TRPG General Chat

nitsua60

00:05

@inthemanual hiya. New dad--that's awesome! Contrats. (Remind me: did I know about this already?) First? Nth? Baby and momma healthy?

inthemanual

You might know about it if you happened to be here for the tiny blurb i was around about 3-4 weeks ago.

First, and all are healthy

V2Blast

Glad to hear it!

nitsua60

I really enjoyed the bit of Gloomhaven I've played. Personally, if I'm going to play something persistent and fantasy-plotty and sword & sorceryey, I'm going to elect for a TTRPG. But if I'm with a bunch of friends who're up for something fantasy-plotty but don't know/like/want any TTRPG, I think Gloomhaven occupies an excellent space.

inthemanual

it's a nice game. our group tends to over-discuss and over-plan in a way that the game discourages, so we have an easier time with it than we're meant to.

in that way it kinda misses the social aspect that TTRPGs fill, which may be why I'm wanting to push the group back in that direction

nitsua60

00:21

@inthemanual How old now? five or six weeks?

inthemanual

3 weeks

that tiny blurb was a "coming any day now" mention

nitsua60

Oh, right--so you said just a few messages back. Awesome! How's the alertness?

inthemanual

my alertness? or the baby's?

nitsua60

00:45

Baby's =)

Interesting conversation/developments over on SO--worth a read (IMO) by anyone who's interested in the Network writ large:

-426

Q: We’re removing “Hot Meta Posts” from Stack Overflow's sidebar for now; moderators now fully control [featured]

tl;dr: We're removing the "Hot Meta Posts" from Stack Overflow's sidebar while we work on looking at how Meta can better meet its goals. To ensure that moderators are able to bring important posts to the community, we'll be giving them exclusive access to the featured tag. "Featured on Meta" w...

104

Q: The world is big and I am SO small. What are the implications for our meta community with the changes in Stack Overflow?

TL DR: The input from meta carries far less sway than it used to. The Stack Overflow Company (I'll refer to as the network) is making the decisions on site changes. We need to adapt to our new limited influence. So this is less of a discussion, more of a heads up, a pointer to a good chat roo...

discussion featured meta users user-experience

V2Blast

@nitsua60 I try to avoid being interested in the network writ large, for my own sanity. :P

Black Spike

@inthemanual Congrats on baby! Hope all is well!

nitsua60

@inthemanual It's too early by years to ask you about your alertness, silly =)

MikeQ

@nitsua60 Do babies grant the Alertness feat? Does that mean babies are familiars?

nitsua60

Hey room: what about a "happy life events" meta? For that time you just feel like shouting from your metaphorical rooftop "I have a new baby (or whatever) and it's amazing!" What're the obvious downsides/repercussions of such a thing?

Black Spike

00:58

while they're cot-bound, it's fine ... once they can move about on their own, you'll need your wits about you! :)

@nitsua60 Do we need to hive it off into a separate area? Would that stop people seeing it?

Shalvenay

hey there @BlackSpike, how're things going?

Black Spike

@Shalvenay hey. Hot. UK heatwave continues unabated

Shalvenay

@BlackSpike alright here

nitsua60

@BlackSpike My nascent thought is an rpg.meta Q that says "Wanna share?" (or whatever) and explains the "rules" in the body (share what you're comfortable with, this is meant to be a way to help people share genuine joy, we recommend sorting by "newest/active", voting probably basically means nothing); each announcement would be an "answer."

Black Spike

@Shalvenay 2nd hottest day EVAH! 37'C. We're 2AM now and still well over 20'

Ben

01:02

@BESW I saw your ping about LLKoM, but didn't get a chance to respond

Been pretty hectic the past few days

BESW

No worries!

I really shouldn't be doing any more RPG design for the next several days. I shouldn't have written Kapok Hearts at all.

Ben

I'm open for a quick chat now though :)

BESW

Okay!

Hopefully it won't lead to me spending the rest of the afternoon knuckles-deep in text revisions.

Ben

Haha. Fingers crossed

BESW

17 hours ago, by BESW

Cards no longer grant extra dice, they're all rule-bending powers. Instead, everyone has [ X - Y ] dice where X is a fixed number like 5 and Y is the number of power cards the monster has.

Shalvenay

01:03

@nitsua60 are you up for a chat now, or not so much?

MikeQ

@nitsua60 I dunno, it seems that this current chat seems to fit that purpose. It's not just about sharing things with strangers, it's sharing things with a community that you relate with.

Ben

Ok, I follow so far

V2Blast

@MikeQ I agree. Meta seems ill-suited to the purpose.

nitsua60

Not really. I'm just barely-coherently bouncing from idea to idea, and can barely hold a complex thought together. I don't want to be responsible for actually processing in a responsible way my input stream.
(My current workflow here seems to be 1. type overly-convoluted thing; 2. re-read for coherence; 3. try to figure out what the heck, if anything, was the context/prompt for the thing I just typed; 4. tab over to something I don't remember opening up; 5. return to chat, see a full entry box, and hit <ENTER>; 6. GOTO 2.)

BESW

@Ben That's all I've got, really. I'd need to come up with more rule-bending features (like double headed) and tweak the X number. Just--do you think it'd be a decent change?

nitsua60

01:08

@MikeQ I can totally see that.

