Jaami'at StackExchange al-Islamyya

HaLaBi

2:00 PM

@ashes999 you are right.. in akhira will be cleared.. thanks bro.

Al Ummat

sure

Manishearth

@halabi if someone calls iraq the cancer of the earth, yes I would tell them not to say stuff like that

ashes999

+1 @Manishearth

Manishearth

Or any other country

Stack Exchange

Great answer: Is punishment for leaving Islam death? http://islam.stackexchange.com/questions/221/is-punishment-for-leaving-islam-death/222?atw=1#222 #sharia

Tweeted by StackIslam on July 5, 2012 at 1:42 PM

HaLaBi

2:00 PM

@Manishearth I said Iran.. not Iraq.. :)

Manishearth

Saying "I don't like what <country> did here" is fine

Calling it the cancer of the earth is not

HaLaBi

I was talking about the system.. not about the people.. !!!!!!!

Manishearth

@halabi oh sorry, on mobile, tiny text :p

@halabi the system is made of people

ashes999

@HaLaBi don't try to justify it. Just accept his criticism as valid, which it is.

yasar11732

@Manishearth @HaLaBi you are getting off topic here, maybe you want to open a new room for this?

HaLaBi

2:02 PM

yup.. with the help of devil..

Manishearth

It's ok, no need to defend yourself from last time... Just don't repeat stuff like this

HaLaBi

I do accept it.. I told him it is my point of view.. he doesnt have to believe in it.. and I do not have to believe in his..

Manishearth

That's all I want to get across :)

ashes999

done, agree to disagree

HaLaBi

I will repeat it if necessary.. :)

end of discussion about this...

please..

@ashes999 said it.. agree to disagree :)

Manishearth

2:03 PM

Just note that if such messages are brought to our notice, action will be take. That's all.

End of discussion :)

goldPseudo

assalaamu 'alaykum

yasar11732

@goldPseudo Alaikum Salam

Al Ummat

@yasar11732 Adab questions are fine

@goldPseudo wa alaikum salam

HaLaBi

@Manishearth ok judge manish :)

Manishearth

Btw, could someone explain the greeting to me? It seems to have two parts

"assalam alaikum" and "(wa) alaikum salam"

goldPseudo

2:05 PM

"Peace be upon you." // "And upon you be peace [too]."

HaLaBi

@goldPseudo wa alaykum assalam...

So @Manishearth are you the type who love to show off the power he has.. in your case the power to 'ban' a user..??

goldPseudo

"And when you are greeted with a greeting, greet [in return] with one better than it or [at least] return it [in a like manner]. Indeed, Allah is ever, over all things, an Accountant."

Manishearth

@gold Oh, thanks :)

yasar11732

@HaLaBi please stop this discussion.

Manishearth

wa aleikum assalam, then :)

Al Ummat

2:06 PM

@yasar11732 as Ashes said how can I have fun is not as good as a question as""how does Islam ask me to treat someone in X situation"

HaLaBi

ok @yasar11732...

yasar11732

Ok, I guess it is decided, I am voting to close it :P

Manishearth

@halabi im not saying me--I'm saying one of the moderators. Why would I show it off? It's a pretty serious tool, to only be used in certain cases

Yes, please stop

@yasar I have voted to close my own questions countless times :P

HaLaBi

I got a warning from one of real staff of SE.. and I accepted.. don't you people didn't flag it already.. so the last thing I need is you to come and open an old issue and 'advise' me... please keep the advise then threaten me.. Please if you think it was offensive.. follow the rules!!! flag it!

Al Ummat

Asalamu wa alaikum or hello @DanAndrews

HaLaBi

2:09 PM

@DanAndrews hello and welcome to the chat room :)

@DanAndrews if you do not mind.. I have something like 1 or 2 million questions for you :)

Dan Andrews

Thank you for the greeting. I was reading the chat history to see what the discussion is about.

I cannot promise to answer all 2 million :D

HaLaBi

trust me don't read it

:)

yasar11732

We need 2 more close votes for this:

2

Q: How should a muslim have fun?

A Muslim's understanding of fun can't be exactly the same as of a non-muslim, because we can't do many things non-muslims can do for fun. For example, we can't consume alcohol, smoke, hang out with a boyfriend/girlfriend, and I guess there are different opinions about music etc. On the other ha...

adab

Manishearth

@halabi as a moderator, there is little point in flagging it. And I said "if someone flags it"--we have to act on it. I was just observing that your comment on "gives us a bad image" was applicable to you as well. That's all.. More of a friendly reminder that you shouldn't do stuff like that.

