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12:07 PM
woehoe for random reboots
I was just away from the computer, came back: bam! fresh into Windows
any idea where I can see what might have caused it
@TomWij, Eclipse tops the charts in this SO question:
Q: What IDE to use for Python?

husaytAsking as a Python beginner, what IDEs ("GUIs/editors") do others use for Python coding? If you can just give the name (for example, Textpad, Eclipse ..) that will be enough. If it is already mentioned, you can just vote for it. But if you can also give some more comparative information, that w...

I tried it, but couldn't really make sense of it :\
Yeah, Eclipse is PITA sometimes, but apart from that it is great to work with.
for python ?
Did you had no sense setting up your project or the programming itself?
I need an interactive mode, so I can tweak my objects in real time
and getting the right libraries loaded was a pain :\
12:12 PM
@IvoFlipse Yeah, that's the thing I hate about Eclipse the most, those settings pages could use some organization.
I guess the debug mode accomplishes the same
well simply set it up for me :P
Yeah, that's the Debug perspective.
@TomWij I'm getting invalid value for permissions[1] while trying to implement the answer mentioned in the SO answer, any idea why ?
@Sathya actually I fear I should learn to try and set it up, if only to know what the heck is going on
12:15 PM
Dunno what's wrong, haven't written such extension yet.
I'm wondering if it wolud just work with
"permissions": [ "tabs" ]
does the channel matter ? Dev/stable et al ?
@TomWij well that seems to work
@Sathya: Yeah, I think there is some inconsistency between the channels.
Searching for the error itself shows that error popping up in combination with people trying to install an extension on a newer version of Chrome.
@TomWij yes, possible. I'm on 8
portable edition, to boot @TomWij
@IvoFlipse Are you using the "Alt+Enter" interactive mode in Eclipse?
great, works fine! Thanks again @TomWij
12:23 PM
well I've just set some things up @Mokubai, so I don't really know yet :P
java.vendor=Sun Microsystems Inc.
BootLoader constants: OS=win32, ARCH=x86, WS=win32, NL=nl_NL
Command-line arguments: -os win32 -ws win32 -arch x86

Mon Jan 31 13:25:23 CET 2011
Unable to get project for the run
The pydev interactive mode has some quirks, such as the current directory being set to the eclipse directory rather than the project directory, but for the most part you can work around it...
oh and I see it's x86 while I have x64
The x64 eclipse?
12:26 PM
most annoying things I find is that I just want to import a library and be done with it, not have to go np.array everywhere
"import np.array as nparr" ?
or "from np import array" ?
well in Spyder (from Python(x,y)) it just loads the interpreter with those libraries, so I instantly have access to all numpy, scipy functions
I don't have to think about all that :P
ah, one mo
great I started a project, tried changing the workplace and guess what: eclipse restarts without me saving the project :P
afternoon all
12:34 PM
You can set up more imports for the intereactive console there
Hi @DMA57361
I'll give that a shot @Mokubai :)
hi @DMA57361
@IvoFlipse I'd just copy whatever spyder has as it's startup line into there.
anyone else having one of those Mondays? :P
@DMA57361 Yep
and so does my computer
it randomly rebooted on me :@
12:38 PM
least I'm not alone then...I suppose...
over-overclocked it?
You're never alone, They are always watching...
I set it to 4.2 Ghz now @DMA57361
we'll see how it holds up
f/e, it's always a bit of a testing game
and now I'm setting up Ubuntu in a VM, to try another Python IDE
@IvoFlipse You can get eclipse and pydev up and running in Ubuntu as well ;)
12:43 PM
I know
What IDE you looking at?
well no, actually I can't ;P
more or less the same as Python(x,y), but well I just want to see what it does
Does it look any good? I've kinda gotten used to eclipse, but it is somewhat odd at times...
my goal for this week will be to make some GUI element that shows my paw rolling off
what the heck, it made a it folder that's 85 folders deep, all named after itself :\
erm, sounds...interesting...
12:51 PM
and it doesn't want to be deleted :S
what is it that's done this?
:/ odd
too bad you'll miss the Town Hall Chat
though in all honesty, I expect most users to already have made up their mind
@IvoFlipse: rd /s "\\?\C:\Path\To\Annoying\Folder"
12:53 PM
getting 10 people from accross the world together at one time isn't an easy task
afternoon @DMA57361
hi @Sathya
bad Monday eh @DMA57361
My laptop was very weird yesterday...
@Sathya well it's not had the best start (or middle) so far
12:54 PM
It came to the point that visiting YouTube causes the screen to be off for 20 seconds, then some flashing and then it shows the YouTube page with the video just green... :D
doesn't work @TomWij
I'll reboot and have unlockr delete it
Happened several times that day with programs that involve OpenGL/DirectX :D
@IvoFlipse: Huh?
Is it locked?
no idea
@TomWij hmm, reminds me of your earlier problem
You can unlock it through Process Explorer.
@Sathya Yeah, it is that problem. I'm still thinking it's the VRAM, but well.
It almost doesn't happen anymore.
But that might be due to exams (= less gaming) :D
12:56 PM
@TomWij hah! didn;t you get it replaced ?
IIRC there was some plastic sticker causing problems too
Yeah, that helped towards lower temperatures and the problem occurs a lot less.
It's downclocked too (not noticable).
I need some software to stress test the video memory only, which I could burn as a Live CD.
Sathya: I have the thoughts that my problem would be 100% fixed if I could somehow flush the video memory on a regular basis.
Hmm, would a resolution change do that?
perhaps @TomWij I'm not too certain though ;( but since resolution change would involve clearing everything, guess that should work
I'd rather have my laptop change the resolution every hour (or when I unlock it or something) than losing my screen when I need it or losing a game or data due to a BSOD.
A better solution would be a real flush without changing the resolution.
Hmm, or perhaps force it to change it to the resolution itself, if possible through API calls.
Err, Google interprets VRAM as NVRAM, bad idea to search that way. :D
@Sathya: Hmm, what about screen orientation, could rotate it 180° twice. :D
Then the windows shouldn't rescale.
@TomWij clever :D
Let's see what happens when the control panel does that.
1:09 PM
you should try to get it replaced :\
Hmm, would there be a way to monitor vram usage...
VGA BIOS 62.92.AE.00.0C
Q: How can I monitor video memory usage?

