The Frying Pan

We don't have trams. I don't live near a bus stop, and it would probably require about four different buses to get there from the nearest bus stop to my house.

It's possible that the surgeon's clinic won't open that day anyway.

Cerberus

12:56 AM

Yikes.

David Wallace

Oh dear.

Cerberus

If you only need the dressings changed, you could go to your GP?

David Wallace

We have a fantastic web site that lets you work out what combination of buses and trains you need to catch, to get from point A to point B anywhere in the Wellington region.

But there's no way of telling it that there are no trains. Even though it already knows.

And it's not telling me any way of getting from my home to the hospital that doesn't involve getting a train from Lower Hutt to Wellington.

No, it's not just to change the dressing.

Cerberus

There isn't some box to untick for trains?

Our application has that.

(It has all public transport in the country, including ferries.)

"More options"? "Advanced"?

David Wallace

There are a couple of bus routes that stop near my home. But no buses that go anywhere near Bowen Hospital.

Cerberus

1:01 AM

@DavidWallace I just found the box where you can uncheck trains.

Metlink.org, right?

David Wallace

Ooh, I just found it too. Thank you.

How did I not see that?

Cerberus

Ah, stupid.

But it's 12 minutes on foot from the bus stop to the hospital.

Probably more if your leg hurts.

You could get a cab for that part of the route?

David Wallace

It's given me three options. Two with 27 minutes in total of walking, and one with 32 minutes.

Cerberus

Or you could call up the hospital and ask whether they can arrange transportation.

@DavidWallace How many minutes from the stop to the hospital?

12?

David Wallace

That's what it says, for two of the options.

It's a shame you can't untick walking.

Cerberus

1:06 AM

Heh.

David Wallace

Here it is with my planned journey.

metlink.org.nz/journeyplanner/…

I would actually get off the bus one stop earlier than it's telling me to, and walk along Blackbridge Road. Although looking at the map, that's not very much further than walking from Crofton Downs Railway Station, which is what I was originally planning to do. Maybe this isn't so bad.

Cerberus

It's 5 minutes farther, apparently.

I would call the hospital. Explain your problem.

Maybe they can pick you up from the bus stop with an ambulance.

David Wallace

Haha, that would be cool.

Cerberus

I think hospitals will do that here if you can't get there yourself.

The lights and sirens will be off, of course.

David Wallace

Huh! I just got a text from the train service. They've started running again.

Cerberus

1:13 AM

Yay!

David Wallace

And they'll probably be still working on Thursday, unless there's another big earthquake.

Cerberus

I'm sure they will be.

David Wallace

Haha! I misread that first time - as "I'm sure there will be". Meaning another earthquake.

Cerberus

Oh noes!

I'm not that sadistic.

David Wallace

1:31 AM

Of course it is of practical use to you. There is ONE country in the world that uses this system, therefore it should be taught in every English class, as if there were no other country in which English is ever spoken. @Cerberus.

Cerberus

@DavidWallace Hehe. Yes, it's really something.

David Wallace

I'm sorry. I shouldn't hang around in that room when he's there. I just can't believe that there's anyone in the world who acts quite like THAT and believes it's normal behaviour.

Cerberus

I totally understand.

Somehow it usually cannot touch me.

David Wallace

Then you're a better man than I.

Cerberus

Slides off like feathery fluff.

David Wallace

1:34 AM

It's "not nice" for you to use degrees Celsius? What has he been smoking?

Cerberus

When it's that absurd, I feel like I'm disconnected from any emotions.

So I just chuckle.

David Wallace

I keep thinking of that story of the spoon.

Cerberus

What was that?

David Wallace

There is a story about an Englishman, a Frenchman and a German who are debating the merits of their respective languages. The German starts by claiming: ‘German is off course ze best language. It is ze language off logik and philosophy, and can communicate viz great clarity and precision even ze most complex ideas.’ ‘Boeff,’ shrugs the Frenchman, ‘but French, French, it ees ze language of lurve! In French, we can convey all ze subtletees of romance weez elegance and flair.’ The Englishman ponders the matter for a while, and then says: ‘Yes, chaps, that’s all very well. But just think about…

Cerberus

Heh.

What a great analytic mind!

