other seasons’ versions. Variations in punctuation, spacing, and capitalization do not matter. Well, there is the word autumn-tide, but it doesn’t get used much. Here’s o...

skullpatrol

03:06

!!youtube autumn wind is a raider

Jarvis the Bot

►

skullpatrol

There is the answer^

@tchrist

skullpatrol

06:57

@Johan math.

Matt Эллен

07:33

Good morning

skullpatrol

07:51

Hi

How are your bruises looking and feeling @Matt

Johan Larsson

@skullpatrol math?

Matt Эллен

@skullpatrol bit of an ache, but otherwise, good, thanks :)

Johan Larsson

@skullpatrol feels wrong :)

skullpatrol

08:51

In my opinion @Johan Larsson since it has one less letter, it feels right :)

Andrew Leach

Less or fewer?

skullpatrol

~~less~~ *fewer

Thanks @Andrew Leach :D

Robusto

@AndrewLeach Prescriptivista!

Andrew Leach

No; but saying "one less letter", it feels wrong :)

Robusto

Hey, @Andrew. Who deleted my comment from the "autumntime" question? It wasn't offensive or irrelevant.

Johan Larsson

09:03

@AndrewLeach what about maths?

Robusto

09:19

@AndrewLeach: What, no answer?

Andrew Leach

@Robusto Sorry, I'm at work. A project manager arrived. I'll see what I can find...

Robusto

NP

skullpatrol

09:54

@Johan Larsson it comes down to saying either six of one or a half dozen of the other.

Johan Larsson

ok I'll stop nagging now

skullpatrol

Six=half dozen :)

If we didn't have these little nagging questions in our minds, science would not progress.

Andrew Leach

10:47

@Robusto OK. Because the person who took the action is not publicly revealed, I don't believe I'm supposed to subvert that, so I won't at the moment. (I'm still finding some things are new! I've asked about policy; I may be told I can say something concrete.)

Flags on comments are even more ephemeral than comments. Can't see whether it was flagged at all, let alone which flag it was.

Robusto

@AndrewLeach I'm just curious about the reason for deletion. Plenty of less substantive comments are allowed to remain.

I mean, I was not offering it as an answer. Which is why it was a comment.

Andrew Leach

I suspect it was Not Constructive, probably because it said "Not really sure why. We just do it that way."

Robusto

room topic changed to English Language & Usage: / no comment / (no tags)

Andrew Leach

But even "We do it that way" can be an answer.

Although it's not an easy answer to explain.

Robusto

@AndrewLeach Well, that's bullshit. Can you see the comment text itself?

Andrew Leach

10:51

Yes.

Robusto

Would you mind posting it here so that I have a record? I'm considering taking the issue to meta.

Andrew Leach

> We just use fall or autumn in those cases, both as nouns and adjectives. Not really sure why. We just do it that way. That's not to say you couldn't say "autumntime" if you really wanted to.

Robusto

Thanks.

I think that is more informative than most comments one sees on this site. And not exceptionable at all.

Andrew Leach

As you say, it's not offensive, and it's not completely off-the-wall either.

Robusto

I don't think it's even a little bit off the wall. It's germane to the question, but not really an answer: hence, a comment.

Andrew Leach

10:56

... goes back to look at question again ...

Yes. I can't see an issue, really. We'll give it another go, but it may be flagged and removed again.

Robusto

Thanks.

I posted a "why was this deleted" message on Meta.

Mitch

11:35

@SkullPatrol I'd totally take a 1/2 dozen. 6 doesn't seem like enough.

Robusto

How many is that in metric?

Mitch

11:54

0.5 of a lot. 0.6 of several is nowhere near as much (I can understand why people might be confused)

skullpatrol

12:21

@Mitch I agree.

Have you seen this @JohanLarsson?

terdon

12:34

@AndrewLeach That's interesting, it sounds fine to me. Just like one less mouth to feed . In fact, one letter fewer sounds very wrong to me.

21 hours ago, by Johan Larsson

37

Q: Did the Twitter account Fifndhs predict the World Cup results ahead of time?

There was a feeling of exhilaration and excitement on Twitter, with the Twitter account @FifNdhs called “FIFA Corruption” seemingly having predicted the final result of the World Cup final hours ahead of time. The amazing German footballer Mario Götze scored the game’s only goal in the 113th m...

Too slow @skullpatrol :)

skullpatrol

sorry

terdon

Why sorry? Cant be expected to read the whole transcript every day! I just thought it was funny you both posted the same Q.

