The Nineteenth Byte

Григорий Перельман

00:01

I think I'll post my bracket problem later today, I think in around 4-5 hours

Conor O'Brien

how long has it been in there?

Riker

3 hours

@ГригорийПерельман prollly best to wait 24h at the minimum

just to set an example

Helka Homba

@Riker One novel idea to (kinda) simplify things is to have them output an image 4x the size of the original where the original is in one quadrant and R/G/B versions are in other 3 quadrants.

Like:

ORIGINALREDREDRE
ORIGINALREDREDRE
ORIGINALREDREDRE
GREENGREBLUEBLUE
GREENGREBLUEBLUE
GREENGREBLUEBLUE

Riker

hmmmm

that's an interesting though, but I think I like the plain channel better

Conor O'Brien

well, one's a transformation problem and is relatively simple; the other is a bit more in depth

Григорий Перельман

00:03

I generally only use the sandbox when I need help verifying/thinking of test cases.

Riker

@ConorO'Brien which is which

Григорий Перельман

I feel like I'm a pretty good challenge-writer.

Riker

@ГригорийПерельман it's best to use it at all times, mostly for dupe checking

@HelkaHomba I don't think it would really change the code much, except adding the image-stitching part

TacoLemon

@Riker "You may not assume the image has a particular filename" is an arbitrary restriction for this challenge.

Григорий Перельман

Most of my challenges go through the chat first, which is pretty good at dupe-checking.

Riker

00:04

@TacoLemon it's mainly because I don't think tha'ts a valid input method and wanted to say that explicitly

Conor O'Brien

@ГригорийПерельман tbh, only Helka is "good" at challenge writing

Riker

@ConorO'Brien @DJMcMayhem's pretty darn good also

@TacoLemon that's like assuming the input is stored in a variable IMO

Conor O'Brien

I don't remember which challenges he did

Григорий Перельман

I have mostly good challenges.

TacoLemon

That's like saying STDIN is a stored in a variable.

Anonymous

00:05

@TacoLemon It can be

Григорий Перельман

The only one I have with a negative score is my second one ever.

Riker

in many languages it is, such as julia

ARGV irrc

Anonymous

ARGV is CLI args

Григорий Перельман

ARGV is the commandline arguments.

TacoLemon

My point is is that the community generally accepts it being stored in a file (with a particular name), and a challenge not focused on IO shouldn't restrict it.

Helka Homba

00:05

@Riker Yeah, and that might invalidate some languages. On the other hand the stitched images are nicer to look at (imo)

Григорий Перельман

Ninja'd

Anonymous

In Pyth, STDIN is Q

Григорий Перельман

Doesn't Perl have $_ for that?

Anonymous

@TacoLemon I agree

Riker

@HelkaHomba hm, I dunno

Down Christopher

00:08

Hey i need judges for a challenge. you just have to judge how clever the solution is.

This will be later but i need some people

(Sandboxing post rn)

Григорий Перельман

Sounds like popularity-contest

Helka Homba

@ConorO'Brien :D I'm alright, mainly prolific :J

Down Christopher

@ГригорийПерельман No just bonuses for clever solutions

Actually it is a triathlon

Riker

@DownChristopher I really don't think that's a good idea

for the most part, challenges should be objective

Григорий Перельман

Everything you're saying sounds like an "Unclear what you're asking" close vote.

Down Christopher

00:10

ok

DJMcMayhem

@Riker Awww ty :3

Down Christopher

I just made it so you get one point per upvote

Riker

which is literally popcon

DJMcMayhem

I haven't written very many recently though

Riker

@DownChristopher you're writing either a popcon or codechallenge

Down Christopher

00:11

@Riker Kinda

Riker

depends on scoring, if it's pure vote-based then it's popcon otherwise codechallenge

Down Christopher

Codechallange

Riker

@DJMcMayhem :( yes this is true

Destructible Lemon

@DJMcMayhem I think I might start sandboxing the brainflak corewar combo, but I need to figure out the name

Down Christopher

But the main points are golf

Anonymous

00:12

Having judges is definitely not objective, so it would be closed as off-topic.

Helka Homba

@Riker We could theoretically have a decision-of-the-elders tag where a predetermined group of skilled users get to choose the winner. But I don't think that would ever pass meta and don't think it should.

Riker

^

DJMcMayhem

@Riker sadly, I don't have much time for SE right now, and most of it is spent on chat anyway haha

Riker

@HelkaHomba nice name if it gets made though

I don't think it should but still nice name

Helka Homba

yes :P

Down Christopher

00:13

@Mego Wait what?

Destructible Lemon

I accidentally pressed enter before I was finished but

strawpoll.me/12622631

Helka Homba

@DestructibleLemon Braincore War

Destructible Lemon

noted

Conor O'Brien

Thinking about posting this, any qualms?

