The Bridge - 2013-06-27 (page 4 of 7)

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3:00 PM

@badp They want to the freedom for the own state to choose "no" rather than having a federal law enforce a "yes" across the board.

@badp It gets a little weird with state vs federal. Like, you can get married in state that allows it but live in one that doesn't. Now it's time to file your taxes. You can join file federally, but what about state taxes?

I mean, like boring technical details get weird.

@FAE but they were okay with a federal law saying "no" anyway.

@Sterno And it's shitty because other state-focused marriage provisions aren't enforced in the same way same-sex marriage is.

@badp People are dumb.

@FAE Unquestionably shitty.

Tax code, everything else aside, is shitty.

It's not like there's even a federal marriage database where people can even know if you're married in one state before you can get married in another for opposite-sex marriages.

Before I could move to the Netherlands, I essentially had to get a "certificate of singleness" stating that I wasn't married in the US, and it was kind of laughable.

3:03 PM

@FAE That is retarded

If the united states of Europe ever become a thing that exist, I hope we'll manage more coherency

@badp LOL

@fredley you're not invited :P

@badp Are you kidding? You European countries disagree and argue all the time.

@FAE That's what I can't get my head around. Why should there be a "yes" to be enforced? There is absolutely no reason same-sex couples shouldn't be able to marry. It shouldn't even be considered as any different than opposite sex couples. This shouldn't even be an issue!

Look at Germany and Greece.

3:05 PM

@ShotgunNinja oh, because the states always were agreeable to each other and never engaged in civil war even after the union :P

@SaintWacko But...it's wrong! It makes me uncomfortable, and that means I don't want it to be allowed anywhere near me!

Individual european countries are doomed to be irrelevant in the big picture unless they unite in some way

This is the same Europe that is taxing printers because you might infringe copyright with them

@fbueckert Exactly. I wish they would just not let heterosexuals vote on the issue. It doesn't affect us in the least

@badp Just the crappy ones (sorry Italy)

3:07 PM

@SaintWacko Yes it does! I have to look at them being all sappy! In public! That's immoral and disgusting!

Also hyperbole, in case anyone thinks I'm being serious.

Except in the knowledge that an incredibly stupid and offensively discriminatory mindset is not being pandered to

@fredley you're already basically puppets of the US anyway :P

@SaintWacko I wish they would just realize voting on it is silly because not allowing it is silly.

2

@SaintWacko Welcome to America, the land of entitlement.

@badp We can't decide whether to be US's puppet or Germany's puppet. Now we get the worst of both :(

3:08 PM

@OrigamiRobot This. So much fucking this.

Perfectly describes how I feel about it

It seems almost unreal that there's even a debate about it

People fear the unknown and that which they do not understand.

@OrigamiRobot The fact is, though, that in a democracy you can't grant people rights without voting to do so

People are fucking stupid

@murgatroid99 The rights should already be there.

@murgatroid99 What rights? What rights are there to be granted?

3:10 PM

Rather than attempting to figure out why you don't like it, they'd rather just live in their own isolated world, so they don't have to come to grips with it.

Everyone has that kneejerk reaction to something or other.

@SaintWacko Taxes, healthcare, etc.

@SaintWacko There are lots of rights that governments grant to spouses

what are you guys' opinions on same-sex couples adopting or half-getting children, btw?

There are already "rights" that allow people to get married. Why should who you're marrying make a difference?

@OrigamiRobot Lots of things should be

3:11 PM

It takes rather more courage to admit you're uncomfortable with it than just denouncing it outright.

@murgatroid99 What's your point?

@badp I was pretty much raised by my mother and grandmother. I turned out fine.

@OrigamiRobot sloths

@badp No different than opposite-sex couples adopting children

@SaintWacko His point is that there are rights to be granted.

3:11 PM

@SaintWacko What is yours? There are rights that gay couples deserve that they are not granted by their legislatures

@badp I don't see how it's different from being adopted by a heterosexual couple (which I was)

@badp The same as on different-sex or whatever-sex couples or bunches of people doing the same, basically: I wished it wasn't necessary, but it's better than the child living with just one parent or worse.

