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6:00 PM
what happens when someone closes the sandbox?
@tuskiomi Strong words and reopen votes
these two are 1) the immediate effect 2) the aftermath effect
though 1) might not even happen, 2) is sure to happen...
I saw the one VTC, and I got curious.
And if people abuse their privileges to close the sandbox, that would be grounds for suspension imo
6:05 PM
a mod can always close and immediately reopen the sandbox to remove the offending vote and then they can't VTC again although intentional abuse of privs is an absolutely direct cause for suspension
Well sure, but how long would it take to notice?
Apr 14 at 3:53, by Dennis
@WheatWizard Or as duplicates of Things to avoid when writing challenges.
@programmer5000 "'new favourite golfing quote: 'should use' isn't in a golfer's dictionary. — Okx yesterday" that's my comment and I am the only one with the right to use it as I have copyrighted it.
@Okx no, you haven't
6:16 PM
@Okx I see no ©
@EriktheOutgolfer © well now you see one
at least not on your comment
or even a or ®
ok i will delete it and repoost it with a ©
'should use' isn't in a golfer's dictionary ©EriktheOutgolfer (credit to @Okx)
too late I copyrighted it
fixed* fail
6:18 PM
I added the link so that we don't have namechange issues or another user joining as me
@EriktheOutgolfer stackoverflow.blog/2009/06/25/attribution-required ha ha you need to credit me
Unless you want to break the law?
old, no objective winning criterion
Maybe™© I™© should™© try™© copyrighting™© everything™© I™© say™©.
@programmer5000 no.
@programmer5000 Maybe™© you should remember than everything is CC-SA no matter what you do :p
6:20 PM
I think additional licenses are allowed (©redit to ©opyright holders)
CMC: Append ™© to the end of every word.
@Riker close-voted.
@Okx new challenge idea.
@Okx there's an easy retina one in here somewhere
@Okx But if you want to post it, it is copyrighted by me, so you need permission.
@Okx closevoted as too trivial
6:22 PM
@programmer5000 you can't copyright anything though :p
Oh well, but you still need credit.
I did make the challenge myself, though.
@Riker I think ^ works but I'm not sure
\b or literal \b
6:24 PM
#"™©"«ðý - 8 bytes just answering my own challenge here don't mind me
@Riker \b is word boundry
how do you run it? in command mode?
or normal
@programmer5000 Why did you protect that popcon?
protect? o-O
prolly a misclick
6:26 PM
It hasn't had activity in 3 years. No need to protect it.
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Satan's SonFlatten the CUBE Ridiculous opening to come code-golf string Task Given a 2D representation of a cube (layout below), flatten it into a single string, based on pointers. The CUBE This is the layout of the cube filled with no-ops (,) and pointers at the corners (<>v^/). The IP begins the pro...

it isn't protected
he just undid it
check the rev history
so quick...
Q: "Hello, World!"

Martin EnderSo... uh... this is a bit embarrassing. But we don't have a plain "Hello, World!" challenge yet (despite having 35 variants tagged with hello-world, and counting). While this is not the most interesting code golf in the common languages, finding the shortest solution in certain esolangs can be a ...

6:29 PM
@Mego Oops! My bad.
> Good luck.
@NewlyFeaturedQuestions I realized this bounty is trivial, so I'll give the rep to the shortest answer not using the " operation.
@WheatWizard I can't use Klein, as it requires a module named _curses?
pip install curses?
6:39 PM
@Okx no, it's not
@WheatWizard Is Klein going to be on TIO before the end of the week?
@Okx In klein.py you can remove line 1 replace lines 72-86 with pass and delete everything past line 108 in interpreter.py. Don't use the -d flag and it will run fine
@Phoenix s/\v<.{-}>/&ab/g works
@Riley I've asked Dennis already, we'll see
@JanDvorak you can't handle the truth
@Riley that is an adorable cat
6:41 PM
OKX didn't provide the truth...
@Okx python2.7 -mpip is too ungolfy...
@Riker Thanks. That's my favorite picture of him.
what's his name?
or at the very least he didn't provide a convincing argument for his claim
@JanDvorak you can't handle the truth
6:43 PM
I can handle the truth just fine, thank you
@Riker River, but we have about 100 different things we call him.
I have even considered trying out the Ubuntu subsystem in Win10
seriously actual, truly truthful truth is seriously actual, truly truthful unhandleable factually true factual fact
@Okx You can actually leave interpreter.py alone as long as you do what I said in klein.py
tl;dr: there is no such thing as "the truth"?
6:44 PM
@WheatWizard It works, I also had to remove the curses inport in interpreter.py
Oh yeah, that too
Actually if you comment out both of the imports it should work just fine
no additional changes need to be made
Oh, and I can't figure out how to print an ASCII character
There's no chr function
nvm, it's a flag
@Riley lol, mine is the same way
depending on what she's most recently done it ranges from "stupid cat" to "little fuzzball"
@EriktheOutgolfer I thought this was going to be a truthy/falsy and actually/seriously pun
@Riker truth is never falsy
I usually call my cat FuzzButt
6:48 PM
@Okx Flags are the same as Brain-Flak if you are familiar, if not use -h to get the help menu
@EriktheOutgolfer actually, it can be
vacuous truth is still truthy right?
@Riker My girlfriend often calls him Angel muffin puff, and a jerk in the same sentence. He like to bite when he plays.
for example, "truth" is falsy in seriously
it outputs "truth" which evaluates to nothing
@Riley lol
CMC: create a language where "true" is falsy and "false" is truthy
6:53 PM
#define true false
I mean the string values, not some identifiers
#define "true" false
Can you even do that in C? (also, it fails the second requirement)
@tuskiomi error: macro names must be identifiers
@JanDvorak no
#define false "true"
6:57 PM
... no?
@Mego Sounds like a fun fizzbuzz variant
Jelly, 5 bytes: “⁸1»w
note that any substring of "false" is also truthy, is that acceptable?
fails a="false";a
6:59 PM
I... what? you get a compile error.
> This statement is false! (Don't think about it, don't think about it)
the strings must be falsy and truthy respectively, not just the literals that generate them
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Satan's SonInterpret The Interpreted Task You must write a program in Language A that will output the source code for a program in Language B which will then output the source code for a program in Language C and so on and so forth. The final program must output the x root y where x and y are the inputs e...

