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7:03 PM
Maybe? I honestly am not sure.
 
@nitsua60 Basic also includes a lot of stuff that SRD doesnt (including some pictures, descriptions, and a handful of special rules)
 
@DavidCoffron let's not get into pictures.
:D
 
Re: burnination and retagging: how much does fixing the tags of closed questions matter?
 
7:21 PM
@Someone_Evil personally, i dislike updating closed questions unless it's specifically an attempt to reopen. Otherwise, it raises the profile for no apparent reason. But that is entirely just my own opinion.
 
@Someone_Evil I agree with NautArch ^
 
@Someone_Evil It matters if it is their only tag, since untagged questions kinda fall through the cracks.
 
especially since only the first edits bring it up in the Review Queue so after the reviewers click past saying it isn't ready for re-opening, any later edits actually intending to get it reopened won't automatically bring it queue
(instead waiting for a high rep user to vote to Reopen to set it in queue)
 
whats the appeal of lawful characters?
 
@MageintheBarrel Stability!
 
7:35 PM
I don't get why someone would want to play as a stonefaced rule junkie with all the flexibility of a brick wall and a head as hard as one
 
@MageintheBarrel If I'm playing a character that has a really structured set of principles, regardless of their general Good↔Evil alignment, they'll almost always be lawful.
 
lawfuls are just plain resrictive
 
@MageintheBarrel I think you are thinking about alignment too lawfully
@MageintheBarrel What are they restricting?
 
free thinking
if someone is admantly set in their ways to the point where they won't budge they'll just get in the way
 
lawful != lockstep regimented.
 
7:38 PM
That's one of the ways of interpreting lawfulness. I don't think it's the only one.
 
There's a lot of free thinking that should be gotten in the way of
 
Examples: My Lawful Good Monk, who used to be an MMA-esque brawler used to strict rules of engagement, honorable behavior, etc.,. Or my Lawful Neutral Sorcerer, who is a Freelance Assassin, but who has certain types of people she will not target (children, poor, etc.) and always holds back the killing blow until she can ascertain that her target is correct.
(Assassin is a title, not a reference to the Rogue subtype)
 
If you want watch a LN character played out: Acq Inc's Omin Dran. (How strictly they are using alignment - or any other part of the rules - is debatable though.)
Lawful doesn't have to be about strict rules. Principles of Order or groups are just as - if not more - important. Kobolds are LE, but will welcome any idea (as long as it gets all of them loot/food)
 
@MageintheBarrel Lawful doesn't mean they aren't free thinkers. Some lawful thinkers are perfectly happy to change the laws/code/rules, they are just adamant that whatever the laws/code/rules are should be maintained
Like a police officer might dislike the way a laws are designed personally, but upholds the law anyway. That would still be a lawful character in my eyes.
In contrast, a chaotic character places less stock in laws, personal codes, or other rules.
 
@Xirema SRD and basic rules are different things, but D&D Beyond's listing of the "basic rules" is actually an inclusive combination of the two
SRD is here: http://media.wizards.com/2016/downloads/DND/SRD-OGL_V5.1.pdf (hasn't been updated with the latest errata)
Basic rules are here: http://media.wizards.com/2018/dnd/downloads/DnD_BasicRules_2018.pdf (they are updated)
 
7:50 PM
@DavidCoffron Yeah, the character who upholds justice even when it's unpleasant seems like one of the examples of cool lawful concepts.
 
so following laws even if they are obviously wrong is better than not following them period or just following them as nessesary
 
@MageintheBarrel Most importantly, Lawful doesn't mean Lawful Stupid.
 
lawful = stupid because chaining yourself down is just that
 
@MageintheBarrel That seems like an adversarial interpretation of the above.
I might as well come up with an adversarial interpretation of a chaotic, but that doesn't mean I should when trying to understand the fun of chaotics.
 
@MageintheBarrel I mean, that's varying flavors of Lawful-Evil, what you're describing.
 
7:53 PM
@DavidCoffron Judging from my previous search on the matter, only editing the post body causes it to appear in the review queue; tag edits alone won't do it? I might be wrong there.
 
A Lawful-Good character isn't an Angel or Celestial, literally incapable of reasoning about their circumstances—if a LG character encounters rules that are bad, they push to have those rules changed.
 
which will nenver happen
 
And a LE character will actively abuse bad laws to their advantage.
 
