English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Noah

1:00 PM

@tchrist I am not a bot, at least thats for sure ;)

F'x

@ShyamK run while you still have a life :)

Noah

@ShyamK welcome

Shyam K

@F'x hehe..

tchrist

@ShyamK Technically, English is not always non-technical.

Noah

@F'x dont scare him right at the beginning

Shyam K

1:02 PM

@Noah thanks :)

Noah

By they way guys, Matt is always here... no matter what. I don't think he ever sleeps... Or he might be a bot :)

Shyam K

@Noah I don't scare easy ( *there are no monsters under the bed... there are no monsters under the bed * )

Matt Эллен

bzzzt I am no robot bzzt what makes you think that

Shyam K

well I shall be back l8r.. see ya'll then..

:D

Matt Эллен

C U

Noah

1:04 PM

Because humans sleep..

and you dont seem to...

Matt Эллен

maybe this is all my dream.

Noah

maybe...

Matt Эллен

I hope not, because I'd like to think my dreams would be better than this

Noah

Do you wana get onboard with Noah on his arc...

tchrist

Aug 13 at 13:31, by tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA chants That is not dead which can eternal lie, and in strange æons, even death may die.

Matt Эллен

1:07 PM

@Noah I don't have another Terrifying Orc Head to go with

Noah

Yea, it's better to dream about girls than English geeks

@MattЭллен than you might well get under storm

Matt Эллен

I see

RegDwight АΑA

@ShyamK plain color means beta. Size is popularity, yes. You can use the list view instead.

Matt Эллен

I am awake. really! I'm not dozing off at all

Cerberus

1:22 PM

Hello.

Matt Эллен

Hello!

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA I haven't really gotten used to the categories, like culture vs arts, etc.

Cerberus

What is lurking in this room?

Mitch

@RegDwightАΑA but..but.. so the dude is trollish, and the question is not about English but... anyway it's GR.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus welll. I thought I saw some shadowy wings...

Mitch

1:29 PM

@Cerberus gah! when people mention jQuery or SQL, I usually figure, oh shit, I should know that, but the wording of the question is so beyond basic, that I couldn't answer intelligently, just things like 'did you forget a semicolon?'

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist the algorithm relies on dice. Ask here for details:

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Wingèd, too?

RegDwight АΑA

tchrist

@MattЭллен Ahah! And now at last the Conspiracy is Unmasked!

Cerberus

@Mitch Such modesty. But nothing will stop us.

@tchrist Blasphemy. I will have nothing of this.

Mitch

1:33 PM

@ShyamK 'totally dedicated'? We define it. If there's a difference in usage between people or communities, we decide which one is proper and which one to disparage. The French have their Academy; we (and I mean we English speakers, have us (we here at ELU).

tchrist

@Mitch The French may have their Academy, but we have our Allþing. It's better in all ways.

Isn't it Alþing?

Sure.

OK.

The key letter is the thorn. That's what keeps the French out.

Mitch

1:39 PM

@tchrist What do the Icelanders have? It's probably that couple down the street (you know their son, the financier, barely got out of the crisis with a shirt to his name).

@Cerberus: is there a dutch version of l'Academie? (sorry tom, no accent)

tchrist

@Mitch Shirts are overvalued.

Mitch

That's the problem with the market.

The 2008 shirt boom market is what started the world wide depression.

tchrist

@Cerberus Alþing is like pinging the broadcast address.

Mitch

@tchrist They would totally ruin it too if they had shown up.

Robusto

If you hide in the hide you will get a good hiding.

Mitch

1:44 PM

Why didn't Tolkien just say from the beginning that he was writing Norse mythology based fanfiction?

directly based that is.

tchrist

@Mitch No kidding. They already screwed up the tongue badly enough as it is. Try not to have any of their words in what you say. It takes a bit of work, but it can be done and is not too hard. Mostly you keep to nice short words like these, full of thorns.

Mitch

those batards!

tchrist

@Mitch += Celtic

Mitch

@tchrist OK them too.

and maybe some Nibelungenlied? except without all the sex.

tchrist

@Mitch README.

