English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Another word of mysterious origins of jism, in the sense of spunk. The OED mentions it is sometimes spelled jizz, and may even be the precursor word to jazz. But neither the OED nor Etymonline gives any etymology for this word. The oldest citation is from 1847, and there are many citations ...

@RegDwigнt No, don’t post nonsense, please.

Ste

@tchrist - Are you willing to provide even the tiniest of clues re: Eureka?

tchrist

Yes.

Ste

2:17 PM

Please don't tell that was it!

tchrist

I already did.

RegDwigнt

@tchrist yeah yeah I didn't even begin to begin. My consideration ended right with my previous comment.

Actually rather than posting anything I am waiting for it to be time for me to go home.

tchrist

Good. I’d’ve thought you had better sense, and am glad I was right.

RegDwigнt

Perhaps I could unpack some LEGO and re-pack it for transport home.

> rep cap was reached via rep from upvotes *only* on 41 days
earned at least 200 reputation on 51 days

Anonymous

I wonder if the people on the Russian and Spanish sites have noticed this

Ste

2:20 PM

@tchrist - thanks!

RegDwigнt

I think I'll +1 there today, but I'm not getting that Legendary badge until after the Winter Bash 2058.

tchrist

@RegDwigнt Go for Legendary! Go go go go go!

RegDwigнt

> What's your learning the English language question?

Anonymous

Formerly "What's your question about learning the English language?", maybe?

RegDwigнt

@tchrist I am touched that you want me to live for that long.

@snailboat Formerly "And who are the you?"

Oh I forgot to ping @mr.shinyandnew安宇 about the LEGO hat:

7

A: What are the fantasy secret hats you'd wish to get?

I'd like to have a LEGO hat, obviously. Credit: Jean Charles de Castelbajac. Oh, and obviously, as a reference to the classic 2×4 brick it would be awarded for four meta posts with a score of 2+. In the same vein as Upboated, but harder to get, as downvotes on metas are rampant.

Actually I was thinking we should the invade the LEGO Answers chat some the time during the Christmas, for a nice the revival and of course the some hats.

tchrist

2:24 PM

@Ste There, I’ve done all I could think to do.

Robusto

Obviously.

RegDwigнt

His hat looks like a poor, and failed, attempt at yours.

Ste

@tchrist - Yeah, I think I've done it - waiting for the job to tick over. Is 1 enough?

Cerberus

Hey, Hermes?

Robusto

It's the winged helmet of Hermes.

tchrist

2:25 PM

@Ste Yes.

RegDwigнt

He looks decidedly Ungreek.

Robusto

But Hermes didn't bring anyone to justice. He just served the subpoenas.

Ste

@tchrist Should just be a case of waiting for the job to kick in. Thanks. :)

tchrist

@Robusto That’s the JSA Flash not the JLA Flash.

Robusto

A Flash in the pan.

RegDwigнt

2:26 PM

Edgar Allan Poena.

tchrist

Did you guys see the Pancho Clause bits from last night?

RegDwigнt

He got blown to pieces?

I am not sure what the reference here is.

I am not the opposite of Batman, I am the opposite of Captain America in that one scene in The Avengers.

tchrist

8 hours ago, by tchrist

Oh for crying out loud, there’s a Pancho Claus from the South Pole.

RegDwigнt

That's one rad ride.

tchrist

8 hours ago, by tchrist

¡Feliz Navidad, Pancho, pero por dónde me has escondido los regalitos que ya me prometiste?

RegDwigнt

2:30 PM

Actually, it's a four-Rad ride. At least I hope so.

tchrist

8 hours ago, by tchrist

Quam olim Abrahae promisisti et semini ejus.

RegDwigнt

Semini is Russian for "semen". In the partitive.

Robusto

►

Cerberus

@RegDwigнt I forgot, did Proto-Indo-European have a partitive case?

tchrist

The Avengers (TV series)

The Avengers is a spy-fi British television series created in the 1960s. The Avengers initially focused on Dr. David Keel (Ian Hendry) and his assistant John Steed (Patrick Macnee). Hendry left after the first series and Steed became the main character, partnered with a succession of assistants. Steed's most famous assistants were intelligent, stylish and assertive women: Cathy Gale (Honor Blackman), Emma Peel (Diana Rigg), and later Tara King (Linda Thorson). Later episodes increasingly incorporated elements of science fiction and fantasy, parody and British eccentricity. The Avengers ra...

Cerberus

2:32 PM

I know it had an instrumental...

I think it had 7 cases?

tchrist

@Cerberus Some of it did.

