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4:00 AM
I've never seen Voyager, so I wouldn't know
 
Which was basically "Janeway makes the worst possible choice because otherwise the show can't exist"
:/
 
user15026
I mostly watch Discovery for Tilly.
 
Not an enticing start
@Ash I feel like Tilly is part of the reason I couldn't watch it
Because of the bad ways they handle her character
 
Ben
@trogdor [gasp] you're a monster XD
 
@BESW I knew him as that one guy from Sneakers for a long time before I saw Star Wars, and it was a long time after that before I knew he was the voice of Vader.
 
Ben
4:05 AM
@trogdor That's fair.
 
@Ben yeah no, it's literally Because I cannot handle more bad representation
It's certainly not that she only gets that
 
Ben
@Miniman He was in the '67 version of Dr Dolittle, which is where I knew him from originally
 
But the fact that she gets any would make it not worth it for me
Let alone the other weird choices the show makes that make me think they don't care about past or future Trek
 
Ben
She does get discarded a lot.
"Oh this plot arch that was about Tilly? It's not actually about her at all. She's just a Segway"
 
@Miniman I also knew LeVar Burton as the Reading Rainbow guy; my first exposure to Star Trek was when he did an episode of Reading Rainbow on the TNG set.
 
user15026
4:10 AM
@trogdor that's totally fair. I pushed through but honestly they could have tried so much harder.
 
@BESW wait that's a thing?
 
"I feel like LeVar thinks I know something about this episode that hasn't been properly explained..."
 
@Ash exactly, I feel like I don't have to put up with them,... Not trying all too hard
 
Welp I have to watch that as soon as I can
You monster
XP
 
4:14 AM
@BESW I knew of Reading Rainbow because it gets mentioned a lot when Burton cameos as himself in Community!
(I think it never made it over here.)
 
user15026
@trogdor nah, just read the Xandri books again for good rep and space stories.
 
> This video contains content from PBS, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.
 
 
@Ash fair point
I think I will be doing that at some point
They are definitely good enough to read again
 
user15026
Just call it prepping for the next one to come out
 
4:21 AM
I completely forgot! XD
There is definitely a book three coming out
Which is the best news
 
user15026
Yes! I am so excited.
 
Obviously I am as well
I'm extremely glad you tweeted her and she just responded like it was nothing that she was making the next one
I couldn't find anything on the subject
Not even to the effect that Tone of Voice was the ending
 
user15026
4:40 AM
I know! I was so surprised when I got that reply.
 
If I had known she would just do that I would have actually made an account just to ask
 
user15026
At least now we know!
 
Yep
But that also somehow makes it harder to wait
XD
 
Ben
4:56 AM
Do you ever look at a photo of someone you know, then something in your focus shifts, and they look completely different?
 
Sometimes
 
@Ben can't say that's ever happened to me
 
It sorta depends on the picture
And how much attention I paid the first time
 
Ben
It's an odd experience
Like when you say "bowl" over and over again until it loses its meaning
 
Semantic satiation (also semantic saturation) is a psychological phenomenon in which repetition causes a word or phrase to temporarily lose meaning for the listener, who then perceives the speech as repeated meaningless sounds. Extended inspection/Over-Analysation in place of repetition also produces the same effect. == History and research == Leon Jakobovits James coined the phrase "semantic satiation" in his 1962 doctoral dissertation at McGill University. It was demonstrated as a stable phenomenon that is possibly similar to a cognitive form of reactive inhibition. Prior to that, the expression...
 
Ben
4:59 AM
Yeah. Same but different
 
5:26 AM
@Ben the airplane one was the funniest
 
@Ben This is great
 
user15026
@Ben these are amazing.
 
Ben
I am at that stage of the day where I am searching for things to keep me entertained. Lol
It doesn't help that I had a redbull either
 
user15026
5:43 AM
For me, I think it is bedtime.
 
user15026
Thanks again, y'all, for celebrating my happy with me.
 
@Ben Ah fridays. The day where nothing gets done
 
Ben
@Ash Sleep well!
@linksassin So true
Ohhhh yesss! This song gets me going!
It's the "outro" in the final episode of Happy! Season 2.
 
@Ben Video not available.
 
Ben
@linksassin Com Truise - … Of Your Fake Dimension
 
5:50 AM
@Ben Can't say we have the same taste in music.
 
Ben
I dunno what it is about this song. It's not what I normally listen to.
 
