The Bridge

That said I believe that anyone who owns or manages a mean for people to talk to each other and doesn't make it easy for people to comfortably and anonimously flag assholes to oblivion are a much, much bigger part of the problem

and those who deal with those flags and generally seem to ignore them are equally as responsible

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz But you seem to think that it's only OK to talk about one side of the issue

badp

The software support needs to improve all over the board and I really like how Stack Exchange deals with it

murgatroid99

And I don't think that's much better

Frank

1:07 AM

@LessPop_MoreFizz I have no issue discussing this, but I would prefer if you would actually treat my opinion with some respect, rather than just deciding I'm wrong because I don't fully agree with your viewpoint.

LessPop_MoreFizz

there has been, for many years, a culture of silent acceptance of the sort of misbehavior that has erupted in the past few months, under the impression that "It's just teenagers acting out and they'll get over it and nobody will get hurt," and I think that sort of dismissive attitude is harmful and dangerous.

badp

In 99% of forums the report button is a black hole; nothing will happen out of your report

that's just so wrong

murgatroid99

@badp This is something I can agree with. It is only possible to scale moderation by allowing everyone to do it

@Frank Thank you. I've never manage to fully articulate that

LessPop_MoreFizz

@Frank You are welcome to disagree with me about how to solve problems. In this particular context, I am not interested in being disagreed with as to what constitutes a problem. @murgatroid99 has generally insisted upon trying to do the latter.

Frank

@murgatroid99 I do see both sides being argued here. I think a call to action is a good thing, but I don't think pushing people into doing said action really garners the sort of response you really want.

murgatroid99

1:10 AM

> I am not interested in being disagreed with as to...

Frank

@LessPop_MoreFizz What you're interested in is irrelevant. You need to respect other people's viewpoints, whether you agree with them or not. Especially here.

murgatroid99

This is exactly what makes constructive conversation impossible

LessPop_MoreFizz

@Frank Not all viewpoints deserve respect. Misogyny, harassment, and support thereof is on that short list.

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz And if you lump someone's argument in with those things, it's much easier to dismiss them

Frank

@LessPop_MoreFizz You're seeing every differing viewpoint as not deserving of respect right now.

LessPop_MoreFizz

1:12 AM

@murgatroid99 It's hard not to lump someones argument in with those things when they continually come rushing to the defense of the people who espouse those things. If you don't realize that that is what you've been doing, then we're beyond constructive conversation anyway.

Frank

Is there a problem? Yeah, I think there is. Should we do something about it? Probably, although I don't know what or how. Does that mean we burn those that don't do anything at the stake?

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz I explicitly said that I don't condone those actions. But that doesn't seem to matter to you

LessPop_MoreFizz

Because really, all I'm going to be able to say is "Those people are assholes, why are you so insistent on trying to be one of them?"

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz If you're lumping in innocent people with the assholes, am I wrong for defending those people?

Frank

Okay, this is getting beyond possible constructive discussion.

I request a topic change.

badp

1:13 AM

@murgatroid99 ...yes

I think we've hit the core

Why are you feeling associated with them to begin with

I play games, I consider myself a "gamer", but those "gamers are dead" articles don't really touch me

murgatroid99

@badp So if I say someone's a misogyist, they become completely indefensible?

DwarfSlice

You can be a misogynist and still have good points about other issues.

badp

@murgatroid99 I never said that.

I did say that your sense of identity is... weird

murgatroid99

@badp The "you" in my sentence was referring to LessPop. So you just said that yes, if LessPop lumps someone in with assholes, then that person becomes indefensible

LessPop_MoreFizz

@murgatroid99 I linked the 'Not all Men' comic before and you dismissed it because it's a comic, but I meant it rather seriously. The discussions that spawned it (1) and (2) for example are a rather good example of exactly what's going on here and why what you're doing is problematic.

Tim Stone

1:16 AM

The issue is that there's no point in bringing up the broken arm rest when the entire train has derailed and is on fire, yet there's still "LOOK AT THE ARM REST! LOOK AT IT!" going on.

3

badp

I don't care for those 11yo's voice chat spamming pottymouths and wish we could be rid of them personally

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz If you just link a sarcastic comic without context, there's no reason that I would understand what you're trying to say

badp

They're not one of us

They're not here, and if they were, we'd kick them away pretty quickly

Tim Stone

@badp Elect @spugsley as president, she'll clean up those children real quick

LessPop_MoreFizz

@murgatroid99 I was hoping that you might have enough familiarity with it to understand the larger argument it signified. I was trying to use it as shorthand, but I guess it went right over your head. I apologize.

badp

1:17 AM

@TimStone This is a good plan

@murgatroid99 The English language is ambiguous, deal with it.

spugsley

@TimStone WITH PUNCHING

Tim Stone

KAPOW!

badp

@spugsley PUNCHING OVER INTERNET PROTOCOL WHY DON'T WE HAVE THIS YET

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz I've heard of the "not all men" thing before. I just don't understand it

And those articles aren't helping

Frank

@spugsley I can see everybody enrolling in boxing, because of president @spugsley.