Robusto

Is it Christmas yet?

RegDwigнt

@Robusto wow, it is three hours long! What is it, the Odyssey?

Robusto

Yes.

Cerberus

Nom, gen, dat, acc, loca, instr...and then...

Robusto

2:32 PM

I just found a part with Hermes in it.

tchrist

@Cerberus No use having an instrumental without some vocatives to liven up the affect.

RegDwigнt

Hm. That joke didn't come out right.

Robusto

He also seems to be a butler.

RegDwigнt

Or perhaps yours did.

tchrist

@Robusto Hermès?

RegDwigнt

2:33 PM

@Cerberus vocative!

Cerberus

@tchrist I'm sure it had an a-capella case.

tchrist

@RegDwigнt Et te invoco ego!

Cerberus

@RegDwigнt Does that count as a separate case in Proto-Indo-European?

RegDwigнt

Mucho Gustav!

Cerberus

(Because it doesn't in Latin or Greek, normally.)

RegDwigнt

2:34 PM

@Cerberus I have no idea. I am just throwing things at you to stick for a second before you forget.

Robusto

"Then she will make you an offer to take her to bed. You cannot refuse a goddess!"

Cerberus

Hmm what things...ohhh a butterfly!

RegDwigнt

Yeah I threw that butterfly real hard.

Cerberus

Circe? She is only a...what is she, a demigoddess?

Robusto

Butter pie?

@Cerberus Still qualifies as a goddess of sorts.

Actually she was a witch.

Whatever the translation is in Greek, I don't know.

Hex?

No, that's German.

I dunno.

Cerberus

2:36 PM

> nominative, accusative, genitive, dative, instrumental, ablative, locative, vocative, and possibly a directive or allative

Robusto

Case closed.

RegDwigнt

@Robusto try μάγισσα or φαρμακίς.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt What did Homer use?

RegDwigнt

Ach Gottchen...

A donut?

Obvious cop-out is obvious.

Robusto

manissa or farmakis?

RegDwigнt

2:37 PM

Yeah.

No wait, magissa.

That's a gamma.

Anonymous

Perlative is the best case.

RegDwigнt

Case in point is the best case. It fits literally anywhere.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Δ'ω!

4

tchrist

@Cerb @Reg This is the best Spanish verb conjugator I’ve seen. It shows various so-called “irregularity” models and also includes the Argentine/Chilean vos forms.

Anonymous

But it's more fun saying perlative.

Ste

2:39 PM

@tchrist - I must have missed something out...

RegDwigнt

@tchrist oh! that one actually looks familiar.

tchrist

It’s always fun to say perlative.

RegDwigнt

Though I'm not sure if it was you who posted it before, or if it was indeed in this room.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Oh, right. A descender.

tchrist

Reflexives, too.

RegDwigнt

2:41 PM

I only know "che se fuiste".

And that is probably wrong.

I mean, beyond the Italian spelling.

WTF is wrong with me.

Robusto

@tchrist Well, but does it dice carrots and sew buttons on shirts? If not, how can we sell it on late-night TV?

tchrist

the se should be te, of course.

Tú te vas => Tú te fuiste

RegDwigнt

Right on.

tchrist

Which is not the huir flight verb, just the left verb.

RegDwigнt

No me doy cuenta.

tchrist

2:42 PM

Ya lo sabes.

RegDwigнt

Si.

Es cierto.

En Barcelona hay una fabrica de coches.

tchrist

fugire > fugir > fuir > huir

Which is somewhat irregular.

Cerberus

phew I don't have to go help my friend paint her house today.

tchrist

So an huida is a fugue, flight, or that thing Mohammed did, I think.

RegDwigнt

@tchrist that is incredibly offensive in Russian. A very offensive word for dick. Conjugated all over the place.

They have that with huevos, too.

We used to eat flan de huevos and my wife wouldn't stop laughing.

tchrist

2:44 PM

The actor who played Aragorn in The Lord of the Rings lived in Argentine, speaks good Spanish, and uses vos forms.

@RegDwigнt ¡La leche, dices!

Robusto

Viggo Mortensen?

RegDwigнt

You should go watch him in that movie with Michael Douglas and Gwyneth Paltrow now.

Makes for a whole nother experience.

@Robusto Yes.

Aragorn on a sub.