David Wallace

1:55 AM

Oh dear. It's bad enough having to read everything he says ONCE. Now he's quoting himself wildly so we have to read it TWICE?

Cerberus

Haha.

I'm not reading that, just skip it.

Mien

10:53 AM

It seems that @ElendilTheTall will be a good boy from now on :P

derobert

4:47 PM

@DavidWallace Indeed its not, everyone should use Kelvins!

Why does reading the last page of transcript feel like hearing half of a conversation?

sourd'oh

@SAJ14SAJ @SAJ14SAJ I've seen a lot of recipes that use much shorter autolyses, like 15 or 20 minutes. Overall though, I doubt it's going to have that much impact for a home baker either way.

derobert

Its cooled off a bit today, its only 301.

SAJ14SAJ

5:12 PM

@sourd'oh I have never seen a recipe like that... does it make any practical difference over such a short time frame?

@derobert Kelvin?

Cerberus

@derobert We apologise.

derobert

@SAJ14SAJ Yep.

Cerberus

Let's see, I think Kelvin 0 = Celsius -273, or thereabouts?

Or what was it again...

Ah, yes.

So it's 301 K for you. Still too hot, but cooler than here.

derobert

Wait, its warmer over there now?

Of course, we're up to 302 now.

Cerberus

5:30 PM

We were up to 305 here today, officially. In reality, it gets hotter in the city.

At the moment it's 304, says my phone. Based on some other source, not actual measurements. It lacks a thermometer, alas.

derobert

5:43 PM

@Cerberus Hopefully you do not share @ElendilTheTall's lack of AC.

Cerberus

@derobert I do.

Nobody has AC here.

Except some shops and offices and trains.

derobert

Wow... How miserable is it there? What's the dew point?

Cerberus

But not nearly all.

I am too exhausted from the heat to look that up!

derobert

Sounds like what you need is to install AC.

Cerberus

I know!

The only good thing is that it only gets this hot maybe one or two weeks a year.

timeanddate.com/weather/netherlands/amsterdam

It says the dew point is 16 °C at the airport.

About 15km from here.

derobert

5:49 PM

Ah. It is normally this hot for around 3–4 months a year here.

Cerberus

Yeah, then you certainly need AC!

derobert

Much drier there, too

Cerberus

Do all buses, trams, and trains have AC too?

derobert

forecast.weather.gov/…

I think they all do, but I hardly ever ride on one.

Cerberus

So your dew point is higher.

But you have AC.

derobert

5:54 PM

Yep. Inside its fine.

Cerberus

If I can get your car in the deal, and parking spaces everywhere, I'll trade with you.

Switch lives.

derobert

The AC in my car is broken :-P

Cerberus

Swap locations / stuff.

Awww.

derobert

Hah, you could move over here!

Cerberus

Hmm...I'd love to, but could you first have the AC in your car fixed please?

People here move around by bike, so the heat really gets us.

derobert

5:57 PM

@Cerberus It was too expensive to fix...

Very annoying in sumer.

Cerberus

Yikes.

I wonder how your ancestors lived there before AC.

derobert

I think they all went on a summer vacation to the mountains.

Cerberus

Hmm.

derobert

Also, they had buildings designed for cross-winds...

Cerberus

I suppose that is possible, if you have a datcha there.

Cross-winds?

derobert

6:00 PM

@Cerberus Maybe the wrong word... but having windows on two sides of the building open, so the wind blows through

Cerberus

Right.

Most houses have that, outside cities.

But still, there may be little wind.

And it will still be too hot...

derobert

Well, not really. A lot don't have that many windows. And often only on two sides of the building, not all 4.

Windows are pretty costly in terms of energy efficiency, if you're trying to heat/cool the house

Cerberus

But they have wooden houses anyway, I thought?

So very little insulation?

derobert

Modern stuff has a lot of insulation on top of the wood

Cerberus

6:20 PM

Right, but a hundred years ago? Or how old is AC?

Cerberus

6:55 PM

@SAJ14SAJ chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/10447422#10447422

Arg, it's not showing up.

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus That is is exceedingly cute!

Cerberus

I know!

SAJ14SAJ

I have a taxi on the way, my phone died, I have to go buy another one.

