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5:00 PM
In IE, it clears the focused text field.
.oO (And on TIO, it activates command mode. )
 
@Dennis Just like vim! :P
(except s/command/normal/ but meh potato tomato)
 
It's a very different command mode though.
 
@Dennis ew, IE. behavior in IE is unimportant to consider because the only purpose of IE should be to download another browser :P
 
It's hella annoying behaviour
You're just typing, hit esc on accident, and boom, gone.
 
What are you typing that you hit ESC, sitting way up in the corner by itself, on accident?
 
5:11 PM
laptop keyboard, and a ` (backtick) character
 
^
 
vim users might hit it out of habit.
 
@Dennis I actually hit jk out of habit all the time
 
Muscle memory. Like driving to work when you wanted to go elsewhere.
 
And I hit µµ€ out of habit all the time thanks to Jelly :)
 
5:14 PM
The heck? Why would you possibly want µµ?
 
But I should stop doing that, given that there are some new crazily helpful additions
 
@DJMcMayhem then insert some code between those
 
@DJMcMayhem I used to do µµ€ and then move the cursor between the two µs to fill up the helper link.
 
Oic
 
@DJMcMayhem muumuu?
 
5:15 PM
Also because typing the hooked C is annoying on a mac
 
@ThomasWard OK, that makes sense. I didn't think about that scenario.
 
there's also probably other scenarios too, but i don't know them all offhand.
 
LPT: !! in sh inserts the previous command, for example, rm somefile -> you shall not pass; sudo !! -> somefile = ded
 
what is LPT
 
L(ife|inux) Pro Tip
 
5:21 PM
o ok
 
@totallyhuman TIL
 
5:52 PM
Is there some sort of grand list of the various Catalog challenges? :P
 
0 results...
 
@totallyhuman Again, 0 results
 
5:54 PM
i thought that existed
 
That tag doesn't exist because it's a
7
A: Should there be a [catalog] tag (e.g. shortest in every language)?

Martin EnderNo there shouldn't be a tag. They aren't really different from a normal challenge, except that they focus on simple/standard programming exercises and explicitly ask for answers in non-competitive languages. That makes the tag seem very much like a rather arbitrary meta tag. I would be in favour...

 
Thanks. I saw it in the thing @DJMcMayhem linked
 
my chromebook just stopped working (screen randomly turns black, probably shut down) for the second time today...
 
that's very unusual
 
5:57 PM
uh, check battery?
 
@HyperNeutrino Didn't you install Linux on it
 
@Pavel ... no...?
it's a school chromebook so i can't do weird stuff like that to it
 
Must be thinking of someone else then
 
Still working on QUARK. Managed to golf down the truth machine even further using some of the new commands.
i′{p}&
less than half the size of the old (naive) truth machine
 
6:15 PM
Announcement: APL Cultivation in 14 mins.
 
@Adám Hype!
 
6:35 PM
-1
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

ChristopherText to Brain-Flak Your challenge is to turn input text to brain-flak code that will output the text. Tutorial taken from here with permission here Brain-Flak has two stacks, known as 'left' and 'right'. The active stack starts at left. If an empty stack is popped, it will return 0. That's it....

any feedback?
 
@Mego bah, I'm not sure about getting the prizes, I live with my parents, too young to be head of the house yet :/
 
@Dennis unless you use Jelly in google code jam I will be disappointed
 
it's not an option
 
really?
@EriktheOutgolfer write interpreter duh XD
for sure a good idea
final feedback (hopefully)?
 
@Christopher Must programs be stack clean?
 
6:49 PM
@DJMcMayhem no
Always asking hard questions
yes they must
no they don't
 
0
Q: Text to Brain-Flak

ChristopherYour challenge is to turn input text to brain-flak code that will output the text. Tutorial taken from here with permission here Brain-Flak has two stacks, known as 'left' and 'right'. The active stack starts at left. If an empty stack is popped, it will return 0. That's it. No other variables....

 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

RealUniversal Self-correcting Program The idea here is to make a program that can tolerate errors in its own code, while still functioning correctly. Since "error" is too broad, we will define it by a single bit flip. Of course, more tolerant versions, that could accept swapping any character with ...