DwarfSlice

1:18 AM

Alaskan natives join game devs on Never Alone

Cool!

badp

@TimStone I want a punching processing unit built into every graphics processing unit sold from now on, MAKE IT SO

I mean, it worked for physx

Tim Stone

@badp We can market it as "POWER YOU CAN FEEL"

LessPop_MoreFizz

@murgatroid99 the tl;dr is that by 'not all men' hijacks the conversation - it turns the condemnation of the problem into a defense of people who it was never about in the first place and who everybody who was seriously part of the conversation understood not to be who was being talked about. It derails the constructive conversation - in this case, about harassment, slut shaming, misogyny, etc. (c)

, and turns it into a referendum on the people who didn't police their language carefully enough when condemning that behavior. Essentially, by continually rushing to the defense of 'gamers', you're protecting the rotten trees because you're terrified about the damage to the forest - and are so intent on doing so that you're letting the forest rot from within.

badp

@TimStone BRING VIRTUAL REALITY TO LIFE WITH NON-VIRTUAL PAIN TO YOUR FACE

Fluttershy

@DwarfSlice I am really excited for this game.

badp

1:21 AM

if you see it as a Torgue ad it literally writes itself

DwarfSlice

@Fluttershy I am not sure about the 'platformer' thing.

Fluttershy

@DwarfSlice I am not sure about your face.

:P

Tim Stone

Oh wow, this is delicious. Remember Eliza? Gamergaters are endlessly mansplaining at a twitterbot. See https://twitter.com/search?f=realtime&q=%40ElizaRBarr /ht @mbarnett

Tweeted by bonaldi on October 14, 2014 at 10:24 PM

DwarfSlice

=[

Tim Stone

facepalms

DwarfSlice

1:22 AM

@Fluttershy Out of curiosity, what interests you about it?

badp

g'nite

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz And I think that is a mischaracterization of the situation, because I wasn't the one who made it about gamers as a group

LessPop_MoreFizz

> a referendum on the people who didn't police their language carefully enough when condemning that behavior.

@murgatroid99 You are willfully misinterpreting the various articles in question as being about "All People Who Play Games" when they were very clearly and deliberately not about that.

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz If you criticize me, should I just say "OK, you're right, I'm actually a sexist bigot because those other people, who happen to belong to the same group, are"

LessPop_MoreFizz

They were about a specific constructed identity stereotype which is no longer helpful when describing "people who play games", and which is ever increasingly marginal within that larger set.

murgatroid99

1:25 AM

@LessPop_MoreFizz It wasn't willful. Such miscommunication is not solely my fault.

LessPop_MoreFizz

@murgatroid99 No, but you should also have the sophistication as a reader to understand that sometimes people talk about the behavior of groups based on their vocal and visible representatives rather than the behavior of a substantial number of the rest - or even the majority - of that group.

See also: Muslims. Christians. Men. Women. Americans. Europeans. Etc.

murgatroid99

@LessPop_MoreFizz Then maybe people shouldn't judge whole groups based on the behavior of the vocal minority. But that's a wider problem

LessPop_MoreFizz

@murgatroid99 It may not have been at first, but given the continued attempts at refining the argument since then, and the continued misbehavior on the part of the people associating themselves with the hashtag in question, maybe, just maybe, you kind of have your head in the sand a bit?

user15026

I suspect we need to stop making assumptions about the beliefs and ideas and such of other people in here without strong factual basis.

user15026

I think that might make things a touch easier on all sides.

murgatroid99

1:28 AM

@AshleyNunn I agree with this

And it's time for dinner

OKAY, PANIC.

We will be changing load balancers momentarily to test a configuration change, there should be no user impact.

Tweeted by StackStatus on October 15, 2014 at 1:19 AM

As of now, #stackexchange and #stackoverflow no longer support SSLv3 due to POODLE. You can read about it here: https://www.openssl.org/~bodo/ssl-poodle.pdf

Tweeted by StackStatus on October 15, 2014 at 1:30 AM

StrixVaria

I keep getting Amenhotep gilds :|

Tim Stone

@OKAY,PANIC. Damn poodles! shakes fist

badp

@strix I wasn't all too happy about my 4× Athena gild until I got her to level 1,000

StrixVaria

@badp Amenhotep doesn't have the normal self-dps boosting upgrades, though.

