English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Theta30

00:07

@z7sgѪ perhaps some people do not like bdsm questions

z7sg Ѫ

@Theta30 Such people have no place on this site.

Theta30

00:39

ok my close vote was declined

-5

Q: Why does this sentence use perfect tense?

Would the meaning of the following change if the sentence was "All they know that they have to surrender"? All they know that they've had to surrender. Does "would've been" in the following imply the warriors were not actually present? And these gothic warriors would've been terrified. ...

so perhaps I should answer it

simchona

01:33

@Theta30 It's not a vote to close if it can be declined

Theta30

?

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

School is tommarow... :((

simchona

@Theta30 You don't have close votes if someone can deny them

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū tomorrow

And I start Wednesday, so I feel your pain

Theta30

@simchona i voted to close and it was declined,

simchona

You flagged. There's a difference

Theta30

01:35

so it means those who declined my vote think the question is fine

oh yeah, flagged

simchona

But the question isn't great but it is understandable. What did you flag it for?

Theta30

for not a real question

anyway, as you can see, I answered it

simchona

@Theta30 Yup. It's so weird not being able to ping you as Bogdan any more

Cerberus

Hi.

You are Bogdan!?

Theta30

yes

Cerberus

01:41

Why did you change your name?

Theta30

well, first I changed in chat because here it is more informal

Cerberus

Huh you can have different names in chat and on the main site?

Theta30

yes, it surprised me too

in other SE sites, I have my real name

Cerberus

I see you as Theta30 too on the main ELU site.

user19161

@Theta30 That's what makes it even more confusing!

Theta30

01:44

lol, yeah I am in an identity crisis

user19161

Anyway it's confusing enough to ping some people here whose real names I already know.

Cerberus

This is too confusing for me.

simchona

Hi @Jasper!

@JasperLoy I could lie and say you don't really know my name.

Cerberus

I will use the name you are using here and forget all about your history. You are a new person.

Theta30

That's good. Born again ELU

simchona

01:45

Hallelujah!

user19161

@simchona OK, but I tell no lies here. This is my real name.

user19161

@Cerberus Sounds very religious!

Cerberus

@JasperLoy Yes, I should start a cult!

Who wants to join?

user19161

And everything I say here is real too.

user19161

drinks water and thinks of what cult Cerb is forming

Theta30

01:53

ELU witnesses

user19161

Anyway, I recommend everyone reads "The road less travelled". It does not matter what religion you have, or none. It is largely a book on psychology, love and personal growth. It changed my thinking a lot when I read it at 16.

Cerberus

Cool.

user19161

In fact the book changed my whole perspective on life. But I don't like the sequels to it.

Theta30

who wrote it?

user19161

David M Scott Peck, a shrink.

user19161

01:59

So do read it and it will change your life I believe, but I was disappointed by the two books following it.

Cerberus

Perhaps you were in a different phase of life when you read the sequels?

simchona

Ugh :

-2

A: Valuable things

........value added.........

user19161

@Cerberus I think it is because the sequels were repeating a lot of stuff in the first book and also becoming more religious.

Cerberus

Yikes.

simchona

The user whose answer I posted is deleting his single-word-request answers

user19161

02:05

@simchona Excessive and unnecessary ellipses, if that is what they are.

simchona

@JasperLoy I meant his comments on why he can't seem to write a real answer

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@sim maybe he is trying to annoy you on purpose.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū He's destroying his own answers. That doesn't help me any.

user19161

It is from that book that I learnt that love is about caring for the other person's growth as a separate individual, and not merely treating the other as an extension of oneself for the purpose of satisfying one's own emotional needs.

user19161

This truth needs a lot of meditation to really understand.

simchona

02:11

@Chaos: Single word requests do not need to be answered with a single word

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

meditation as in what? sitting cross-legged on the floor doing complicated movements with your hand?

user19161

@simchona You need not have edited his answer which is beyond redemption.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@sim I agree him as in saying that it could have been answered with single link to other sources. You do that.

user19161

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Meditation here means reflection.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū I include context. I don't give one word and space fill with periods

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

02:14

@sim I was not talking about the answer, I was talking about quality of the question. OP could have googled it.

user19161

@chaos So this week school starts and you also turn into Sonic!