 
7:05 PM
what
 
7:18 PM
@WheatWizard I just posted a CW glossary of brain flak terms. Feel free to edit in any terms you think would be useful
 
@DJMcMayhem I'm not really sure that is a golfing tip. :/
Perhaps it should be moved to the wiki or something.
 
hence my comment...
 
Hmmm...
 
hMMMMM.....
gahh
why are spaces only 1/2 the width of a char
:(
 
@WheatWizard I suppose you're right, but I still think it's really useful. I guess I could A) make a meta post asking if answers must be directly related to golfing, or B) Edit it into the question itself.
I like B), but it might be a pain to have that at the top if it gets long
 
7:21 PM
I'd say do neither of those, but delete the answer
 
I think I agree with Erik.
 
Yeah
Dj was wrong, remove the diamond!
</joke>
 
there's no need for a meta post, the question makes it clear that it's about tips for golfing, and editing it into the question itself is no better
 
it is though
 
i would put it in the BF wiki
 
7:23 PM
every other answer references these terms
you gotta know what the tips are talking about if you're gonna use them
 
then learn the language first
that's why the wiki is there
 
uh... you can learn the language without...
 
@Christopher Come on now
 
but the glossary can be put there
@Christopher he's still pretty new to the club :P
 
@EriktheOutgolfer oh yeah that makes sense
 
7:26 PM
@DJMcMayhem if you thought getting a blue name would set you free from me you were wrong :}
 
@DJMcMayhem questions/answers don't need to be related to golfing. There's already a meta on it somewhere.
 
@DJMcMayhem You still haven't changed TAC to CAT in you tip.
 
> what tips do you have for golfing in brain-flak?
 
I'm not saying it applies here, I'm just saying in general
 
anyway, let's move on now, it's not really that big of a deal
 
7:29 PM
aha, i finally spent the time to look at the vimtutor to find x. i've been doing li<BS> for too long...
 
I still think it would be a very useful post to have somewhere more visible than a tag wiki, but since that seems to be an unpopular opinion, I'd rather delete it now to avoid controversy and revisit it later today when I have more time
@totallyhuman There's shorter alternatives even without x. Like vd or s<esc> or dl, or even cl<esc>
 
@DJMcMayhem right but i'm no vimspert :P
 
@DJMcMayhem When I say wiki I mean the github wiki, not the tag wiki.
 
@AdmBorkBork Link? (if you can find it)
 
The first one is even a "meta"-tips question, in that it's asking about writing challenges and not about answering.
 
7:41 PM
productivity over time with use of TNB
 
@totallyhuman you found me out :P
almost 5k network rep
 
> I should never post while sleepy.
go to sleep then
 
I have posted on meta while sleepy. IIRc -22
 
@Christopher Only -17, it seems, unless you're talking about an answer. Nice question btw :)
 
7:49 PM
I don't think we need to link to the post...it's like saying "oh, you were not so bad, you were just that bad" which seems kinda rude to me
 
@Scrooble -22
 
@Christopher Ah, TRUE Meta.
 
@Scrooble my best answer on true meta offset it
 
@Christopher Times three. How much for the hat? Any cheaper if I buy a dozen?
 
8:05 PM
QUARK's parser has taken 1 of the two steps it needs to work completely. Just need to parse numbers!
[Point(28), Point(2), Block([Point(2), Point(41)]), Block([Point(3), Point(41)]), Block([Point(31)]), Point(35), Point(0)]
(To note, Point(x) is just a codepoint from the codepage)
 
CMC: implement the WROM algorithm (non-isomorphic tree counts for 'n' nodes, A000055/example code)
code-golf
 
@Pavel that would be me
 
@DJMcMayhem Doesn't this look like somebody is serial-downvoting me?
 
@Adám It Absolutely does. I'll look into it
But it will most likely be reversed be the script
 
@Adám if issues persist, flag one of these and include links to all of these, or a secret anonymous pastebin if space isn't enough
 
8:16 PM
@Adám it often takes more than 21 minutes to reverse, just fyi.
 
@Riker Thanks. First time I experience this. It's not like I'm running low on rep or anything, though…
 
one should wait for at least 24 hours before flagging
@Adám vote abuse is abuse regardless of rep
I have even complained once about upvote abuse on my posts
 
@EriktheOutgolfer Meaning someone serial-upvoted your posts?
 
