The Nineteenth Byte - 2021-10-16

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emanresu A

00:01

Actually, eval does what I wanted ;)

Unrelated String

...alright then

i'm pretty sure eval is an identity operation given numbers

will convert strings that represent numbers to numbers though

emanresu A

I have a list of numbers to concatenate

Outgolfing Dennis somehow

Unrelated String

oh yeah V is great for concatenating integers

nice

btw you do not need the R

emanresu A

Oh wow thx

Unrelated String

Ḋ is one of the nice list builtins that automatically rangifies

emanresu A

00:06

And the one Dennis's answer uses doesn't?

Unrelated String

Ṗ and Ż are two other good ones to keep in mind

D just converts a single integer to a list of decimal digits; he uses R first so it vectorizes over the whole range

emanresu A

I was thinking of something like ;/ but I didn't realise that ; does list stuff...

Idk why I thought it was like that

And this is shorter anywaty

OldSandboxPosts

01:00

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Solve the halting problem for ^/ab*/ba*/[ab]*$ in /// [code-golf] [halting-problem]

emanresu A

01:15

When you sort by votes then forget and go to the sandbox ಠ_ಠ

3

Wezl

lol I literally just realized what :P is supposed to represent

two eyes and an eyepatch, right?

Unrelated String

clearly

emanresu A

No, it's a Vyxal program that takes one argument and returns an empty string

DLosc

01:34

@Wezl I think it's two eyes and a mouth with the tongue sticking out

P.^) could be someone with an eyepatch

Or maybe P̣^)

Unrelated String

(hint: systems that convert it to an emoji convert it to 😛)

Wezl

02:11

Yeah that's totally different. How my browser renders it, it's an upside-down face with no mouth or nose and a large hole with the brain sticking out above the eyes

@Wezl either the eyepatch is covering the nose or that's some crazy perspective that's not normally used in emoticons

Wezl

02:34

user image

@DLosc I don't doubt your credibility and research, but somehow I'm not sure what emotion this is supposed to represent

DLosc

You gotta turn your head sideways. You kids these days and your right-side-up emojis... /s

lyxal

02:51

˙ᓀ˙

2

@Wezl is ^ any better for you then?

DLosc

03:02

user image

(Incidentally, for me, :P is never smiling, it's a flat expression like what I've drawn. Which means 😛 really isn't a good equivalent.)

Unrelated String

03:48

yeah same actually

caird coinheringaahing

04:07

@emanresuA "somehow" - that was posted when Jelly was 6 months old, and builtins like ; and Ḋ didn't event exist :P

IIRC that answer got posted shortly after Jelly got the sort builtin :P

1 hour later…

emanresu A

05:23

@cairdcoinheringaahing Oh :p Oh well

@cairdcoinheringaahing Wait, it had multiset union but no prepend?

caird coinheringaahing

I believe so, yes

Unrelated String

yeah wait what

caird coinheringaahing

05:48

i cba to dig through the commit history, but I think ; was added surprisingly late

feel free to tell me I'm wrong tho :P

Unrelated String

i can be arsed

the commit that added ; was titled "published interpreter"

caird coinheringaahing

huh

Unrelated String

and i can't view the blame prior to that commit because there were, unsurprisingly, no prior commits

caird coinheringaahing

guess Dennis just forgot about it then

Unrelated String

what would he have used it for considering F beats ;/

caird coinheringaahing

05:52

1; instead of multiset union

Unrelated String

the key insight with emanresu's solution or whichever one he ported is starting from 2 so you can prepend 1 instead of actually moving a 1 to the start

caird coinheringaahing

Oh right, Dennis' already had a 1 in the list?

emanresu A

@UnrelatedString Ported my Vyxal - this is annoyingly one shorter, makes Vyxal look bad.

Unrelated String

sad

1 hour later…

caird coinheringaahing

07:19

@NewPosts VTC and VTD pls :/

Also, isn't that just bits and pieces copy pasted from codegolf.stackexchange.com/help/formatting?

ATaco

Yep. That's a weird one.

Bot trying to build reputation by ripping random content from other questions?

They've got a similar question on Stack Overflow, and I assume posted similar questions on some other communities that got deleted.