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

yep.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū How? Nobody can come up with good answers for that question

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

Maybe I should.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Who are you responding to?

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

02:16

@sim you.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū If you can, by all means do so. But the difference between gen ref and some single word requests is that you need to search a bit to find the answer. Yes, you can find it in a single source. But sometimes it takes longer to get there.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

After all, I did answer your Cavendish Drawl question.

simchona

Also, I wouldn't answer just yet--there have been downvotes to every single answer

and I think it was the same person

user19161

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū That's another thing about this room. Sometimes you don't know what message is being replied to.

user19161

@simchona Do you know who?

simchona

02:18

@JasperLoy I have a guess

Theta30

@simchona I think it is not good that that he tries to diverge the discussion "patronising assumption that they have no clue about anything" ", How many questions have you voted to close because it could be answered with a single link to a standard reference? "

user19161

@simchona It is certainly not me. I don't waste my precious rep on downvoting answers.

simchona

@Theta30 I'm trying not to continue that argument (I get into too many here), but I think he confuses general reference with single-source answers.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

..This is one of the harder questions. I am relishing the challenge.

Theta30

@simchona my point is that he makes assumptions about you that were not about that discussion

simchona

02:21

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū If you get a downvote, just know it might be revenge

@Theta30 True, and thank you for kind of supporting me in this. He disregards past community discussion--the very Meta post he linked to said that there were ways around the char limit, but they all provided more help to the answer

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

Nobody downvotes me without a reason. If he wants to, fine. But I fear that he will have to install as many anti-virus software as possible if he does...

user19161

@simchona I admit that there was once or twice I was unhappy sb downvoted my answer which I thought was alright, and so I downvoted one or two of his answers which I didn't like.

simchona

@JasperLoy But I think this user is downvoting every other answer because it is in single-word-requests

user19161

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Oh man, I didn't know Chaos can implant viruses like that.

user19161

@simchona But that does not make sense.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

02:24

Dude, I can combine billion laughs with spamming software.

simchona

@JasperLoy He is now against that tag because it is 'not worth his time'

That is why I think it is him

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@sim does he have snob syndrome?

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū I'm not sure. You could be safe now

user19161

@simchona OK we can only guess with some uncertainty then. That's why this place is fun!

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

I.. will not let this question stop me... to answering it... Bring it on!

simchona

02:26

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Ganbatte~

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

cracks knuckles

whats ganbatte?

user19161

@simchona That is one of the few Japanese words I know from watching Japanese dramas!

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū "good luck"

Someone noticed the poster was deleting his answers, which means that either a 10k user noticed or the poster flagged himself

Congrats @dr65!

user19161

I think I will give an answer to that question. Watch out...

drɱ65 δ

@simchona Thanks!

simchona

02:36

@drɱ65δ I asked you to come to chat to say that the user with 3 bounties is on a vandalism tear

drɱ65 δ

What does that mean?

simchona

@drɱ65δ Look at his recent edits

user19161

OK I answered that question with "evaluable".

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

hmm

sounds ok, but I am right now tring to best this...

This is harder then Megaman X Final Boss!!!

user19161

Evaluable just means something that can be given a value, which I think is what he is asking.

simchona

02:40

@dr65: Like this, this, this

and this for 10k users

drɱ65 δ

Well... "vandalizing" his own posts, yes. What's wrong with that?

Severely shortening them, anyway.

simchona

@drɱ65δ He's saying "they're the same" to everything now

His answers are no longer answers

Which means that he is also degrading the quality of contributions in general

drɱ65 δ

Ah, I take your point.

