The Nineteenth Byte

quartata

12:00 AM

@ConorO'Brien Scroll up

Dennis

Eh, mixed up n^2 and 2^n, and I wasn't sure if Excel had ^. That's what happens when you try to do math at 4 AM... Thanks, @Emigna. — Dennis ♦ 8 hours ago

Nathan Merrill

Chat*

quartata

Really? Didn't they just change the design a couple months ago

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

@NathanMerrill It's been like this for ages

Conor O'Brien

@quartata the bk thing?

quartata

12:00 AM

@ConorO'Brien Yeah.

DJMcMayhem

@NathanMerrill really? I'm on mobile chat and nothings different for me

Nathan Merrill

@βετѧΛєҫαγ it looks prettier to me. Maybe not

Conor O'Brien

I'll wait on finding out what you're talking about until El'endia finds some resources on it :P

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax @Dennis take a look at it now I explicitly specified that submissions are full programs or functions that are strictly less than 30k

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

So you can't star @DJMcMayhem?

El'endia Starman

12:01 AM

3 mins ago, by quartata

@El'endiaStarman Found a blog post on it: http://blog.notdot.net/2007/4/Damn-Cool-Algorithms-Part-1-BK-Trees

Downgoat

@RohanJhunjhunwala do note unless you have a very good reason. people wont be happy for you disallowing functions

El'endia Starman

@quartata Oooh, that's pretty cool.

Conor O'Brien

@El'endiaStarman oh, goodie, you found it.

:P

DJMcMayhem

@βετѧΛєҫαγ What are you talking about? I can star

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

That's the update isn't it?

quartata

12:02 AM

I'm testing with 5 as a threshold but I suspect that might be a little low.

DJMcMayhem

I've never used any other mobile chat, so if it's a recent update, it was a long time ago

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Downgoat I explicitly allowed it now, I originally had disallowed functions because the goal was high scores, and golfing could be trivial to just remove boiler plate to make a full program, but I decided to open it up.

quartata

I might experiment with scaling the threshold based on the length of the string

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala Allowing function to return a newline-separated string, but not a list seems a bit weird. To clarify: Requiring full programs might make sense for this challenge, but you must say that full programs are required in that case.

Downgoat

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ when will you change your name back? :3

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

12:03 AM

@Dennis ok I will require full programs

Helka Homba

@El'endiaStarman no

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@Downgoat In 6-8 weeks

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala If you allow functions and full programs, can Alice golf Bob's code down from a full program to a function, or does it have to stay a full program if it started that way?

El'endia Starman

@HelkaHomba Good thing I didn't for any of my solutions. :P

Downgoat

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ inclusive/inclusive?

trichoplax

12:05 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala is the upper case I in the title a pun I'm missing or just a typo? Didn't want to edit it without checking...

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax that is part of the reason why i kept output restricted and required full programs

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala That makes sense

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@Downgoat teleclusive/transclusive

Downgoat

question: What's a single word for "said exasperatedly" or "said in anguish"

quartata

In other news I forgot how bad Python's pickle is when it comes down to objects. If the class isn't in the namespace in the exact same way as it was relative to the originating module it throws an error when unpickling

@Downgoat lamented

trichoplax

12:05 AM

@Downgoat exclaimed?

sighed?

Conor O'Brien

@Downgoat cried?

trichoplax

gasped?

Helka Homba

wailed

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax there was no intentional pun in the title

trichoplax

snapped?

Downgoat

12:06 AM

@quartata too deathy. idk if you can even use that for said

quartata

You can.

Helka Homba

^

Downgoat

@trichoplax feels to happy/cheery

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis I;m voting to reopen let me know if there is more clarification needed. I apologize for the confusion,a nd I will be more patient in the sandbox from now on

quartata

also how is it "deathy" lel

> a passionate expression of grief or sorrow

checks out

trichoplax

12:07 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala In that case I've edited the title - hopefully it's how you intended?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

yes looks good I didnt even notice it

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala You should also clarify if I/O has to be in decimal. By default, some language are allowed to do I/O in unary.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Ok clarifying @Dennis

Downgoat

Baby goat crying

►

^ too much cuteness. not enough anger

Conor O'Brien

aw

quartata

12:08 AM

Are you writing goat fan fiction

Helka Homba

@Downgoat Would be confusing to have a mix of functions/programs. Seems more homogeneous and proper this way.

