English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2011-07-28 (page 4 of 6)

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5:00 PM

@Rhodri But I did thank you for the help!

1 hour ago, by Martha

(But thanks for the help.)

Gah, how'd it get to be lunchtime? TTYL.

and I'm caught up!

time to see what Jin sounds like

5:17 PM

morning

@simchona morning!

evening @simchona

So I noticed the question on synonyms for "proactive" got deleted. How come?

@simchona hmmmm, I think it was closed as gen ref. I didn't realise it was deleted!

@MattEllen I tried to help the OP make it less...general. He also had a few different questions going on, one of which was a peeve about "proactive"

5:23 PM

@simchona Request from OP

Ohhh, thanks.

Wait, what?:

1

11.5k 1 11 42

meaning etymology single-word-requests word-choice word-usage phrases differences

oh my

that's not good

i almost want to think that this is someone else

b/c surely he realizes that if he only changes one letter, then we're going to catch on

I...I wish I could tell

the account was just opened today

wait! Clark Kent is who now?

5:30 PM

"thursagan" gets a decent number of google hits, so it's plausibly independent invention

but superman wears glasses, they're nothing alike

most thursagan hits are related to computer RPGs

thursag**e**n gets many of the same hits

it does sound like a dwarf-y name

any evidence that the new guy is sock-puppeting things that our friend 3I would benefit from?

Investigating... don't worry about it

5:32 PM

@JS: He hasn't voted on anything yet

@simchona but he answered one of his doppelganger's questions

@JSBangs So far he seems to have answered one question. 3I's question.

Jinx!

I do have a continuing peeve on a question, though. I'm starting to dislike OPs who ask one question, I answer it, and a completely diff answer is "right".

7

A: Is this the right way to use past perfect?

The form of the past perfect tense, in English, is [had + past participle]. It has a few specific uses: the idea that something occurred before another action in the past. It can also show that something happened before a specific time in the past. (ex. I did not have any money because I h...

I asked for context, and didn't get it. The OP, however, decides that waiwai is "wrong" for saying FFs answer isn't an answer.

@simchona does that happen a lot?

@MattE: The OPs other question was closed. This is the same person who used double negation to explain the "whose job is vs. whose job it is" question

His other things have been deleted, beside this question

"Fumblefingers is a cool guy/girl, he answered. by the way what does waiwai even mean. Why is proofreading if you tell somebody, whether a way of speaking is right or wrong. There are thousand other questions that ask exactly the same, if something can be said this way. You should check your basic, fundamental questions of life By the way FumbleFingers has a nice english name, what does waiwai even mean. If could I would give you thumbs up man, girl. Thanks from the bottom of my heart "

5:37 PM

I've seen his ridiculous comments! They're a bit beyond the pale

Actually, @waiwai, how did you choose that username?

@simchona Real name

Chinese?

Yep. :)

everyone agree with this right answer!

2

A: Correct usage of word "spoil"?

Yes, that is perfectly good usage. 'to spoil' can just mean 'to ruin'. "The drunk clown spoiled the birthday party for everyone." I'd rather question your usage of 'slowly'; do you mean in the course of a conversation, he developed a "concerned expression" and that made him look bad, or is...

5:39 PM

@Waiwai. Cool. Should tell Tasos, "that's my name, you nincompoop".

@simchona xD It's fine—I'm used to having an unusual name that people don't respond normally to.

you could use the "insensitive clod" rejoinder!

Is your name Wai ___, but you double the wai in chat names?

insensitive clod

(sorry, I get really interested in this)

5:41 PM

i really like the sound of "You should check your basic, fundamental questions of life"

@JS: What is the meaning of life...

well, the answer to the ultimate question of life the universe and everything is 42

don't forget your towel

@MattEllen Often seen as "Wild punctuation killed my parents, you insensitive clod," or something similarly ludicrous.

@MattEllen The question really should try and explain what spoil is intended to be used for in that case.

5:44 PM

I always know where my towel is :D

I mean, you can assume what is intended, but how can we tell if it's a correct usage of the word if we don't know the intent?

@GraceNote good point. the question needs better context.