Dan Andrews

I cannot vote to close yet

Al Ummat

2:11 PM

@yasar11732 I will vote to close than

goldPseudo

i've already tossed in my vote.

yasar11732

@AlUmmat ok, thanks.

Manishearth

You started to argue, so I thought you hadn't really accepted the SE warning :/ That's all. Can we please close this issue now?

Al Ummat

ok we just need one more vote whoever wants to please go there and close to vote

Dan Andrews

@HaLaBi you can email me anytime.

HaLaBi

2:13 PM

ok i will close it.. but please no more threatening.. issue closed.

@DanAndrews I will for sure..

@DanAndrews is it ok if i asked about freemasonry.. you know we have a lot rumors about it and it will be nice if you clear somethings...

Manishearth

Warning is not the same as a threat :/

Agreed, closed :)

HaLaBi

hear it from you better than believing rumors..

Manishearth

@dan you're a freemason? Wow

yasar11732

Since people are gathered, what do you think about this:

Dan Andrews

Yes, I am and two of my brothers are which are from Turkey and Muslim.

yasar11732

2:15 PM

1

Q: Should we allow "true muslim"?

The original heading to this question was "What should a true muslim do if his daughter does not respect the faith" (I suggested an edit about this, it may or may not be accepted while you read this). The word "true" in the heading sounded wrong to me, and since the tone of the site is important,...

discussion

Dan Andrews

When greeting HaLaBi in a chat room, it is proper to say, "as-salaamu ‘alaikum HaLaBi" ?

goldPseudo

"true" muslim is too divisive. should be edited to make it more neutral.

ashes999

Is it just me, or is this another question about people trying to justify their ideology and asking leading questions: islam.stackexchange.com/questions/980/…

HaLaBi

@DanAndrews yup.. if you are starting it.. and if you are replying a greeting you say "wa alaykum assalam"

Dan Andrews

saying "true muslim" is bait, IMHO

yasar11732

2:16 PM

@DanAndrews Are you Turkish too, or just your brothers? (are they half-brothers or something like that)

Dan Andrews

Oh, sorry, we are brothers because of Masonry.

HaLaBi

@yasar11732 i think he meant "free masonry brothers"

yasar11732

Ohh, ok.

HaLaBi

it is a brotherhood after all..

Dan Andrews

I'm from Ohio, USA. Which is where they live not to go to school.

the live now

ajfkls;dfjkl; I cannot type today

They are both working on their PHD's in Mechanical Engineering

HaLaBi

2:17 PM

@ashes999 voted to close that question..

goldPseudo

@ashes999 the question seems legit to me. it's explicitly asking for people to explain the counter view to the one he posited.

HaLaBi

@DanAndrews can I ask one question before i go to work? and the remaining 1.999 millions later...

ashes999

@goldPseudo look at that (temporarily banned) user's history. It's clearly a lead-in.

Dan Andrews

sure, but I do not want to debate in this chat as this is ISLAM's chat, not Freemasonry :D

goldPseudo

@ashes999 i judge the post, not the poster.

HaLaBi

2:19 PM

@DanAndrews one quick question with no debates..

Manishearth

@dan oh, in chat its ok to go a bit off topic

Dan Andrews

very well then

HaLaBi

@DanAndrews briefly, in two lines.. whats the free masonry's main goal?

ashes999

@goldPseudo you cannot ignore a person's history. That's why SE supports bans. Because sometimes, the issue is the person, not the posts.

@goldPseudo we look at patterns of posts too, not just posts as isolated incidents.

Dan Andrews

The main goal in Freemasonry is the three tenants of Masonry, Brotherly love, Relief, and Truth. and I will explain:

HaLaBi

2:22 PM

I asked that because we have a believe here.. free masonry is evil.. but thats from one side.. I would love yo hear it from you..

ashes999

Can I please humbly request some flags on this as offensive: islam.stackexchange.com/questions/1240/…

goldPseudo

@ashes999 i feel it sends exactly the wrong message if we close down otherwise good questions just because the poster has a history of bad questions; users need to learn how to work their posts so they're acceptable to the site. that means shutting the bad ones down hard, but accepting the good ones.

ashes999

@goldPseudo then why was that user banned for seven days?

