@DavidCarlisle For example, at work, I'm not the administrator of my pc, I use Overleaf to write my LaTeX documents and CTAN to search for packages documentation.

@yo' I totally agree

@UlrikeFischer Blast! I had just sent off an update to CTAN. Fixed now. Another update off to CTAN ... Thank you very much for catching that.

@UlrikeFischer would you mind having a look at this one: tex.stackexchange.com/q/514361/3929 I've never heard that texstudio should have started asking people to update miktex

@daleif I don't use texstudio so I don't know. It could be that the user has some side effect from on-the-fly package installation. But imho it would be the best to go to the texstudio bug tracker or forum and ask there.

@DavidCarlisle spooky :)

@PauloCereda Hi :) Any idea for a better solution to tex.stackexchange.com/q/511439/124577?

@TeXnician Hi! :) Just saw it and upvoted. :) I think that's a great answer. We could be wacky and suggest the OP to invoke arara for every file arara finds. :)

I'm a bit tired by tex.stackexchange.com/questions/514074/… can someone else please take a look?

A nice font to explain in the next LaTeX curse what kerning is: hellveticafont.com

@JonasStein you're a bit late, it has been posted by Joseph a few days ago :)

oh no. The search function did not highlight that match. Sorry.

@JonasStein it's among the starred posts on the right (at least for me). Oh, and nothing to feel sorry about!

now its starred more

@PauloCereda @TeXnician Yo! Tell me, ya chaps, is arara already Turing-complete?

@CarLaTeX perhaps, but for almost everyone, if they are not admin then that's fine but go with what the admin gives you, for people who don't chat here and so don't know about and want to try this week's latest bleeding edge package release, using overleaf is fine but use it as tl2017 (or 18 if they have upgraded now) most people shouldn't be using overleaf then hand installing packages from ctan.

@DavidCarlisle I don't have a LaTeX distribution on my work pc, if I want to use LaTeX when I'm at work I'm obliged to use Overleaf. They upgraded to 2018 now. However, I've never installed a package from CTAN, I use it only to look at the package documentation instead of typing texdoc …

@yo' it's funny, because your account name is "yo'" and you addressed them with "Yo!"

@yo' ooh a tricky question... I'd say yes. :)

@CarLaTeX well you are forgiven then for looking at ctan, hope you were not too scared by yesterdays page:-)

@PauloCereda Wow! really? You have written an interpreter that can add integers and has an if statement?

@DavidCarlisle :)

@CarLaTeX https://texdoc.net/pkg/<name> (perhaps asking @StefanKottwitz to update it to TL'19 ...)

@PauloCereda Turing completeness sounds so much more impressive.

@DavidCarlisle don't make it sound so simple, or else we can't say "of course you can do it in TeX, it is Turing complete" to impress people.

@DavidCarlisle what has the Entscheidungsproblem ever done for us

@PauloCereda it gave us streets?

@Skillmon ooh

@PauloCereda the aqueduct?

@Skillmon ooh

@PauloCereda it gave us peace!

@Skillmon ooh!

:)

@PauloCereda we had a talk from an "academic supervisor" grandson of Turing the other day.

@Skillmon That must have been a mere coincidence.

@DavidCarlisle I wasn't scared, they are a bit repetitive, the yesterday's page layout was the same as last year and the year before last year :):):)

@JosephWright I always forget about it :):):)

@CarLaTeX they are doing this as training for "how do I change the skin".

@DavidCarlisle wow, really?

@UlrikeFischer :)

@DavidCarlisle how is the celebrity distance here? does the father count as a step?

What's your favourite sans serif typeface? (except Hellvetica, of course)

@Skillmon I like Fira Sans and one from Adobe.

@PauloCereda What about Lucida sans? :)

@mickep ooh Lucida <3

@Skillmon I love PT Sans (more for display rather than longer texts) and Muli.

@DavidCarlisle ooh meeting is adjourned

@yo' could you do that again...

Hi, we still distribute passivetex on Gentoo Linux. I think about removing it. Do you think anyone does still use it? ctan.org/tex-archive/macros/xmltex/contrib/passivetex

@JonasStein I suggested removing xmltex (on which passivetex is built) once and it was scary how many professional typesetters were still using it, but I suspect xmltex users are in single figures and that passivetex users are a small fraction of that....