BESW

I'm thinking it might even replace Target as a "don't knock out the little guys too fast" rule.

nitsua60

(WHOOPS)

V2Blast

@nitsua60 I assume you meant to reply to @Shalvenay :P

lol

Ben

Ok, so to clarify, what affects this? Does everyone start with that same X number? And does the Y value come from your cards, or the other players?

Shalvenay

@nitsua60 okiedokie. probably best to catch you either right before or right after Sat's game, provided you're up for that session that is?

nitsua60

01:09

@V2Blast (wonders who'll believe nitsua if they say mis-replying was unintentional.) That was unintentional.

V2Blast

hahaha

nitsua60

@Shalvenay Yeah. I imagine that tomorrow's feeling/coherence will be a strong indicator of... things.

trogdor

@Ben I'm pretty sure he means the X dice are the same number for everyone and doesn't change

And that the Y fluctuates because it's based on how many cards you have

BESW

@Ben Yeah, I'm thinking that X is universal, and Y is from your own cards. That would make your attack and defense ratings the same, which I'm not sure how I feel about--I could make a Y and a Z where Z is the opponent's cards and get more complex with the math but I don't like that.

Ben

Yeah. But what determines the number that it is? Like, what determines the value of 5?

nitsua60

01:11

I'm going to incoherently bug/sidetrack other people for a while. (Teacher's Lounge: prepare to be boarded!)

Hot RPG Questions

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Q: What is the difference between 1/3, 1/2, and full casters?

I saw in a recent answer a reference to 1/3 casters and 1/2 casters, and have never encountered this terminology before: Paladin's are known as 1/2 casters, so their spell progression isn't as big as full casters. What does it mean to be a 1/3 caster vs a 1/2 caster vs a full caster? How d...

dnd-5e terminology spellcasting

BESW

The basic idea is, you start out with lots of rule-bending options but not many dice, and as you lose options (and get closer to death) you get more dice so your agency doesn't diminish.

@Ben Playtesting.

nitsua60

@Ben Peano's axioms. (ducks and runs away)

Ben

@BESW ahhh I see

trogdor

@BESW lol

Ben

01:13

Like a desperation style of thing

And yeah, I don't think the Z is needed.

@nitsua60 that was a bad throw anyway, it certainly went over my head

nitsua60

@Ben It's a pretty deep-dive into number theory:

Peano axioms

In mathematical logic, the Peano axioms, also known as the Dedekind–Peano axioms or the Peano postulates, are axioms for the natural numbers presented by the 19th century Italian mathematician Giuseppe Peano. These axioms have been used nearly unchanged in a number of metamathematical investigations, including research into fundamental questions of whether number theory is consistent and complete. The need to formalize arithmetic was not well appreciated until the work of Hermann Grassmann, who showed in the 1860s that many facts in arithmetic could be derived from more basic facts about th...

Black Spike

@nitsua60 I really wish I'd taken Maths Degree. (option: Pure Maths as a BA, not BSc)

Ben

I do humour, generally on the form of puns and general word play. Haha

nitsua60

@BlackSpike Not sure I'm following: are you saying you did a BA in maths and regret not doing the BS, or vice versa, or something completely different?

Black Spike

@nitsua60 I started on Accouting, ditched it at 1st opportunity as it was dull as all heck, and moved into Computers. left "maths" behind. Shame, I really enjoy numbers

nitsua60

01:22

My son's watching a British show about animal rescues and hospitals; one of the vets' names is Cat. I'm really anticipating an animal-themed episode of Benny Hill to just up and break out.

@BlackSpike Gotcha. Thanks.

Black Spike

@nitsua60 Another option I only learned about too late was combined Maths/philosophy

(but I'm chasing a tangent-bunny. You were talking Game.)

Shalvenay

01:36

hey there @Viishnahn, how're things going?

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay It's going pretty well, despite the fact that I had to leave two gaming groups in two weeks due to the game getting bad

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn awwww :/ what sort of bad? :o

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay First one started off with 5 players, quickly dwindled to 2. One session the DM did nothing but narrate descriptions of empty rooms. Eight rooms, in a row. For two hours.

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn wow, nothing in those rooms whatsoever to be interacted with?

Viishnahn

Second one the DM basically said that he reserves the right to railroad us whenever he feels that it is necessary. And I'm talking "You fall asleep", no dice rolled railroading

nope

Shalvenay

01:39

yeah, that's pretty O.o

Viishnahn

I've had one other GM out of five that hasn't had their game fall apart due to their own choices or inactivity.

I've only been TTRPG'ing for about 2 years now, but I feel like it's been much longer

V2Blast

@Viishnahn I've been doing it for less!

Viishnahn

@V2Blast O.O

you wut m8

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn perhaps we'll have to find a way to play together sometime?

also, weren't you running a campaign of your own at one point? how's that coming along?

V2Blast

@Viishnahn I started playing D&D 5e in November 2017

Viishnahn

01:42

@Shalvenay Once I'm back in school in *looks at watch* a month I might have time

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn ah

Viishnahn

@V2Blast October 2017 myself. How's everything on your end?

V2Blast

@Viishnahn Going pretty well. Haven't heard from my CoS DM in about 2 weeks though :/ Hope everything's okay.

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay It's still going somehow. First ever game, people in and out all over, plenty of big and small mistakes, still have the core two players, though. Had to switch to monthly since I took an internship three hours away.