> I was trying to say that a persons expression saddens within a minute or two while pondering over something, but not instantly as would be the case when caused by shock. – Skasi 1 hour ago

That's added as a comment to an answer, would've been very convenient on the question itself.

I wonder if I can work it in with an edit...

'twould be awesome if you could, the descriptive choice is too awkward to me.

5:47 PM

Can we close the "past perfect" question as "not a question"...?

If anyone else tries to answer, they're going to be offering the wrong answer

@GraceNote well, I've just copy/pasted the comment :D

"from berlin with love" - definition/usage? How informal is it? Would you use it in a letter to a collegue? a friend?

@MattEllen That works.

it seems to fit well with the question

@Julius Only if I wanted to send love to said colleague.

5:49 PM

@GraceNote right

I have close friends, for example, who I liberally use "With Love, <signature>" to, but most I do "With Care".

@GraceNote okay, so being romantically involved isn't a prerequisite?

being a close friend seems to be enough?

@Julius If you feel comfortable saying "Love" to someone, then being close friends would be fine

@Julius Pretty much. For example, with people on a more family-level of friendship, that's not romantic but you could still say Love if you feel comfortable as such.

@Julius I say "Love from, Matt" in correspondence with my close friends

well, I write it

saying things at paper is quite futile

5:52 PM

:-)

@MattEllen And yet you were curious to see how Jin sounded. ♪

I thought you were giving my superpower of Photolocation a run for its money.

@GraceNote yes. I realised after I wrote that :D

@MattEllen And here was me assuming you were powering up Audacity or something :-)

@Rhodri hmmmm, I wonder if there is a sound -> shape algorithm... (not FFT)

although it will probably involve FFT

@Rhodri Audacity claims that the R-9DH does not have any sound systems and so it cannot record audio. It's been distressing.

5:54 PM

@MattEllen How about the "visualisation" on most MP3 players?

@Rhodri I was thinking of getting an actual picture of Jin from how he sounds

I wonder if there's another option if I just want to record the output on my speakers.

you can record that using any sound recording programme

@MattEllen Audacity claims I have no speakers or any sound at all.

This is even with a microphone plugged in, too. It worked on my old machine but it doesn't work on the R-9DH

I'm trying to remember how to do it....

6:00 PM

The R-9DH is a Windows 7 on a Sony VAIO, but I don't have it on me right now so walkthrough won't get too far right now.

found an answer: How to turn on stereo mix recording

it works too

then in Audacity you need to edit->preferences

MMSYS.cpl, I see

Thanks for finding that, @Matt ♪

then in the devices tab, in the recording section, select stereo min

@GraceNote no probs :)

6:18 PM

@Mitch: The wiki for grammaticality says, "Whether something obeys the rules of grammar for English" which is what that question is asking: "Is the following statement appropriate?"

6:30 PM

Oh, okay, I see the clarification edit now. I switched the tags back to word-usage and meaning and then voted to close as off-topic.

2

Q: "adaption" vs "adaptation"

I'm writing a formal paper, and have a section about the process of adapting a model to a new situation. Should I title the section model adaption or model adaptation? I'm rather confused by the difference between the two words. I am inclined to use adaption but I don't know why.

meaning differences

Still need two close votes on this

@MRHen: I can only flag...

Well, I don't see how this question is fundamentally different from "pricy vs pricey", "despite vs despite of", "grey vs gray", "alright vs all right" or countless others.

@RegDwight I am happy closing them all.

If they are asking about the history of the differences, great.

Otherwise, close.

6:45 PM

Then you don't have a site.

0

Q: "Without further adieu" vs "Without further ado"

I just seen an email with "Without further adieu", I always thought it was "Without further ado." Which is it?

word-usage confusables

@RegDwight Obviously untrue. What's your point?

Can this be general ref?

@simchona This can be a dupe.

@MrHen My point is that if you close all questions, you have none left, and then you don't have a site.

@MRH: Dupe with what? An ado vs. adieu question?

6:47 PM

@simchona Hm, either I misremembered or misimagined.

i don't see one

however, is it gen ref?

@RegDwight I didn't mean "all questions ever". I mean "all questions that are general reference"

@JSBangs I decided no, because it was about an idiom

user19161

@simchona Or it could be the other way round, but in either case, it's probably in dialect and not Mandarin itself, I think.

