The Nineteenth Byte

Hey guys, sorry to interrupt. I was searching the main site to see if a specific challenge already exists but couldn't find one. Perhaps you guys have come across it. It feels so basic that I'm sure someone will have asked it already.

Say you have a wall of words (basically multi-line text). Each character in that text can be characterized by a row and column number (the line number and the distance from the leftmost character on that line). If I give the coordinates of a rectangle (say the upper-left and lower-right coordinates), extract the text contained within the rectangle.

totallyhuman

@HyperNeutrino what's this new language, brainduck

Erik the Outgolfer

1:10 PM

why censor duck?

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman you saw nothing

@EriktheOutgolfer you didn't see anything either ><

Business Cat

At least it's not Brainsh**p

Erik the Outgolfer

@HyperNeutrino no I did

chat.stackexchange.com/messages/38705419/history

HyperNeutrino

:(

Mayube

@Zaid I'm not sure if that already exists, but the correct word for that kind of "wall of words" would be a 2d array or matrix of characters

Erik the Outgolfer

1:10 PM

that is, well, unless Dennis elevens the history

Mayube

@totallyhuman your memory sucks, Braingolf 1 byte: ^

Erik the Outgolfer

alright now 11 won't work either ;)

web.archive.org/web/20170711131114/https://…

Zaid

@Mayube I'm not so concerned about what it's called at the moment. I was hoping that someone's already posted a similar challenge so that I could see some creative solutions

Destructible Lemon

@EriktheOutgolfer did you actually just archive that?

totallyhuman

@Mayube oh that's the new addition from yesterday ><

Destructible Lemon

1:12 PM

really?

Erik the Outgolfer

@DestructibleLemon yes

HyperNeutrino

BF Level 4:

a:+++++++
a[>a<-]>.-......

Erik the Outgolfer

that is anti-abuse stuff practice I guess

Mayube

@totallyhuman yes, me, you and Zachary discussed it in chat yesterday

you were there >.>

Destructible Lemon

do you follow the streisand effect like a religion?

Kritixi Lithos

1:12 PM

@HyperNeutrino noice

Mayube

@Zaid I don't think anyone has posted it yet, you could always post it yourself. I'd suggest using the sandbox first to make sure it's properly specified, cos it sounds like a pretty decent challenge IMO

Zaid

@Mayube it is a nice challenge. code-golf? Or popularity-contest? Remember that I'm interested in approach diversity

totallyhuman

× is multiplication, ^ is bitwise OR or XOR (can't remember) and * is exponentiation

Destructible Lemon

is there a challenge for converting an array of 1s and 0s into one of those unicode blockdrawing chars?

Mayube

@Zaid popularity-contest is a tricky one, because you not only need to have "Your code must do ___", but also "People should vote for the answer that is the most ___"

and no, you can't have "Creative" as that second blank, that's a highway to getting your challenge closed as being too broad

Zaid

1:19 PM

I'm open to suggestions

HyperNeutrino

popularity-contest is probably the hardest tag to use that you can use.

That is to say, that excludes code-bowling and code-trolling

totallyhuman

But if you do it right, it can go very well

Mayube

personally I'd say code-golf, the restriction of doing it in as few bytes as possible brings out some interesting creativity

totallyhuman

^

HyperNeutrino

Yes. Popcons tend to be quite popular (I wonder why) because then it's not always about making it really short but using completely outrageous and weird things (depends on the specs though).

Mayube

1:20 PM

@HyperNeutrino I thought code-bowling was allowed, I thought it was just ones like code-trolling and underhanded

HyperNeutrino

@Mayube underhanded is dead but I think code-bowling is no longer considered well enough specified.

