English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

RegDwigнt

15:00

Quiz time!

What does the manhole say?

Jez

hey

RegDwigнt

Jez

anyone see this? telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/nelson-mandela/10512672/…

RegDwigнt

Yup.

Sep 23 at 11:04, by RegDwighт

I believe in the existence of angels.

Jez

Mr Jantjie said that during his episode, he continued seeing things and hearing loud voices in his head that impaired his ability to hear well and interpret what was being said.

He told the newspaper that he could not leave, so stayed on and continued to sign things that did not make sense.

Thamsanqa Jantjie (Facebook)

“Life is unfair. This illness is unfair. Anyone who doesn’t understand this illness will think that I’m just making this up,” he said.

hilarious

Jasper Loy

15:01

He might be telling the truth.

Jez

no way

RegDwigнt

Actually, his track record suggests that it might be precisely the people who do understand this illness that will think that he's just making it up.

Jasper Loy

Oh?

RegDwigнt

@JasperLoy It wasn't the people who don't understand sign language that thought he was making it up.

Jez

i love the audacity of it

he mustn't have been called out on it before. people just assume that stuff is sign language lol

RegDwigнt

15:05

It did look legit to me.

He translated "remember" the same way each time, for instance.

Jez

you can read sign language?

RegDwigнt

@Jez no, and that's the point.

badass

Hey sharky, did you swallow that walrus whole?

RegDwigнt

That's one slender shark.

It is but two studs wide. The walrus counts six.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt With a wave of the hand? Sounds pretty general to me.

RegDwigнt

15:08

@Robusto no, with a touch of right temple.

I'm just saying I couldn't fake it anywhere as well. I could fake playing piano though, or writing in English. You need a certain skill level.

It takes a pro to suck next to Obama.

Jasper Loy

I think he is just crazy, like he says.

RegDwigнt

No crazy person would admit to being crazy.

Jasper Loy

@RegDwigнt Except me.

RegDwigнt

This guy fooled you once, so you're gonna believe him now.

I understand your reasoning, I just don't follow it.

Jasper Loy

Wow, I have a star in this chat.

badass

15:15

You become obsessed too easily.

Jasper Loy

You should watch that movie, really.

badass

I did.

Jasper Loy

Did you like it?

badass

Not impressed.

RegDwigнt

badass

15:16

I prefer sports.

Jasper Loy

What sports?

RegDwigнt

This is the kind of navigation you can expect in Russia.

badass

NFL

RegDwigнt

For future reference. We discussed.

Jasper Loy

Of course, we have no idea what the signs say.

RegDwigнt

15:17

That's the point. You have no idea what the signs say even after they have been "translated" for you.

Jasper Loy

lol

KitFox

@RegDwigнt Wow, that's really helpful!

Now I know exactly where to go.

RegDwigнt

@KitFox and how do you like them Pirogov?

KitFox

Over easy.

Jasper Loy

Clinic them? lol

badass

15:18

\o/

Jez

is Vokzal a place?

RegDwigнt

Vokzal is a train station. That sign says "railway station".

Except it does not.

Jasper Loy

So one should not go to Russia for vacation.

RegDwigнt

"Clinic them Pirogov" is a hospital named after one N. I. Pirogov.

@JasperLoy and exactly nobody does, unless they speak the language.

Robusto

@JasperLoy Napoleon hated it.

KitFox

15:20

I was trying to learn Russian, but my brain kept hemorrhaging.

Jasper Loy

I have almost not travelled abroad my life.

RegDwigнt

And "dom Youth" is something like youth club.

Dom means "house".

Robusto

I knew that one.

Jasper Loy

I thought it was for condoms.

RegDwigнt

@Robusto Yes, from JavaScript.

Jasper Loy

15:21

"Condoms for youths" lol

RegDwigнt

How is that a lol?

You're a lol.

Robusto

Nah, it's one of the few words I remember from my two semesters of high-school Russian.

RegDwigнt

OIC

badass

\/

RegDwigнt

So looks like even the Russians can only translate Russian using Google Translate

"Im" actually is the pronoun "them", except that the "im." here stands for "imeni", "named after", from "imya", "name".