I know that we agree about tolerance and judging people and not being presumptuous. That's why we're both still here.

I think we disagree about when we can accept a person's history and continuous actions as an indicator of something deeper.

Dan Andrews

We have brotherly love for each other, we know that where ever I see another member I will help him and he would help me should I need it. Relief, we give relief to everyone in distress Freemason or not. We raise money for different charities. Truth, we search for the truth in our personal beliefs. Which allow us to go beyond our personal religious authorities to see the good in other's beliefs.

Which is what has prompted me to learn more about Islam.

Manishearth

IMO, if a user with a history of bad posts posts a good one, we should ignore the history for the duration of that post

ashes999

2:25 PM

Agreed @Manishearth

That's why said banned user actually had a decent rep of several hundred, if I recall correctly.

Manishearth

We support bans in the cases where we feel that a user is posting too many bad posts and will continue to do so

ashes999

I personally upvoted some of their questions and answers.

goldPseudo

he had well over a thousand rep.

ashes999

Yes, I think that's what the case was here.

Dan Andrews

@HaLaBi You say, "I asked that because we have a believe here.. free masonry is evil." this is not exactly true because there are Masons here.

HaLaBi

2:26 PM

@DanAndrews thats why I asked.. to clear things out and hear it from the source

Dan Andrews

I am not the source, I am only a member :)

ashes999

-1

A: What should a muslim do if his daughter does not respect the faith

Just as a note to everyone who comes later to read this: Islam does not condone honour killings in any shape, form, or way, and for any reason. Killing is haraam (prohibited), and is one of the major sins of Islam that's hard to top. Killing your own child is even worse. As Allah says: And ...

Dan Andrews

@HaLaBi, I will tell you a part of the first lecture we are taught....

HaLaBi

@DanAndrews a member is the closest to source...

Dan Andrews

"By the exercise of Brotherly Love we are taught to regard the whole human species as one family, the high, the low, the rich, the poor, who as created by one Almighty Parent, and inhabitants of the same planet, are to aid, support, and protect each other. On this principle Freemasonry unties men of every country, sect and opinion, and conciliates true friendship among those who might otherwise have remained at perpetual distance."

So for example, my brothers from Turkey who are Muslim. Would probably never become friends with me, from the US and Christian.

HaLaBi

2:31 PM

@DanAndrews i always had the impression it is a white brotherhood.. thanks for clearing that :)

Dan Andrews

Oh no, there are many different culture. It is VERY popular in the afro-American community. Maybe more popular than with whites right now.

Big in India too. A couple weeks ago, I had a lunch at my house. There were several Christians, a guy from India and his wife, and the twin brothers from Turkey.

yasar11732

@DanAndrews Ok, I have a question, how do you make an application to join?

Dan Andrews

You have to find a lodge in your area and request a petition.

HaLaBi

@DanAndrews thanks for the info.. i gtg.. work

salam alaykum

Dan Andrews

good day HaLaBi

yasar11732

2:35 PM

Can I decide to leave any time I want, or are there some rules about leaving?

Dan Andrews

nope, you can leave when ever.

If you don't want to go through the process of leaving (which is just mentioning your name in lodge) you can just stop paying the annual dues

yasar11732

So it is perfectly ok to join see what is going on and leave?

Dan Andrews

yes

It happens sometimes

It is what I thought when I joined

I though, "I'm going to find out why these guys are bad and tell everyone" It turns out, they were not and I have many good friends

yasar11732

So, if you suddenly leave, ninjas doesn't abduct you in the middle of the night or something :P

Dan Andrews

I promise they will not :D

yasar11732

2:40 PM

It would be cool :)

Dan Andrews

I must get back to work: As-Salamu Alaykum

yasar11732

Wa Alaikum Salam

Al Ummat

@DanAndrews wa alaikum salam

yasar11732

Should we close this or not?

islam.stackexchange.com/questions/1240/…

goldPseudo

@yasar11732 the question looks good now, after the loaded bits have been edited out.

Al Ummat

2:45 PM

@yasar11732 no it is good, it seems on topic and goodas goldpseudo said

yasar11732

@goldPseudo Ok.