Denzel Washington is only not the most overrated person on the planet because Whoopie Goldberg is a thing.

tchrist

2:46 PM

Alatriste

Alatriste is a 2006 Spanish historical film directed by Agustín Díaz Yanes, based on the main character of a series of novels written by Arturo Pérez-Reverte, The Adventures of Captain Alatriste (). The film, which stars Viggo Mortensen, is the second most expensive Spanish language film ever made in Spain (about €24 million – US$30 million); only preceded by Agora. It portrays Spain of the 17th century using both fictional and real characters. Twentieth Century Fox has bought the rights to the film. Plot The story takes place during the 17th century in the Spanish Empire. ...

Robusto

@RegDwigнt I disagree. I think he's a really interesting actor.

tchrist

Fíjate: that was a Spanish-language film where he had the lead.

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Did you see Training Day?

tchrist

Oh, it says Spanish and Dutch. @Cerb

RegDwigнt

@Robusto He made a couple good movies but then sold out is how I see it. I haven't seen a decent movie with him in years.

@Robusto yes, and I only just rewatched it last week.

In English, too.

Cerberus

2:48 PM

@tchrist Hmm what?

Robusto

@RegDwigнt I agree he hits the potboilers a bit too hard. But when he's in a good film, he rises to the occasion.

tchrist

I was just surprised the 2nd-most-expensive film made in Spain had Dutch language in it.

Frick, I’d need subtitles.

Cerberus

I don't know, European cinema can be fairly international.

Robusto

The Armada had Dutch subtitles, ne? I'm talking about the actual fleet, not the film.

Cerberus

Everyone needs subtitles with European films.

RegDwigнt

2:49 PM

I mean, come on. Deja Vu? Inside Man? Unstoppable? Have you seen any of these? More to the point, have you been graced with seeing them all?

Cerberus

@Robusto *cannon balls

@tchrist By the way, don't you agree that "a film in Spanish" is far less illiterate than "a Spanish-language film"? And it's shorter, too!

Robusto

In fact, didn't one of the reasons the Armada failed was that they took on water in Holland that was casked in barrels of unseasoned wood, and all the sailors got sick?

RegDwigнt

Oh and that awful Pelham remake.

shudders

Robusto

@RegDwigнt Yeah, there was no need for that. But Flight wasn't bad. His role in it was good.

Also The Siege.

Cerberus

@Robusto I have never heard of that, and which armada of the...two? Three?

RegDwigнt

2:50 PM

@Robusto That's one I still haven't seen.

Robusto

But Training Day is the masterpiece.

RegDwigнt

It looked too similar to Flightplan production-design wise. So something made me instinctively block it out.

Cerberus

I remember unfavourable winds and lots of Dutch sloops outmanoeuvring the Spanish frigates...

And the English probably helped, too, but that I wouldn't remember...

I wonder what would have happened had Spain conquered England...

Robusto

►

RegDwigнt

@Robusto that one had its highs and lows for me. Even upon rewatching. Though that's perhaps not the best description, "highs and lows" sound too specific and pointable-to. It was more of an underlying unsettling feeling throughout most of the movie that something was missing or wasn't quite right.

tchrist

2:53 PM

@Cerberus Pues, en aquel caso todos hablaríamos castellano, desde luego.

RegDwigнt

Some of it might even have to do with my putting myself into Ethan's shoes subconsciously. Not quite getting what's going on, you know. Being gamed over and over again. Which in turn would be a plus. But I am not sure.

Ste

@tchrist - does this one take longer than the others to appear?

Robusto

That's the tension of the film. You have one day to figure out who to trust—or die.

Cerberus

@tchrist Es possibile.

tchrist

@Ste Yes.

Cerberus

2:55 PM

And I bet I have even made a mistake in a two-word sentence...

tchrist

Crud, now look what I’ve done.

10

A: Hello as a verb

Theoretically, any, absolutely any word in English can be used as a verb. Nothing prevents you from helloing, betweening, egadsing or greating. However, it's one thing to just use a word as a verb, but a different thing altogether to have it also be understood by others, and it's a different thi...

Cerberus

@tchrist So don't you agree that the whole modern "x-language film" and "x-based company" is ugly and illiterate? It's nothing personal, of course. We all have our...deviations.

RegDwigнt

I am looking but not seeing.

tchrist

@RegDwigнt Comment chain.

RegDwigнt

Ah that. Yes, yes.

You dunnit.

tchrist

2:57 PM

@Cerberus You have three mouths to feed: you shouldn’t need to be putting your own words in other people’s mouths.

Very well, then.

@tchrist - cool. I'm very impatient!

RegDwigнt

I now finally have more gold badges than Mehper. Now I can retire.

228 behind Web Apps.

Jasper Loy

3:14 PM

@RegDwigнt Good, you may deleted your account now.

RegDwigнt

I need the bunny ears first.