Downgoat

@quartata haha no

Helka Homba

Are you riding a goat in the fan fiction?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

the goat earns a star to be cheered up

quartata

@Downgoat resists urge to post something involving goats and cooking

Helka Homba

12:11 AM

(do people ride goats?)

Downgoat

@quartata can you please stop with these jokes

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I think the reference to "losing" bytes could be confusing, and is a longer explanation than simply saying only the shortest code in a given language contributes to your score.

@Downgoat I suspect your objection fuels them. I never get turtle soup jokes...

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax fixing

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala They must not be derived from another language (brainfuck versus Alphfuck) is a bit unclear. Does that mean I can crack a brainfuck answer with Sesos? Probably not...

DJMcMayhem

^ Or could I crack vim with V?

quartata

12:15 AM

Or Python with Pyth

Dennis

Vim seems to be broken by default. hides

quartata

Or Ruby with goruby

DJMcMayhem

@Dennis ;_;

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis it means that you can not post another submission in language X if another language has already been posted, and X is a trivial derivative of X. Sesos would not necessarily be a trivial derivative of bf

Helka Homba

@trichoplax Turtlr vs goat vs fox? strawpoll.me/11049646

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

12:16 AM

Is there a way I can clear that up?

Dennis

> GNU Emacs ported to Android! If Emacs segfaults try changing font size.

5

wat

DJMcMayhem

What does "trivial derivative" mean?

Helka Homba

Also, finally a sane font on Strawpoll!

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis seems legit

trichoplax

@HelkaHomba You win... :)

DJMcMayhem

12:18 AM

3 votes for fox already

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala But if two "things" are counted as the same language, can I crack variant A with variant B?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis no

@Dennis perhaps I can replace that section with some clause that tries to have people avoid posting trivial variations on other languages. For example, we don't really need one answer from every trivial bf derivative

if we have a bf answer we don't really need an OOK! answer

DJMcMayhem

I do agree with that.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I like that rule, but it means you should probably insist that each answer specifies a version number. Otherwise people will post "Python", and it will be open to being cracked by either Python 2 or 3 since they didn't specify

quartata

TypeError: object of type 'generator' has no len()

can't wait for pytek

Dennis

12:19 AM

But what counts as trivial?

Downgoat

What is your favorite direction

@quartata o_o that looks just like JS error

quartata

Also I guess that's because random.choice needs a list

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis is there any meta consensus on this? I guess I can allow derivatives, but strongly "advise" against it?

DJMcMayhem

@Downgoat Woah, SP accounts? o_O

quartata

@Downgoat It's just weird because len is a magic method

Dennis

12:20 AM

@trichoplax Even Python 2.2/3.4 is quite different from 2.7/3.6.

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

A Fragile Quine quine code-challenge An N-fragile quine is a quine such that all programs resulting from removing any N characters from the source code error. You will make an N-fragile quine for any N-value of your choosing, however, higher N-values will give you a better score. To elaborate,...

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

who voted for right

Downgoat

halp how 2 check if function terminates

brb creating solution to halting problem

quartata

@Downgoat That's called the Halting Problem

Downgoat

@quartata ik >_>

quartata

12:21 AM

I can recount a nice proof that you can't do it if you want

trichoplax

@Dennis Ah good point. I guess specifying exact version number including minor release might be best then @RohanJhunjhunwala but then does that mean there can be no entry in python 2.2, 2.3, 2.4,... once an answer arrives using python 3.6?

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala Strongly advising means squat. If the score or the validity of a crack depends on it, it must be clarified. The meta consensus is that every challenge has to define it itself.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

So do you have a recommendation on how to specify it? @Dennis

Downgoat

Hello @ReleasingHeliumNuclei

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

I'm not a big fan of saying Language X != Language Y iff !X.tostring().equals(Y.toString())

Dennis

12:24 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala For your scoring method, not really. Allowing answers in all *fuck languages should not be allowed, but it's non-trivial to come up with a rule that is both clear and disallows these.

trichoplax

The problem is that not only is specifying each language individually going to be tedious, but it will likely invite complaints about fairness since different people see things differently

Releasing Helium Nuclei

@Downgoat hai

feersum

To me a challenge that encourages participants to submit something in as many languages as possible is inherently bad.