Mayube

@HyperNeutrino if you look at the top popcons of all time, the vast majority of them are HisLocked or Closed

HyperNeutrino

yup

because underspecs

I think spec requirements have been tightened a lot over time

totallyhuman

Mm that's exactly why I want to redo the Fibonacci

But that's not happening I guess

Mayube

the main problem is filling in that second blank I posted above. The "people should vote for the answer that is the most ___"

another problem with popcons is that after a certain amount of time, it's near-impossible to win them

with many golfing challenges somebody could come along a year after the challenge was posted and find a way to do it shorter than any other answers, but with popcons that doesn't work

I think a meta post to clarify the spec requirements of code-bowling would be nice, it's a cool tag and I'd like to see more bowling challenges

(for those too lazy to check, code-bowling is the opposite of code-golf)

totallyhuman

1:27 PM

Sorry I'm still a little weirded out by the fact that I had two upvotes and a few people agreeing and then got 3 downvotes in a row

Mayube

Well, I don't think yours should've been dupehammered, but I don't think it makes a good catalog for fibonacci, given that it's not quite fibonacci. I agree with one of the meta suggestions that we should edit the original fibonacci challenge to make it a proper catalog

Oh yeah I still need to do subonacci in Braingolf

it's really awkward because I have to take into account inputs < 3

totallyhuman

@Mayube Fibtraction :P

Mayube

I prefer Subonacci, especially given how hard the post sank :D

totallyhuman

:P

Anyways the post is still open and has 25 upvotes

If I wait for a week, the close votes should expire too

Oh 26 actually

I got an upvote and a downvote

Mayube

so, did you make ,,,, @totallyhuman?

totallyhuman

1:35 PM

Yes

Mayube

oh god why, 22 bytes

Braingolf, Subonacci, 22 bytes: [vl1-?!-|l1e2|l0e1|R]v

totallyhuman

?

Oh

New Main Posts

1

Q: Find the Serialized Integer

Task Write a program that will take (as input) a positive integer. It will then count up from 0, appending each integer to a String, only continuing if the length of the String is less than the value of the input. A serialized integer is defined as the fully-formed integer with the maximum val...

-2

Q: Any web developer here? I need a website and one app

I need a dynamic website in any language. Developer/designer as soon as possible contact me

code-challenge array-manipulation natural-language internet javascript

Mayube

I'm down 115 rep today

HyperNeutrino

@Mayube wait what why

Mayube

1:47 PM

@HyperNeutrino Bounty

HyperNeutrino

ah ok

I was thinking either that or user removal

Mayube

yeah your account got deleted again and I lost all my rep, RIP

HyperNeutrino

yup rip lol

totallyhuman

So I'm not sure if Fibtraction is possible yet in ,,,

Hmm

Business Cat

I'm trying to do it in Gaia but I seem to have a bug in the interpreter

Kritixi Lithos

1:50 PM

link to Gaia?

Business Cat

Here

Don't have docs written yet though

totallyhuman

Oh I'd recommend starting docs if you're gonna have a lot of functions

It's painful going through later

Business Cat

Well I have like rough stuff for myself but it's not good for teaching people

Kritixi Lithos

"All operators do something different for each data type" hey that's what Carrot also does :D

totallyhuman

Fibtraction just became my highest scored post yay

Business Cat

1:55 PM

Oh, I think I found the bug

Kritixi Lithos

Positron looks like Python

totallyhuman

That's rude

HyperNeutrino

It was originally designed to look kind of like Python.

But I don't think the call syntax looks anything like it...

Erik the Outgolfer

@KritixiLithos or CJam

or GolfScript

or Pyth

HyperNeutrino

And also codeblocks.

I mean, Python does this:

def add(a, b):
    return a + b

Positron does this:

add = function {
    return $1 + $2
}

I'd say it looks more like Javascript in this sense.

totallyhuman

1:59 PM

JavaScript

Ninja'd

Kritixi Lithos

@HyperNeutrino does indentation matter like Python?

