Root Access

Burgi

2:01 PM

@Bob what does this mean?

> Free snags and everyone’s keeping their distance?

MyDaftQuestions

Is it possible to use Autohotkey to click the YES from a UAC dialog?

Or does the UAC message (or the operation) prevent the interaction from scripts etc

Bob

@Burgi snags = sausages, especially on a bbq

user226528

@MyDaftQuestions No.

Bob

@Burgi And the joke is aussies should be going for the snags, not ignoring/avoiding them :P

Burgi

@Bob ah!

MyDaftQuestions

2:02 PM

Cool, I felt not from what I've tried and looked up but it's nice to get it confirmed. Thank you @FleetCommand

allquixotic

@MyDaftQuestions depends on how it's set -- on Windows 10 (and 8.1? not sure) there's a specific UAC setting where you can lower the "security" of the UAC prompts by making them display as regular pop-ups on your desktop as-is

Bob

@MyDaftQuestions Kiiiiiiiiiiiinda.

If you run AHK with uiaccess privileges then it can interact with even the high-security UAC prompts.

allquixotic

but when you have the security up on high, it switches to a separate "secure desktop" which does not accept any interaction whatsoever from programs on your main desktop unless you do what Bob just said

user226528

@MyDaftQuestions Microsoft deliberately did it to prevent malware from requesting elevation and then elevating themselves by clicking on yes.

Bob

docs.microsoft.com/en-us/previous-versions/windows/it-pro/…

MyDaftQuestions

2:03 PM

Yes, I see

user226528

Yeah. Good luck doing that.

MyDaftQuestions

I have an AHK script which basically opens up a file with admin privileges. I have to manually click the Yes with the UAC, was wondering if that can be automated too. It's not a hardship to click the Yes button :)

user226528

You need a digital signature from Microsoft for that.

Bob

> UIA programs are designed to interact with Windows and application programs on behalf of a user. This policy setting allows UIA programs to bypass the secure desktop to increase usability in certain cases; however, allowing elevation requests to appear on the interactive desktop instead of the secure desktop can increase your security risk.

MyDaftQuestions

Thank @Bob for link

allquixotic

2:04 PM

that setting is a plain old, ordinary popup that AHK can handle without any special permissions

Bob

@MyDaftQuestions The correct solution is to run AHK itself as admin. Then the program it launches would inherit this privileges. Of course, this means you must secure your AHK script (e.g. prevent modifications), else it can be used as a privilege escalation path.

user226528

Oh, that might work.

allquixotic

that setting (and the top one) switch to the secure desktop

MyDaftQuestions

Clever idea @Bob

I will have a play. Thank you everyone

allquixotic

apparently some graphics drivers (e.g., the Kaby Lake i7 IGP + Nvidia GTX 1060 on my Alienware 13 R3, for example) have serious performance issues with switching to the secure desktop

user226528

2:06 PM

I once read that the only truely secure UAC setting is the top one.

allquixotic

that's why there's that lower level setting

Bob

@FleetCommand No you don't. You need a digital (authenticode) signature, but it doesn't ahve to be signed by Microsoft. i.e. you never need t osubmit the binary to MS. AFAICT.

allquixotic

I'm gonna be perfectly honest, I exclusively run my systems at the bottom level, which is to disable UAC entirely... I keep a clean system; if rogue processes start popping up on my system, I'm owned even if I click "No" to the popups because they can start encrypting and/or uploading my user data (the stuff I can usually access normally) even without escalating

Bob

@allquixotic That actually used to be a common issue when Vista was first released.

You'd spend literally minutes waiting for the switch, on an otherwise fast computer.

user226528

@Bob That's exactly what I thought when I purchased that $400 digital certificate from Symantec.

allquixotic

2:08 PM

@Bob yeah well a Q2 2017 full-fat gaming laptop running W10 v1709 still has that issue with a December 2017 graphics driver (both Intel and Nvidia), last I checked

Bob

@FleetCommand That's still you signing the binaries, not Microsoft.

allquixotic

not minutes though.... more like 6 seconds

user226528

@Bob Elaborate please

Bob

@FleetCommand You run signtool. You don't upload the unsigned binary to MS and download a signed copy.