@Adám well, nothing has been done about it yet, so it seems that it was just coincidental, but my flag was marked as helpful
 
Parser's done. Supports inputting numbers now too. (Numbers can be multiple characters large, so they have to be parsed beforehand)
[Point(28), Number(0), Block([Number(0), Point(41)]), Block([Number(1), Point(41)]), Block([Point(31)]), Point(35), Point(0)]
 
8:22 PM
^^ things like that are generally somebody clicking through to your profile from an answer
and just looking all yer cool stuffs
 
@Riker Yes, I've certainly done that. But I wasn't just upvoting everything he's got, rather I was genuinely amazed by that user's posts.
 
@Adám the system can't differentiate that from reckless abuse, unfortunately, so you should space your votes out
yes, sometimes there is a valid reason to upvote many posts of a specific user
 
^
see: reading calvin's questions tab
you can rightfully updoot all teh great posts, sadly if you do more than like 5-7 at a time it will be reversed
 
@Riker Will I at least be notified?
 
@Riker did you intentionally decrement 6-8
 
8:32 PM
.....no comment
@Adám yes, i'm fairly certain you'll get notified by the suspension
>_> but no not otehr than that
 
@Riker Suspension‽
 
IF the mods suspect you of sock behaviour, you could get suspended
 
well, maybe a warning if it's a first offence
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Wait, what? They'll automatically suspect I'm a sock of Erik if I upvote a lot of his posts in quick succession, and suspend me from SE?
 
@Adám voting patterns are visible, yes
 
8:36 PM
@Adám You'll get an email/private message from the mods, and if there was a low rep user upvoting a high-rep user, they'd probably suspect sock. With two high-rep users, I'd say it'd be less likely
Of course, I'm not a mod, so take this with a pinch of salt
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Yeah, if two accounts have years of activity with no noticeable interaction, and then one starts upvoting the other, I find it much more likely that one found the other's profile than that a single user had been scheming for this all along.
 
My multi-year plan of learning several languages and taking the time to golf in each of them is coming to fruition!
 
@AdmBorkBork Powershell doesn't count as several :P
 
QUARK now kinda works. It only has numbers and a print command, and is incapable of comprehending formatting (rust formatting is both a blessing and a curse), but it kinda works.
But i'm fixing the number thing before i even dare git push.
Number(BigDecimal { int_val: BigInt { sign: Plus, data: BigUint { data: [9009] } }, scale: 0 })
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing No, one for each of my socks, ya goof. :p
 
8:40 PM
@AdmBorkBork More proof that AdmBorkbork == Magic Octopus Urn :P
 
CMC: Given a strictly positive integer list, return string which is a uniformly distributed dash-separated number with segments of lengths as indicated by the given list. E.g. [3,2,4]084-37-5727
 
ngn
@Adám random?
 
@ngn Yes.
 
ngn
@Adám {1↓∊'-',⍪1↓¨⍕¨a+?a←10*⍵}
 
@ngn You can do better.
 
8:50 PM
PowerShell, 47 bytes Try it online!
 
ngn
@Adám yeah, I can
@Adám how long is your best?
 
@ngn 22
 
@ngn And as a proper function, not just replacing your with and removing the braces.
 
ngn
8:56 PM
@Adám {1↓∊⍕¨¨'-',¨?⍵⍴¨10}
 
@Downgoat @Pavel how terrible does this look
 
Hmm actually I could make that much shorter. Once I stop tweaking the charset I should make a phone keyboard so I can actually type that stuff.
 
@ngn wow, 19 bytes?
 
wait >_> Charcoal has no builtin for digits
 
@Οurous Hehe, I designed the code page of one of my WIP languages based on the characters I can type from my phone :P
 
ngn
9:00 PM
@EriktheOutgolfer yeah, if we generate the random numbers digit by digit, it's shorter
 
@ASCII-only listify?
 
@totallyhuman I meant the string 0123456789 but that's a good point too
 
is there a listify function?
 
Charcoal has no listify unless you mean Pythons which is probably too many bytes
 
@ngn that's what I was going to do, but with a less clever use of ∊
 
9:07 PM
@Adám Charcoal, 15 bytes: WN«⭆× ιI‽χ-»←
 
thats not charcoal!
nice SBCS tho
 
@moonheart08 it's charcoals verbose mode
 
..huh
no it's not?
 
