The Awkward Silence - 2018-10-17 (page 2 of 3)

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3:00 PM

Just saying that when "shit happens" asking about it on meta is the appropriate way to go. It's why we have meta.

@apaul We never said otherwise, actually. We just agreed to wait until SE staff were up and could answer our prior questions before bringing it up to meta.

@avazula " We just agreed to wait until SE staff were up and could answer our prior questions before bringing it up to meta." is kinda saying otherwise?

Journeyman Geek

@apaul as opposed to twitter

there's two parts to it:
- covering this stuff on meta is a good idea, because it is relevant to the broader site audience.
- expecting further answers after someone's repeatedly said they don't know any more than what everyone else already knows, is kinda pointless—we do need to wait until someone else comes along who has any answers at all.

@JourneymanGeek Ya... That's not ideal. Should have started and ended on meta.

Journeyman Geek

3:05 PM

@apaul yup

@apaul We do have a topic open on it on meta

There's just not a lot to opine about until we know deeper reasons that staff had - they'll have to have their say first. I could vent and speculate (like I have done on chat) on meta, but that'd be unproductive.

@apaul well, it's open both on IPS.meta and MSE so, until we have answers, there's nothing more we can do ... It's just we all agree to wait for answers before bringing it to meta, but someone disagreed and it ended up there and then anyway.

@doppelspooker The advantage of meta is that a question can be posted and answered at any point. Telling users not to ask until mods and CMs can discuss privately causes a lack of transparency.

Journeyman Geek

is opine an actual word?

Yeah

opine
/ə(ʊ)ˈpʌɪn/Senden
verbFORMAL
hold and state as one's opinion.

Journeyman Geek

3:07 PM

@apaul I think that was in reference to chat, and a certain degree of running around like headless chickens, and slightly un-necessary drama on some parts

I think the "we agreed to wait" bit concerns passing judgements until staff wakes up

@Magisch what do you mean?

There really ought to be a staff-driven post on this to be coming, and we'll have to wait for that until we can know the exact reasons and process behind what happened.

I did not downvote the meta post fwiw

Journeyman Geek

practically there's no point in speculating for now - I think words have been had, there's meta posts, but there's a certain risk of... passions flaring for it as a topic for chat?

@JourneymanGeek I agree. We can't do much more right now besides waiting.

3:10 PM

just personally I don't have anything to say on meta until I've given staff a chance to explain their reasoning. assuming good faith and all that ... :)

Journeyman Geek

da

keep calm and carry on and all that

No problem with the hnq issue, more about procedure n' all that.

Yeah. I think that was really surprising for everyone. Moving on...

I had some fun with facial recognition today

But I'm pretty upset by our purpose for using it

Journeyman Geek

._.

people tracking?

i.e. filming customers and analyzing how they react to new objects and stuff to buy

I hate it.

Journeyman Geek

3:12 PM

ah

people tracking

@avazula I can guess

Would it be for ... idk, safety ... I'd be more okay

@avazula ajusts tinfoil hat

Journeyman Geek

cool tech, terrible use?

@apaul Hahaha

Journeyman Geek

(heh, I'm surprised that we don't use that)

3:13 PM

@JourneymanGeek Yeah.

@JourneymanGeek "we"?

Journeyman Geek

@avazula oh, my employer.

We have cool retina scanners, thumb print scanners...

I hated today too

had a bunch of meetings about legal stuff

@Magisch :( what happened?

ugh

including one with an actual lawyer who asked me questions and wanted my opinion on stuff

Journeyman Geek

I actually had a good day ;p

3:14 PM

stuff I'm in no way qualified to talk about with certainty

@JourneymanGeek yay :D

Journeyman Geek

Now I need to stay up all night ;)

@Magisch :/ that sucks

Journeyman Geek

@avazula ya, I had a "I told you so moment" ;p

tis' bovine waste

3:15 PM

@Magisch :o language please, dear! :p

@JourneymanGeek Ha? How's that?