The certificate belongs to you.

It has your name on it.

user226528

Yeah. But you need a special certificate from Microsoft for UIAccess to work.

allquixotic

2:10 PM

code signing certificates of EXEs is like PKI for executables (with a trust chain and all that) as far as I know... it's TLS for EXEs, sorta

Bob

This is distinct from an application that is literally signed by Microsoft, which is a yet higher level.

user226528

It is a $400 lesson that I learned.

Bob

@FleetCommand You need an Authenticode cert, which is a fairly general code-signing cert for Windows (and can be had a lot cheaper than $400, btw)

I don't think uiAccess needs a higher level than the standard certs

DavidPostill

Hmm.

-4

Q: Mac is being compromised help please

So forgive me if I'm posting this in wrong section. But I need answers and some help bad. My real nice guy ex biz partner decided he didn't like us splitting ways. So he has made it his mission to crash computers and in hopes lose my head and eventually everything I have. Ok so I can see him in t...

user226528

@Bob Well, you should.

Bob

2:11 PM

I think there is a higher level but that's only for drivers?

Yea, kernel mode drivers (as of 1607) require an EV code signing cert

allquixotic

> tteansmitting

@Bob even that doesn't require Microsoft to review and approve your code as non-malicious or something, though

DavidPostill

I'm sure I've similar crap before ...

user226528

Also, the app that has UIAccess = true must run from a protected location, like Program Files.

allquixotic

basically at no point is anyone going to look at your code and say "Yep, that's legitimate" or "No, you're trying to be a hacker" as part of getting your code signed, unless you want to get WHQL certified

Bob

@allquixotic Yea, I think UEFI binaries are the exception.

That's one that actually needs to be signed by a MS cert directly

(or you can add your own cert root to the machine key store, of course)

allquixotic

2:15 PM

@Bob I think UEFI binaries only need to be signed if you want to do secure boot

Bob

@allquixotic ya, if you want to do SB and you can't add your own cert and you can't use one of the existing presigned shims

user226528

@allquixotic Okay, this rings a bell. I actually was aiming to get certified for displaying the Windows logo.

user226528

Back then, Authenticode certs were very expensive.

Bob

@FleetCommand For comparison, Digicert charges $178/yr for a normal code signing cert, and $331/yr for an EV cert

user226528

I know but back then, Symantec charged $400. A week later, I discovered Comodo charged only $80.

Bob

2:17 PM

EV certs are only required for drivers, AFAIK. Never for normal programs (including uiAccess)

@FleetCommand ...your first mistake was using Symantec

(I've been telling people that for years :P)

see starwall ==========>

user226528

Fortunately, that wasn't my mistake. I did it under duress.

allquixotic

the big, old world CAs like Digicert, Symantec, Thawte, Verisign, etc. are waaaaay overpriced compared to the new kids like AlphaSSL, even Comodo

user226528

And they don't sell software signing certs anymore. Only SSL certs.

allquixotic

to say nothing of StartSSL if/when they ever get back on their feet (or continue to depend on Spain)

Bob

Comodo seems to do $166 and $299 (EV)

user226528

2:19 PM

(And these SSL certs are not used for SSL either. TLS.)

Bob

Certum is the absolute cheapest now, I think

user226528

Microsoft no longer gives certificates for Windows logo, because now it has its own freaking store.

Bob

completely free for open source

user226528

O.o

user226528

That's not bad.

Bob

2:20 PM

oh wait it's €28 now :\

allquixotic

startcomca.com/index/News/newDetail?date=20171116

Bob

used to be free a few years back

allquixotic

wait, what? they went through all that trouble to get Camerfirma (Spain) to sign for them and now they're discontinuing?

yet it looks like I can order a cert from the homepage

Bob

@FleetCommand If by "they" you mean Symantec, they don't sell any certs anymore.