9:09 PM
no it's not :P
oh
now i see. i missed the -v flag
lol
 
@moonheart08 it didn't have the -v flag is the thing :p
 
jelly, 10 8 bytes (untested) (full program): ⁵*ḶX€j”-
 
-1
Q: Create a Magic 8 Ball

DevelopingDeveloperAs a child, my friend had a magic 8 ball that we would ask questions to and see what the fate of that question was. Challenge Your challenge is to write a program(or function) that when run(or called), outputs(or returns) a random answer from the possible answers below. (Random being: impossibl...

 
unexplained downvotes are useless and annoying...
 
1
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Wheat WizardLead or Follow answer-chaining descision-problem restricted-source In this challenge you are to write a program or function, that takes a string as input and outputs one of two possible values. For an answer to be valid it must meet three additional criteria When you pass your program to its...

 
9:19 PM
also finally got everything working for grader site :D casual contest in case anyone is interested, should be pretty easy
 
Feedback? I added a winning criterion.
 
@WheatWizard Is the blurry cat in your profile pictures your cat?
 
Nope.
@HyperNeutrino I think they are useful, perhaps less useful than an explained downvote. But they serve to show what the community thinks is valuable.
 
I mean I suppose yes, but for +9/-1 it's not particularly meaningful. you have a point though, it's less useless than nothing i suppose
 
serial downvoting on new challenge
 
9:22 PM
If I took the time to explain every downvote I gave out I would have less time to downvote more things.
 
true. but usually I just say something like "your definition of ___ is unclear, please clarify" or something like that
occasionally/often I just downvote and upvote a comment if applicable
 
I always try to explain my downvotes, because it forces me to think about why I'm downvoting
 
@WheatWizard but in the end IMO it would sum up to being more helpful
 
yeah unexplained doesn't amount to anything except for a decrement
it all comes down to whether you want the poster to improve it or not
 
I don't really think anyone cares why I downvote things. Most of the time I just think that whatever I'm downvoting cannot be improved.
I don't really downvote things because I think they might need improvement. For that i'd just leave a comment.
 
9:24 PM
@EriktheOutgolfer Unless things changed in the past to years, you don't have to use a programming language at all, as long as you upload the correct output file.
 
@WheatWizard i think you are ridiculously wrong about the community
 
@Christopher I'm not sure I'll even participate.
 
people post their code for a reason
which they think is right
 
@Dennis the reality is that I've never participated in a code jam before, since I live with my parents and they'd be furious at me if I get "prizes" :P
 
What makes you think that you would get prizes if you competed
 
9:27 PM
@EriktheOutgolfer I cannot comprehend the thinking behind "my child is good at something and now I hate them"
 
TFW Python beats you by 9 bytes (using a semi-golfing language) :/
 
1
Q: Cutpoints in a maze

ngnA maze is given as a matrix of 0s (walls) and 1s (walkable space) in any convenient format. Each cell is considered connected to its 4 (or fewer) orthogonal neighbours. A connected component is a set of walkable cells all transitively connected to each other. Your task is to identify the cutpoint...

 
@Οurous more like "you told them our address and now they're spamming us and of course your prize is legally our possession and you won't get it all at once"
 
Would they really be furious if you won $15,000?
 
You have to be 18(?) to go to the finals anyway
 
9:31 PM
Yay serial downvoting on the magic 8-ball answers
 
@Dennis no, but they will be furious because I shared our address and then who knows
 
Doesn't serial downvoting have to be against a single user?
 
@H.PWiz Wtf you only get a t-shirt if you're under 18?
 
Yes, t-shirt == $15,000 if you're under 18 ಠ_ಠ
 
also I'm not legally financially capable yet, as H.PWiz said
 
9:32 PM
The finals are held live, so I guess they don't want to fly out a minor?
 
that too, flying for that is a no-no-no-no-no for us
 
@EriktheOutgolfer It's Google; they already have it. ;) But I get it, some people are more secretive then others.
 
but a flippin t-shirt?
that's kinda mean :|
 
@totallyhuman at least give them a lifetime supply of the t-shirt.
I'd dig that.
 