Mitch

1:46 PM

SFW?

tchrist

@Mitch Eh?

Shyam K

hello again :)

Mitch

links scare me on principle. When I get there will I get crazy cross-celtic-nordic erotica?

tchrist

@Mitch I don't do slash.

Cerberus

@Mitch Yes, we have the Taalunie (Language Union).

It regulated spelling for Dutch around the globe.

Mainly coöperation between Holland and Flanders.

Matt Эллен

1:50 PM

Damn you Flanders!

Cerberus

But there are probably some members from (former or current) colonies in it too.

@tchrist The broadcast address?

@Mitch And Christian. And Olde English.

@MattЭллен Naaahh they're OK.

Matt Эллен

:D

tchrist

@Mitch Dimitri Fimi's 2006 paper "Mad" Elves and "elusive beauty": some Celtic strands of Tolkien's mythology is a scholarly investigation of high repute, and well worth the read.

Cerberus

Or are you still mad at them for the parts that you once conquered and lost?

Mitch

@tchrist "eyes-plitting Celtic names." [sic]

@Cerberus couldn't control the Afrikaaners though.

Matt Эллен

1:53 PM

@Cerberus hehehe, no. I was doing a Homer Simpson impression

Cerberus

@Mitch Alas, no.

@MattЭллен Oh, I see...

tchrist

@Cerberus Network broadcast address goes to all hosts on that subnet. The Big Stick version is 255.255.255.255.

Cerberus

OK...

Mitch

@Cerberus is there an anti-English (or anti-German) bias there for new words or do they just accept and regulate (making sure they spell the English right)?

Cerberus

@Mitch We all share an anti-English bias nowadays: it is considered vulgar (in the traditional sense) to use too many words borrowed from English, though of course many are acceptable. Before the war, our bias was mainly against German. One of our foremost magazines of popular linguistics, Onze Taal, was founded to counter the influx of German words.

Borrowing German words is now never vulgar any more.

Nearly always acceptable.

Matt Эллен

2:02 PM

how vulgar

tchrist

@MattЭллен You mean wool-gathering.

Matt Эллен

Hush Humpty

Robusto

@Cerberus You could call it the Vulgeht.

Cerberus

I'm not sure whether an anti-French bias ever existed; French was traditionally the biggest source of borrowings, and we still have tons of French words (many more than German ones). But modern nationalism only emerged in the 19th century, when the influence of French was already waning—except among the higher classes, which is probably why it was never looked down on, as far as I know.

user19161

So many balrog messages starred.

6

tchrist

2:04 PM

@Robusto That won't keep the sheep out.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен It evinced a lack of education or culture, and a tendency to value superficial things like money and popularity too highly. Really bad. We mock it daily.

@Robusto We already have the Vulgate.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus and yet you speak English now!

tchrist

@Cerberus I should think that an anti-German bias would increase in the postwar period, not decrease.

user19161

@Cerberus Though money can buy most things in this world, it's true.

Cerberus

Speaking a different language is good; corrupting a language is bad.

tchrist

2:06 PM

@Cerberus Spock was framed!

Robusto

@Cerberus Money is not superficial. It's official.

user19161

No money, no honey.

Cerberus

@tchrist But the German threat had vanished. It is possible that German was still warned against for some time after the war—I don't know exactly when English overtook it.

@JasperLoy Not the important things, not here.

@tchrist Huh?

@Robusto Same thing.

tchrist

@Cerberus The whole Vulgate Affair, in which it was alleged that Spock was sneaking into Nurse Chapel's quarters after dark.

user19161

Wow, I got two stars in this room today, amazing. This means a miracle is about to happen...

Cerberus

2:09 PM

Eh I don't know much about the first Star Trek series, sorry.

Can someone star Kit's starred message, lest it fall off the list?

RegDwight АΑA

I can unstar the rest.

Matt Эллен

yay!

Cerberus

Thanks for the star!

@RegDwightАΑA The non-balroggish, yes, please.

Matt Эллен

bah. some guy called matt has entered the Maths room and now I'm being told about his stupid pings

Cerberus

Eek.

Is his name just Matt?