Considering the whole impending distrust from all browsers.

user226528

@Bob No. All of the old-timers

Bob

2:21 PM

@FleetCommand Digicert still does code-signing.

Thawte and Verisign are Symantec, I think.

user226528

I don't see anything on Digicert. Linky?

Bob

oh, lookee. Symantec actually sold their cert business to Digicert.

So it's basically a single big player left over

@FleetCommand digicert.com/code-signing and digicert.com/code-signing/ev-code-signing

Comodo is big-ish I guess

allquixotic

GlobalSign

GlobalSign is a WebTrust-certified certificate authority (CAs) and provider of Identity Services. Founded in Belgium in 1996 the company offers a diverse range of Identity service solutions. == Services == GlobalSign provides PKI and Identity and Access Management services to provide enterprises with a platform to manage internal and external identities for the Internet of Everything. The services allow organizations to deploy secure e-services, manage employee and extended enterprise identities and automate PKI deployments for users, mobile, and machines. GlobalSign's identity and access...

Bob

At least we have Let's Encrypt to keep them honest for TLS certs

allquixotic

they're pretty big, and have a good reputation

my AlphaSSL cert is backed by GlobalSign and it was quite affordable

user226528

2:24 PM

@Bob Those are in Dollars not Euros.

Bob

@FleetCommand Yea?

The Euros mentioned earlier were for Certum.

@allquixotic Startcom is a sad story :\

They had a decent thing going, and then sold to WoSign

Took them quite a few years to be accepted as a root CA too

allquixotic

@Bob WoSign's reputation is so poor... it's like, your purpose for doing business is to be trustworthy, then you run your business like a child playing with play-doh

no idea why anyone would do business with them

user226528

@Bob Dollar is for US only, you know. (Have you never heard of a phenomenon called Donald Trump?) Do they have a website for EU region?

Bob

@FleetCommand What? Pretty sure they're not geo-restricted.

allquixotic

most good payment providers will do currency exchange for you

Bob

2:26 PM

You can pay in USD from European countries, y'know :P

user226528

... if I manage to buy one

user226528

Correction: I could.

Bob

@allquixotic Even if they don't, the credit card provider will.

PayPal, Amazon, etc. will do currency exchange (and charge for it, ~5%)

Credit cards (Amex, Visa, Mastercard) will also do currency exchange. Usually 3%.

user226528

Argh! Digicert.eu is not responding anymore.

Bob

If you've got a good card, that can be 1.5% or even 0%

allquixotic

2:28 PM

@Bob I'm confused by their peace out message, though: I can't tell if they're continuing to do business as a reseller or intermediate CA of Camerfirma or if they're completely shutting down everything except for their OCSP servers

Bob

@allquixotic Either way, they're effectively dead

the name is poison now

user226528

Of course, there were times that I could access domains that never existed because my dumbass DNS was providing a typo correction service.

Bob

free certs won't win many people over anymore

and they'd have to be ridiculously cheap

@FleetCommand Symantec is also a US company, so... yea.

allquixotic

yeah but if you can get a product out of them (even the paid ones) and it's signed by Camerfirma, then pending any hack / bad business practices on Camerfirma's part, it'd be at least a good cert

@Bob people who want free but can't figure out LE autorenew?

user226528

Wasn't planning to buy from Symantec anyway, now that I am not under duress.

Bob

2:29 PM

@allquixotic technically, yes, but they'll have trouble finding customers

allquixotic

or whose app simply doesn't support it

Bob

@allquixotic approx. as dodgy as startcom/camerfirma: gogetssl.com/comodo-ssl/comodo-free-ssl

:P

oh wait the description says it's 90 days

allquixotic

I won't pay money for a cert that doesn't last at least 2 years, as a general rule. If I needed EV (I don't) I'd probably go with Comodo. I'm slowly coming around to the idea of using LE as my primary cert provider for any endpoint where I'm able to get certbot autorenew working successfully.

