TRPG General Chat

nitsua60

12:05 AM

also...

Night gathers, and now my watch begins....

MikeQ

For the night is bark and full of terriers.

2

Swear it by the old dogs and the new.

Miniman

12:24 AM

@nitsua60 Night gathers'n, my wand cow hats begin.

nitsua60

12:58 AM

I left my 7 year-old in the car for a moment while I fetched my 9 year-old from a friend's house today. We sat down and buckled as she said "Koalas are dying in crazy numbers, their habitat's being ruined by wildfires. I heard it on the radio."
Which is to say: how're things down south?

Miniman

@nitsua60 Everything is very much on fire right now.

nitsua60

Fingertips (1 - Everything Is Catching on Fire)

►

(For those who know the suite: that's just #1 there, not all 19-or-whatever.)

Miniman

Things are fine for me personally, though. I mean, not counting the haze of smoke hanging over everything.

How about you? Less fire, I hope?

nitsua60

Two snow days yesterday and today.

(Which equals two days I was expecting to get lotsa work done but instead was home with three kids....)

Should be doing now, but I've stalled a bit the last ten minutes.

Gonna push ten more, then go home to re-start another push.

Miniman

1:15 AM

Hmmm, snow. Snow. Nope, can't say I recognize that one.

BESW

We had a storm last week, took out a lot of banana trees.

MikeQ

Was it a wind storm or monkey storm?

BESW

It was Tropical Storm Kammuri.

trogdor

Banana trees are kinda weak though right?

I don't think that storm broke basically anything sturdier than that

BESW

1:31 AM

They're usually the first to go, yeah, but the farmers lost more than they expected.

trogdor

Fair enough

Still not great to be sure

BESW

I talked with the Farm-to-Table people yesterday. They also lost all their leafy greens.

trogdor

Huh

Really?

Man I didn't think we had been hit all that hard

Was it all the rain?

It was a lot more than we usually get

Or are they easily ripped out of the ground by wind or something?

BESW

Yeah, I think so. Apparently the protective canopies collapsed on the lettuces.

I'm guessing it was the weight of the rain that made the canopies fail.

But also if leafy greens get too wet, they can get ruined that way too.

trogdor

That's what I was thinking

The Oracle

1:41 AM

1

Q: Trying to contact Red Orca for permission to print an answer in a book

I apologize in advance for breaking protocol. I'm just looking to get an official okay on rewriting and publishing Red Orca's answer in this thread in an upcoming book about Magic Items. I looked for alternative ways to contact them but fell short. It's an incredible answer and I'd love to make i...

discussion

trogdor

I sort of doubt they are as easily knocked down by wind as banana trees

Banana trees are kinda notoriously unsturdy from what I understand

Hot RPG Questions

6

Q: Is Absorb Elements cast before or after a save? Is it cast before or after damage?

I was wondering where on "the stack" I can cast Absorb Elements. Is it when I get targeted, when I get hit, after I fail a save, or after the damage is rolled?

dnd-5e spells reactions resistance

V2Blast

2:08 AM

9 hours ago, by Xirema

@MikeQ Okay. My questions have been resolved.

14th unofficial site motto?

nitsua60

2:24 AM

@V2Blast Looks like we're done here, folks. Grab your stuff, clean out the fridge. Last one, get the lights?

V2Blast

2:40 AM

:D

KorvinStarmast

3:03 AM

@MikeQ our latest tunnels and trolls session died. One new player told the DM "not the kind of group I want to play in" and I suspect it had to do with the other new player who went sort of chaotic/murder hobo during the last session. (Gratuitous killing of wolves in a lair when we had a different quest that I'd been leading for three sessions). sigh.

@doppelgreener Ooh, that sounds like a possible Chatizens evening. @Mike@ @Shalvenay @V2Blast @trogdor

@nitsua60 If "south" includes Texas, I got to spend 3.5 days of Thanksgiving weekend with granddaughter and daughter and son-in-law - and a ton of his relatives. Mrs Starmast was in heaven, with little one in her arms. Good vibes. We are not on fire. Drive home friday towards san antonio was in fog and rain for seven hours

V2Blast

5:26 AM

@KorvinStarmast Oof, that is unfortunate

Miniman

6:19 AM

Random question for chat: what does everyone else see as the distinction between homebrew and houserules?

Personally, I've always taken houserules as alterations to existing content, where homebrew is new content.

But I don't really have a basis for that beyond "it just seems obvious".

BESW

That's my general impression, yeah, based on how I see it used.

But I've reached the point where those words don't seem useful for my own play. I like "drift," myself.

kviiri

Yeah, I use it similarly, although I don't really tend towards very precise definitions where they aren't needed

MikeQ

It's probably subjective depending on which language and system the players use. It gets into fuzzy semantics territory.

Folks have said that homebrew is a subset of houserules, while others say that houserules are a subset of homebrew, or that they're mutually exclusive. None of these views are really wrong.

kviiri

6:36 AM

What's the origin on "house rules" as a term? Gambling?

Hot RPG Questions

6:49 AM

4

Q: Can I play a pure Ur-Priest?