@MageintheBarrel I personally believe that we should adhere to the laws of a democratic country even if I disagree with them. We should work to change them as they are intended to be changed. My personal perspective would likely change if laws are instead dictated by a monarch or other non-democratic regime, but I don't have the experience there. Lawful characters in D&D could just have the same idea..
 
unless whomever is making bad laws is removed they won't be
 
7:55 PM
@Someone_Evil I don't think it matters much as long as we don't leave them untagged. I basically said as much as in my reply to Jon Ericson's response on meta. In most cases there's not too much benefit to adding a bunch of tags to questions that are off-topic or will otherwise stay closed forever.
 
@MageintheBarrel Your argument sounds like a personal disapproval of strict legal/rule systems, not a criticism of the alignment itself (as a mechanic).
 
@MageintheBarrel that very much depends on the world in which you're playing. That's only a true if there's a single creature determining, managing, and keeping those laws.
 
and regardless of what kind of government your under you have no choice but to sit on your hands and wait it out
 
@MageintheBarrel That's untrue
There are many forms of government that have various means to adjust legal codes
 
or go against order which lawful characters won't do unless they get their arm twisted 10 times over
 
7:56 PM
@DavidCoffron And failing those, civil unrest up to revolution to change the rest
 
Enacting change in an orderly fashion is not necessarily acting against order.
 
there's no such thing as orderly change
 
E.g. legislating a change to a law would be a more lawful-ish way of doing things; starting a revolution would be a chaotic one.
 
just look at the current state of the us
 
@MageintheBarrel That's just... wrong. It literally happens every democratic election, to varying degrees. That's what elections and votes are.
 
7:58 PM
and brexit
 
@MageintheBarrel Depends on how lawful
 
both cases followed laws and order and look at where we ended up
 
No character is purely lawful or purely chaotic, they exist on a spectrum
 
Very lawful characters can be fun to RP. Start with a core concept, get creative when you run into situations that challenge or stretch it.
As long as it's not used adversarially against other players - which is usually true for most character concepts anyway.
 
@MageintheBarrel Weeeeeellllllllll..... Brexit was motivated by partisans in the UK literally lying to their constituents about its merits.
 
7:59 PM
I think we're getting dangerously close to real-life political discussion. And we should beware.
 
@MageintheBarrel Umm... just because you pose two examples of disorderly (debatably) change doesn't mean there is no orderly change. Many countries have orderly change
 
There are many views of looking at something, and we must remain Nice.
 
@MageintheBarrel Why so USA-centric? Take a look, for example, at the dissolution of USSR through orderly means, when everyone expected to need a hot world war to break it up.
 
Like, there's a seriously difficult conversation to be had about the value of Democracy in a world where the voters can be so easily led astray by the power of social media and organized propaganda campaigns, but that's sort of orthogonal to a question about how alignment should be applied.
 
And even stepping away from countries, I have an orderly method of changing my personal code of conduct (reasoned debate).
 
8:01 PM
Or to questions about how "orderly" Trumpism/Brexitism are.
 
And levels of order are impossible to quantify anyway
 
in the first place laws are decided by the people on top
 
The stack has meta in order to change itself in an orderly fashion
 
A change of a law through legislation is orderly. A change of law through revolution is chaotic. Legislative changes do happen across the world.
 
I certainly wouldn't describe the upcoming U.S. election as "chaotic"
@MageintheBarrel That's a political statement. You'll find many that agree, and many that don't
 
8:02 PM
Also, lawful characters aren't necessarily the overly rigid ones. That's part of a more general "my guy" problem.
 
@MageintheBarrel And if we are able to step away from countries, Workers Cooperatives are at least an example where the rules are definitely not created by those on top
 
lawfuls are literally only second to evil in my guy criteria
 
Really? Not the Chaotic Sillies?
 
@MageintheBarrel Neither one of those are My Guy. It's how a player uses them that becomes My Guy.
 
@MageintheBarrel I mean, a chaotic character can be just a disruptive as a lawful character
 
8:04 PM
^
 
My Guy can apply to any alignment
 
some have higher risk factrs
 
it's treating alignment as rigid and using it as a cudgel to make the game unfun that causes "my guy syndrome"
 
That ^^
 
I've got two Lawfuls in my group, and our Chaotic has been far more disruptive than both of them combined.
 