Bob

@allquixotic yea, the only other one I'm doing is mumble... to be honest, the 90 day expiry hasn't really been an issue, surpirsingly

everything else is on certbot or letsencrypt-simple (windows)

Blog bot

Remote Work in the 2017 Developer Survey

Julia Silge on January 22, 2018

The 2018 Stack Overflow Developer Survey is open right now, and we on the Data Team are eagerly awaiting this year’s data so we can uncover new insights about the worldwide developer community. Every year, we learn interesting things, whether that’s about student developers’ attitudes toward industries or fictional representations of coders. I work remotely, along with the majority of the technical employees here at Stack Overflow, so before we have new survey data to explore, let’s take one more dive into the 2017 data to see what we can learn about developers who work remotely. …

bwDraco

2:44 PM

roar

WTF. T-Mobile gave me an "all circuits are busy now" message while trying to place a call.

Bob

lol

DavidPostill

@bwDraco downdetector.com/status/t-mobile/map

NY is currently covered by a strange orange cloud :)

djsmiley2k

lul

as is most of the east coast

some kinda wositt outbreak going on?

DavidPostill

Recent reports mostly originate from: Mountain View, New York, Brooklyn, Los Angeles, Seattle, Houston, Chicago, Apo, San Antonio, and Honolulu.

allquixotic

@DavidPostill reports of what? T-mobile outage?

good thing I'm on Verizon landline and AT&T, but if they're down because of a Tier 1 ISP problem then that affects me too (but I seem to be fine right now)

also those orange blotches look strangely like the population centers of the US... all of them

DavidPostill

2:59 PM

14 mins ago, by bwDraco

WTF. T-Mobile gave me an "all circuits are busy now" message while trying to place a call.

bwDraco

A later attempt to call succeeded, though. They say it's a common issue in NYC.

Burgi

3:31 PM

@allquixotic are you working at the moment or having an enforced holiday?

Journeyman Geek

@Burgi I don't think @allquixotic works for the company that works for the TLA any more ;p

Burgi

ah#

i'm an old man now, i can't keep up

also i'm dying of some lurgy but i've barely mentioned it

djsmiley2k

muahahah

Burgi

battling on like a real man with barely a comment that i'm dying a horrible and agonising death from the lurgy

Journeyman Geek

manflu!

@Burgi I'm a fan of those lemon flavoured flu remedies for those

djsmiley2k

3:41 PM

I'm a fan of whiskey

Burgi

how come no one starred @DavidPostill's birthday greeting trhis morning?

DavidPostill

clearly nobody likes me (except @burgi) :(

XKCD

3:57 PM

The worst are graphs with qualitative, vaguely-labeled axes and very little actual data.

allquixotic

@Burgi working

@JourneymanGeek I do

Journeyman Geek

4:18 PM

@allquixotic my bad

Burgi

@DavidPostill well at least you got one!

djsmiley2k

Happy Birthday @DavidPostill

4

(is it really your birthday?)

Burgi

4:35 PM

everyone remembers his! no-one remembers mine! :(

Jan 22 '17 at 12:00, by DavidPostill

Happy Birthday @Burgi

djsmiley2k

wtf

Happy Birthday @Burgi

5

anyone else wanna join in?

Burgi

:D

djsmiley2k

4:58 PM

right I've had enough and am going home o/

barlop

5:12 PM

I can't log in from another machine since I have a wordpress login.. i'd like my account merged. superuser.com/users/864777/user864777 that's me

is this the right place to ask?

just asked here chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/114/ask-a-super-user-moderator dunno if there is another chat I should ask in

DavidPostill

5:37 PM

@djsmiley2k Yes it is!. Thanks :)

@Burgi Happy birthday!

djsmiley2k

wtf is up with this laptop

hmmm that's better.

mouseover and clicks aren't working half the time

like i can't mouseover and click reply on @DavidPostill's message

DavidPostill

@djsmiley2k Reload the page? Restart your browser?

djsmiley2k

gonna try restarting the browser now

djsmiley2k

6:00 PM

@DavidPostill whoohooo!

mine is on 31st.

my brothers was yesterday

allquixotic

81-18, resolution to extend the Continuing Resolution passed

government will reopen

Senator Cardin from my state is speaking post vote

he voted for reopening the government

djsmiley2k

america, y u so funneh

@DavidPostill hmm, if I'm clicked on another window, i can't click to this one, but i can alt tab, wtf

ok i can't click between windows

and now i can, WTF windows. :/

@allquixotic I can't reply to the message below this.