HyperNeutrino

@KritixiLithos nope

add=function{return$1+$2}

Kritixi Lithos

that syntax looks nice

the less pythonic, the better

Poke

yubikey is 50% off for prime day

Kritixi Lithos

also the bash-like $1 seem interesting

totallyhuman

2:00 PM

3 mins ago, by totallyhuman

That's rude

Poke

get em while they're hot

HyperNeutrino

And apparently the @ function calls look like Mathematica?

totallyhuman

Yes

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman what is

totallyhuman

Saying that the syntax looks like Python

HyperNeutrino

2:04 PM

oh ok

lol

totallyhuman

Also somebody golf this please

That's way too long

Mayube

this is a nightmare in braingolf D:

totallyhuman

Also prefix notation confuses the crap out of me

But it's pretty golfy though

Business Cat

OK, now that that bug is fixed, Subonacci in 13 bytes: :3<⟨(:(←†¤−⟩¡

It could probably be shorter =/

Mayube

hah it starts with :3

Business Cat

2:08 PM

Also it's recursive so it gets pretty slow

totallyhuman

And contains :(

Mayube

but also (:

totallyhuman

Why is so much of our code sad :(

Mayube

braingolf doesn't have faces

totallyhuman

Maybe

There's the (...) loop

Does : do nothing?

Mayube

2:09 PM

: is an else

Business Cat

Because I chose to make : be copy

Mayube

; is supress implicit output so in theory you could have ;(

Business Cat

So it appears a lot ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Mayube

you could also have ;) but it'd be very weird

totallyhuman

@Mayube oh yeah so you can have faces

1?"blah":(1+)|

Kritixi Lithos

2:10 PM

Is the word "falsey" or "falsy"?

Mayube

falsey

totallyhuman

either

Business Cat

Wait how did my language lose to machine code

totallyhuman

hah

Mayube

haaa

HyperNeutrino

2:11 PM

lol wut

Business Cat

> x86 Machine Code, 12 bytes

Kritixi Lithos

tbf machine code gets very short in some cases

Mayube

I should make a simplistic language that uses :) :( ;) :3 :D D: etc

totallyhuman

just liek

fork braingolf and prefix every command with :

Business Cat

@Mayube Most of those could plausibly appear in CJam

Well, (; or ); is more realistic

Erik the Outgolfer

2:13 PM

:3 can only appear in string, D: must not be the end of the program

totallyhuman

well i could actually implement a loop in ,,, right now that would make fibtraction possible

although now it'll be on the second page, nobody knows the lang and hence will get no upvotes

Business Cat

D: doesn't really make sense... unless you're assigning the value of D to another variable or you already made D be a list

Neither of those are typical

Erik the Outgolfer

how about stuff like :C:D?

HyperNeutrino

hm my positron solution doesn't work on TIO

Business Cat

Hm, I guess so

I may post the Fibtraction answer but I feel like I should make some docs first

Kritixi Lithos

2:17 PM

is Gaia TC?

Business Cat

Presumably

Kritixi Lithos

so it has loops

totallyhuman

Presuming makes a pres out of you and me

Business Cat

I don't have enough made to try making a BF interpreter or whatever, but it has loops, conditionals, arbitrary memory etc

totallyhuman

Oh hey that's what Trump must've done

Business Cat

2:20 PM

Currently it's just while- and until- loops

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman no it makes a pres out of you and ming

Business Cat

Who's Ming?

HyperNeutrino

No idea

totallyhuman

Poor guy

What if they don't wanna be pres

Kritixi Lithos

A search for "Ming" gives "Ming Dynasty"

Erik the Outgolfer

2:22 PM

ming dynasty existed

ming the clam also existed...rip

Mayube

isn't Ming the guy from Flash?

Kritixi Lithos

so what's a pres?

HyperNeutrino

president

?

Okx

That feeling when you golf 645529908917543095693194848473365182141641310585344
bytes off a 645529908926937253684695788965635909332404360034079 byte answer

totallyhuman

Nice

Kritixi Lithos

2:22 PM

unary?

Mayube

@Okx that's a lotta bytes to golf of a unary answer, how'd you manage that?

Okx

Lenguage

Mayube

did you find a much more efficient brainf**k answer?

Kritixi Lithos

what's the answer?

Okx

14

A: I don't even... I only odd!

Lenguage, 645529908926937253684695788965635909332404360034079 9394157991500940492270727190763049448735 bytes Formatted with commas, that's 9,394,157,991,500,940,492,270,727,190,763,049,448,735 bytes, or 9 tredecillion bytes. The file is simply 9394157991500940492270727190763049448735 ones. This...