@Ben I'm just hoping it doesn't affect my recommended playlists...
 
Ben
Haha
 
I get some weird stuff sometimes because I use my music account for background music during games.
Google seems to think I'm really into ambient videogame soundtracks.
 
Ben
My normal tastes are around Disturbed/Bon Jovi/Gorillaz/Tool
Some specific songs form specific artists, depending on the mood
@linksassin Yeah I've been getting a lot of those lately
 
5:55 AM
I mean, I don't mind a soundtrack or two but who really wants to listen to a 30 minute track of town sounds?
 
Ben
@linksassin Ah that kind of ambient.
Mine are all ambient music
 
@Ben I get those too. But don't mind them. i would sometimes choose to listen to game soundtracks that have a decent score
 
6:23 AM
I'm 3 pages into the Lancer Core Book and I already like it
> On Content, Discomfort, and Lancer
 
6:47 AM
Good morning and happy Midsummer Eve to my fellow Nordics and everyone else who likes this stuff
 
How to be a linux noob 101: try to copy a sym-link to windows thinking it is the real file... Be surprised when it doesn't open... It must be a friday.
 
Ben
@linksassin Quarter to 5 on a friday
Lol
 
@Ben TBH my brains already on the pathfinder session I'm running tonight
First session back after a PC death. This should be good.
 
Ben
@linksassin Ohhh
 
7:25 AM
> "NEON GENESIS EVANGELION" TV Series All 26 Episodes and "EVANGELION:DEATH(TRUE)2" "THE END OF EVANGELION" finally releasing on NETFLIX!!!
(courtesy of the official Evangelion account)
 
@V2Blast That puts me in the awkward position of having to make a decision about whether that's something I want to rewatch.
 
I have yet to watch it
 
Maybe it won't be on Australian Netflix and I won't have to think about it.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if it's not
 
7:58 AM
@V2Blast wow
Now I have less excuse for not having seen it
 
@trogdor I think "self preservation" should still be valid... :P
 
@Wrigglenite welcome!
 
Omigosh Powell's has a copy of the 1989 The Prisoner: GURPS RPG book for $40, with 25% off if you buy it before midnight their time.
 
Hello, hello
 
[wave] Hi!
 
8:04 AM
Don't mind me, I'm just lurking
 
Lurking? In the chat? Unheard of. Totally preposterous. I don't believe you.
 
Well, you're welcome to lurk or chat as you like! We're heading toward the weekend, so the chat's activity is likely to dip a bit the next few days, but there's always several people around.
 
@Wrigglenite Congrats on becoming a mod over in gaming.SE!
 
1
Q: Is there a way to scan someone's memories while they sleep without them knowing?

AlidenIn my campaign, I want to have an NPC group that is gathering intelligence by kidnapping people while they sleep, scanning their memories, and returning them before morning. I know that I could just rule that they can do this, but I wanted to see if there was a spell that could be used for the pu...

 
@V2Blast Oh! Thank you, and same to you for RPG! I was following your election since it started a week before ours, and it seemed to me like RPG had few, but very qualified candidates
 
8:09 AM
@Wrigglenite Thanks! :)
 
@Miniman get in the robot, miniman
 
9:08 AM
9
Q: What happens when your group is victim of a surprise attack but you can't be surprised?

Pandora's MoxMy character was unaware of a group of bandits, but my character cannot be surprised (I have a Weapon of warning) but the rest of my group is out of the range of my weapon of warning, do I get to take my turn even when the rest of my party was surprised? Do I take my turn before the attack of th...

 
 
1 hour later…
10:14 AM
@Derpy not a huge fan of it?
 
10:56 AM
@trogdor Actually, yep, not really a fan. But I didn't mean to bash the show there.
My comment was more on the lines of
"expect to understand nothing of the plot. And when you think you have understood something, expect the next episode/movie to throw a curve ball and change it"
 
11:12 AM
@kviiri A map for you. (twitter link)
 
@Derpy ah fair enough
that's in line with what I have heard of it
that it's real weird throughout
 
@trogdor what?
 
Evangellion
 
@BESW Heh, all of them are pretty accurate!
 
@trogdor ah, sorry my bad, misread the reply, it is clearer now
 
11:26 AM
ah
 
I actually had that as "It is weird that Evangelion should be weird"
 
wat XD nope not what I said
 
Esp the first one, I'm pretty sure most of Finland indeed exists
 
11:44 AM
Happy Friday
 
12:17 PM
Happy Friday o/
Just washed a cauldron full of potatoes
 
Next on the to-do list, wash the potatoes.
 