PyGamer0

07:48

@cairdcoinheringaahing i wish i could do that

emanresu A

Is Jelly TC without multiple links and eval?

(@cairdcoinheringaahing @UnrelatedString @anyoneelsewhoknowsjelly) ^

PyGamer0

08:06

@emanresuA you forgot hyper

Anush

@Wezl thank you

I am confused by gitter. If you go to scipy's gitter page for example there is nothing since september. Is there another place open source projects are discussed these days?

caird coinheringaahing

@emanresuA Yes

ais proved that a while back, I'll just find the answer

14

A: Turing-Complete Language Interpreter

Jelly → "Add minimum to transpose", 5 4 bytes +"Ṃẞ Try it online! (runs only one iteration, to avoid timeouts) A very simple Turing-complete construction: we take a square matrix as a program, and loop forever, identifying the lexicographically smallest row, then increasing each element of th...

emanresu A

@PyGamer0 Hyper is slep for the next few hours

caird coinheringaahing

→ 1 irritatingly long-lasting VLQ post moved to The Nineteenth Bakery

emanresu A

What do we need... Icing sugar?

(Contrary to popular belief, moderators do actually sleep)

PyGamer0

08:13

:59377508 replying to future

provided it works

caird coinheringaahing

It doesn't

emanresu A

It works only if:

- You edit the message after the one you're looking for gets posted

PyGamer0

dang it i couldn't guess

emanresu A

- The message you're looking for is in the same room

PyGamer0

@emanresuA i know that

@emanresuA and that

argh

caird coinheringaahing

08:15

Go try this in the Sandbox

PyGamer0

@cairdcoinheringaahing and i got it first try

in Sandbox, 34 secs ago, by PyGamer0

:59377540 o

emanresu A

IIt's worked before

Aug 25 at 5:52, by Jo King

:58978493 Anyone tried to reply to the future yet?

PyGamer0

@emanresuA i know that also

emanresu A

Ok, this is officially the worst help center page.

> Code Golf Stack Exchange works really well for technical support and we welcome this, within limits

> n fact, unless your product is brand new, we probably already have some questions about it

4

> Code Golf Stack Exchange can help support your product but it can't be the only support

> We welcome questions and answers about your product here on Code Golf Stack Exchange

PyGamer0

wwwhaaat

Unrelated String

08:24

wow

Jo King

that's pretty awful

Anush

trying discord for the first time. Man it's confusing

Unrelated String

what kinds of issues are you having lol

caird coinheringaahing

@emanresuA There's an outstanding MSE feature request to remove that from all sites but SO I believe

emanresu A

Link?

caird coinheringaahing

08:31

Finding it now :P

22

Q: The "product support" page in the Help Center does not make much sense network-wide

The Help Center page Can I support my product on this site? appears to have been written with Stack Overflow and other technology sites in mind. It does not make much sense in Help Centers of other sites (where it sits top-center among the topics): Can I support my product on this site? We get a...

bug status-review help-center

From 2014

emanresu A

ಠ_ಠ

It's almost 4 years later now. Any indication what happened in the meantime? — Mast Jul 26 '18 at 5:30

caird coinheringaahing

Tbf, it got slapped with a status-review less than a month ago

emanresu A

:)

Anush

@UnrelatedString first of all I just couldn't log in via the web at all. It kept on telling there was a problem and that I should verify my account. When I tried to do that via email it told me that the account already existed!(Of course it did, it's my email address!). When I tried to verify by SMS I got a text message saying the account already existed so I should delete it first

I then started discord from the command line and it worked! Now I am in I have no idea how to find channels that are actually alive. I tried python-general but it seems completely dead

on the other hand I seem to be subscribed to all sorts of weird (off-topic) channels

e.g. ot0-gdudes-pony-farm !

