The Nineteenth Byte

Is it fine to make a programming language based off another language that just replaces all the functions/keywords of the original language with abbreviations (and then use that to code golf)

quartata

Can't do that in tabs without an IDE that just lines it up for you anyways

MendeleevLemon

@GenericDisplayName Yes. See: RubyGolf

Geobits

@GenericDisplayName Not illegal, but meh

TacoLemon

@GenericDisplayName Yeah.

quartata

12:19 AM

or using a bunch of tabs

TacoLemon

See: Pyth

Generic Display Name

all right

MendeleevLemon

1 min ago, by MendeleevLemon

Tabs aren't just x spaces. They line up to set tabstops.

Григорий Перельман

@quartata So, every text editor ever other than MS Notepad?

TacoLemon

I only ever use 4 tabs or 1 space.

Helka Homba

12:20 AM

@GenericDisplayName Yes, but it must exist before any challenges it answers (or else be noncompetitive)

quartata

@ГригорийПерельман ???

Not every language needs an IDE :P

Григорий Перельман

What doesn't line up the tabs for you?

quartata

vim suits me just fine

@ГригорийПерельман I don't know of any that does, actually.

If it is it's something like Visual Studio or Eclipse.

Geobits

Oh yeah, well anyone who likes vim is clearly not allowed in the spaces vs tabs argument ;)

Helka Homba

Someone should invent "stabs" to end this debate

2

MendeleevLemon

12:21 AM

@quartata Literally everything lines up tabs.

Tabs were invented to be lined up to a certain tabstop.

@Geobits I like vim, and it also lines up tabs.

TacoLemon

Also, I first did the write up for this challenge on the 12/12/16, but never got around to posting it.

Geobits

@MendeleevLemon Oh I didn't mean that it wouldn't. Just that vim users have no credibility

2

MendeleevLemon

That was made using 1 tab between numbers and t's

@Geobits huh what?

:(

Destructible Lemon

@TacoLemon you monster

Geobits

@MendeleevLemon Sorry, it's a reflex. No insult intended.

quartata

12:23 AM

OK, do Linux virtual consoles do that?

Generic Display Name

the best answer is 1 tab = 8 spaces ;)

Helka Homba

>.>

quartata

Not looking forward to catting a file and having every indent be 8 spaces and things not line up

Helka Homba

you'll wear out your spacebar

Riker

Geobits

12:24 AM

Just set tabs to one space and make everyone happy

@quartata AFAIK yes

Good night

That's a terminal emulator

At least it looks like one

Mistah Figgins

@Riker well that escalated quickly

quartata

12:26 AM

@Geobits That would work.

Riker

@MistahFiggins and the fire + explosion

Mistah Figgins

indeed

Geobits

@MistahFiggins It would escalate quicker if we would just use vertical tabs instead

Generic Display Name

would tab = line break satisfy everyone

Geobits

Generic Display Name? Crap, now I can't use Generic Holiday Name during the winter time.

Григорий Перельман

12:28 AM

quartata

@ГригорийПерельман I don't use Atom so I didn't know that.

Geobits

I like how x is fine, but xy is misspelled

Mistah Figgins

@HelkaHomba sounds painful

quartata

Yeah, doesn't exactly instill faith into its status as an editor for me...

Григорий Перельман

Geobits

12:30 AM

@quartata As far as bigger IDEs go, I know both IntelliJ and Eclipse will. But that's probably expected.

quartata

I don't use Notepad++ so I didn't know that

@Geobits I'd just rather use spaces and have it work in any editor.

Григорий Перельман

What do you use?

quartata

vim. And occasionally NetBeans.

Mistah Figgins

I just use normal notepad

Geobits

I use tabs and they work in any editor I'd choose to use ;)

quartata

12:30 AM

Github doesn't like tabs either

Mistah Figgins

tabs for me

quartata

Well they show up as eight spaces and you can't change the tabstop...