Cerberus

Yikes.

Borrow one?

SAJ14SAJ

I am going to buy a really cheap pre-paid model. I hate the contracts.

And maybe I can play android games :-)

Cerberus

6:58 PM

Sure, a cheap Android is still fine. How cheap?

Your could buy a dumbphone for € 20 or so.

SAJ14SAJ

Maybe $100

I have to go outside, cab will be here any minute.

Will prob. be on tonight.

Cerberus

Good luck...

SAJ14SAJ

8:14 PM

@Cerberus Thank you. Got it. $98

derobert

8:33 PM

@SAJ14SAJ wait, you need a taxi to buy a phone?

SAJ14SAJ

If you don't want to wait for fedex

derobert

Wait... you live out in the suburbs and you don't have a car?!

SAJ14SAJ

Through a long and sad tail which I don't propose to tell, I am not driving right now. My car is snug in the garage. And just for the record, I don't drink, so it wasn't that

derobert

Oooh, if you don't tell, we get to make up stories!

SAJ14SAJ

It also gave me an excuse to pick up a giant box of Popeyes spicy. It was a really good batch!

derobert

8:38 PM

It could be as mundane as "vision problems"

SAJ14SAJ

@derobert You all would anyway.

derobert

Or it could be more interesting. Perhaps the cats have hidden your license, so you can't escape.

SAJ14SAJ

I carpool with a collegue, work from home a lot, get the occassional taxi, Peopod grocery deliveries. It actually isn't bad,and I save about $1000/month.

The taxi fees don't put dent in that unless I make multiple trips to columbia.

derobert

Yeah. Cars do cost a fair bit. Well, unless you get a cheap used one.

sourd'oh

Hello

SAJ14SAJ

8:40 PM

@derobert Mine is completely paid for :-)

So maybe I don't save quite so much without a payment, but still....

@sourd'oh Hey

derobert

I've never actually tried Peapod.

SAJ14SAJ

They are expensive, but I am single and make good money and I love the convenience. I used them--a little less often--even when I was driving.

derobert

Yeah, when I looked at them last, it cost a fair bit...

Cerberus

1000 a month!?

SAJ14SAJ

What I compare it to is eating is restaurants, which for me was an almost every meal thing. So in that sense, they are still a good value, but you do pay for the privilege.

Cerberus

8:43 PM

My brother used to spend € 80 or so on his car monthly.

Or so he claimed.

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus Maybe not so much, but insurance and gas alone are about $400/month. Add tolls, maintenance, and a car payment and it could easily be that.

Cerberus

Wow.

derobert

@Cerberus That's hard to believe.

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus Did his car have two wheels and iron pipes and let him get wet in the rain?

Cerberus

I think he included taxes, insurance, and petrol. But not maintenance. But he did much of that himself.

SAJ14SAJ

8:44 PM

Patrol?

derobert

Then he must not have used it at all. Isn't petrol fairly expensive in Europe?

SAJ14SAJ

Ah.

Cerberus

It is.

He didn't use it every day.

Is there no public transport in your suburb?

But I suppose taxis are cheaper there.

SAJ14SAJ

Not in any practical sense.

derobert

Most suburbs in the US don't have usable public transit

Cerberus

8:45 PM

How do the poor get by?

SAJ14SAJ

In the US, only in major urban areas downtown like NYC or Chicago can you actually get buy on public transit.

Cerberus

And students? Children?

derobert

@Cerberus they get cheap cars

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus They don't, not very well. A lot of their income goes towards transport.

Cerberus

@derobert Still more expensive than many people can afford...

SAJ14SAJ

8:46 PM

Students tend to find housing Based on transport availability. For example, my universitry ran a private bus network that was free to students, faculty and staff. I chose my apartments by where the lines ran.

Cerberus

Wow.

derobert

@SAJ14SAJ hah, I picked where I bought a house by the FiOS map :-P

SAJ14SAJ

@derobert I would do the same :-)

Cerberus

I mean, in the country, it kind of makes sense, if the population density is too low.

Fios map?

derobert

@Cerberus every once and a while, the local government sends me a brochure about all the transit available (which they seem to think is a lot).