I mean, of course I can do anything the DM allows, etc. But is there a rules-as-written sequence of events that ends with a character with only Ur-Priest levels? I.e. ECL = Ur-Priest class level. I have been playing with this question as a sort of puzzle for the past few months, and haven’t fou...

dnd-3.5e optimization prestige-class

BESW

Or a pure-ur priest-iest?

kviiri

Purpurest purveyor of pure Ur-Priests

doppelgreener

10:54 AM

@kviiri Merriam-Webster claims that specific term's first known use was in 1947, fwiw, but doesn't specify what context it was in

but yeah we've had the concept of house rules for a long time before TTRPGs: a rule we make here in this place that only applies here

to me homebrew is just new content, doesn't necessarily require any house rules

kviiri

Yeah, eg. a setting can be homebrew.

doppelgreener

Those terms have a lot of significance in D&D and there's a lot of utility in splitting them—bringing new content is not making the game work differently in D&D

they don't have much relevance to any games I've been playing recently

Someone_Evil

If it is homebrew rules then you're probably looking a new (or replacement) subsystem

kviiri

I kinda agree although I need to add the stipulation that there might still not be a very clear boundary between a ruling, a house-rule and homebrew in all cases.

Someone_Evil

I agree that they bleed over into each-other, but it is still useful to distinguish them (when possible)

doppelgreener

11:00 AM

Oh you're right, homebrew rules systems would be both content and making it work differently lols

BESW

@doppelgreener I did some digging into Google's ngrams to see if I could track it down, but there's way too many examples of House Rule as a legal term for a protocol in a House of Representatives, and also "house. Rule" sentence combinations.

kviiri

I personally would categorize "ruling" into something that applies for a rather particular situation, is usually made ad hoc or that merely fills in a gap in an existing rule. House-rule is something formal enough that it can be presented in the table outside that specific situation and it still makes sense.

BESW

For TTRPG-specific purposes, I wind up wondering at what point the distinction between a house-ruled game of D&D 5e, and a D&D 5e-inspired game we made up ourselves, becomes r🐘.

Someone_Evil

That feels like a top-down versus bottom-up distinction, if those terms are familiar.

House-ruling is going from 'bulk D&D' to the game you're actually playing, whereas the other you are 'building up' the game your playing inspired by/taking the pieces you want from that material

I find the idea of 'bulk, unrefined D&D' oddly charming, so at least I amused myself with that outburst

vicky_molokh

@Someone_Evil Would you call it 'raw D&D'? ^_^

Someone_Evil

11:15 AM

I feel like I walked into that one

BESW

@Someone_Evil That feels kinda like a distinction without a difference.

Someone_Evil

Do you start by assuming any one piece is in the game, or out?

BESW

What does the design process matter, for the people playing the result?

Someone_Evil

How you describe it to them. Do you explain what the differences are, or do you explain it as a new system

kviiri

11:32 AM

I think there's a quite significant difference between a game where I can trust that the rules in the book are valid until confirmed otherwise, and a game where there is a book full of rules but the GM won't tell you which are used until it's the time

KorvinStarmast

@Miniman this houserules is alterations to existing content, where homebrew is new content seems to be how it is used and how I understand it.

doppelgreener

11:58 AM

When I said this was of particular significance to D&D, I said that in part because of how the community fixates and categorises things (e.g. house rules OK, homebrew not OK because it's always broken and overly powerful, oh hey look at this new official class that came out I'm sure it's completely balanced and fair and has no rules issues at all)

Once you leave the scope of a handful of games, those concepts become less relevant

e.g. there's no homebrewing in fate, there's just adjusting and customising it to fit your needs, and that's totally normal usage so it doesn't have a special word.

BESW

Yeah, a lot of the assumptions about the nature of systems and modifications to systems, just... don't really apply... to my experiences outside of directly D&D-like spaces.

Like, I'm thinking about using InSpectres as a chassis for an Amaterasu reboot, but it'd probably still use a lot of Fate mechanics and philosophy.

doppelgreener

homebrew doesn't have a quality stigma that I'm aware of in PBTA games I've played, instead you just have custom playbooks and they're often a lot of fun. make your own custom playbook if you like, let's see how it goes. (it's hard but it's good, and often people share the results online if it works out well.)

Someone_Evil

How much do you think that would change if a bunch of people posted untested playbooks?

BESW

Bubblegumshoe has "drifts," which D&D would probably call campaign settings, but they're more fundamental than that term generally implies--yet still very much Bubblegumshoe. Misspent Youth's "Sell Out With Me" supplement calls its material "settings" but many of them are so dramatically different that you'd barely recognize them as the same game except for a couple of core mechanics.

@Someone_Evil That happens all the time.

There are more than 350 playbook items on DTRPG alone, many of which have multiple playbooks in the same item. They're starting to pile up on itch.io as well, and many many more are available and compiled on non-store websites.

Someone_Evil

But a quality stigma has not grown up around them (from what I gather). I'm failing to see a fundamental difference between the two categories (and a lot of the positives mentioned for playbooks can also be applied to D&D homebrew), so I can only assume it's a matter of community attitudes? (not trying to argue, as much as learn/understand)

BESW

12:13 PM

Have you played any AWE games?

Carcer

is there an argument that PBtA is a system where mechanical balance is not nearly so much an overriding concern as it is in something like D&D?

Someone_Evil

@BESW What is AWE in this context? (that's a no obviously)

Carcer

I would have guessed that the primary issue people usually have with D&D homebrew content is that it's poorly balanced, but that's only relevant because D&D is a system where that mechanical balance is a quite dominant concern

BESW

Apocalypse World Engine. When people talk about games like Dungeon World being "Powered by the Apocalypse" (PbtA), they mean that the games are built on the system engine used by the game Apocalypse World.

doppelgreener

@Someone_Evil there's a lot of ideas and connotations attached to "homebrew". When I say "I made a homebrew feat for D&D", that sends chills down the spine. When I say "I wrote a new stunt for my fate character", that's just, okay, sure, that's how playing the game works, awesome, let's see it.

