The Nineteenth Byte

I started implementing discord/github oauth because I was gunna make a tool for random weekly programming challenges between a couple of friends, and a tool for timed delivery of sealed messages, but like all projects I never got around to them

lyxal

You uh don't actually keep the discord data do you?

Mayube

pretty sure all it keeps is the oauth token, and I don't know if I even got that far

I'lll check the db

yeah there's only 1 user and 1 token from 2019, so it didn't store anything from you :P

Bubbler

@RedwolfPrograms IMO you risk failing in the middle that way, and I don't want to risk it. There are many gem-likes in the sandbox but assessing if it is actually a gem takes time

lyxal

Lol

@Mayube ^

Mayube

12:08 AM

grumble grumble made me SSH into my server for nothin'

lyxal

Listening to people's soundcloud is also a hobby of mine.

Which is what I'll be doing a little later

Mayube

oh god my soundcloud is quite old

lyxal

@Mayube wow holy crap I didn't know you were twitch famous

Mayube

err.. define twitch famous lol

lyxal

500 followers

Mayube

12:15 AM

my old twitch account has ~500 followers because I used to stream music production like 6 years ago

lyxal

549 to be exact

And 550 when i can figure out how to open it on the twitch app

Mayube

I mean I don't stream anymore and if I did it'd be on my new account, but I won't stop you :P

lyxal

@Mayube obviously

> last streamed 2 years ago

Mayube

@lyxal if/when I eventually get around to making user accounts work on my site, I'll be sure to let you know ;)

lyxal

Very cool

Can't wait to add it to my list of obscure socials

Mayube

12:24 AM

alright, back to trying to host TIO

Enjoy stalking my socials @lyxal :P Lemme know if you like the music

Niko

12:38 AM

pogger

I am having a code comp later

Mayube

hmm.. nim says it should be in the standard package repos for Fedora, but Fedora disagrees

maybe it's only in 35

hyper-neutrino

@emanresuA ofc it was me lol i'm just trolling

emanresu A

Oh lol

Although I spent half an hour trying to find ACE vulnerabilities in the bot's code :(

Mayube

oh wtf it's actually only available in Fedora 33

do I downgrade Fedora again or update the scripts to use choosenim?

hyper-neutrino

@emanresuA wait you actually did lol

well i appreciate it but nah i just signed in to it cuz i was going to test something

Redwolf Programs

12:43 AM

@Mayube Seems like it's easier to install an extra package from somewhere instead of potentially having to do that for a ton of Fedorta-35-only ones

lyxal

> Fedorta

the crappy-off-brand version of Fedora

Redwolf Programs

Alongside Urbuntu, Debiam, Rad Hat, and OpenSUSSY

lyxal

I prefer Wingdows

Redwolf Programs

Marc OS

Marcus

emanresu A

What about ZimbabweDollarOs?

Redwolf Programs

12:54 AM

Vanadium OS

Vanadium is such an underrated element I swear

Neil

@lyxal I prefer WinDOS

I prefer macdows 95

Michaelsoft Binbows

classic

It's not what most people think

It was a computer parts store in Japan

The name is actually a pun, off of a Japanese word, meaning something like "cheap" or "bargain" or something

Mayube

12:59 AM

Ah, I see you watch Nick Robinson as well

I was about to post the video

Redwolf Programs

No, just that video lol

I was kinda halfway expecting you to have seen it, given that about 60% of the videos I mention here someone else has seen lol

OldSandboxPosts

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Validate a Metroid password [code-golf] [decision-problem] [encoding] [checksum]

Neil

@Mayube is that the one where he pores over Google Street View to find it?

also, YouTube isn't sure I'm over 18

Mayube

he has a lot of equally odd deep-dives into various things, like who voiced the uncredited narrator in one of the super monkey ball games, or where this weird official sticker of pikachu from Detective Pikachu comes from

@Neil yeah and he's super sad that he couldn't actually go to japan this time

Oh and he had a couple of videos about this one time McDonalds Japan used Nintendo DSs with a "McDonalds training game" to train their employees, and the McDonalds-branded matte black DSs that came with it

Redwolf Programs

Oh, that was him?