@allquixotic now i can

DavidPostill

@djsmiley2k Get a new mouse ;)

djsmiley2k

tis a laptop

and it seems to be the browser which is acting up tbh

DavidPostill

@djsmiley2k Get a new nipple :)

djsmiley2k

6:15 PM

touchpad plus buttons

but it's not the button acting up

else mouseover would work

wtf.

it's like i can't mouseover anything on the bottom 'half' of the page

That Brazilian Guy

> would still require knowing my password

@FMLCat Yeah, except many services offer pasword resetting via SMS

Psycrow

Ahoy, I've got a question that I'd like to ask on the exchange but am worried it will be closed as off topic, as some similar questions I found while searching were, can I run it by you all here for an opinion?

djsmiley2k

I don't know of .... err.... any

is it on topic @Psycrow ? :D

That Brazilian Guy

@djsmiley2k Google and Facebook, IIRC.

FML Cat

@ThatBrazilianGuy None of mine do. And that's not 2fa.

That Brazilian Guy

6:27 PM

Ok, then let me state more clearly: SMS as a point of security is a failed approach as long as services allow resetting your password using the same factor that is used to authenticate you (in this case, the SIM card).

2FA = you have to know one thing and possess another thing.

"Oh but I forgot my password"

"Here, let me be really convenient and allow you to reset your password using SMS"

djsmiley2k

i can't do that on my google account

allquixotic

!!tell 42426921 meta

ChatBot John Cavil

@Psycrow Please don't ask to ask; if you simply ask your actual question, we will help you if we know the answer or can help you find it. This is much faster and simpler than asking if it's OK to ask. As a rule, it is always OK to ask in this channel. Please go ahead.

djsmiley2k

it goes 'hahahaha no'

That Brazilian Guy

So in those cases "NO-MORE-2FA = you ~~have to know one thing~~ and possess ~~another~~ thing."

FML Cat

6:29 PM

@ThatBrazilianGuy Well yes, 2fa is broken if it becomes 1fa when you click the "Forgot password" button

2

That Brazilian Guy

I was reading an article the other day that corroborates that.

Psycrow

I want to know how to rig my my 3 monitor setup so that two of the monitors can be switched to my laptop, I've only found ways to do this with one monitor and not sure if what I want to do is possible

Cheers, wasn't sure of the etiquette

FML Cat

And how secure that SIM card factor is depends on whether you protect your SIM card with a PIN, and whether your phone is protected with a PIN when the SIM is unlocked

And how generous your network is at handing out PIN unblock codes or replacement SIMs

allquixotic

@Psycrow so you have three monitors connected to a desktop, and you want to be able to toggle 2 out of the 3 to your laptop?

Psycrow

Yup, I use 2 monitors at work and when I work from home I'd like to be able to keep the same screen config

allquixotic

6:32 PM

@Psycrow depending on your hardware this may not be possible, or you may have to purchase an additional box, but the best technology for doing this is DisplayPort. HDMI might be possible, DVI might be possible, and VGA is going to be ugh and will probably require purchase of an expensive converter box

That Brazilian Guy

@Psycrow Not sure if what you want is similar to this: howtogeek.com/306237/…

allquixotic

you'd have to tell me exactly which ports you have on your laptop, and what outputs your monitors have

in the simplest case, you have two monitor ports of some kind on your laptop (for example, DisplayPort and DVI, or VGA and HDMI, or two DisplayPort, or a ThunderBolt 3 (supports DisplayPort) and another DisplayPort or TB3 port...

if your monitors and your laptop both support DisplayPort 1.2 daisy chaining you can connect the monitors to each other like this and plug a single cable to your laptop - quite nice