2

trichoplax

@feersum Do you have specific reasons?

feersum

One, it's not interesting to compete in.

Translating something to 100 languages is a tedious slog.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

12:27 AM

@Dennis so should I allow all languages and just handle the trolls with downvotes?

feersum

And having a large number of posts makes it hard to navigate.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala you don't currently have a winning criterion tag, which may lead to being closed as soon as it's reopened. Does code-bowling suit?

feersum

It's hard for anyone to spot incorrect answers and point them out.

Releasing Helium Nuclei

Oh Emojicode 0.3 beta 2 is out

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala People that follow the rules aren't trolls. If you host a competition, expect people to play to win.

trichoplax

12:29 AM

@feersum The difference with this challenge is that there won't be a solution in each language for each competitor, since the goal is to post something which prevents any other competitor from using that language. Still cluttered, but I think not as bad

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax @Dennis had me remmove code-bowling I personally like code-bowlinh as a tag. Is that acceptable?

Dennis

code-challenge would be better.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I only saw the objection to golf and bowling together (since they are opposites).

feersum

@trichoplax Though in that case it becomes a game of FGITW.

trichoplax

@feersum I do fear it being spoiled by someone posting golfed code instead of bowled code, and winning by default with a much lower sum score than the competition invites

Mitch Schwartz

12:31 AM

bit of a silly question, do you guys have a special way of remembering that it's [text](link) and not (text)[link] ? i'm thinking of remembering it in terms of omitting parentheticals in english sentences, but maybe there's a more natural way

Conor O'Brien

CMC: given a string S and a number n, yield all strings that result from removing n characters from S

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis I think perhaps this as a rule. You must crack a program in the same language and version, but you may not submit an answer in Language X if there is already a solution in a language Y such that all programs in language Y can be translated to language X by a program that is less than 50 bytes long? It seems arbitrary, but it could work?

Downgoat

@MitchSchwartz You usually say "the best place to search is google (google.com)"; instead of using square brackets

feersum

I can translate Brainfuck to C in less than 250 bytes.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

is that better?

50 bytes?

Mitch Schwartz

12:33 AM

ok so that's pretty close to what i was thinking

feersum

No, it's not better.

trichoplax

@MitchSchwartz If it helps, the () is optional in posts on main. You can just write [text] and then put [text]: URL at the bottom of the post. Remembering that functionality helps me remember than the [] is the essential bit

Mitch Schwartz

ok thanks

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis I guess if someone wishes to post a bunch of *f---- submissions than I can't stop them

Or just explicitly block *f--- languages

Mitch Schwartz

huh, i always used [1], [2], etc and never [arbitrary text] for the footnote links

trichoplax

12:35 AM

@MitchSchwartz Another way is that they are not in ASCII order, but that's a bit awkward to remember

@MitchSchwartz I always used [arbitrary text][1] and then [1]: URL at the bottom, until I saw somewhere that you can just use the text without the number. I like it that way for editing later, as you can see from the list of links at the bottom what each one is described as

Mitch Schwartz

yeah that's a nice feature

that i didn't know about until now

trichoplax

Particularly useful when coming back to edit a post months later...

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis @trichoplax I have fixed it up now, do my rules on languages seem clearer and fairer?

trichoplax

1. What counts as a derivative?
2. What if X is a derivative of Y (instead of Y a derivative of X)?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax a derivative is a language that is extraordinarily similar to a language and "derives" its syntax almost entirely from its "parent" language

trichoplax

12:42 AM

My best advice would be don't try to find a rule. Either leave it open or specify a long list of equivalence classes

feersum

If X is a derivative of Y and Y is a derivative of Z, is X a derivative of Z?