I wonder if he thinks he's taking out unnecessary material.

simchona

I even don't like it on the one where we both answered (your "my goodness" question)

@drɱ65δ Read the comments here

That's not what I think he thinks

user19161

Yay, I got a plus one for my answer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

simchona

02:44

@JasperLoy OMG could it be the return of one of your fans?

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

hmmm

there must be a better answer!

user19161

Well, fans have no legs. We all have two.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

urg, my head hurts...

drɱ65 δ

@simchona Sounds like he's having a bad attitude.

A little like a watered down version of Mark Wallace.

user19161

Actually it is a very natural answer. The thought process is value->evaluate->evaluable. It is not found in OALD though, which is why I linked to MW.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

02:47

MW is better then OED.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū No, OED is authoritative.

user19161

The title of the question is misleading though. He does not want something to describe valuable things I think.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@sim it all matters in opinion.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Ask @Cerberus which is better. OED (which you might have access to via your school) actively researches words to find their use over time.

drɱ65 δ

It makes me happy

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

02:51

@Jasper evaluative might be better.

@drm congrats.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Or the OP will pull a "nvm I meant Alabama" routine

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū with garats?

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@sim ...they better not do that, for the sake of their wallet and their computer.

simchona

@dr65: He's at it again

2

A: How did "yank" came about in vi/emacs?

I'm not sure. Maybe they were just having some fun.

drɱ65 δ

@simchona When I see your flags, can I just copy them and flag with the same text?

So I'm agreeing/casting my vote, too?

simchona

@drɱ65δ I only got 10k last week, so I'm not sure, but I think so? Which ones are you seeing?

drɱ65 δ

02:55

Possible vandalism of own posts; multiple deletions in a short time; english.stackexchange.com/q/40253 english.stackexchange.com/q/40519 english.stackexchange.com/q/40520 english.stackexchange.com/q/40568 english.stackexchange.com/q/40530

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

ok, someone just upvoted all of mine ans sim's comments on this: english.stackexchange.com/questions/40694/…

drɱ65 δ

@simchona Can I just say the same thing?

user19161

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū See my comment on the main site.

simchona

@drɱ65δ That wasn't me. I saw that one too. It's someone else--I just flagged and said that he was revenge downvoting.

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Wasn't me. I can't upvote my own comments

drɱ65 δ

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū That was me; that's what you're supposed to do when you want to say the same thing

Isn't it?

Or when you happen to heartily agree

Or when you think the comment was clever beyond the lot of mortals...

user19161

02:58

@drɱ65δ Nice number!

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

I have to sleep soon to go to school tommrrow... Except for the fact that I have developed a horrible sleep habits of sleeping at 3 or 4 am and waking up at 11 or 12....

drɱ65 δ

@JasperLoy What, the 10000 or the 0.34%?

user19161

@drɱ65δ 10,000

drɱ65 δ

YES!

Theta30

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū you will get over it

user19161

02:59

Well, I have more important things than rep to care about!

Cerberus

@simchona Yeah OED is way better than anything else for real research. For casual look-ups, just use Dictionary.com or something.

drɱ65 δ

I'm actually in the process of semi-retiring, like ShreevatsaR.

From ELU, I meam.

Too addictive.

user19161

@drɱ65δ That's what we all say.

simchona

@drɱ65δ I already tried.

Cerberus

I'm supposedly retired too.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

03:00

@Bodgan thanks,.

Cerberus

So is Robusto.

drɱ65 δ

See my profile.

user19161

Me too, but I felt like answering just now.

Cerberus

We did bring our number of answers a day down drastically.

drɱ65 δ

Well, hopefully I can be successful.

g2g, thanks!

Cerberus

03:01

Good luck...

user19161

Bieber is growing up. His face is changing, but he is still cute.

Cerberus

I know you're a Faber.

user19161

@Cerberus The word is Belieber.

user19161

I love Bieber, and I love to believe.

user19161

Hmm, perhaps I should change my avatar to Bieber again...