@MrHen Every question is general reference if you know where to look.

Looking up the words wouldn't necessarily tell you about the idiom

6:49 PM

@MrHen depends on how common the idiom is. however, in this case i think you're right

Since the question is asking "which is it", I think Google should have been a first step

@RegDwight Ugh, really? I am not in the mood for word games. You understand my point, yes?

@MrHen Yes, but I am rather worried you don't understand mine.

May 7 at 21:21, by RegDwight

We could just make a list of useful English-language tools (in fact, we have one), and close all questions as a dupe of that.

@RegDwight I understand it but think it isn't helpful here.

I don't care about hyperbolic "Oh, then we won't have a site" crap right now. Obviously there is a gray area with regards to General Reference. Presenting a question for people to vote on that gray area is exactly what chat is for.

user19161

@RegDwight But there are some which has several, different answers even if you look, which is what the site is for.

6:51 PM

So, people who think it is General Reference can vote. People who don't can not vote.

@MrHen Precisely. Then how come I am not allowed to say, "hey I vote to keep?"

Because that's all that I have done.

You posted a link, I said, that one is salvageable.

6 mins ago, by RegDwight

Then you don't have a site.

Then you went down this path

I would have been just as happy saying "I vote to keep" and shutting up.

So, I vote to keep.

'lo, @Lauren!

hey! just figured I'd come and see what you all talk about in here

6:54 PM

@RegDwight Sure. I apologize if I am over-reacting; I just am sick of people claiming that closing questions is going to leave the site with no questions. It is obviously wrong and completely irrelevant.

@LaurenΨ It flips. A lot.

@LaurenΨ gawd, don't ask about that. you really don't want to know

Like, earlier in the week, we talked about Hollandaise vs. Mayonnaise. Right now, is a bit more heated.

it's pretty sordid most of the time

especially when the subject is mayonnaise

@GraceNote Sorry. I'm done. :P

6:55 PM

@Grace lol ok. Well it might also make it easier to ask me questions about my edits

in case there are more

@LaurenΨ Yeah, sorry that you walked into a minefield on meta

@LaurenΨ This is wise. I hope my answer didn't come across too curt.

user19161

@LaurenΨ I noticed you edited the breasts question, but I guess Jeff rolled it back because he did not want the title to offend.

i, for one, am very pleased to see these Ψ showing up everywhere

user19161

That question caused a lot of debate before.

6:56 PM

@Jasper yeah. I didn't realize there had been a group consensus about that earlier

I'm supposed to be editing questions for grammar/spelling etc, and to make them more specific

user19161

Actually that's our job.

user19161

But how long will you be doing this?

@JasperLoy What is our job?

@JasperLoy No, that's her job. It's just something we simply do.

2

right, everyone is welcome to edit, I've just started working at SE

6:58 PM

@JSBangs Agreed.

part of team CHAOS, and we're working to make questions more readable

user19161

@LaurenΨ I know. What I mean is: are you supposed to be editing things like forever?

no just for the next few days

and only the top 1000 questions

@LaurenΨ Someone was mentioning SEO, too. Is that part of what you guys will be doing?

user19161

@MrHen Well, what I mean is the community does do a lot of edits already.

6:59 PM

And... holy wow, suddenly Jeff's behavior makes more sense if they just hired a bunch of people to improve SEO...

yeah we're basically just trying to improve the quality of the site so more people will start using it

@JasperLoy Yeah. More doesn't hurt, ya?

user19161

@LaurenΨ So what happens after that? It goes back to before you came?

@LaurenΨ Sweet.

by the way, hello @Wanda

have you been here in chat before?

7:00 PM

@Jasper the thought is that our edits will catch on

Hi JSBangs. I have popped in before.

YOOOOOOOOOOOOO @Robusto!

user19161

@LaurenΨ Reg here has made over a thousnad edits. He's the man!

@GraceNote — Hola.

very impressive

I've spent all day doing a couple hundred

7:02 PM

What up?

@Lauren Is this an internship? Or are you a full employee of SE?

@LaurenΨ i have to say, i'm pretty glad that isn't my job

i mean, i do it for free, but i only edit a handful per day

user19161

@GraceNote Of course!