@BESW Good idea
 
12:43 PM
I have a problem, but I am uncertain if asking about it will result in people taking it out-of-context and attacking me personally. How can I ask a question without being labelled as all the bad things?
 
@LucasF. If you mean avoiding associating the reaction with this user, perhaps use an anonymous (non-logged-in) account, which the Stack does allow for question asking IIRC?
 
@V2Blast Let me know when you're back on. I'm honestly not sure if the dndbeyond access is full, but we'll try :)
 
@vicky_molokh I can, yes, but I feel like if I just ask the question without any context, then people would just ignore the question itself an bash the anonymous sockpuppet account
 
@LucasF. Is the amount of context necessary too long to fit in a question field?
 
May I state the question here, without any intention of receiving an answer, just to see if there is a way to perhaps phrase it in a non-offensive way?
 
12:46 PM
Try me.
 
My question would be "What is the purpose of RPG safety tools?"
Specifically, the idea of having an X, N, and O card
 
@LucasF. Arethose associated with a certain game?
 
Seems like a reasonable question.
 
I recently came across those and I have trouble figuring out what the advantage of those cards are, in comparison to just plain communication
@NautArch No, they are not. The idea is that a player can at any point raise an X card, and the game comes to a halt. It's for the purpose of people feeling uncomfortable with what is happening, or what is about to happen.
I imagine this is used for things that a person may have personal problems with.
 
@LucasF. This bit here is the key, I think, to being taken seriously and not assumed to be asking in bad faith: that you understand the need for safety but are curious about the need for formal rather than informal structures to ensure it.
 
12:50 PM
@BESW Yes, I am afraid that people would interpret "What is the purpose of this?" as "People who use such systems are weak and should be ashamed of it!"
And I would like to avoid people interpreting the question as such
 
@NautArch Many modern games are mentioning the X card and similar tools as suggested additions to the game, or including them as part of game prep specifically. But the tools are mostly designed independently of any one system.
 
Given that my account is relatively new, I am afraid that people would just see it as a troll attempt
 
That's a reasonable concern, given certain corners of the online discourse around safety in gaming.
If it were me, I might say something like "I'm glad people are talking about the need for safety in gaming, but why are specific tools needed? My group seems to be doing okay just with open communication."
 
@LucasF. probably, one of the merit is that it kinda enforces the felling that there is a social contract already in place. Raise the card and I won't ask for explanations or judge you. Just talking on other hand could make you more uncomfortable since you are finding yourself in what you perceive as an unplanned situation - "What they will think of me if I speak now?"
 
I believe people should be free to have their own opinions about such systems, but I am not asking about those opinions. I only want to know what advantage people who use those systems gain by using them, as compared to stating "I am really not uncomfortable with this. Can we please rewind and find a different way to resolve this?"
 
12:53 PM
@Derpy He's not asking for answers here, he's asking for how to ask it on mainsite without getting mistaken for a troll.
 
I'll try to formulate a question that sounds as neutral as possible, and I will also include a disclaimer stating the background of the question.
 
yep, sorry, just kinda "thinking aloud".
 
@BESW @LucasF. Gotcha - thank you! I just hadn't heard of them and wanted to make sure i was approaching this from the right way.
 
@Derpy It's a good answer nonetheless
@BESW Thank you very much for your assistance.
 
@LucasF. I think it's a great question and if you get trampled on it I think several people here in chat have your back.
 
12:55 PM
@LucasF. I think it's fine, but I'd also heavily recommend stating in the question that you are looking for answers from people who actually have used the system (or similar systems). My concern is that we'll get answers from people that haven't. I know that I'd be interested in answering but shouldn't :)
And if lots of those answers roll in, the question may be closed a primarily opinion-based.
Not because the question is, but because the answers are.
 
@NautArch I wonder if there'll be answerers who have but ended up concluding that they prefer a different approach.
 
@NautArch I will include that, thank you. Although I hope it's not closed as opinion-based, because I am not asking about the opinions people have about the system, but what advantage they believe to gain from it
 
@vicky_molokh Which would be a good answer. But I'm starting to think it may be an opinion-based question now. It's going to vary greatly by the group.
 