Journeyman Geek

hopefully they're interested - was matchmaking stuff, and the girl's cute ;)

@Magisch ^^

Journeyman Geek

@avazula so, I kinda asked my mom to call someone's dad off the matchmaking site

Mom went "Email them please!" despite me pointing out that the sucess rate for purely emailed requests was 0

... 3 days later "Hey geek! they never got back"

._.

"MOOOOOM"

@JourneymanGeek Is it the one you linked in you know where?

Journeyman Geek

"Ok ok. I will call them day after tommorrow, its an auspecious day"

/_.

3:17 PM

I'm utterly baffled by that website

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch naw

same site

different girl

@Magisch I am too!

But I'm getting very little help on this

What on earth is horoscope matching

do I even want to know?

Journeyman Geek

ohh man

no!

@Magisch HAHAHAHA. Do you want me to explain? :p

Journeyman Geek

I don't really believe in that

3:18 PM

@avazula rather not

Journeyman Geek

@avazula ... the indian system is even worse

I want a nice evening

an evening without GDPR or horoscopes

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch I could cliffs notes it

@Magisch Then stay with us. We'll do our very best to keep you cheering up :)

Journeyman Geek

Its not that bad, and my reasons for not beliving in it are funny

I don't get the details myself. I'm going for a very rough star match off a list my parents sent me

3:20 PM

I'm actually -25% spiritual so flat out atheist tbh

@JourneymanGeek Oh, I'm not critisizing it, I don't know how it is elsewhere than in my country. But in my country, it is very excentric haha

Journeyman Geek

because some people believe in it

but but

If my fate is fixed in the stars

and is predestined.

It will happen anyway

absolute determinism implies the lack of choice and agency

Journeyman Geek

If it isn't, its BS.

which makes basing decisions on it self contradictory

Journeyman Geek

3:21 PM

SO, there's no point either way

@JourneymanGeek Wait a minute. When you say "matchmaking site" ... you're not talking about Tinder-like sites?

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch precisely

i.E if you believe everything is pre-destined then nobody can go to hell for believing in the wrong thing because that too is completly pre-destined.

Journeyman Geek

@avazula erm... kinda?

@avazula it's like tinder but for finding someone to marry

with less tinder and more economics

Journeyman Geek

3:22 PM

lol

Its almost like a job application

@Magisch Huh, I figured out a Tinder-like site. How do you feel about it @JourneymanGeek (finding a partner online)?

Journeyman Geek

@avazula for various reasons I'm not actually a fan

@JourneymanGeek makes somewhat sense given the gravity of the decision

(no judgment here, of course, I never went on dating sites or marriage sites)

marrying someone is one of the most important things in a life

Journeyman Geek

3:23 PM

I'd prefer to go even more oldschool

But my parents are a bit useless

eh

as long as it's all by choice

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch it is? ;p

and people aren't forced into it

Journeyman Geek

you can always say no

@Magisch yup. I read some interesting articles recently where they were saying that our modern, occidental weddings were due to fail because we don't disclose to each other before getting married and so we can't resist any difficult moment. This isn't really a popular view in my country.

3:23 PM

@JourneymanGeek presumably you're free to go "I will not marry this woman" and so is the woman

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch yup

or "I don't want to move"

@avazula I dont know, i've never been one for relationships

@Magisch TBH I honestly feel that weren't I with my SO, I'd stay single my entire life.

I'm naturally solitary, asexual and aromantic. Dating me would be cruel and unusual punishment

Journeyman Geek

lol

3:25 PM

@Magisch for both of you actually. Surely isn't easy for you either (dating if you don't like it I mean)

I wouldn't mind so much if I was given enough space to have my down time. But I have no affection to give so it really wouldn't be fair.

Journeyman Geek

@avazula lemme link you an example

@Magisch Erh. I don't know. I feel like I understand what you mean.

I had a girlfriend before I started being honest with myself about myself. It was not a good relationship for her and I'm still sorry about having let it on for as long as I have

I'm very lonely by nature and I'd not feel comfortable should my SO not give me enough space.

@JourneymanGeek ok :)

Journeyman Geek

3:27 PM

ssmatri.com/ssnmlprofilelist.php?type=GI just pick any one

the little squares on the bottom right are horoscopes

@Magisch :/ at least you didn't keep going when you realized. Many wouldn't have have that courage.

