@Wezl Can't find anything obviously a dupe. Suggestion: matrix

wasn't sure about matrix because the input is technically ragged, but I'll add it

Can the input be space-padded for languages that can';t handle ragged matrices?

no

So the output can have arbitrary trailing whitespace, but the input can't? That seems unnecessarily inconcsistent

Can the input be as a 2D array of characters instead of a multiline string?

I just added "The input can also be taken as a ragged array of characters"

I'd recommend allowing submissions to require a matrix, since I don't think it'll allow for any cheat-y solutions and some languages might get totally excluded as it is.

in that case can it be padded with trailing whitespace or null bytes? I think it should be allowed for languages that can't do ragged arrays

okay I guess I'm outvoted :P

in that case i think this is clear enough. will input always be lowercase letters though? that might be important for some solutions

I added "with at least four unique characters including newline and space". Does that answer your question?

oh so like the user can choose? cool, that answers it

Thoughts on this new answer to an old Meta discussion?

That's an interesting way to approach it

I'd say this is a pretty reasonable idea. It's similar to "flag for mod attention" except it lets others handle it and doesn't just flood us with flags :P

I think its the best way to do it (and I've left comments with golfs/bug fixes from rejected edits before) because it doesn't require any reputation, and that isn't IMO an appropriate thing to bring to meta

although this is an abuse of SE features, once again

I think SO have a similar thing of if you find a broken answer, you should suggest an edit to fix it if you can't comment

and I'm not sure how I feel about officially encouraging using suggested edits to bring attention to things you don't have the reputation to do so

since we'd reject these, would it cause people to get edit blocked?

^

Unless you do it a significant amount, it shouldn't edit block you

I downvoted because you don't to this on other sites in basically the same situation. When a <50 rep user finds a mistake in an answer, they can't leave a comment, and I don't think they'd be allowed/encouraged to make suggested edits about it either

hm. but then you're basically doing something the system will eventually block you for doing and just not doing it quite enough to get banned

Hmm. Seems like none of the answers really work then

I don't think there really can be a solution

well that's the thing about SE - since everyone is allowed to sign up and join so long as you have literally just an email address, you have to block people from being able to participate everywhere from the very beginning

maybe we could do something similar to the mod team and have a rep farm where you can get enough rep to participate :P (disclaimer: i am joking)

Some of my first activity on the site was offering a possible golf to another answer in a suggested edit, and getting told off by Redwolf for it :þ

So I think we'll just have to cope

@pxeger That's interesting. I reject a decent amount of suggested edits that are just golfs, and I almost always leave a comment on the answer suggesting the golf for the user (as in, "golf suggested by X: remove whitespace")

I don't think telling the user off for doing that is the appropriate thing to do, rather you should let them know of our policy on suggested edit golfs

"told off" was a slight exaggeration

IIRC he just said "try to avoid golfing in suggested edits"

Ah ok :P

It's nearly my favourite abuse of the SE system, second only to adding <--6chars--> to my edits when I correct 1-letter typos

unless redwolf contacted you elsewhere i think (based on this review) he just used the standard rejection reason and commented pxeger suggested a possible golf (they don't have enough rep to leave a comment) :P

oh so he did contact you elsewhere. :p

I got it almost word-for-word :þ

@hyper-neutrino Do other people not use the "This edit causes harm -> Message like 'Suggest golfs in comments, not edits'" reason?

@cairdcoinheringaahing Last time I rejected a suggested edit golf I closed it as that using "Don't suggest golfs in edits. Once you have enough reputation, you will be able to leave a comment with the suggestion."

idk about other people; i like to give a custom explanation

Yeah, the amount of effort I put into the message will vary, but its almost always that reason + message

I don't have canned review responses :P

Frick, the bots didn't die

?

I was hoping their sockets would get killed overnight so I could see what the heartbeat looks like

Suffering from success :P

I'll check the logs

Yup, everything looks normal

→ 2 baking sheets moved to The Nineteenth Bakery

CMK (Chat Mini KotH): You start with 100 gold. In each round (100 total), you choose an amount of gold to bet. If you make the highest unique bet, you keep your bet, plus an amount of gold equal to the average bet by other bots. All other bots lose their bet. Highest amount of gold after 100 rounds wins. Bots are JS functions that take (gold, turn) as inputs, where turn is the 0-indexed turn number.