8:05 PM
A true neutral character that treats it like an excuse to not care about anything is very disruptive to cooperative play. And that's just one interpretation of that alignment (which is a disruptive one)
 
Hello, @TheSimpliFire. Welcome to the RPG.SE lair :)
 
what an alignment is is rigid by nature becuase it's literally in the rulebook what they are
 
@TheSimpliFire welcome!
 
Hello @Someone_Evil, I just dropped in due to a flag
 
@V2Blast Alignment, or class, or race, or other aspects of the character.
 
8:05 PM
(and hello @V2Blast)
 
@MikeQ Yep
 
@MageintheBarrel - The thing to remember is ALL of the mechanics such as alignment, class, are merely tools and suggestions.
The implementation of said mechanic is what makes it rigid, lax, disruptive, etc.
 
@V2Blast Agreed. Alignment imo should just be the principles the character values. I consider myself a principled (lawful) person, but I violate my principles from time to time due to a variety of factors (the flavor of sugar is the main one xD)
 
lol
 
@DavidCoffron ...sugar has flavors?
 
8:07 PM
@DavidCoffron BZZT You get an alignment shift. No more paladin levels for you.
 
@MageintheBarrel Well... depends on the game you're playing
 
@TheSimpliFire We can tell. The topic gets... interesting and then two users with blue names drop in in quick succession. I'd just like to pretend otherwise.
 
@JohnP taste* :P
 
I consider myself tn I use laws when it suits me and act chaotic when it suits me, I don't try to make peoples lives better or worse
 
@Someone_Evil Well JohnP has been fairly regular. So, just one new name from the flag
 
8:08 PM
that's about avergage human being if you ask me
 
@Someone_Evil Because diamonds like interesting things too
 
@MageintheBarrel Maybe for an anarchist...
 
@MageintheBarrel Some people would call that Neutral Evil based on the line "when it suits me". Alignment is impossible to pin down
 
your only evil if you try to do harm throughvyour selfishness
 
@MageintheBarrel That's still an interpretation. I'm just demonstrating that alignment isn't so well defined that you can make judgments like that
 
8:10 PM
@TheSimpliFire Yup. And flags don't indicate if there is a mod present in the room already or not...
 
If alignment was so easily and strictly defined, we wouldn't have such problems with questions involving them
 
Oct 12 '18 at 18:54, by Mike Q
All alignment discussions are, by nature, evil because they harm everyone's sanity and produce no benefit
 
@Someone_Evil Also worth noting that I, as a non-blue, have dropped into other chats due to flags before too.
 
hahahaha
 
Congrats, you're all evil now.
 
8:11 PM
honestly alignment is a dumb system
 
@DavidCoffron Right. Alignment is a guide post. People are changeable. It's using alignment as a cudgel for a player when roleplaying that it can become My Guy. And any alignment can do that - it's more of a player issue than an alignment issue.
 
@MageintheBarrel I'll agree to that
 
@MageintheBarrel Yup. Just play your character and don't be My Guy.
 
@DavidCoffron Mmm....I'd argue against dumb and rather say limited approach to a many faceted entity.
 
@DavidCoffron I could've switched my parent user and you would never have known...
 
8:12 PM
Which is why at my tables we use alignment as a descriptive rather than a prescriptive mechanism. I might call my character neutral good because he values goodness and doesn't really have a preference for law or chaos. You might think my character is true neutral because he doesn't do to many good things, but he wishes he did more
 
@TheSimpliFire I can do that now, for you, if you wish. :p
 
alignment is a dumb system period made even dumber by it's poor implimentation
 
@MikeQ It's better to put the 'e' at the start than at the end...
 
@MageintheBarrel Let's still remember Be Nice. But i'm not sure it's poorly implemented in all systems. Heck, in 5e they really make it clear that it's just a guideline.
 
@MageintheBarrel Well I don't agree with that. I find alignment useful in some systems at some tables as a way to convey basic ideas between characters
 
8:13 PM
@MageintheBarrel And, I think we've exhausted that line of conversation.
 
@JohnP I sometimes underestimate the things we can do in chat
 
magic
 
@TheSimpliFire Makes for a brief amusement in moderator restricted rooms. Change parent, lose mod, get kicked. :p
 
if your by change wondering what brought this on my dm thinks that fey of the spring court are lawful neutral or lawful good
 
Well, it's a court, right? So they'd abide by the laws of the court?
 