@DJMcMayhem that statement is false so it's true but if it's true how could it be false so...
#define false "true"
#define true "false"
7:01 PM
those are still identifiers
but you're redefining thruthy and falsy, no?
if a = b
then b = a
truthy means if(cond) should run and falsy means if(cond) shouldn't
but you can't say if(string). That's a type mismatch error.
@tuskiomi in such a language, string is neither truthy nor falsy
7:05 PM
but then booleans would have to evaluated the same as strings...
the language that you create has to be reasonably weakly typed, yes
would a regex find and replace algorithm be a possible submission then?
Your compiler may be implemented in Retina, yes.
> me when I see the msg: NO WHY
> me when I watch the gif: d'awww
The genuine thing would probably qualify as a suicide
7:11 PM
A: List of bounties with no deadline

Satan's Son7 * 50 rep for quines in my new languages I have created 8 programming languages that can all be found here and have only made one quine using these (found here). Therefore, I am offering a 50 rep bounty for a quine in each language. In order to claim this bounty, ping me in chat with a link to...

@JanDvorak Shot twice in the back of the head by cat lovers, police ruled suicide
I mean more like clawed to death by said cat
Q: Tag score not matching combined score of tag answers

MD XFI just started using PPCG and I'm off to a good start, almost 400 rep in a week. My best tag is code-golf. But while I was looking at my profile, I saw a bit of a problem. My score for code-golf is 19, but the score of a few of my code-golf answers adds up to over 19. What's going on?

@Riker I thought you would say that XD
I sent it to icy and she had basically the same reaction
7:15 PM
Question: (Should this be posted on meta?) Am I allowed to take my own specific input for a program, as long as I add that input (+1 byte due to pressing enter) to the byte count?
@JanDvorak I think the cat would be stunned long enough for the person to run away. I'm not advocating testing that though.
If someone does test that, though... toss me a link
I don't think "cat stunned" is a thing, though.
A: Loopholes that are forbidden by default

Martin EnderAdding input or rules which weren't explicitly mentioned in the challenge There was recently a case where an answerer claimed Nowhere does it say the program can't (also) ask the user what the [result] is. Adding additional input or new rules, because they haven't been explicitly forbidden...

@Okx Probabally post that in Meta.
@Mego I see, thanks.
7:40 PM
Wow, had to scroll halfway down the second page of the (sorted-by-active) Sandbox to find the challenge I posted 5 hours ago O_o
Q: Sum of first row and column, then second row and column

Stewie GriffinTake a non-empty matrix / numeric array containing positive integers as input. Return, in this order, the sums of the first row and column, then the second row and column and continue until there aren't any more rows or columns. Suppose the input is: 2 10 10 2 4 9 7 7 2 9 ...

7:56 PM
Can this be closed:
Q: How low can you go? - Signal Limbo

tuskiomiFrom the Sandbox, 6 months in the making. Sometimes we need a low voltage, sometimes we need a high voltage. Let's design a VDC power supply! The challenge is simple, with 2 lines (+5V and GND), Create a Variable DC power supply on a standard breadboard that ranges from +12V (+/-0.1) to 0V. I...