@Jasper: Did you see the notes I left for you last night after you left?

user19161

@simchona Yes, nothing in the transcript escapes me. I'm a robot.

user19161

7:04 PM

I meant my random thoughts, not his.

@LaurenΨ — Wait, I thought we were trying to "make the internet better" ... now I'm all confused. This is scope creep.

user19161

And I was just trying to calm everyone involved.

Ohhh. Well, I don't think he was joking. But that was yesterday.

@simcho it's a full-time position

Szia, @LaurenΨ!

7:06 PM

@Lauren: That's cool. What, officially, are you?

@simcho I'm a member of team CHAOS - Joel wrote a post on it earlier: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/100137/…

user19161

@simchona I see he is back today. I don't think he's that bad a person. Sometimes, friction arises when people are on different wavelengths. We need to try see things from the other's perspective too, in any situation. But I hope it doesn't bother you anymore.

@Robust just trying to improve the site (mainly the titles) for readability

user19161

@robusto RobinHood came in and said Kit's pinging you reached his inbox instead.

@LaurenΨ — Just messing with you.

7:10 PM

@Lauren: Just read the post -- ganbatte

@JasperLoy — Then RobinHood shouldn't have picked a name with such a common first three letters. We've been over this before.

@Jasper: Different wavelengths is one thing. Telling me -- offensively -- that I am living my life wrong is another.

user19161

@Robusto I suspected you were in the same room then. But then I realised that he was in the woods while the cigar is in the city.

@simchona Aye to that

@JasperLoy the meaning of this idiom is lost on me

user19161

7:12 PM

@JSBangs Really? Robin Hood is the hero in the woods, while Robusto is a cigar brand.

@JasperLoy — Ce n'est pas un cigare. C'est un rêve.

@JasperLoy didn't make the association, but i get it now

user19161

Well @reg was the one who said Robusto is a cigar, and I laughed.

Anyway, who says you can't have cigars in the woods?

@Robusto so French sells tobacco, now? It was supposed to be the language of love, how were we downgraded so fast?

user19161

7:16 PM

@Robusto At least not in the Robin Hood movies!

@Fx — Wait, I thought Italian was the language of love.

@Robusto isn't Italian just French spelt wrong?

@Robusto don't tell the dog, though

@Fx — I dunno. All these Romance languages claim to be for lovers. Me, I'm not so sure. If you're still talking by the time the love starts, you're doing it wrong.

@Robusto Perhaps they should be less the language of love, and more the language of romance.

@Robusto that is wrong on so many levels…

user19161

7:19 PM

Ya, I always found the term Romance languages a misfit.

@Fx — Name five.

If you find the country that has the most blind people, their language is the language of love

@Robusto do I get paid?

user19161

@MattEllen That is very deep.

You misspelled "laid" — and I don't have an answer for that either.

7:20 PM

@JasperLoy really? thanks!

@Robusto also, it'd have to be audio, obviously

@Robusto it's been a dry patch for one of the two spellings, recently :)

@Fx need to find a job?

or a girlfriend?

or a boyfriend. Let's not discriminate

Wow... chat went downhill fast.

7:22 PM

There's always the oldest profession.

@MrHen and all because of me!

@GraceNote banker? :)

I think he needs to find a derivative, personally.

Heh heh.

@Fx hunter

Two birds, one stone.

user19161

@Wanda No he needs to do some integration instead.

7:24 PM

unless berry picking is a profession. it seems to simple to be a profession

@Jasper phwoar.

user19161

What is a profession? We need skills to even clean things properly. Every job is a profession IMHO.

interesting question for philologists

3

Q: What is the meaning and etymology of 'scut' from 'scut work'?

What is the origin of scut in scut work? According to Merriam-Webster, scut work: routine and often menial labor Probably from medical argot, scut meaning 'junior intern' First known use: circa 1962 Usage example: ... women who generally feel that they are second-class citizens in the medi...

meaning etymology slang

me, when I was a Soviet pioneer

I searched for a good half an hour, and couldn't figure out a good answer

7:26 PM

user image

user19161

@Wanda That is a difficult word. There are too many sounds in this room not found in the dictionary.