@JonasStein It's not built in vanilla TeX Live for me ...

@JonasStein Sebastian died and I am in denial that I wrote chunks of it, so the chance of getting any support if it goes wrong is slim

@JosephWright it is: jadetex

@DavidCarlisle That wasn't the question asked ;)

@JosephWright well jadetex is the format built on passivetex macros

@JosephWright isn't it? (it's all so long ago:-)

@JosephWright oh no jadetex is the dsssl one, oh ok (still what I said above about passivetex is still true:-)

@JosephWright But the package description on ctan.org/tex-archive/macros/xmltex/contrib/passivetex tells me "Contained in TeX Live as passivetex"

or do you mean a minimal installation of TL with "vanilla"?

@JonasStein You should probably ask on TEI list if they still recommend that.

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@JonasStein I would be very surprised if they still do, last mention I see is from Sebastian in 2010

@DavidCarlisle well, it's poorly coded and probably keeps getting broken with TL 18+, but it's not mine anymore...

@yo' was it yours before? Could you comment on:

@yo' a google search for actapoly.cls only really turned up your comment asking @PauloCereda to look at it....

@DavidCarlisle oh goodness

It's true that it gets distributed as a ZIP file...

ok thank you. I think we should drop it then.

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@DavidCarlisle I commented, though I don't think this will be a satisfactory answer to the OP :-/

@yo' thanks he replied without pinging you

@DavidCarlisle Hm. Guess why the OP is getting an undefined command error:

  % make sure these two cross-referencing commands are defined, at least to \relax
  \@ifundefined{r@FirstPage}{\relax}{\relax}

@UlrikeFischer well, this is probably a quick fix by one of the people at the publisher, which, unfortunately, does not really work :(

@yo' well it did work at some time, when \@ifundefined had the side effect to define stuff, but it doesn't now.

@UlrikeFischer ah so this is the dirty trick I used back then!

(this whole class is not something I would be super proud of...)

@UlrikeFischer thanks a lot for replying. It could really be \@ifunderfined{r@FirstPage}{\let\r@FirstPage\relax}{\relax} but it doesn't matter actually to the user. And the publisher's typesetter will have some working version...

@UlrikeFischer ah I blame you for that (can't think of anyone else to blame)

@UlrikeFischer @yo' but that will explain the windows/mac difference one will have a newer latex (I suppose I should add that to my answer)

@DavidCarlisle you are so modest ;-)

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@DavidCarlisle I see you obviously keep a database of these link, soft-of as a book of counter-spells

@UlrikeFischer Oh you have answered already

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@PauloCereda 6778

@DavidCarlisle ooh a new goal

@DavidCarlisle I think you could have cited another message which contains this link...

@Skillmon pick one chat.stackexchange.com/search?q=q%3Dooh&room=41

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@PauloCereda now you're just trying hard to push that count up, aren't you?

@Skillmon :)

Btw, I'm 100% not sure what is the best, but I wish Britain the best in the elections! @JosephWright @DavidCarlisle

ooh Umbuary

Is there a way to make l3build run LaTeX, Biber, LaTeX, LaTeX? If I add Biber to runtest_tasks and set checkruns to 3, Biber gets run three times.

@moewe for tests or for a documentation?

@UlrikeFischer Tests, please.

I think I made it work with

function runtest_tasks(name)
  if i == 1 then
    return "biber " .. name
  else
    return ""
  end
end

but testing for i does not really look like best practice to me.

@moewe something like this works too:

function runtest_tasks ( name )
 local compilation= " pdflatex " .. name .. ".lvt"
 compilation = compilation .. os_concat .. " biber  " .. name
 compilation = compilation .. os_concat .. " pdflatex " .. name .. ".lvt"
 return compilation
end

No one mentions arara... :(

@JosephWright will probably know how to avoid to have to add the lvt and if this is really the best idea.

@moewe I could extend the function here to pass a 'run number' argument, if that is helpful: you have to remember that really the idea with l3build is that it doesn't test BibTeX or Biber or whatever, so would 'expect' a pre-created bbl file

@moewe I was right, you need new features :)

@moewe, @UlrikeFischer I can set up runtest_task(name,run), then you just need local run = run or 1, etc.

@JosephWright A 'run number' would be useful, yes.