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala That's more detailed, but different people will still understand different things from it.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax I added a "cach-all" clause that allows people to ping me with any questiosn

@feersum the transitive property applies

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala In that cases nearly all languages are derivatives of each other to some extent ;)

Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala Proving that something can't be done is usually quite difficult if not impossible.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

12:44 AM

@Dennis what are you referring to?

@Dennis I altered that rule

feersum

@trichoplax And if they aren't we can make it so by inventing some new intermediate languages!

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@feersum that is a "standard loophole"

trichoplax

@feersum That is sneaky :)

Lynn

We should be able to close languages as duplicates.

7

Dennis

The 50 bytes transpilation criterion.

quartata

12:45 AM

@Lynn hahaha

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis oh I fixed it

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I share @feersum's concerns about someone posting in all the languages up front with minimal effort, leaving no fun for anyone else. Would it help to have a rule restricting a person from posting a second answer until a certain time later, or until a certain number of other answers have come in from other people?

Downgoat

question: what's a word for a crappy solution just put together as a last-minute fix

trichoplax

Otherwise I'm worried someone will not bother bowling, and just post short code for every language

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax yeah like one hour between posting submissions or cracks

DJMcMayhem

12:48 AM

@Downgoat kludge

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Downgoat kludge DJ ninja'd me. Otherwise Bodge works

Lynn

Seriously. Subjective community consensus works perfectly fine for “are these challenges too similar”, because the system actually lets us vote for it. If we had the same for Brainfuck derivatives and Python-with-shorter-builtin-names kinda crap, we’d be set! …Maybe.

DJMcMayhem

Hack is also acceptable, but not as good IMO

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Lynn make a meta

@Lynn or follow Dennis's starred advice about asking on meta whether something is on topic for meta

DJMcMayhem

@Lynn What's to say we can't vote on them? But with close votes, but down votes

trichoplax

12:51 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala I'm not so worried about cracks - they should take longer to come up with. But I'm wondering whether a restriction on initial answers would help, giving more time to people who will post genuinely long code, so someone who just posts short code can only spoil a limited number of languages.

Lynn

The major downside is probably: that’d be adding another layer of weird bureaucracy to this all.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Cant get strikethrough lol

trichoplax

The weird bureaucracy is all part of the fun

2

@RohanJhunjhunwala ---text---

feersum

Isn't weird bureaucracy our raison d'être?

Ninja'd while trying to copy-paste raison d'être.

5

Helka Homba

If my home magically had an extra room and I was given $20000 USD to decorate it, I would make it into a...

Lynn

12:52 AM

I swear sometimes PPCG is like a big game of code golf Nomic.

3

quartata

@HelkaHomba That was easy

If I had a greenhouse I could finally grow some carnivorous plants in this god-forsaken temperate climate

Conor O'Brien

@HelkaHomba I would make a small closet then used the rest of the money for my own whims :P

Lynn

@HelkaHomba Ooooh I’m torn between art studio and library~

Downgoat

@HelkaHomba i would do rumpus room but i have no friends to play with ;_;

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@HelkaHomba video game room, except it would be dominated by several servers all running an instance of Mathematica in parallel

3

Helka Homba

12:54 AM

@quartata I knew I shouldn'a put that as an option

Conor O'Brien

@Downgoat invite all the nice people from ppcg

Downgoat

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ SO MUCH GOAT DIRECTION RECOGNITION

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax sure I can add that restriction

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I don't know the best way to do it. I'm hoping others have some ideas

Lynn

Can I have music equipment in my art studio. That would seal the deal

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

12:55 AM

Jul 24 at 2:01, by LegionMammal978

;)

Helka Homba

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ ..why?

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

Note that I later updated it to give a more accurate image:

Jul 24 at 2:26, by LegionMammal978

DJMcMayhem

@HelkaHomba I love building PC's, so the answer is pretty obvious. I'd do like overclocked sli titan x's with dual cpus, and several 4k monitors. drools

Helka Homba

@Lynn Ooh, sure. I forgot to have music room as an option.

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@HelkaHomba why not

DJMcMayhem

12:56 AM

Oh, I might go with that instead

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Dennis I have added in all of your fixes is it considered ready now?

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala This is why I leave my challenges in the sandbox for months :)

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Does anyone here have reopen hammer powers?