@OrigamiRobot But why does the gender of the spouse matter?

@badp No problem at all

Studies have been done on this

3:12 PM

@SaintWacko Because that's how the laws are written

@OrigamiRobot @murgatroid99 How does the gender of the spouse make any difference?

@FAE People are concerned about children not having paternal/maternal figures in their lives... although that also probably happens if one of your parents dies anyway

Basically, children are better off with two parents than one, but there's no difference between hetero/homo parents

@murgatroid99 And that's what I'm saying doesn't make any sense

@SaintWacko He's not saying it should matter, only that the transition from the current state to the correct state is by definition granting rights.

3:13 PM

@badp IMO, if you want to deny any couple/family who is willing to give a child a loving home when there are so many children aren't there who don't have one, there's something wrong.

@SaintWacko Yes, that is true. It is still the reality, though

@murgatroid99 Not entirely true, democratic votes cannot undermine the rights granted in the Constitution

Gah, this issue is the only one that really gets me going, because it's just so nonsensical

@badp Also, divorce rates being nuts.

LessPop_MoreFizz

> "Popularity of Mushroom Videogame Grows Like a Fungus in Japan"

Front page if today's WSJ

3:14 PM

Well, in theory anyway, in practice they can and do until they get put before a court that rules the law/etc was unconstitutional

@LessPop_MoreFizz cc: @GraceNote

@MartinSojka That's another thing. The "sanctity of marriage"

@MartinSojka (Even after divorce, parents get to have some time with the children anyway don't they?)

@SaintWacko Who the hell gets to decide what the sanctity of marriage even is in a secular country?

@fredley Exactly

3:15 PM

@BenBrocka True, but in this case the rights we are describing are more like additional protections granted by the government in official recognition that two people constitute a single household and other things like that

@badp Most of the time, yes. But "father/mother for a week-end" (I have both cases in the family, sadly) is not nearly the same as having multiple authority figures around who care for you and split responsibilities.

@fredley The fact that the country is secular does not mean that religion does not influence politics

@SaintWacko I live in a monarchy with the head of the state as the head of the state religion, and even we're not that nuts.

@MartinSojka I realize. I guess the law can't force them back together, though.

@fredley What country?

3:16 PM

@badp Also that concern also ties into overly traditional views of gender roles, i.e. "women will be better caregivers" and "men are better leadership rolemodels" and such.

@ShotgunNinja UK

And how can same-sex marriages break this "sanctity" when there are so many divorces and stupid marriages that have no effect on it just because they're between opposite-sex couples

@fredley There aren't that many truly secular countries around, and the US certainly isn't one of them

Wow. Paula Deen "apologizes" by saying she'll never change

7 mins ago, by SaintWacko

People are fucking stupid

3:16 PM

arghasdlnjawcieen this has my blood boiling

@MadScientist Nope. Apart from the constitution, but who even cares.

@SaintWacko IMO, we can't claim "sanctity" over something you can do in Las Vegas in 10 minutes.

@fredley You probably mean "England", unless you want your Irish subjects to murder you in your sleep. ;)

@MartinSojka Ireland is not part of the UK

@MadScientist It's supposed to be, though

@FAE Exactly!

3:17 PM

@fredley Well, ok. :D

Ireland is a part of the British Isles (but not Great Britain)

@fredley Oh right. Well you guys have your own blend of tight-lipped humor and intellectual discourse that ensures no one gets too stupid, though...

6 mins ago, by murgatroid99

@OrigamiRobot Lots of things should be

@ShotgunNinja Oh, we have stupid people

@FAE Well, it's supposed to be sacrosanct. When it comes down to it, marriage is primarily rooted in religion.

3:17 PM

@ShotgunNinja nah, the humour just bores stupid people into killing sprees :P

One of the advantages of an old-boys network basically running the country is that at least they're all well educated, for better or for worse

instead of sedating them into watching THURSDAY NIGHT FUTBOL

@fredley Not in ours. See the science committee fiascos.