@Cerberus I drive to work in ~10 min

@Cerberus I could take the bus, and get there in a mere 2 hours!

SAJ14SAJ

8:48 PM

@derobert Jealous.

@derobert Sounds about right.

Its bad, and only slightly mitigated by t he fact that you can read. I didn't drive until I was 26.

derobert

@SAJ14SAJ Yeah, I have to go in every day, though. But yeah, my commute is definitely much less than average.

Cerberus

@derobert I suppose that could be helpful.

@derobert And biking? Is that an option?

@derobert Jesus.

derobert

@Cerberus Technically (and legally), yes. Practically, I'd be biking on roads where cars are going >50mph

Cerberus

No biker lanes?

derobert

Not most of the way. And none on the fast road.

Cerberus

8:50 PM

I see.

wax eagle

@Cerberus those are pretty rare depending on where you live

Cerberus

Not that I would want to bike at 303+ degrees...

derobert

@Cerberus There were supposed to be some built, and the community I live in paid to build them (and we're about to spend a good chunk of change maintaining it)... but the folks next door, apparently the county forgot to get them to. Or something.

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus I didnt drive until I was 26. I was very passionate about biker laws and the right of the road. And the thing is, at least under US conditions, because biker lanes are on the right, and the need to make left hand turns, they are actually more dangerous than non-biker lanes. For this reason, I would ride in the CENTER of the lane when preparing to turn.

Under most US laws, bicycles are vehicles and have the same right to the road as any other, whether the drivers like it or not.

Cerberus

@derobert Perhaps some day...

SAJ14SAJ

8:52 PM

And of course, a good cyclist (on a decent bike) can accelerate a LOT faster than a car, so it doesn't inconvenience them much.

derobert

Yes, legally, you have every right to bicycle down Rt. 7...

SAJ14SAJ

I would never have ridden on 7.

Even driving it is scary!

derobert

Exactly!

Cerberus

Hmm.

I wonder.

People in countries like Canada and America always say biking is dangerous.

Also in London.

While people here don't think it's dangerous.

We also don't wear helmets.

derobert

Well, we don't always say it is—we say it is on certain roads...

wax eagle

8:54 PM

@Cerberus partly perception, partly that us drivers aren't used to driving with cyclists

derobert

There are a lot of roads—the vast majority of them, by mileage—where its safe

wax eagle

I am at this point because I live in a cyclist heavy area, on a cyclist heavy mountain on a cyclist heavy road.

SAJ14SAJ

I always wore a helmet. But form the way you described, you didn't ride at 20 mph either!

Cerberus

@derobert Sure, but there are enough unsafe roads to make the average trip unsafe, according to many people in many places.

Is there mainly a physical difference, or rather a mental difference?

@waxeagle Right, possibly. It may also have to do with speeds.

derobert

The roads where I'd say its safe either have lower speed limits, or much less traffic, often both.

SAJ14SAJ

8:56 PM

damn security packaging. I should have bought an iPhone

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ Yeah, that's not possible in cities. Only on long, straight roads in the country, which means only on new lands, in the polder.

wax eagle

@Cerberus yeah. like the road I live on, it's popular with cyclists, but the speed limit is 55MPH which is...a lot faster than even a good cyclist. Specially when most folks drive 65-70

SAJ14SAJ

Polder?

Cerberus

Polder

A polder is a low-lying tract of land enclosed by embankments (barriers) known as dikes that forms an artificial hydrological entity, meaning it has no connection with outside water other than through manually operated devices. There are three types of polder: * Land reclaimed from a body of water, such as a lake or the sea bed. * Flood plains separated from the sea or river by a dike. * Marshes separated from the surrounding water by a dike and subsequently drained. The ground level in drained marshes subsides over time and thus all polders will eventually be below the surrounding wat...

derobert

@waxeagle Does it at least have good visibility?

SAJ14SAJ

8:57 PM

In my prime I could cruise a level road at 20-25 mph. 40 on a good downhhill, but that gets scary.

Cerberus

Reclaimed land.

SAJ14SAJ

@Cerberus Ah, I learn something new; never heard that term before.

wax eagle

@derobert for the most part, but it's a mountain road, there are parts of it that are inevitably windy

Cerberus