Helka Homba

@ConorO'Brien Capitalize "coverage" in the title (but you probly knew that)

Riker

00:16

@HelkaHomba [decision-of-the-eldritch-horror][𝔗ℌ𝔈𝔜 ℭ𝔒𝔐𝔈𝔈𝔈𝔈𝔈𝔈𝔍𝔄𝔒𝔇𝔍𝔖€€ˆ]

Conor O'Brien

@HelkaHomba yup, careless mistake

@DestructibleLemon Braincore war as well

Down Christopher

uh oh

DJMcMayhem

I like core-flak

Down Christopher

I was having a tripple challenge idea and have a problem

I ran out of ideas

Destructible Lemon

D:

Riker

00:19

@DJMcMayhem same

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

The Coding Triathlon I have three challenges set before you and your job is to answer each of them on three different challenges (linked below) and on each part I will have a leader board that will tell the winners of the individual challenges and the overall winner. I will cover three major ite...

Helka Homba

@DJMcMayhem You me and martin should have a challenge-challenge. We each get 2 hours to write a challenge from scratch (no sandboxed ideas) and post them exactly when time's up. No edits after posting. The one that eventually gets the most upvotes (and not not closed) wins.

Григорий Перельман

@HelkaHomba Challenges have to follow a theme to make sure no one gets a head-start

Helka Homba

Maybe

This week on IronPPCG...

Григорий Перельман

And please open the competition to more people, if it happens?

Conor O'Brien

00:21

OOO CAN I BE PART OF THIS

Destructible Lemon

can we have one person as the joke because they can't compare?

Steven Hewitt

That'd be me

Destructible Lemon

no

me

I called it

Down Christopher

Actually me

Look at my challenges

Riker

@NewSandboxedPosts dupe of all three

Steven Hewitt

00:22

yeah no chris wins

Helka Homba

@ГригорийПерельман Sure. Don't see why anyone couldn't participate

Destructible Lemon

16 secs ago, by Destructible Lemon

I called it

Down Christopher

@Riker Rly

Conor O'Brien

it's funny and depressing that there are many people scrambling for last

7

Down Christopher

That sucks

Riker

00:22

yes

Steven Hewitt

I'd actually try to win... I just wouldn't

Conor O'Brien

that's less funny and more depressing >_>

DJMcMayhem

@HelkaHomba Hahahaha, that's hilarious. It's kind of a good idea, but it would be way too easy to copy an idea you've already been thinking about

Steven Hewitt

Does this look like the avatar of victory?

Григорий Перельман

I want to voice my opinion on this discussion but I don't want to be mean.

Destructible Lemon

00:23

@ГригорийПерельман just say "no offence"

DJMcMayhem

I don't know about everyone else, but generally challenges formulate in my head for a long time before posting

Conor O'Brien

@DJMcMayhem how about honor code? i.e. new idea?

Down Christopher

Or "Bless your heart "

Helka Homba

@DJMcMayhem @ГригорийПерельман is right that it should have a theme to somewhat avoid this issue.

Destructible Lemon

its the tried and true way of avoiding offence /s

DJMcMayhem

00:24

Oh yeah, a theme would do it

Григорий Перельман

Who decides the theme tho...

Down Christopher

I could

Conor O'Brien

should we mention in the posts that its part of this theme?

Down Christopher

@Riker Wait how... There are only 2 challanges

Helka Homba

Are we talking theme like "operations on lists" or like "dogs"?

Steven Hewitt

00:25

more the former, probably

Helka Homba

idk how dogs would work, just saying

Григорий Перельман

We could compile a list and determine one pseudo-randomly with a fixed seed

Steven Hewitt

It's easier to rewrite a challenge you're already thinking of to incorporate a flavor-type theme

DJMcMayhem

@HelkaHomba If your goal is to include the statistical top challengers, you'd have to make sure to also include doorknob, Joe Z, and zgarb too

Steven Hewitt

than it is to incorporate a computational theme into a challenge

Григорий Перельман

00:26

Should we make a seperate room?

Steven Hewitt

Sure

DJMcMayhem

Maybe also TimmyD and Stewie Griffin

Riker

@DownChristopher assuming you're finding a third challenge

"linked below"

Down Christopher

Hey it is in the sandbox

Also wat?

How dupe if non exist

Riker

I mean

you're making it right

when you make it it will be a dupe

Down Christopher

00:27

thats mean

Conor O'Brien

Propose a theme!

3

Down Christopher

Guys I have so much skill that challenges I have not made are dupes

Conor O'Brien

(This is just a little idea I had)

Helka Homba

@ГригорийПерельман Maybe. Or a meta post to keep things organized. I might do that but probably not today

Григорий Перельман

@ConorO'Brien Multiple submissions allowed?