(An "internet friend" of mine was almost killed by a gang of bored people; he made it out myracolously)

@fbueckert Thus my firm belief that marriage shouldn't be even part of the law codes, just family unit should be.

3:19 PM

@badp FOOTBALL PAGE THREE TITS FOOTBALL X FACTOR LOTTO FOOTBALL TELLY FOOTBALL

@SaintWacko Neither @murgatroid99 or myself are saying this issue needs to be voted on because it's validity should be questioned. He is merely saying it needs to be voted on because that's the process of things in this country.

@fredley That one part of London where the guy got beheaded by those terrorists? Or the part where people didn't understand negative numbers on lottery tickets?

@FAE Yes. Although governments and science do not mix well in any country

@fredley you think you have it bad, but you didn't get the Berlusconi treatment :P

@MartinSojka It's not a perfect system; religion had it's say as part of the law when they were originally drawn up.

3:19 PM

@badp Well done on convicting him by the way, even if he'll probably win his appeal

@OrigamiRobot I guess I'm disagreeing that there are any more rights to be granted. All rights which concern couples shouldn't change based on the gender of said couples

@ShotgunNinja Negative numbers on lottery tickets.

The system is rigged in such a way that these people can't, on the whole, spoil it for the rest of us though.

@fredley See, suddenly the British insistence on calling math "Maths" sounds rather silly.

@ShotgunNinja Math is a stupid name for Maths.

@fredley At least we know what negative numbers are.

3:21 PM

@SaintWacko How do you not understand this concept that there are state governments that are only recognizing and granting protections to couples in heterosexual marriages that they are not granting to couples in homosexual unions?

Speaking of the constitution, the part of DOMA that (explicitly!) violates the Full Faith and Credit clause is still intact, right? News articles weren't so clear on that, just the federal stuff

@ShotgunNinja You 'murican?

@fredley Yes. And pursuing a minor in Mathematics to go along with my Software Engineering degree.

@murgatroid99 That's exactly what I don't understand: Why there should be any difference.

@fredley Maths is a stupid contraction of Mathematics

3:22 PM

@FAE Nah, man, Las Vegas marriages are the most holy thing ever.

@ShotgunNinja I can't imagine why, I bally well studied the maths after a jolly well course on chemistries and physic

@SaintWacko Marriages are determined by individual states. The federal government grants some protections to married couples, but the states decide who can get married

@SaintWacko But the fact of the matter is that right now there are rights they don't have. Giving them the rights they deserve is granting them rights.

But- Gah, it's never going to make the slightest bit of sense to me. This is just pissing me off

@SaintWacko I wouldn't even say "couples". If somebody wants to make an Oneida Community 2.0, and they can keep that family unit together and share parental responsibilities, why not?

3:24 PM

@fredley he's not in prison

@badp I know

@badp He'll probably find some way of not being put in prison

@SaintWacko Take a deep breath man, we're all on the same side here.

@fredley His party's pushing now hard for a justice reform

@SaintWacko Just because there shouldn't be any differences in how the state treats someone differently doesn't mean they won't.

1

Q: Is it possible to see the end of the world in Runescape?

In Runescape there used to be an area that was just a black wall. Is it still there and if so where is it?

3:26 PM

@murgatroid99 But from Full Faith and Credit you have to respect things that are legally binding in other states (like marriage) even if you didn't marry/etc that couple in your state

This applies to everything, not just states and their treatment of same sex couples. It used to be that if you're skin wasn't white you weren't allowed to attend certain schools. Should it have been that way? no, of course not,but it was that way.

@Wipqozn And it had to be voted on to be changed.

@badp Unsurprising. He has a good record of changing legislation to avoid jail

@BenBrocka Right, right. I was just trying to say that individual states can deny rights to couples by preventing them from marrying in that state

@Wipqozn I think we have somewhat of an advantage, living in Canada; we've always been a massive cultural melting pot, and it exposes us early on to different cultures and ideals.

3:27 PM

@OrigamiRobot Exactly. It's really, really stupid that you need a vote in order to remove racism, but that's the way the US government is structured.