Psycrow

Only one output, but I'm planning on getting a universal laptop dock which supports VGA and DVI I think

allquixotic

what outputs do your monitors support, and are they all the same?

and what screen resolution are they, and what graphics card or IGP does your laptop have?

or if you can just give me an exact model number of the monitors and the laptop I could do the research

Psycrow

That's very kind of you, unfortunately I have the laptop at work right now but I could pop back into chat tomorrow

allquixotic

6:37 PM

also, if you get a laptop dock, I'd recommend that you get one that has DisplayPort 1.2 support, if such a thing is supported by your laptop

really the ideal configuration is that you'd have:
-- Monitor 1 daisy chained into Monitor 2 via DisplayPort
-- Monitor 3 permanently plugged into your desktop PC via whatever
-- Two "output" DisplayPort cables coming out of Monitor 1: one permanently plugged into a DisplayPort port on your desktop, and the other that just hangs loose unless your laptop is there, then you plug it in when you want those monitors on your laptop, and use the "Input" switch on the monitor button panel to swap back and forth

that's about the "cleanest" setup I can think of

or I suppose if your monitors are all VGA or DVI or HDMI only (no DisplayPort), you could buy a laptop dock that has at least two ports of a compatible port, and just plug the monitors into the dock separately - but then you wouldn't be able to use your laptop with the monitors outside of the dock

but DisplayPort daisy chaining + a USB hub mostly makes traditional laptop docks obsolete and unnecessary

with ultra-modern stuff you could do a single Thunderbolt 3 cable from a monitor into your laptop that would provide (1) power to the laptop (and charging), (2) a USB hub attached to the monitor, and (3) DisplayPort 1.2 with MST (daisy chaining) for your external monitors... all in one cable to your laptop

that's the future though, and you'd be pretty lucky to have that sort of support on your monitors and your laptop without having planned it that way

Psycrow

Yeah that sounds ideal, but my work laptop is probably 3 years old now and the monitors not high end enough for that kind of tech

Monitors are all Acer K24HL

allquixotic

a 3 year old laptop probably has DisplayPort 1.2 with MST support though. I also have a 3 year old laptop for work, and it has it.

Psycrow

Laptop is a Lenovo Thinkpad but I don't know the exact model

allquixotic

I was worried it was like 5+ years old, in which case it might not have it

@Psycrow ah, yeah, pretty much independently of what model it is, a Thinkpad released in ~2014 would definitely support DisplayPort 1.2 with MST, almost certainly

(though, probably not ThunderBolt 3, so you'd still need to use your power brick)

Psycrow

Well, who knows if it was new when they gave them too us, might have been in a warehouse for a while knowing my employer 😛

allquixotic

6:44 PM

ah, true

Psycrow

But yeah, the monitors only support DVI and VGA unfortunately, not the newest but I did get all 3 for £150 so I get what I paid for I suppose

allquixotic

well that throws DisplayPort out the window... you're going to need a laptop dock then, make sure you get one that's compatible, and you can just plug your monitors straight into the dock

the way you'd switch back and forth is, say, if your monitors are plugged into your desktop PC via DVI, you'd have them also connected via VGA to your laptop dock at the same time

then fiddle with the buttons on the bottom of the monitor to swap input when you want to change it

not too bad, all in all, except for the desk space the dock takes up when your laptop isn't home

Psycrow

Yeah that seems like the route I'll have to take

allquixotic

if the dock annoys you too much, consider buying monitors that support DisplayPort daisy chaining, depending on the size and quality of monitor you can find them around the $100 USD price point, probably less in GBP

Psycrow

My current alternative is to have one monitor permanently connected to the pc, one on a kvm switch to the laptop dock, and one connected permanently to the dock

So at most have 2 monitors connected, but never be able to have 3 in use at once

allquixotic

6:49 PM

or get a KVM switch that supports 2 monitors; those exist

not sure about VGA but I'd go with DVI if possible

Psycrow

Yeah that might be an idea for the future, just bought my first house so excess spending money is a but thin on the ground

