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4:00 PM
Can we please get silent edits?
FTFY
 
@Nick We don't have silent tag edits.
And I've only been doing 5 ever day or so, it's not a big deal.
 
@Wipqozn Yeah, I realize that.
 
If it was a big deal, they'd create some system to hide them
I just like filling the front page with my name
 
@NickT Actually I think they are just too lazy to.
 
@Wipqozn I'm not trying to take it out on you, I just think it has to be done
 
4:01 PM
@Nick I agree with you, along with many other members.
 
M5 killing a tower at about 2 minutes, jeez
 
@NickT It is a big deal. It'd be a good idea to create a system to hide them. That's why we don't have it yet.
 
@ArdaXi It's a big deal...but no system, suggesting low priority....
 
Is there a feature request on the stackexchange meta I can upvote somewhere?
 
@NickT That's a non sequitur.
 
4:03 PM
@Nick I believe it has been suggested several times, but shot down every time.
 
It's a big deal... but no system, suggesting absolutely nothing.
 
your statement?
 
No, by no twist of counting we have 5 feeds
SE Blog, Gaming Blog, New questions, New meta questions, Gaming like questions and XKCD.
 
@Arda You said, "it's a good idea, that's why we don't have it"
 
This is StackExchange. Things that are a bad idea are accepted, things that are a good idea are declined, amongst bad declined and (very rarely) good accepted.
 
4:04 PM
doesn't make sense
 
@NickT I agree, but you should tell Jeff that, not me.
 
12
Q: Is there a way to edit a question without bumping it to the front page?

Richard MarquezGiven that the Stack Overflow trilogy is to be a resource for googlers, I usually try to go back over my questions/answers and improve them in whatever way that I can; however, I feel this may be inappropriate if there is already an accepted answer. Because edits bump the (already answered) quest...

14
Q: Could we have the ability to mark a change as minor in questions or answers?

Pascal ThiventIt would be nice to allow users to mark a change in an answer (or question) as minor (e.g. for a simple spelling or grammar correction). A change marked as minor wouldn't push the question on top of the list of questions on the home page or in the feeds. It wouldn't trigger any notification. This...

4
Q: Retagging/Bumping Etiquette

squircle(Semi-related to http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/46205/too-much-retagging) I have been going through a bunch of single-use tags on SuperUser (misspellings, tag synonyms etc.) and retagging them with proper, commonly-used tags. However, this causes a lot of unnecessary bumping: Even acc...

 
"Imagine if people could make changes to the system without anybody noticing."
Yes, imagine Jeff changed the system without telling anyone.
Just... imagine. Oh, wait.
rolls eyes
 
I understand their reasoning, and it makes sense. However I think adding in a separate minor edits feed would solve the problem.
 
@Wipqozn No it doesn't.
The only argument I've ever heard against it is "but what if they make a terrible edit?!"
The solution is to add a page on /tools with recent edits, like there used to be.
 
4:07 PM
How about just having 'minor edits' hidden from the site if nobody is logged on
 
@NickT Err?
 
and only let people >X k rep be able to tag them as minor
 
I suggested making it a reputation-based privilege.
 
@ArdaXi Which is a good idea.
 
@ArdaXi what's wrong with that
 
4:08 PM
The response: "but what if they make a terrible edit?!"
 
Look for example at GnomeSlice's tagging.
 
?
 
I'm sorry to pick on him, but he's the perfect example.
 
What's the actual problem with bumping all those questions
 
4:10 PM
@NickT They fill up the front page.
 
The homepage is our business card
We should mind not littering it :)
 
Who are we concerned about showing it to? Existing/experienced users or new people?
 
Everybody
 
Answerers mostly
 
A homepage littered with old stuff sucks for new and old
 
4:12 PM
Equally?
 
Whether they're new users or old veterans, the question list needs to attract people to questions they can answer
 
@Brett: Email'd you regarding NYCC stuffs. And on that note, I'm off to go drive in circles for 8 hours. Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
 
@LessPop_MoreFizz Enjoy work.
 
So how about letting people select if they want to ignore minor edits or not, and have that as the default for lower-rep/anon users?
 
I mean, I'm all for fixing things for new users so we have a larger community
But also, that doesn't fix the problem for ME
 
4:16 PM
@NickT That just adds clutter.
 
How?
 