@V2Blast Yeah, DMs that have communication problems are red flags in my book (no offense meant, I've just gone through a couple lately, so I may be just a bit testy)

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn ah. good to hear it's still going-ish. DW's dwindling somewhat due to scheduling issues, but I did get to take Fellowship for a whirl, so that was cool

V2Blast

01:46

@Viishnahn He's usually pretty good at communicating which is why I'm worried

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay From my brief internet search of the system, it sounds interesting. How do you like it?

@V2Blast Text? Steam/Discord/whatever? FaceBook/Twitter/whatever? Call? Nothing?

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn I like it quite a bit, the playbook choices do limit flexibility somewhat in a sense, but that's something I've found pretty livable as a player so far

(I'd have a bit more trouble with that as a DM though)

V2Blast

@Viishnahn It's an online game. I only have his Discord

Viishnahn

@V2Blast Ah. Can't say that I've done any online play. Hope everything turns out for the best. Are you running any games of your own right now?

V2Blast

@Viishnahn Nah. The only game I DM is with my IRL friend group (Starter Set campaign). Scheduling is the worst. I don't want to deal with this again :P

Viishnahn

01:50

@Shalvenay I can imagine. Letting go of a few things in DW was hard enough, like trying to call for a Discern Realities check without a PC first asking for it

@V2Blast I had a player (twice, he left again) who is a chronically poor communicator. Would infrequently return calls/texts 24+ hours later

Great guy, but good luck getting ahold of him

I actually came in here tonight because I wanted to ask about Eberron and was wondering if there were any present with experience in the setting

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn I have about a dabbler-level experience playing in it, no experience running it

Viishnahn

I'm specifically wondering if it would be better to use 4th Edition rather than 5th for an Eberron campaign due to the high-magic nature of the system and setting, whereas 5th Edition seems to be aimed at lower-magic games.

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn I don't have enough 4e experience to judge that, but it may be worth a shot

Viishnahn

I own some 4th stuff, and I'm not too interested in going back to 3.5 (yet, we'll see in the years to come, I'm sure)

@Shalvenay How much 4th experience do you have?

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn failing miserably at char creation, once.

Viishnahn

01:58

@Shalvenay Fair enough. I got the PHB 1, MM 1, and DMG 1 out of curiousity

Shalvenay

yeah, I really want to gain more experience with non-D&D systems

Viishnahn

It led to a number of houserules that eventually got reverted, but it's really interesting to see the incredibly granular builds you can come up with using different power/feat/weapon combos

Shalvenay

really want to try running Fate again (something based on the House of Bards campaign world, this time)

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay Is Fate an Apocalypse-powered game?

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn oh LOL no. Fate's its own can of fun XD

Viishnahn

02:01

@Shalvenay I've heard them compared, I guess. Is Savage Worlds related to Fate, or am I barking up the wrong tree there, too?

Shalvenay

also, might see about tossing my hat in the ring if BESW and co. are able to get a certain Bubblegumshoe game going (think "teenage sleuths" if you want an idea of the genre)

@Viishnahn totally barking up the wrong tree

Viishnahn

I'm aware of Bubblegumshoe, would love to try sometime

@Shalvenay darn

Shalvenay

Fate's basically a semi-general-purpose narrative development engine -- the base assumptions it makes are that the protagonists (PCs) are competent, dramatic, and proactive

Viishnahn

speaking of BESW

Shalvenay

as a result, the mechanics are both highly generic (it's very much a phrasal system) and focused very heavily on narrative-based conflict resolution

Viishnahn

02:04

I dunno if I should ping him or not, he's pretty greyed out

@Shalvenay Ooo, that's neat

Shalvenay

fate-srd.com if you want more info

it's a massive paradigm shift from say D&D, but also can be quite interesting/useful, lending itself to stuff that's well outside the "normal" scope of TTRPGs (see for ex. Atomic Chef, which is basically built around an alien cooking contest)

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay Not the kind of drama I was expecting from a game, but I'm sure it's got its place somewhere.

What's the pinging etiquette in here? If someone leaves, their portrait leaves too, right?

Shalvenay

not sure

go ahead and ping them if you have something you wish to drop them though, I reckon

Viishnahn

Oh well, maybe he'll get back to me. I know he has quite a bit of 4th experience

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn yeah, stuff like House of Bards (modern political intrigue in a fantasy setting) plays more to stuff we're more used to dealing with :)

Viishnahn

02:09

Hi @BESW, hoping you're awake and around. I've got some D&D questions for you (4th Edition, and Eberron-related)

lol rip

Shalvenay

personally, I want to run what I call "Tabula Rasa" in that system: "you are the folks left after some disaster swept through the palace, wiping out just about the entire ruling class. none of you have bloodlines or any real formal standing to take a position of power: foreign dignitaries, managerial-level civil servants, aristocratic merchants. but here you are, what's left, stuck picking up the pieces and rebuilding the apparatus of gov't, as the old ways were lost in said disaster"

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay So apocalypse-event setting, but with rebuilding instead of living by scavenging, etc.?

inthemanual

I want to play some Fate

I also tried running some bubblegumshoe

that went over excellently

/s

Viishnahn

@inthemanual What happened with that?

