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10:00 PM
@MichaelHampton - don't want to bring our www website in house...at least not anytime soon.
 
OK, I'd have to also go with POSTing the data back to an in-house server, then.
 
@TheCleaner Their website sends a POST to your server-only website that does the database entry. He says. Again. :)
 
@JeffFerland and @voretaq7 - thanks...I will let them know...I'm not a website guy at all so even POST is new to me.
 
electrified doorknobs.... thats what I need, electrified doorknobs
and a door....
 
@TheCleaner The idea is that you don't give it direct database access, but that you give the presentation code (the view) a way to submit data to an intermediate business-logic layer (the controller) that has access to your database (represented by the model). So, from a security perspective, you can implement MVC concepts even without using an MVC framework.
 
10:03 PM
@TheCleaner You do POST all the time. Whenever you hit a submit button on a web page.
 
@MichaelHampton I should have clarified that I don't know HOW to implement such a thing.
 
@TheCleaner That's for the developers to worry about. :)
 
security wise, will the source code on the page tell people what the SUBMIT button is doing in the background? ie. will myinternalserverWANIP.com/whereverthisisgettingPOSTed be listed externally? would the public have any knowledge where the POST is going?
@MichaelHampton - the scary part is they are coming to me asking me how to make it happen. Hence the original "grrr."
 
@TheCleaner The data could be POSTed to your public web server, which could do a second POST in the background to your internal server.
 
@MichaelHampton - they came by today "hey...umm...the external website doesn't have access to the database like our test site we built on our computer at our desk does. How can we fix that?"
@MilesErickson - thank you...that helps as well
 
10:08 PM
@TheCleaner I wouldn't worry too much about giving the public web site some limited access to the internal database, say to insert and update records. It's really no worse than a web site in your DMZ having such access.
 
At least it helps in terms of telling them. MVC framework had to be googled. I gave up on programming or learning anything about it years ago
 
Except that you'll almost certainly want to encrypt the connection.
 
OK thanks folks. I'll relay. Sorry to interrupt, back to cable modems, beer, and philosophy. :)
 
@TheCleaner I find that having some development background helps, in spotting when the developers are about to do something utterly braindead.
@TheCleaner I would only have significant worries about the public web site having access to the internal database, if it were on shared hosting.
 
@MichaelHampton "To us, VMware offers a lot of bells-and-whistles (product extension nice-to-haves) — but are these bells-and-whistles worth a 40% price premium?"
 
10:15 PM
@ewwhite 40% over RHEV, the exact numbers are a few pages in
 
@TheCleaner @MichaelHampton's suggested approach is good. The customer POSTs the form to an external web site, which POSTs the same data to an internal URL that exists solely to receive those submissions, and that site is responsible for sanitizing input and inserting it into the database. Aso, don't forget that you might want some sort of a captcha on that form, even if it's just a text query intended to prevent only the dumbest of automated spam postings.
 
@MichaelHampton - it is on shared hosting. That was my original issue mentioned with allowing a 3rd party server access.
 
@TheCleaner In that case, you have bigger problems :)
 
besides last fall when our site hosted viagra ads and links to porn sites for 24 hours?
:)
 
@TheCleaner Yeah, things like that. And even if you implement this two-POST approach, some other user on that host could theoretically read your code and start sending you fake data.
 
10:19 PM
@TheCleaner It's really simple. Don't put business logic or database passwords anywhere on your shared external web server.
 
@MilesErickson - I think that last line is the one I'll copy/paste into my "get out of jail free" emails I keep for future reference. :)
 
@TheCleaner TL;DR: Your company has outgrown shared web hosting, and it's time to bring the web site under closer control.
 
That too.
 
We are a 400MM/year company, with 6 global sites and one netadmin/sysadmin (me). But I'll bring up the "outgrown" statement as well.
 
Jeebus.
You should have been off shared hosting years ago.
 
10:24 PM
@MilesErickson So about your trip, are you going completely round the world
 
@WesleyDavid That be the plan.
 
@WesleyDavid You look different hissss
 
@TheCleaner If you need hosting, we can help you.
 
@MilesErickson Kewl. Must be nice to be able to leave for that long!
 
@JoelESalas He's getting younger, to make up for my absence in the handsome department.
 