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch heh, I'm in that funny place where I don't want to be, well alone, but at the same time I have no idea how someone's going to put up with me XD

@JourneymanGeek oh

I'm so perfectly fine with being alone :p

@JourneymanGeek there's so many things I don't understand lol

Journeyman Geek

3:29 PM

@avazula its ok. XD

I can explain some

@Magisch That's great then :)

@JourneymanGeek the irony of making a typo while editing

Journeyman Geek

SO, basically this is a listing for folks of my specific cultural group

...that should be It's, not Its'

Journeyman Geek

shrug I wasn't fixing spelling.

3:30 PM

I was, that was my typo :P

@JourneymanGeek that horoscope is so much different than ours

...and it's too small to submit another suggestion to fix it

Journeyman Geek

Yup

@Mithrandir oh

@Mithrandir at the end?

ya

@Magisch Are you still struggling with people judging you for being aromantic?

Journeyman Geek

3:32 PM

@avazula basically the positions of the 9 planets with respect to where you were born, at the time you were born

@avazula almost nobody knows :p

It's not something that comes up naturally

there are the odd one out people calling you an abomination or genetically defective but it's more humorous now then angering

@JourneymanGeek Oh! I think ours is based only on stars and Earth (I guess?)

@JourneymanGeek So we're counting Pluto then?

Journeyman Geek

@Mithrandir ... not really

@Magisch o_o if that's humourous then ... :)

Journeyman Geek

3:33 PM

they count the sun and moon, I THINK 5 planets, and 2 other things

it's humorous because you just know the people spewing this aren't very happy and have to project

@JourneymanGeek Then the Neptunoid in the Oort Cloud? :P

so I imagine what kind of person would just go for blatant bigotry like that and think "sure bud if you need it, knock yourself out"

Journeyman Geek

Navagraha means "nine planets" in Sanskrit and are nine astronomical bodies as well as mythical deities in Hinduism and Hindu astrology. These are the Sun, the Moon, Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, Venus, and Saturn, and the ascending and descending lunar nodes. == Planets, celestial bodies and lunar nodes == The term is derived from nava (nine) and graha (Sanskrit: graha "planet, seizing, laying hold of, holding").The Navagraha are: Surya (a.k.a. Ravi), the Sun Chandra (a.k.a. Soma), the Moon Mangala, Mars Budha (Budh), Mercury Guru, Jupiter Shukra, Venus Shani, Saturn Rahu, Lunar ascending node Ketu...

@Magisch I have no sexual interest in people (don't get me wrong, I'm not into other animals either), and people who find this out about me just assume I "haven't found my bliss". Lol, no dude

3:35 PM

I have heard this more times I can count or care to remember btw

"If you find the right girl you'll change your mind" I'm pretty sure that no

Journeyman Geek

immanotjudging

I used to identify as asexual

and the wierd thing is, while I'm not now, I can totally see it working for some people.

@Magisch most terrible thing is that many people pursue saying this to homosexual people as well ... ("you haven't found the right gal/boy")

Journeyman Geek

bleh

@JourneymanGeek How come that changed?

<--- pan

Journeyman Geek

3:36 PM

@avazula stuff

well, people like to not believe in what they can't understand or reconcile

Journeyman Geek

Well someone I really liked, and well...

@Mithrandir you?

Journeyman Geek

anyywayyy

I've had someone tell me "What, you're one of THEM? are you sure?"

3:36 PM

@JourneymanGeek hahaha. ok :p

@avazula yep

Journeyman Geek

Its not really a story for here, or anywhere XD

@JourneymanGeek ._.

Journeyman Geek

and lots of complicated massive personal change, some of which is hard to explain ;p

@Mithrandir oh parts of it? I'd probably talk about in private with random internet strangers

@Mithrandir Ok. I actually don't know where I am myself. As I said, I have no sexual interest in people, yet the person's gender is not relevant at all when I fall in love with someone. So ... what am I most liekly to be? dk...

