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12:00 AM
My touchpad doesn't work well with my sticky hands, so sometimes I use two hands instead of one on the touchpad to move a tab in Firefox.
I actually prefer rough plastic touchpads to smooth metallic ones because of my sweaty palms.
 
@WillHunting brrr, touchpads,,,
 
Other times, all this math sounds like math.
 
Ah, @CaptainAmerica hasn't perished yet.
 
@LeakyNun How are you doing modular forms as a second year!?
 
Nah, it's gonna take more than a little poison to end me boi.
 
12:04 AM
@Symposium there's this option called sitting in other lectures...
 
I'm still hungry anyway.
 
0
Q: Prove that $\mathscr B=\{D(z,\epsilon)\} \cup \{E((x,0),\epsilon)\}$ be basis for a topology on $A.$

Math geek Case 1 $B_1, B_2 \in \{D(z,\epsilon)\}$, case (a) $B_1 \cap B_2=\phi$ case (b)$B_1 \cap B_2\neq \phi$ $x\in B_1 \cap B_2$. Geometrically, I am able to see an element of $\{D(z,\epsilon)\}$,$B_3(say)$ such a way that $x\in B_3$ and $B_3\subset B_1 \cap B_2$. I took radius of $B_3$ as $d...

Am I done correcly?
please
verify my solution.
 
@LeakyNun You just made me so excited.
 
@CaptainAmerica16 :D
 
@LeakyNun Okay, yeah makes sense. So you won't get credit/not eligible for seminars etc? I really wanted to do some third/fourth year modules early, but read that regulations prohibited this. :\
 
12:07 AM
seminar?
 
Tutorials?
 
I think I can still go to those lectures
 
you might find yourself without a seat though...
 
sure
 
I've read in America people freely take graduate classes early. Sounds like a blast!
 
12:09 AM
depends wildly on the place
 
yeah I don't like the fact that you dont get to choose during the first two years in the UK
 
at least it isn't like HK where you need to study "compulsory modules", aka modules having no relevance to the subject
 
i think people in the US have to do that too
 
please help me. It is my humble request.
 
have to study things that arent in our concentration frequently but we often get a lot of leeway in what those things are and tbh i think that's a good thing
 
12:16 AM
atleast tell me whether my idea correct or not?did I left any case there?
 
I've studied/registered for 16 modules so far, and out of those 14 were compulsory; the other 2 were out of 4 possible choices in total - so really not much of a choice there either.
 
@Mathgeek: I don't want to read all that. Do you have a specific question to ask?
 
Case1. intersection of open discs, Is my radius correct?
then I consider 4 cases. Do I left any case?
I drew all the possible cases. Can you please go through the pictures atleast?
@TedShifrin
 
12:33 AM
mmh, after reading the first paragraph of my new aquired book, i am not so sure anymore about just anything.
 
Mission accomplished @Alucard.
@Mathgeek: You should ideally give a formula for the radius in terms of the distance of $x$ from the centers of the balls, rather than saying distance to boundary. You can be explicit. You wrote nothing in case 4. Don't you also need to say every point is in some basis element? (Obviously, that's clear, but ...)
 
okay.I will rectify those errors. Thank you very much. :)
 
You're welcome.
That's a very bizarre topology on the half-plane.
 
@Alucard That's why you shouldn't read Socrates. He corrupts the youth and causes them to doubt.
 
in the book the author makes a "false" quote, what if alot of history is just a fake, and then they come up with technologies to verify the age of a document, but to a mortal it could be as well magic.
 
12:40 AM
I take it this is not a mathematics book, @Alucard.
 
@TedShifrin more scientific/fiction
also i have to trust the translationer, that's why i better learn the original language
 
id venture to say most people have a poor grasp on history to begin with anyway so it's not really a potentiality
 
One of the reasons I learned several languages was to be able to read literature in the original.
 
definitely a worthwhile thing to do (doesn't mean in translation is always inferior tho)
 
so, @Eric, you make plans? :)
 
12:45 AM
What's the book called @Alucard? It sounds like Fukuyama's but you said it's translated, so probably not.
 
plans?
 
with Soid
oops, Sid
 
@Symposium Simulacra and Simulation
 
Never heard of it, @Alucard.
 