stackerHow can I monitor video memory usage?

hmm not enough info there
I found an interesting way to test video ram integrity. The leadtek utility, winfox, has a small app that informs you of graphics memory usage. So i ran that, and two instances of rthdribl, resizing the two windows until all video ram was in use. Then i started bumping up my video ram speed until the internal driver test failed. Here's a screenshot.
@TomWij In Windows Vista GPU-z (techpowerup.com/gpuz) can monitor VRAM usage for my nVidia GPU...
1:23 PM
@Mokubai: Checking.
Interesting, Memory Controller Load and Video Engine Load looks like useful information too.
It's pretty neat to watch the video engine load while playing HD video... :)
Nice to prove you're actually using the hardware decoder instead of software...
Yay! @Sathya: Changing color depth twice seems to do the job.
180 MB (32 bit) --> 36 MB (16 bit) --> 78 MB (32 bit)
@Mokubai yep..
Wait, what.
Parts of YouTube video are loaded in VRAM?
Close YouTube tab, see it free 40 - 45 MB. xD
Or hmm, maybe just the images Google Chrome uses.
@TomWij hmm GPU acceleration ?
1:30 PM
Yeah, it's GPU accelerated.
@Mokubai: How does the "Log to file" thing work?
@TomWij it logs whatever you see on screen to a text file
As my computer would crash, how can I see the contents of that file?
Guess I should just click it and locate the file with Process Monitor.
Then let it log all the time I use my laptop, and then I can see what condition it crashes in...
it'd be saved every n seconds, I'd imagine
looks like it writes it on a second by second basis, so as long as Windows actually flushed the file to the drive you'll get some indication
Because the Exception the NVIDIA Driver throws is "Insufficient Resources".
1:33 PM
just set it to log and the file is growing while I'm looking at it...
Although that's not really true, at least not for disk, page and memory.
Perhaps VRAM.
When I clicked log to file it came up with a "choose file" dialog, and was set to the GPU-Z directory
Though I have a slightly older version of GPU-Z
But I just think, as the memory might be unstable. If I flush it every hour or so, I can remove the dirty bits which cause the crash...
@Mokubai: Ah yeah, I see it now. Nice that it asks... :)
The log is in a nice csv format so you can just open it in excel or whatever...
Oh, it's a CSV, nice.
1:36 PM
Hmm, now I wonder if it is possible to run GPU-Z at boot.
And have it automatically log.
you could get it to go with an AHK script if nothing else....
Yeah, could try.
Or rather "I should do"... :D
There are always those thoughts that would speed up your work (eg. I sometimes need to translate a word quick which I could do very quick, but as I don't have the tool for I instead google for Google Translate and do it there.)
why not drop it into startup @TomWij
Hmm, makes me think, would it be possible to control the Super User site with keyboard only. :D
1:40 PM
AHK could probably let you set up a load of hotkeys to navigate around...
Ah, yes Sathya, it automatically logs. No need for a script, woohoo... :-)
It remembers that you were wanting to log when it restarts? Cool.
Set it to minimized mode in the shortcut properties.
I'd watch out though, that log file could grow big quite quickly by the looks of it
Only shows loading screen and then hides in task bar.
@Mokubai: Let's see what compression does to it.
Size: 45.9 KB
Size on disk: 8 KB
1:43 PM
Aye, windows compression would probably help make it small, only problem there is that's an extra delay before it being written to disk
@Mokubai: I don't care if the file turns out to be a few GB, it'l be a long time until it hits 226 GB. :D
I don't know how windows compression works but on a large file wouldn't an append mean loading the entire file in before compression and writing back out?
While an append on an uncompressed file just be adding blocks at the end...
@TomWij Fair enough, plenty of space to grow :)
@tombull89 What language is that?
my guess is that "POMOCY" means "help"...
1:46 PM
woops I hit delete a bit too fast :P
Google translator polish > english almost makes sense.
@IvoFlipse: This post has been deleted - no more edits are allowed
I was translating it... :D
> What's the problem with Skype that doesn't want to turn on? So yes, I have installed Skype and when I run it it shows up as normal
beat ya: Whats the problem with skype I do not want to turn. describe how it looks. so yes I have installed skype manadżer run them on task in the process shows up and growing use as normal but when it comes to this momętu is activated when the process disappears.