Experience-based answers will be amazing.
Opinion-based answers aren't a bad fit for the site. Only unsupported opinions get tossed out on their ear.
 
12:57 PM
@BESW Absolutely. And I think it's okay if they do provide different results. It'll all be helpful. But they must be experienced based.
 
Aye, and there's a whole complex and nuanced set of conversations around the various tools.
For example, the X card is a really popular generic safety tool, but it's not a good tool for handling PTSD triggers.
 
@NautArch I do think there's likely to be something of a selection bias in the answers, as you pointed out, with people who find the whole principle unhelpful likely not even trying and thus having a non-experience-based answer, while people who have the experience likely being 'pre-selected' to be inclined to find the tools helpful. (Disclaimer: this is purely armchair opinion-based musing on my part; no statistical backing.)
 
@BESW I personally prefer asking people beforehand what they are comfortable with, and if there is anything off-limits for the players.
 
@vicky_molokh If they haven't tried it, the answer should be downvoted (and hopefully removed)
But yeah, my concern is folks submitting unsupported opinions.
 
1:02 PM
For instance, I used to be a player in a Pathfinder group, and we all agreed that sexual content should be off-limits for the game. Yet one player insisted on pushing the boundaries, asking the GM if there were any brothels in town, etc.
 
user15026
@BESW I knew this was gonna be the eye contact flower. I knew it.
 
user15026
@LucasF. which is good but isn't gonna work for everyone. Sometimes you can't articulate things.
 
@Ash It's the only safety tool I've ever encountered for which I cannot imagine any situation where it wouldn't be actively worse than no tool at all.
 
@Ash That's fair enough. I was talking about general topics that people feel uncomfortable with, not 100% specific things
 
@LucasF. That just frustrates me as a DM. I'd just say "NO" in game, and out talk to them out of the game that if they don't knock itoff, they won't be invited back.
 
1:05 PM
I know it's not the solution to all problems
 
user15026
@LucasF. I can still think of a handful of my triggers that I wouldn't necessarily be comfy with bringing up in most groups.
 
@LucasF. No tool is. They provide options to help.
 
@NautArch This is exactly what happened. This player wasn't really that good to be around for other reasons as well, and after two sessions, we sat down with him and explained to him that we feel like he is not a good fit for the group
 
user15026
@BESW yeah, it's so universally just terrible
 
@Ash It's difficult in general if there is something you would rather not talk about, because a GM has no knowledge of what they should not bring up
 
1:07 PM
@Ash I just feel really bad, because at least the designer is coming from a place where they are trying to be mindful and trying to help. :(
 
Okay, I have a headache and the grumpies so I'm going to log off. G'night! @LucasF. I look forward to upvoting your question in the morning, and I'll be thinking about how to write an answer based on my experience with the subject.
 
@Rubiksmoose I understand, but at some point you have to ask yourself: How many people would be comfortable to stare into the eyes of another person for a prolonged amount of time, in addition to an already stressful situation?
@BESW I hope your headache gets better. G'night!
And thanks!
 
@LucasF. Oh I just meant I feel a bit guilty being so hard on it. But it is absolutely bad, by any metric that I can think of.
 
I'm so bummed about this question
 
To be clear, I think it is right to be hard on it. This is a safety tool. If it isn't doing it's job we shouldn't ignore the flaws and especially when it is going to make things worse than not using any tool at all.
 
1:11 PM
@Rubiksmoose Yes, but you criticize the product, not the person. You are saying "this thing is bad for these reasons", not "the person who made this is bad for making bad things"
I believe that this is absolutely a fair observation to make, and not in any way too harsh or overly negative.
 
@LucasF. For sure, it doesn't keep me from personally feeling guilty about it is all. To be further clear, I wasn't making any observation or judgement beyond the observation that I feel a bit guilty about it (whether I should or not). I agree it is good and fair to point these things out :)
 
Yes, I understand that it's a bummer if someone wants to help, yet the thing they want to use to help just makes things worse
 
Indeed. I think we are agreeing completely.
 
user15026
Yeah, I am like oh you wanted to help but you did it so badly. My issues are purely with the tool as presented not with the humans who tried really hard to do a thing without, I think, understanding the core of what was needed.
 
No good deed goes unpunished.
3
 
1:15 PM
@NautArch Yeah :(
 
@Rubiksmoose I felt bad about riding the author to actually confirm, but now I"m glad I did.
 
@NautArch Absolutely.
 