@Robusto blogfiles.wfmu.org/AB/badsex.mp3

user19161

@trg787 Hello! I hope you feel better today!

gotta go, see you all later

Farewell F'x

7:27 PM

Bye F'x

@Fx Later ♪

cya @Fx

@Jasper, hello , brother! Yes! I'm a stubborn thing

user19161

@simchona OK point taken.

user19161

@trg787 I see you upset simchona a bit. But let's hope things get better from here.

7:28 PM

"a bit" is an understatement

But there's no need to really stir things up right now

Can't cope with my mysoginism......

@trg: I shouldn't need to deal with your misogyny at all here.

user19161

@GraceNote OK just trying to help. 'A bit' can be a euphemism. And it's not to stir things up, it's for closure.

@trg787 We shouldn't have to deal with... well, I guess sim's got that already

user19161

I believe closure is very important...

7:31 PM

But what I was saying - 80% in it just a humor

@JasperLoy Closure is the kind of thing that a mediator figures out how to edge along to without forcing.

user19161

@GraceNote OK I'm not pointing a gun at anyone, am I? :)

unless the mediator's a parent.
Say you're sorry!
Say it like you mean it!
Better. Now, don't do it again.

@JasperLoy Force isn't always force.

@Trg: I don't care if 80% was in humor. It was offensive. A woman's place isn't in the home, with the kids and kitchen. It is damn well where she wants it to be.

user19161

7:35 PM

@GraceNote 'Pointing a gun' was metaphorical.

@JasperLoy Then you understood my point, I'd assume ♪

@z7sg Yeah, and all that Barry White bad-dream crap too.

user19161

@GraceNote Of course, and I think you understand mine too. :)

Then we are in agreement as we really were from the beginning.

user19161

Hey, nobody is in disagreement over anything.

user19161

7:37 PM

Just closure, period.

7:50 PM

@simchona , nthg offensive in it.. I 'd myself dream to be a 3K man

...hooboy

@simchona just a note: if you click on someone's name, you can “ignore this user”

@grace is rubbernecking a word you're familiar with?

@Matt: I am

@MattEllen I am, yes.

7:52 PM

Just kinda what I'm doing here

I'm here because I'm the mainly active blue in the room right now, which I'm hoping I don't have to exercise.

@trg: It was completely offensive. If you want to be at home with the kids, then you can do it. But don't you dare tell me that I'm a bad female for not doing so

@GraceNote Thanks for being here. I know moderating this kind of thing can't be fun

@simchona I'm happy to help. You're not the only one offended here. ♪

Not why I'm here, just what I'm doing since, well, that hole just keeps getting bigger

Mr. Disappointment

Oh my. Moderating? This argument shouldn't exist at all...

Or, what, have we gone full circle and turned back into primitive tribe cultures?

7:55 PM

Actually I was raised out of my home and my family... for 7 or 8 years.. Until now I feel it as a trauma.. I was OK physically, but very hard morally.... very hard.... I wanted to live in my home

@MrD: Should someone fill you in?

@MrDisappointment Some of the worst things manage to withstand the test of time.

@GraceNote Like Russian emotes)))

@Trg: I am very sorry for your circumstances. But do not tell a highly liberal female that not SHE is a bad female because she is not doing what you want to do.

Mr. Disappointment

@simchona Go ahead, though I don't wish to aggravate things, if it will.

7:56 PM

@MrHen That's a Russian thing?

Mr. Disappointment

@GraceNote A sad but seemingly true observation.

@MrD: I would suggest reading back to last night's transcript (by last night, I mean my night... so maybe 15 hours ago?)

@Simchona , my apologies to you

@simchona Most of it is scrapped off, actually.

@trg787 Thank you.

7:58 PM

And so we head in the direction of closure ♪

user19161

@GraceNote Exactly.

@MrDisappointment I'd never seen that kind of thing before until Jasper mentioned it the other day in comparison to my punctuation.

1

Q: What does ")))" mean at the end of a sentence?

Someone I know keeps ending their chat messages with ))): A: Except if you're not good at jokes B: Then you can still copy jokes from others.))) I assume that this isn't some newfangled emoticon gone wrong. What is its purpose?

user19161

@matt Since you answered the ))) question, what does )) mean?

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Jul '1128

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…

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