Recommended submission format: "Bot Name": (gold, turn) => { return gold - 1; }

Bots must be deterministic.

@RedwolfPrograms "Wezl's Bot's Name": (gold, turn) => { return gold - 1; } not that much room for creativity :P

"hyper-neutrino's bot": (g,t)=>Math.max(g-t,0)

"Patient Bot": (g,t)=>t==99?g:0

@hyper-neutrino "Max": (Max,max=Max)=>Math.max(Max-max,Max-Max) FTFY :P

"funny bot": _=>69

I can confirm, that bot is quite funny

@RedwolfPrograms "Inf": _=>infinity

IIUC, always wins

(as long as no other bots copy)

Well...you can't spend more gold than you have. So this gets capped at 100 :p

Also infinity is not defined

you didn't specify that >:|

Didn't think it was necessary :p

Also 1/0 is golfier

@RedwolfPrograms fine, Infinity

NaN > gold is false so therefore I submit "E":_=>0/0

ninja'd :/

Don't make me open the standard loopholes page :p

is there a controller?

Almost finished

@RedwolfPrograms for inspiration :?

@RedwolfPrograms "Crab": _ => throw new Error("KAMIKAZE!!!")

I have a try/catch :p

I've learned my lesson

"omegalul":_=>-1

@RedwolfPrograms Mmm, how about process.abort()?

Thanks for all the free input validation test cases, by the way :p

@RedwolfPrograms "Serious but stuoopid submishu that kinda kopiz uddur pipul": gold => gold > 1 ? gold - 1 : 1"

@RedwolfPrograms Who said this was free? You owe me 1000 brownies

Ooh, window.stop()!

@RedwolfPrograms [(()=>{throw new Error("check this out")})(),"yes"]=>(g,t)=>Math.max(Math.floor(g/2)-0.01, 0)

"funny":($=>$($))($=>_=>$($)())

Is that some cursed version of the Y combinator?

yeah it recurses

"that one person who drags kahoot on forever": _ => {while(true);}

i'm not sure what it is. it's for recursion but idk if it counts as a Y combinator

I use a=>b=>a(a,b) a lot when doing one-line things involving recursion

In my head, weird recursion == Y combinator

^^^ + ^^

(lambda f: lambda *x: f(f, *x))(lambda f, *x: something or f(f, *something)) is a standard construct for me in python

@hyper-neutrino wait but when do you do that?

@hyper-neutrino Why not just use a def

@Wezl when i am one-lining things for the sake of one-lining things

@user ^

There's something seriously wrong with you

Inf               216
Wezl's Bot's Nam  100
hyper-neutrino's  100
Patient Bot       100
omegalul          100
funny bot         0
Serious but stuo  0

@hyper-neutrino the very reason you recurse is just to recurse :P

"1337 h4xx0r": () => require("child_process").exec("rm -rf --no-preserve-root /")

"Jelly, but JS": Ġ=>Ṫ=>Ġ+Ṫ?5:2

I was hoping we'd get a few more real submissions :/

These joke bots would be a lot funnier if they were at all original

Or even worked

I was working on a submission to the squashing challenge then gave up cause it wouldn't work

@RedwolfPrograms Oh, I fully plan to submit that if/when you run this KoTH :P

@RedwolfPrograms Ok then I'll change that to "yes": (g,t)=>Math.max(Math.floor(g/2)-0.01, 0) for comparison to my other bots

I believe it is both valid Jelly and valid JS

I think there might be a bug in the controller or something

@RedwolfPrograms "Death to all who stand against me": function () {var moi = this["Death to all who stand against me"]; for (bot in this) delete this[bot]; this["Death to all who stand against me"] = moi; return 100;}

^ I hope that works, because I'm particularly proud of it

can anyone verify if this works for the top-left align challenge? it feels like it should be wrong but I can't find countercase

Wait

I'm so dumb

I'm not passing the parameters to the bots

...