10:25 PM
And you'll be on HP gear :)
 
@MilesErickson - is your situation similar to a buddy of mine? He used to work 6 months contract and then take off somewhere overseas for 6 months. Single, traveled, worked if he felt like it (remote programming contracts). Or is this a whole family thing?
 
They featured your office on the website?
 
@JoelESalas Yes, that is exactly what our office looks like.
 
@ewwhite - thanks...I think right now it is through a local firm that "puts" it on a server with Rackspace.
 
@TheCleaner Sadly, I am becoming newly single. Wife wants kids yesterday, I'm not ready, and all the compromises we tried on didn't fly.
 
10:27 PM
@ewwhite I meant your personal office :D
 
I will keep your site info and get back to you
 
@MilesErickson Not even a puppy??
 
@JoelESalas My, oh, my, has that been tried.
 
@MilesErickson - sorry to hear that. Genuinely.
 
@MilesErickson We did puppy... I'm not sure I'm ready for more yet.
 
10:28 PM
@TheCleaner It's a sad story, but we remain friends and we remain in love. Bittersweet crazy, that, considering I know a lot of people who have fallen out of love and stayed married.
 
why didn't you feel ready for children?
 
@ewwhite - is that the company you work for? I don't know if I want to host on a site using HP servers that can't reboot. ;)
6
 
@TheCleaner LOL!
 
@ewwhite Mostly context (where we live) and availability; if I'm going to be a father, I want to be the best one I possibly can be. Doing important things halfway isn't how I roll.
 
@MilesErickson - I read you wrong...still sad for you, but I read it as the wife wants "custody" of the kids as of yesterday. I'm also guessing you don't literally mean yesterday.
 
10:32 PM
@TheCleaner Oh, I should post a solution...
 
@ewwhite I think the only "ready" needed is to be prepared for kids to take over the #1 spot on your priority list, and stay there for many years.
 
@TheCleaner Your new interpretation is better. We are talking sacred sperm and eggs here, not pre-born progeny.
 
@MilesErickson I'm sorry for what you're going through. I hope your impending tour will be good.
 
@Ward and I wonder what's wrong with me for not being ready like that
 
@Ward Yup. That's exactly what I'm not ready for.
 
10:33 PM
I don't know whether to think it was a good chat day or that I should get back to work
 
@MilesErickson Will you be poppin gin from time to time?
 
@TheCleaner I think you won the internet.
 
@WesleyDavid I didn't realize that it came in pill form.
2
 
@ewwhite You like having privilege and means?
 
@TheCleaner You're going to have to beat my record of 7 of 10 messages on the star wall.
 
10:35 PM
@JoelESalas Wife's clock is ticking.
 
@MichaelHampton 10 - I only see 7
 
@Iain Get a larger screen?
 
kids are great for some, not for others, and some just aren't quite ready. Sorry that it takes divorce in your case to be the solution. Everyone's situation is unique so don't let people judge or criticize what you and your wife are choosing to do.
 
@MichaelHampton >1024 ?
 
@Iain Yeah, the rest of us see 10 messages on the star wall.
 
10:38 PM
@TheCleaner I fully endorse the fuck-the-police thug-life approach
 
@TheCleaner Oh, we're not. Nor are we letting people take sides or criticize the other. We have given this our absolute best effort at resolution, and neither one of us is angry.
@TheCleaner We're just very, very sad.
 
@MichaelHampton 7 is sufficient raving thank you
 
Understand @MilesErickson - don't know you from Adam but hopefully this trip will bring about what you are looking to get out of it, even if it is just to get away.
 
Kids - best if you can give them back.
 
@Iain Just so long as you don't try to show them back in the womb, or they start throwing words like "pedophile" and "sex offender" around.
 
10:45 PM
honestly, we love our kids. Never felt a "love" quite like it. I love my wife and always put her above our kids, but 8 years ago when our first was born I realized what it meant when someone said they would kill someone if they ever harmed their kid.
 
@MilesErickson so that's why you're taking time away?
 
@TheCleaner It kind of pisses me off when a friend is like "Omg I love my kids so much". I'm like "I've known you for years, you barely met this kid. Where are MY hugs and kisses"
 
crap... a wildcard cert will not work on a sub-subdomain will it...
 