They'd be better on literally any other hero.

badp

1:33 AM

Well I guess you can regild

StrixVaria

I will once I get a few more hero souls.

badp

On the topic of hero souls I'm at something silly

188+366

StrixVaria

I'm at 58+11 right now.

badp

Pushing zone 480

I almost don't want to spend them on ancients

and just take the raw speedup

Frank

And I'm here at 40, and more or less happy.

7Blue_Beast7

1:36 AM

Hi All!

Fluttershy

@DwarfSlice I like its art style, and I like platformers in general. Plus, the story sounds neat.

badp

Unfortunately I won't make it to zone 500 in this run

7Blue_Beast7

I got 12/12 on my math test!!!!!!!!!!

It wasn't an easy one either

Very hard

badp

Upgrades are starting to take way too long

StrixVaria

@badp I'm at 179. I can take 180 once my skills cooldown in an hour.

badp

1:37 AM

This +25 on Athena will cost me the equivalent of 15 hours' worth of idle play

Lazers

0

Q: Are there any tricks to Rival Smash?

Currently, I'm trying to be as cheap as I can think to be in rival smash: using characters like Bowser and Zelda to keep the rival in the air as much as possible, while taking advantage of their decent offensive capabilities. The most I can seem to get is 20, but Challenge Board 3 has a requireme...

super-smash-bros-4

StrixVaria

@badp May be time to ascend then.

I'll probably ascend once I get 500 more hero levels (making 18k).

Oh I just got that.

badp

9,865e51/2,062e52

StrixVaria

Level 180 isn't primal so I may just ascend now.

Would bring me up to 70 hero souls...

badp

@strix it'll be done by the time I wake up

I can use that to take down zones 485 and 490

The next jump to 495 and 500 though... Although it would be so worthwhile

Frank

1:42 AM

Once monsters start taking more than sixty seconds to kill, that's usually the point where it's time to ascend.

badp

Ehhh I've last ascended about six days ago

Chippies

2 new ancients got added :O

cc: @James @Arperum @badp

badp

Did they really add the active clicking hero?

Frank

@badp I don't have Vaagur so I can push several dark rituals a day. :P

Chippies

@badp huh?

badp

1:44 AM

@frank you might want to fix that

Frank

@badp That would deplete my already meager supply of souls.

badp

@chippies they published a beta with an ancient that gives you extra DPS for clinching

Chippies

dark ritual isn't even that useful unless you're going for gilds

badp

Saying it was an experiment

Chippies

in 24+ hours I get around 2500 souls

in ~2 hours I get around 2000 souls

Frank

1:46 AM

@Chippies Says the guy with dozens of gilds.

badp

@chippies that doesn't compute

Chippies

@Frank more souls > dark ritual

@badp I may have exaggerated, more like 3~4 hours

StrixVaria

Ugh the cost of rerolling ancients went up. I guess it's based on the number of ancients I have?

badp

The rate at which you gain souls accelerates the deeper you go in the game

Frank

@Chippies More gilds means you get more souls faster.

Wanna know how many I have? 40.

Chippies

1:47 AM

@Frank more souls means you get more gilds faster

StrixVaria

Oh I should wait and do level 180 for the gild if nothing else.

Chippies

@badp the point is, I get to 400'ish without having to use any skills, whereas the highest I have got so far is 560, with 25+ hours into

badp

To get 2,000 souls without ascension you'd have to push, what, zone 700?

Chippies

@badp atman+solomon

Frank

@Chippies And it takes me ~36 hours to get about a dozen souls.

Chippies

1:48 AM

around zone 500 is 2000'ish souls

badp

Huh, I guess that's true once you have +2000% souls

Chippies

Frank

This run has got me I think two whole primals.

Chippies

+2000% souls sounds awesome, but I am far from that

LessPop_MoreFizz

Jimmy Johns is an awful company and is forcing the dude who makes your sandwich sign a non-compete contract.

badp

1:50 AM

I'm at 480 with +366 souls in the bank

Frank

@Chippies Oh, good, now I know what Vaagur looks like.

Chippies

@Chippies this run is 3h 48min since ascension and I have spent most of it playing Diablo

badp

I guess you have a ridiculous +chance on primal bosses?

Lazers

0

Q: Tomodachi Life Mii level cap?

What is the level cap for a Mii in Tomodachi Life? Also when a mii reaches the maximum level, is there a message that says the Mii is at the maximum level just like on the first time a Mii reaches level 20 when the message says you can give hats and clothing at level up?

tomodachi-life

badp

I've bought three ancients this run but didn't upgrade them much to keep my soul multiplier high

Chippies

1:53 AM

@badp that's what atman does, maxed = +25% for a total of 50% chance

badp

Atman is one of them

Also the +souls% one

Chippies

it costs quite a bit to max it, but once you do, it's awesome

LessPop_MoreFizz

Some more details on just how bad Jimmy Johns is.