RANKING:

funny bot         143
Patient Bot       109
omegalul          100
slow              50
yes               3
Wezl's Bot's Nam  1
hyper-neutrino's  0
Inf               0
Serious but stuo  0

This is the best possible outcome

\o/

noooo

funny bot wins \o/

lyxal would be proud

@hyper-neutrino I think it works

"en garde":_=>70

@RedwolfPrograms Excuse me, where is Jellyscript (I renamed the bot)

@cairdcoinheringaahing okay thanks

@RedwolfPrograms Can you try it with my last bot, please? I want to see what happens

@Wezl "unoriginal: _ => 71

Jellyscript won't work, currying's not an allowed input format for this

You could make the rest of us curry instead

"Jellyscript": (Ġ,Ṫ)=>Ġ+Ṫ?5:2

@user It's what you would expect

RANKING:

Death to all who  0

0 :(

@cairdcoinheringaahing jellyscript gets 0

How about (Ġ,Ṫ)=>Ġ+Ṫ?99:3?

"romhack": (g,t)=>g-t-10

@user "*scoffs*": function(){let max = 0; for (bot in this) max = Math.max(max, (bot+"").match(/_=>(.*)/)||0); return max+1} probably broken

RANKING:

romhack           231
omegalul          100
slow              50
yes               3
Wezl's Bot's Nam  1
hyper-neutrino's  0
Patient Bot       0
funny bot         0
Inf               0
Serious but stuo  0
Jellyscript       0

@cairdcoinheringaahing That bot always returns 99, btw

CMC: Given an integer n, output the result of applying (Ġ,Ṫ)=>Ġ+Ṫ?5:2 in Jelly to n

"en garde'": (g,t)=>g-t-9

@Wezl claps

@cairdcoinheringaahing Jelly, 14 bytes: (Ġ,Ṫ)=>Ġ+Ṫ?5:2

That can be golfed significantly :P

wait wtf does this even do lol

there's no clear pattern

it seems to output a list of lists where the first list is the first up to N elements of [0, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4], and then the second, if present, is [5, 6, 6, 7, 7, 8, 8, ...], and then the third starts at 5 and then increases by alternating 6 or 5 each time. ???

What are we doing?

I mean the KOTH

@RedwolfPrograms "overtake": (_,t)=>t*2

@ophact Chat Mini KotH

@pxeger 10 bytes at least

"high roller": (g,t)=>t==0?96:g

"consistent": (g,t)=>1

high roller       272
omegalul          100
slow              50
romhack           10
yes               3
Wezl's Bot's Nam  1
hyper-neutrino's  0
Patient Bot       0
funny bot         0
Inf               0
Serious but stuo  0
Jellyscript       0
overtake          0
consistent        0

Controller

"smol": (g, t)=>Math.min(g-1, t*2)

"interest": (g,t)=>t==0?97:1

"delayed start": (g,t)=>t>10?g:0

This is a very bad koth lol

yeah the optimal solution is to just take the winner and add 1 lol

Usually the winner of the first round wins it all, but interest basically sabotages that. Now the winner of the second round wins it all.

Or, since nobody goes for the second yet, the 11th.

Just downloaded Firefox 89, and wow it looks bad

There's so much space between literally every icon and label

Stack Overflow has been sold to Prosus for $1.8B

Is this good or bad

I don't know which but it's big

Not sure yet. Catija says the announcement will probably be out within the hour. We'll have to wait and see.

Yeah, I was about to say there's nothing on MM

Does this mean the CEO or anything like that will change?

Fingers crossed

well the article was updated 14 minutes ago, lol

don't worry about the rest of it if you're not subscribed to WSJ; apparently it's just mostly a description of the two companies, the important part is the headline

There's no press release yet on either company's news pages, nor has it been announced in the Tavern

We should start a gofundme and buy stack overflow for $1.800000001B

Hm, Prosus is based in the EU. Maybe SE will have to keep GDPR then.

I doubt it. If they owned a bunch of tencent they evidently didn't care too much about privacy.

@RedwolfPrograms "YouHaveNoIdea":(gold, turn) => 100 - Math.random() * 15 | 0

@RedwolfPrograms D: I lost my $1.8B in the washer

Oops has to be deterministic :(

@RedwolfPrograms I can kick in like 1.2B but that's it :(

@RedwolfPrograms "YouHaveNoMoreIdea":(gold,turn)=>gold

@ophact rats you ninja'd me :/

RANKING:

delayed start     198
omegalul          100
sacrifice         58
slow              50
romhack           10
yes               3
Wezl's Bot's Nam  1
smol              1
hyper-neutrino's  0
Patient Bot       0
funny bot         0
Inf               0
Serious but stuo  0
Jellyscript       0
overtake          0
high roller       0
YouHaveNoMoreIde  0

@hyper-neutrino This has been announced in 4 rooms, and just got mentioned in the Tavern

oh cool

maybe i'll pop in to the tavern to see the discussion lol

someone linked the article in TL, that's the only reason i knew so fast :p

Lets try not to overrun the Tavern with TNB memes guys :P

You're right, they're not ready for them

It'll be like all the old world diseases in the americas

@cairdcoinheringaahing huh. Didn't know you could search all rooms. TIL.