Journeyman Geek

3:38 PM

parts of it, no ;)

@avazula meh, just labels

@avazula demi?

@JourneymanGeek :)

Journeyman Geek

you are who you are

(doesn't mean I have no intercourse btw. Just that I could totally live without it)

labels are only useful for quick explainations

you're under no obligation to fit one

3:39 PM

^ what Mag said

@Mithrandir Never heard of it. I'll search that.

:) True

(I've... probably looked into the terms way too much...)

Journeyman Geek

@Mithrandir that's natural.

@Mithrandir I get that. I learnt a lot about autism when I met El'endia and Noon. I took a dozen of quizzes myself and I got quite a high score in nearly all of them, and it may sounds strange but ... Imagining I may be on the spectrum myself would explain so many of the things that happened in my life ... Maybe labels are good sometimes

related

El'endia Starman

3:42 PM

I'm pretty sure I'm straight + demisexual. A close friend introduced me to the idea not all that long ago and it made a lot of sense. Basically, my sexual attraction to women (straight) comes after an emotional attachment (demisexual).

(Not that I want to sound insulting to anyone by assuming things about me that weren't diagnosed)

@avazula SE is a place where people with ASD seem to congregate

It lends itself well to the way of thinking and working, and with allowing to be social without actually beeing too social

@El'endiaStarman That's interesting. I didn't know about demisexual before.

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch and well till recentish, you could hunker down in purely techie spaces

I joined SE when I was still pretty much suffering from social anxiety

@JourneymanGeek Did it help ... idk, "reducing" it?

Journeyman Geek

3:46 PM

No ;p

I wouldn't have ended up here if it had been a traditional forum though

SE definitely helped me mature... at least slightly ;P

Journeyman Geek

I popped into chat when I was a little better

though, erm

my popularity, so to speak still baffles me ;p

@JourneymanGeek Erh. You're a great person :p no wonder you're "famous"

@El'endiaStarman it was interesting when that came up. I was raised to believe there was only one way to do it, that being straight was the only right way (catholic upbringing) and now I'm understanding it's not quite that way

Journeyman Geek

@avazula I... post stuff. I'm not really as "intentionally" active cross site as some.

3:50 PM

@ElizB My sisters' curator is in biology researching and he taught me that many scientists accord to say humans are not wired to be mono-partner. Which is quite different from what society is teaching us after all :p

@JourneymanGeek Activity doesn't make quality ;)

Journeyman Geek

@avazula mostly on 2 sites

@avazula Very interesting.

@Magisch I've seen worse than this, including ma^&%bating and fingering.

@AJ Islam.SE gets these fairly often

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch tbh, I avoid my own religion's site quite a bit.

all my posts there are on meta ;p

4:04 PM

ayayay what a day, and i missed so much over here :O

@Cashbee :p

I hope there's more info tomorrow. And I'm gone again. See you all in HNQ

or not xD

@Cashbee you nasty person :o xD

Journeyman Geek

@Cashbee OI

Too soon man too soon

@JourneymanGeek :p

4:07 PM

not too soon enough

@Tinkeringbell removing criticism, and not the response to that criticism isn't a great look.

@apaul ? Did I miss something?

I literally just came back from dinner, so whatever it is, I didn't do it?

@Cashbee memecrunch.com/meme/QRFM/disappointed-cat-okay/…

@apaul, which is why I tried to keep the discussion in chat to a minimum too. If you catch up on the transcript, you're likely to see a few messages requesting people to just hold off on discussing it/posting on meta until we could get hold of a CM and have a proper response for all of you. ( I was personally more in favor of them making an announcement than having a question to reply to) — Tinkeringbell ♦ 1 hour ago

Journeyman Geek

I can attest to her missing most of it

4:14 PM

@apaul Ah. I didn't delete that comment, FWIW. I'm going to check it out.

I see no reason for that to be deleted. I've undeleted it for now, if someone else tells me why it should've been, we might remove both. :)

Mhmm

@apaul That'd be me. Sorry for that.

Just try to keep in mind that sunshine makes everything clean. Encouraging open dialogue on meta is a good thing, even when it's a little contentious.