@moewe Hmm, I have a few feature requests to do: urgent or would it be OK by say Monday?

@JosephWright Monday is perfectly fine. I'm not in a hurry.

@JosephWright Thanks for looking into this.

@moewe github.com/latex3/l3build/commit/…

@moewe I just want to look at some requests for (u)pTeX: @DavidCarlisle might also have a view on them ...

@JosephWright There is a typo in the description "is is into a call to the system to run the engine". Is runtest_tasks always executed after the engine run?

@moewe Tidying up docs now

A question to all: I just answered this: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/514490/… and I have seen again this \resize macro that seems to be called automatically before savedanchors in pgfdeclareshape. I am unable to find documentation... do anybody have a link? Thanks!

ooh mr. squirrel is here

@PauloCereda Yep, hi!

@Rmano 'ello :)

@JosephWright I'll try the iftex tests with the new no etex version

@moewe can't you test for the bbl file existing?

@DavidCarlisle Oh that might work as well, but then I would have to read up how to do that.

@DavidCarlisle Give me a few minutes

@moewe more or less if filexists(whatever .. '.bbl') I guess

l3build/l3build-typesetting.lua: if fileexists(dir .. "/" .. name .. ".bcf") then

@JosephWright I just got in, not planning to do anything for a bit:-)

mornings o/

@FélixGagnon-Grenier evening

@FélixGagnon-Grenier quack (")>/

awww

@PauloCereda dinner!

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@moewe I made such a test in the bib script with and not lfs.attributes(filename..".pdf")

/quacks in despair

@DavidCarlisle Cool

@JosephWright then I hope to get back to the filename stuff after the iftex diversion.

@DavidCarlisle then I better don't tell you that there was a question involving spaces and quotes ;-)

@UlrikeFischer just saw it now

@UlrikeFischer ooh space

The last frontier

@DavidCarlisle the interesting part is that miktex actually allows to create the pdf in the (absolute) graphicspath folder (I knew that at some time, but had forgotten it again)

I miss Nicky. <3

@UlrikeFischer ?

I use pdflatex from the command line interface and have gotten to what seems to be a quite common theme for beginners: relative includes. reading tex.stackexchange.com/questions/52486 and tex.stackexchange.com/questions/25572 seems to hint at ways to make includes relative to a file, but that stil does not seem to work when I launch the pdflatex command from, for instance, a working directory that is one level higher than the target .tex file.

@DavidCarlisle Cool

Am I simply misunderstanding the answers, and it should actually allow direct cli commands to correctly import, or do I really need to change the working directory to where the .tex file is located for relative includes to work?

@FélixGagnon-Grenier Everything is relative to the root file

@FélixGagnon-Grenier the underlying tex system filepaths are always relative to the working directory, it's generally much easier to go with the flow and not try to hide that behaviour

@FélixGagnon-Grenier I personally advise to put the root .tex file in the top of your directory structure, so everything will be relative to it.

@DavidCarlisle If the eps is in C:\Users\Figures (and the document somewhere else) and you run pdflatex the pdf is placed by epstopdf in the folder too, texlive wouldn't allow this.

@UlrikeFischer ah that pdf. I thought you meant the typeset output

@UlrikeFischer ooh MiKTeX is mean

@FélixGagnon-Grenier you should always change the working dir. It will save you a lot troubles.

well, that seems to be a consensus :) thanks y'all

@DavidCarlisle That works really well. Thank you very much.

@JosephWright Four million Overleaf users rely on TL'18 texdoc ;-)

@StefanKottwitz Ah of course :)

@moewe Turned out to be a bit easier than I expected: upload on the way to CTAN now

> ! LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.

y so unintuitive

(please don't take insult from this, there is an invisible humoristic tone)

@JosephWright where is issue 107?

@UlrikeFischer github.com/latex3/l3build/pull/107

@JosephWright ah a pull, not an issue.

@UlrikeFischer PR 107 was an elaborate plot to break as many harf tests as possible.

@MarcelKrüger ;-). It will also break quite a lot tagpdf tests. But this numbers were quite useless anyway, it is a pity that the log no longer reports literals.

@UlrikeFischer Right. We could work-around that by setting .token instead of .data, but I fear that that would just lead to unnecessary catcode trouble.

travis has gone green:-)

@DavidCarlisle in unquote? And do you have tests for all the issues?