It would be nice if someone commented why they thought it was unclear
can - yes. May - maybe.
or what could be improved
How to do :s/foo/bar/g command in Vim on all lines?
7:59 PM
Does that make the fully command :s/foo/bar/g% ?
A: Largest Number Printable

tuskiomiJava. Score: 10↑↑↑2.265 / 97^3 public void g(){while(System.nanoTime()>Integer.size()) System.out.print(System.nanoTime());} While its alive, this answer will print out the current time in nanoseconds, and string them together until one day (about 584.94 years from the run date), the nano clo...

The answerer of this question has recently edited multiple answers to the same question, changing their score. I don't think the edits are correct, could someone take a look?
Please do. I don't intend to misrepresent the answers.
8:03 PM
Thanks @tuskiomi
Do you understand the double arrow thing?
Then you realize that 10↑↑3 = 10^10^10 = 10^(10 billion)
And that 10↑↑4 = 10^(10↑↑3)?
Oh wow. Big numbers.
yes. n = 10 ↑↑ log(log(n))
If the original analysis of the scores were correct, then your edits are a tad wrong...
No, n << 10↑↑log(log(n))
8:06 PM
but n = 10↑log(n)....
and n = 10↑10↑log(log(n))
= 10↑10↑10↑log(log(log(n)))
10↑↑x = 10↑10↑10↑...↑10

with x amount of 10's
:P @programmer5000
A: Largest Number Printable

Simply Beautiful ArtRuby: score is approximately (much greater than) fω²(fω²(fω²(fω²(fω²(fω²(966))))) where fα(n) is the fast growing hierarchy. def f(a,b=a,c=a,y=?!.ord)(c>y)?a.times{a+=f a,b,c-y}&&a:(b<y)?a:f(a,b-y)end;f(f(f(f(f(f ?φ.ord))))) https://repl.it/Hvr5/42 Note the unprintable character on the secon...

I recommend you read the end of my answer to get a general idea of what these arrows are sort of doing
What does ω mean?
It's a transfinite ordinal
A: How does one make a large number using computable methods?

r.e.s. What principles make the lifetime of a worm so large? It's the same principle for worms, hydras, Goodstein sequences, and even the fast growing hierarchy: a fixed "transformation rule" is being repeatedly applied to some particular kind of expression, stopping only when the expression reach...

Basically, the idea is to reduce 'infinities' down to smaller infinities until you reach finite numbers and eventually 0
8:11 PM
I see
I thought those arrows were a little flat.
Yeah. The arrows are way stronger than you think ;)
O↑o should be our new emoticon.
Or ω_ω
Weird emoticons:
@tuskiomi So 10↑↑10 is very large, and then you get things like 10↑↑↑10 = 10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10↑↑(10))))))))))
Aw pooey, end of editing that message
8:15 PM
Maybe a challenge with the highest number you can output, where your source code is an emoji?
Don't think I could manage that... at least not without learning something outside of just Ruby
@programmer5000 emojicode.org
Should've expected that
I love how the site has the same style of description as any conventional language's site, but no one in their right mind would use it practically
If @tuskiomi or @programmer5000 wish to continue this conversation, we can do so here. :-)
A: Largest Number Printable

theblitzREXX As big as you want :) Rexx effectively has no maximum length of a number. Default is 9 but you can change it easily. So: numeric digits x2d(FFFFFFF) say x2d(left(F,x2d(FFFF),F)) X2D takes a hex string and converts it to a decimal number. First lines sets the number of digits I want. It...

Should we delete this?
8:27 PM
Already hit delete vote limit already today, though.
A: Largest Number Printable

Adam Speightvb.net (69c --> ∞) Module M Sub Main() OutputEncoding=Unicode Write("∞"c) End Sub End Module

And this?
Normally we would allow time to fix it. But it was been a while and judging by the comments OP has no intention of doing so
Guess I'll VTD
@BusinessCat Yeah, I thought so as well.
8:31 PM
Ok the second one deleted for sure
Really wish the new answers could be analyzed and added to the leaderboard :(
Can't that be done via edit?
But... I feel like someone's gotta give the 'OK'. Like, I believe my code works, for example, but I'd like someone more experienced to take a lookie
The accepted answer should certainly go on the leaderboard. If I assumed all of the analysis was correct, the top three on the board would be:

1. [Peter Taylor](https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/18954/58880)
2. [r.e.s.](https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/18920/58880)
3. [Me](https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/120228/58880)

And I think the rest would stay the same.
I'd say just edit it in
Edits can be undone
8:44 PM
Oh do you not have enough rep to make edits?
I could do it for you
or I could just review it
I'm already doing it
Ok np
If I get a review out of it I'm happy
@DJMcMayhem kek
and reviewed :)
8:47 PM
@JanDvorak stunned while attached to your face
congrats on silver reviewer badge for close votes @Mego!
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

programmer5000code-challenge integer math Emoticon numbers (related) Your challenge is to output the highest number you can. You can output as a number or as a string. You must output something that matches the regex ^\d+$, as in only 0-9. Highest number wins! The Twist Your source code must be: Same fo...