Ershad

3:11 PM

Assalamu alaikkum

Al Ummat

@Ershad Wa alaikum salam wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

Ershad

islam.stackexchange.com/q/1240/38 Was this question about honor killing?

Al Ummat

@Ershad how are you today?

Ershad

@AlUmmat I fine, Alhamdulilah

how are you?

Al Ummat

@Ershad good alhamdulillah. i am not really sure if that is what the question is asking, it would seem that it is asking for the punishment

Ershad

3:17 PM

Ah..okay

Anyone heard of the hadeeth saying command the children to pray when they are seven and hit them at ten if they refuse to fulfill prayers and separate them from bed.. ?

btw, hitting is totally wrong for reasons like disobeying parents

The actual way to do it.. by using words

i.e. advicing

the hitting is restricted to prayers alone

based on that hadeeth

May the person was asking about that?

*Maybe

goldPseudo

i don't want to say the question is about honour killings since it doesn't bring up killing at all. it's original wording was definitely loaded though.

Ershad

lol.. Could be..because I saw it only now..which is the edited version

goldPseudo

in it's current form, i think it's a perfectly legitimate question.

Ershad

yes, that is what I think too

goldPseudo

albeit a bit weak since there's no real "body" to it.

Ershad

3:23 PM

yeah.. it needs to be specific.. like did the child abandon salah or something

goldPseudo

i'm not so much a fan of question posts that literally just ask their question and leave.

with absolutely no context or rationale.

Ershad

yes.. someone could misinterpret it

goldPseudo

i won't DV because it is a legitimate question. but i won't UV either.

Ershad

well, it is not open now.. and i don't think anyone would reopen it since it is not very great question or controversial

goldPseudo

i'm not convinced it's controversial (anymore).

but if nobody votes to reopen, so be it. that's democracy for ya. :)

Ershad

3:28 PM

lol... that's me too.. I don't close vote or reopen the first.. unless I am really sure..like "completely ridiculous question" which will definitely get close

goldPseudo

i'm quick on the CV if the question obviously needs work.

Ershad

No interesting questions today?

goldPseudo

so nobody wastes time or effort answering it while it's in flux.

nothing really "interesting".

only 9 questions posted in the last 24 hours. 3 of which are closed

Ershad

lol.. that is bad statistics..

goldPseudo

two of which spawned meta posts, but those are both fairly cut and dry.

Ansari

3:32 PM

assalamu 'alaikum folks

@yasar11732 here now

@HaLaBi - just skimmed through the chat. is my answer to the qur'an/wudu question wrong?

goldPseudo

wa 'alaykum assalaam

Ershad

lol.. It we have to get out of public beta.. we need lot of questions and answers.. @Ansari Walaikkum assalam

Ansari

@goldPseudo @Ershad - yeah a lot of our stats are dropping like rocks

goldPseudo

i think that's to be expected. our initial flurry of new-site activity has died. now we're dealing with what our actual questions per day would look like.

which aren't necessarily bad; we're not even at 300 visits per day yet, but we're still getting a steady stream of legitimate questions.

Manishearth

Site stats dropping is normal

Do not panic

goldPseudo

3:35 PM

God willing, if and when we hit the recommended 1500 vpd, our qpd will go up to acceptable levels as well.

Manishearth

panics

:p

Ershad

@goldPseudo Sad.. and when is that 1500 vpd? one year after??

Manishearth

Seriously though, you guys have months before you should even start thinking about stats

goldPseudo

God knows the future where we do not.

Ansari

apparently SE has a recommended timeline of 90 days

but plenty of sites have gone beyond a year

goldPseudo

3:36 PM

i think the site will be beta for 90 days minimum, regardless of how well we do.

Manishearth

I asked aarthi if we should worry about the stats (we're at 70 days) and she's like "your site is waaaay too young"

90days isnt the recommended one

Ansari

oh ok

just minimum then?

Manishearth

Nobody graduates that fast

goldPseudo

i've got an almost psychological obsession with numbers. i don't care how useful they are, i need stats :p

Manishearth

I think you have an evaluation in 90 days (nothing to be afraid of, it just lets you know where you need to improve)

If you get the modship, you get even more stats! And graphs! With moving averages! Gorge yourself! :P

goldPseudo

3:39 PM

if the site isn't viable on it's own, we may find ourselves merged into Christianity to bring their numbers up.