It basically went from yes to probably to maybe not to no.
 
@LucasF. For future reference: we actively encourage people to test the waters on questions here in chat and on Meta. So this is a good thing and something we are happy to do (with the caveat of course that we are not perfect and even with refinement can't predict how well a question will be recieved or solve all issues)
@NautArch Yeah I kept checking back and the signs kept getting worse and worse!
 
@Rubiksmoose I've been a bit off this week, but did you think I was coming off negatively in the comments?
 
1:20 PM
@Rubiksmoose Addendum on imperfect predictions: meta and especially chat are a very small subset of the community, and the general views may differ from those in these two smaller subsets.
 
@Rubiksmoose Thank you very much. When I first wanted to ask the question, I immediately thought "Oh no, people are going to think I want to troll them". Hence why I was very cautious. It wasn't the first time that I asked a question somewhere and, instead of answering the question, people questioned my intentions and labelled me as a terrible person instead.
0
Q: What are the benefits of using a TTRPG Safety Toolkit in comparison to plain communication?

Lucas F. I am aware that this question may come across as ignorant or as an attempt at trolling. While I cannot prove it, I hope enough people believe that this question was asked in good faith and with the goal of gaining a deeper understanding in how to make the game more accessible for players. ...

 
@LucasF. I think generally people here are good about adhering to the idea of assuming the best intentions behind people. So, we definitely don't jump on people. I think we get very few trolls here in chat and they are pretty quickly sussed out. Though prefacing a sensitive topic and making your intentions explicitly clearer is never a bad idea.
 
Question is now live. I hope that the disclaimer clarifies things
 
@NautArch I'll give it a lookover.
 
@Rubiksmoose I hope it's good
 
1:25 PM
@Rubiksmoose Thanks, they never reacted well and I wasn't sure if my writing tone was off.
And I know I can come off gruff at times :D
 
Ah shoot, I didn't include the bit about first-hand experience
Time to [edit] :D
 
@vicky_molokh Very good addendum and absolutely true.
 
@LucasF. I put it in as a comment as well to reinforce.
 
@NautArch I am trying to add the information from the comment into the question, but I don't really know how to formulate it in a polite way.
 
@LucasF. Heh :) You could just say "I'm looking for table experience with these tools to help me understand. Please don't answer if you haven't used them."
or something like that.
You can make it more light-hearted with a "I've got my opinions on this, too, but I want to hear how they have actually worked before I give into my predispositions!"
 
1:32 PM
UGH
 
@goodguy5 ?
 
@NautArch You may have come across as being a bit aggressive, but I'm also unable to tell for sure how they reacted to it. I'm not sure I have any concrete suggestions. I think part of the friction (if any) there was that OP was more in "here's what I found" mode rather than "here's my conclusion based off of what I found" and you were pushing them towards the latter.
 
I've added a link to the meta and asked people to back answers with personal experience, not speculation
 
@Rubiksmoose Totally fair. I'll try and check myself in the future.
 
Goodguy, we need these tables pulled.

"Yea, okay, I can do that"

yea, but we're going to be vague about it.

"Could you not?"

No can do, I'm afraid. Also, I need you to pull them from one system and upload them to another, across 2 firewalls... and change the format of them.

"-sigh-"
But it's done
 
1:34 PM
@goodguy5 UGH
 
exactly
 
@NautArch And just to be extra clear. I still think you were well on the good side of Be Nice by my personal reading. So I as an individual have no concerns there.
 
@goodguy5 With table you refer to a database?
 
@LucasF. hahaha. yea. not the four legged variety
 
@Rubiksmoose It's a thin line when someone is frustrated with the standard of expectations here.
 
1:35 PM
@goodguy5 "We need those tables pulled" - I thought you were either about to kick some guests out of a restaurant, or players out of a game store :D
 
ha.
Alright. now to get some breakfast, then I can finally start paying attention to the stack.

Work and bodily function getting in the way....
oh man, I'm going to get such a big coffee from wawa....
 
I mean, I've only seen people getting kicked out of a card store once
But it was for good reason
 
@NautArch For sure. Especially with us using comments for business and not conversation. I do find that earnest questions seem to be taken a less aggressive. "I'm not sure I understand X. Do you think you can add something about Y?" though you gotta watch out for passive agressive tones.
@LucasF. Just as an FYI, I'll put a note in so the mods can be aware to keep an eye on it when they can.
 