El'endia Starman

something something Super Mario Sunshine

@El'endiaStarman the goal in that game was to keep things clean, so you're on the right track

4:25 PM

@apaul hmm

Since the community seems to have taken this meta on board as the discussion topic, I'll remove my downvote and my comment. (And I've flagged gparyani's reply for removal.)

@doppelspooker in all fairness I think @gparyani's response in the comment is important information for anyone looking to answer the question. It should probably be edited into the main question itself.

@doppelspooker oh woops, I just made a reply to that comment

@apaul True. And I'm all for telling you everything I know as soon as I know it (and have pushed some buttons to make sure I won't lose my diamond for sharing). I just personally would've preferred waiting for an announcement rather than a meta question... because from experience I know it's easier to have free reign when writing such posts than having to frame them as answers to a question ;)

@Tinkeringbell you could still write an announcement and close the Q as duplicate

4:31 PM

@AJ Giving the impression that mods shouldn't be publicly questioned doesn't build confidence in the system. Allowing us to question decisions shows that you all are open to criticism and are holding yourselves, and each other accountable.

@apaul I am not saying that you shouldn't question us.

from the outside this looks very knee-jerky to me.

Can we just drop this discussion and wait?

@JAD what does?

the reaction to that tweet

ok

4:35 PM

someone mentions being welcoming and drastic measures are taken

I saw that.

the time between those tweets are 30 minutes

Again, I don't care much about the HNQ issue. The process by which it happened, and the whole "let's not talk about it" seems counter to a community driven and moderated site.

"oh shit, someone is critical of SE and accuses us of not being welcoming, quick, let's change how we work so they can feel nice and fuzzy"

@apaul 'let's not talk about it' is never the impression I tried to give off. But apart from everyone agreeing on 'the reaction to that tweet seems knee-jerky' and 'why weren't we included in the conversation' in this chatroom... We moved on and had some productive talk in here today too.

My proposal was 'let's talk about it, ONCE we know what's actually going on here'

4:37 PM

In that vein... Some meta posts by staff should be upcoming, so maybe let's hold our horses for now.

And that still holds. I'm busy talking to all sorts of people know, finding out what can and should be said. And what @Mith said

@JAD for all we know this could've been something the SE dev team has been talking about forever and they decided to roll it out a little early for the good PR of responding quickly to a tweet. I agree with the mods on this one, there's not really going to be any constructive criticism until we hear what actually happened from the staff

Not that any of as actually have horses besides Yvette, but that's beside the point

@scohe001 you're right, we don't know what exactly went on. I would've liked it that if they had these concerns for longer, they'd addressed it earlier on meta.

So, I like funny picture that why I have decided to post one here every time someone say: "let's change the subject" :P (please, let me know if you want me to stop). Here is the picture:

user image

4:42 PM

@JAD I agree that a "Here's what we're thinking, it'll take effect starting next month" post would've been welcomed (and that's definitely something I'm hoping to criticize if it's not addressed), but I feel like any discussion we have right now between ourselves will boil down to "Man this sucks that they did it this way."

Process matters. Taking a drastic action, without discussion beforehand, or even an announcement afterward, and then going silent for hours, didn't provide a great user experience...

@scohe001 exactly, :grabs pitchfork:

@Noon haha that's genius!

(full disclosure, none of the picture are mine, they are just from a facebook group that I follow)

they're also kinda old ;)

4:46 PM

@JAD You are making me sad :(

@Noon You are making me feel old ;)

@JAD Ahah, sorry about that :P

Don't worry

user image

Oh dear!

5:09 PM

@apaul I don't think there's anyone here who would disagree with that.

(from what I understand it's not like the IPS mods reached out and asked for this)

@doppelspooker Nah, I understand the problem. Asking the chat room to not discuss this, and hold off on the meta rants the way I did may be seen as trying to shove it under a carpet. That was not my intention, and I'll rethink my actions to improve them, while hopefully never having to use them another time ;)

@Tinkeringbell ok, I see.

@El'endiaStarman something something Vicky something something :o

→ 5 messages moved to Trash

5:49 PM

Revisiting the “Hot Network Questions” feature, what are our shared goals for having it?