Downgoat

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ Correct greenc olor is #4C9067

Helka Homba

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ Servers running mathy junk != gaming room

trichoplax

12:57 AM

@HelkaHomba Did you mean > ?

Releasing Helium Nuclei

Anyone here watched Person of Interest?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@ReleasingHeliumNuclei yes

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@HelkaHomba It was your closest option ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

top notch

DJMcMayhem

@ReleasingHeliumNuclei I did. I didn't really like it

Releasing Helium Nuclei

12:58 AM

@DJMcMayhem welp

@RohanJhunjhunwala what do you think happened to Control?

Ded?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@ReleasingHeliumNuclei don't spoil anything I watched it on netflix lol

I'm behind a season

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala It only takes 5 reopen votes, and 4 have been cast already, so anyone (mod or not) can cast the last one now. I'm not casting it myself because it still seems like there are outstanding things to fine tune

Downgoat

questoin: what's a good way to descibe lots of people moving and running around doing productive things and al

I was thinking "flurry of activity"

Conor O'Brien

@Downgoat bustle?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

eh that doesnt work either

Downgoat

1:00 AM

@ConorO'Brien oh, that's good

Conor O'Brien

thank you.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax ok, what errors are left?

DJMcMayhem

@HelkaHomba is it possible to mix and match? Cause spending 20k on video games seems wasteful, but a music/video game/server room sounds incredible.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala The problem with "ping me for clarification" is that some people won't think clarification is needed (they assume their interpretation is the only one and only find out later someone else had another interpretation). So no one will know whether their assumptions are correct but some will post anyway, not realising they have made an assumption

Downgoat

another question: how to describe ambient chatter? e.g. lunchroom at school

DJMcMayhem

1:01 AM

@Downgoat Chatter?

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala Not errors as such, just things that might end up being disagreements later

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax should I just remove the thing about derivatives?

DJMcMayhem

Or if you want to go fancy: "ambient chatter"

Lynn

“Ambient chatter” is already great

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

and just ban *f--- languages

Downgoat

1:02 AM

@DJMcMayhem doesn't really connotate lots of noise, echo, etc.

Conor O'Brien

@Downgoat noise? chatter? walla?

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala Unless you have a clearly defined rule then it's just saying something that cannot be enforced, so I guess it's better to leave it out

DJMcMayhem

Like I said, ambient chatter sounds good. Maybe hubbub?

Conor O'Brien

oo, nice one

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

wait I have an idea

DJMcMayhem

1:03 AM

Commotion?

No, nvmd

Helka Homba

@DJMcMayhem Vote for the one your room would be closest to

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Y is a derivative of language X iff Y is a language such that for every command in language Y there exists one string replacement to translate the language into x and vice versa.

Releasing Helium Nuclei

@Downgoat we use uğultu in Turkish

Downgoat

;_; no hablo turkish

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@trichoplax ^^^ see the above forgot to ping u on it

feersum

1:05 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala Almost any language pair satisfies this.

Conor O'Brien

@RohanJhunjhunwala define trivially, and that is a horrible metric.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I think you run into the same problem Dennis mentioned earlier. How can you prove that something cannot be done?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Should I give up on it?

And just ban bf derivatives explcitly?

DJMcMayhem

I think this whole commotion would be avoided if the primary winning condition did not promote answering in a ton of different languages

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Do you have an idea to fix that?

DJMcMayhem

1:07 AM

No

trichoplax

I recommend accepting that you cannot define it objectively, and just either leave it open, or include a list of equivalence classes in the post. Only one language from each equivalence class can be used (whichever one is used first). Any language not mentioned in any equivalence class can be posted in a comment so that you can assign it to a (possibly new) equivalence class and edit the post

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

I think ppcg doesn't see enouugh rosetta-code

Ok

I'll do that

DJMcMayhem

Look at this challenge:

trichoplax

Just expect a lot of work and a long list to maintain ;)

DJMcMayhem

69

Q: Can you outgolf me? (Cops section)

Cops section The robbers section can be found here. Thanks to FryAmTheEggman, Peter Taylor, Nathan Merrill, xnor, Dennis, Laikoni and Mego for their contributions. Challenge Your task is to write 2 different programs (full programs/functions/etc.) in the same language and the same version (...