Conor O'Brien

00:30

no

Григорий Перельман

> Write a mini SQL version

Who submitted that?

It seems to be a challenge, not a theme :P

Helka Homba

A simple way to gather themes is to list off existing tags like source-layout, ascii-art, strings, regex, image-processing, etc.

Григорий Перельман

I like that idea.

Another idea: gather a list of tags (excluding ones like tips, code-golf, python, etc.) and pick 2 randomly.

You have to write a challenge that fits both

Helka Homba

that sounds good

Григорий Перельман

Is there a plaintext list of tags anywhere?

Helka Homba

00:36

Note that lots of people competing in this challenge-challenge may only increase the number of bad challenges we have... :p

Riker

just helka, conor, ГригорийПерельман, and DJ please

all of them consistent produce good challenges

Григорий Перельман

Thanks!

Riker

and too many challengewriters spoil the site

Григорий Перельман

I guess I'll compile a list of tags myself

I'll try to remove duplicates and such

Downgoat

Question: is *a->b: (*a)->b or *(a->b)?

Григорий Перельман

00:38

Wut

TacoLemon

(*a)->b

AFAIK

Григорий Перельман

There should probably be more than 2 hours given, timezones and such

Riker

@Downgoat * is splat right

Григорий Перельман

There are eight pages of tags

o_0

Riker

lol

Helka Homba

00:41

@ГригорийПерельман page 1 has the most common. Perhaps enough

Григорий Перельман

But the ones further down the line have tags that are not necesarily less intresting, just harder to write challenges for.

e.g. polyglot is on the bottom of page 2

LegionMammal978

WUUUT

just got a reddit gold somehow :/

Riker

o_O

@LegionMammal978 lel nice

LegionMammal978

and 7 new comments in my inbox

not sure which one it was on

Steven Hewitt

The gilding message should have a link to your gilded comment

Григорий Перельман

00:48

We really do need a source that lists everything we've decided on for this.

Challenge-Writing Contest

@HelkaHomba @ConorO'Brien @DJMcMayhem ^

ping anyone else you think this applies to

Conor O'Brien

@AdmBorkBork

Григорий Перельман

(And @Riker please kill my earlier message containing the list of tagsdue to taking up the entire screen)

Riker

done

Григорий Перельман

thx

LegionMammal978

Found the comment

Григорий Перельман

00:53

I gtg I have homework to do

Riker

see ya!

Mendeleev

cya

Downgoat

friendly ping: @ГригорийПерельман how is app installation going :P >_<

Григорий Перельман

I don't have an iPhone anymore

I borked it

Downgoat

D:

@Riker is ipad still in hawaii

LegionMammal978

00:56

@Downgoat Will gitgoat for Android ever be a thing?

Riker

@Downgoat no it's across the room but I'm leaving in like 2 min sorry

@LegionMammal978 prolly not

Downgoat

@LegionMammal978 likely, android seems to have 10/10 quality UI APIs so probably will port but I don't even have android phone so problem

so maybe in like 8 months

@Riker ok, pls install when you return (if you lost invitation I can send you a new invite email too)

Riker

kk

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Android is FOSS and x86 compatible so you can easily VM it, the android studio includes a full fledged emulator

Downgoat

@Mendeleev do I need windows

Mendeleev

01:00

@Downgoat works on mac, actually you can even install it into e.g. virtualbox and it would still run fine

It's just a linux based OS

Downgoat

:D

Mendeleev

Please help

youtube.com/c/DmitryKudriavtsev2/live

I'm trying to make music and I can't figure out how to use this program, please listen to my attempt and help me

Григорий Перельман

The problem with Android development is that the hardware is so different. The BlackBerry Passport runs android and has square screen

@Mendeleev Aren't some ARM and not x86?

Mendeleev

@ГригорийПерельман Most are ARM, yes. The apps should work the same either way, there's versions of android for ARM, MIPS, and x86

Downgoat

@Mendeleev once you figure out how to use program please make goat remixes :D

Mendeleev

01:14

@Downgoat What are goat remixes?

Downgoat

@Mendeleev youtube.com/user/GoatStep

Mendeleev

@Downgoat lmao

please don't copyright strike me

Conor O'Brien

01:40

Alright, about to post htis:

6

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

2016 Time Capsule String: Coverage code-challenge restricted-source Consider the 74 characters from the 2016 time capsule string (note the leading space): !!!!!#$$%&())))*+...1449:=@@@AHILOQQQTTZ\\^`````````eefmpxy{||||~~~~~~~~~ Your task is to write as many programs as possible (in the sam...

TacoLemon

01:57

I'm writing a Brainfuck Interpreter in ReRegex.

Progress is good.

Mistah Figgins

> with the total length of the programs being a tie-breaker.

Does this mean that usage of more or less characters wins in a tie?

Also, is input allowed?