7

spiral succulent

6:26 PM

@Magisch nice post summing up frustration at how this was handled without opening up a flamethrower

I was this close to breaking out into an angry unhinged rant but that would be unconstructive

Journeyman Geek

always is

@Magisch You did well :) Just enough rant in there ;)

@Tinkeringbell (Can I edit this to be a link?)

@Mithrandir Nope, because I was about to do that :P

6:30 PM

user image

Is that the reaction to the link editing or what to what I just told you? :P Also... is that cat sad or grumpy?

that cat is both.

just general reaction

Here. have something to cheer up:

user image

we just came off multiple months of a perpetual meta war that was started by the very same kind of short sighted bad optics

My whatsapp history with my dad XD

6:33 PM

prepare for round 2 now with more causticness and toxicitiy

@Magisch I have good faith that that will only happen if we (as IPS) make it such. Much of the rest of the network.. doesn't really seem to care :P

we need to show off our exemplary interpersonal skills...

the annoying thing is its something I've been in favor of for a long time, but the circumstances around it makes it a complete non starter

@Tinkeringbell This <3

@Mithrandir To be honest... All of you already did a great job of that today. The chatroom was a lot calmer than I think anyone would've expected, and the patience of everyone of you was overwhelming :)

(I'd also like to thank everyone that jumped in to help keep things calm in here, community members and mods alike)

@avazula I really want to ask what the voice calls are about... but I don't want to mess up the streak :P

6:41 PM

Yeah, that wasn't one of the easiest days.

can't you just go downstairs and ask? :p

Nah, that's not how things work :P After dinner, you don't go downstairs again :P

You might end up talking with your parents for hours!

^^

I wish I hadn't come home this weekend. My sisters were treated for lice and they gave it to me. Now I'm just brushing my hair with a tiny comb and burning everyone I find (not very vegan, is it?)

So, yeah ... family issues ... xD

(Seems like I scared everybody with my lice story)

Journeyman Geek

@avazula LICE MURDERER!

In the old days apparently they'd wash your hair in kerocene

@JourneymanGeek erh... some shampoos are basically gasoline here...

Oh, and here's your meta answer: interpersonal.meta.stackexchange.com/a/3331/1599

Journeyman Geek

6:52 PM

@avazula I've never had lice soooooo

@avazula oh fun

@Mithrandir Wanna see? lol

i had lice, ended up cutting most of the hair off ;_;

Journeyman Geek

heh since I'm balding, I probably wouldn't mind that as much

@Mithrandir I actually stopped cutting my hair a while ago :p did that help stopping the invasion?

6:53 PM

if I had lice, I'd just go bald for now

hair regrows, lice are annoying

Journeyman Geek

hair today gone tommorrow ;)

@Magisch can't get bald, my boss would kill me ("office apparences, blah blah blah")

heh

benefits of being male, eh?

@avazula It certainly made getting through my thick curly hair that tends to tangle really badly with a lice comb easier...

@Magisch :)

6:55 PM

(that sentence could use some parentheses to help in word grouping)

I actually can't really think of one advantage being female

@Mithrandir I see. My hair's actually like your avatar's, so... makes things easier

Journeyman Geek

naw, that's straight tho

Extroverted Main Man

0

Q: How to gently ask family member to help You simply by leaving job

Context My girlfriend's family happened to have pretty small income and because of that she was getting pretty nice social scholarship from her university. She have one sister who also was getting pretty nice social scholarship (although a little bit smaller). Scholarship is calculated each mo...

family boundaries

Journeyman Geek

... I am clearly not awake

@avazula Easier access to software engineering jobs :P

@JourneymanGeek Take some time to wake up (or sleep)

6:56 PM

@Tinkeringbell Erh ... Can't relate, have tons of offers these days, it's insane and I feel like a fraud o_o

@avazula Some people see that as an advantage :) I don't like it either :P

Journeyman Geek

lol

@Tinkeringbell at work

and I'm a bit hungry cause someone drank all the OJ :(

@JourneymanGeek oh no :(

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