Григорий Перельман

Even normal notepad does it

quartata

And I'd also like to point out that this has nothing to do with the tab key. Just whether you expand your tabs into spaces

Mistah Figgins

the only way I will ever use spaces is if I copy the 4 (or 8) spaces onto my clipboard so I can ctrl-v instead of tab

quartata

12:31 AM

..??

Now it's my turn to ask what editor you're using that can't expand tabs

Mistah Figgins

I've only ever had to do that when writing quick explanations of the PPCG answer box

ASCII-only

@quartata Well you can change the tabstop in the GitHub editor :P

quartata

@ASCII-only That's true, but not when viewing it.

Григорий Перельман

I'd test Emacs, but it doesn't seem to support the tab key at all.

TacoLemon

Sublime Text defaults as 4

Python thinks a Tab is 8.

ASCII-only

12:36 AM

No, Sublime defaults as autodetected

New Main Posts

0

Q: How to respond to "thank you" and "sorry"?

I am a foreigner and I am wondering how to respond "thank you" and "sorry". I think I could respond to "thank you" like this: You’re welcome. Don’t mention it. Not at all. (It’s ) my pleasure. That’s all right./That ok. No problem. I think I could respond to "sorry" like this: It doesn’t m...

natural-language

TacoLemon

For Plain Text, the default is 4.

Destructible Lemon

> I think I have pretty much the best code you can get [...]

same post

ASCII-only

@NewMainPosts Wat

Destructible Lemon

while 2>1:

ASCII-only

12:38 AM

@DestructibleLemon D:

Link?

Destructible Lemon

5

Q: Decide whether a triangle is isosceles or not

I think I have pretty much the best code you can get when it comes to this particular task but I'm always open to improvements. This code does all necessary checks to the best of my ability to find out if the user input lengths are possible to construct a triangle and if these values are valid...

python python-3.x mathematics

TacoLemon

while 1==1:

Destructible Lemon

It also has empty else blocks

Mistah Figgins

@ASCII-only this?

Destructible Lemon

Dunning–Kruger effect

The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which low-ability individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly assessing their ability as much higher than it really is. Psychologists David Dunning and Justin Kruger attributed this bias to a metacognitive incapacity, on the part of those with low ability, to recognize their ineptitude and evaluate their competence accurately. Their research also suggests corollaries: high-ability individuals may underestimate their relative competence and may erroneously assume that tasks which are easy for them are also easy for others. Dunning and...

Григорий Перельман

12:39 AM

@quartata you picked the only two text editors on the planet that don't dynamically size tabs.

ASCII-only

@DestructibleLemon Yes this

Destructible Lemon

> [...] best code you can get [...]

else: 0

ASCII-only

The formatting is hurting my eyes, and the severe lack of DRY is hurting my brain

Григорий Перельман

Wait no, even Vim spaces tabs

Destructible Lemon

its more wet than the ocean

also it kind of annoys me that it says 0 length sides on a triangle are impossible

MendeleevLemon

12:41 AM

@quartata Installing Lubuntu in a VM

Mistah Figgins

@DestructibleLemon I thought this might be an interesting challenge, and then saw it was code review

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon For what purpose?

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман My vconsoles don't work, I want to test the tabs.

Also you can't take screenshots of vconsoles

Destructible Lemon

> [...] best code you can get [...]

Григорий Перельман

I can test everything but sublime

Destructible Lemon

12:42 AM

if (float(side1)+float(side3))<(float(side2)-0.000001)

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман why

Григорий Перельман

I have like all the other editors installed

MendeleevLemon

sublime has a free demo

@ГригорийПерельман Do you have SAM installed?

Nedit?

Parallax Propeller IDE?