That Brazilian Guy

@Psycrow Congrats!

allquixotic

startech.com/Server-Management/KVM-Switches/…

Psycrow

Oh really? I've only seen 1monitor switches, I'll have another lool

@ThatBrazilianGuy thanks!

allquixotic

hmm, if your monitors only have 1 x DVI and 1 x VGA output, you'd have to get VGA to DVI converters or adapters for that

Psycrow

6:51 PM

@allquixotic that actually looks perfect, if only it wasn't $420, something to save for though!

allquixotic

see, this sort of thing is exactly the kind of headache that DisplayPort 1.2 daisy chaining and (even better) Thunderbolt 3 are trying to address

that's probably over 3-4 kilograms of hardware and cabling (very thick cables) for a job that Thunderbolt 3 could do with one single cable

or even one DisplayPort cable, but those are bigger

Psycrow

Maybe I'll wait a bit longer and upgrade to better monitors then

3 DisplayPort monitors would do the trick?

allquixotic

I'd bet $10 (or 10 GBP, whatever) that your Thinkpad supports DisplayPort with MST

and yeah, you could even daisy chain all three monitors together and use them all simultaneously with your laptop, if you wanted to (or not)

either way you're going to have to buy things to solve this project, and I'm not actually sure that the cabling and switching and stuff you'd need for the old protocols would be cheaper at all than buying new DisplayPort monitors

and if you're super frugal you could resell your existing monitors on eBay or something

Psycrow

Yeah that's always an option

allquixotic

it depends on exactly what ports your ThinkPad has.... For example, I have a 2014 model HP laptop that has 1 x Mini-DisplayPort, 1 x HDMI, and 1 x VGA

Psycrow

6:57 PM

I already have a single monitor kvm kicking around and was hoping I could add something to that to do the job, but this is probably better off in the long run

allquixotic

in your shoes, I could go: Monitor 1 DVI -> Mini-DP with a $5 passive converter; and Monitor 2 VGA -> VGA direct

Psycrow

I'll check when I'm in tomorrow, hopefully!

allquixotic

if you want to use your desktop peripherals (keyboard and mouse) with your work laptop, you could just buy a USB "KM" switch with no display support

much cheaper, simpler, smaller, lighter, and eliminates the unneeded video part which you wouldn't need if your laptop has enough output ports already

or use your existing single-monitor KVM switch (if it has USB) for free, as a "KM" switch

and don't plug any display cables into it

Psycrow

So, just to get a goal clear in my head, three DisplayPort monitors daisy chained together connected a laptop dock, and also connected to the pc (I assume they'd each need, for example, a hdmi connection or similar to the pc), and then switching can be done manually on the monitors themself

I wonder if it's possible to daisy chain the monitors together, then have a switch to change the input between the laptop and the pc

allquixotic

@Psycrow once you have them daisy chained, you'd only have to select the output on the "last" monitor -- the one monitor whose plug goes into your laptop or desktop

Psycrow

7:08 PM

Ah I see, that makes things simpler

allquixotic

that's assuming it has two outputs... make sure you buy a model that does. It'll need a minimum of at least 3 DisplayPort ports on each monitor, or at the very least, the "last" monitor

Psycrow

And makes sense, wasn't thinking about how daisy chaining actually works

allquixotic

Port 1: receives video data from Monitors 2 and 3 via the daisy chain
Port 2: connected to your desktop PC (permanently)
Port 3: connected to your laptop

Psycrow

Gotcha, thanks

allquixotic

and you wouldn't need a dock in that case either

there are DisplayPort KVM switches though, and most of the newer ones support 1.2 with MST, so you would be able to flip a switch or press a button to go from desktop PC to laptop and back

not strictly necessary if your monitors have 3 DP ports

Psycrow

7:10 PM

Well the dock let's me plug the Ethernet and peripherals in without having the cables all loose on the desk, just me trying to keep the desk a little tidy

allquixotic

and if you didn't want all three monitors on your laptop (to use your desktop at the same time, for instance), you could just not daisy chain the third monitor and leave it plugged into the PC all the time