Cerberus

03:06

Haha.

But faber is bean in Latin.

Theta30

myqlarson's account was suspended

for 7 days

simchona

@Theta30 I just saw that

user19161

I have to get used to typing @theta instead of @bog.

user19161

Perhaps bog will change his name again to bog. The return of Bog.

Theta30

perhaps, you can change it every 30 days

though in chat, you can do it more often

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

03:11

@sim I guess you have sweet taste of victory in your mouth, hmm?

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū What is tast?

user19161

@simchona That's naughty.

simchona

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū No? It's not victory when a user gets suspended

user19161

Let me refresh my avatar and come back.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

I guess Jasper has Bieber Fever...

user19161

03:16

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Yes. I love Bieber and I love to believe.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

...How do you change it and load that fast??? mine takes about 5 min!

Theta30

@Jasper how do you listen Bieber?

user19161

@ChaosGamerΕΛΥēelū Because I believe...

Theta30

you have his cd-s?

user19161

@Theta30 No money now. Just listen to youtube.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

03:17

Well then, I guess I have MJOS.

Michael Jackson Obsession Syndrome.

or Music syndrome. MJMS.

Theta30

interesting young people still listen MJ

user19161

Sim has kitten fever. While kittens are universal, there is only one @sim.

user19161

And @chaos has Sonic fever.

ChaosGamer ΕΛ-Υ ēel-ū

@Theta30 My cardinal rule in music: If it is not MJ and if it is not Gospel, it is not worth listening, besides very few musics of course.

My cardinal Rule in Art: My dad's drawing is always best. Did you know that he drew almost accurate picture of Mona Lisa?

I could find it and post it here... If I can find it...

user19161

03:34

I edited the question on value, in particular the title. Hopefully that is his intention.

z7sg Ѫ

13:14

Damnit where is my copy/subscription to OED?

user19161

@z7sgѪ You really have one? Or hoping to have one?

z7sg Ѫ

Others have it. I feel deprived.

user19161

Well, if it is not about etymology and you don't need rare words, the other dictionaries are OK.

user19161

Anyway I announce that since I can't fix the flash freeze on Debian I'll switch back to Ubuntu.

user19161

Is there something happening this week? It seems to be a slow week even though the weekend is over.

z7sg Ѫ

13:21

I like kubuntu.

user19161

I hate KDE.

z7sg Ѫ

Anyway I need the OED I NEEED IT so don't tell me I don't. I also need access to the Collins English corpus.

user19161

No, you don't need it. You only need rainbows like the other unicorns.

z7sg Ѫ

Unicorns cannot live on rainbows alone, we also need stardust and sparkles.

3

user19161

I have a feeling sth is going on in the world, that's why it is slow moving here.

z7sg Ѫ

13:26

Maybe they are all in the other room.

user19161

Which room? This is the most interesting one on the planet.

user19161

Ah, my chat profile now shows I have 10k system wide. I wonder if I'll get any flag notifications.

user19161

Let's type a few more lines to see the 10k appearing.

user19161

OK one more line.

user19161

Oops, only 9972 here!

user19161

13:32

OK, I'll see what happens when I get 30 more points.

F'x

13:48

hi all

simchona

hey

F'x

@JasperLoy well, I'm 30 points from 20k, same here :)

I await my mind being blown away by the power of the new tools

aedia λ

14:10

@z7sgѪ Preach it!

aedia λ

14:23

@Jez By this point I had already followed, wasted my on/off-topic votes on things that probably didn't help you at all, and completely put it out of my mind after leaving for a long weekend. But it looks like someone after me pushed you over the line into Commit :)

F'x

@aedia @z7sg did you see my nice homage?

I mean, the Soul of a Unicorn

Jez

@aedia yep

z7sg Ѫ

Praise Be!

aedia λ

@Fx Oh my goodness, yes! I forgot to thank you!

dances and spreads rainbows in happiness

simchona

Too many line breaks...