Григорий Перельман

SAM, but not Nedit

ASCII-only

Emacs? :P (also what about nano)

Григорий Перельман

12:43 AM

Sure

Nano comes with Ubuntu

Destructible Lemon

oh god this is something I expect to see on the dailywtf

ASCII-only

I'm assuming nodepad/n++ work in wine

@DestructibleLemon what is

Григорий Перельман

@ASCII-only Other way around, Windows with WSL

Destructible Lemon

the codereview post I posted earlier

Григорий Перельман

@ASCII-only For Emacs, scrolled up

ASCII-only

12:44 AM

@DestructibleLemon Look at all the time.sleep(2.5)

Destructible Lemon

> [...] best code you can get [...]

    if side1 == side2:
        print("This is an isosceles triangle!")
    elif side1 == side3:
        print("This is an isosceles triangle!")
    elif side2 == side3:
        print("This is an isosceles triangle!")
    elif side1 != side2 and side1 != side3:
        print("This is not an isosceles triangle!")
    elif side2 != side1 and side2 != side3:
        print("This is not an isosceles triangle!")
    elif side3 != side1 and side3 != side2:
        print("This is not an isosceles triangle!")

ASCII-only

@ГригорийПерельман ^Q + Tab (ctrl-q + tab)

Destructible Lemon

wtf is the point of that elif chain though

Григорий Перельман

@ASCII-only Don't know what that does, I don't use these editors

ASCII-only

Why are the last three even needed

@ГригорийПерельман ... it inserts a tab

Destructible Lemon

12:46 AM

The worst part is that this is from a guy who knows that else exists

he just uses it to evaluate zeros wtf

Григорий Перельман

I, I just pasted in tab literals.

Destructible Lemon

    else:
        0

that appears more than once in source

why can't he actually use elses?

ASCII-only

wtf

Destructible Lemon

if (float(side2)+float(side3))<(float(side1)-0.000001):

this is the real wtf though

it would have been easy to use <= to if he wanted to weed out 4, 3 and 7 triangle for example

but no

Mistah Figgins

This could easily go on /r/iamverysmart

TacoLemon

12:48 AM

I have basically no knowledge of Python. But, This I feel is a much better Naïve approch.

Destructible Lemon

WHY CAN'T YOU UNDERSTAND OPEN SETS!!!

I think there is a subreddit for things like this

MendeleevLemon

OMG music is so amazing with these headphones

Mistah Figgins

@DestructibleLemon /r/shittyprogramming?

Григорий Перельман

My dad met with the CEO of reddit earlier today

Mistah Figgins

cool

MendeleevLemon

12:50 AM

@ГригорийПерельман who is that?

ASCII-only

@TacoLemon ew semicolons

MendeleevLemon

blanking on name

Григорий Перельман

Apparantly reddit has decided to sell its soul to Microsoft

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман ?

waaaat

Downgoat

@ГригорийПерельман oh no not another one

Григорий Перельман

12:51 AM

Steve Huffman

MendeleevLemon

not minecraft again

L3viathan

@TacoLemon You're sorting strings

MendeleevLemon

quick pull the source before it's too late

Mistah Figgins

it had a soul in the first place? :P

TacoLemon

@L3viathan Still works.

Григорий Перельман

12:51 AM

Since reddit essentially doesn't record site analytics, they're having Microsoft do it in exchange for Microsoft having access to all of said analytics.

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман Why not Google? At least feed the great AI

Григорий Перельман

Which basically means that starting soon, what you browse on reddit will impact the advertising you get.

@MendeleevLemon ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Probably a better deal with MS

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман I use ublock origin anyway

Григорий Перельман

All in all, nothing major, Microsoft already knows everything you do anyway.

Riker

no

google knows what I do

MendeleevLemon

12:54 AM

@ГригорийПерельман If you use Windows...

Riker

I choose to sell my soul to google instead

L3viathan

@TacoLemon 80, 60, 60

Григорий Перельман

Well, MS owns your reddit history now.

MendeleevLemon

Linux 4 lyfe™

Destructible Lemon

@TacoLemon 3 2 2 fails

Григорий Перельман

12:56 AM

@MendeleevLemon I run Ubuntu on my laptop and technically dual boot on my desktop, but I haven't actually touched the Linux installation in a while.