@Rubiksmoose I already added a disclaimer on the bottom. I hope that it conveys the essential information.
 
@LucasF. It looks great to me.
 
1:45 PM
As you may have noticed when reading my chat messages, I tend to get very self-concious about the questions I write
 
@LucasF. Well feel free to ask us as you did. We'll give you as much feedback as we can :) We'd rather you ask your questions here with confidence rather than not because you worry about them.
Hm I was looking at creating but I'm not finding enough questions about them yet :(
 
The closest I could find was physical-safety, but it was specifically about LARPing
 
FWIW I think it is a great question.
 
Thank you very much
 
I'm hoping the answers we get are high quality.
The question has the potential to help a lot of people I think.
 
1:54 PM
Yes, perhaps it can help some people get better access to TTRPGs, which can at times be somewhat toxic and exclusionary
 
2:44 PM
1. is RTFM an allowed acronym?
2. is RTM ubiquitous enough to use?
 
@goodguy5 I would say it depends on the context. It's more well known in the IT crowd, and can be seen as condescending. While I personally don't have a problem with someone calling me mentally deficient for not seeing something that was in Chapter 3. "How to do the thing you wanted to do", it could violate the "Be nice" principle.
In an answer, I would use a more neutral tone, such as "As stated in the [manual]..."
 
2:59 PM
37
Q: How should we deal with RTFM comments?

Roee AdlerI encountered this question, which contains an RTFM comment in response to a user's question-comment about the answer. I believe that in SO there should not be RTFM answers, as was already established, but my question is about RTFM comments. When I see RTFM I find it offensive to the question a...

30
Q: RTFM-like answers: Flag them or allow them?

Awesome PoodlesIf an answer essentially tells the OP to "Read the ¤cough¤ Fine Manual", should we flag it? I'm not talking about rude answers (that's a given), but answers like "Look up X in the Y" (and maybe don't even provide a link!). For example, see this answer... To my mind, this isn't even as useful...

 
@Rubiksmoose 0/1 so far :(
 
@NautArch wait what?
re your comment
I read it and thought it made sense, then when I went to address my answer, I couldn't decide what you were referring to
 
@goodguy5 I was mostly asking if you can include more of how the discussions went with the player(s) who challenged rules at the table.
 
you mean me?
 
@goodguy5 I think it was in regards to this question: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/150311/…
 
3:12 PM
@goodguy5 ohgod, no! Your answer is good! This was on Lucas' question ^
 
but you did post it on mine, briefly, right? I'm not gaslighting myself am I?
 
I think you are
 
@Rubiksmoose I actually just meant the actual usage of quote "rtfm" endquote
 
@goodguy5 Oh, I did post a comment to you about adding some stories about how things went. I just deleted it after you said check back in 5 minutes :)
I trusted you'd do it.
 
@NautArch okay. that's what I was referring to.
 
3:21 PM
@goodguy5 I mean, what comment. I never posted a comment. You cray cray.
mwahahaahahahahaha
 
IIRC our guidelines on abbreviations state they should be clear what they reference. For RTFM I'd say
1) It's not obvious.
2) If it is obvious, then due to the nature of it, it doesn't adhere to the Be Nice/Code of Conduct guidelines for SE
 
Thanks, Will. I decided against it anyway
hyuk hyuk.

anyway, are the edits satisfactory?
 
ye flipping gods bathroom renos are expensive.
 
@JohnP yes, yes they are.
 
Indeed
 
3:26 PM
We did our kids bath a couple years ago and it was about 20
About to do ours and expect it to be a bit more.
 
@NautArch We had a failure that caused a leak, and it's covered by our insurance. Remediation + reno estimate = 23,000ish
 
@JohnP Yup, that's right on target.
 
@NautArch twenty what?
 
blegh.
 
kroners? not so bad. grand? very bad
 
3:28 PM
@goodguy5 20K US.
 
20 Firstborn Children
 
@NautArch oh lord no
that's a downpayment on a new house.

or a car
lawd
 
That's not even a down payment where I live
 
I could go to trade school to be a contractor, then buy all the requisite materials and install them for that cost
 
Bay area is stupid expensive
 
GcL
3:29 PM
@goodguy5 Never RTFM. It is never the correct approach. I haven't seen much of it on this site, and that's one of the reasons I'm still here.
 
