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12:18 AM
12:56 AM
Hi. So far, liking this page overall. :)
wow. i've asked as many questions here in two days as in seven months over at askubuntu.com
Hah. :P I definitely haven't been this active in SU.
A: What is the basis for belief in non-sola-scriptura?

sidran32There really isn't a Biblical basis for holding to Sola Scriptura The teachings of the Scripture of the time of Jesus (the Torah) was the only Scripture that they had then. All other teachings, by Jesus and by His disciples, were orally transmitted. The saints of the Church hadn't even started t...

Why might that be downvoted? It got 2. Perhaps there was a bit too much commentary in there? That's all I can see.
and actually, i feel more attached to my answers at AU than here
over at AU, I know when my answer is good or bad or somewhere in between. downvotes on a good answer are a lot more perplexing
but the numerous downvotes i've incurred here, well, everything is so subjective anyway
as much as i strain to be detached
ah. @sidran32, you get downvotes for outright claiming there is no biblical basis for holding to sola scriptura
many a christian will disagree with that
you're claiming your own personal interpretation for the whole of christianity
@djeikyb That's what I thought. I was thinking of editing it accordingly but wanted to get someone else's opinion on that. Unfortunately no one responded to my inquiry.
at least, that is why i am inclined to downvote it. which i have not yet done
1:06 AM
Well, I'll edit it, then. Since I realize what's wrong. I will admit that I was overtired and hasty when writing it so that's probably why that kind of talk snuck in there :P
no prob. fwiw, i agree with your claims. it's just that i have many a friend who heartily disagree
I edited the last paragraph.
And removed the top sentance :P
i think that is better
if you don't mind my asking, what flavour of christianity are you?
I'm Catholic. :)
Also wondering how liberally I should preface my answers with that fact.
you don't need an RC disclaimer, but maybe source your claims from the catholic encyclopedia
or explain what tradition your answer comes out of
1:11 AM
I have done that with a few of my answers already
I did put a disclaimer in one answer where they specifically asked for a Catholic opinion.
oh, i think i saw that..on the mary thread, no?
i dunno how this site will end up, but my idea at least is that all opinions be sourced to a flavour of christianity rather than a SE user
also, fun to see i guessed your flavour correctly
christian diversity fascinates me
1:14 AM
Is it typical for beta pages to not allow you to see upvote/downvote counts by clicking on the number? I recall being able to do that elsewhere but not here.
you don't have enough rep
you need a thousand, i think
That'd be why.
I have over 1000 on SU, so I can, there. Makes sense.
I need to get in the habit of providing answers with references more. :P
heh. yeah. it's not a simple matter of "try it. it works."
1:27 AM
Yup :P
i'm super curious about how long this site will last, or if it will actually make it permanently
Of course it will.
i think that's half of why i'm here
just to see
I think there's some growing pains, as there have been some troll attempts already. But discussion has been good so far and it's been active enough that I'm optimistic.
i'm a little sad i missed the area 51 part
1:30 AM
Me too
always been a little curious about that process
just not enough to commit to it on a subject
until this one. which i missed by a day apparently
oh well
Side note: The Vatican needs to hire real web designers. Its website is ugly as sin (excuse my horrible pun >.>)
Brown text on textured lighter brown background @.@
1:54 AM
and find a pic of the pope that isn't a dead ringer for emperor palpatine circa original trilogy
site could be worse
Ya, he's not very photogenic. :P
Well, I was referencing their online version of the Catechism and it really is a pain to read the text in that color scheme.
oo, you're right. when you get to full page content it's nigh unreadable
Nice. :)
2:42 AM
So... What's the stance on questions that should have been answered by reading the wikipedia article of the same title? Because there's a lot of them, and they're annoying.
i'm wondering that myself..despite being the poster of some of those questions
(how) are we supposed to differentiate the site from wikipedia?
@mxyzplk Vote to close as not a real question and comment that they are general reference questions if they are that bad.
this site isn't like SO where there is a demonstrable problem->solution
(though be nice about it, no need to make people feel like we want them to go away if they just don't get it yet)
@djeikyb That's a very good question that you could ask on meta.
@HedgeMage Alas, no VtC privs here yet
@djeikyb Because SE is interactive, and is about experts answering specific questions, not creating general definitions. I think some of the problem is the lack of specificity - people are not asking actual questions about problems they face. They are asking general "define this, it would entertain me" questions. The SE format begins to fray when it's not real, somewhat knowledgable people asking genuine questions about actual problems they face so that other experts can help them.
2:51 AM
You guys have 25 people with VtC privs so far -- not bad for this stage of the beta. If you see something really egregious, flag it, else you need to get the community voting the run-of-the-mill garbage into oblivion.
Otherwise what will you do when we aren't babysitting your site 24/7
@HedgeMage @mxyzplk i'm hammering out my meta question
I think I agree with @mxyzplk.
<-- is big on training the community early
@HedgeMage That's rather clear and awesome. :D
@HedgeMage i think one reason this SE site interests me, beyond general interest in christianity, is i don't understand how it works in the SE framework. i'm really curious about this
2:54 AM
@djeikyb How so?
So @Hedgemage
We were talking about my doubts question.
@djeikyb Well, people may have specific questions or problems regarding particular aspects of Christianity or the Christian churches. As a problem->solution format, there is potential. Although, other SE sites (from what I can gather) have Q&As that involve curiosities, even if it isn't related to an obstacle they are currently facing.
And we all agree that it could be reopened with some modifications.
So in that framework I think this one will work well.
(BTW, if I randomly disappear please do not take offense, or assume I was offended... my 8yo just came down with a fever, so if he wakes up again I have to run.)
@Purmou have a link? They all kind of blur together after a week or so...
3:00 AM
@sidran32 how is asking / answering about aspects of christianity and its churches not fall in the category of ignoring / duplicating the efforts of existing reference material?
@HedgeMage sick kiddos is blech. Hope LF feels better soon.
Good grief 400 qs already
@waxeagle heh
@waxeagle LOL. Why are you surprised? :P
@ElendiaStarman You have 4 more rep than I do D:
@Purmou LOL. You were actually above me earlier in the day, I think.
3:10 AM
Indeed. Above you by quite a lot. :P
@ElendiaStarman Gardening has generated 550 in a couple months :). We would kill for this kind of volume :).
@Purmou This is turning out to be a great race. :P
@ElendiaStarman I think it's a race to 1000. You ready? :D
@waxeagle Well, I wouldn't think that Gardening is QUITE so contentious, eh? :P
@Purmou Oh, you're on. >:D
@Purmou Good luck catching @ElendiaStarman in votes :)
3:11 AM
[starts spamming questions] :P
@ElendiaStarman lol yeah our big meta controversy was whether to allow patio and pest questions
@waxeagle you're a gardener, or just a mod?
@waxeagle Whaahahat? :P
@Purmou supremely amateur gardener. I grow some veggies for my own use.
Q: How is christianity.se different from wikipedia?