isnt that baudrillard
 
12:46 AM
Spread the good word of $\mathbb{P}^{n}(\mathbb{C})$ xD
 
yup
 
<---- ignoramus
 
and the first paragraph consists 80% of a bracket
 
idk much about him but think from what ive heard he's in the sphere of people i tend to like
but hell if i know
@TedShifrin we sort of just met to have a regular meeting time and talk about sheaf cohomology
we're going through ch 0 of GH
 
sounds like a plan :)_
 
12:48 AM
roughly along ur outline
 
I'll stop pestering you, now that you're settled :)
hi Nick
 
one thing is that GH is hella annoying to carry around lol
 
well, in the modern era, people aren't used to lugging around actual books
 
I carry a lot of books :( hurts the back
 
@Alucard Interesting. There's a famous novel that has a single sentence with over 3000 words xD
It's a masterpiece though.
 
12:51 AM
I barely have a neck and back now.
But I don't think I can blame it on high school or college
 
:(
tbf i guess the compactification of like all text is probably one of the biggest benefits of tech
and i should abuse that more and leave the books for home use
i just kind of hate reading screens
 
Me too .. especially for math
 
@TedShifrin Hi Ted :D
 
Hi Nick.
 
something about the physicality of the page makes the math easier to digest idk what it is
 
12:57 AM
I like being able to flip back and forth — harder to do with .pdf unless one has multiple copies.
 
:D @EricSilva which page is that, Eric? Also, what's a GH?
 
You must use much reverence when referring to GH, Nick.
 
GH is griffiths & harris book on complex alg go
i also just meant like "the page in a book" generically
 
@TedShifrin Is it a holy book?
 
I guess according to the star board it's my holy book
 
12:58 AM
To some of us, yes, @Nick. :P
Plus, my name is in the preface :P
 
so an ideal is a subring but even stronger than that
 
@TedShifrin intentionally? Well, that's pretty neat.
 
Yes, @Jacksoja. It's a "big" subring.
 
since for a subring its elements are closed under multip with elements from the set
but ideals it is closed with all elements in the Ring
 
@Eric: I'd forgotten about your admission of religion earlier.
right @Jacksoja.
 
12:59 AM
lol
 
@TedShifrin Hi Ted, what do you mean big ?
 
I mean bigger because of what you just said.
 
more elements jacksoja
 
@Jacksoja: What's a subring of $\Bbb Z$ that is not an ideal?
 
@TedShifrin none of them
all subrings of Z are ideals
hell all subgroups of Z are subrings
 
1:02 AM
Oh, right, you're right.
Let's try a better ring.
 
$\mathbb{Q}$ has an example
 
trick question !
 
No, I was being stoopid.
 
No way sir! you are the most important person here!
 
Blah.
 
1:03 AM
always helpfull and has alot of knowledge and patient with us mortals
iv seen you helping people here on a daily basis
and on behalf of all of us, i thank you ^^
 
Thanks, @Jacksoja. I'm impatient with some people.
 
ofcourse if people want you to do their homework without trying / wanting to try then you can't do much
 
@Eric: I think I can find a subring of $\Bbb Q$ that is not an ideal, since there are only two ideals :P
 
Same with $\Bbb Z[i]$.
Well, not totally same.
 
1:06 AM
you can find one in $\mathbb{Z} \oplus \mathbb{Z}$
 
Those are isomorphic :P
Well, not as rings.
 
also i think $\mathbb{Z}/3\mathbb{Z} \oplus \mathbb{Z}/3\mathbb{Z}$
uhh
yeah
ok i guess there are obviously gonna be billions of easy manufactured examples lmao
 
again drinking water
 
ring ring ring...
 
@Jacksoja You misspelled helpful.
 
1:13 AM
@Alucard as the great Will Hunting once said... it is good to stay dehydrated
 
I'm playing billiards
 
@WillHunting i misspell always , it is not a big deal, english is my 4th language
 
I've convinced someone yesterday that the last time I drunk water was 2014.
 
how?
 
I was surprised myself. They were carrying what seemed like 10 gallons jug of water. We got into this conversation about the benefits of water and I said that. They were very concerned.
 
1:16 AM
lol
 
at the airport, you are only allowed to travel with 10*100ml of fluids
so...
my solution is cucumber
 
ROFL
Cucumbers can be very good in gin martinis.
 
I say the dumbest stuff sometimes. I lied to someone else about something equally useless once and forgot about it; somehow they told other people.
 