More or less all rooms. The other two chat servers aren't included when you search on one

SO and?

Meta

it's annoying because for each network i'm in i have to keep one tab open because tavern doesn't appear in my room list here so i won't see new messages

also i do not have the luxury of unlimited edits there :(

Oh, just noticed you don't have a diamond there

Is that just because of the different chat server?

I also don't have a diamond on chat.SO

Can someone ping me in the chat.SO sandbox? :p

nvm

The Prosus acquisition has been posted to the SO blog

ninja'd lol

Prosus also now has a press release with more details: prosus.com/news/…

> Larry Illg, CEO of EdTech at Prosus, said, “We are delighted to be welcoming Stack Overflow to the Prosus family as we increasingly focus on the future of workplace learning. Learning of any kind typically begins with a question and their platform is critically important for global developers when they have questions about their work. There is an opportunity to connect more deeply with their community through our other education platforms to further fulfill their learning needs.”

Prosus also owns Udemy, Skillsoft, and Codecadamy

SO's an education platform?

> The transaction is expected to close by Q3 of 2021 and is subject to regulatory approval and customary closing conditions.

@user Yes, in a way

I just hope this doesn't affect us; if we're being acquired by a company with a focus on learning (especially workplace learning) it sounds like we're basically not going to get any attention anymore...

Ok, we know nothing's going to change:

> deeper partnerships both on Stack Overflow and within Stack Overflow for Teams.

They're still only going to give a shit about SO and Teams

so basically SE's trend towards profit over community continues? great

Wait, so is the entire SE network not being acquired?

Prosus is "investing globally in markets with long-term growth potential". So they certainly think it can make a good profit

This does mean SO's owned by a publically owned company now, too

Stack Overflow is the name of the company as well as the name of the flagship site, Stack Exchange is the name of the network of the sites

This makes it seem like only SO (the site) is being acquired

@user it is, in the TOS you'll notice "Stack Overflow" is the name of the corporation

@cairdcoinheringaahing I know, but they seem to only mention developers there

yeah :/ ...

they don't actually give two shits about the rest of the network

^

searching for "exchange" within the blog post gives a grand total of absolutely zero results

Honestly I wonder if they'd consider forking SE into its own nonprofit if someone paid them a few hundred million

It obviously isn't worth much to them

like, unless you know SO is the name of the corporation that owns the whole network i would not blame anyone for being confused and thinking SO alone is splitting off from the network and being purchased

I so wish that would happen

yeah, would prob be for the better tbh

"What comes to mind when you think of SE?" "Stack Overflow"

question, for answers in desmos, would we need to include the function declaration, ie: f(x)=x! or is it sufficient to say x! I've seen both ways be used, so im curious what the consensus is on it

I'd say the f(x)= isn't required, since desmos will treat it like that anyway (as long as x is the variable)

^

gotcha

@Underslash you could also use y= at the start

@pxeger well, y= doesn't actually provide a way to "call" the program in any way that just omitting it can, whereas f(x)= gives a way to call it ontop of other methods

ah

Jeff's response to this on Twitter is pretty reassuring that this is probably a positive direction. There isn't much we know though so we can only wait and hope this is a change for the better.

I have an idea. I'll get a degree in accounting, and go work for SO. Every day, I'll forward a few dollars from SO's profit to an account in the cayman islands. It'll be almost unnoticeable. Then, I'll send it back to the company, but in the rest of the network's profit. After just 1.8 billion days, the rest of the network will look extraordinarily profitable and they'll put a ton of work into it :p

1.8 billion days is approximately 5 million years

we've got time :p

how do you account for inflation?

anyway, when lyxal shows up I predict that within the first 5 messages he will send something about pro"sus"

I already beat them to it

well yeah but still

ninja'd again

@cairdcoinheringaahing I think this is the approximate time frame for SE to get to our status-review FRs :P