At least it's not San Fran though
 
@Rubiksmoose just a quick guess: reading that answer I think the poster was going for option B - "Something you can back up with a reference". He probably is thinking that presenting the reasons behind the creation of the X card - directly as quotes from the original author if I understand correctly? - is reference, as in "I gave you the official documentation on the matter".
Mind you, that probably is just my poor reading of the situation given that I am quite extraneous to the site, but I though it would be still useful to warn you that I had the impression the user may be a little confused by what you meant by "reference"
 
@goodguy5 You can probably do it for 10-15k if you using just very basic stuff. BUt if you want anything 'nicer', you're in the 20range.
 
the actual sentence I was considering was:

"Everyone's playstyle and preferences are different. Personally, I prefer a *RTFM* approach, but that's me."
 
@goodguy5 There is a severe lack of trades in the US now, due to the huge push of "everyone needs to bury themselves in debt for a college degree"
 
3:31 PM
@Derpy Applying how effective a tool is is very different than a manufacturer describing how to use their tool. THe former is what we're looking for.
 
@NautArch The thing is: I have a fair amount of time. My money is more scarce, and thus more valuable.
 
GcL
@goodguy5 I see. Still wouldn't use that in a sentence like that. "By the book" seems like it would be a reasonable substitute in that case.
 
@goodguy5 And that's why a lot of people to the reno work themselves. My problem is, I don't have the skill, but I have enough knowledge to look at something and say "That was done well." Unfortunately my experience has been looking at work and saying "THat's really sloppy."
and getting frustrated about paying for it.
 
@NautArch yep, I kinda guess that. I just pointed out that the link Rubik posted does indeed say "Something you can back up with a reference" and the poster may genuinely be thinking that "Word of God / Author Words" is reference. Not really contesting anything, just pointing out that the user may be confused.
 
@GcL agreed. I decided against it.
 
GcL
3:35 PM
@Derpy Some users are less than happy to be poked with that stick.
 
@Derpy And the poster just basically said that :) I stated my concern as a comment.
 
@NautArch oh, nice, didn't saw that. I guess that should be enough to make things clear.
 
If anyone is feeling generous this morning, my homebrew question could use a last reopen vote.
 
@JohnP Merry Christmas, ya filthy animal.
 
@goodguy5 ... home alone?
 
3:42 PM
@JohnP no, my wife is here, but thanks for asking.
(and yes)
afk. chiropractor
 
@goodguy5 Oh. Hello mrs goodguy
 
I think chat has cononically decided that it's goodwife5?, but I could me mistaken.

definitely goodbaby5 when referring to my kid...
 
@goodguy5 ... what happened to goodbabies1-4?
And goodguys1-4 for that matter.
 
Wow. 8 views 3 upvotes already. That's a scorchingly hot topic for Fitness.
 
@Yuuki See Paranoia. And report to The Computer.
 
GcL
3:54 PM
@JohnP I could post the link to some HAES blogs and get you a lot of views in a hurry }:-0 /S
 
4:21 PM
@NautArch That information is above everyone's clearance level. All loyal members of this chat room are strongly encouraged to visit their nearest adjustment center for memory fixing.
 
@Yuuki goodguy5 is our last, best hope for goodness.
 
@MarkWells Until we discover goodguy6 :D
 
> "Warlocks should unionize to increase collective bargaining power with their patron."
> "... Isn't that just a cult?"
 
4:36 PM
@Yuuki Sounds of Note Scribbling
 
Oh man
That's a great idea
 
5:02 PM
Scenario: The patron hires adventures to break up the Warlock union as they've been getting on their nerves.
 
@williamporter If you're okay with it, I'm so banking this to use if a Warlock player blanks on making an (actionable) backstory
 
Go ahead, I'm tossing ideas out there
 
@Someone_Evil Scenario: Competing patron wants to supplant the current union with one of his own.
 
It is subjective question day today :)
 
@NautArch Maybe we should make it a tradition for fridays?
 
5:13 PM
@Someone_Evil would love that! Maybe it would get folks to better answer them.
double fake internet points
 
5:33 PM
2
Q: What are familiars really?

ArthabanWhat actually IS a familiar, speaking from a Lore point of view? I'm not asking what the use of a familiar is, or what kind of creatures can be a familiar- But in essence, what truly IS a familiar? Is it an actual animal (Or other creature depending on the feats a character might have) that has,...

 
@HotRPGQuestions That question seems familiar for some reason...
 

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