Not smart, Symposium.
 
Do you want to be known as Dishonest Symposium?
 
1:19 AM
is there a two sided ideal of M_2 (Z) ?
 
What would Plato say?
Besides the whole ring, @Jacksoja?
 
that is a proper ideal
 
"i want my mcrip medium rare"
 
@Jacksoja {A : det(A) is even}
 
Good example, @Leaky.
 
1:20 AM
@LeakyNun thanks
 
@LeakyNun thank you
 
I tried to construct example, i keep getting either left or right but not both
 
@TedShifrin Haha, I usually truly flamboyant and incredible lies, usually I'm joking but I've a perpetual poker face so I let it take its course when I see that it wasn't received as such.
 
I have a conjecture
 
is it actually an ideal though
 
1:22 AM
No @Leaky.
 
@Jacksoja {A : every entry of A is even}
 
The thing about lying a lot is that you have to keep track of so many Bourbaki-like back-referencing.
 
You get in lots of trouble, Symposium.
 
@LeakyNun it is not closed under multiplication by elements in R
 
Are you sure, @Jacksoja?
 
1:24 AM
@TedShifrin Tell me about it. It's exhausting! xD
 
det A being even
does not work, did not try yet even entries
 
Oh, that one is ... but it's not closed under ...
 
it is not a subgroup
 
Do you know that $\det(AB) = \det A \det B$, @Jacksoja?
 
Yes
 
1:25 AM
@TedShifrin what is M(2,Z) quotient the commutator ideal?
 
So, if $\det A$ is even, then $\det(AB)=\det(BA)$ is even.
 
but if we add two matrices of even det we do not get the sum to have even det ?
 
The commutators are matrices of trace 0, Leaky.
 
@TedShifrin is the other direction easy to prove?
 
There's no formula for $\det(A+B)$, @Jacksoja.
 
1:27 AM
hey chat
 
Easy? Probably not. But possible to prove? Yeah, I think so.
 
Leaky: I think one important consequence of ZF-empty or ZFC-Empty is that intersections can never be empty (because the empty set does not exist). This will have implications in topology, for example, we can no longer have T1 spaces
 
can't access a viable source, only some .ru sites. surely enough the translated version is gettable in pdf form...
 
@Leaky: What I said is only true in characteristic zero.
 
@Secret I don't think ZF-empty means "empty set does not exist)
 
1:28 AM
yes but take the matrix whse entries on the diagonal to be 2 and 1 , and another one with 3 and 2 @TedShifrin
det of the first = 2 and the second = 6
but det of the sum is 15
 
@LeakyNun But axiom of empty set asserts the existence of empty set, so nuking that (plus suitable modification to axiom of infinity) should nuke the empty set
 
Right. I told you that didn't work.
 
okay good ^^
 
@Secret I think you need to modify the axiom schema of subsets by a lot
 
ah right, because "there is no x" is a valid sentence and thus a definable function can be written based on that
hmm...
 
1:31 AM
i'm out
 
Heya, @KarlK ... we've had another Karl here, so you've been getting pinged a lot.
 
@Jacksoja is $R=\{x^s=(1-x)^s|x\in \Bbb Q(0,1), s\in \Bbb Q$ a ring?
 
You can complain that he needs to change his name. :)
 
lol
Actually, I haven't been pinged though. :)
 
oh, I thought I had to say MikeM so that other Mikes wouldn't get pinged.
When the other Karl and I first were discussing some projective geometry stuff, I thought it might be you, but I figured out it wasn't. :) @KarlK
 
1:35 AM
Yeah, I remember cases of people with the same initial sequence getting pinged without being in chat. When I scroll up, the pings are highlighted.
@TedShifrin Ah :)
 
I don't memorize avatars the way some people do.
 
@TedShifrin You can just use autocomplete.
 
I don't often do that.
For most people, it's too much trouble, compared to fast typing.
 
@TedShifrin @KarlKronenfeld can you help me identify the ideal?
 
@TedShifrin You mentioned that Apple computers are well built which I agree. But the Apple Superdrive which is an external DVD drive is not well built! I read so many bad reviews about it, how it cannot detect discs.
 