Joel Harmon

@nitsua60 Is it because your action is generally better spent doing your own thing? You could swing 2-4 times, or Help your buddy get advantage on one swing. The odds are not in your favor. To really emphasize it, you'd have to either buff helping, or add another action type explicitly for assisting others in some way.

inthemanual

02:14

@Viishnahn lots of things

Joel Harmon

By 'buff helping', I'm leaning toward a Dungeon World style system where the strength of your bond to another impacts how much you help/hinder them.

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn less "society collapses" and more "someone just basically decapitated the gov't and all the contingency plans it had" in the style of the ending of Debt of Honor flowing into the beginning of Executive Orders, if you're familiar with the Jack Ryan novels that is...

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay Afraid not, but I think I'm starting to see the picture

My first instinct is to ask why someone would bother to go that far

Shalvenay

part of the idea is that life outside the palace still goes on: the traders are still trading and the craftsfolk crafting, the farmers tending their crops and the ranchers their herds, town guards are still mostly coming to their posts and soldiers reporting for patrols in the outskirts....

Viishnahn

What are the nobles doing? Foreign dignitaries? Royal servants, guards, etc.?

Shalvenay

02:19

@Viishnahn one mental image I had was Red Wedding-ish, just writ larger and less lopsidedly score-wise? of course, it can just as easily be a something vs. a someone

inthemanual

an inappropriate player kept sidelining things and trying to steal all the attention. his "secretly gay" character was nothing but mockery and innuendo.

Another player wanted to emphasize the cliques everyone had placed themselves into, and wouldn't communicate with anyone in a different clique.

Everyone else except maybe one or two players just didn't care about the mystery as presented and chose to just roleplay as annoying high schoolers talking shit and gossiping about each other.

Shalvenay

maybe a few servants and guards survive, as well as possibly a dignitary or the like who winds up in the party

inthemanual

@shalvenay uprising by the working class? teh servants orchestrate the "red wedding" against the rich?

Viishnahn

@inthemanual Oof. Were these new RP'ers?

Shalvenay

@inthemanual I was thinking that this was less of an insurgent-type "storm the castle" rebellion -- wouldn't yield the kind of framing for the aftermath I am after

inthemanual

02:22

new to non-D&D RP

Viishnahn

@inthemanual Hmm, nothing special about RP in D&D, really. Were they this way in that too?

inthemanual

@Shalvenay not so much storming the castle, just poisoning the soup to change the people in power

Viishnahn

Welcome @KorvinStarmast

Shalvenay

@inthemanual yeah, same problem: I'm not just looking to change the who, I'm trying to frame a scenario where the systems and structures of power and governance have to change, because there's no rebuilding what was

KorvinStarmast

@nitsua60 As an analagous challenge, try writing a seven page briefing for a Turkish Admiral while one is drunk after a NATO luncheon. I feel for you. Long Live Good Meds

@Viishnahn Hello! Cheers!

inthemanual

02:24

@Viishnahn chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/11?m=51153870#51153870

@Shalvenay poison a lot of soup

Shalvenay

@inthemanual hrm, that could work for the disaster as well

inthemanual

@Viishnahn clique quy is the hyperfocuser, inappropriate player is the "gruesome" guy

Viishnahn

@inthemanual I see. This was in-person?

KorvinStarmast

@nitsua60 there is no downside to that. (says a two time dad)

inthemanual

@Viishnahn yes.

KorvinStarmast

02:28

@BESW Oh yes you should have. I read the doc and there's some goodness in there. Let is sit for a while and come to it with fresh eyes.

Viishnahn

@inthemanual Too bad to hear, sounds like you had some decent folk that might have just needed some encouragement to speak up for themselves a little more. Maybe you can do more stuff with them and find a way to discuss behavior change or leaving with the others.

inthemanual

@Viishnahn progress was made, but schedules conflicted, group fell apart, you all know how that goes.

Viishnahn

@inthemanual Much too well, I'm afraid

Shalvenay

@inthemanual in fact, I could see how this could work out as sort of a "hybrid" idea -- the soup/punch/... gets spiked with something that basically turns everyone there at each other's throats

Viishnahn

But hey, you gave it a go

@Shalvenay Paranoia soup

all at once, or over time so it's not noticed?

Shalvenay

02:32

@Viishnahn over a short-ish span of time (maybe an hour or two) -- enough that the tasters don't notice anything amiss

inthemanual

True. I'd just like to give it another go. we'll see how the group's schedules start to line up again soon

Viishnahn

@Shalvenay Oh, I was talking about potentially days or weeks

@inthemanual Yeah! I hope it works out :)

Shalvenay

@Viishnahn ah. if the event was something that long-form, that could work

Viishnahn

might be going out on a limb here, but worth a shot
Hey @KorvinStarmast, do you have much experience with Eberron or 4th Edition D&D?

inthemanual

Or perhaps to have some fate/bgs/anoter non-d&d system play myself so that I can be a better guiding hand for the group as to how it's all "supposed to work"

Viishnahn

02:36

@inthemanual I've only ever tried running something other than D&D (DW, specifically) once myself. I feel you.

BESW

02:51

@Viishnahn I'm in the middle of some heavy stuff. Ask your questions and I'll respond when I'm able.