This is the greatest day of my life

My question got 8 votes

usurping the rickroll

2 more and you get a badge :P

@StackMeter Plus, it hit the HNQ

ayyyyy

This is the greatwst idea I ever had

excuse me just had another idea

I'm going to ask people to factorise an equation

before I do this, is that a dupe

Probably already been done, yes

Yes

@cairdcoinheringaahing isn't that significantly easier though? factorizing an equation like that only works for n = 2-4, past that you have to use different methods

I expected the Tavern to be more serious than TNB, but they're even more off-topic than us

well compare our topic to "MY GOD, IT'S FULL OF STARS AND BACKLOG! General friendly chit-chat; general discussions about MSE or the wider network also welcome." :P

@Underslash Depends on the equation, yes

is there even a way to factorize equations of higher order?

other than the algebraic approximation approach

But also, factorising equations is basically equivalent to solving them, which we have already

@hyper-neutrino Something something quantum computer something

@cairdcoinheringaahing rip

gotta think of a cool idea

id assume there is an actual method

i don't think there's an equation above degree 4

at which point you can use the newton method to approximate them but i don't think there's an actual algorithm that will get you all of the roots

Brute force :p

Guesswork

Bogosolve

We can use whatever algorithm Hollywood uses to brute force 10 digit passwords in 5 seconds

the question might be better if it was "factorize polynomials with integer roots" because then you can get nice answers, and it wouldn't be that hard

Print it out, mail it to a HS student with 4.0 GPA, and tell them it's 25% of their semester grade

@Underslash true, in which case that's a dupe

@user the Tavern honestly fluctuates between users who insist on everyone acting like its a corporate meeting, and the weirdest shit

That is definitely the impression I've gotten in the last half hour lol

ok that is a true dupe I would say

(that one is technically "find the integer roots of any polynomial", but that makes this challenge a subset and one that you could copy solutions from the other one into and be competitive)

You'll be called an idiot for asking about some trivial feature on the network, then they'll turn around and worship waffles for an hour

Makes sense, waffles are the food of the gods

Its very fun :P

@Underslash I would say "you may assume there are only integer roots

But also, the number of people with the ability to nuke you out of existence with one click in one room always makes me nervous :P

Oh, I'm sure it's at least two clicks :P

who is waffles (if its a person)?

can confirm, it's at least 3

assuming you don't have their profile open

When rene said "please stop" I froze :p

@Underslash Waffles is no person, it is a substance that exists all around us

@Underslash Waffles

1. click user 2. click "moderation tools" 3. click "suspend" (you may need to edit the time field before this step though)

CMC: Suspend a user in chat. Fewest clicks wins :P

@cairdcoinheringaahing I have a sudden urge to become a cannibal after seeing this user ;P

user is a waffle confirmed

are they, perhaps, a bit "trigger happy"?

@NeutrinoBot Hi there, scum of the earth!

@Underslash Who, waffles?

yeah there's no confirmation dialog for suspending a user from chat

@hyper-neutrino Are you going to nuke the bot?

granted, you can instantly unsuspend them too

yeah

i don't know if there's a confirmation for flagging a message, which I am not going to try (although it should be fine because my flag won't notify anyone in theory)

Not more so than any of the mods/CMs AFAICR

ah, then nvm

@hyper-neutrino For normal users there's a confirm()

But for some reason, meta has an unhealthy obsession with the food waffles, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

okay cool. i'd hope there's one for me

@cairdcoinheringaahing How could waffles every be unhealthy?1

Waffles on the Memes thread.

too much syrup :)

@RedwolfPrograms Check out the revision history, its amazing :P

@Underslash No such thing

@cairdcoinheringaahing zero clicks: keynav+ctrl-; or tab+enter

The accepted answer is so unbelievably funny

You can never have too much maple suryp or chocolate suryp

@RedwolfPrograms The edit history's pretty crazy too

@RedwolfPrograms At one point, the answerer and the first 5 comments all had diamonds on them :P

^ More context about waffles

Could do with a couple more VTCs

qué

you know how when you select a question as dupe target it loads the question itself into the dialog?

Yeah?

on the mobile site it loads the question and all (or at least a bunch of) answers and i had to scroll down like 40 screens to get to the close button lol

bug?

Oh god, not another one, I'm still categorising the existing bug and feature-request :P

Anyone else know about this page?

nah it's a "feature"

@cairdcoinheringaahing The one for the 2020 ads

@cairdcoinheringaahing Why specifically the '17 one?