MendeleevLemon

> Ubuntu

Canonical is a sellout + advertiser, use arch

Destructible Lemon

fixed better

actually sorting strings is still an issue

Downgoat

@ГригорийПерельман I mean if you live in US, microsoft can now just buy it from your ISP

Destructible Lemon

done

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon I'm considering Fedora

ASCII-only

12:58 AM

@DestructibleLemon even better

Григорий Перельман

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман That's cool too. dnf > yum

Destructible Lemon

we aren't golfing here buddy

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман I did

Destructible Lemon

also I can outgolf you

@ASCII-only also it fails for 1 2 3

wtf are you even doing right now man

why do all of your programs suck

Helka Homba

1:00 AM

be nice

Григорий Перельман

Well, I just deleted my Ubuntu partition

ASCII-only

@DestructibleLemon D:

Downgoat

wow OK, Apple just dropped baseline price of iPads by $179 O_O

that is 40% price cut

Destructible Lemon

I mean, two out of two programs failed for obvious test cases

Григорий Перельман

I might install Fedora on it later

Destructible Lemon

1:01 AM

you just weren't trying

ASCII-only

@DestructibleLemon yeah sorry fixed

@DestructibleLemon plus they were the same if you were talking about my edit

Destructible Lemon

@ASCII-only wait a minute this was intended

sorry

my fault

:P

ASCII-only

@DestructibleLemon what was intended

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман arch or bust

Destructible Lemon

but it still fails for 4 2 3 anyway

MendeleevLemon

1:04 AM

livestream it

Destructible Lemon

wait nvm I confused myself

sorry

MendeleevLemon

Anyone who wants to can check out my final version of Attempt1 here

Григорий Перельман

By the ____ or bust mentality, I should be doing LFS

ASCII-only

@DestructibleLemon Oh yeah, the new one doesn't

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon No clue how

MendeleevLemon

1:05 AM

@ГригорийПерельман LFS?

Григорий Перельман

Linux From Scratch

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман Capture card or VM

Destructible Lemon

yeah should fail for 1 2 3... confusing myself way too much

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман Yeah IK, I was correcting spelling

Григорий Перельман

Oh, right

Song is awesome btw

MendeleevLemon

1:05 AM

Thanks

I improved the ending a lot

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon Don't have a capture card, and installing linux in a VM seems kind of not-the-point

Anthony Pham

I really feel that my Sandbox entry is pretty confusing: codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/11903/36594

Any suggestions?

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon TBH, kind of repetitive. Have you considered putting in some other instruments or something?

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман No, what you do is run off a Ubuntu live USB stick with persistent space, install VMWare, attach your VM to the hard drive, then install OBS and stream

Григорий Перельман

Or maybe it's because I've listened to it for so long on repeat

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anthony Pham

1:07 AM

That happens a lot with music

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман Yeah, I've noticed a bit. I can't think of anything good to add

Next one will have some piano stuff in it

Anthony Pham

@MendeleevLemon Electric guitar should help

Григорий Перельман

I'm just going to install Fedora later today/tomorow

I'll try to run Unity on it.

MendeleevLemon

@AnthonyPham ehh

@ГригорийПерельман why

GNOME 3 is better

you get used to it

Григорий Перельман

@MendeleevLemon Unity is amazing and beautiful

MendeleevLemon

1:08 AM

@ГригорийПерельман Unity is a platform for advertisements

It also does not have activities overview hot corner

Григорий Перельман

I have not yet seen an ad inside Unity

MendeleevLemon

@ГригорийПерельман They turned them off, but there used to be Amazon ads when you searched

Григорий Перельман

Eh

Don't care

Anthony Pham

That's why there's AdBlock :)

Did I just kill the conversation or something?