Robusto

More proof that we live in a fantasy world.

skullpatrol

I'm just not as much on the ball as @JohanLarsson is.

Robusto

If it's a soccer ball, @JohanLarsson is on it. ^_^

skullpatrol

12:38

-_-

Matt Эллен

If it's the ball of his foot...

Johan Larsson

Where does the 'S' come from in the UK version? Could be the same origin as the s in mathematic**S*?

Robusto

@JohanLarsson I think that's likely.

Americans just truncate the whole word. Brits seem to feel that the word requires the plural distinction.

Neither way is "right"; just a matter of style.

Johan Larsson

ok feels better now, felt wrong without the s, now I'm not alone.

terdon

Which s is that?

Johan Larsson

12:42

Still have to wrestle with VS for a couple of hours more.

Robusto

@terdon mathematic[s]

@JohanLarsson VS?

terdon

What's a UK thing? Does anyone say mathematic to refer to the science?

Johan Larsson

Visual Studio

Robusto

Ah, right.

I knew that meant something, but I don't use VS these days and it wasn't on the tip of my thoughts.

Johan Larsson

huge bs today, been moving backwards poking with all things I could think of

Robusto

12:43

I like a lot of things about VS, but dislike a lot of others.

skullpatrol

@terdon math(s)

Robusto

jinx

terdon

Ah! Math, versus maths OK.

Johan Larsson

@Robusto what is your preferred editor/IDE?

terdon

Also, does anyone else agree with @Andrew that one fewer letter sounds better than one less letter?

skullpatrol

12:44

I do.

Robusto

@JohanLarsson If I could I would go back to editing in emacs. Other than that, I have no preference, as long as it isn't Eclipse.

@terdon Not me. I actually think one less letter sounds better.

Johan Larsson

I agree with Andrew cos he is so much better than I am, no other opinion really, both feel ok.

Robusto

The distinction between fewer and less cannot be resolved to six decimal places.

terdon

@Robusto Me too. One fewer letter sounds outright wrong actually.

@Robusto Or less.

Robusto

@terdon Yes. Because fewer implies quantity, and when it gets a singular complement it causes consternation.

terdon

12:47

I meant six decimal places or less.

Robusto

I know what you meant. Took me a few seconds, though.

terdon

By the way, why would you have given up on emacs? What have you found that's better?

Traitor.

skullpatrol

@terdon Like "how many" and "how much" ... "fewer" is discrete, while "less" is continuous.

Robusto

Heh. When I was just coding on my own I used emacs. Then I started working for companies, and so the IDE thing began.

terdon

@skullpatrol It's not as clear as that. Consider one less mouth to feed for example.

skullpatrol

12:49

that is an idiom

Robusto

But an instructive one.

Idioms are part of the language too.

skullpatrol

@terdon I'm talking math

terdon

@Robusto Use EBC!

Andrew Leach

23

Q: Which is correct: "math" or "maths"?

Which one is considered correct? I say "math", however I believe I heard somewhere that "maths" is correct. Also, should it (and "mathematics") be capitalized or not?

word-choice

terdon

JSBձոգչ

12:50

@terdon wtf

terdon

@skullpatrol So? How about one less thing to worry about? One less bug to solve_?

@JSBձոգչ emacs baby!

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

one less man to pick up after

JSBձոգչ

@terdon no, i mean why does preflightCheck return a 20-element array?

make that thing a hash or... something

Robusto

@terdon Does it have intellisense, code completion, automatic syntax checking, etc.?

terdon

@JSBձոգչ I never use it as an array. The function is just reading options and setting those variables. I use the array syntax for simplicity, that's all.

skullpatrol

12:52

@terdon Is there no difference between the discrete and the continuous?

JSBձոգչ

@terdon i am also suspicious of a function that returns 20 values

Robusto

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 What is the optimal number of men to pick up after?

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

I gotta shower.

terdon

@Robusto Some of that, yes. Completion certainly, syntax checking in as much as the coloring changes (but that is very extensible, I just haven't bothered) and intellisense I don't know.

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

@Robusto one, as long as he appreciates it.

Robusto

12:53

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 That's not an answer.

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 So if you had one less, that would be zero. Zero men to pick up after.

terdon

@skullpatrol Well, I would use less for both I think.

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

@Robusto hey, I didn't write the song.

@Robusto I was answering skullpat.

!!afk shower

Robusto

every day i write the book

Matt Эллен

@terdon when do you use fewer?