Yeah, I found a shorter brainfuck answer

Mayube

2:23 PM

nice

totallyhuman

Wait how do you translate brainfuck to lenguage

Mayube

lenguage is just a unary representation of brainfuck

totallyhuman

Yeah but how

Okx

Replace each character according to this table: puu.sh/wH3KT/a028d5f51b.png

Then, prepend a 1.

Convert from binary to decimal, and that's the length of your answer

Mayube

> The contents can be anything the programmer wants it to be.

Okx

2:26 PM

I can't answer that challenge in Unary because you have to use zeroes, and only odd bytes are allowed

Mayube

you were pretty boring going for all 1's

Okx

well

Mayube

shoulda gone with !#')+/13579;=?ACEGIKMOQSUWY[]_acegikmoqsuwy{} repeated over and over

Kritixi Lithos

or some sort of ascii art (since you can use newlines)

Okx

oh wait

Kritixi Lithos

2:27 PM

and tabs can be used instead of spaces (since tabs > spaces)

Mayube

@KritixiLithos always use tabs to indent your unary

to be fair @Okx knocking 11 whole digits off your bytecount is pretty impressive

3

Okx

I can say it has the md5 hash of 006f87892f47ef9aa60fa5ed01a440fb and hope that there is a collision in the 45^9394157991500940492270727190763049448735 possible solutions

HyperNeutrino

positron is giving unknown errors

Mayube

you made it mate

totallyhuman

But but you're the Creator

HyperNeutrino

2:29 PM

I think the Fibtraction challenge might be impossible in Positron

totallyhuman

Doggone it ninja'd

HyperNeutrino

Actually nothing is impossible (except the halting problem maybe)

totallyhuman

@HyperNeutrino in a practical language?

HyperNeutrino

Because I can just write a Python program and Python-eval it :P

@totallyhuman yes

Erik the Outgolfer

well, if it's tc then it should be possible

Kritixi Lithos

2:29 PM

@HyperNeutrino maybe that still is possible

HyperNeutrino

bugs lol

Erik the Outgolfer

otherwise it shouldn't be considered practical...

HyperNeutrino

@EriktheOutgolfer it's a very new language lol

totallyhuman

Yeah but if you fix the bugs, it's possible :P

Kritixi Lithos

TC, halting problem, infinite cimputations, quantum computing

Mar 16 at 19:56, 1 hour 17 minutes total – 110 messages, 15 users, 1 star

Bookmarked Mar 31 at 10:42 by Kritixi Lithos

totallyhuman

2:30 PM

> cimputations

Kritixi Lithos

(sorry for the spelling errors)

aaah ninja'd

HyperNeutrino

ah ok

totallyhuman

Finally the Fibtraction challenge tied the taxicab question on answer count

V. Courtois

@Okx why does this "lenguage" exist? already read this and this too, but whyyyy

HyperNeutrino

oh right I realized that you can't return a value from a code block in older versions of positron

Okx

2:32 PM

because someone can make them so they will

totallyhuman

@HyperNeutrino wut why

HyperNeutrino

which is patched but not updated to github or tio

totallyhuman

o0

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman because it evals the blocks and then doesn't pull independent statements out of that so it doesn't return.

Mayube

braingolf is doing some weird shit

HyperNeutrino

2:33 PM

functions will eval everything and if it's a return statement then it will return it

it was an easy fix

totallyhuman

What is it today with language creators have problems with their own languages

Mayube

[0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 1, 0, 2]     - Starting state
[0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 1, 0, 2, 1]  - Push 1
[2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 1, 0, 2, 1, 1]     - Subtract last 2 elements

pls

totallyhuman

Next thing you know, I'm gonna give up trying to write conditionals in ,,,

Mayube

literally the code happening there is =1=-=

Kritixi Lithos

noice

Mayube

2:34 PM

why won't it just do what it's supposed to do!? wtf is it even doing there

HyperNeutrino

and then there's positron which thinks Fibsub(10) is 2

Hey look I made an odd/even checker

Kritixi Lithos

Carrot is very buggy, but on top of that, the website is slightly buggy and doesn't show trailing/leading whitespace correctly always

totallyhuman

@HyperNeutrino does positron not have modulo

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman it does

that's meant to be a fibtraction program

but it turns into an odd/even checker ><

Okx

I gave on on making an online interpreter because I couldn't get input and output to work asynchronously