Viishnahn

@BESW Ah yeah, keep up the good work on your new game! I was just wondering if you had any experience playing in or running D&D in Eberron. I think using 4th Edition would be better for the high-magic inclination of both system and setting, since 5th Edition is typically used for lower-magic games.

nitsua60

03:04

Aug 13 '18 at 19:46, by Mike Q

@ColinGross The DC of scheduling a regular D&D game for 4 adults is "Impossible", +5 per additional adult

V2Blast

accurate

trogdor

Seems legit

nitsua60

@Viishnahn I'd... wait a couple months before making that decision, if that's workable?

(maybe up to a year, actually... I'm a little hazy on some time0things.)

Viishnahn

@nitsua60 Are you talking about Wayfinder's Guide?

@nitsua60 Can confirm

V2Blast

I think Wayfinder's Guide will be finalized soonish, and there's also a different hardcover Eberron book coming out this year

Viishnahn

03:11

@V2Blast I would be pleasantly surprised should it be so soon. You're right, I forgot about that other book. Isn't that supposed to be a module or something?

V2Blast

@Viishnahn Unclear, they haven't announced many details on the hardcover

inthemanual

@nitsua60 the DC is reduced slightly by one of them being a teacher and pretty freely availale in summer months, and another being a student with similar openness.

nitsua60

Maybe. Not trying to be cagey, I legitimately don't know, just do know that some time (not likely more than a year) might help, if you're not in a rush.
On a completely unrelated note, I occasionally playtest WotC products well in advance of their publication, and it's hard to keep track of the sequencing of what's out ad what's coming and what pieces of playtest are destined for what products. Just a little sharing-time, no relation to the previous topic.

V2Blast

But Crawford mentioned in yesterday's Dragon+ that artificer was being revised after UA feedback and that the next time we'd see it would be in a book (dunno if he explicitly mentioned the hardcover)

he then also confirmed on Twitter that it'd appear in WGtE: twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/1154155211620884485

> Twitter user: You said during the last D+ that Artificer will be added to a new book. Does that mean it won't still be added to WGtE as an update like Mearls & Baker said it would?

> Crawford: We still plan to add the artificer to the Wayfinder's Guide.

Viishnahn

@nitsua60 I'm in no rush, I just like to plan early so that I've done some research if I need to change things around later.

nitsua60

03:14

Understand--I like to let things simmer a while, too =)

Viishnahn

I'm just wondering if 5E's lower-magic design mentality won't work against the ubiquitous nature of magic in (parts of) Eberron.

inthemanual

I never understood 5e as a low magic setting or system

Viishnahn

I picked up the 4th Edition Eberron Campaign Guide and like most of what I see. Obviously, there's assumptions about markets for magical items, certain wealth levels, and so on, but it totally fits with Eberron.

@inthemanual The bounded accuracy system doesn't necessitate +X magic weapons and/or armor to stay competitive as enemy challenge increases in 5th Edition. 3/3.5/4 all did that.

inthemanual

lack of necessity doesn't necessarily equate with a lack of availablity.

Viishnahn

The 4th Edition PHB has lists and prices for magic items - 5th edition moved that (and made prices very ambiguous) to the DMG

inthemanual

03:22

okay, so its comparatively less, but that still doesn't mean that it's "low"

V2Blast

@inthemanual Yeah, it pretty much lets the DM make it as high- or as low-magic as they want

(within certain thresholds, of course, given the magical abilities of casters)

Hot RPG Questions

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Q: How much damage does a magic stone cause when hurled from a sling?

There appear to be two plausible interpretations. The magic stone’s effect amplifies and thereby replaces the regular damage of the stone hurled by the sling. The sling is hurling the stone at high velocity causing regular damage and the spells effect is that it causes it’s damage (additional)....

dnd-5e spells damage ranged-attack

kviiri

05:14

Fire in the Lake was fun and surprisingly smooth

It was quite similar to Cuba Libre except more more and more stuff. I would've been fine with less though, being a mellow man of moderation.

I did win through a risky gambit that almost failed me. It's always with these games where the objective is to "be over threshold when card X comes up" that one wants to avoid springing their positions too early to avoid prolonged defensive positions but also never too late because that's even worse.

I did spring it too early, and then I had the most experienced player of the three others basically telling everyone what to do so I'd lose. They tried. :)

trogdor

Sounds like an interesting game

kviiri

05:37

It has this interesting coopetition thing going on. US and ARVN are friendly to each other, as are NVA and VC. There's still only one winner, but friendly factions are rather limited in their options against their "team mate".

trogdor

Huh

kviiri

The game, including setup, took over four hours tho. On "short game" mode.

trogdor

Oh ouch

That's a lot of time

That's approaching RISK levels

I've never managed to finish Risk

No one wants to keep playing after it's been 5 hours and no one has definitely won yet

XD

Maybe my family is just too stubborn

kviiri

Risk was one of those games I saw some older kids play and I was soooo jealous. Then I finally got to play it myself, and I didn't like it :P

trogdor

Oh I love it

kviiri

05:47

Good that the world has taught me envy is a folly at a young age.

trogdor

Unfortunately most other people don't

kviiri

@trogdor I think it might have layers child me neglected though, like the "guess your opponents' objectives" minigame.

trogdor

Also it takes a ridiculous amount of time on which everyone has to keep playing it

@kviiri yeah, plus you always want to stop others from getting a full continent, or expanding too quickly yourself