Having a /tools page for edits sounds perfect.
I mean, it's the exact system Wikipedia uses.
@NickT By having an extra option?
 
That's what I was getting at, but the thing is here the edits are used to determine what questions are 'active'
 
@NickT Right. Major edits should be used for that.
This is why it should be a high-rep privilege, at which point users should be able to determine what constitutes a 'minor' edit.
If a user abuses the privilege there's always the option of flagging the user.
 
I dunno, I'm not uber-leet user, but I like just surveying the main page for what's going on, be it new or some update of old
 
4:18 PM
I think /tools sounds like a good option - we already have /review after all.
 
You can't flag the user. The only thing you can do to users are talking to them and suspending them if that didn't work.
 
But, as I think @NickT is getting at, who would /tools be available to?
 
You can also rename them funny names, but that doesn't really fix anything does it?
 
@Nick It is available to 10k users.
 
I don't know if I'll ever get to 20k
 
4:19 PM
@badp That fixes everything.
Okay, right then. Really need to leave. Work! Late!
 
So if I'm not a 10k user then forget me?
 
I'm not making up this /tools feature, it's already existent.
@NickT No, then you don't get to see the behind-the-scenes stats pages.
 
@ArdaXi Yeah, I understand that
 
That's how it's always been.
The front-page isn't intended as a page to monitor edits, it just happens to be one where you can.
 
How would putting it at /tools help me at all though?
 
4:21 PM
@NickT When we are talking about minor edits, we mean really minor. LIke changing a tag, or fixing some minor grammar issues.
 
@NickT Help you with what?
 
The front page is intended as a page to monitor everything
 
Showing you what we want to hide?
 
Reviewing new edits
with something I can't use
 
@NickT New minor edits*
 
4:21 PM
@NickT Reviewing has always been a 10k privilege.
 
A list of edits should probably be available for <10k
 
We're not talking about hiding all edits, just minor edits.
 
I mean, for scale
 
Minor edits shouldn't need reviewing.
 
Who would be able to mark 'minor' edits?
 
4:22 PM
Only if it's abused
@NickT That is for the team to decide.
If it's abused, we don't want to show most users that, hence /tools.
 
What's the point of hiding /tools for so long anyway
 
17 secs ago, by Arda Xi
If it's abused, we don't want to show most users that, hence /tools.
 
@ArdaXi Yeah, but at 5k you're pretty invested, right?
 
/tools highlights the worst content on the site, as it were.
 
@ArdaXi actually nvm, reviewing isn't 10k, not sure what it is
 
4:23 PM
@Nick That you should ask the SE team.
@NickT Reviewing edits is.
 
I think review is 1 rep, you just don't have a link to it tho
 
I can't believe it's not site-by-site
 
? no it's not
I can see /review
 
@Nick why would it be?
 
4:23 PM
10k here is not 10k on SO
 
@Nick Why not?
 
@NickT Yes, but that's nothing to do with edits.
 
Less throughput, WAY less throughput
 
@Nick So?
 
4:24 PM
i.e. Even if someone wants to help, it's much longer to get there
 
Are you saying a cop in America should need more training than a cop in the Netherlands?
Because America is bigger?
 
@ArdaXi You misunderstand his reasoning.
His reasoning is that it takes longer to get 10k on gaming then SO due to the lower volume of questions.
 
@ArdaXi That's a terrible analogy, but I do sort of get the idea that we're looking for dedication
 
@Wipqozn I understand his reasoning, reputation takes longer to get here.
@Nick How is it?
You're saying it's easier to get rep on SO than on Gaming.
 
Yes
 
4:26 PM
It still takes roughly the same amount of activity.
 
How are most of those mod tools even actual power? They're just utility, and everything that a typical user would do with them (afaik) is subject to review (by bumping) anyways
 
4 mins ago, by Arda Xi
/tools highlights the worst content on the site, as it were.
 
16
A: Could we have the ability to mark a change as minor in questions or answers?

Robert CartainoImplementing any sort of "don't bump" functionality would also delay accountability and transparency for those edits. Notifying users of edits in the system allows them to take a look at the content and make sure there isn't something fishy going on. Imagine if people could make changes to the s...

 
And if I stumble on a question with a pending suggested edit, I thought I can approve it anyway
 
But you can continuously answer questions on SO, there's no shortage of them coming in
 
4:27 PM
@NickT You can.
 