@Wipqozn Agreed.

@fbueckert Yeah. Canada certainly has had problems in the past with racism, but they seem to be aimed more at Native Americans.

@FAE Oh, I know. It still breaks my brain, though

@Wipqozn Discrimination was in the laws, and you always have to do something to change laws. They don't just go away once cultural progress has been made

They're not pissing me off, it's the issue in general

3:29 PM

@Wipqozn Er. Yeah, I've got somewhat of a blind spot for that.

Mostly due to the massive number of them that fit the stereotype so well.

@Wipqozn Very good way of putting it

@murgatroid99 mhm exactly.

On my way home

Zzzz

I've got some friends that are natives, but they're the exception, not the norm.

Okay, taking deep breaths

3:30 PM

@fbueckert I'm not referring to the way natives are treated today, but in the past.

@Wipqozn It's definitely not a bright spot in our history.

@fbueckert <-- Metis, technically

@TrentHawkins Really? I had no idea.

That's where all your apathy comes from!

It all makes sense now!

@murgatroid99 Yeah, they can for sure. But DOMA goes further. I don't see why that part of DOMA wasn't killed too (or was it not part of this case?)

@BenBrocka I think it might not have been relevant to the case

As I understand, the case was about someone being denied equal treatment by the federal government, so that was the part they invalidated

3:32 PM

@fbueckert You didn't know you were Metis? That's crazy (technically the arrow was pointing at your name)

@Wipqozn If I'm part Metis, I think Dad needs to have a talk with Mom.

Also, I'm stupidly proud of my little sister. She graduated from high school with an average of 90%+ in her senior year.

I see we've lost @iKlsR to OpenTTD.

@fbueckert Another lost soul.

So I just got an eBay message from the guy I bought the 3DS from, saying that he wouldn't be able to ship it until Saturday, which is bad considering that I need it before Wednesday

I was in the middle of typing up an alarmed message when I got another message saying "Oops, never mind."

@SaintWacko what happens Wednesday?

@Sconibulus I'm leaving on vacation

3:42 PM

@fbueckert The "problem" is that there is no limitation, If you have one Metis ancestor # generations back, you are Metis, there is no point at which someone ceases to be one, so long as you identify as Metis. My dad and his siblings have rejected this. So while I am technically Metis, since I do not identify as one, I am not card-carrying - and am not granted the various federal benefits of that status (not that I particularly want those benefits).

@SaintWacko Oooh, have fun

@SaintWacko Do you still need game recommendations?

12 hour car trip up to Wisconsin, then a trip around the lake to Michigan, then another 12 hour trip back home

Ooh, I should probably pick up a car charger

@TrentHawkins Ah, unlimited generational grandfathering.

@TrentHawkins but you guys have an infinity simbol as your flag! How cool is that!!

:P

3:45 PM

@fbueckert I think I got some good ones yesterday. I'm going to run out to a used games store to see how cheap I can get them :P

@SaintWacko Monster Hunter, in particular, will occupy you entirely.

@TrentHawkins aren't there different groups of Metis? How does one know which gorup they belong to?

Also, FYI, I gave you access to the MH3U chat room way back when already.

@SaintWacko Did/do you have a normal DS?

@fbueckert Even on 3DS instead of Wii U?

3:46 PM

@SaintWacko Yup.

@OrigamiRobot Yep, the Legend of Zelda DS Lite

It's the exact same game, you just can't play online.

@fbueckert Alright, I'll pick that up. I really enjoy the PSX one

@SaintWacko Jealous!

@OrigamiRobot Yeah, it's beautiful. Unfortunately I didn't get a case fast enough, and it got a little scratched :(

3:48 PM

@SaintWacko I never used a case for mine.

I hate cases for mobile/handheld devices.

@OrigamiRobot Not that kind of case. Just a storage case

Oh, I see.

A really nice, neoprene lined one

Never used one of those either even though i had one.

Too much of a bother.

user image

3:54 PM

@OrigamiRobot Why not? It helps keep those game carts together

@BenBrocka lol

@Krazer Yes... the carts... that I definitely had...