1:39 AM
Is it closed under addition, @Ultra?
I have never had a problem, Jasper. I bought one because they no longer have CD drives built in.
I'm sure everything's built in China, so the tariffs will be immense.
 
this is a silly question but
in any ring , if we have xa=ax , and we want to show that -x also commute with a
 
@TedShifrin Oh dear. Indeed, almost every computer brand I have seen has some part of it made in China.
 
-xa = - (ax) , how to slide that minus sign further ?
what axioms to be used? i would want to write a (-x)
 
@Jacksoja: Prove that $-x = (-1)x$.
 
@TedShifrin Thanks
 
1:42 AM
Sure. I'm going to cook dinner, so bye, everyone.
 
bye ted
 
Let me eat your dinner later.
 
@TedShifrin Bye Ted
 
Yes, ted it is closed under addition
 
I actually feel hungry now. I should eat more breakfast.
 
1:44 AM
mind you, I'm fixing $s$
and $s\in \Bbb Q$
 
I'm kind of dense @Ultradark, what are the elements of the set you're describing?
 
1
Q: What are the differences between empty set, zero set and null set?

mikaWhat are the differences between empty set, zero set and null set? If i'm right empty set and null set is the same which is {} but zero set is {0} ?

the many types of zeros
 
@KarlKronenfeld $P_{x}=\{s\in\Bbb Q\mid (1-x)^s-x^s=0\}\text{ for }x\in\Bbb Q-\{0,1\}$
sorry, it should be $P_s$
because I'm fixing $s$
 
1
Q: Alternative set theories?

user76844Is there a version of set theory that allows the existence of a set that does not admit the empty set as a member? I.e., reject the axiom $A\cup \emptyset = A$

Leaky: Ok so we basically end up with unique atoms
and it is not different from ZFC
 
@Ultradark bah
 
1:50 AM
accidentally wrote it twice lol
 
To be done: Nuke all axioms of empty set and nuke atoms
 
so what is it? @Ultradark
 
and explore consequence of the resulting set theory
 
Again, I'm very dense.
 
@Ultradark how did you prove that structure is closed under addition?
 
1:55 AM
@KarlKronenfeld $\qquad P_{s}=\{x\in\Bbb Q-\{0,1\}\mid (1-x)^s-x^s=0\}\text{ for }(s)\in\Bbb Q$
 
@Ultradark What are the elements explicitly?
 
What's $\mathbb Q^2$ and how do we interpret $s$ in it?
 
wait that should be just $\Bbb Q$
 
mmh, i might go to a philosophychannel instead of hijacking this channel :)
 
@Alucard Philosophy is just the mathematics of words. xD
 
1:58 AM
ok great @Ultradark. What do you want to prove about $P_s$?
 
actually what prevents me from building my own world(view). instead of reading i should type.
 
Hi @Secret, anything weird to talk about today?
 
@KarlKronenfeld I want to prove or disprove that this structure is a ring
 
it was so easy, create folder: "my world" :D
 
@Holo Set theory.
 
2:02 AM
@Ultradark under the operations that $\mathbb Q$ is endowed with?
 
@Symposium it is always set theory. The question is, what in set theory
 
@Holo Not atm though you might interested in that dedekind infinite set it was constructed by my dream last night
 
you mean the operations addition and multiplication? @KarlKronenfeld
 
@Secret hmm, dedekind infinite? Not d-finite? Let's hear
 
@Ultradark Yes.
 
2:06 AM
@KarlKronenfeld okay yes
 
We have some set X with a minimum and is of cardinality A. It has $A$ subsets of cardinality $B<A$, each has a mimimum, and each of these subsets have $A^2$ subsets of cardinality $C<B$ and so on the construction goes
 
meh the philosophy channel is not very active :(
 
Wait, each subset has A² subsets smaller? Not B²?
Oh, I see
 
yeah. It is basically a generalisation of a binary tree except each level has $A^n$ sets
 
@Ultradark You might want to start by stepping back. Do you have opinions either way as to whether $P_s$ should be a ring for a given $s$?
 
2:09 AM
I see, I see, so C has A³ smaller subsets and so on
Now, can i assume we are not assuming choice nor its negative?
 
The reason it is dedekind infinite is because the minima in each level allows one to get a well ordered chain of subsets
so we have a countable subset in it
 
Kummer surfaces look interesting.
 
we are in a choiceless universe atm
 
Don't we need choice here? To create the chain
 
@KarlKronenfeld okay I'll try stepping back. I was thinking the intersection set taken together might be a ring
 
2:13 AM
But each level has a minima thus we can pick them uniquely?
like level 1 has one minima, level 2 has A mimima and so on?
 