djeikybTL;DR: Are there objectively answerable questions that aren't covered by standard reference materials? I'm used to other SE sites like Stack Overflow where there is a demonstrable problem with specific solutions. At SO, questions that are answered by standard reference material (ie, man pages, w...

i think that is what i mean to ask
3:13 AM
@ElendiaStarman lol those were the hard questions we had to answer during our private beta over there :)
@waxeagle sweet, i have a huge garden and wanna start planting some veggies and herbs.
but i'm having trouble expressing my thoughts.. maybe i should sleep early tonight : D
for all of your questions
we do flowers too
@Purmou: No! Don't follow him! That is the easy path and the way to the Dark Side! O.O
@ElendiaStarman You leave me alone, rep opponent. :P
3:15 AM
@Purmou :)
Hmmm...I'm considering asking a question concerning the Westboro Baptist Church.
Something like "How does the Bible call us to deal with the [WBC] people?".
@ElendiaStarman I would not use them in the title. You might use them as an example. I would be hesistant to call out a specific group though.
How about "How does the Bible call us to deal with contentious Christians?"
@waxeagle Hmmm...good suggestions.
I'm not sure thats actually construcive though....
If the body is well formed I think it can be on topic, but its borderline at best because it verges on sectarian...
@waxeagle Okay, I'll think about a way to phrase it in a good way.
ok, heading to bed now. Good night folks
3:46 AM
now the westboro baptist church is quite something
they think they're faithful in the eyes of God, yet they're judging everybody else on his behalf.
they prance around, going all "Yeah, you're going to hell."
nothing wrong with judging
it's more that they judge badly
4:02 AM
What do they judge badly, do they have some facts wrong? (devil's advocate)
their interpretation of the bible leaves much to be desired
It's very literal, right?
i'd say it goes beyond literal
no that isn't right.
they are not literal, because they pick and choose verses and distort the literal meaning
ie, the ever popular leviticus 18:22, which is part of god's revelation to the jewish people
not only do they ignore surrounding verses
but they apply it to non-jews
and worse, leviticus was not just given to a particular people, it was given in a particular time and place
it isn't relevant for christian living today
4:10 AM
but every Christian sect does that with different parts, deciding what does & doesn't apply. There will always be arguments, even about the literal meaning.
i'd argue a literal interpretation of jewish law and OT scripture leaves christians bound not to god-prescribed israelite culture, but to the noachide covenant
@AndrewVit oh aye. i fully expect wbc to say i judge badly
@AndrewVit obviously i, here, am deciding what does and does not apply, and deciding what a literal meaning is. but i like to think my logic is more consistant than wbc
which really goes back to my original point. the problem is not judging, but how well you judge
Consistency & logic are important.
Q: Is Christianity a monotheistic religion?