@OrigamiRobot Ahahaha

@Krazer Unsure, at least the Manitoban Metis have largely organized into a federation. Of which one of my uncles (second cousin? X times removed?) is on the board of directors.

0

Q: I can't keep Willis alive (spoiler)

I'm at the point where Willis has repaired the plane and we are fighting off the remaining attackers. I can't get past it since he gets killed in like five seconds. I don't even have time to set any mines up or place any C4 before we are overwhelmed and he charges into the open, right into enemy ...

4:07 PM

@SaintWacko Driving through Milwaukee?

Watch out for Milwaukee traffic; I'd bypass it if I were you. Today is the second day of the world's largest music festival, and you aim to drive through Wisconsin...

sigh Was trying to run python scripts without downloading and installing a full python stack

@ShotgunNinja We're actually heading to a suburb of Milwaukee, and we're not leaving until Wednesday

Tried using PythonPortable. Wow was that a huge mistake.

@SaintWacko Are you gonna check out Summerfest while you're here?

Rather than using the cmd window I launched it from, it opened its own command window.

4:09 PM

@ShotgunNinja Um... I don't know

We're going there for my cousin's wedding

and since I'm running non-interactive scripts, their windows closed immediately and I couldn't see their results.

@SaintWacko If you like music, you should check it out at least one of the days it's open.

It goes until like July 7th.

With July 1st being an off-day to clean the park.

summerfest.com

Seriously, it takes a special kind of person to launch a new terminal just so that they can display their stupid logo first.

@Powerlord What exactly is a f***hat and how does it work?

@ShotgunNinja Well, you take your hat...

4:12 PM

@ShotgunNinja You put it on your head, you grab this knife and all the screams stop.

@ShotgunNinja I have no clue what you're talking about... I clearly said ~~f***hat~~ person.

Now that I've installed the full python stack I can actually SEE the error it was tossing

Which was that MSVC's compiler isn't in the path.

always go full python

@badp never go full retard.

Now I have to locate the VC++ compiler and add it to the path so it can find it.

Wait... VC++ has a special command prompt just for that, doesn't it?

Also, @SaintWacko, if you're in town, we should hang out at the Fest.

4:16 PM

@ShotgunNinja That would be cool. I'll have to see what our plans are

clicks Visual Studio Command Prompt

It's like $10 or $15 to get in for the day, cheaper on weekdays. The band lineup is on their site.

Except now I get a different error. sigh

Because it expects mercurial to be installed. Great.

Seriously, you can't compile MetaMod: Source without Mercurial, Python, and AMBuild all being installed?

Someone remind me why I'm going through this crap just to test if the new Source SDK works with it?

Because magnets.

Oh yay, they're upgrading our time reporting system here.

I wonder if it will still look like it's a Windows 3.1 app.

4:24 PM

user image

@StrixVaria That would be a cool pokemon.

Looks Gundam-y.

0

Q: Why can't I sell my Steam Trading Cards?

I have joined the Steam Trading Card Beta group, and have gathered 3 cards from CS:GO and FTL. When I open my inventory and try to click "Sell," the option is greyed-out. It says that since I recently changed my password, I can't use the marketplace until 6/27/13. However, the current date of me...

steam steam-trading-cards

valve day switches over in half an hour, right?

@Sconibulus Yeah, I was thinking about that too

amazon.com/2K-Games-Borderlands-Bundleganza-Download/dp/…

For those of you who don't yet own Borderlands 2.

Gets you everything except the...character classes? for $22.

I'm only missing all the DLC

4:28 PM

@StrixVaria I kind of like this one better:

user image

@fbueckert Is the season pass alone anywhere on sale?

@MadScientist amazon.com/gp/feature.html/…

@Ullallulloo This one is more in line with normal Pokemon designs.

I like the ones that are drawn really menacingly, though.

I don't see the season pass itself, but the DLC is priced seperately.

4:31 PM

I'll see what happens at the Steam summer sale

@SaintWacko Hey did you ever manage to beat the Stone Soup?