Jarvis the Bot

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 Nobody cares.

skullpatrol

12:54

@terdon That is not the mathematical convention :)

terdon

@JSBձոգչ Well, it's only run once, and its job is to check that everything is OK. Those are global variables used throughout the script. Also, bear in mind that I am a biologist by training and trade, not a programmer :)

JSBձոգչ

@terdon perhaps i'll grant you an indulgence :)

terdon

@MattЭллен That's what I'm trying to figure out. There were fewer people than I expected for example.

@JSBձոգչ Thanks :). By the way, I enjoyed the story you posted the other day! Sounds like an interesting universe. Keep them coming!

Mitch

@JSBձոգչ Me me me! raises hand furiously I want one!

Robusto

@terdon My son is a biologist too. His programs get the job done, but I always tsk-tsk when I see his code.

terdon

12:56

:)

JSBձոգչ

@Mitch what sins have you committed?

Mitch

I want to save up. Just in case.

terdon

@Robusto I've improved immensely but I've never taken a programming class in my life so my style is probably not too good.

Matt Эллен

Mitch has committed the sin of preparedness for sinning.

terdon

@skullpatrol I would say that fewer can only be used for discrete while less can be used for either.

Mitch

12:57

@MattЭллен Dammit... turns in chips

terdon

The main difference being the presence of a number. So, fewer mouths is fine while less mouths sounds strange while 5 less mouths sounds fine.

KitFox

I'd like to take a moment to publicly praise our new moderators. They are doing a great job.

7

@terdon 5 less mouths sounds horrid.

terdon

I think for me the difference is whether the number is specified.

Matt Эллен

basks

JSBձոգչ

who are the new mods?

terdon

12:58

@KitFox Whohooooooooo Yay new mods!

KitFox

@JSBձոգչ Matt, Andrew, Yoichi.

terdon

@JSBձոգչ All them new blue people.

JSBձոգչ

Yoishi?

Mitch

@terdon I'm going to start saying 'fewer' for indiscreet things. "I'll have fewer guilt once I have my prophylactic indulgences"

KitFox

Have you been under a rock?

Mitch

12:59

And you can't stop me.

JSBձոգչ

we allow septegenarian japanese men to mod on ELU now?

skullpatrol

@KitFox star worthy

JSBձոգչ

@KitFox yes

KitFox

@JSBձոգչ Octogenarian.

JSBձոգչ

@KitFox even better.

terdon

12:59

@Mitch Oy! Nobody said anything about countable vs non-countable!

@JSBձոգչ Allow, shmallow, he was voted in and by a landslide if I remember correctly.

KitFox

@JSBձոգչ And it is more of an honor post.

JSBձոգչ

in all seriousness, i can hardly think of a better person than Yoichi

maybe we can make him president

terdon

I'd love to meet the guy.

Robusto

@MattЭллен Wait, you can prepare for sinning? If so, how do you prepare for Original Sin?

Mitch

@JSBձոգչ Dude.... I've been under a rock (long story) and I still know.

JSBձոգչ

13:01

i knew we were having elections. i hadn't looked at the results yet

terdon

@Robusto Always carry a small fruit knife?

Mitch

@terdon He'll probably tell you to get off his lawn.

Robusto

@JSBձոգչ It's Yoichi, not Yoishi. Sheesh.

terdon

@Mitch Heh, probably.

KitFox

@Robusto Oishi-san.

Mitch

13:02

@Robusto It's a skill.

Matt Эллен

@terdon lol

terdon

Speaking of original sin:

►

Robusto

I haven't seen his name in Japanese, but if I were to guess Yoichi means "first good" and Oishi means either "small stone" or "big stone" . . . In fact, I find it rather disconcerting that I can't see his name in the original. Leaves me always to guess at this.

►

there's no such thing as an original sin

terdon

I really need to spend some time listening to Costello. One of those musicians I know I'll like but have never really gotten into somehow.

Robusto

@terdon Ask @cornbreadninja麵包忍者. She's got the bug.

KitFox

13:10

@yoichioishi Would you share your honorable name with us in chat, as it is written in Japanese?

So @JSB, when do you talk to your agent?

JSBձոգչ

@KitFox already talked to her. i'm taking a bit to clean up the doc then sending it in

KitFox

Did she know you had a novel?

JSBձոգչ

i told her

!!jquery isArray

Jarvis the Bot

@JSBձոգչ api.jquery.com/jQuery.isArray

Robusto

@JohanLarsson It really bugs me when people use the term OCD when they really mean fastidious or obsessive! nerd rage

2

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

13:21

@Robusto it's more like a virus that flares up. Herpes Simplex EC.