Matt Эллен

2:12 PM

yes

I've even left the room now

people have either stopped pining him, or the system has caught up with itself

good either way

Cerberus

Annoying.

Matt Эллен

Yes. SE needs better AI

ΜετάEd

Do Vulcans have wings, or not?

Cerberus

Pinging should give an error when two users with the same name can be addressed.

Vulcan (mythology)

In ancient Roman religion and myth, Vulcan (Latin: Vulcanus) is the god of both beneficial and hindering fire, including the fire of volcanoes. Vulcan is often depicted with a blacksmith's hammer. The Vulcanalia was the annual festival held August 23 in his honor. His Greek counterpart is Hephaestus, the god of fire and smithery. In Etruscan religion, he is identified with Sethlans. The god belongs to the most ancient stage of Roman religion: Varro citing the Annales Maximi, recalls that king Titus Tatius had dedicated altars to a series of deities among which Vulcan is mentioned. Et...

Matt Эллен

autocomplete should work properly and then there would be no need for such nonsense

Cerberus

2:15 PM

If Daedalus could make wings, then Vulcan certainly could.

@MattЭллен Yes, and the shorter username should be addressed when a ping could address two names.

Matt Эллен

Yes

Cerberus

That does mean that non-alphabetic characters should be forbidden.

Non-Latin.

Matt Эллен

No, I mean I should be able to tab complete MetaEd's name properly

instead of not working at all

tchrist

@Cerberus Define.

Cerberus

Too lazy.

@MattЭллен But he is using Greek letters...can you even type them?

ΜετάEd

2:20 PM

Sure you can type them. But you should also be able to autocomplete from them.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus No, but If I type M, then I should be able to tab complete from a list

at the moment all I get is Mitch

ΜετάEd

@MattЭллен Right. The names should be mapped to ASCII for autocomplete.

RegDwight АΑA

I wonder what the superping does.

@μετάed

Ha.

It actually lowercases correctly.

ΜετάEd

pong

Right!

Cerberus

@MattЭллен But Greek M ≠ Latin M.

Matt Эллен

2:22 PM

@ΜετάEd

Cerberus

@ΜετάEd I meant Matt.

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus said he who kept telling me that all three As in my name were the same.

You make no sense, Cerberus.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Did it work?

RegDwight АΑA

You contradict yourself as it suits you.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus oh

Cerberus

2:22 PM

@RegDwightАΑA Your As are different.

They look normal to me.

RegDwight АΑA

Well too late.

Cerberus

They are just As.

RegDwight АΑA

I see no difference between Μ and M, either.

Cerberus

You can't see it.

RegDwight АΑA

ΜMМ

Cerberus

2:23 PM

But it is there.

RegDwight АΑA

That was my point about the As which you said was bollocks.

Cerberus

Your As are completely different.

They are just As.

You just said so yourself.

As.

RegDwight АΑA

Go troll @tchrist.

My super powers are of a different kind.

Cerberus

Trolling you is way funner.

Because from time to time you seemed to think I was actually serious.

Matt Эллен

I am very serious.

as you well know

ΜετάEd

2:28 PM

If you type or paste a Greek letter mu, does it autocomplete my handle?

Matt Эллен

yes

ΜετάEd

Well that's something, anyway.

Matt Эллен

I didn't realise it was a greek M

my complaint is invalid

RegDwight АΑA

Where is that?

Cerberus

Always.

RegDwight АΑA

2:29 PM

Valid is in Always?

My geography is rusty.

We should play some guessing games again.

Cerberus

Always includes the way from somewhere to anywhere.

@RegDwightАΑA Then post a map!

RegDwight АΑA

When I'm at home.

tchrist

@Cerberus ꝕ LATIN SMALL LETTER P WITH SQUIRREL TAIL

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus We played quite a few recently but you wouldn't participate.

Cerberus

@tchrist Yes, thank you.

@RegDwightАΑA What!?

How recently?

Matt Эллен

2:31 PM

OK. how about I try to draw a map, and you try to guess what I was thinking of

Cerberus

Cool!

RegDwight АΑA

Aug 3 at 21:50, by Joseph Weissman

tchrist

@Cerberus Squirrels are good, preferably monosyllabic ones.