BESW

12:16 PM

And yes, that's kinds where I'm going too, @Carcer. D&D communities tend to care a lot more about numerical combat/utility "balance" between characters and character options.

A lot of other TTRPG communities care about other stuff a lot more.

Carcer

I would apportion some of that to the nature of the system as well as the community but yes

BESW

@Carcer Absolutely yes, but pre-3.x D&D, and to some extent 5e, have more room in the systems for balance taking a back seat.

vicky_molokh

I wonder what 'D&D-like' should even mean in this context. D20 games? Dungeon-delving games? All traditional games? (IME, to take a traditional but non-D20 example, the GURPS community is full of homebrew stuff, particularly magic-related and other subsystems, and the community seems to treat that just fine.)

BESW

I'm on a dev Discord server where the conversations about mechanics tend to be about the experience the mechanics create at the table, what kind of story choices mechanics push, whether a mechanic's required materiel make the game less approachable, whether mechanics can be made thematic or diegetic.

Carcer

@BESW my personal take on 3.5e/5e wouldn't necessarily be that balance is less important in 5e than 3.5e but that balance is easier in 5e than 3.5, at least so far

but then I grew up playing 3e so that was pretty formative on how I interpret roleplaying games

BESW

12:25 PM

@Carcer 5e is also a lot louder, in the text, about giving explicit permission for individual groups to throw balance out the window if they find it more fun that way.

Carcer

good point

3.5 just buried balance under an avalanche of splatbooks

kviiri

12:44 PM

@Carcer Mechanical balance is much less of a concern in Apocalypse World and its direct offshoots, yeah. That doesn't mean it's completely absent and that there isn't other kinds of balance to respect.

BESW

A lot of the elements in PbtA playbooks are of a nature that "balance" in the D&D sense isn't just impossible, but nonsensical.

kviiri

^ That's a good way to put it

Apocalypse World has a clearly defined list of things it intends to accomplish, as a game. Therefore the primary concern of homebrew rules (eg. custom-made moves) is whether they serve or oppose those principles.

DnD doesn't have a clearly defined list of things it intends to accomplish, but it usually involves some relatively mechanically rigid combat, so usually homebrew is assessed based on its combat balance.

BESW

And each playbook is judged to be effective based on its ability to add the story beats and aesthetic experience of its chosen archetype to the game being played.

kviiri

Yes

A lot of our DnD homebrew evaluation question answers could be totally wrong because the asker wasn't thinking of combat and instead was looking for a campaign where 90% of everything is resolved with Animal Handling checks, who knows! :)

BESW

For example, the Paladin has a special move when they order an NPC around by invoking their divine authority, which causes the NPC to obey, flee, or attack, depending on the outcome of the associated roll. No other PC has that ability, they're likely to need to use the generic Parley move which requires that the PC have leverage and the NPC is likely to expect something in exchange.

This means that when the paladin is in the game, the "Paladins order people around and it causes trouble" story beat is liable to show up.

kviiri

1:00 PM

Yeah. I think Apocalypse World is even more liberal in its handing out of plot hooks for characters at chargen, although some playbooks go without.

BESW

I'm not very familiar with AW itself. I've played a few sessions of DW and MotW.

In Monster of the Week, the Monstrous playbook treats being able to move through solid objects as "balanced" with +1 to natural attacks, mind control, self-healing, or immortality, among others.

kviiri

The first one that springs to mind is Maestro'd, a playbook whose shtick is that they own and run a leisure establishment that can be anything from the fanciest restaurant to Mos Eisley plus opium. As a part of chargen, they need to specify three people: one they owe for their establishment, one who wants in on it, and one who wants it gone. They also must specify their best and worst regular.

BESW

It's all about "what kind of monster are you?"

kviiri

Similarly, Hardholders and Hocuses get to specify how their holdings/cults fall apart in duress, the Chopper gets to specify how their gang tends to attract enemies, etc.

BESW

Yeah, MotW's characters get things like "oh yeah, I've got a crew of NPCs that'll do pretty much anything for me" or "I cannot die until my destiny (to be determined with the GM) is fulfilled."

kviiri

1:11 PM

I should try MotW when I have the time

BESW

I found it very frustrating as an entry point into PbtA, but a lot of people think it's one of the best introductory PbtA games, so... [shrug]

kviiri

I often find myself at odds with "lots of people" :)

BESW

To be fair, I've concluded that I came to PbtA far too late in my evolution away from D&D for it to be the paradigm-shifting kick in the pants that it is for so many people.

kviiri

It totes was one for me

BESW

By the time I played MotW, as a GM it was a lot of rules to make sure I did stuff I was going to do anyway.

doppelgreener

1:29 PM

IIRC we had someone else took a look at MotW for us, and they concluded it is pretty bad at explaining how to play PBTA, and instead is basically just talking about how it gets played in a way that only people who already understand PBTA would understand what it means

KorvinStarmast

@doppelgreener recursion without a start point?

kviiri

I still hope I'll get that proper start with Fate at some point, although I'm quite happy within the PbtA box too

And I've been quite happy focusing on board games over TTRPG's too

doppelgreener

@KorvinStarmast i haven't read the parts in question, but it's the kind of explanation you only fully understand if you already know exactly what it means, is what I recall. compare that to Apocalypse World or Dungeon World which actually fully explain so that anyone will get it.

doppelgreener

1:51 PM

Oh! Another thing I've been playing recently with some folks: Henshin: A Sentai RPG. To decode that for people not already familiar with Super Sentai, you're basically playing the Power Rangers. It's a diceless Powered by the Apocalypse game. It's fun! It's got some faults, but it's fun.