And use choke points effectively

kviiri

@trogdor Winning too much gets one smashed

trogdor

Well technically Winning is good

But you can choose to stop attacking at any time

kviiri

05:50

Yes :D

trogdor

And you do that for at least two reasons

You don't want more land than you can hold with your reinforcement

And defenders have advantage

So attacking weak spots close by is usually good, but carving out more land In a wide area isn't as great

Jasmine

Hi everyone

Is this for discussion of role playing games

MikeQ

@Jasmine Among other things, yes. Welcome!

trogdor

Yes indeed

Jasmine

Which is the best role playing game

trogdor

05:54

We do stray a bit off topic rather often but RPGs are the purpose of the room

Lol

Best

MikeQ

Your imagination is the best role playing game! ♫♫♫

trogdor

XD

The game called Life

Jasmine

I really like telltale game series

@trogdor cool

MikeQ

Anyhow, when it comes to video games, the term "RPG" is used so broadly that it's hard to pin down any specific definition

Jasmine

@MikeQ indeed

V2Blast

06:01

Aug 7 '18 at 20:02, by doppelgreener

At least for this chat, going by its history, the most off-topic thing anyone's probably asked in here was a tabletop RPG question.

jcm

@Jasmine 'best' how? What are you looking for in a game?

Jasmine

@V2Blast lol

kviiri

Hi and welcome o/

Jasmine

@jcm In a game I look for adventure , good quality display , strong storyline , it is the ' best ' if it feels realistic

kviiri

@Jasmine We are mostly about tabletop RPGs here, but I think some of us have a pretty solid CRPG ("computer role playing game") experience too

I don't number among them though :P

jcm

06:10

@Jasmine 'good quality display' we're talking about video games then? I loved Morrowind. It's pretty old but the lore and storyline are excellent.

MikeQ

@jcm I was going to suggest Morrowind. The modding community is still active and there are plenty of graphic mods to make it look more up-to-date.

jcm

@MikeQ every few months I get an urge to check how the Tamriel Rebuilt project is going and to reinstall the game. Sadly I currently don't have the hardware/time to play.

MikeQ

@Jasmine If you like JRPGs, there's Golden Sun 1 & 2, the Persona series (I recommend 4 & 5), and some of the Tales of... games were pretty ok

@Jasmine There's also Super Mario RPG and Paper Mario 1 & 2, all good choices there. Not particularly realistic, but the writing and gameplay were fun.

jcm

My copy of Morrowind GotY is in another country. Time to think about having someone send it over.

@MikeQ My workmate also loved MW and had good things to say about Oblivion and Skyrim as well. Never played those two. What's your opinion?

MikeQ

@jcm Gameplay-wise, more fun. Story-wise, Oblivion has some well-written sidequests. Skyrim had more exciting combat but the writing was mostly bleh. Overall I enjoyed them all, especially messing with the AI.

Miniman

06:21

I will say that while the core gameplay might have gotten more fun, it also lost everything that made it unique.

jcm

Ooh, sad to hear that about Skyrim. Story is the main thing that motivates me.

Miniman

Spellcrafting, alchemy, awesome mechanics like levitate - they basically got rid of everything that you could potentially use to break the game.

Which is understandable, but the lack of artificial walls was one of the coolest things about Morrowind.

kviiri

I liked Morrowind for a while, but it had an unfortunate problem of crashing frequently on my computer so I never got too deep into it.

jcm

I once RPed a MW character who wouldn't craft nor use enchanted items because they abhorred the idea of soul gems.

(I still do abhor the idea)

kviiri

I eventually realized the gameplay has problems that pain me in all the wrong ways, but I really enjoy the setting not being "yet another fantasy Anglo-Saxony" but rather mixing various aesthetics and cultural themes.

MikeQ

06:25

@jcm Skyrim's thieves guild and assassins guild storylines were okay, plus the vampire and daedra DLC, but the core game's main story seemed kinda lazy

jcm

I guess the AlmSiVi vs Dagoth Ur was so well-written (IMO) that it would be tough to follow.

kviiri

I wish I could get into Morrowind again but the level-up mechanic currently irks me way too bad

jcm

A lot of the mechanics are sooo easy to abuse

kviiri

I am prone to analysis paralysis and find some relief in games that allow respeccing, or at least have order-invariant level-up choices. Eg. taking upgrade A at level 2 and upgrade B at level 3 results in a L3 character with the same specs as taking those the other way around. Morrowind doesn't do that --- increasing one's constitution has a cumulative effect on all levels past that, making buffing con early disproportionately good.

jcm

On another topic, I've made it clear through NPC interactions that it would be a very bad idea for the party to stray off the path in the forest they're about to enter. How do I 'engineer' things so they'll *want* to go off the path?

@kviiri a bit of FOMO, perhaps?

MikeQ

06:33

@jcm Present a better incentive to stray from the path.

kviiri

@jcm just analysis paralysis. I'm also annoyed by the incentives to perform mindless busywork like jumping everywhere to buff the ever-useful Acrobatics skill

jcm

@MikeQ if there were a Round Table-like Paladin a hint of adventure might be enough but the party is very cautious.

@kviiri hahaha I read somewhere about pointing your character at a wall, holding the key down with some object, and then leaving to go do something else.

If any of you are Kara, Nix, Morn, Tealeaf, or Phojeff let me know!!!