LegionMammal978

Hmm

I've used Unity since I got Ubuntu

Григорий Перельман

1:10 AM

Advertising is fine in the search

I don't use the search

LegionMammal978

No idea what everyone's complaining about

Григорий Перельман

@LegionMammal978 I know right! Unity is awesome!

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Grade My Test! code-golf Standardized testing usually comes with a scan-tron or some type of answer document that records your answer. A computer or human(s) would then check your answers and determine your grade. So here, given a scan-tron and the answer key, determine the score and questions ...

Destructible Lemon

1:26 AM

@MendeleevLemon have you done any more on attempt1 since you last posted it while I was in chat?

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon Yes

Destructible Lemon

where can I keep up to date on your work?

MendeleevLemon

Soundcloud and YouTube

Destructible Lemon

link pls

and not the character from LoZ

or any character for that matter

MendeleevLemon

soundcloud.com/dmitry-kudriavtsev youtube.com/channel/UC5TzKTjyZDLLJMMiaUdirXg

Destructible Lemon

1:29 AM

I SPECIFICALLY STATED TO NOT RECEIVE THAT

ALSO WHAT DAW DO YOU USE

ALSO WHY ARE YOU NOT MENDELEMON @MendeleevLemon

/caps

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon fl studio, this was partially made using the demo and then exported using the full version

Destructible Lemon

I'm gonna see if I can find something free

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon I found a way to sail the seven seas with FL Studio

Destructible Lemon

um

also you didn't answer my second question

MendeleevLemon

I didn't make this with that version though, this was exported with a friend's full version

Destructible Lemon

1:32 AM

I'm gonna use Ardour

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon Have fun

Destructible Lemon

Oh come on it actually costs money

ffs

stupid english

TacoLemon

Oh god the yellow.

Destructible Lemon

YOU ARE PART OF THE DISEASE

DO NOT CONDESCEND

LegionMammal978

Stars!

4

Destructible Lemon

1:34 AM

OK soo

if I can build ardour from the source

its free

MendeleevLemon

LegionMammal978

Nobody can think of any star names?

:(

Destructible Lemon

well

the link doesn't work

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon Heh

Destructible Lemon

@MendeleevLemon This is what my nightmares are going to be for the next week

thanks

MendeleevLemon

1:37 AM

@DestructibleLemon heh

LegionMammal978

Breaking news: the Sun and Alioth are the only stars in the sky

MendeleevLemon

@LegionMammal978 Didn't you see my response?

TacoLemon

I too responded.

Destructible Lemon

what is the thing to give execution permission for a file?

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon chmod +x <file>

LegionMammal978

1:40 AM

So if both MendeleevLemon and TacoLemon claim they didn't put Alioth on there, and there are only two responses, then who put it there?

MendeleevLemon

@LegionMammal978 Can you refresh the responses page?

LegionMammal978

@MendeleevLemon Fixed

MendeleevLemon

@LegionMammal978 No, but

LegionMammal978

Just don't get Jennifer Lawrence on a spaceship

MendeleevLemon

I showed this to my friend and he started submitting all sorts of things

Mostly movie stars

Destructible Lemon

1:48 AM

stupid unreliable school wifi

ok so I think I figured out how to build this thing

Brew is taking a long time to pour...

done!

ok where are the dependencies so I don't have to keep finding out about them each time it fails

is hell where you try to build something but you need a dependency, and then you brew install it but then you try it again and you need another one ad infinitium

MendeleevLemon

@DestructibleLemon no

Destructible Lemon

also

MendeleevLemon

hell is a cyclical dependency chain, but every time you restart, you forget that there was a cycle

Riker

@MendeleevLemon @TacoLemon @DestructibleLemon just fyi: your avatars are all really confusing. especially to someone with poor vision, you all look identical

Destructible Lemon

I just installed libarchive and it can't find it

Riker

1:58 AM

and your names are all somewhat similar in length also

Destructible Lemon

TacoLemons is quite different!!!

also I was a lemon first!!

wtf

this thing can't find libarchive

help pls

Riker