good luck
1:48 PM
post deleted - post undeleted o.O
Translated. :-)
@Mokubai: 28 KB now.
@TomWij Compressed or uncompressed?
I'm looking into the stock BIOS (not planning to flash it).
100% fanspeed is simply not true, it's done by the motherboard in my case.
But interesting to now that it shuts down at 108 +- 6 °C
Clocks are these:
Voltages for each mode are: 1V; 0.9V; 0.9V and 0.85V
2:36 PM
> Because of security issues, Google restricts extensions to run at Chrome Extensions Gallery page. Please try to run at any other page. :D
hi @Bloodphilla
ok forget it, I've had enough of trying to make Eclipse work for now :P
code that runs perfectly in Python x,y fails to run in here and I have no clue how to troubleshoot it
and the machine gave me another big F, by rebooting on me
I don't even notice any problems, like the fans turning louder or something :S
My extension is acting weird...
which extension @TomWij
2:51 PM
anyone any suggestions for finding out what might have caused the reboot?
would Windows keep a log?
One I downloaded to translate, and now... When I select something it translates it.
@IvoFlipse: Yes, even a memory dump if it isn't power or overclocking related.
@IvoFlipse the event log should have everything
lol I clicked on memory check: bang reboot :P
event log, where do I find that one?
system: app crash
3:00 PM
Kernel-power error
what could be the cause of that?
Plese help me out pick up this box with a robot
@fahad 0_o huh?
@KronoS: I want to pick this box up with the help of a robot
use a magnet :P
3:04 PM
Its made up of wood : )
I was thinking to use a rod which will insert from the 6.5 cm hole and pass through the second hole.But there is a danger that the box can move upside down then
put iron in it ;)
so use two rods and stick them in the right side
its a competition : p
if it's filled with something, gravity would prevent it from rotating
I cant do anything. I just have to pick it up in this state only
stick it through the two holes then
3:10 PM
@fahad are the holes mirrored on both sides?
I would approach by going through the two holes to the other side... there's no tipping
like a forklift
Cant move there
My robot will come from the front side
I can use a mechanical arm to pick it up
I think that If i use all the fingers of the robot to insert them in the box then I can do it.But its a typical job then
what does the robot look like?
@Sathya, it appears Speedstep is the problem, especially when overclocking I reckon
@IvoFlipse you ought to disable it
yeah, though it's a major power safer I reckon
some others claim some of the drivers might conflict
trying to uninstall some hardware, to see if it helps
SpeedStep and OC'ing are often go in the reverse ways
generally most people disable SpeedStep since it often brings down the clocks
it does, but they fire up very quickly
user image
@IvoFlipse :)))
they event viewer also mentions one error just before crashing
3:27 PM
@IvoFlipse what's that ? same kernel-power ?
> Het stuurprogramma PCI heeft een ongeldige id voor een ondergeschikt apparaat geretourneerd (010101010101010100). (sorry for the Dutch)
the driver PCI returned the wrong ID for a device
I wonder if that's a GPU problem :S
it's the only PCI device I have
is the GPU overclocked ?
but the drivers came from Windows
3:32 PM
so I might install the official ones instead
grab the nvidia drivers
didn't give me any problems before though
3:50 PM
where did you calculate that @Sathya?
wakoopa @IvoFlipse
oh you tracked it yourself
@IvoFlipse yep, have it running all the time on my laptop
I don't want to know I reckon :P
3:59 PM
@IvoFlipse Did you find a good alternative to Eclipse + pydev? I've gotten a bit annoyed by it's "problems"...
but I'm going back to Python x,y for now
it just works
though you don't get a lot of the fancy Eclipse stuff
Which IDE do you use in Python x,y? Eclipse is an option in there...
uhm no hang on
click on that button
it will run Spyder as your IDE
but strangely, it used to have options: full, and some others
Okay, will give Spyder a try
and they're gone :S
which meant what libraries it had to preload
4:04 PM
just loads everything or nothing now then :S
Does it do code completion or anything like that?
basic code completion yeah
We now(inetcore.com/project/ipv4ec/en-us/index.html) have less than 1,000,000 IPv4 addresses
if we got rid of all the spam sites, we'd have plenty left
And... if we got rid of all the unused IP addresses that companies have just in case they may need them in the next 1000 years, we would have plenty.
4:45 PM
strange @Mokubai I'm looking at PyQT examples, but when I click on the documentation, I get C++ code :P
A: Google Chrome URL Variables/Macros?