-1

Q: Phrase and word-order meaning [example from road sign]

I know that "only" and "just" and word-order are oft-mentioned topics on here, but word-order for phrases and meanings - don't both of these meaning different things? I saw this road sign (no motor vehicles diagram) which said: 10 am - 4 pm except for loading whilst on another street in a town...

grammar phrases word-order ambiguity

user19161

14:31

@simchona Morning! I'll try to edit it.

user19161

Oh dear, I'm still trying to figure out what he is saying.

simchona

@JasperLoy That was my other problem with it

user19161

@simchona I will try to understand it first. If it is too hard then I will forget about editing it!

z7sg Ѫ

I understand it. Most of it should be deleted.

user19161

@z7sgѪ It's quite a cacophony.

aedia λ

14:37

holds hand over eyes until it goes away

user19161

OK whoever wants to edit it go ahead. We'll see how the system handles it.

Jez

@simchona Maybe they should've written the sign in Welsh. That'd be a lot clearer.

Alenanno

@z7sg Ѫ whoa that was a huge edit lol :D

hello everyone

z7sg Ѫ

@Alenanno it had to be done... the example with the road sign didn't work and was merely a distraction

i hope it hasn't offended. i'm sure he will get a good answer now

Alenanno

Oh not to me

z7sg Ѫ

14:44

yeah i mean the OP

Alenanno

I didn't read all the question honestly, I just adjusted it because it had too many line breaks

and it was hard to read it

simchona

@Alenanno My eyes glazed over

user19161

@z7sgѪ It is now totally different from the original question but I don't blame you!

z7sg Ѫ

@JasperLoy it's really not different! that's what he really wants to know, i'm sure!

simchona

This one is depressing:

0

Q: What's a word/expression to describe a feeling of anxiety about the passing of time?

Sometimes, I feel a sense of anxiety about time passing by. I am not referring to boredom. Boredom refers to not having anything to do or being dissatisfied with what I'm doing and wanting to do something else. I am referring to the feeling I get when I contemplate the finitude of my life at th...

single-word-requests

Alenanno

14:46

@simchona lol I kind of get what you mean, but what is an alternative of "glazed over"?

simchona

@Alenanno it's like...your mind blanks out when you're trying to read something

Alenanno

haha okok

simchona

similar to being out of it, but because of something

Alenanno

my dict helped lol

No matter how much you study English, there's always a phrasal verb that you never saw before.

user19161

@simchona Why is it depressing?

simchona

14:49

> I contemplate the finitude of my life at the end of a day and regard the time having gone by as an expenditure (or sometimes, a waste) of a finite resource that I will never recover.

aedia λ

@simchona I always think of it like... a glassy-eyed stare like a sleeping fish. Or I imagine my eyes look like Commander Data and I forget to blink.

user19161

@simchona I see. I thought you meant the question quality.

aedia λ

The answer is "mortality" and "stop thinking about it"

simchona

too localized:

0

Q: What's the pronouciation of ohloh?

ohloh.net is a famous website for open source projects. When I introduce it to others, I don't know how to pronounce it. I googled for a while but didn't find any answer.

pronunciation

user19161

Interestingly what he contemplated is what I used to contemplate very often in the past. Just make the best out of what remains is my conclusion.

user19161

14:52

This attitude applies to not just the finiteness of life but also the evils of life.

Jez

LOL, email from the Conservative party: Do you want to help shape our policies?

how brain dead does one have to be...

Cerberus

They might listen...

user19161

@Cerberus Boo!

Cerberus

Boo!

Jez

@Cerberus I'd propose legalization of cannabis, so I doubt it.

Cerberus

14:59

They would not even consider that?

Jez

of course not.

Cerberus

Hmm.

user19161

Today I changed Thursagen's "pronounciation" again. He never changes even after I edited about 10 of them.

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…