Mayube

1:04 AM

yeah

and a series about the Dominos Japan X Hatsune Miku app, and him tracking down the president of Dominos Japan to talk about it

Unrelated String

amazing

@RedwolfPrograms 貧乏? probably not exactly considering it means poverty

Seggan

1:20 AM

i was implementing the Jelly decompression algorithm in Java, i must say, Dennis is a genius

Unrelated String

wait no it is lmao

that's amazing

hyper-neutrino

lmao

Fmbalbuena

2:13 AM

@Seggan i got 17 upvotes and 1 downvote and 16 total in my question. i think i'm reaching you.

Seggan

mine got 18 by now

Fmbalbuena

@Seggan ok. but i got 2 close votes. and you?

Mayube

lol

Fmbalbuena

@Mayube why i got 2 close votes?

and 3 is needed.

to close. but why???

Mayube

pretty sure it's 5 votes to close

@Fmbalbuena because a lot of things had to be clarified about the challenge in the comments, and those clarifications haven't been edited into the question.

Fmbalbuena

2:16 AM

@Mayube I clarified. right now.

@Mayube i have a question: can unvote to close? (without voting to reopen)

emanresu A

CMC: Determine what this is

Mayube

@Fmbalbuena Not unless you voted to close and are retracting that vote

emanresu A

(Warning: Laggy)

Mayube

@emanresuA that's a graph

Fmbalbuena

@emanresuA this is mathematically elegant graph.

emanresu A

2:21 AM

*looks like

It's what happens when I try to do maths instead of messing around.

lyxal

@emanresuA a fever dream

Fmbalbuena

@Mayube @lyxal How to link question?

@lyxal do you like making golfing languages?

lyxal

Yes

However I find I can only focus on making one at a time

@Fmbalbuena just copy the link lol

Fmbalbuena

but how do you make diccionary?

@lyxal do you find a question what makes string diagonal example:

abc outputs

a
 b
  c

emanresu A

2:39 AM

@Fmbalbuena Vyxal j, 4 bytes ėƛ÷꘍

Fmbalbuena

@emanresuA but i'm finding a question

what is related

Redwolf Programs

72

Q: Diagonal Alphabet

Given no input, your task is to generate the following: a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t ...

Close, but with a hardcoded input

Fmbalbuena

but i mean if the input is 1y then outputs

1
 y

Redwolf Programs

3:01 AM

I love how every time I listen to a certain song on YT it classifies it as a different genre

Unrelated String

oh?

Redwolf Programs

It's gone through like ten of them now lol

Unrelated String

lmao

Redwolf Programs

I think so far it's included pop-punk, rock, hardcore, post-hardcore, emo, and some others that don't make as much sense and/or are just trivial variations of the others

Which like...there's overlap, but make up your mind lol

Unrelated String

@RedwolfPrograms not strictly correct but i've seen it called a cartesian product

lyxal

3:05 AM

@RedwolfPrograms imagine listening to songs that actually get genre'd

Unrelated String

@Razetime apparently, but at what cost

Matthew Roh

I am back after a long time of inactivity and I am recently learning J

its actually really fun to learn J

Unrelated String

ncie

*nice

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms Ooh two new ones: punk rock and heavy metal (which it definitely is not lol)

Unrelated String

lmao

Razetime

3:31 AM

@UnrelatedString yo wow

@UnrelatedString is the input format that flexible?

Unrelated String

3:50 AM

sure hope so
op has looked at it and the only complaint is that i completely forgot to put the program on the first line verbatim

which is going to be... costly

hyper-neutrino

@UnrelatedString i came up with something for 10 (put ;@⁶ḤḤ¤W;ç on the next line) but surely you can get better by restructuring it

i haven't actually examined how your solution works

Unrelated String

i haven't either

lyxal

@UnrelatedString haha lol me too

Unrelated String

@hyper-neutrino i think i'm just going to have to resort to not outputting as a list of lines

anything else i try refuses to work

hyper-neutrino

that could work

Unrelated String

4:05 AM

never thought I would write ¹⁷

wait no that isn't indented what am i smoking

absolutely hate what i have now

maybe there's some fold i can do

Unrelated String

4:29 AM

so now it only loses to stax by one byte

PyGamer0

5:17 AM

ok i have an idea for a tacit language

but i am worried that i will make another jelly clone lol

Razetime

there's many ways to do tacit systems

avoiding jelly's system should not be hard

hyper-neutrino

how weird would it be for a semi-python-like language (designed mostly with practicality in mind) to not have any operator precedence at all

like a+b*c would just be (a+b)*c

ik languages like J don't have precedence but that's cuz it wouldn't make much sense with the tacit structure IMO