You can play Red, Blue, Green, Black, Yellow, or Pink. You pick a name, and you're that color ranger, and you have a weapon, a suit of armor of some sort, and a mech.

And you can combine your weapons for an ultimate attack, and you can combine your mechs for an ultimate mech. All the staples.

All the playbooks have Tasks. They're general guidelines for roleplaying points you should aim at. For example, the Green Ranger has tasks like "show that one size fits all", or "demonstrate what you've learned from somebody else", or "throw experience and ineptitude at a problem to see what sticks". If you're not sure what to do, look at your tasks and play into them as hard as you can.

The Black Ranger on the other hand has tasks like "defend others at any cost". Everyone's Tasks are different.

One of the game's faults is that Tasks are the absolute most important part of any character — they are the thing you should be looking at, especially to determine what character you want to play — but the character sheets don't say this and hardly draw any attention to the Tasks at all. They're presented alongside some other sections which only sometimes get referenced and look just like them.

Tasks aren't a fault, they're great. Just the presentation is a fail.

Rubiksmoose

@doppelgreener Whoa! How does diceless PbtA work?

(also it sounds legit awesome)

doppelgreener

@Rubiksmoose Through a fate point-like currency, in this one. You have a list of Moves: they are Special, Heavy, Medium, or Light moves.

Light moves cause problems and set you back: for example, one of Red's moves (IIRC) is to rush into danger without any company; one of Green's moves is to run in unprepared and put someone else in harm's way. However, all Light moves give you a token.

Rubiksmoose

That's really neat.

doppelgreener

Heavy moves cost a token but help you resolve problems. Everyone has a Heavy move to summon their armor and weapon. Green has a Heavy move to somehow deal an unlikely perfect hit.

Medium moves help move things forward and don't take or give tokens.

Rubiksmoose

Interesting, so there's really no randomiser then?

doppelgreener

2:01 PM

No randomiser at all.

Rubiksmoose

Neat. That reminds me a bit of GSS actually.

doppelgreener

Every character has a unique Special move which does something out of the box: Green's is "When you take an opportunity to prove what you've learned to someone else, they receive a token."

Oh, and there's Squad Turns, which represent everyone acting together in unison. They're things like joining together to confront danger, unleashing your Ultimate Attack, or unleashing your mechs' Ultimate Form.

Rubiksmoose

:D

@doppelgreener I freaking love how PbtA goes out of its way to encourage RP like this.

doppelgreener

We actually keep forgetting about the Special Turns and the Squad Turns. I'm sure there's a design lesson in there for the character sheets.

Rubiksmoose

Now, does the GM get spent point? Or is it all player-side?

doppelgreener

2:04 PM

@Rubiksmoose Me too! I've been playing Green and it's so, so fun. The game just tells me "hey, be the unprepared one that causes trouble through just being really bad at everything" and I am so down for it.

@Rubiksmoose GM doesn't have any points that I'm aware of.

Rubiksmoose

@doppelgreener Interesting. I wonder what the GM guidance on moves looks like then. Maybe it is based entirely on what the players choose.

doppelgreener

Moreover, the game doesn't need to respond to players rolling a 6- because the Light moves are themselves the invitation for the GM to throw things their way.

There's a natural flow: the GM presents problems. The players need points, so they take Light moves which complicate things and help the problems develop further. Then the players can take Heavy moves, which help them address some of the newer problems they created as well as addressing and changing the original problem.

Rubiksmoose

@doppelgreener That makes sense.

@doppelgreener That's really good to hear. I've never actually played PbtA as a player. But as a DM those kinds of things are like a nice warm RP safety-net trampoline that really feels like the system is supporting and encouraging the things that should be happening. I love it.

@doppelgreener That's...kind of genius honestly.

And you say it seems to be fun in practice?

STT LCU

Hi folks, quick Q: I have a paladin with the sentinel feat that is in "base contact" with a NPC foe. The NPC takes the disengage action but my attack of opportunity stops him from fleeing. At this point the master said that since the foe didn't move, he's free to use his action to do something else (in this case, cast Burning Hands). Based on my understanding of the rules, that sounds wrong to me (and unfair, too). What's the correct interpretation here?

Carcer

if he took the disengage action that was his action and he's done

KorvinStarmast

2:14 PM

He already took his action. Unless he can take a reaction to cast burning hands, the NPC has to wait until the next turn to use burning hands. DM needs to review the action economy.

Carcer

the GM could retroactively declare he didn't take that action after all since he knew you'd still be able to hit him but that's pretty cheap

doppelgreener

@Rubiksmoose Red is meanwhile meant to be the leader and the central character; they're good at charging ahead and pushing things forward, then sharing the spotlight they claim with other characters. Black is meant to be the team guardian, looking out for when others are in danger and helping them or rescuing people, etc.

Carcer

I would've just judged that was a learning experience and now the enemy knows that trying disengage will not help them get away from you

but they don't retroactively get their action back.

doppelgreener

@Rubiksmoose It's fun! We're new to the system and we're shaky with it, we've only played two sessions and we're not yet used to taking squad actions or special turns, and it only clicked for us last session how damn important Tasks are.

Like midway through the first session we noticed them and thought "hmm, these seem sorta important", and midway through the second we realised "wow these are absolutely important for basically every single thing we do".

goodguy5

as everyone else has said.