Jarvis the Bot

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 There goes the neighbourhood.

Robusto

@cornbreadninja麵包忍者 The gift that keeps on giving.

KitFox

I liked the Battleborn reveal trailer.

Just saw it on my way to some tingles.

tchrist

@Mitch Indiscreet things like “seeing” your mistress before going to church with wife and kids?

@Robusto You can turn a programmer into a biologist, but not the other way around. I’ve seen it so often that is to cry for.

skullpatrol

@tchrist discretion is the better part of valour

terdon

13:26

@tchrist Ha! That's what programmers think.

cornbread ninja 麵包忍者

@Robusto it looks like a luxury and feels like a disease

terdon

Accretion is the better part of value.

Mitch

@skullpatrol The worst part of valor is that chicks think you're stuck up.

Robusto

@terdon Discretion may or may not be discrete.

KitFox

@tchrist Excuse me?

folds arms

terdon

13:28

@KitFox Are you one or the other?

KitFox

It was a biologist who turned into a developer. Now I'm a business analyst in a research laboratory.

skullpatrol

@Mitch chicks like that need an attitude adjustment

Mitch

@terdon Neither here nor there? Linsey-woolsey?

terdon

@KitFox That's some trajectory you (it?) have there.

Johan Larsson

@Robusto I dunno the difference

Robusto

13:31

@JohanLarsson joke

Mitch

@skullpatrol You should 'check' the 'dial' before 'seeing' her before 'church'. Wait... that's the instructions on my chafing dish that I use the for the poached salmon for brunch on Sunday.

KitFox

@terdon There were other stops and other dimensional trajectories as well.

Mitch

It all comes clear now.

KitFox

I'm rather non-linear.

Johan Larsson

@Robusto I got that much, but not the joke :)

terdon

13:31

@JohanLarsson When it's you doing it, you are meticulous, a perfectionist who gives great attention to detail. When it's someone else, they're anal or have OCD.

Johan Larsson

ty ty

Robusto

@JohanLarsson The joke was, my statement itself was an example of what many would consider OCD behavior.

JSBձոգչ

i'm not feeling great. i may have to capitulate and go get food

Robusto

See, it ruins a joke to have to explain it to a Swede.

Johan Larsson

I thank you for your patience though :) (All of you)

skullpatrol

13:34

Swedes are cool

terdon

Suedes are cooler.

►

skullpatrol

!!youtube dont step on my blue suede shoes

Jarvis the Bot

►

tchrist

@skullpatrol Rutabagas. Kohlrabi.

terdon

@skullpatrol No! Not the Elvis version! The Perkins one I posted is much better (and came first) :)

skullpatrol

13:39

I'm not interested in originality, just popularity :D

terdon

Tsk.

:P

Robusto

@terdon Ah, a Carl Perkins aficionado. Cool.

skullpatrol

@JohanLarsson do you like ABBA?

terdon

@robusto At least for that particular song, certainly.

Johan Larsson

@skullpatrol no, vocals are ok but the songs are meh

Robusto

13:41

Gotta go into a meeting. laterz.

skullpatrol

later

pal

KitFox

14:33

So @Matt, I am writing more flash fiction for Neil.

Matt Эллен

yay!

what's it aboot?

KitFox

let me think a min.

"on your doorstep" is the theme.

It's going to have a dishwasher — the person kind — and a potentially homeless young woman who is not a homeless young woman at all.

Matt Эллен

interesting

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox So an appliance that's actually a person and a person who's potentially not a person.

aedia λ

Funny how my brain jumps immediately to thinking they're both evil robots.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

14:42

@aediaλ! hao jiu bu jian!

aedia λ

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Hola!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

how've you been?

aedia λ

Good! Busy. The start of summer has been a bit crazy at w*rk on account of everyone's vacations, but now things are settling down again.

And I'm almost done redoing my front porch! That's been absorbing every spare minute of my time except when it's raining.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

nice

Kit and I are planning a party on your front porch

so it's nice that you're getting it tidied up

aedia λ

Last night it was pouring out so I gave myself a night off and played videogames.

Hehe!

You'll like it. The blue and white is very relaxing.

user116848

14:57

Hi folks!

Cerberus

Hello!

user116848

@aediaλ You mean it was raining. How much rain?

Matt Эллен

Hello!

user116848

@Cerberus Hey Cerbs. How are you doing today man?

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…