PyGamer0

@hyper-neutrino lets just use right to left

a+b*c == a+(b*c)

Razetime

@hyper-neutrino J is from APL and APL was definitely RtL before it was tacit

hyper-neutrino

oh, interesting

Razetime

5:25 AM

removing operator precedence could help basically any language tbh

PyGamer0

@Razetime so tacit came way later?

Razetime

when J came so did tacit

PyGamer0

@Razetime the problem is i dont know jelly's system

Razetime

@PyGamer0 there's a chatroom where everyone wants to teach you about it

so go there :)

PyGamer0

@Razetime JHT?

Razetime

5:27 AM

yes

PyGamer0

but i want a document (or a webite) that shows diagrams of how the tacit system works

Razetime

now that is an interesting idea

@cairdcoinheringaahing thoughts?

hyper-neutrino

i'd be interested of doing something like that

could go well with my cheat sheet on the site

PyGamer0

i find diagrams easier to understand

Razetime

that sounds cool

you might be able to repurpose the stuff from the bqn site

PyGamer0

5:36 AM

a jelly program

@Razetime you mean this?

Razetime

there's an "explain" feature here: mlochbaum.github.io/BQN/try.html

PyGamer0

i dont know

holy the explain feature is very cool

Razetime

function names must start with a capital letter.

PyGamer0

@Razetime oh

why is that a restiction

Razetime

BQN has a context free grammar

by enforcing that it doesn't have to do work in order to find out what your code does

PyGamer0

5:45 AM

oh so if a function can be named anything, BQN will need to parse and eval to know if it is a value or a function

but if the function has a restriction it does not need to do that

it already knows

@Razetime it just shows which is evaluted first

it does not show how the primitives are applied

Razetime

it's easier for the interpreter adn you can decipher what the program does at a glance

PyGamer0

for (let i = 0; i < 10; i++)
    alert(i);

i learnt javascript :P

Unrelated String

@PyGamer0 there are a few of those in lynn's tutorial

PyGamer0

@UnrelatedString link?

Unrelated String

i think it's both on the tips page and the github wiki

never mind there's only two diagrams lmao

camo.githubusercontent.com/…

PyGamer0

6:00 AM

@UnrelatedString actually i already saw those diagrams lol

Unrelated String

lol

PyGamer0

lol

for(let i=0;i<25;i++)alert(i)

ok imma go play karlson

PyGamer0

6:33 AM

i want to solve a cmc

emanresu A

@PyGamer0 Good job, although your javascript looks a little like Python.

PyGamer0

@emanresuA thats how i write my C

if i write C

ATaco

Although alert is a very golfy way to get output, it's also painful.

emanresu A

@PyGamer0 CMC: 452

(From a car numberplate)

PyGamer0

am i supposed to output 452?

Try it online!

ATaco

6:36 AM

I'm sure we can do better than that

PyGamer0

how?

ATaco

I can't tell you immediately, but 452 is smaller than 2 bytes, so there has to be a way to do it in some language in 2 bytes. Right..?

emanresu A

Vyxal can do up to 356 in two butes

PyGamer0

@emanresuA wow butes

emanresu A

You know what i mean

hyper-neutrino

6:42 AM

jelly's short int compression requires 3 bytes and can encode from -31349 to -100 and 1001 to 32250, so wouldn't help here :/

PyGamer0

apparently i made a base converter

@emanresuA Base452 lang: Try it online! :P

emanresu A

ಠ_ಠ

hyper-neutrino

Print452Lang, 0 bytes

2

PyGamer0

@hyper-neutrino implementation

lyxal

@emanresuA Keg, 2 bytes

PyGamer0

6:45 AM

@lyxal ~~hacks~~ flags

emanresu A

Vyxal, 1 byte

3

(Outputs in base 452)

PyGamer0

7:01 AM

CMC: Print 20434i exactly as it is.