@UnrelatedString did that answer your question? :)

5 hours later…

user

13:26

Apparently the Google Closure Compiler (GCC) is a thing ಠ_ಠ

2 hours later…

PyGamer0

15:20

@user atleast they dont call it gcc

unlike alexa-presentation-language

user

@PyGamer0 Well, gcc (the compiler) is called GCC, and GCC (the compiler, not the other compiler) is called GCC too, so both are GCC even if one is also gcc

PyGamer0

wat

c-(gcc)

wait gcc is older (gnu c complier) so the other gcc (closure complier) should have another shortform

Huỳnh Trần Khanh

@user I'm p sure that it's actually called the Closure Compiler, not the Google Closure Compiler lol

but people don't use Closure Compiler anymore right

hmm wait. the project is still maintained

lol

user

15:39

Oh, I just saw the Scala.js benchmarks using "GCC" to talk about the Closure Compiler. Shame on them then

Huỳnh Trần Khanh

lol

PyGamer0

16:03

@user oh

lol

caird coinheringaahing

16:46

BTW y'all, as much as the edit notifications annoy me, please do edit in your Lean answers/challenges into the LOTM post, as it's the best indicator of how "successful" the lotm event is/was

thejonymyster

alphabetization would be big-endian, right

since its the first letter that counts the most

or is that only like, analogous

pxeger

@thejonymyster big-endian is like "normal" base conversion; little-endian is backwards

thejonymyster

17:07

right i know which is which

im just saying does that apply to the concept of alphabetization or like

is it wrong to apply that term in that context

pxeger

17:30

it doesn't really make sense to use it there IMO

thejonymyster

17:40

gotcha, ty

user

18:25

Java 17 is out! It's got some basic pattern matching, sealed classes, and more now (well, it was there in earlier releases, but 17 is an LTS release)

hyper-neutrino

wait java is already up to 17??

damn i feel old

pxeger

they've switched to a much faster release schedule than versions <= 8

hyper-neutrino

ah

user

Every six months

(but Java 8 is really old at this point, idk why so many people/places still use it)

pxeger

18:41

idea for an esolang: just Python, but every time you use the value 1, it is replaced with 2

or similar

user

That sounds like Python with extra steps

nvm it is

pxeger

or the same, but where that value 2 is instead chosen randomly once per interpreter invocation

user

Why would you want something like that, though?

pxeger

to be deliberately difficult

you could even say, to fuck with your brain

Sandbox Posts

19:06

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Arbitrary Alphabetization [brief exposition on alphabetization for background] Given a non-empty string containing an alphabet in order and a list of words, return the list in alphabetical order according to the string given. Characters not in the string go before the first alphabet character in ...

pxeger

19:24

CMQ: If I tried to resolve a merge conflict in git but did it wrong, how do I reset the resolution and fix the conflict again?

found the CMA: git checkout -m

thejonymyster

delete everything and start from scratch

or that

pxeger

I don't want to have to re-fix all the other merge conflicts

there are several merge conflicts

I have already fixed most of them

caird coinheringaahing

@pxeger Python v x is just that, but replaces the value of x-1 with x

pxeger

I just want to un-"fix" this latest one

caird coinheringaahing

So Python 4 is just Python 3 that replaces every 3 with 4

pxeger

20:15

After much kajoggling with git, Whython is now updated to use Python 3.10! It will be on ATO... at some point...

Unrelated String

@user ooh, that's some nice stuff

user

Unfortunately, no Gradle support yet :(

@pxeger Go back to a previous commit, copy the files over to a new computer, destroy your first computer, destroy GitHub, start a new repository on your new computer, and never commit to it :P

caird coinheringaahing

20:34

@pxeger Spam ctrl-z

emanresu A

21:22

@lyxal I kinda want to make this, but as a website, and for Vyxal.

Redwolf Programs

21:53

@emanresuA I have the &tab=active (or similar) version as a bookmark

Wish it was set per-question

And then you could just set a default in your profile settings

Y'know...since y'all were disucssing :p earlier, I've noticed recently that I spend so much time here and use :p so often, I have to make an effort not to stick my tonue out at people as a way of acknowledging their jokes

Jo King

do you stick out your tongue whenever you send a :p?

Redwolf Programs

~~You don't?~~ :p

@emanresuA Congrats on 16k!