Conor O'Brien

greater, editted

Mistah Figgins

@ConorO'Brien What about flags?

Conor O'Brien

isn't that a default--no input for challenges without input?

@MistahFiggins I should think not, what do you think?

Mistah Figgins

I agree, just wanted to make sure it was specified

or you can have the input also count towards the characters

Conor O'Brien

02:08

hm, no

Steven Hewitt

So I'm running into integer overflow with normal Python integers

I don't understand how, but eval(str(depth)+"*2") is giving a reasonable result, whereas depth*2 is overflowing for no reason whatsoever

Григорий Перельман

@StevenHewitt integers don't overflow, but floats do. What type is depth?

Steven Hewitt

Definitely an integer

def predict_one_intermediate(tree, datum, label, depth=1): ... return predict_one_intermediate(tree[0][tree[1](datum)], datum, label, depth*2+tree[1](datum))

Wrapping it in eval seems to work though so I guess I'm fine

New Main Posts

02:33

1

Q: Find the permutation before

Specifications Your program must take in an integer n, then take in n more strings (containing only alphanumeric characters) in your preferred method (seperated by whitespace, file input, hash table etc.). You must then find the permutation before the inputted strings when sorted in lexicographi...

code-golf

New Main Posts

02:46

0

Q: 2016 Time Capsule String: Coverage

Consider the 74 characters from the 2016 time capsule string (note the leading space): !!!!!#$$%&())))*+...1449:=@@@AHILOQQQTTZ\\^`````````eefmpxy{||||~~~~~~~~~ Your task is to write as many programs as possible (in the same language) using these characters. The output of each program must be...

code-challenge restricted-source

2

TacoLemon

I have now written Brainfuck in ReRegex.

Riker

why

TacoLemon

I don't understand the question.

Григорий Перельман

@TacoLemon Wut

How

TacoLemon

Just wait, fixing it up a bit.

Григорий Перельман

02:48

Send teh codez

O ok

Mistah Figgins

So its turing complete? or did we know that?

Григорий Перельман

It's almost retina, so I think we knew that.

Conor O'Brien

what is reregex

can it answer the @NewMainPosts question?

TacoLemon

#import math
#import cond

#Setup initial conditions
M\{([\[\]+\-.r<>]+)(!(.*?))?\}/\n\n\n\n$1\n$3\n/

#If the current memory is blank, unblank it.
^([\d ]*)\n([\d ]*)\n\n/$1\n$2\n127\n/

#If the program's terminated, dump it to output.
^[\d ]*\n[\d ]*\n\d*\n[\[\]+\-.r<>]*\n\n.*\n([\d ]*)$/$1/

#LOOPING STUFF
MATCH_LEFT\{([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{(\])([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{\}/$1$2\n$3/
MATCH_LEFT\{([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{(\[)([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{(_*)\}/MATCH_LEFT{$1$2}{$3}{$4_}/
MATCH_LEFT\{([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{(\])([\[\]+\-.r<>]*)\}\{(_*)_\}/MATCH_LEFT{$1$2}{$3}{$4}/

EZPZ, requires the latest version of ReRegex.

Mistah Figgins

Pfffft your avatar @TacoLemon. Nice Photoshop(/MSPaint) job

TacoLemon

02:55

Also, io is decimal bytes separated by spaces, because converting decimal to ascii would double the progrsm

Helka Homba

Opinions on the PPCG Challenge Writing Contest? Idea. @MartinEnder @ConorO'Brien @Doorknob @AdmBorkBork @DJMcMayhem

Conor O'Brien

@HelkaHomba I'm in the room lol but thanks for the ping

TacoLemon

@ConorO'Brien without a /, all it can really do is output plaintext

Conor O'Brien

@TacoLemon it's still possible, I think

just not very interesting

Helka Homba

@ConorO'Brien Sorry. Thought I saw you in list of users to invite

Doorknob

02:58

@HelkaHomba Sounds neato, but if it's any time soon I'm super busy and probably won't be able to participate.

Григорий Перельман

@Doorknob Might as well sign up, so when we do start, we know to ping you.

We can put you later in the order, if you want.

Mistah Figgins

@HelkaHomba ^^^

Conor O'Brien

@Doorknob good luck with whatever you're doing!

TacoLemon

03:12

Well, it's good to know ReRegex is TC.

Григорий Перельман

@TacoLemon feature-request: -f flag to take input from a file.

TacoLemon

Java -jar ReRegex.jar code.rr < file.txt

Just pipe to STDIN

Григорий Перельман

Dur

TacoLemon

this is a more up to date version of the BrainFuck script.

2

Mendeleev

03:58

@ГригорийПерельман Check this out u.dk0.us/Attempt1.mp3

Updated version of my earlier "composition"

Григорий Перельман

Cool.

That's awesome

Challenge-Writing Contest

Transcript for