It's very similar, and it was in the sandbox for weeks

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

1:11 AM

The two languages used must be distinctly different. In particular:

They must not be different versions of the same language (e.g. Python 2 vs. Python 3).
They must not be different dialects of the same language (e.g. Pascal vs. Delphi).
One language may not be a subset of the other one (e.g. C vs. C++).

That was "borrowed" from the polyquien challenge

does that work?

trichoplax

No that still gives only examples, with no way of objectively extrapolating to other languages

Also, saying C is a subset of C++ will bring war... ;)

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Lol xD

um...

Let me try borrowing stuff from other rosseta-stone challenges

trichoplax

Helka often says that you can just trust people to keep to the spirit of the challenge, which is usually true. I think as long as the rules are clear and unambiguous, little misunderstandings can be deleted and the challenge doesn't need to be perfectly defined

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

so can I jsut leave out language restrictions?

I feel that we wont see "trolls" just answering in every trivial variant of language X

trichoplax

It's up to you how much to trust the competitors. You could just give a reasonable warning that solutions in a language you consider too similar to an existing solution will be disqualified at your discretion.

Lynn

1:19 AM

@trichoplax That seems to contradict Dennis’s position

trichoplax

@Lynn That it should be strictly defined?

Lynn

50 mins ago, by Dennis

@RohanJhunjhunwala People that follow the rules aren't trolls. If you host a competition, expect people to play to win.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

It seems to have been reopened,

I will just add this warning "borrowed" from another rosetta-code Also, no shenanigans with basically the same answer in a slightly different language dialects. I will be the judge as to what submissions are different enough.

Lynn

Specifically expect people to play to win vs. trust people to keep to the spirit of the challenge

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Does that sort of wording work?

Can I arbitrarily judge if a language is considered "different enough". THat doesn't seem objective

quartata

1:22 AM

@HelkaHomba Why not?

trichoplax

@Lynn I think there needs to be a compromise. I have a tendency to try and close every possible loophole when writing a challenge, which often turns out to be unnecessary. It can rarely be perfectly defined so it's about deciding how far to go. I really don't know where to draw the line with this one. The only way I can see to ensure there is no way around the rule is to have the list of equivalence classes I mentioned. Do you think that would be watertight enough?

quartata

@DJMcMayhem What about a cluster of 4,000 Raspberry Pis

Lynn

My experience is that if you try to close all the loopholes people will scrutinize your challenge harder. :(

feersum

@Lynn Got an example?

Lynn

Leave something subjective and people will play along. Try to pin-point it, and people will nitpick.

trichoplax

1:24 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala I think it is as objective as you can get for this purpose. It seems fair for all the languages you manage to mention up front, but for the languages you miss you'll have to make a decision that wasn't known to the competitors at the start, which gets awkward

Lynn

Hmmm

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

All right take a look at how it looks now feel free to edit the wording

trichoplax

My personal preference is to make everything watertight, but I'm trying to consider how important it is in specific cases, and to judge how strict a given challenge needs to be

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

Any active CMCs? Pretty bored right now

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Yeah, but I do feel that most submissionsfollow the spirit of the challenge

trichoplax

1:28 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala Did you still want some kind of restriction on how often someone can post a first solution in a given language?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

I added that

Downgoat

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ yes: fix cheddar argument parsing in fewest bytes possible

3

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Lol

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@Downgoat ._.

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala Ah I see it now

Mitch Schwartz

1:30 AM

@LeakyNun done. (with a one byte improvement)

Conor O'Brien

1 hour ago, by Conor O'Brien

CMC: given a string S and a number n, yield all strings that result from removing n characters from S

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@ConorO'Brien Can S be a char array?

trichoplax

@RohanJhunjhunwala I'm a bit too tired to take in what I'm reading now, but I suspect there are things mentioned in the tl;dr that are not mentioned in the main body, which could be confusing. Is the time delay mentioned in the main body?