@Dennis no, they don't; Dyalog does, but I haven't violated their license yet :P
 
9:35 PM
Clearly you should get a lifetime supply of Google from winning the Code Jam :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing if this means that my Google is limited I'm going to be unhappy.
 
@EriktheOutgolfer Whatever information you can think of, Google probably has it.
@totallyhuman I assume there is a legal maximum value for prizes that can be won by minors.
 
@Dennis I bet Google doesn't know what YouTube video I'm watching right now :P
 
And a $15 t-shirt is nicer than a $15 check.
 
won by minors? at least here in Greece, minors don't have property
 
9:37 PM
then the law is mean :P
 
adds Greece to long list of things I fundamentally disagree with
 
well, they technically do, but, until the minor turns into a major, parents have the same rights as the property owner
@Οurous thanks
 
@Οurous Add Romania too
 
@Dennis It was a joke :P
 
@ASCII-only for (i) Print(Cast(Random(10))); is golfier. But what you really want is Print(Join(Map(InputArray(), StringMap(Times(" ", i), Cast(Random(10)))), "-"));.
 
9:38 PM
you won't believe how much propaganda is going on here
 
@Dennis what is that Laytex
@EriktheOutgolfer must be russians
 
@Christopher It's not LaTeX. Turn off your userscript.
 
@Dennis How can i live without userscripts??
 
oh i see
 
9:40 PM
@Christopher Dennis used dollar signs in his message, they are the trigger for latex.
 
@Christopher like the common folk.
 
@WheatWizard makes sense
 
it was hard, but I finally got rid of the PPCG graduation userscript (auto leaderboard was the reason)
 
@Οurous I use Brain-Flak. I am not common
 
like the common folk.
 
9:40 PM
s/Brain/Pain/ IIRC
@EriktheOutgolfer What's wrong with it?
 
@EriktheOutgolfer your point got lost in the pain
 
auto leaderboard?
well, it's kinda buggy for many language names
 
@Christopher well nobody can live without PPCG-Design. but the others aren't really needed
 
and doens't always update (caching)
 
@WheatWizard If you don’t mind me asking, what does your new profile picture represent?
 
9:42 PM
It is a cat sneezing
 
Where do you get these photos?
 
his cat obviously
 
@ASCII-only I almost never user design
and live for the other ones
 
I know he's gotten at least one from /r/surrealmemes though
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing everything :P also I would like to depend on as few userscripts as possible
 
9:42 PM
@WheatWizard dude you have the most screwed up profile pictures
 
23 mins ago, by caird coinheringaahing
@WheatWizard Is the blurry cat in your profile pictures your cat?
 
Ah I see... mk
 
I googled searched cat sneezing.
 
@EriktheOutgolfer What's so bad about the auto-leaderboard
 
it's too goddammit slow
 
9:44 PM
1
Q: What to do about down-votes without comments?

DevelopingDeveloperI posted a question that received multiple up & down votes within the first few minutes. I assume the first few down-votes were from my question not specifying what I meant by rounding. But after specifying that, my question started receiving more up-votes, followed by more down-votes. However,...

 
@cairdcoinheringaahing sarcasm :p
 
So every time you see something weird on Google, you make it your new avatar? That explains a lot. ;)
 
I think he searches for the avatar explicitly
 
@Neil Oops >_> InputArray is Input atm
 
@Dennis i think he just mashes his face into a keyboard and runs it through jelly then uses the result as a google search
 
9:46 PM
TBF, his latest picture isn't the weirdest he's had
 
@Adám Charcoal, 11 bytes‌​: ⪫EA⭆× ιI‽χ-
 
Is anyone still attempting this? I kinda want to edit in my golf.
 
yesterday, by Martin Ender
someone seems to be having fun with vote buttons...
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing No >_>
@cairdcoinheringaahing If it uses vanilla mode then <_< >_>
 
@ASCII-only No, vanilla mode is rarely golfy :P
 
9:51 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing ok good
 
anyways gtg byte!
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing I'm stupid for some reason I thought only lambdas counted towards lambda line count
@cairdcoinheringaahing also wow 0/10 that's just changing the functions to lambdas
 
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ It's a common golf
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing also exsqueeze me the results you state on TIO are inverted
 
ngn
@Adám k, 15 bytes: {"-"/,/'$x?'10}
 
9:59 PM
@ASCII-only Corrected
 

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