Robusto

15:24

@RegDwigнt Что это? Это стул.

beams

KitFox

In Mother Russia, signs translate you.

RegDwigнt

So I guess it only serves the Russians well that Google Maps have updated their interface.

Robusto

стул в доме.

KitFox

OH MY GOD! LOOK OUT, LADY!

RegDwigнt

Now every street, which would be "ulitsa", is called "khulitsa", which roughly translates to "abuse-treet".

@Robusto I am amazed at the proper case.

Robusto

15:26

@RegDwigнt Sounds like every street in Russia.

RegDwigнt

Квид про кво.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt I don't remember much, but what I do remember I remember correctly. I think.

@RegDwigнt Trying to trick me with Cyrillicized Latin, eh?

RegDwigнt

Трайинг?

Robusto

Trainer?

RegDwigнt

See. Wurks.

Robusto

15:28

No.

Trainning.

I dunno.

RegDwigнt

Trying, you silly person.

Where's my hats anyway.

I want hats and I want they now.

Robusto

I no now.

KitFox

Not yet! You must be patient.

RegDwigнt

Ein Bummer!

Jasper Loy

Why you keep changing avatar Reg?

KitFox

15:30

Oh! I forgot! Somewhere I have the shopped avatar with the hat.

RegDwigнt

Why you keep creating new accounts Jasper?

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Zwei Bumsen!

KitFox

Try Bumming!

RegDwigнt

@KitFox my copy is probably lost forever to The Great Crash. Some things I didn't think of backing up.

KitFox

Well, I can probably find it for you. brb

Robusto

15:31

@KitFox Fucking is better.

KitFox

I prefer Berlin.

RegDwigнt

@Robusto I'd like to see you order that in St. Pauli.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt I would only order it from a St. Pauli Girl.

RegDwigнt

Or Reeperbahn, wevs. Same difference.

Okay here's one final test for Kit. If you can read this, you are fluent in Russian and beyond.

Robusto

RegDwigнt

15:33

I don't think she'd have time for two Bumsen.

She barely finds the time to handle all the beer.

badass

2 mins ago, by Robusto

@KitFox Fucking is better.

Jasper Loy

She is mine.

KitFox

@RegDwigнt OK, so I shouldn't dump anything in there during the winter months because someone lives there then?

Robusto

@RegDwigнt But I bet she gives good . . . er . . . can't think of German for "hand jobs"

RegDwigнt

@KitFox I don't know, I am barely halfway through with it.

KitFox

15:35

@Robusto Pretty sure they call them "handys".

RegDwigнt

What Unsinn!

Hand job is "einen runterholen".

KitFox

looks dubious

Robusto

@RegDwigнt And an extra one is a wiederholen?

Jasper Loy

Now I know that Reg Dwight = Russia Deutscheland, QED.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Wait, wouldn't that be a "reach around"?

RegDwigнt

15:37

@KitFox dict.leo.org/#/…

@Robusto no, "get one down"

Usually reflexive.

Robusto

Ah, ok.

RegDwigнt

Sich einen runterholen.

Get oneself one down.

KitFox

Oh, because it's standing up.

Jasper Loy

Geezis.

Robusto

@KitFox Ideally.

RegDwigнt

15:38

@KitFox Actually I only just realized that myself. You never think about such things.

KitFox

RegDwigнt

KitFox

@RegDwigнt You never think about these things.

There, and I found your hat.

Robusto

WTF?

RegDwigнt

High-gloss periodical about finance.

Robusto

15:39

It's as good a title as any.

RegDwigнt

@KitFox thank you.

KitFox

My pleasure.

MετάEd

YOU WILL WEAR THE RED HAT

Robusto

I like it much better than The Economist. As a title for a financial publication, that is.

KitFox

You don't have to wear it, but now you have the option.

RegDwigнt

15:40

This title wasn't bad.

MετάEd

INCORRECT

Robusto

There is The Daily WTF, of course, but its coverage of financial matters is spotty at best.