@NickT You can look at most flags for moderator attention. Ain't that power.
 
@Nick But you still need roughly the same amount of answers.
 
So why is /review/suggested-edits hidden though
 
@ArdaXi But over a significantly longer period of time
Which is my point
 
@Nick I realise. That's the point I'm disagreeing with.
Privileges shouldn't be granted just for staying longer than anyone else.
 
4:28 PM
You're saying you can reach 10k here in the same number of days/weeks?
 
@Nick No, I am not.
I'm disagreeing with the idea that it matters.
 
Arda is saying that although you took longer to get to 10k, you still have as much experience as the person who took less time to get there.
 
Exactly.
 
@Nick You can reack 10k in significantly less answers and questions actually
 
Yes, I agree with that
@badp here?
 
4:29 PM
And it's the experience we're looking for, not the amount of time.
 
@Wipqozn Really? Define "experience", and what is actually relevant on the site?
 
Yes, here.
 
@NickT We define it as "reputation".
It's the numerical figure under your name.
 
What if some user never visits meta.*, do they have the same actual level of experience?
 
@NickT Experience, yes.
 
4:30 PM
Experience using the site and knowing how it works? I doubt it
 
@NickT Meta doesn't explain how to use the site or how it works.
That's MSO.
 
I'm not sure what else I can say, I suppose we just disagree on when a user is ready to access /tools
 
So meta involvement doesn't connote any additional experience?
 
@Nick I don't necessarily agree with the arbitrary 10k limit.
 
MSO activity doesn't give you SO reputation or SO privileges, only MSO reputation and MSO privileges
 
4:31 PM
I do however believe it should be the same on every site.
@NickT Not with using the site, no.
It gives you more experience on the meta side of things.
 
Why does the election thing show meta questions/answers if it's totally uncorrelated with experience?
 
@NickT You're mistaking experience with using the site with experience with the site in total.
 
So meta.* has nothing to do with what goes on at *?
 
Anyway, dinner is ready, so I'll have to leave. Be back later.
 
@NickT Because moderators are supposed to know how the system knows, in addition to having field knowledge
 
4:33 PM
@ArdaXi Enjoy.
 
Yeah, but so much of what goes on at the site is tied to what's decided at meta
 
Even if you're the world's greatest and largest expert in videogames, if you don't care about how to run the site... people should consider that when voting
After all, if you're the world's greatest and largest expert in whatever, you likely have greater and grander things you can do than moderating a site on teh internets.
 
So the person who is the largest expert at videogames you'll give access to /tools and /suggested-edits so they can approve all sorts of [*-rec] edits or whatever?
 
@NickT That's because they're rewards to active users
 
Do people lose "experience" by approving bad edits?
 
4:35 PM
You need field knowledge to review edits
/tools is mostly though a carrot ahead of your mouth
gamification is also about that.
 
6 mins ago, by Arda Xi
@NickT We define it as "reputation".
3 mins ago, by Arda Xi
@NickT You're mistaking experience with using the site with experience with the site in total.
 
Besides from flags, most stuff in /tools is publicly available
 
0
Q: Minecraft: What texture pack is this?

fbreretoI recently saw this on Reddit and would like to use the same texture pack, but I don't know what it is called: Any ideas?

 
Changing definition of experience
 
If you look at the top questions on the homepage you'll see what have close votes on it
If you look at a question with a suggested edit you'll be able to see it and review it
You can actually sort of see the list of suggested edits if you know the URL schema
and the URL schema is http://gaming.stackexchange.com/suggested-edits/{id}
the most recent having id 1161
 
4:38 PM
Yeah, but why is reviewing edits so radically different than editing questions?
 
It isn't.
Let me give you an example...
 
Because I can give a user 2 reps for it?
 
2
A: Should I worry about territorial contiguity when choosing what territories to not save every month?

BanditoBunnyA red zone level 4 adds +1 infestation to each uncleaned neighbor area each turn, if you are not getting ready from your first turn you end up with completely red map by 10th turn. So I choose the next area to clean based on: How many uncleaned neighbor areas it has How well it cuts the map, e...

@NickT Look at the edit button for this post
 
yeah, so I can do it, they're just all hidden
like I'm not supposed to know
 
The way it's intended to be, it's not something you need to bother with
Edit review is designed as a burden
A burden "we" ask mods and 10kers to bear.
 