The enemy had to take the disengage action to find out that you could still hit him, so the action is burned.

doppelgreener

2:21 PM

I'd compare Tasks to being a bit like Lady Blackbird's Keys, if you've played that one.

Someone_Evil

@STTLCU D&D 5e, presumably? (if you look around you you will see different systems being discussed, and it's always better to get an answer for the system you are playing)

STT LCU

yes @Someone_Evil, it's 5e, my bad

I let it go after a brief chat at the table, but I aim to bring it back next time. Sentinel is a key part of my character, and it's a little disappointing to see it nerfed like that

Rubiksmoose

@doppelgreener Ooooh! I've played one session of it (and would love to do more) but that does click.

Gwideon

hello

doppelgreener

o/

Hot RPG Questions

2:37 PM

9

Q: What is homebrew? Should I use it in normal games?

I keep on hearing about homebrew in D&D and I was just wondering what it meant.

dungeons-and-dragons homebrew terminology

Rubiksmoose

@STTLCU That seems reasonable.

Gwideon

how is everyone

Someone_Evil

@STTLCU What that NPC a goblin, monk, or rogue, then they would have been able to disengage with their bonus action. (You DM should then have told they could and did that, especially if you noted on it)

NautArch

@STTLCU Totally reasonable to be upset. The enemy didn't 'know' before, but now they do. Having said that, i had a paladin with sentinel and there were quite often enemies that had the natural ability to not create OAs when moving away (or they'd teleport/misty step or something like).

Someone_Evil

There are also a lot of flying creatures with the flyby trait which negates a bunch of OA (and makes the owl familiar quite good)

STT LCU

2:45 PM

@Someone_Evil It was a wizard, and the DM explicitly said that it was going to use the disengage action (since it would have suffered 4 extra OAs from my allies), not any bonus or reaction.

@Someone_Evil but my other feat, polearm master, would have triggered an OA when the owl enters my reach :D

Someone_Evil

@STTLCU Correct, but they weren't an owl either. That was more a general discussion mention

goodguy5

@STTLCU keep in mind that you only get 1 reaction. I assume it was mentioned earlier, but still.

STT LCU

yeah yeah the owl was just a sidetrack distraction in the conversation. For the original topic, the wizard shouldn't have had any other action after the failed disengage

thanks folks :)

Someone_Evil

@STTLCU Then, based on what you have told us, they made an oopsie. If you take it up with them (which would be quite reasonable), do start from an assumption they made a genuine mistake in the heat of the moment. In my experience, DM-ing includes keeping track of about 15 things at once, and running a spellcaster is even worse, so losing track of actions for a moment is bound to happen. I at least, appreciate when my players are keeping a check on me, helps make the game fair

STT LCU

yes, I understand that DM'ing is hard, that's why I let it run for the session :) I'll gently bring it up with the dm before the next session

NautArch

3:01 PM

@STTLCU Just focus on this is how you've built your character. You don't expect it to always work, but the monsters should play it honestly as well. If they've never heard of you, then they'd have no reason to know disengage wouldn't work.

@nitsua60 I see you suspended one of the accounts. Did you want us to flag the related ones or are you aware and opting to leave unsuspended?

nitsua60

@NautArch We're aware of the five that were mentioned in comments to some of the questions. (Two by one name, three by another.) If you see more than that, please do flag.

NautArch

@nitsua60 Okay, I think that's it. Just wasn't sure about the suspension(s).

goodguy5

what about suspensions?

nm

wasn't paying super close attention and just saw the s-word

nitsua60

Just to try to constrain the proliferation and thereby (hopefully) make the merging easier on SE staff.

NautArch

@nitsua60 And my apologies for the flail snail thing yesterday. While I still feel that it shouldn't have been changed, I think i made a mountain out of a mole hill.

Tried to fix it this morning :)

But also a bit surprised that there really isn't another spell besides regenerate that...regenerates parts.

Someone_Evil

3:16 PM

There aren't a lot of effects that cause the loss of limbs, are there? If you haven't got a lot of sources, you don't need a lot of cures

NautArch

@Someone_Evil true. But weird for the flail snail to say "Healing magic that restores limbs, like regenerate" But not actually have other options besides regenerate. But I guess it's a 'just in case we make one' thing.

Someone_Evil

I think that's a just in case thing too. Same with the "magical shields aren't weapons unless their description says so" from a bit back. There are no such shield, but I now want to write one

nitsua60

@NautArch Didn't notice anything apology-necessary, but I'll take it and bank it =)

NautArch

@nitsua60 I just feel like sticking to policy may have done more harm than good. One of those everyone didn't act well circumstances.

OP could have easily just asked the new question, but I also could have relatively easily adapted my answer.

goodguy5

alright guys, stop being so polite. this isn't Canada. rough each other up over a minor misunderstanding or something.

Someone_Evil

3:24 PM

I've not seen "fight eachother IRL" before, that was new

NautArch

@Someone_Evil definitely!

Someone_Evil

4:06 PM

Design wise its a bit weird, because it very quickly turns into a weapon with a +2 to AC

NautArch

@Someone_Evil I don't think I'd turn a +2 shield into a +2 magic weapon.

It'd have to be a balance, and probability a rarity spike (more akin to how magic armor has more rarity than the equivalent bonus to weapons)

Someone_Evil

@NautArch That wasn't what I meant. If you have a shield that counts a weapon with an attack with a damage die of 1d6, it looks a lot like a mace which also gives you a +2 bonus to AC. (neither case has a bonus to attacks and damage)

NautArch

@Someone_Evil Ah, gotcha. Although it's a mace that takes an action to wield/drop.