Charles Gargentproblem not solved closing....

A: Google Chrome URL Variables/Macros?

Charles Gargentproblem not solved closing....

deleted those
like he wanted them too, but without the rep gain :P
@IvoFlipse PyQT has horrible documentation
well what else do you recommend for making some GUI elements
dunno really :-s never handled the GUI part
4:52 PM
good evening everyone
hi @DanielBeck
hi @DanielBeck you're amongst the monthly toppers in the Super User league
nice going
I lost #1 spot somewhere around the 17th IIRC
and there are not enough OS X questions for me on the site ;)
@DanielBeck hah, @Mark complains the same ;P
Just noticed that you can disable sites on the StackExchange Hot Questions list, cool...
4:59 PM
@Sathya He's right. And I fear it gets worse now that Apple.SE is out of beta.
we haven't had decent Windows questions in over a year ;P
@IvoFlipse: what? my windows question was pretty decent :)
hi everyone.
@IvoFlipse: did you check out pyside.org instead of PyQt?
hi @akira
5:16 PM
I'm looking at it now @akira
I'm just going to work through some tutorials, to see what I can do with what
Hello @JeffreyDahmer
O wait... he isn't in here...
howdy all
I seem to have lost access to the web pages again >.<
have you checked your DNS? ;P
have you looked in the trashcan?
yeah, been though all that last time
ah, no wait, it's awakened
it's Voting Time™
5:54 PM
ooo, Strunk & White :)
wow... seriously only 41 users on SU have it?
heh, only 9 have Copy Editor
the Sportsmanship badge only has 4 users too
that's strange really
I either don't post an answer if a better one is there
I don't post if I don't think I have the right answer
or I edit the answer that was posted earlier, but not as pretty as I want it to be
so how on earth would I get the sportsmanship badge if there are never great competing answers ;P
@IvoFlipse Sometimes there are different solutions, both good. Read one, upvote it, post the other.
6:02 PM
that's true, but not enough to get that badge ;)
wow... you guys kept going on in the town hall eh? I see how it is ;)
we waited for you to leave ;P
I see... well see if I still keep slaving away to you now @IvoFlipse ;P
why not just use SO? ;)
If you ask for the best programming language to get started, it will be closed as subjective&argumentative?
is that a question or a statement @DanielBeck
6:12 PM
belongs on Programmers.SE and even there it's a crappy question
300 million dollar mistake... ouch
One could try asking for great introductory guides to programming and use whatever language they use. That could work.
Q: What is the easiest language to start with?

TeifionWhat is the language with the lowest barriers to entry, simplest syntax, easiest setup. I'm aware that there's not a best language but I am sure that there will be one that's got a good score in all three areas. It's for teaching friends how to program, I like PHP and Python but I don't want to ...

6:34 PM
@KronoS Impressive. It seems they don't close as easily as we do.
@akira that was amazing
SO is burdened by a legacy of old popular questions
@DanielBeck I don't know... we let things like this though:
Q: Why aren't there many monitors with higher than 1920x1080 resolution?

Icode4foodI haven been shopping around for monitors and it seems that everything from 19" to 24" have a max resolution at 1920x1080. Is there some technical reason for this or is that just how it happens to be. I have a 23" monitor at this resolution and it seems to me that If I had anything any larger, t...

sorry that was my answer to it... this is the actual question...
@KronoS Both my 24" Samsungs are 1920x1200. I don't understand the question.
he's asking my aren't 23" monitors generally higher resolution
6:40 PM
But I got them back when they were somewhat expensive.
Well that's not that bad of a question, is it? Resolution independence, UI scaling and these things.
i don't know... that was a question/answer that I answered when I first came to SU
I'd love to be able to see the vote counts on the "C" answer regarding best beginner programming languages.
personally now I would close it for subjective sake... but he's got 10 upvotes so...
Well it's not subjective imo. Both cost relative to gain (for 1920x1200 for example) and resolution dependence (i.e. no market or just not usable) are good reasons.
Q: Top Question of the Week #4

KronoSNow we're into week 4 of the "Top Question" of Super User in the Super User blog. Please post and vote for your favorite question for this week. Please post any question that you feel is of worth and the reason why. Try not to promote your own questions or answers for publicity sake. We are lo...


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