@RegDwigнt That is a headline, not a title.

MετάEd

Is that a photoshopped cover?

RegDwigнt

@Robusto Same difference. Remember "clinic them pirogov"?

MετάEd

Because if it's not I think I should subscribe.

RegDwigнt

15:40

@MετάEd no.

Robusto

Stop talking about pierogies and snow and shit.

MετάEd

They already have a great reputation; now they have great covers. Nice!

RegDwigнt

@MετάEd they never even tell you who wrote the articles. Otherwise you'd know they are written by 12-year olds and would never subscribe in the first place.

@Robusto and I mean cover, not headline.

Titelbild in German.

Vs. just Titel.

MετάEd

@RegDwigнt In the Economist, nobody knows you are a dog.

Robusto

Titelbild und Titelkopf?

Kinda like Tweedledum and Tweedledee.

RegDwigнt

15:42

Perhaps there's a Titelkopf as well. You never know. I wouldn't.

@Robusto gib mir die Rassel zurück!

Robusto

NÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖ! Meine!

RegDwigнt

> The magazine is written by young people pretending to be old people...If American readers got a look at the pimply complexions of their economic gurus, they would cancel their subscriptions in droves.

There, that's the correct quote.

Robusto

All young people in Britain are actually old people.

RegDwigнt

That makes it easy for you to know all about their fucking skills.

Jasper Loy

I have no fucking skills.

Robusto

15:46

No Sex Please, We're British (film)

No Sex Please, We're British is a 1973 British comedy film directed by Cliff Owen and starring Ronnie Corbett, Ian Ogilvy, Susan Penhaligon and Arthur Lowe. It is based on the 1971 play No Sex Please, We're British with a number of changes to the original plot. Synopsis Runnicles, a clerk in a small-town British bank (openly depicted in the film as the branch of Barclays Bank in Windsor High Street), is horrified when a package arrives containing pornography rather than the new calculator he expected. His efforts to dispose of it, while avoiding detection, turn into a farcical series of ...

KitFox

That sounds hilarious.

Jasper Loy

Never watched it.

RegDwigнt

Yeah, "Ronnie Corbett", "Ian Ogilvy", "Susan Penhaligon" and "Arthur Lowe". That's some funny slang right there.

Jasper Loy

Weird names.

RegDwigнt

Wait till you see their screen names.

tchrist

15:49

@Kit what was your question, quick. Otherwise it will be later tonight.

KitFox

Oh! Um.

recalibrates

This project that I'm on, they are looking at improving the search function for a subset of pages on the public site.

I'm trying to remember why I thought there was something I could ask you.

badass

@KitFox nice hat :)

KitFox

The pages are pre-built html and he's using MongoDB. Damn, there was something specific I thought you wold know something about.

Except I can't remember now.

tchrist

If you aren’t just going with Google, and you want something better, you’re might be going to have to do some NLP work, like synonym sets, or worse, actual meaning inference.

I assume you're already stemming.

KitFox

I think the whole thing is hokey. I don't understand why they are spending so much time building static pages. They apparently take hours and are built nightly.

tchrist

15:53

So they can be fetched quickly and can be cached.

KitFox

But they aren't fetched quickly.

tchrist

But if you have to rebuild an index each time, that’s going to take the time you mentioned.

KitFox

Oh, that was the thing!

tchrist

What?

Index rebuilds?

KitFox

There is inconsistency in the search response time. I thought it probably had to do with the way the indexes are being accessed, but I'm not sure I understand how he's fitting the pieces together.

He says he's going to switch over to using JSON instead of...shit, whatever he's doing now.

I thought that sounded like a good plan, but I still can't figure why the response times are so incredibly slow.

He did brag to me at one point that he had indexed every letter, and I thought that sounded like someone who didn't know how to do effective indexing.

Still and all, we are talking possibly 10,000 pages. Doesn't seem like it ought to take seconds to search them.

RegDwigнt

15:57

Commute. Lators.

Matt Эллен

CU

tchrist

It shouldn’t.