But you're right. It's definitely got more upside.

Someone_Evil

Upside and downsides are one thing, I would want to design it so it still feels like a shield, which is quite tricky

NautArch

You could require that to attune to it you have to be able to either engage in Two-weapon fighting or have the tavern brawler feat for using improvised weapons.

Gwideon

4:16 PM

my mini's look like they came out pretty good

Xirema

@Gwideon Would you be able to post pictures? =3

NautArch

@Someone_Evil The animated shield does give you the AC bonus without requiring your hands at all (just as an example of a shield providing benefits without limitations)

Mr Mystery

I'm going to play D&D as twins who had their minds' merged. Any tips on playing two characters as a singular?

NautArch

@MrMystery Is it a single race/class, but just two personalities?

Xirema

@MrMystery Is the merged mind basically an amalgam of the two, or do they each take turns "piloting" the body as distinct identities?

Mr Mystery

4:19 PM

I've made them the Illithid race (or failed to turn) so it makes some sense

I'm thinking that it'll be a mix of the two, sometime they're one when they need to focus, other times they'll split when making decisions

Gwideon

@Xirema They're still going through the wash cause they where basically encased in support material.

NautArch

@Gwideon careful removing those struts. I'v definitely broken stuff on my self-prints.

Gwideon

@NautArch the 3d printer i'm using uses a soluble support material. you basically put them into a bath to dissolve away the support material. also I was wrong about it being a makerbot it's actually a Mojo printer.

NautArch

@Gwideon that is super cool!

So it'll dissolve the struts, but not the piece?

Gwideon

yep

Xirema

4:24 PM

@MrMystery My recommendation then is to give each of the twins stark, contrasting personalities, so that you have A) an easy way to distinguish them, B) an easy way to distinguish when they're basically "in-sync" with each other, and C) maximum chaos potential as a character.

Gwideon

@NautArch it takes longer than just removing the struts but it guarantees the piece won't be damaged.

NautArch

@MrMystery Can you clarify that it's just two personalities, but a single race/class?

Mr Mystery

@Xirema So make a black and white sort of pairing? I'm thinking if making it so that they talk out of the other ones mouth. E.g. Twin A could say something embarrassing and Twin B would say it but Twin A would also feel the embarrassment

@NautArch Of course! They are two humans who failed to turn into Illithids but gained some of the Illithids powers

Xirema

@MrMystery Blue and Red is the idiom I'm more familiar with, but yes.

NautArch

@MrMystery So you've got a homebrew illithid race you're using?

Mr Mystery

4:30 PM

@NautArch Yeah, basically. They just have the human stat block but with the Illithid mind powers.

NautArch

@MrMystery I'd just be wary of being My Guy with this.

Mr Mystery

@Xirema Thanks I like the idea of contrasting personalties. Perhaps I'll make one highly chaotic while the other tries to think before hand. I could put lawful/chaotic neutral in the alignment

NautArch

I'd very much consider having each personality written out, but maybe randomize when they come up. Roll dice each turn/each several turns, etc. for who is currently in control.

Someone_Evil

You have talked with your DM (and the rest of your group) about this, right? That should be the first step, before soliciting ideas from random people on the internet.

NautArch

^^

Mr Mystery

4:34 PM

@NautArch I'm getting a bit of leeway with my guys because the triplet is the big bad guy and I already wrote him up for the DM. He's new and asked for help so I set up the bad guy for him

NautArch

@MrMystery triplet?

Mr Mystery

@NautArch Yeah I didn't bother mentioning him becuase I'm not using him

NautArch

I'm a bit confused here. But either way, is everyone else at your table using homebrew races? What did you take away from the Human stat block and which illithid mind powers did you get?

Mr Mystery

He'll belong to the DM and can completely control my guys which is why they are TERRIFIED of him. He wasn't as immune to the illuthids as the younger two

MikeQ

If you're writing content and deciding what rules/options are playable at the table, but another player is running the game... who's actually the DM?

Mr Mystery

4:36 PM

Haha

This DM is usually a player with me

I got him into D&D and he wants to try his hand as the DM

kviiri

I knew it! We have a question somewhat similar to what you're describing

14

A: Can a character have two pasts?

Rules don't govern character personality Mechanically, issues relating to characters' personality and past are almost non-existent in DnD 5e: only race, class and to a lesser extent background are important. As long as you're ok implementing this concept without any extra skills or other mechani...

MikeQ

Ok. Do you think it might be easier for them to manage gameplay if you went as a mechanically simpler character, rather than one of these weird multiple-characters-in-one homebrew things?

Mr Mystery

I said I can't do any more for him

kviiri

Sorry, accidentally linked to my answer in there but well. it's recommended reading.

Hot RPG Questions

8

Q: If I drop a bag of of say 15 alchemist fire on giant and hits it will it take 15d4 of fire damage and so on?

While flying over a giant, I drop a bag containing 15 alchemist fire and hit them. Will the giant take 15d4 of fire damage and so on? Will the damage also be 15d4 for the following round?

dnd-5e damage equipment stacking

Mr Mystery

4:39 PM

@MikeQ Oh yeah, you might be right. I thought I would be handling the chracter completely but if it's his first time

kviiri

@HotRPGQuestions Well that's indeed a hot question.

@MrMystery Do you know what characters the others will be playing?