Andrew VitOne of the commandments states "place no other gods before me". Does this mean God is implying the existence of other gods, or why is this explicitly stated? The Biblical universe also includes a varied cast of supernatural characters like Lucifer, Metatron, Archangels, Demons, Seraphim, etc. So...

@Amithkk hiya, btw
can we get an objective definition of "deity"?
is it possible?
deity: genderless synonym for god (in the general case)
why do you ask?
4:19 AM
From that definition, I'm not sure what "The essential nature of a god" refers to, but the other parts would apply equally to angels, satan, etc.
Just looking over the answers there, not sure what to make of it.
"these figures are considered non-divine, and certainly subsidiary to God", sure they're subsidiary, but what is "non-divine"
@djeikyb Hwya
@AndrewVit i'm thinking you mean RiverC's answer? christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/1361/…
god is divine
nothing that isn't god is divine
@djeikyb Sorry, I was afk. I think it isn't duplicating in that some people may have specific grievances or questions that simply looking up the reference material may not help with.
Not specifically but that thread runs through all the responses... the other entities exist, but they're somehow different in nature and God is God.
You can look up all the reference material available but it might not address your particular issues because it's presented in a cold manner.
4:33 AM
@AndrewVit i'm not sure what you're asking
that's why I'm looking for a clean definition of "deity" or "divine", and how is it different from the broader term "supernatural"?
well if you consider natural beings like us as a class
I just don't see how "but this one is special" is a valid argument for calling it monotheism. I'd like to understand HOW is it different.
supernatural beings would be in a separate class
4:36 AM
god would be in an entirely different class
ok, getting somewhere...
I think it boils down to this:
God is the Creator of all other beings.
seeing as how god exists, and the others were created
Natural, and supernatural.
at least, that's how i would map it out for christianity
4:38 AM
So one might say the distinguishing difference between the God of Christianity, and supernatural beings of Christianity, is that only God has the ability to create from nothing.
greek mythology is a bit sketchier
There are of course other differences as well... but that's enough to draw a distinction between the two classes of beings.
^ three classes of beings: natural, supernatural, divine
@djeikyb Sure...although I mentioned only God and supernatural beings in my comparative statement :)
4:40 AM
unless you were meaning created vs eternally existed
wb @Purmou
Is the three classes way of looking at it pretty common among Christians? I mean we just hear about "here", and "in heaven" where saints, Mary, angels, and so on sit at God's side... at least that was my understanding.
I'm off for the night. See ya!
night @sidran32
@AndrewVit yeah, i think so
the main point is that god inserts himself amongst his creations
dependency injection? (speaking of classes...) :)
and maybe there are other classes, the main bit is that god and his divinity are distinct from the rest by nature
@AndrewVit hehe
4:47 AM
Anyway, I'm off for now. Cheers for putting up with me.
haha, no, it was an interesting question
maybe it should have been saved for the stack :D
@AndrewVit I think it's common. If you consider animals, then there are actually 4 classes of beings.
soulless animals for you, eh @Flimzy?
@djeikyb I don't think I said/implied that
But whatever the difference, animals were not created in the image of God, which makes them distinctly different from humans.
colour me interested. describe your fourth class
4:53 AM
I suppose they would still be considered "natural" beings, though
Anyway, human vs. animal vs. angels isn't the question, if I'm not mistaken
it's supernatural vs. God, right?
i'm tangenting
bored and waiting for a phone call ; p
and stumped with a linux / fakeraid question
what's the question?
not sure if I can help... I have more experience with software raid...
oh, trying to get it auto-recognised so i can stick it in fstab
Q: How do I automount a fake raid?

djeikybHardware Asus K8N4-E Deluxe Mobo Sil 3114 fake raid, onboard 2 Seagate 250 gb hd, hosting my /home A backup on a separate hard disk of /home What I have so far I've made the raid using the Sil 3114 firmware. I'm using raid level 1. I have a bash script I run as root as soon as I get a prompt...