Chippies

@badp that's solomon, also quite expensive to level up

badp

and the -cost one

LessPop_MoreFizz

1:54 AM

Holy shit this is mega bad news unethical bad shit.

Chippies

@badp that was one of my first ancients, pretty useful

badp

@chippies eh that one is actually one you want to be careful with

Chippies

@badp how so?

badp

Upgraded it to level 4, but level 5 ain't worth it

Chippies

it's not something you max out asap, I was getting a level or two every ascension until I got it maxed

wasn't a high priority

badp

1:56 AM

I can't recoup the extra 2% discount with the 5 souls lost to it

Chippies

@badp if I did the math you do, I'd probably have the game beat by now

badp

And it seems that even with 500 souls it's going to be an even trade at best

Chippies

I am not very efficient with my ancients and souls

badp

And yet I'm using this sub optimal strategy of going as deep as possible with every run because I find it more fun

Chippies

for the most part, I just try to not have less souls than I did on last run

sometimes even that doesn't work out

badp

1:58 AM

Plus if you keep ascending there's not enough time for maths :P

Chippies

@badp I find it less fun, because the deeper you go, the less interaction is required from me

badp

But the less you achieve!

Chippies

I usually do one ascension per day, but today I got 2 new ancients and realized I'd should ascend more often for a quick jumpstart :P

badp

I have 70% of all achievements in five ascensions

I might get the zone 500 one too

And The night is plenty long

Chippies

@badp that's pretty cool, but I want to have all ancients and at your snail pace I don't think I could do that

in theory, I could get to zone infinity without any ascensions

Frank

2:01 AM

The game seriously slows down when you're dragging yourself to attempt to hit level 1000 on even Treebeast.

Chippies

but that's no fun for me

right now, when I ascend, I level up heroes and try to catch up with my gold income up to zone 400'ish

badp

I want the ancients too but the souls are all in the late game!

And The early game of clicker heroes is super boring

Chippies

@badp every 5 zones after 500 is maybe 80-100 souls for me, if I get a primal

badp

Lol, after 500

Chippies

but if I want the most souls, it's much faster to just ascend and go to zone 450

badp

2:03 AM

My previous ascension stretched to about zone 340

Chippies

4 hours 2 minutes

the next 50-80 zones are gonna take me ~20 hours

Frank

Welp, there went most of my souls. Bought the idle DPS one, and leveled him up to +100% DPS.

Chippies

I will get more souls per boss, but I will get a lot less bosses in those 20 hours than I would if I ascended 4 times

Frank

Wow, my next set of ancients suck.

Lazers

0

Q: Is it possible to disable wonders?

I find the mechanic irritating sometimes. Is it possible to disable it so I don't have to bother with wonder racing every game?

civilization-5

LessPop_MoreFizz

2:10 AM

So, this is a thing that happened today.

MBraedley

@LessPop_MoreFizz This is why I can't support gamergate. A few nutjobs ruins it for the entire group.

Newly Opened Proposals for Entertainment

1

Stock Exchange

Proposed Q&A site for investors and analysts of the stock market and general stock investment practices.

Currently in definition.

Fluttershy

@MBraedley It's... considerably more than "a few," I think.

LessPop_MoreFizz

►

/cc @OrigamiRob

Origami Robot

2:29 AM

@LessPop_MoreFizz pug

LessPop_MoreFizz

►

/cc @Fluttershy

7Blue_Beast7

2:45 AM

@Chippies What is the name of that clicker game?

Anyone know the name of that clicker game you guys play the most out of your day?

StrixVaria

@7Blue_Beast7 clickerheroes.com

7Blue_Beast7

Ah... thank you :D

@StrixVaria Nice pick by the way :D

Chippies

@7Blue_Beast7 yeah, what Strix said - clickerheroes.com

SaintWacko

I think it's clickerheroes.com

Unionhawk

asdfjkl;

that is all

7Blue_Beast7

2:56 AM

Hm?

@Chippies What wrong with Unionhawk?

Chippies

@7Blue_Beast7 I'm assuming he's just being himself

Unionhawk

@7Blue_Beast7 VTC: Too Broad.

7Blue_Beast7

He has been really weird. He started out fine last night and then started saying things and... and... man... he... he... is just acting so strange lately.

@Unionhawk VTC?

spugsley

WHY IS PICKING A SHIRT SO HARD

7Blue_Beast7

BECAUSE WE TRY TO PICK THE BEST SHIRT POSSIBLE.

ahem....

clears throat

user15026

2:59 AM

@spugsley Whatcha picking one for?

spugsley

@AshleyNunn my costume :3