Mr Mystery

Puns

@kviiri Yeah, we have four players including me, not the DM, and a definite Vampire rogue. I know we'll have a barbarian but I'm not sure if that player has settled on half-orc or a were-bear. My group Is very much into homebrew which is what brought us together

Not completely sure on the last guy though, but looking on his past he'll probably be a spell chucker of sorts

kviiri

I'd advise doing this sort of brainstorming with your group

No matter how cool your character concept is, it can only really shine if it has buy-in and reciprocation from the rest of the players.

Mr Mystery

I've asked all of them about the twin mind but they've never done anything like it either. I was hoping to find someone here that's had experience playing that way but I did get some pretty good ideas and suggestions form others

Oh yeah, I wouldn't worry about that, we are all equally siked to see each other's characters in action. They know I want to do this but it's my job to pull it off

MikeQ

Yep. That player (the "DM") may have preferences for how much complexity and shenanigans they'll be expected to juggle. Will they need to account for the werebear and vampire effects, or can the individual players (controlling those characters) handle that themselves?

Mr Mystery

4:47 PM

We have a strict rule when bringing homebrew into game. BRING A RULE/SPELLBOOK. It makes everything sooo much easier, and gameplay is smoother when you don't need to search everything up constantly. Unless of course it's very simple.

Someone_Evil

Does your group care alot (or at all) about balance?

Yuuki

@MrMystery Seems like a bit of a hassle if all you want to do is show off your homemade limoncello and you have to look for a ruler as well.

kviiri

@MrMystery That's not exactly what I mean. There's a saying in Swahili: mtu ni watu, roughly meaning "a person is many people". We are largely defined not only by what we are, but what we are in relation to others, our interactions with them, the help we get from them and that we give them. It's much harder to get those interactions if everyone designs their characters on their own time and then tries to smash them together --- but of course not everyone cares (or has to care) about that

MikeQ

Ah I wasn't clear. I was asking more along the lines of... When these homebrew mechanics start activating in the game, who (among the players) actually does the cognitive workload of managing those effects? Because if that responsibility all falls on the DM, then it can be a lot to juggle, especially if the DM is inexperienced.

Mr Mystery

@Someone_Evil Haha, no not really but oh well, in a world where you can slay gods and screw dragons...

@MikeQ The DM will usually manage the effects but in this case we may just go a few rounds without applying before going into the main story, getting Tom ready for the onsluaght.

@kviiri I now it may seem odd, but my group is very chaotic, I think it's part of the charm. Take a mimmic and a mother bear turned into an elf. An unlikely duo that would probably kill each other. We, (my group) will understand this fact. We will REVEL in it. Choas is what makes my group the way it is. Definitely not for everyone!

NautArch

5:00 PM

Okay, I'm starting to get really frustrated with people changing questions after I've already put an answer up.

Mr Mystery

@NautArch, Oh sorry man! I didn't realise that I changed anything, but I did take your suggestions on board, they were very helpful!

Someone_Evil

Nov 21 at 19:27, by NautArch

damnit, i'm answering questions again. I said I wasn't going to that.

Mr Mystery

Haha, the past come to haunt

Someone_Evil

@MrMystery I think they were talking about questions and answers on main, not here in chat

Mr Mystery

Ah, oops

Kinda just inserted myself in there

Someone_Evil

5:05 PM

Don't worry about it. Perfectly reasonable to assume something is meant as part of the discussion it seems to be posted in. Especially if you don't know about the thing they are actually referring to ahead of time

Mr Mystery

o'-(u )>

David Coffron

Are there any 10-sided dice that are easier to turn to a specific side (no need to be symmetric or fair)?

Mr Mystery

@DavidCoffron Like a weighted die?

Someone_Evil

@DavidCoffron Like a d10 spindown?

David Coffron

@Someone_Evil I don't know what a spindown is...

Mr Mystery

5:09 PM

Haha, same buddy.

David Coffron

@MrMystery No, its for keeping score rather than for generating random numbers, and the d10 is just not a useful shape.

kviiri

@DavidCoffron It's a die that has consecutive numbers adjacent to each other

Someone_Evil

@DavidCoffron d20 usable to count life in MtG

@DavidCoffron d10 example (no affiliation)

David Coffron

That would be part of it, but there's also the issue with the shape.

kviiri

And yeah, it's usually used to track numbers (but ofc can be used as a normal die too)

Mr Mystery

5:10 PM

Ah

MikeQ

@DavidCoffron Take a d6, file four of the corners so that they're triangular and flat, then label them as 7-10

Mr Mystery

Smart but the die would be tiny

David Coffron

@MrMystery Eh. Could get a bigger d6

NautArch

@MrMystery yah, sorry about that! Just needed to vent and the timing was wrong :)

kviiri

Does it need to be a die?

Mr Mystery

5:12 PM

True, some of them come in the size of cricket balls

David Coffron

@Someone_Evil That would be work, but with the 10-sided dice, I always find it easy to accidentally bump to another number, much less common on other dice

@kviiri Not really, I've looked at spinners that have 10 positions, but its not as appealing to me

MikeQ

Ok, then take a d20, and relabel 11-20 as 10s

kviiri

Are glass stones and similar out of the question?

David Coffron

@MikeQ Oh yeah... That is really obvious now that you say it

Mr Mystery

What about those eight balls that have a dice inside

David Coffron

5:15 PM

@kviiri What do you mean? Like just your score is X number of stones?

kviiri

@DavidCoffron Yeah. Ten is already enough to make it a bit unwieldy but you can have a different color representing X-many stones so you don't have to fiddle with as many pieces.

David Coffron

@kviiri nods contemplatively could work

kviiri

What's the use-case?