4:59 AM
Are you using kernel drivers that shipped with your kernel, or did you have to install a separate fakeraid package? (I don't remember how fakeraid does that)
we use ubuntu at school
never could get used to that OS
wow, askubuntu is probably the most different-looking SE site.
@Flimzy i didn't install anything to use it, so I assume i'm using standard kernel drivers
@djeikyb this doesn't answer your question... but why fakeraid instead of software raid? are you dual-booting off the same array or something/
root@daedalus:~# lsmod | grep sil
sata_sil 13542 1
root@daedalus:~# lsmod | grep raid
dm_raid45 77827 0
xor 12890 1 dm_raid45
heh, fakeraid because it's the only way to use four of my sata ports
and i would like to mount it in windows using ext2fsd
Your SATA ports only work in fakeraid mode?
that's very strange
Anyway, if you want to use it in Windows then fakeraid is your only real option
5:03 AM
well, i haven't completely determined that. i have a sneaking suspicion they might. but the disks don't show when the BIOS posts except under the raid bios
If you weren't using Windows, I'd suggest software RAID... as it's often/usually faster than fakeraid (even on the exact same hardware), it's usually more flexible... and it's usually easier
(i have four normal sata ports)
sw raid also makes it easier to move your array to another machine, or upgrade y our SATA controller/motherboard... because you aren't then tied to your specific controller
my sneaking suspicion is that linux might not care what my bios reports. basing this off seeing both disks separately in fdisk -l before dmraid -ay
yeah, i'm reading all this negative stuff about fakeraid after i made the raid1
i'm thinking to break it as long as it doesn't kill the data
@Purmou you more of a windows guy?
@djeikyb I'm more of a Mac person myself, actually.
5:07 AM
ah, nifty
i want a mac for the beautiful screen
oh yes
osx lion
on a 27 inch screen imac
I have 3 24" monitors
and now i'm jealous
@Flimzy I'd love a screenshot of that resolution
5:08 AM
I wouldn't have room on my desk for 27"
@Purmou: That's actually how I got into photography...
I couldn't find any desktop wall papers big enough
so I resolved to create my own :)
that's awesome
that's quite cool
mmkay. so. maybe i should look into software raid. mounting /home to windows isn't crucial
I'm not sure if you can use this link... facebook.com/…
But that's my 3-monitor set up (at my old house)
oh my
5:10 AM
the desktop extends onto the laptop, right? virtual kvm? ; D
hehe, no
i never understood how to connect multiple monitors
I may have been using synergy at that point, though
what screen res do you get on that? :P
1920x1200 on each monitor
5:11 AM
i used synergy all the time when i was working software qa
testing on three or four machines at my desk
so 1920x5760 in all
sweet program
so the actual resolution is 5760x1200, you mean
I love it so I can control my media center PC from my laptop :)
how do you actually connect multiple monitors?
5:13 AM
all you need is multiple monitor ports
I have two video cards, each with 2 video ports
I have one monitor plugged into each of 3 ports
then just configure X windows for it
or Windows
RAM is for programs
it's easy to configure in Windows, too
5:14 AM
multiple monitors shouldn't take any resources beyond the graphics card
@djeikyb yes, i know it's for programs :P
but it interests me how much RAM he actually has, because he can run a lot of programs on that computer (visually at least)
ohhhh. misunderstood
This system has 6gb
I don't actually run any more programs than I would on a single monitor...
I just don't have to juggle as many windows
Q: What is prayer?

JustinYMy question arose while pondering the answers to Praying to people outside the Trinity? Is prayer any form of communication with God? Is it called prayer solely because its communication with God? Or is there a specific form and reverence that is necessary for communication with God to be a pray...

I don't see why anybody didn't answer this with a bible reference
I found several which talk about what praying actually is
@Purmou then why not answer it yourself?
5:24 AM
shh, i am :P
Did you get mortarboard yesterday?
Jesus can form up a speech on the spot
now that's a good public speaker
6:10 AM
In [Matthew 6:6](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%206:5-8&version=NIV), Jesus speaks of praying in some detail (emphasis added):

> <sup>**6**</sup> But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and **pray to your Father**, who is unseen. **Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.**

So when you pray, you are to pray to God. Within the scope of Christianity, the definition of "pray" (the most fitting one [from dictionary.com]) is:

> to make earnest petition to (a person).
what do you think, @Flimzy?
I wanted to get some feedback before I posted it
G'night peeps! :)
night, @ElendiaStarman
@ElendiaStarman must be out of votes for the day
7:09 AM
quiet night
i'm reworking my ID question
7:41 AM
A: In which year was Christ born?

rpegIt is not known or clear when Jesus was born - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronology_of_Jesus#Year_of_birth December 25th derives from pagan traditions - http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_sel.htm

Flagged that not an answer, flag was disputed, commented.
lol. the question is explicitly about the year, not the day
@dancek how was the flag disputed?
the first article he links to is about the day
the year
Even so, links are not answers

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