Cerberus

Haha.

Jasper Loy

@Cerberus You are not wearing any hats, like me.

Cerberus

Indeed not.

badass

Not indeed.

Cerberus

3:27 PM

@badass What do you mean?

RegDwigнt

Commute!

badass

Later

@cerebus nothing in particular, just word play :-)

Jasper Loy

@badass cerberus

badass

*Cerberus

:-)

Robusto

3:42 PM

@RegDwigнt Nah. You'll grind out more silver badges than I have fairly soon.

Jasper Loy

I am thinking if Barrie will retire after reaching 100k

Cerberus

@badass Sabads.

badass

What does "sabads" mean?

@cerberus

Robusto

@JasperLoy Why does it matter?

tchrist

4:07 PM

@RegDwigнt Wah. I’ll never get a gold.

@Jasper What number account is this for you?

@JasperLoy I blame you for all those heisenvotes on my weefil!

77

A: What animal is a “weefil”?

f vs ſ That’s merely a “long s”, not an f. Therefore, it is not a weefil but rather a weeſil — meaning of course, a weasel. We can rule out weevil because it has the look not of a bug but of a musteline critter. Here are some examples in various faces — namely, in roman, italic, scrip...

@Ste Both of my unexpected hats yesterday came hours after I thought I had fulfilled the conditions. I think that means I missed a step at first, and then later something happened that finally fulfilled it, but I don’t know what did it.

Ste

@tchrist I shall wait and see what happens. Do need gold still?

tchrist

@Ste Yeah.

I can’t see a way there other than the Weefil, which is lame.

Ste

Right, let's see what we can do about that..

tchrist

This doesn’t even have 2k views, so it will never get to 10k:

17

Q: Time and tide wait for no man

In the old proverb: Time and tide wait for no man. Our first record of the proverb is from St Marher in 1225: And te tide and te time þat tu iboren were, schal beon iblescet. When it was already considered ancient. EDIT: As near as I can make out, the Middle English proverb quoted ab...

grammatical-number proverbs middle-english nuance

Ste

15 more upvotes on this will get you populist: english.stackexchange.com/a/94894/20739

tchrist

4:13 PM

Oh?

That’s closer by 8 votes than weefil.

I haven't run the report lately.

Good catch.

I actually tried looking for something for a Reversal, but that’s tough, because once your answer goes up, their lame question goes up, too.

Ste

Yeah, I will market your populist candidate.

tchrist

How does one “market” these things?

I’ve been trying to do that for other stuff, but have never been successful. No one is interested.

Ste

Come on guys! @tchrist needs only 14 upvotes* ON THIS ANSWER. Get voting and star this for visibility!

4

Star that.

tchrist

Oh!

Ste

And if @RegDwigнt can star it too, it goes to the top of the star list.

We could downvote the accepted answer too but I don't think that is morally correct.

tchrist

4:18 PM

Ewww!

Ste

Exactly!

tchrist

Please don’t.

Look, here I have 5 Populists, with more on the way. But on ELU, naw.

Ste

No I wouldn't. I didn't on my populist attempt.

tchrist

I think we need more voters or some of these things to happen.

Damkerng T.

@Ste I'm doing my part!

Ste

4:22 PM

Great!

tchrist

@RegDwigнt What, like Ngram graphs, or like Graphviz graphs?

24

Q: What are the fantasy secret hats you'd wish to get?

I had for some days the fantasy of getting a grinch hat. I know there is a hat when you only do upvotes in a day and believed it could make sense to have the same kind of hats for downvotes only. It would be the grinch hat. The programmer that ruined christmas. What are the fantasy secret hats y...

discussion winterbash-2013

Surely we creative people can think of cool hats that make sense in an SE framework!

I’m wondering about the supersecret hats. Are those just ringers in the sprite, or are they real?

Ste

There may actually be supersecret hats!?

tchrist

Yeah, where’s that sprite?

Ste

!!wiki sprite

KitSox

Sprite (computer graphics)

In computer graphics, a sprite (also known by other names; see Synonyms below) is a two-dimensional image or animation that is integrated into a larger scene. Initially including just graphical objects handled separately from the memory bitmap of a video display, this now includes various manners of graphical overlays. Originally, sprites were a method of integrating unrelated bitmaps so that they appeared to be part of the normal bitmap on a screen, such as creating an animated character that can be moved on a screen without altering the data defining the overall screen. Such sprites ...

tchrist

4:28 PM

2 days ago, by tchrist

Matt Эллен

anyone know what you get Taco (the husky) for?