CMC: Print {⍵ * ⍺ + 34} exactly as it is.

lyxal

@PyGamer0 Try it online! for 6 bytes in keg

Unrelated String

tried ı20434 in jelly and forgot the imaginary unit is j in python

hyper-neutrino

rip

⁽MṢ;”i works ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

emanresu A

8:05 AM

CMC: Find the most bizzare when taken out of context message here.

emanresu A

8:19 AM

I just wrote the horrendous `(\\[`\\])*([^\\]\$\\\$*`|[^`])*`?, then realised `(\\[\\`]|[^`])*`? does just fine :P

hyper-neutrino

i don't even want to think about how many backslashes you had to type to make that markdown work

oh wait, not actually that many? huh. i thought you had to escape backslashes

emanresu A

Nope :P

(Trying to understand Jelly's "parser")

hyper-neutrino

ah. have fun

emanresu A

I suppose it doesn't need a very complex parser as there are no structures of any kind, only quicks, atoms and syntax stuff

And how those relate is just inferred by the interpreter

It's more of a tokenizer than a parser, really

Unrelated String

it would still help if it wasn't all like 5 regexes

emanresu A

8:29 AM

I spent five minutes trying to figure out why a modified regex wasn't working and all I needed to do was use non-capturing groups.

I DID IT!!!

I actually managed to successfully modify Jelly's parser!

hyper-neutrino

nice! I'm surprised the original unmodified one even works half the time

emanresu A

Backticked strings actually work, with proper escapes and everything!

Great, now I'm going to need to think about how to merge it all.

Leaky Nun

8:46 AM

CMC: Given positive integers d and e, with d>1, output 1 + d + d^2 + ... + d^e

emanresu A

The codepage is going to be... interesting.

See, I'm using Vyxal syntax, except for Jelly arrays, but deferring to Jelly chaining rules, and using Vyxal builtins.

Neil

9:01 AM

Downvote denial: given a list of up and down votes, the original viewing time, and which (if any) is your vote, show the current total given the following rules:
1. The result of your vote on the total is always displayed. The remaining rules only apply to other votes.
2. Votes before you viewed the post are summed but the total is set to zero if it would be negative.
3. After you view the post you see the cumulative maximum of the cumulative sum of votes.
Example: There were two upvotes and one downvote before you viewed the post and voted. There was then another downvote, two more upvotes…

emanresu A

Is this a userscript?

Somehow, I have less builtins / syntax stuff to keep from Jelly than the amount of Vyxal builtins / syntax that become useless in the context of a tacit language.

Unrelated String

you could warp chaining semantics to operate on a stack

emanresu A

That's... too cursed to even think about.

Also I'm trying to keep it half Jelly, half Vyxal - and doing that kinda nudges it towards Vyxal a lot.

Unrelated String

you could store running value as top of stack, monad left/dyad right as second from the top, and dyad left as third from top
and any operation on anything that isn't tos just peeks it so there's no difference until you actually use stack builtins and then it just goes to shit

emanresu A

Nah, that sounds too complicated.

Also I've decided I'm going to use Vyxal flags 'cos why not.

(* at least the ones that make sense in a tacit environment)

AncientSwordRage

9:14 AM

emanresu A

You literally copy+pasted two of my messages :P

@UnrelatedString Does Jelly have any sort of 'replace' function? If so, how?

Unrelated String

y

emanresu A

Oh, I see, that's clever.

Unrelated String

it's only single character replacements though

for anything more than that you have to defer to split and join stuff

emanresu A

Ok.