@MattBear If it's *.domain.tld and you want to do mail.domain.tld then yes it will work
 
if its issued for *.company.com, it wont work in sub.sub.company.com
 
10:50 PM
Oh and...
1
A: HP ProLiant DL360 G7 hangs at "Power and Thermal Calibration" screen

ewwhiteSo, after bringing a third system into the mix, and experiencing the same issue, we began to question the environment. I dug up a copy of the HP ProLiant Servers Troubleshooting Guide and found the POST problems flowchart shown below. Carefully running through the steps in the chart, we realiz...

 
@JoelESalas - lol, well it is flesh and blood, plus they don't have to support you for 18 years :) . It's a very strange internal "knowing" somehow with your kids. I can't quite explain it, and I know plenty that have no kids and I don't look down on them for not having any, it was just right for us.
 
@JoelESalas For me, that depends on the hotness of the friend in question.
 
@MilesErickson And I'm back. Are you coming to the states as part of your trip? Coming near the Phoenix Arizona area?
 
@ewwhite glad you got to the bottom of this one, serves you right for using non-HP crap though ;)
 
@Chopper3 So during my flu I vomited all over and crapped myself. I thought of what you have to put up with every day.
Know that some strange American kid was thinking of you with steaming crap in his pants.
4
 
10:56 PM
@Chopper3 Well, SOHO shit attached to his servers.
 
@WesleyDavid Nominee, best quote starred out of context, 2013 :-)
 
@WesleyDavid I've done a lot more of the latter than the former to be honest, almost permanently super nauseous, but I've only been sick maybe a dozen times in 9 weeks+, whereas I'm on the loo at least an hour a day
 
@ewwhite - interesting. So the KVM connects to the RILOE board (I'm assuming that's the Lights out board, haven't used one of their servers since Compaq in the 90s) instead of the normal video on the back/mainboard? Does the RILOE not have the ability to get a console video via IP (basically remote KVM)? Just curious why the KVM doesn't plug simply into the mainboard.
 
@TheCleaner well, that's outdated... but it gave me the idea to check our KVM
 
@ewwhite Have you left orders to burn all the SOHO junk before your next trip back?
 
10:59 PM
@ewwhite Correct. Can't focus on work. Not interested in getting paid to be less than the best at what I do.
@WesleyDavid I have no plans specific to the USA, but if I come to Phoenix we can pop some gin.
 
@MilesErickson Like all the kewl kids.
 
Gotcha. well that's good. We/I use Raritan kvm's but they rarely get touched. Typically I just remote into the IBM IMM on the server if I need to see the "console". Regardless, glad you guys thought of checking it.
 
@WesleyDavid (I actually am about as non-alcoholic as sysadmins come... last time I had alcohol was September if I recall correctly.)
 
@MilesErickson You need some qmail in your life
 
@Chopper3 Point of curiosity: Here in WA, a lot of chemo patients swear by (legalized) medical marijuana. Do they offer that over there?
@voretaq7 That would do it.
 
11:03 PM
@MilesErickson No, not a chance, wouldn't want it anyway
@MilesErickson besides, today was the first day of cycle 4 of 6 - I'm past the half-way point - I'm fucking it right :)
 
@@mdmarra - Time to fix the mess you made!
 
@MilesErickson Actually, me too. Never really been into it - maybe sip a beer once in a great while. I'm more into getting crazy with green tea.
 
@WesleyDavid Holy hell, we'll get along great.
 
@MilesErickson We'll brew a nice Kagoshima.
 
11:09 PM
@WesleyDavid It's a plan. And anyway, I've got family in Prescott.
@Chopper3 Well... you have our respect. If I'm ever stricken with 24/7 nausea, I might ask to borrow your attitude.
 
@MichaelHampton Freakin' Zedler... I've met him.
 
@RyanRies Is he as much of a nutjob as he seems there?
 
@MichaelHampton There's something wrong with our country when an idea like that no longer gets someone hung for treason, shot in the genitals, or both.
 
@MichaelHampton Unfortunately pretty much all the politicians here are
@MichaelHampton We have important shit to worry about and the old man can't get his mind off strippers.
 
11:20 PM
Seattle is having a bad week for spontaneous combustion of vehicles. First, we find out that Boeing has been shipping the 787 with gigantic Lithium-Ion batteries -- you know, even though they're so dangerous that small ones aren't allowed in checked baggage -- and that the passengers and crew were lucky the battery went up on the ground. And then this morning we find out that our commuter buses have a similar feature.
 