Robusto

@KitFox Why would he index every letter? That is obsessive in the extreme.

tchrist

Depends on indexing tech.

KitFox

But I don't do search stuff, and I don't understand the system well, and he's generally uncooperative.

tchrist

15:58

Plus I don’t smell any stemming.

Robusto

@KitFox Oh, that guy. Have you tried hitting him with a stapler or something?

KitFox

He's using a library, and they are working on what they call "faceted search" which sounds to me sort of like using XQuery and nodes.

Robusto

Eeeesh.

KitFox

Which made me think that using xml might be equally as effective and more supportable than what we have going on.

tchrist

Too many layers of indirection to actually ascertain/analyse anything.

Well, from a satellite-eye view like this.

KitFox

16:00

Personally, I'd dump it and use a live database connection. But that's my bailiwick, so of course I'd say that.

tchrist

I needs must commute. Hasta la vista, baby.

KitFox

Thanks.

And most concerning of all, as far as I'm concerned, is that he is talking about disabling the back button to "provide a consistent experience."

That shouts to me that he can't possibly, possibly know anything about good coding practice.

Matt Эллен

certainly nothing about good UX

KitFox

@Robusto Yeah, that guy. It's not you, is it?

Matt Эллен

you make your site work with the back button

KitFox

16:02

I'm not sure what to do about this project.

Robusto

@KitFox No. Not me.

KitFox

@Robusto I thought you would have more sense, if I ever actually knew you.

Robusto

@KitFox I do have more sense. But I wish I had more money than sense. Just once.

KitFox

Haha.

So, given the very slanted way I'm presenting this information, do you then agree that I should feel apprehensive? Or is this just me being new and not knowing things?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

There is a search library called Solr which we use on our site and it's pretty good.

KitFox

16:09

How does it work? Or should I go and read up on it?

Oh! Apache.

I could get behind that.

Jez

I wish I had @KitFox's problem

KitFox

Oh, this sounds like what I was thinking of...they prebuild the pages, so I thought, what if rather than prebuilding them as html, they built them as xml and then used an xml searching library.

Jez

i'm not unsure; I'm pretty sure the way things are done here are sucky

course I say "here", I mostly mean India

Robusto

@KitFox I'd be apprehensive.

KitFox

Do you think my idea is good? Naive?

Robusto

16:17

@KitFox The most consistent experience of all would be an app that presented only a blank screen. The man is a fool.

MετάEd

CDC webcast on flu activity and vaccination coverage in about a half an hour

Robusto

I am on pins and needles.

Matt Эллен

I am on puns and noodles

Robusto

I am on pens and nettles.

Matt Эллен

I am on pans and nibbles

badass

16:35

I am on posts and news.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox You could probably index the html pages

Robusto

I am on pwns and noddles.

EnglishMaster

Do you think this strategy going to work?

badass

I am on penicillins and nibblets

EnglishMaster

Ok so, she and I are going to watch Hobbit 2 tomorrow and when movie starts and lights go out, I'm going to write this question on my phone and ask her

me: "Hey, can I ask you a question?"

"ok"

me: "your breast size is AA isn't it?"

Matt Эллен

16:38

I am on pons and nipples

EnglishMaster

"No it's B!"

Me: "Bullshxx, can I check?"

Matt Эллен

no that won't work

EnglishMaster

how come?

badass

because it's corny

Matt Эллен

has she ever made it seem like you can touch her breasts before?

EnglishMaster

16:40

no

Matt Эллен

why would it be cool now?

so you think she wants you to touch her breasts?

Jez

probably will work. jerks always seem to get women.

EnglishMaster

50/50

Matt Эллен

well, I guess you've got nothing to lose.

EnglishMaster

yeah

badass

16:41

but she can slap you in the dark

EnglishMaster

so i'm going to attempt

badass

and believe me it hurts more when you don't see it coming >8(

Matt Эллен

I'm giving 2:1 on that she'll reject you.
10:1 on that she'll punch you in the nuts

badass

I'll take that bet.

do you take bitcoin?