8:16 PM
@MageintheBarrel Honestly, it seems like you and your DM are not only on different pages, but different books. You need to have a lot of this convo with them. :)
 
i might just play a different race
rewritting that part of my character seems less painful than playing a rule junkie
 
Is a rule junkie anything like a rule lawyer?
 
Every time we have an alignment conversation, I constantly want to make CSS jokes/references.
 
@MageintheBarrel That's a band-aid solution. You need to get on the same page as your DM/table. Otherwise this is going to crop again somewhere else.
 
Anyway, I'd better get going. See you later (hopefully not through one of these :P)
 
8:19 PM
@Yuuki Please do
 
@MikeQ c'mon man. Just give me a rule.
 
The only bad alignment is center. I'll burn for eternity before you can make me center justify something.
2
 
@Yuuki Hahaha
 
@MageintheBarrel Actually, fey really don't have alignment if you go by true lore. Fey are creatures of impulses more than anything.
 
@JohnP (which some consider Chaotic Neutral)
 
8:20 PM
if anything fae are chaotic
 
If anything, CSS is Chaotic Neutral.
 
@MageintheBarrel Except the Spring Court does have a set of rules which is lawful-begging
 
@DavidCoffron quite possibly.
 
@MageintheBarrel But at the end of the day, the world you're playing in is your DM's world. Lore is lore, but how they use the lore to build their world takes precedence.
 
Although I would never make a character adhere to an alignment just because they adhere to a set of rules. It depends on how the character sees those rules
 
8:22 PM
@NautArch Have a star.
 
Wait, just to back up, what's the problem at hand? Is this just another pointless alignment discussion or are we trying to resolve something?
 
Is the issue that the DM decided that certain NPCs are a certain alignment?
 
@MikeQ I believe Mage is having a viewpoint difference with their DM over alignment of the spring and summer courts and the enforcement of said alignment.
 
7 mins ago, by Mage in the Barrel
if your by change wondering what brought this on my dm thinks that fey of the spring court are lawful neutral or lawful good
 
8:23 PM
no I decided to play as a fey rolled spring court and got saddled with a lawful alignment
 
Ok, so the DM decided that certain NPCs are of a certain alignment. Why is that an issue?
 
@MikeQ Speaking of, I think I met my first co-player who uses very contrived interpretations rules to justify what I would consider anti-rules rulings.
The GM handled it very well though, so it didn't affect my enjoyment of the game
 
@DavidCoffron I'd like to hear about that. Let's put it on the discussion queue for now.
 
:thumbs-up:
 
@MikeQ In this case, it seems that it's due to it apparently being a playable race in Mage's game and thus the DM apparently informing them their alignment must be lawful (for whatever that's worth)
 
8:25 PM
he didn't inform me it was lawful until after I got all my stuff together
 
Okay, @MageintheBarrel ask your DM about how lawful alignment would impact the character. E.g. Ask if you can still roleplay the character as the concept you want.
 
also I wrote the race to be a fey but he said it was spring court
 
Okay? Maybe spring court is a subset of fey in this setting. Not a big deal.
 
@MageintheBarrel That could be just so it fits into the story.
 
corrention i wrote a race that was fey and rolled spring court
 
8:26 PM
I think the biggest concern is if the restrictions your GM has placed will impact how you are able to portray the character
 
Yep. And only you know the DM. So only you can ask them how, if at all, the alignment might restrict your character.
 
@MikeQ This. Us discussing it is like the blind men and the elephant.
 
@MageintheBarrel Then that is a conversation to have with the GM. If you feel like the restriction is not justified and would negatively impact your fun/roleplay, you can ask that it be lifted.
 
@MageintheBarrel - Bottom line comes down to their game, their rules. You need to sit down and have a good give and take discussion with them about reasons on both sides, and then decide if you want to play in their system, compromise or take your participation elsewhere.
 
8:32 PM
@MikeQ The ruling in question was a discussion about catapult and the player's request that if he catapulted a weapon it would also deal weapon damage (in addition to the 3d6). The DM was hesitant, but the player insisted that since the spell said "straight line" he could direct the dagger to puncture.
The DM agreed to allow it, but made it pretty clear that "throwing all your weapons to the enemy side" may not be the best strategy (implying that he will use in-world reasons to nerf it rather than just banning it, which I liked)
I also expect that the GM would be happy to say something like "a larger weapon like this greataxe you are trying to fling is too unwieldy to direct effectively. You only get the bludgeoning damage for that one"
 
@DavidCoffron That sounds like an eminently reasonable DM. I might have said they could have either/or. Bludgeoning or piercing, with the reasoning that if it is piercing, there is no bludgeoning impact which (presumably) requires a greater surface area for impact.
 