Unrelated String

9:23 AM

~~or python eval~~

AncientSwordRage

@emanresuA yes... but I didn't want to name you ... hope thats ok?

emanresu A

It's fine :P

AncientSwordRage

I just saw that 'Is this a userscript?' message on my 'other rooms' ticker an my meme-sense started tingling

emanresu A

10:08 AM

Me when I saw this: There's a fly on my screen!

lyxal

10:29 AM

@AncientSwordRage seems more like a chrome extension to me :p

lyxal

11:15 AM

Mfers been complaining about flags and loving JS since 1812

(for legal reasons that's a joke)

PyGamer0

12:34 PM

@emanresuA wow

even i thought the same

lyxal

12:54 PM

@AaroneousMiller I have a picture you might be interested in

and with that, it's time to be a [[BED SHOT]]

o/

user

1:20 PM

???

pxeger

who knows

PyGamer0

1:48 PM

@lyxal ()/

PyGamer0

2:02 PM

CIC: Make a CMC generator (like AICMC)

user

Wjat's the I stand for?

Fmbalbuena

2:31 PM

@cairdcoinheringaahing i have a problem.

Fmbalbuena

2:41 PM

What happens the bounty if the question is closed

user

You can't close a question with a bounty

Fmbalbuena

@user ok. i'm willing to bounty.

user

Cool-looking language: Effekt. Haven't looked at it too closely, but it seems to basically have first class support for effects

@Fmbalbuena Bounty which question?

Fmbalbuena

my question because the users does not give attention.

@user this does not look cool

user

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The fact that it looks like Scala is a good part of why I liked it :P

pxeger

2:53 PM

@user Koka is another language with similar ideas

user

This one? Looks pretty nice, I'm always surprised to see companies researching cool stuff like this

pxeger

yes

I actually didn't know it was a Microsoft project

user

So is Lean, I think

Huh, the Effekt docs say it was inspired by Koka (some syntactic sugar, at least)

Fmbalbuena

@user Lul

user

We have a feed to post bountied questions, by the way, it's just kinda slow

Fmbalbuena

2:58 PM

5 minutes to post?

user

idk, it varies

You haven't answered Dingus's last comment, by the way

Newly Featured Posts

18

Q: Write a Stack Exchange compliant brainfuck explainer

You are to take a string representing a piece of brainfuck code, containing only printable ASCII characters ( to ~, ASCII 32 to 126) as input and output an explanation of that code, formatted to be compliant with Stack Exchange markdown. That is, the explanation must satisfy: Each line has an a...

code-golf string brainfuck whitespace

pxeger

@user speak of the devil and he shall appear!

user

Ooh, nice, I've been trying to reach him for days

Hey Satan, you there? I need to sell my soul, idk if it's in the best condition but it should be worth something, at least

bruh the devil's lazy af

Fmbalbuena

@user Try it online!

user

3:10 PM

???

Are you the devil? Is that all I get for my soul? :P

Fmbalbuena

@user no, this is cool binary lambda calculus program.

user

Very cool, but you don't have to ping people specifically if it's something you're saying to everyone

Fmbalbuena

@Fmbalbuena *bitwise cyclic tag

PyGamer0

my little brother's shirt has the HN on it

my guess that hyper-neutrino made it or it came from hackernews

Leaky Nun

3:35 PM

7 hours ago, by Leaky Nun

CMC: Given positive integers d and e, with d>1, output 1 + d + d^2 + ... + d^e

PyGamer0

@LeakyNun Try it online!

Leaky Nun

@PyGamer0 I can do it in 26

user

Using the geometric series formula thing?

I got 27 but I assume you have a trick with ~ or the like up your sleeve

pxeger

@LeakyNun 25 bytes

user

Isn't it d*d**e?

pxeger

3:48 PM

yes

lol

@pxeger I said 21 bytes for the first attempt but it was actually 23 initially. Anyway now it's 22

PyGamer0

@user i just did what my tiny brain thought

Which mobile browser allows you to change fonts?

user

4:04 PM

Safari lets you, in reader view, at least, I think

PyGamer0

4:21 PM

is there no android browser that allows changing of fonts?

well 'time to make one'

Fmbalbuena

4:38 PM

CMC: Print graham(input)

pxeger

CMC: list all the Unicode characters that are basic outlined rectangles

CMSpoiler

Fmbalbuena

@pxeger ?

pxeger

4:53 PM

@pxeger I think somebody's hacked into my keyboard and changed all the number keys, because I meant 25 not 22 lmao

Sandbox Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

OEIS A049190 your task is to print all numbers of this sequence. is separated by newline, is separated by space or separated by comma. the first few numbers are: 1, 3, 5, 59, 245, 2491, 235253, 127756731, 330567489269, 258479716298484155, 36823182192123209878050549, 255764121170542963442093532991...

user

@pxeger I was wondering how you gotd that lol

Fmbalbuena

5:16 PM

@user fix my sandbox post.