RegDwight АΑA

Aug 3 at 21:51, by RegDwight АΑA

Cerberus

Oh, Shanghai.

RegDwight АΑA

2:31 PM

Aug 3 at 22:11, by Matt Эллен

tchrist

@Cerberus Ꝝ LATIN CAPITAL LETTER RUM ROTUNDA

RegDwight АΑA

Aug 3 at 22:31, by RegDwight АΑA

tchrist

Yum, rum.

Cerberus

Random cities are hard.

I got Shanghai.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist I'm holding out for LATIN SMALL LETTER VOOM.

Cerberus

2:32 PM

@tchrist Thank you, dear. Why don't you put it on the kitchen table.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwightАΑA I remember that one...

RegDwight АΑA

They are not random. They were all very easy. Except Matt's. There's clues in the transcript, too.

cornbread ninja

Could we have the name of this room changed to English Language & Balrogs?

5

Cerberus

Right. You would need clues.

Matt Эллен

Brasilia

Cerberus

2:33 PM

@cornbreadninja Yes!

cornbread ninja

@Cerberus :D

waits for it

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Waiting on your drawing.

Matt Эллен

oh! aren't you going to guess at the older maps above?

RegDwight АΑA

@cornbreadninja I can change your name to cornbalrog.

cornbread ninja

@RegDwightАΑA huzzah!

Cerberus

2:34 PM

@MattЭллен I guessed the one that was guessable.

ΜετάEd

They're all guessable.

I guess.

That was easy.

I'll only do outlines, because real maps take too long

tchrist

2:35 PM

@Cerberus These are all Latin letters that Ed can use: æ Ↄ ȸ ʚ ɤ Ᵹ Ⱶ ⱶ ᴉ ɟ ʄ ỻ Ꞁ ʎ ɱ ᵑ œ ɔ ɷ ȣ ⱷ Ꞃ ↆ ↇ ↁ ↈ ↀ ↂ Ꝛ ꝛ ᴙ Ɍ ɍ ᵲ ɹ ʴ ᴚ ɺ ᶉ ɻ ʵ ⱹ ɼ Ɽ ɽ ɾ ᵳ ɿ ʁ ʶ ꝵ Ꞅ ꞅ ſ ẞ ß Ꞇ ᴟ ɰ ʌ ʍ ƍ Ꝣ ʒ Ƹ Þ þ Ƿ ƿ Ꝩ ꝩ Ꝫ ꝫ Ꝭ ꝭ Ꝯ ꝯ ꝰ ꝸ ƻ Ꜫ ꜫ Ꜭ ꜭ Ꜯ ꜯ Ƨ ƽ ʔ ɂ Ꜣ Ꞌ ʕ ǂ ʘ ʬ ʭ.

@RegDwightАΑA lol

@MattЭллен Eire!

@Cerberus ding!

@tchrist You call those Latin?

They do look pretty.

You probably mean they are in some font called "Latin".

RegDwight АΑA

room topic changed to English Language & Usage: aka The Incomprehensible Room. Now with 89% more Balrogs. (no tags)

tchrist

2:37 PM

@Cerberus Each of those codepoints has the Unicode Script=Latin character property.

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA Thanks!

tchrist

And thus, are Latin.

Cerberus

@tchrist You have the frapunzel property in my system. Doesn't mean people commonly call you that.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwightАΑA yay!

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Another one!

Or shall I?

tchrist

2:39 PM

@Cerberus Immaterial; Rapunzel is not a defined Unicode character property in UAX #44, the font of all official character-property names.

cornbread ninja

@MattЭллен seconded!

Matt Эллен

tchrist

goes off questing for balrogs

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Holland!

Matt Эллен

ding!

RegDwight АΑA

2:40 PM

@tchrist use the search box.

Cerberus

@tchrist It is in my system.

RegDwight АΑA

Just imagine all the people searching for Balrogs, and now finding this room! We'll be full!

@MattЭллен Italy.

To be precise, the hate child of Italy and Turkey.

Cerberus

RegDwight АΑA

Blame Canada.

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA We're destroying the internet! Yay!