Ste

Oh dear - I am going to have to work harder. Has anyone got any of those?

Matt Эллен

oh, maybe it's not a husky. the dog one

tchrist

@Ste Letme check.

Ste

@MattЭллен - and check the starred link on the right - @tchrist is on a mission for gold hat.

Matt Эллен

4:31 PM

aye, I've added mine :)

Ste

Cool - and star the message.

:o)

badass

5:18 PM

!!wiki sabads

Where's the bot when you need it?

JSBձոգչ

bot only comes on when @KitFox comes on

b/c it runs in her browser

so both of our foxen may be out for the holidays

badass

Icic

Robusto

5:44 PM

> It is easy to be beautiful; it is difficult to appear so.

Meysam

6:10 PM

Hi everybody

Saladin

I want to take 4 days holidays (24-27th jan 2013) to avail some of the remaining annual leave which I have left for this year. Also, I want to take these holiday to prepare for Qradar exam I have on coming friday (27th 2013).

Kindly approve this request.

can someone revise this para?

JSBձոգչ

> I want to take four days of holiday (Jan 24-17 2014) to use up some of the remaining annual leave which I have for this year, and to prepare for the Qradar exam I have on Friday, Jan 27.

@JSBձոգչ thanks

np

@JSBձոգչ Hi

6:19 PM

hallo

Meysam

Which one is correct? He introduced me to this book - vs - He introduced this book to me.

JSBձոգչ

both are equally correct

the second is slightly more idiomatic

Meysam

Which one is more likely to be used by you?

JSBձոգչ

probably the second

because a book is not actually animate

Meysam

Thank you :)

RegDwigнt

6:44 PM

JSB's grammar post keeps getting me good arguments OVER 9000 years later.

And I see he finally got a shiny silver badge for it.

JSBձոգչ

which post is that?

the one about "why do we have grammar"?

RegDwigнt

Aye.

I'm standing on the shoulders of linguists.

Feb 10 '11 at 14:57, by Kosmonaut

Well, I got that info from someone else too :)

@JSBձոգչ that, by the way, is not entirely true. I have used the bot on more one occasion with Kit not in the room. Sometimes it just hiccups, is all.

tchrist

7:02 PM

@Ste Aw dang it, they moved my cheese!

RegDwigнt

Glory hallelujah, cheese shall not be moved!

tchrist

Ok I’m outta here. See you on the farside.

Meysam

@RegDwigнt Hi

Anonymous

7:23 PM

@RegDwigнt Which one is that?

Anonymous

Also, I got the milliner hat! :-)

Meysam

Hi guys

which one is correct

He asked me to study the book XXX

He asked me to study the XXX book

He asked me to study the book titled XXX

Anonymous

@Meysam Is XXX intended as a title in all three?

Meysam

@snailboat Yes

Anonymous

@Meysam Then the last one seems most normal to me. (People often talk about a book called something rather than titled something, by the way.)

Anonymous

7:36 PM

The second one could be used if you were talking about the XXX book as opposed to say the XXX movie

Anonymous

But that usage is less common

Meysam

@snailboat Thank you

Anonymous

The first one would have the title as an appositive

Anonymous

Which is okay too

Meysam

What's the verb for someone who works on a farm?

Anonymous

7:41 PM

Farmer?

Anonymous

Oh, verb

Meysam

verb

Anonymous

What are they doing? "Working on the farm?"

Anonymous

Farm...ing? :-)

Meysam

Planting, harvesting, watering, etc

farming?

Anonymous

7:43 PM

Well, it's a word!

Meysam

"Till the end of summer, I was busy farming". Is this correct?

Anonymous

I don't know. I guess I'd say "working on the farm", but I've never even been to a farm.

Transmission from

@Meysam 'doing farm work'?

badass

Working on a farm is fine.

RegDwigнt

25

A: If the English language is always evolving, why do we need to learn and follow grammatical rules?

Your question mostly turns on the definition of grammar. From a linguistic point of view, grammar is simply the set of patterns and rules that speakers use to structure their utterances. Grammar is absolutely necessary for communication. A sentence with literally no grammar cannot be understood,...

Mitch

7:54 PM

@Meysam 'farming', though not incorrect, is not the preferred term. You'd say 'working on the farm' mosr likely, or even better, the more specific term (harvesting, seeding, tilling,etc.

Transmission from

@Meysam 'farming', to me, suggests 'running a farm'.

badass

Congrats @regdwight on becoming one of the owners of the ELL chatroom. :-)

Transmission from

I suppose that people working on a farm are not (all) called farmers, right?

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…