Psycrow

Hmm, worth bearing in mind if I can't find 3DP monitors at a reasonable price

FML Cat

@allquixotic Do all monitors with multiple ports support daisy-chaining? I'm yet to actually use one myself with more than one DP

allquixotic

@FMLCat no; it's possible that they might have multiple displayport outputs for convenience (so you can switch them using the buttons without moving any cables), but not support MST

DP 1.2 w/ MST is roughly a 2013-2014 phenomenon in terms of when it really started to hit the market, though it seems graphics cards got it before the feature was very common on monitors themselves, and the first monitors were hella expensive

Psycrow

Unfortunately I need to head off, but thanks for all for the advice, I'm sure I'll be back soon to steal more of your computery wisdom though

Canadian Luke

7:15 PM

Morning all

allquixotic

an example of a current model of very nice work monitor (one I have myself) with MST support is the Dell U2417H, but it looks like they sell close to 200 GBP each... you can find cheaper though

FML Cat

I don't generally buy cheap monitors anyway... my last two were over £400 each

ToxicFrog

All my monitors have been relatively cheap and have served me well, although it looks like the oldest of them may be on its way out

It no longer powers on consistently and was making an awful screeching noise even when off yesterday.

(it is at this point over a decade old)

allquixotic

I used to buy cheap monitors, but I bought an Acer Predator X34 at MSRP and three Dell U2417H at MSRP too

the MSRPs on those are quite high, especially summed together

ToxicFrog

I'm considering picking up two 1080p monitors to replace it, which would finally let me do an Eyefinity setup that doesn't suck

Not sure it's worth it, though.

Michael Frank

7:48 PM

omg this scanner is driving me insane...

Customer is complaining that it jams every few sheets, every morning for about 30 minutes and then it's good for the rest of the day. I can see in the logs that it's jamming... but I can't get it to jam when I'm testing! D:

djsmiley2k

8:11 PM

only in the morning? it's cold?

Michael Frank

shrug apparently "whatever you did last time you were hear worked!"

So it's not doing it now... thanks for telling me. -_-

bwDraco

8:45 PM

So... playing with PrimoCache again on Bifrons. New version supports using the L2 (disk) cache for both reads and writes. On the 60-day trial right now; chances are good I'll get a license this time.

Being used with the StarTech enclosure and old Plextor SSD; 4 GB allocated for cache.

System responsiveness noticeably improved - it appears this is reducing the disk contention on the system eMMC, especially when the external SSD is actually faster in many cases than the internal storage.

@Bob, since you use PrimoCache, I'm wondering what your thoughts are.

Defer-Write enabled, 30 seconds.

bwDraco

9:13 PM

@allquixotic I thought your primary system only has one monitor?

I'm on two monitors at home, with a Dell S2417DG (1440p 144+ Hz TN with G-SYNC) as my primary monitor and an Acer H226HQL (1080p 60 Hz e-IPS) as a secondary monitor.

Mokubai

Frikken damnit! Even Tokyo gets some damn snow!

bwDraco

I'm not all that into multi-monitor gaming. I mainly want one good monitor for gaming and another one for system monitoring (no pun intended) and extra desktop space.

Mokubai

@bwDraco Main monitor for gaming, second for watching a film while waiting for the raid to form up

Michael Frank

only while waiting? Just run that movie through the whole raid!

Mokubai

Well yeah, but you probably pay less attention to it. I didn't mean you turn it off...

I swear, in MMORPGs you are like the worlds least discriminating bounty hunter.

"A shiney rock and some fluff you found lying on the ground to kill that guy over there? Sure, why not..."

And WoW knows it. In at least one quest what you get is a "gold painted rock"

bwDraco

9:29 PM

Heh.

Mokubai

I'm pretty sure there was also a cold, wet diamond. Guess what that turned out to be?

Bob

9:51 PM

morn

bwDraco

roar

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