Awesome important note that catapulting a object also destroys the object upon impact.
Well maybe not destroys but whatever the damage is for the attack is also on the object
 
> the object and what it strikes each take 3d8 bludgeoning damage.
@NautArch That is kind of messed up. So I could catapult a loaf of bread for 3d8?
 
Maybe it's odd, but as either a player or GM, I have no problems with a weapon that is visually massive (like a two-handed maul) but does 1d8 (1d10) warhammer damage.
I might have a particular look and feel that I want but if it makes it easier on the GM to just treat it like some existing mechanic, then I'm fine with that.
 
@JohnP 1 lb minimum
 
8:39 PM
@Yuuki I agree. I'm a personal believer in less strict narration and just ensuring the mechanics are balanced.
 
@NautArch It could be a very large loaf of bread
Or pumpernickel
 
For example, I've had a character rolling around in my head that uses a buckler and a massive hammer. Ostensibly two-handed for most people, my character has enough strength that they can just wield it with one hand. I'm okay with that hammer dealing 1d8 bludgeoning.
 
@NautArch Sourdough Boule - Easily 1 lb per loaf.
 
@Yuuki Especially since HP is an abstraction anyway ;)
 
@MikeQ zomg. we are all missing the boat. PIE FIGHT!
 
8:42 PM
Does anyone know how to sell a personal D&D campaign
 
Like getting a self-written adventure published for sale?
 
Yeah
 
@JohnP something something mass velocity acceleration
 
That's from someone that did it.
 
The low overhead route is getting a PDF of your content together and getting it on drivethrurpg, but I hear their cut is a bit much if you don't have much of a following. Knowing the rules of publishing content for the game system you target is super important.
 
8:45 PM
@TrevorFait Like a full, hardback book-size campaign or something dmsguild sized?
 
Full book prob
 
(there I go making assumptions that its D&D 5e, ignore me if it isn't)
 
@DavidCoffron Don't be so centric. :p
 
@JohnP I'll just go drop myself a downvote to compensate ;)
 
That article isn't a bad starting point, does point to relevant related articles in addition to how to target something for 5E.
 
8:46 PM
@DavidCoffron It is
 
@TrevorFait Well, first thing is to make sure it adheres to the copywrite policies WoTC has lined up. You can find information about thier Open Gaming License here
 
OK ty
 
For other licensing options you'd have to get in touch with WoTC directly
 
From there, the article Maximillian linked is a good start
 
8:48 PM
Oh, it wasn't me that linked it. That was JohnP.
I don't know how flooded the market is with 5E 3rd party content. It was a complete mess in 3.0/3.5 days. Getting your name out there isn't easy. If you're aiming for a product on retail hobby store shelves, that's even harder.
 
@TrevorFait - Or you could go the dragonlance route and write it up as a novel :)
 
@JohnP Yeah I could do that
 
@TrevorFait In either case, that's pretty cool that you have a campaign that evolved.
 
@JohnP Thanks my party really liked it so I thought others would too
 
Publishing and printing are costly, so the eBook route appeals to many.
Print on Demand seems to be a thing too.
 
8:53 PM
@Maximillian True
 
Oh, they have one of those now? Nice.
 
9:28 PM
12
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Q: Is this adjustment to the Lucky feat underpowered?

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10:28 PM
8
Q: Social Encounters in a West Marches Campaign

AuWiMoI am a new DM with one session under my belt and am planning to run the campaign as a "West Marches" D&D 5e campaign. One of my players requested I have some social encounters next time and I am wondering how to have these in a WM game, especially as it progresses and players spend more time away...

11
Q: Does Mage Hand give away the caster's position?

August BebelI was thinking about casting mage hand while hidden to do things like, for example, pulling a lever behind a guard's back. But if I'm not an Arcane Trickster, the hand is visible and the question is, does it have any kind of “spectral” connection to me as its caster? The spell doesn’t say anythi...

 
11:24 PM
@Maximillian There's a Style Guide Resource Pack on DMsGuild: dmsguild.com/product/267467/…
It comes with the Forgotten Realms Style Guide, the general D&D House Style Guide, an IP guide, and an adventure design guide
 
11:49 PM
@Maximillian DMsGuild cut is 50%, IIRC.
 
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