Taking a level, we have unique minima, now we need to get the next level, what minima are you choosing from the second level?
 
@Ultradark And from the other side, are there any things that might stand in the way of these or their intersections being rings?
 
Also how do you choose the level?
Let's say X is a set with size A and with A subsets of size B<A and A subsets of size C<B<A. Does the next level is the level of B or C? And what if B,C are not comparable?
 
Well the way X is constructed means any subsets that are further down must be a subset of levels above, so the subsets form a total order of sorts
 
This implies choice
 
2:17 AM
@KarlKronenfeld basically it all comes down to trying to describe the solution space. Honestly I have no idea what I'm doing
 
I think
 
it's probably not a ring or anything
 
Ah. Well $s$ is a rational number. What does that mean?
 
Doesn't it linearly ordered the cardinals?
 
That is, let X be the set and Y be the disjoint union of the subsets of size A and Z be the disjoint union of subsets of size B. Then we have Z subset Y subset X
X has this tree like structure under the subset relation
 
2:20 AM
@KarlKronenfeld it means that a specific $s$ is an element of the rational field
 
As in, what is the definition of rational number?
 
so any set in the same level all have the same cardinality
 
But you again got into the problem. What if there is Y and Y' different but both fitting to be the next level?
 
a rational number is the ratio of two integers
 
Great! Is this useful, or could we have replaced $\mathbb Q$ with something else?
 
2:21 AM
could have replaced it with something else
 
Like, same cardinality means "the current level is well defined" but there is no unique "next level"
 
@Ultradark And still, you can take exponents?
 
@KarlKronenfeld yeah, but if $s$ is rational you will be taking a root. for example $1/10$ as an exponent is the same as taking the $10$th root
 
For uniqueness we need well ordering or choice to the original set X
 
but if all the sets have the same cardinality whenever they are in the same level, don't we have a unique next level?
 
2:25 AM
@Ultradark There are lots of rings where I would not know how to take powers using elements as exponents.
@Ultradark Yes, exponentiation will generally involve taking roots with rationals.
 
Also every subset has a mimimum, so will that ensure uniqueness in some way?
 
No, let me give you an example: we have N the set of natural numbers. Then Nn=all of the subsets of size n. With this I am defining level as Nn is a level and the next level is Nm for m<n. With this my next level is not unique
@Secret for this we need linear order, because it is possible that there are disjoint maximal chains
 
hmm I see
 
@KarlKronenfeld are you saying that using elements as exponents complicates things
 
2:30 AM
@Secret to be honest I'm not sure such set even consist within ZF(I mean, such set with transfinite number of levels)
@Secret this looks like a monster
 
So this guy is not dedekind infinite
 
@Ultradark Certainly. If you could just simplify those exponents, things would be a whole lot easier.
 
Assuming choice, we can choose the next level. But when choice fail we need better rule, maybe if A is a set such that all of its subsets are aleph numbers in size it will work?
No, this is not good enough, we need to somehow choose the next level after limit aleph of limit ordinal
 
ah I see, so a tree structure of minima and inclusions is not sufficient to guarantee existence of a countable subset
 
@Secret You drew two people crying inside a tent with (bullet?) holes in the head.
 
2:34 AM
@Symposium nah those are sets, and the black dot are the minimum for each of these subsets
Lol, so it turns out my dream is correct after all. It constructed a dedekind finite set
 
@Secret It is sufficient, but you need first to define the structure, rn the structure uses choice (in the "next level" part) if you successfully find a structure such that the conditions holds it is d-infinite
 
i thought my dream's assertion is wrong that the set is dedekind finite because I thought I can pick a countable subset from it
 
How should I put it...
The tree you are building is a transfinite decreasing sequence with inclusion
If you successfully build such tree we know that it either stop at finite step or at infinite step(but it has to stop by axiom of regularity)
If it stops at finite step it is d-finite otherwise it is d-infinite
 
@Symposium thinking about laws for my world for what it's worth...
free education sounds fine
 
The problem is; how can we define such tree without choice?
 
2:39 AM
@Alucard Turn it into a glorious dictatorship.
 