DLosc

5:32 PM

@LeakyNun Pip, 7 bytes: $+aE,Ub (9 bytes in Pip Classic)

caird coinheringaahing

5:51 PM

@Fmbalbuena Instead of starting a bounty to stop people closing your challenge, why don't you instead clarify it, as I and others have repeatedly said?

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing yeah i know. but i can't find a way to clarify. what i do?

caird coinheringaahing

Nov 17 at 11:57, by caird coinheringaahing

@Fmbalbuena I'd rephrase it as "The explanation for each character will be provided as input. You may choose how to associate each explanation with it's character (for example: dictionary; mapping; list where the first element corresponds to +, the second to -, etc.), but it must be consistent" Then add some test cases with other explanation texts

2 days ago, by caird coinheringaahing

@Fmbalbuena I'd suggest you clarify that there will only be 9 "explanation" strings given, and that answers may choose how to associate each command with each inputted explanation string

You can use that exact wording from the first if you'd like

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing but users alaways don't print the code at the top of STDOUT. what i do?

caird coinheringaahing

@Fmbalbuena I don't know what you mean

If you mean that there are answers that don't fit the output format, you don't have to worry about that - just let the answerer know its invalid in a comment and the OP will fix or delete it. The reason your challenge has gotten close votes it because of the confusion around the input format

Fmbalbuena

caird the old TIO link of this is TIO

caird coinheringaahing

6:02 PM

@Fmbalbuena And lyxal fixed it? That's perfectly fine

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing yes

@cairdcoinheringaahing i found 4 answerers what forgot to output. only 6 do correctly.

hyper-neutrino

just tell them they're wrong then and they'll fix it

doesn't matter how many people get it wrong, it's a simple mistake. i've seen a question with 15 invalid answers and only 1 undeleted one

Fmbalbuena

@hyper-neutrino what question?

caird coinheringaahing

I just went through all the answers, and they all look valid to me?

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing yeah because i said all invalid answers.

hyper-neutrino

6:05 PM

@Fmbalbuena don't remember

caird coinheringaahing

@Fmbalbuena link

@Fmbalbuena Then there's no problem right?

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing there no problem

pxeger

@Fmbalbuena What you just added, "where the first element corresponds to >, the second to <, etc.", still isn't clear. What order are the remaining elements? Just putting "etc." doesn't explain it, because I don't know what are +-.,[].

Fmbalbuena

@pxeger the first line is brainfuck Description of ">", second line is brainfuck Description of "<", etc.

hyper-neutrino

you've literally said exactly what pxeger already said isn't clear enough

caird coinheringaahing

6:07 PM

I'd suggest saying that answers can choose how to associate each brainfuck command with each explanation

Fmbalbuena

@cairdcoinheringaahing ok i will do.

hyper-neutrino

I doubt Fmbalbuena is doing this intentionally, but the bounty is stopping the question from being closed - should it be removed to allow the community to finish reviewing it properly? I could close the question but I don't want to act unilaterally since there are still 2 votes remaining.

caird coinheringaahing

I don't see anything wrong with leaving it, as it looks like Fmbalbuena's trying to clarify the post at least

hyper-neutrino

I'm not personally a fan of using bounties for clarifications; that should be edited in to the post (what happens once the bounty ends?), and the question can always be reopened after it's actually clear enough so there's nothing wrong with closing it while they're fixing it, but I see what you mean though.

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino Ah no, I didn't mean they're trying to clarify it through the bounty, but that they're trying to clarify the input confusion atm with editing

Fmbalbuena

6:12 PM

@hyper-neutrino I used bounty to draw attention.

not clarifications.

Fmbalbuena

6:44 PM

@hyper-neutrino Do you get it?

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