@RegDwightАΑA Ding!

ΜετάEd

2:41 PM

@tchrist Unfortunately, none of those are the initial letter of the word "μετά".

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA There at last fell the King of the Noldor, and flame sprang from his helm when it was cloven. He was overborne by the Balrogs and beaten to the earth and his banners blue and silver were trodden into dust.

Cerberus

Glorfindel had blue and silver?

tchrist

. . . trodden clovers . . .

Fingon.

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist very nice. Did you write that?

Cerberus

Ah.

I guess Glorfindel wasn't a king.

tchrist

2:42 PM

But now in the western battle Fingon was surrounded by a tide of foes thrice greater than all that was left to him, and the Balrogs came against him.

@RegDwightАΑA I typed that.

RegDwight АΑA

Friggon Fingon.

ΜετάEd

@tchrist The origin of the Noldor Bar, a lovely confection of beaten nougat and clover honey.

Norway.

no

2:44 PM

I did say "No".

Matt Эллен

this one is even less well drawn

Thailand.

Nope

Sri Lanka.

no

2:45 PM

Sri is Russian for "shit" (verb, imperative).

Japan.

No

Isle of Man.

No

Denmark, then.

2:46 PM

It is a bit bigger than Sri Lanka

no

Two Sri Lankas.

:D

Madagaskar.

It's not an island

Australia.

2:47 PM

lol

no

cornbread ninja

Brasil.

Matt Эллен

north is at the top

RegDwight АΑA

Then it's not that badly drawn, after all.

Matt Эллен

@cornbreadninja no

cornbread ninja

Greenland.

Matt Эллен

2:48 PM

no

where are Cerberus's guesses?

cornbread ninja

That southern penis is distracting.

RegDwight АΑA

See, I told you he wouldn't participate.

@cornbreadninja that's Florida.

tchrist

But at the last Gothmog, Lord of the Balrogs, whom Ecthelion afterward slew in Gondolin, smote him to the ground, and there he would have perished, but Maedhros and three other of his sons in that moment came up with force to his aid, and the Balrogs fled back to Angband.

cornbread ninja

@RegDwightАΑA America's wang!

"They prefer the Sunshine State."

tchrist

Who is "he"?

cornbread ninja

2:49 PM

@tchrist tri-dog

Matt Эллен

the coast is on the north and west sides

RegDwight АΑA

Netherlands.

Matt Эллен

are you looking at the wrong drawing?

RegDwight АΑA

Are you?

Matt Эллен

:D

cornbread ninja

2:54 PM

Scotland.

Matt Эллен

No

RegDwight АΑA

I have it.

You don't know it yourself!

Matt Эллен

lol

Robusto

@cornbreadninja OE scot meant pig. I wonder ...

Matt Эллен

I know what I meant to draw

cornbread ninja

2:55 PM

@Robusto Swineland.

RegDwight АΑA

Robusto

Your words, not mine.

cornbread ninja

Swinezerland.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA Rooshia.

Cerberus

@MattЭллен Tunisia?

RegDwight АΑA

2:56 PM

@Robusto No.

@Cerberus ding!

Yay!

@RegDwightАΑA China

That was easy.

:D

2:56 PM

All of the above.

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA Mother Russia, d'oh.

RegDwight АΑA

@MattЭллен you are China. I can draw.

@Cerberus no.

@tchrist ^

2:56 PM

Well, a foreign country anyway. Who cares which?

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus Leftearth.

ΜετάEd

@Cerberus Funny.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus that's the east coast of middle earth

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA Close.

Robusto

@Cerberus Mordor most foul.

Cerberus

2:57 PM

@MattЭллен Close.

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus Lefteastearth.

Cerberus

@Robusto Partially correct.

@RegDwightАΑA Closer.

tchrist

Thither had Ungoliantë fled from the whips of the Balrogs, and had dwelt there a while, filling the hideous ravines with their deadly gloom, and there still, when she had passed away, her foul broods lurked and wove their evil nets; and the thin waters were spilled from Ered Orgorath were all defiled, and perilous to drink, for the hearts of those that tasted them were filled with shadows of madness and despair.