I guess we cannot, and X happens to look like that
 
Well, idk really, it is possible that it is consist in ZF~C that X exists but I have no idea how to prove it
 
@Symposium no, dictatorship is not necessary, but neither democracy
 
The dream said the tree is uncountable in height but it has not said anything more about what kind of uncountable cardinal it is and I disagree with the dream that it is an aleph
 
Suppose you have a finite group, and you've manually listed each pairing and assigned each one a particular value, ensuring that pairings where any two pairings where the order of one is the reverse of the other pairing have been assigned the same value. Is it still possible for that group to be non-abelian?
 
2:42 AM
Lol, if we assume that such tree exists then the hight is less or equal to the size of X
No wait, strictly less? Because the last level has less than or equal 2^|X| elements which is less than |X^X|
So hight(X)<|X|
 
Hmm...
 
@Rithaniel What is the definition of abelian group in terms of 'manual pairings'?
 
I suppose I only know it in terms of infinite sets.
 
(that is because each level is set of subsets (with a bit of change to be disjoint) of X)
 
Should I search for that definition or would you happen to have a link handy?
 
2:45 AM
@Symposium what you think of vacation being mandatory?
 
@Rithaniel How? I literally don't see how that is possible.
 
Right, makes sense, so the tree will stop much earlier than X's cardinality as we have less sets in lower levels
 
Now, I'm not sure if the hight will be aleph number, as it is possible that there exists a level with is d-finite union aleph number, and from there I have no idea how the tree will behave
 
Well, I can give a quick example: $\{I, A, A^{-1}\}$, where I define $AA^{-1}=A^{-1}A=I, AA=A^{-1}, A^{-1}A^{-1}=A, AI=IA=A, A^{-1}I=IA^{-1}=A^{-1},$ and $II=I$. This is a manual pairing group that, unless I am mistaken, is abelian. Correct me if it's non-abelian.
 
It's abelian, just not infinite-abelian.
 
2:52 AM
@KarlKronenfeld hmm does it help that each intersection point of the structure, amounts to solving a polynomial equation of the form $x^s=(1-x)^s$? That is to say, each point of the structure represents a specific algebraic object. Follow?
 
@Ultradark Polynomial equations are fantastic, generally.
 
We previously proved that d-finite disjoint union aleph is a d infinite set
 
You could also use slightly more analytic properties of the functions $\alpha\mapsto \alpha^s$.
 
Oh, wait, was your question about How could a person have manually paired every two members of the group and still have it be non-abelian?
 
Yea, but it is incomparable to greater cardinals
 
2:54 AM
@Rithaniel No, I didn't (and still don't) see how it is possible to learn a definition of abelian group only in the context of infinite groups.
 
Ah right
 
So I'm thinking we will have a decreasing sequence and in the middle it will just switch to a new sequence
 
The set of pleasant but instructive examples of infinite abelian groups is small imo.
 
Well, if there is a different definition in regards to manually paired groups, we either weren't taught it or I simply don't remember it. There is a chance that a subtle difference was glossed over by either me or the professor.
 
To be honest, your tree is as weird as iD-finite sets
You have talent to weirdness @Secret
 
2:56 AM
@Rithaniel Wait, you're differentiating between 'mutually paired group' and 'group'?
As far as I can tell, they're exactly the same.
I have never come across the former term before a few minutes ago, though, so I am certainly not an authority on this matter.
 
@Alucard I don't like it! I don't like one bit.
 
That was my original assumption. Your counterpoint implied that perhaps they were different.
 
Looks like since the exposure to politics in 2017, my dreams are able to came up more often weird things that make sense
 
Specifically, I thought "What is the definition of abelian group in terms of 'manual pairings'?" was meant to point me towards something.
Though, perhaps it was a genuine question?
 
while before that it usually came up with weird things that makes no sense
 
2:58 AM
I had hoped you would state the definition in those terms and then see that it is no different.
 
Blah, politics, what happened in 2017?
 
Well, okay
 
I'm completely disconnected from the politics world, or anything that doesn't interest me
 
@Alucard This reminds me, I was thinking of writing a novel set in a futuristic society where people lend their brains to their employer while they sleep; so work is replaced by working during sleep. This frees up time, but negatively affects isomniacs etc.
 
My bad (I read too much into stuff, sometimes)
 

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