Conor O'Brien

@ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ sure

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

no @trichoplax let me fix that up

trichoplax

1:37 AM

@RohanJhunjhunwala I'm going to sleep now. Good luck with your challenge :)

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Ok thanks

Thanks for your help @trichoplax

trichoplax

No problem - it's been interesting

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

@ConorO'Brien Mathematica, 45 bytes: a[[#]]&/@Range[b=Length[a=#]]~Subsets~{b-#2}&

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

2:07 AM

chirp chirp chirp

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

@Downgoat that's been active for like a month

Downgoat

@EᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏIʀᴋ you gotta problem with that? :P

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΨΠʹ

2:27 AM

Definitely ~~superexponential~~ weird

Conor O'Brien

2:40 AM

what is that?

feersum

3:25 AM

Lol, there are at least 3 Stack Exchanges about cryptocurrencies.

Downgoat

@feersum well they are also like 10 SEs about languages :P

feersum

What kind of languages do you mean?

DJMcMayhem

I assume he means natural language

feersum

Will 8dot3 always be with us?

Downgoat

> greeted their opponents

i am very tired

Sherlock9

4:29 AM

Hello everyone

Downgoat

what's a word for quickly tinkering, working effiently?

@Sherlock9 Hello!

Leaky Nun

@Mego Don't you think it would be more convenient for D6 to access the global stack

Sherlock9

Alright, so my campus wi-fi seems to be wonky because it took four captchas to open a strawpoll

Leaky Nun

@ConorO'Brien Perfect challenge for Brachylog

Just kidding

@ConorO'Brien Pyth, 7 bytes: <ReQ.ph

Beware of the complexity

Guys, if nobody is doing the printable in Actually, I'll start working.

Sherlock9

5:09 AM

Printable?

Leaky Nun

23

Q: Print every printable ASCII character without using it

In a programming language of your choice, write 95 programs, each of which outputs a different one of the 95 printable ASCII characters without that character occurring anywhere in the program. For example, if your language was Python, your program that outputs the character P might be print(ch...

code-golf string restricted-source printable-ascii

Sherlock9

Go right ahead

Leaky Nun

Will you do it also?

Sherlock9

Nah, I'm working on another idea

Leaky Nun

What are you working on?

Sherlock9

5:14 AM

CMC: Post all unique partitions of a string (all lengths from 1 to length of the original string)

Leaky Nun

@Sherlock9 Pyth, 2 bytes: ./

Sherlock9

<code>;╕lR╛╧M</code> if you don't care that the results are lists of chars

;╕lR`╛╧♂Σ`MΣi if you want to push strings to the stack with no lists

Leaky Nun

The first one doesn't work for me

Nor does the second one

Sherlock9

@LeakyNun That was my first idea. But you need to print "bd" and "ac" and so on

Try this

Leaky Nun

Eh, that isn't exactly what partition means

Oh, the backticks got deleted

Sherlock9

5:17 AM

Nuts

;╕lR`╛╧`M

Leaky Nun

Nice use of ╧

Sherlock9

@LeakyNun Well, I don't know the word for this. "All possible substrings"?

Thanks :D

Leaky Nun

@Sherlock9 it's called subsequence

Sherlock9

CMC: Print all possible subsequences of a string

Downgoat

@Sherlock9 __import('itertools')__.permutations(input())

did i python correctly

Leaky Nun

5:21 AM

@Downgoat I don't think so

it isn't permutated

Sherlock9

@Downgoat Not quite. They should be unique and have the length-1 subsequences, length-2 subsequences, and so on

Downgoat

oh

Sp3000

Also, Python golf-wise you'll rarely ever need __import__

Downgoat

CMC: golf this python code: print __import__('itertools').permutations(input())

Sp3000

input() (functionally it's basically the same since nothing is output)

Leaky Nun

5:33 AM

__import__('itertools').permutations(input())
from itertools import *;permutations

Downgoat

@Sp3000 fixed loophole

Leaky Nun

By the way, I just found a way to error in Actually

(It was said that it is impossible to error)

actually.tryitonline.net/#code=J2J1&input=&debug=on

@Mego Bug?

Leaky Nun

5:52 AM

CMC: make the char c in Actually using the printables save c.

Fml, the whole lyrics of 99 bottles doesn't contain a single c

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