MikeQ

@jcm Then don't make it a hint. Be very clear about it, that straying from the path would be a better idea than staying on it.

jcm

Stay on the path: safe but not very adventurous
Stray off the path: fame, glory, and mortal danger!

MikeQ

Also, if you've clued in-game that they should stay on the forest path, then why do you need them to stray from it anyway?

(This reminds me of a section in Rise of the Runelords, where the party is expected to investigate a random clue in the woods, and that's the only lead into an unrelated but important story arc)

jcm

06:53

So the forest is fey-haunted, and the fey in this part of the world are very dangerous. So smart thing is to stay on the path (it's a cargo-culted rule in the are that's only vaguely understood but it mostly works). I'd like to put an optional side-quest that takes place only if I can get the party to stray.

so for the main quest the questgiver would love for them to keep on the path. If they missed the optional content I'd be a bit disappointed but I'd get over it.

kviiri

Well the classical example is that there's a Scream of Distress from outside the path. But the problem is, stories where this is invoked often make it clear straying was a mistake (the scream is all too often just a decoy). If your players are shy of danger and genre-savvy as they usually are, they won't go for it.

MikeQ

@kviiri This is what they did in Runelords as mentioned above. It's a sudden random spooky sound in some spooky woods. Not a strong incentive to follow it.

Jasmine

@jcm ok I will have a check

kviiri

If you want to railroad them off the path, you could make the path itself a trap. Maybe it forms a space defying curve that connects back to itself in an infinite loop.

MikeQ

@jcm You've communicated to your players to do X, and now you want them to maybe do the opposite. Perhaps it would be easier to have the sidequest come to them instead, such as the clue or NPC wandering onto their path?

kviiri

06:57

@MikeQ Having the clue be a scream of distress works particularly well though, because it serves as a moment where heroes get to show off they care more about the helping strangers than evading dangers

Jasmine

thanks @jcm @MikeQ for the suggestions lets see how it goes

BESW

@Viishnahn I do think that of the D&D editions, 4e would probably be best for an Eberron campaign. This is because 4e does not distinguish, mechanically, between magical, supernatural, mundane, and technically-mundane-but-obviously-not-actually-possible-IRL effects.

Eberron is also big on blurring those distinctions more than most systems/settings in D&D, so they go together nicely.

Other systems demand ignoring, redefining, or augmenting, their existing mechanical systems because which mechanical suite you use to resolve an effect is determined by the magical/non-magical nature of the effect's origin. 4e doesn't give a h*ck.

V2Blast

"If you were told you are playing in a homebrew world, what questions would you ask the DM?" (a /r/dndnext thread)

on a different note, has there been a question here about how Guardian of Faith interacts with resistance/vulnerability?

nvm, found it:

20

Q: How much damage can the Guardian of Faith spell deal?

The guardian of faith spell description states that it disappears after it has dealt a total of 60 points of damage. There are two things about that which I am questioning: What about creatures which are vulnerable, resistant or immune to radiant damage? Do you factor in the amount of damage i...

dnd-5e spells damage

BESW

@Viishnahn HOWEVER. If you're willing to look outside D&D for a system, there are other options which might be even better because Eberron is a setting that has been settled more than the traditional D&D setting: there's more established and interconnected society to interact with as the meaningful focus of stories, so I think a system which more mechanics for social and faction interaction would be preferable.

For 4e-specific advice... there's an Eberron handbook that I'm not super familiar with except that it has one of the most coveted feats in the entire edition.

If you want a low-magic sense (and just to simplify 4e bookkeeping) I'd recommend using the low-magic-item variant from 4e's Dark Sun handbook. It replaces constantly upgrading magic items with regular increased automatic bonuses, so that magic items become useful for the extra features they grant rather necessary for their numerical additions.

Level 1 Equivalent Damage and Stalker0's Alternate Core Skill Challenge System are quality-of-life changes I'd recommend for any 4e campaign.

@BESW Low-magic isn't what I meant here. Rather, the sense that there's a lot of magic around but it's mostly casual.

Derpy

07:19

@kviiri I think there was a mod that "fixed" that (or at least attempted to). It worked by recalculating your stats completely every level. Only bad result - because of that you more often than not ended up somewhat stronger than average since basically the mod reapplied any bonus (like the const one) as you gained it at level 1

Pierre Cathé

07:33

Morning

V2Blast

@PierreCathé ello

nitsua60

08:42

@V2Blast How much are we/how will we be involved in its creation and fleshing-out? (Which answer will inform whether or not I participate.)

@BESW I've run homebrew where literally every sentient being had at least a cantrip. Do you mean that sort of thing?

BESW

@nitsua60 Kinda. Eberron is a setting where low-level practical magic is industrialized (magic lampposts, elemental-powered trains) but high-level individual magic is largely missing.

nitsua60

Right. Ubiquity, that is.

BESW

It's aiming for a kind of magisteamdieselpunkesque world.

nitsua60

sans actual punk, or actual punk?

BESW

From the Wiki:

> The Eberron Campaign Setting sourcebook lists the following movies as inspirations for Eberron's tone and attitude: Brotherhood of the Wolf, Casablanca, From Hell, The Maltese Falcon, The Mummy, The Name of the Rose, Pirates of the Caribbean, Raiders of the Lost Ark and Sleepy Hollow.