@MilesErickson shrug They're not actually dangerous. Just another bullshit rule we get to put up with because we put lawyers and bureaucrats in charge of the world, rather than into dog food, like we should have.
 
@HopelessN00b They are so safe that the FAA has a training video on extinguishing in-flight laptop fires...
 
I've never seen them catch fire, just rupture somewhat violently
 
@MilesErickson Yeah, government agency has overly-paranoid safety video. I'm shocked.
 
11:37 PM
@RyanRies Have you seen any rupture at an altitude of ~35,000 feet? You know the boiling point of water is much lower. The reaction of other things might be different to in the case of a pressure loss.
 
@Zoredache That can be calculated though
 
@Zoredache I'm sure... I don't know enough about the materials and the batteries to really comment
 
@JoelESalas right, so? Perhaps the FAA has an overly paranoid video because some engineer did a worst cast analysis, add some wiggle room for safety.
They decided the risk was non-zero so they developed a worst-case video.
 
@Zoredache All I know is, I need to see a youtube video of a laptop exploding in a low-pressure environment before I can be sure.
 
@Zoredache But to your specific comment, the boiling point of water in a pressurized cabin would be roughly the same as it is at sea level.
Cabin pressure in a jet is roughly atmospheric pressure
 
11:42 PM
Okay, and the first 2 minutes of
the video show a laptop spontaneously combusting in an airport terminal.
 
@RyanRies Except in some emergency scenario where things get really bad, pressure is lost, and they might need people to to respond correctly?
 
@Zoredache ya
 
Not to mention that the 787 battery issue came to light because one just had a catastrophic battery fire, fortunately after landing.
 
And I'm not arguing that batteries can spontaneously combust. We know that they can
And I don't know, but I Would not be surprised if the changing pressures of transcontinental flight exacerbated that behavior in some way.
 
@MilesErickson They might need to exaggerate the danger a bit to make people remember.
 
11:46 PM
Anyway, laptop batteries are scary and they could hurt a handful of people if they explode. On the other hand, batteries large enough to be powering major aircraft systems are likely large enough to take out major aircraft systems.
 
@MilesErickson And sitting right on top of my crotch is exactly where I want that battery to be...
 
@RyanRies You'd notice that there's a problem before it combusts or explodes. 350 is pretty hot.
 
Uughh I hate not being to edit tweets
 
@RyanRies That's the beauty of Twitter, right?
 
@MilesErickson Yeah I guess so, no takebacks
Twitter + Alcohol = DANGER
 
11:52 PM
@r.tanner.f Hmm. How many floppies are there in a truckload, and how many truckloads would it take to reach one and a half million?
@r.tanner.f Be sure to remind him to test the restore procedure when he's finished.
 
@MilesErickson Bah, restore tests are for SAs who don't have minions anyway.
 
lol that was going to SU but hey: I just had a user try to back up 2GB on floppy disks. I love my job. I love my job. I love my job...
 
Ah, Wikipedia says passenger jet cabin pressure at cruising altitude is closer to the air pressure of ~8000 ft
Which still is pretty low
Nah, that's wrong
 
@r.tanner.f And he stopped after he choked to death on the floppy disks you made him eat?
 
Denver is only 5k ish feet :(
 
11:55 PM
@r.tanner.f At 3 minutes per disk, assuming no breaks and a 2088-hour work year, it takes your user only 4 work years to complete the backup. It's static data, I presume?
 
@MilesErickson haha, yes. I'll have to inform the user.
@HopelessN00b If I choked users for such things, my hands would be too sore to drive home by the end of the day.
 
@r.tanner.f That's why I wear a belt. Easier on the hands when it comes time to kill someone.
 
@r.tanner.f It's worth noting that your user also could store 2GB of data in Amazon Glacier for about 25 cents per year... which means that in the four years it would take to back up to floppies, you would pay roughly the cost of a single floppy.
 
@MilesErickson Actually, I mentioned that. She was trying to figure out what to backup with if she couldn't use disks.
 
@r.tanner.f In all seriousness, why not buy a 2TB USB drive, copy the data to it, and drop that in a firesafe?
 
11:59 PM
@HopelessN00b 'cause it's 2 gigabytes of data. If she's going to put it in a safe, it might as well be on a $5 USB drive.
 

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