Manishearth

:p

You guys are doing pretty well on the stats side (much better than others) and it doesn't matter if your stats are rock bottom right now

goldPseudo

but given our activity (so far) I think we've got a good chance of being viable on our own.

Manishearth

The only issue you need to worry about is the nonconstructive comments/etc

Which you probably already know

goldPseudo

so long as we can prevent this sectarianist element from destroying everything we've worked for.

Manishearth

Stuff like that can kill a site

Ansari

3:41 PM

haven't seen those since that user was banned

Manishearth

Exactly

Yep

Ansari

*suspended

Manishearth

What happens is that stuff like this scares away new users--in the end, only the ones interesting in fighting stay, and the site is closed

So just watch for that

goldPseudo

there's enough forums for people like that already.

Manishearth

Exactly!

Al Ummat

3:42 PM

Asalamu wa alaikum guys, I have to go, I might be back later Insha'Allah

Manishearth

SE tries hard to distance itself from forums

goldPseudo

@AlUmmat wa 'alaykum assalaam

Manishearth

Wa aleikom assalam :)

Ershad

@yasar11732 If you are interested in knowing fiqh(and a bit of comparative fiqh), this is a good book and i came across its English.translation. which is nice Bidayat Al Mujtahid Wa Nihayat Al Muqtasid - ia600801.us.archive.org/18/items/… , ia600802.us.archive.org/29/items/…

@AlUmmat Walaikkum assalam

yasar11732

3:55 PM

@Ershad Thanks

Do you think we should have a community wiki about what kinds of questions to ask and how to answer?

We saw earlier some new users answering as if this was yahoo answers

We could point them there

Something like "the big how to ask/answer question in islam.SE guide"

RobinHood

of cource

Stack Exchange

5:00 PM

Imam Ash-Shafiee's List of Qualities of a Mujtahid http://islam.stackexchange.com/questions/1250/imam-ash-shafiees-list-of-qualities-of-a-mujtahid?atw=1 #usoolulfiqh

Tweeted by StackIslam on July 5, 2012 at 4:42 PM

Ashu

@Ershad are you there?

Ershad

5:12 PM

@Ashu tell me :)

@yasar11732 community wiki would be a good idea. At the same time, it is bad to restrict people on what kind of questions to ask... because we cannot make an exhaustive list.. btw, I remember there is something related to what to ask. Answers, I completely agree.. there should be guidelines

goldPseudo

that is what the FAQ is for.

Ershad

@goldPseudo Yes

goldPseudo

i'd suggest making a meta post, explaining that you want a FAQ entry to detail the types of answers we expect. people would post their suggestions, community votes the best.

Ershad

@Ashu Sorry, I didn't answer your question about Slaves/concubines then. It is know that several prophets had both wives and concubines.. the slave girl doesnt have to become wife . However, her master can teach her, and free her and then marry her. It is up to him.. However, she doesn't have to be become his wife.. she can be a concubine.

@goldPseudo You stay at chat even at work ?

goldPseudo

i tend to stay logged in. may or may not actually be able to participate.

Ershad

5:24 PM

lol.. i can understand.. you are a ghost here ...lol

goldPseudo

i'm sitting at my desk right now tearing open a huge stack of envelopes.

so plenty of time to glance at the screen and see what's up.

definitely don't expect me to write any actual posts while i'm at work though. those take me way too long to do on breaks.

Ershad

what other SE sites do you participate actively in.

goldPseudo

maybe one or two during my lunch break.

this is the most active. i was semi-active on boardgames.SE, but that's rather fallen to the wayside when islam.SE opened up.

Ershad

First public beta experience as well?

goldPseudo

boardgames.SE is public beta, but it was already a year into it by the time i meandered over there.

Ershad

5:26 PM

Ah.. okay. First private beta?

goldPseudo

yep

Ershad

Is there a way to check if any of your posts was flagged by someone?

I don't need the "someone", just to know if any of my posts is flagged

goldPseudo

no clue. i've never seen anything like that, but it could just be i've never been flagged.

Ershad

if it is not there, it is a good feature to include.. a sort of feedback for the answerer so that he can edit the post... what do you think?

goldPseudo

i would like some sort of feedback on which posts have been DVed, for much the same reason.