9:11 PM
Alright so I ask this at least once a month but when is PPCG going to get a redesign?
in 4 to 6 weeks
Q: How many times will you have to golf a quine?

Spammy23How many times will you have to golf a quine? For this challenge, you must create a programme which takes an integer x and outputs its source x many times. Rules This is codegolf, the programme containing the least amount of bytes wins. If you submit a function, the function must take x as ...

@BaldBantha Six to eight weeks after the last person asks.
9:40 PM
any physicist here?
9:51 PM
@flawr Go bother Andras in the CHATLAB room :-P
good idea=)
Q: Words that Contain Digits

J843136028A digit word is a word where, after possibly removing some letters, you are left with one of the single digits: ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR, FIVE, SIX, SEVEN, EIGHT or NINE (not ZERO). For example, BOUNCE and ANNOUNCE are digit words, since they contain the digit one. ENCODE is not a digit word, even...

10:27 PM
@flawr :o somebody responded to a writing prompt about death playing d&d, made it into a short story
4 delete votes on a positively voted (but closed) question having 53 answers?
3 actually
but yea
I assume because it's unclear and OP has shown no effort in fixing it for 2 years now
11:01 PM
@Riker That looks like a good read.
i'm planning to publish a variant of codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/115666/… on anarchy golf with test data such that brute force is too slow. normally i would give credit or ask permission from the author to publish a variant, but in this case i don't think Mickey Jack is the real author; see codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/161398/…
it appears as though Mickey took the problem from some competition without giving credit and also submitted a user's code to that competition without giving them credit
i'd rather not engage with Mickey about this, so i'm planning just to publish it without any mention of the question on this site
feel free to let me know if you think i should do it differently, or something
@ATaco yea, the first bit is on the author's personal subreddit
check the front page of r/WP, link is there
the problem is typical enough that you would expect many people to invent it independently, and i've solved similar ones and also published one that is fairly similar
@Riker that doesn't even make sense
DnD is not a competitive game...
You can make it one.
11:12 PM
but then it would be an entirely different game, really
Separate players into two teams, give a common goal, first one to complete it wins.
DnD isn't necessarily just, Find and Kill the BBEG.
@ATaco well, if you had >2 players
Even with =2 players, an outside DM could do two teams of one.
@ATaco ... that would be 3 players
11:16 PM
Alternatively you can do Player Vs DM.
However, you need an unbaised DM, which is basically asking for a fish to walk on land.
that wouldn't work
especially when it involves life and death
IDK, Maybe GOD can DM.
I outgolfed Dennis!
@ATaco A moment of respite. A chance to steel oneself against the coming horrors.
Dennis comeback in 3... 2... 1...
11:27 PM
I'd like to see him outgolf this.
@DJMcMayhem 3/4, 1/2, 1/4 ....
@ATaco do mudskippers count?
They hop.
@ATaco why didn't you fix or delete codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/115650/2537 ? (although there are errors, the overall approach can still work)
Never got around to it, I'm a busy Taco, and Brainfuck hurts me.
I just spent an hour writing an F# class before learning you can't mix F# and C# in a project.
11:36 PM
that's not too bad
I know that more work than what I did gets thrown away every day
But it still feels bad
@Phoenix ... of course you can't
You can use an F# library in a C# project though
Time is never wasted when you live to learn
Thanks for the edit btw
11:42 PM
@JanDvorak Yes, e.g. if you spend like a day on a bug, at least you know more now, and know how to fix the bug in the future
No problem
Can I put it in it's own project and using?
@ASCII-only unless the next one is a mimic
Why isn't "Outgolf Dennis" a gold trophy?
Because SE can't be bothered to hasn't gotten around to implementing custom features for PPCG.
11:45 PM
PPOG (programming puzzles & outgolf dennis)
NVM, accidentally deleted file
@WheatWizard Btw, I have pending update on the main question that explains how the fractional ↑↑ works
although it would be easier to change the name to popularity puzzles & code governance, so that the acronym stays the same and stuff
@Phoenix yeah because they all compile to .NET DLLs anyway
Ok neat
Another time, though, I realized that what I want uses inner classes anyway.
And F# doesn't seem to support those.
11:53 PM
@DestructibleLemon it's a good story is it not
@DestructibleLemon DM != player imo
@DestructibleLemon Clearly you've never met my players...
but yea I see you mean, 3 people
er, s/G/D/
eh, GM and DM mean the same thing mostly
this was dnd in particular, so it's not like DM isn't applicable
no, i was talking about how i wrote PPOG instead of PPOD lol

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