Redwolf Programs

22:18

hey wait...I just realized that figuring out where a shortened link goes is incredibly easy

I never thought about the fact it's just a 301 to the URL

emanresu A

22:29

@RedwolfPrograms Oh lol, thanks for the bounty

@RedwolfPrograms Yeah - when looking at old popcons 'cos I'm bored, I want the top-voted answers; when looking at the rest of the site, I want the newest stuff

(Aside from answer-chaining, where oldest is slightly better than active)

Redwolf Programs

For answer chaining, a newest sort order would be nice

user

@RedwolfPrograms Not since lyxal started his limb harvesting :q

Redwolf Programs

Keep your friends close, but your limbs closer.

6

TIL you can zoom YT captions with + and -

emanresu A

22:46

@RedwolfPrograms Agreed.

Sandbox Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Check this Scrabble Board's Validity Background Scrabble is a word game in which players collaboratively build a board consisting of letter tiles that spell words. Each word must be connected to another word, and players gain points based on the letters they use and where they are placed. Words c...

emanresu A

Active mostly works, but can screw up a bit if edits are made

codegolf.stackexchange.com/search?q=inquestion%3A88653+python+3

...

Redwolf Programs

lol...I see that sometimes with JS on those sorts of questions

emanresu A

But 17...

EphraimRuttenberg

if people could give my sandbox post (the one above) a read and leave feedback id appreciate that :)

Redwolf Programs

22:54

I think the rules regarding how you get the dictionary need work, they're a bit unobservable right now

I'd just say that answers should take a dictionary as input, the same way they'd take any other input

emanresu A

Also, what about something like:

HELLO

WORLD

Redwolf Programs

> The board is assumed to be contiguous

emanresu A

O

EphraimRuttenberg

ok thanks. that was one of the concerns i had and your suggestion makes sense

rak1507

technically according to wespa rules discontinuous boards are allowed

emanresu A

22:56

I think an interesting cahllenge on its own would be checking if a given board is contiquous, if we don't already have something like that

EphraimRuttenberg

yeah i added the assumption that the board is contiguous because i wanted this challenge to be about checking validity in both columns and rows and i think adding in the extra rule to check would take away from that too much

rak1507

yeah, I think it can be stated more simply (take in dictionary + board -> output decision) without worrying about parsing/whatever

other than that it looks good, nice challenge

EphraimRuttenberg

thanks :D

ill leave it for a couple days and then post it if i dont get any more feedback

rak1507

wespa.org/wesparulesv4.pdf section 3.13.1 d): 'A player is free to refrain from challenging an illegal word placement.' lol, this literally means someone can play a diagonal word/discontinuous/whatever and as long as your opponent is cool with it, it's fine

EphraimRuttenberg

that is pretty interesting, but technically all this means is that illegal boards can arise in games without consequence. the rule itself still acknowledges that these cases are illegal

rak1507

23:05

yeah not saying your challenge should be changed or anything just thought it was interesting

Redwolf Programs

Yeah, sort of like saying killing someone's technically legal if nobody catches you :p

rak1507

wonder if anyone has ever played a diagonal word

@RedwolfPrograms more like killing someone is legal if the person being killed has agreed to it

Redwolf Programs

Yeah, but there's actually specific laws against that

What the heck is that spelling

EphraimRuttenberg

or how people can get away with certain crimes if the victim doesnt press charges

rak1507

yeah, it's actually more like that

EphraimRuttenberg

23:08

theres an interesting example of stuff like this in chess, where magnus carlsen lost a game due to reflexively making a move instead of challenging an opponent's illegal move

theguardian.com/sport/2018/jan/05/…

rak1507

lol, nice

lyxal

@EphraimRuttenberg that reminds me of this:

chess king sacrifice

Redwolf Programs

Oh hey, YT recommended that to us both I see

lyxal

A while ago, yes

EphraimRuttenberg

ha! thats wonderful

a calculated risk

Redwolf Programs

23:16

I've now exchanged like 20 emails with a scammer on all of the weird tech issues I'm pretending to have, and it's so fun seeing their response

"It's giving me a 501 error what is that?", "How do I submit it?", "What is my email address?", "What if I don't live in any particular country, how do I fill out the address?"

emanresu A

23:41

Can you put the transcripts into a gist or something?

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The Nineteenth Byte

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