Ershad

5:35 PM

Yes, but now that is in comments... and the person who DVs has the option to either give a feedback in comments or not... a good feature would be where it doesn't allow you to DV unless you have a specific reason to criticize..and because the answerer gets that criticism in private and he can improve his post based on that

goldPseudo

i try not to worry too much about votes anyway. and i try to write my posts so they won't get flagged.

Ershad

lol.. okay. probably my positive criticism model doesn't fit the SE system

goldPseudo

unless the post is out-and-out wrong, or clearly redundant, i'll usually suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous downvoting and leave the answer up.

the way I see it, SE is essentially an experts site. Handholding people who don't know what they're doing (yet) doesn't seem to fit into the methodology.

And if people are too sensitive about downvotes or closevotes, they're not going to last long anyway.

Ershad

I agree

goldPseudo

that may just be me though. i can be very critical.

i personally don't like giving reasons for a DV, because the hover text on the downvote button usually says it all: "This answer is not useful."

if i can think of ways to make it useful, then i'm more likely to volunteer them.

but nobody really wants to hear me tear apart their post and tell them why it's bad.

Ershad

5:50 PM

lol.. agree

when I am logged into chat, why i am not logged into the site

i had to log into site separately

yasar11732

I am always logged in to everywhere :)

Ershad

lol.. probably your browser remembers everything

goldPseudo

i blame cookies.

Ershad

so I have clear them?

yasar11732

And when I go to site where browser didn't remember me, SE sees that I am logged in to another SE page, and automagically logs me in and gives a message "welcome, yasar11732. You have been automatically logged in."

And ask me to refresh the page

Ershad

6:04 PM

why isn't this question closed ? - islam.stackexchange.com/q/1245/38

goldPseudo

should it be?

yasar11732

@Ershad see the picture? That is what happens when I go to a SE site that I am associated with.

Ershad

6:26 PM

@yasar11732 Yes. I don't go there directly..before that I have to give my google account details..is it because i use my google account for SE?

@goldPseudo How is it related to Islam

yasar11732

I use my google account too.

Ershad

strange.. what browser do you use? I use firefox

yasar11732

It is asking if some symbol is really a part of the religion or not

I currently use chrome.

@Ershad I think it is on-topic

goldPseudo

@ershad the question is asking what the crescent symbol means in Islam. the question is on-topic. (the answer is, of course, "Nothing.")

Ershad

okay.. I thought it will encourage such questions. Next people will be asking if "biriyani" is the official food of islam.

Biryani

Biryani, biriani, beryani or beriani is a set of rice-based foods made with spices, rice (usually basmati) and meat, fish, eggs or vegetables. The name is derived from the Persian word beryā(n) () which means "fried" or "roasted". The cooking method of Biryani originated in Iran (Persia) and it was brought to the Indian subcontinent by Iranian travelers and merchants. In India, the recipe of biryani developed to its current form. Local variants of this dish are popular not only in the Subcontinent but also in Southeast Asia, Arabia, and within various Asian expatriate communities in t...

goldPseudo

6:30 PM

you mean it isn't?

yasar11732

This is the first time I heard about it.

Ershad

@goldPseudo Yes. @yasar11732 Lol, it is a food most people in the subcontinent make on Eids.

goldPseudo

(now i'm so tempted to actually post that question.. "I heard that Biryani is the official food of Islam. Is there any support in the primary sources for this fact, or is it bid'ah?")

Ershad

@goldPseudo Lol

that is ridiculous

yasar11732

@goldPseudo Post it, so we can close it as an example for newcomers :)

TRiG

6:33 PM

@goldPseudo Skeptics SE has a good rule about "I heard that ..." questions.

yasar11732

On the second thought, should we really close such a question?

Isn't is same as symbol question? Asking if something has a place in religion?

goldPseudo

try as we might, the line between on-topic and off-topic will always be a bit fuzzy.

Ershad

yes. we should probably close it and call the questioner to chat and clear his misconception. It is not a question that requires a "expert" answer. and probably not good information to store in the SE archive for future people to see

goldPseudo

assalaamu 'alaykum, @mohamez

TRiG

@goldPseudo The line between anything and anything will always be a bit fuzzy.