4:42 PM
But editing at general?
 
@NickT Editing isn't, because you only edit what you want to edit. Editing is a power.
 
Having to manually flip through questions and see how bad they are is a bigger burden
 
@NickT Which is meant as discouragement.
 
@NickT At 10k that burden is relieved.
 
so I shouldn't bother?
 
4:43 PM
Basically, you're not asked to do that kind of work.
 
@NickT Exactly!
 
Got it.
 
At 10k you'll be able to help if you want to.
The experience is geared towards experts who have little time on their hands, and you want this little time to be spent looking at questions rather than doing housekeeping
If you can find the time to do housekeeping too, all the power to you :)
 
@badp In other words, badp has too much time on his hands.
2
 
Yes.
 
4:45 PM
I can't spend my time looking at questions, I'm too busy looking at... tag edits on the front page
 
You can always decide to not bother with this reputation nonsense and become a moderator, like I have.
 
(just to bring it full circle)
 
@Nick Which is why we need minor edits.
 
Then you get even more power!
 
Power which has turned @badp into the evil tyrannical overlord he is today!
 
4:46 PM
Hmm, at least on Gaming, edits aren't really suggested all that much.
 
@badp I have always meant to ask: why did you change your color from yellow to blue?
 
Become a evil tyrannical overlord today! well, in a week! If you nominated yourself that is! Otherwise well, it's in just a year! Give or take!
 
@Nick He did that when he became a mod.
 
Yellow not mod enough?
 
@Nick Blue diamond, et cetera
 
4:47 PM
@Nick Look at his name.
Moderators get a blue shade.
 
Yeah, I get it
 
Badp just decided to apply it to his avatar.
 
Still, I gotta say I liked the yellow better
 
@badp stole my power! :O
 
@Nick The badp works in mysterious ways.
 
4:48 PM
When a user is elected moderator, he is granted the power through application of a few yottawatts of energy from our lazers. In addition to granting powers, you become a diamond. Literally. Moderators get some swag to go back to their human appearance when in public; otherwise our fingers would sparkle on whatnot. That'd kill the atmosphere in the bridge of this wonderful ship.
 
@Nick Really? I dislike the yellow myself.
 
@badp You... sparkle.
 
@Powerlord I said overlord, not powerlord.
@ArdaXi Such is the power
 
So basically you're a Twilight vampire.
 
@ArdaXi gcrkeudxoeuroeatu
 
4:50 PM
@ArdaXi If vampires moderated sites and weren't vampires and were made of diamond and you'd replace Twilight with Gaming Stack Exchange.
 
The sky's are made of diamonds
 
Actually I haven't renamed anybody funny names. Yet.
 
I went ahead and edited this post to make it more accurate. Tried to edit as little as possible.
6
Q: Gaming Promotional Grant - Round 4 Game Selection Thread, for 8/30/11

Brett White ΨIf you unfamiliar with the cavalcade of fun that is The Gaming Promotional Grant, please follow the link. Voting for the current round ended Wednesday, so you should have checked out this post if you wished to get in on that batch of games. Now, to keep the grant going weekly, I present to you.....

@badp I expected you to half a year ago.
 
@ArdaXi Sorry to disappoint!
Besides I wouldn't rename you.
I was eyeing Community.
 
Why not? :(
 
4:54 PM
@ArdaXi I'm leaving that to the new mods!
 
@ArdaXi He's probably afraid you'll beat him up.
 
I can't rename all the things by myself!
 
Rename all the things!
 
@badp Pretty sure you have so far!
 
@Powerlord I might have been replacing latin 'o' letters with cyrillic 'o' letters.
Actually that sounds like a good starting idea for a new name for Community.
Community needs a new identity I say!
 
4:57 PM
checks Nope, no 'o'.
 
I mean, we have a Community with attitude! Heck! A community with reputation!
Will you look at that three whoppin' reps.
I think Community needs shades or something.
Brommunity.
 
@badp That dude's a jerk. I've seen his edits.
 
He should really be given a gravatar.
 
@Nick You haven't seen his flags.
@Wipqozn The problem with that is we can't do that without changing his email for obvious reasons. I don't think we can do that... safely.
 
@badp Understandable.
 

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