Society- and tone-wise, it's aiming for a noir post-WWI tone.

nitsua60

08:50

(Not trying to cast aspersions on those what would adopt the aesthetic of -punk while eschewing (or being unaware of) the philosophy of -punk. just trying to be precise. At 5am.)

BESW

No worries, I've got plenty of aspersions to cast there.

trogdor

09:04

lol

Derpy

09:26

morning.

Been reading the latest "changes" on SO... what a nice climate of hate we carefully crafted. Must be proud of us. At least I can still come here and don't see people throwing chairs at each other

BESW

I'll just keep my head tucked into this nice little cozy spot and slowly transfer people to Discord so I'll have friends when this finally burns.

@Derpy Have you seen my new playtest-ready game? [gestures at pinned star]

Derpy

09:42

@BESW yep, I have actually even read it :P

BESW

[kermitflail]

Derpy

Didn't had time to actually reflect on it. Out of the blue the only thing that came to mind while I was reading the WIP rules is that I don't know if the fact that the story is random can penalize too much certain toys and advantage too much others.

But since the game doesn't seem to really be competitive I guess that should be "not-a-problem"

BESW

I figure it's an incentive for the players to push the game toward their particular specialties, which leads to a more free-wheeling story.

I dunno about anybody else, but when I was a kid having a certain kind of toy in a game meant that toy's context got added to the story whether it was strictly coherent or not.

kviiri

@BESW One of the best parts of childhood imagination was being able to make p-much anything feel coherent enough to enjoy

BESW

Aye.

Derpy

09:54

@BESW So you are telling me that Captain Harlock was just the childhood memory of a boy that wanted to play space marines but only had pirate action figures :P ?

BESW

I've seen at least one RPG based on that exact concept.

trogdor

lol

vicky_molokh

10:15

@Derpy What are the changes aside of slightly different display of read/posted/etc. values of a thread?

Derpy

@vicky_molokh Removed the Hot Meta Questions feature. Now question will have to be manually featured by mod. You can see the alleged reasons here , but I think that the actual reasons are the one that another staff member pointed out in her reply

V2Blast

@nitsua60 Oooh, good question

Derpy

And if you are interested, I actually took some time to write a reply here

Derpy

10:38

in extreme synthesis, I find the fact that one actual staff member posted this line

> Stack Overflow Employees have panic attacks and nightmares when they know they will need to post something to Meta

extremely bad, either way you read it

Had she made it up, it is an horrible lie to say. And if it is true, it is still horrible that we have actually got so far.

Either way, it implies that the staff<->community relationship is utterly broken and may as well be past any hope of recover

kviiri

I have no reason to doubt it, tbh.

Derpy

Oh, I didn't meant to imply either outcome, quite the opposite - I purposely avoided to make any assumption on that line. My only concern is that either way you want to read it, the trust is still broken, shattered and currently being feasted upon by a pack of hell hounds

Sdjz

10:54

@kviiri those 2 comments 10 seconds apart saying almost the same thing :)

Ludoss

11:04

Where do I ask idea generating questions?

Sdjz

@Ludoss You've come to the right place!

kviiri

Yeah, we don't have the Q&A format restrictions here on chat so feel free to ask them here :)

(welcome!)

Ludoss

11:26

Yes, I'm working on a adventure for my homebrew campaign. I want to start it in a village near a large town. What kind of encounter can there be? There are a lot of farms there and a forest. In the forest is an old battlefield.

The Oracle

1

Q: Proposal to reboot our forum list

Our list of forums gets used in comments quite frequently, including by yours truly --- however, while I like describing it as "our curated list of forums", many of the answers there haven't been updated in ages. This means that statements pertaining to various features like activity, moderation ...

discussion

Sdjz

@Ludoss Do you have Xanathar's Guide to Everything?

Ludoss

No, I dont have

I am not even sure if I want to run the game with dnd5

Sdjz

@Ludoss Hm I can't say I know much about non-D&D family games but what did you want your game to be focused on? Can you tell us a bit about what you are planning?

kviiri

@Ludoss You do want a combat encounter, though, so it sounds like you're still aiming for something reasonably fantasy combat-oriented like DnD usually is?

Ludoss

11:39

I want it a High Fantasy campaign. At the moment I have some setting ideas: ruined land in the west, the autumn forest, brimstone dwarves, like that. It should be a band of adventures explore the worlds. Have some encounter, the whole story arc in the village should be 5 session.

not only combat encounters. I want a rich varity of enc.

KorvinStarmast

@Viishnahn No I do not, sorry.

MikeQ

@Ludoss Have you asked the players what sort of challenges they may want to encounter?

Ludoss

@MikeQ No, I haven't, because the most other players don't have enough time to talk about the game-

They don't like to talk about meta questions either.

kviiri

Huh, that sounds a bit worrysome

Ludoss

Why that?

kviiri

11:54

Not having the time to talk about the game, and being unwilling to discuss meta stuff easily leads to conflicting expectations

MikeQ

Plus it's going to be tricky coming up with content for your players if they haven't given any preferences

vicky_molokh

@Derpy Even though I'm new to this, I've certainly found a thing or two which I would deem big warning signs, like the Twitter-is-more-powerful-than-meta affair on another exchange. That's one example that I think is hard to repair short of giving the users more direct power over these things.

Ludoss

Ah, okay, sometimes the players give short feedback what they like and dislike.

there is just little feedback.

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