Ershad

6:35 PM

@goldPseudo Agree :)

TRiG

(As I've said more than once on Christianity SE chat.)

goldPseudo

similar to the meta post i put up regarding history. how do we determine if it's "Islamic history", vs "history that involves Muslims"?

yasar11732

Hmm, I guess it depends on who are those muslims. If they have religious importance, it is Islamic history otherwise, history that involves Muslims.

mohamez

Waalaikumu salam @goldPseudo

goldPseudo

it'll always be a bit subjective, and the deciding factor would probably be "Is this a question that's better answered by experts in Islam, or experts in history?"

Ershad

6:37 PM

exactly.. I would completely ignore history...or restrict it to history of Prophets/Companions only. Because then we will get question.. What the Ibn Saud conquest of Hijaz legitimate according to Islam?

*Is

goldPseudo

hasn't come up yet, but i suspect we'll have to deal with a similar situation if we start getting questions regarding dhabihah/halal foods.

would they be best answered by an expert in Islam, or would they be best answered by experts in food? (i.e., cooking.SE)

TRiG

@Ershad I think the question about the crescent symbol is very different to the hypothetical question about biryani. (Mmmmm biryani.) I'd be very surprised if anyone anywhere believes biryani is an "official Islamic food", but very many people do think (for reasons which are well explained in the accepted answer) that the crescent is an official symbol of Islam. It's a common misconception. And clearing up misconceptions is a good thing, isn't it?

yasar11732

@TRiG I agree.

Ansari

fwiw i think the crescent has been associated with islam for a lot of people for a long time, and so that question is squarely on topic, even if that association is tenuous

Ershad

Well, everytime after the Eid, my colleagues demand biriyani from me and when I say I didn't make any, they scorn at me, and say what kind of muslim are you who doesn't make biriyani

TRiG

6:40 PM

It's a bit like the Skeptics SE requirement that questions be sourced. You can't ask on Skeptics, Is X true? You have to ask, I saw this notable source saying that X is true, but I find it hard to believe for reason Y. Is it, in fact, true?

@Ershad Is that actual scorn, or just joshing?

mohamez

hey, guys what are you talking about?

Ansari

just joshing, surely

Ershad

@TRiG just joshing :D

Ansari

also eid isn't really a biryani event

TRiG

@mohamez You mean we're supposed to be talking about something? We're supposed to be coherent here?

Ansari

6:42 PM

at least not where i'm from

yasar11732

@mohamez We are talking about if this question is on-topic

Ershad

lol.. @Ansari we know that :)

yasar11732

5

Q: Why is the "crescent moon and star" being used as the symbol of Islam by some muslims?

Why is the crescent moon with a star a symbol of Islam? Is it a tradition or is it mentioned in the Qur'an?

quran history muslim symbolism

Ansari

no i meant in the sense that biryani isn't really associated with eid

yasar11732

I don't think no one in Turkey ever ate that, and in Turkey we have a lot of Muslim population.

Ershad

6:43 PM

@Ansari youtube.com/watch?v=vIAO7DTZv5I

goldPseudo

eid celebrations are very culture-centric.

TRiG

@mohamez I do like chat. It allows me to let my hair down.

yasar11732

So I guess it is cultural.

mohamez

hhhhhhhhh

TRiG

@yasar11732 I was in Turkey once, briefly. Istanbul only. Fun, but I should have found out more about the place before visiting.

@yasar11732 See what was said above about fuzzy edges. The boundary between religion and culture is notoriously hard to define.

yasar11732

6:46 PM

By the way, when you say Eid in English, does is mean holiday after Ramadan?

I didn't speak about religious topics in English much, so I am not familiar with terminology.

Ershad

@yasar11732 Both "Eids" - Eid-ul-fitr and Eid-ul-Adha.. The one after ramadan and one at the end of Hajj

both are Eids

Anyway, I agree the "moon" question was on-topic

but it might encourage similar question

and hence debate of on - or off topic

Ansari

then we decide that case by case

agreed.

yes

agreed

6:51 PM

i do think the faq should be updated to give some guidelines to question writing.

similar to the skeptics.SE example mentioned earlier.

yasar11732

In Turkey, children goes door to door celebrating people's Eid, and collect candy, we pay visits to extended family members, and eat a lot of this -> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baklava

Ershad

what is it? trick or treat ?

lol...yeah..Eid celebration varies with culture :)

I like turkish delight though :D

yasar11732

Don't worry, no tricks :)

mohamez

we have the same thing here in morocco in some Amazigh villages

Dan Andrews

as-salaamu ‘alaikum

yasar11732

6:54 PM