Matt Эллен

lol

badass

16:45

\o/

Matt Эллен

/o\

badass

/o/

Robusto

He takes betcoin.

badass

are you going to hold the bets?

Robusto

@MattЭллен I am on peens and nodules.

@EnglishMaster So your goal is not to get laid, right?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

16:48

@MattЭллен I'm with you. This approach is disrespectful.

But I have to run.

EnglishMaster

Gosh, I don't want to talk about it here anymore

badass

Have you seen Hobbit 1?

EnglishMaster

yeah

badass

Is it scary?

EnglishMaster

I hope Hobbit 2 is boring so she won't pay too much attention to the movie

Hobbit 1 is gay

badass

16:53

Romantic movies are better context, right?

EnglishMaster

yeah

badass

Context is King

Matt Эллен

@EnglishMaster it had its moments, but I thought it was more actiony than jovial.

Robusto

@EnglishMaster It's excessive. If each book of TLotR had its own movie, The Hobbit should merit a single movie. The movie trilogy has been transformed into the reciprocal of the book.

badass

How does a book have a reciprocal?

MετάEd

16:56

@Robusto How did you feel about the last two Harry Potter movies?

Robusto

@MετάEd I didn't watch them. That franchise lost me at around the third or fourth movie.

MετάEd

@Robusto But do you mind that the last book was split into two movies?

Robusto

@MετάEd Since I didn't watch it and don't care about it, no.

I didn't read the books, either.

I tried to get through the first one, for my son's sake, but I gave up at around page 50.

Her writing style annoys me.

MετάEd

@Robusto I'd like to see somebody do this (serialized movies) for The Once And Future King.

Four films.

Robusto

I don't mind serialization, in general, if it lends itself to that. Too often single movies leave out too much of the book. But if you can do a good job getting most of the important stuff in each of the Rings books out in a four hour film, surely the same could be done with The Hobbit.

You could make a miniseries out of, say, Moby-Dick, or War and Peace.

MετάEd

17:03

@Robusto I guess it depends on the book. Some books can sustain serialization and some can't. If Hobbit can, then, well, it can. Otherwise it can't. The proof is at the box office.

Robusto

The proof, for me, is in my mind. The Hobbit is much more linear than any of the LotR books, and hasn't the same logical stopping points.

Also, they're trying so hard to turn Thorin into Aragorn that it perverts what I see as Tolkien's original characterization.

Nov 6 at 1:51, by Robusto

He's blowing up a Hobbit balloon, trying to be as big as TLotR, and soon it will burst.

Jul 30 '12 at 19:03, by Robusto

If The Hobbit had been a cow Peter Jackson couldn't have milked it any harder.

Jan 14 at 16:49, by Robusto

BTW, saw The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey yesterday. I got to the "An Unexpected Pause" part. Really, what a waste of time. Peter Jackson flashes a lot of special effects at us and calls that a movie. He'd better be careful, because he's in danger of becoming George Lucas.

Cerberus

@Robusto So it's worse than the LotR films?

Robusto

@Cerberus I would say so.

Cerberus

OK noted.

Where is the first stop anyway? I forgot what route they took. Not through Imladris?

Cerberus

17:32

@Trig I suppose...I'm not particularly attracted to young anyway. But I imagine he looked older that he was.

KitFox

@English The problem is that first you are insulting her, then asking to touch her boobs.

If you want to have a shot at it working, you should compliment her boobs first.

It's not rocket science.

TRiG

17:53

@EnglishMaster Is this a good thing or a bad thing?

Cerberus

@EnglishMaster Have you considered a more standard order of things? Touch shoulder, later touch hand, later take hand and hold hands if she doesn't pull away, then later pointedly touch her neck to move in for a kiss (but probably not in the dark)? Boob touching should usually come after that, I would say.

KitFox

He's 13. He's lucky he's going to a movie with a girl.

Cerberus

Yes.

Although, if he wants to do what grown-ups do, perhaps he should try to be more like one...

I had no idea he was that young, though.

KitFox

I'm just guessing. He acts like a kid.

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…