David Coffron

@kviiri Level-counting for Munchkin

Someone_Evil

There are spindown d12 commerically availible too, if ignoring two sides is an option

David Coffron

5:17 PM

@Someone_Evil That was my back-up if there was no other thing that I could imagine/learn of

kviiri

@DavidCoffron Ah! in that case my go-to option would be a tracker board with individual pawns (y'know like the scoring board in Carcassonne and similar)

It'd also be good in the sense that getting to level 10 is the goal in Munchkin (at least, so I seem to remember?) so it'll also help you see how close people are to winning at a glance.

Someone_Evil

@DavidCoffron There's an app for that

David Coffron

@Someone_Evil Indeed, but battery life xD

(sometimes my family will play back-to-back games for an entire evening)

Yuuki

In hindsight, I probably could have just transcribed that.

Mr Mystery

haha thats good

David Coffron

5:20 PM

@MrMystery Agreed. Makes me think especially of the Zealot barbarian subclass in D&D 5e

> your soul is marked for endless battle. If a spell, such as raise dead, has the sole effect of restoring you to life (but not undeath), the caster doesn’t need material components to cast the spell on you.

kviiri

@DavidCoffron hah, it seems some Munchkin copies actually come with the tracker board

^ I think I've seen one of those live

Someone_Evil

They also made some special counters which certainly don't look bumpable

David Coffron

Technically it would only need to 9 positions, so a d8 would work with an indicator on the direction of a 6/9

Yuuki

> Most of Death's relationships are work-based so it's nice to get a social call once in awhile.

kviiri

twitter.com/crackedkenshin/status/679027263178858496

David Coffron

5:22 PM

@kviiri I really like that

Someone_Evil

@DavidCoffron Someone who's on level 9 probably warrant some special marker anyway as their about to win

kviiri

@Someone_Evil I recommend that everyone wears a hat with a light bulb that starts flashing when they reach level 9.

David Coffron

@Someone_Evil nods maybe puts a little cover over the die with a big fancy 9 on it

(although honestly most of my victories come from making a jump from 8 to 10 with Wandering Monster on myself so that I can jump up from like 5 or 6 with some treasure sells when everyone isn't starting to save all of their monster buff cards)

Yuuki

@Someone_Evil Get one with a pressure plate that starts playing "All-Star" when there's a marker on the 9 spot.

David Coffron

5:38 PM

@Someone_Evil Like that? ^

Now I'm trying to find some commercial mini-domes to go over my d8s that I can paint with my miniature paints.

goodguy5

5:53 PM

When one invokes perception to see something such as a pressure plate trap, that's actually just to detect the pressure plate, right?

And thus, if I were to theoretically hide various pressure plates that did nothing and some pressure plates that did something, a successful perception would only reveal that there were a bunch of hidden pressure plates, but not actually which one(s) did anything.

Is that interpretation correct and is that when investigation would come into play?

Someone_Evil

That sounds like a reasonable way to play it

Xirema

@goodguy5 I would think so. But then the Forbidden™ DM techniques come into play, like asking for a Wisdom (Investigation) or Intelligence (Perception) check. ;)

goodguy5

I've never used one of those, but I really REALLY like the idea of doing it

Though, funny enough, I just talked about it in an answer... last week, I think

NautArch

@goodguy5 I think it kinda depends. I'd proably go with perception to notice the plates, followed by investigation to discern which are active.

Xirema

Trying to decide when to use alternative Ability Score/Skill Proficiency combinations is something I wish the DMG would have spent more time examining.

goodguy5

6:02 PM

Ah, it was that "What is diplomacy in 5e" question. And two weeks ago. Thanksgiving really messes with my time perception

Xirema

Some are pretty easy: PC wants to make a check to dance? Dexterity with Performance.

goodguy5

What about performing an intricate dance as part of a precise ritual?

Intelligence (Performance)?

@Xirema They have that whole chart for deities, they could have made a similar chart for nonstandard skill usages

Xirema

@goodguy5 Yeah, possibly. Would depend on whether the more difficult part is remembering the steps (Intelligence) or performing the steps (Dexterity).

MikeQ

6:36 PM

@goodguy5 Could be Constitution (Performance) if it's an endurance-based dance contest

goodguy5

@MikeQ What would be wisdom? lol

NautArch

@goodguy5 To not twerk when doing ballroom dancing?

2

nitsua60

6:58 PM

@NautArch That sentence seemed about four words longer than necessary =)

Someone_Evil

To twerk or not to twerk, that is the question

goodguy5

you're right, it should have read:
"Twerk when Dancing"

and I agree

Mark Wells

7:38 PM

@goodguy5 Why are those even separate skills? I've never understood that.

Yuuki

@MikeQ Nah, the Supreme Court is Performance (Constitution).

goodguy5

1. Investigation and Perception aren't just related to traps; it's only murky when traps are involved, imo.

but I think it's the difference between noticing a trap with clear mechanics and understanding a trap that is clearly visible.

1) A thick wire runs from one wall to the other, 1 foot off the ground. (what does it do?)
2) The feint outline of a trapdoor spans 5 feet of the hallway. (do you see it?)

or something

Yuuki

So it's easily summarized by Arnold Schwarzenegger. Where is your daddy (Perception) and what does he do (Investigation)?

goodguy5

7:55 PM

While I love the reference, wasn't it "who is your daddy?"

nitsua60

@Yuuki Is that an excellent Kindergarten Cop reference?

Yuuki

@goodguy5 Yes but that's a Diplomacy check, not Perception.

@nitsua60 I wasn't aware there were any other kinds of Kindergarten Cop references.

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