Mayube

2:36 PM

@Okx just make an interpreter that works from a file and get Dennis to TIO it

totallyhuman

Oh lol

@Mayube problem with that

Okx

I know...

totallyhuman

having to bug him with pulls every single time

V. Courtois

@HyperNeutrino an odd/even checker stackoverflowing after 1000000 >_<

HyperNeutrino

lol

New Main Posts

2:37 PM

3

Q: Color me a Pole

Lets say your job is to paint poles, and a client asks you to paint a pole with 5 red sections and 3 yellow sections. You can do that pretty easily as follows: r y r y r y r With just yellow and red stripes. Now lets say your client asks you to paint a pole with 2 red sections, 2 yellow sect...

code-golf permutations

HyperNeutrino

@totallyhuman it's literally git pull. if it's written in a compiled langugae he has to compile it first but otherwise it's just pull

totallyhuman

But still I'd hate having to bug him

HyperNeutrino

same

totallyhuman

I wonder if there could be a way for the language creator to control that

Some sort of a console for the creator

To roll it back and etc

Mayube

I don't think dennis would want creators having that much control tbh

he's very picky about all the languages on TIO actually working

totallyhuman

2:42 PM

I'll propose the idea in the room and see his opinion on it

Business Cat

He did say something about TIO auto-pulling at some point in the (distant) future

HyperNeutrino

oh

totallyhuman

I don't like the idea of that

HyperNeutrino

I think the equal sign is taking higher precedence than the minus sign or something like that

yay

totallyhuman

Nice

Is there such a thing like aggressive parenthesizing

Mayube

2:48 PM

Lisp

totallyhuman

Lithp

Mayube

omg the entire problem was a stupid modifier issue

totallyhuman

Hehe

Erik the Outgolfer

3:04 PM

I wonder if Pietu1998 is a sock of Leaky Nun or something...

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer nah, I'd never have thought of that

totallyhuman

and the account has 13k rep

if you have a sock that has 13k rep...

Erik the Outgolfer

who says socks have low rep?

@LeakyNun hmm...you might be right on that...

caird coinheringaahing

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Use all your characters! Your task is to output the largest number possible, using all characters in your language's code page. Code Page There are two options when talking about your language's code page: A predefined code page, such as in Jelly or 05AB1E If your language doesn't have a pre...

What do you think?

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer I still have no idea how it works

Erik the Outgolfer

3:09 PM

yeah ik

HyperNeutrino

3:29 PM

is there a language called "stencil"

Business Cat

I think so

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer oh I get it now

Erik the Outgolfer

yeah it's a bit easy with docs...

HyperNeutrino

lol my email is so inactive that the most recent primary email is the one between me and the SE team getting my account stuff back lol

@BusinessCat for KC/Ascii right

Business Cat

Yeah, I don't exactly remember what it is but the name sounds familiar

Adám

3:38 PM

@HyperNeutrino ⌺?

2

HyperNeutrino

@Adám ?

oh apl?

Adám

@HyperNeutrino Some of APL's operators are so powerful that they really could be thin-cover'ed into languages of their own. Just Like I already did with two of them; QuadR and QuadS.

HyperNeutrino

oh interesting

Anonymous

Would someone like to give some feedback on this?

musicman523

3:53 PM

@Adám quietly designs APLF***

Adám

@musicman523 dfns.dyalog.com/n_bf.htm But in all seriousness, what's up with these F*** languages? Are they actually related to BF other than by name?

musicman523

@Adám Some of them are derivatives of BF, others I believe are named that way because they are as difficult/unnatural/esoteric as BF. For example JSF - you can do anything in JSF that you could in JS, but it's ridiculous to even try programming in it

Mayube

JSF is fun

said nobody ever

Anonymous

Any Turing tarpit will inevitably get compared to bf, because it is the most well-known Turing tarpit

musicman523

said no-one ever

ninja'd

Business Cat

3:58 PM

@Mayube Well JSF stands for JavaScript is Fun, right? /s

2