Sigh

@Ullallulloo This looks epic.

user image

@kalina So how'd it go?

4:34 PM

@ChrisHateZ Yeah, I've won once

@SaintWacko Nice.

It was easy mode, though. A MiGl :P

xD

I've been having a ridiculous amount of fun with ToME

Unlocked Temporal Wardens

@fbueckert Currently unavailable? >:/

4:35 PM

Plus a lot of others

Stone Warden may be my favorite, though

@Powerlord Probably ran out of Steam keys.

Should get more in a bit, I bet.

Iv'e been playing FTL recently. Got to say it dissapointed me.

@SaintWacko I think I'll start playing ToME again. But then again Rogue Legacy will be released in 25 minutes from now.

@ChrisHateZ Wait, really?

Damn, that looked like fun

Where is it being released?

@SaintWacko Yep. Iv'e been playing demo of it today. It's hard as hell, i kept dying so damn fast.

@ChrisHateZ what don't you like about FTL?

4:38 PM

@SaintWacko It's greenlit on steam, so it will probably be released there. And i guess on their main website and maybe desura.

@ChrisHateZ I would buy it if I could figure out how to preorder...

@Sconibulus I don't like the fact that it only has 8 sectors, and that you have to rush to next sector before the fleet catches you therefore lowering the amount of exploring and fun you can have.

Meh

@ChrisHateZ that sounds pretty fair

@ChrisHateZ You don't have to rush that much, and you can slow the fleet sometimes.

4:39 PM

@ChrisHateZ I think there's a mod that disables the time restriction per sector, but that will of course screw the balance of the game

I do kind of wish each game was longer and easier though.

Written warning so i have to start turning up on time

ANYWAY, other than one (previously known) error, MetaMod: Source compiles fine against the source-sdk-2013... at least the TF2 version does.

@Ullallulloo yeah... but... you can't pudding farm

@kalina Ouch

4:40 PM

@Ullallulloo +1

@Ullallulloo You can play on easy (I actually did most of the time)

@kalina Shouldn't you be doing that anyways?

@fbueckert how often do buses break down

@iKlsR Depends on how old they are.

Maybe

4:41 PM

And when their last maintenance was.

Do you have vehicle depots to do maintenance?

@fbueckert hmm, ok, I have about 5 depots setup

I don't like waking up in the morning

@ChrisHateZ Seriously, how do I buy it?

@iKlsR You can check their reliability on their details page.

ok

4:42 PM

user image

invisiblebread.com/2013/06/in-the-wild

@SaintWacko Rogue Legacy? It should be up on steam and their webpage in 20 minutes from now.

@Ullallulloo It involves talking.

user image

@Ullallulloo That's not real life at all.

0

Q: Why can't I sell my Steam Trading Cards?

I have joined the Steam Trading Card Beta group, and have gathered 3 cards from CS:GO and FTL. When I open my inventory and try to click "Sell," the option is greyed-out. It says that since I recently changed my password, I can't use the marketplace until 6/27/13. However, the current date of me...

steam steam-trading-cards

4:44 PM

@MadScientist I never mod games, i prefer playing them the way developers intended it to be played. Only game i ever played with mods was STALKER, but that's because the game is terrible without them.

Lol steam trading cards, wut?

@ChrisHateZ Yup. They were in Beta for like a month and rolled out to all users yesterday.

@Ullallulloo pft everyone knows you have to HIT them with the pokeball to make it work

And when they say "trading cards" they're not kidding, because the only other thing to do with them is combine them into a Steam badge.

@SaintWacko If it's not up in 15 minutes, then it definitely should be up soon after that.

Bets on Steam Summer Sale starting today?

4:46 PM

@Powerlord lol

@BenBrocka I like this.

@fbueckert The Summer Sale TF2 items added yesterday say July on them.

@Ullallulloo Did they give a concrete date?

@fbueckert No. There's a chance it could start today.

Wait, I don't July anymore.

Oh, it's in the schema.

> + "name" "July 2013 Claim Check"

Curse You July!

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