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KitFox
KitFox
1:14 AM
I am so bored tonight!
I see people I know in here, but no one is talking.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
1:42 AM
:P
 
KitFox
KitFox
I would give you a hat, had you none.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
@KitFox Thank you.
I could always do with another hat
But it's so hard to find one that fits
 
KitFox
KitFox
I like your Frosty. Looks good on your avatar.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
1:57 AM
@KitFox Yeah as long as you ignore the button. :P
But yeah this one seems to fit alright.
 
KitFox
KitFox
I was pretending you had a rose clenched in your teeth along with the pipe.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
@KitFox Hah that's what I was imagining too.
 
LitheOhm
LitheOhm
2:41 AM
 
trogdor
trogdor
@BESW lol, why would they waste Vin Diesel in a role where he has to wear such a ridiculous costume?
@BESW just another thing 10's run has poisoned people about
 
 
2 hours later…
Metool
Metool
4:29 AM
@BESW This.
 
BESW
BESW
4:48 AM
@trogdor It's not a costume, it's CGI.
 
trogdor
trogdor
either way
 
BESW
BESW
He's doing the motion-capture, like how they did Gollum.
I think it could work, since he's very much a body actor rather than a face actor.
 
trogdor
trogdor
but he looks awesome already
I agree about that though
 
BESW
BESW
But he doesn't look like a tree.
 
trogdor
trogdor
I suppose you don't lose much when you can't see his face
 
BESW
BESW
5:09 AM
[blink]
0
Q: The argument of regenerations

AudreypuppyI've seen a lot of discussions about the number of times The Doctor can regenerate...but one thing every one assumes is that we have seen each and every regeneration. We've seen how the writers can quietly insert a new regeneration (the War Doctor) but the fact is the doctor himself tells a com...

doctor-who
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
6:03 AM
@BESW Haven't we been through this dozens of times before, in countless answers to tangentially related questions?
Not to mention the fact that it's not a question, just a rant.
A "I'm smarter than you all" rant.
 
BESW
BESW
"Because I remember something that never happened!"
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
Also, g'morning, @BESW. You can't hog all the 2014 to yourself anymore!
 
BESW
BESW
@lisardggY [sob]
And seriously, there are at least another dozen possible-canon regenerations of the Doctor which could be shoehorned into the holes in screen canon, and NONE of them are women.
The closest the Doctor's come to being a woman on screen is Two and Three cross-dressing several times.
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@BESW And all of it based on a mishearing of one line of Tenant's?
 
BESW
BESW
Sigh.
I have to come up with a Q&A post about flying the TARDIS, too.
 
trogdor
trogdor
6:11 AM
@lisardggY he hasn't been
I am just less vocal about it
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@trogdor Hey, if you don't stake your claim on a year, you get left with all sorts of odds and ends, like the hours of 4:50-5:34am on odd days in late February. Carpe Annum!
 
BESW
BESW
6:34 AM
My dad's reading Digger. I think he likes it.
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
7:18 AM
@lisardggY Yoooooooouuuuu
@lisardggY I cannot remember the name of the damn movie, but it was about the signing of the Magna Carta. IIRC it was called Ironbound or something of that persuasion, but there's a scene where one of the main characters fights a ton of guys with a claymore. A great illustration of why Dex matters in combat, even with large weapons.
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@Lord_Gareth DEX matters, certainly, but to the exclusion of STR?
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
@lisardggY The way it's used? Yeah, honestly. You need to be strong enough to support the weapon; everything else is finesse, leverage, and skill
Mostly those last two
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@Lord_Gareth I concede, then.
I'm guessing it's not this movie: imdb.com/title/tt0240618
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
Definitely not. I really wish I could remember the name >.<
Its depiction of medieval melee combat made me happy inside
Armor did stuff! Weapon styles were period-accurate!
 
BESW
BESW
@Lord_Gareth How recent was it?
Ironclad (film)
Ironclad is a 2011 adventure film directed by Jonathan English. Written by English and Erick Kastel, based on a screenplay by Stephen McDool, the cast includes Paul Giamatti, James Purefoy, Brian Cox, Vladimir Kulich, Mackenzie Crook, Jason Flemying, Derek Jacobi and Kate Mara. The film chronicles the siege of Rochester Castle by King John in 1215. The film was shot entirely in Wales in 2009, produced on a budget of $25 million. Plot The film opens with a prologue describing how the barons of England, aided by the Knights Templar, rebelled against King John in a war that lasted three year...
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
7:30 AM
@BESW Last year/couple of years? YES! IRONCLAD
THANK YOU
 
BESW
BESW
For future reference, it was result number two on a Google search for film about signing of magna carta.
Hey, guys! Lungbarrow is free to download! How did I miss this?
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
@BESW You imply that I can Google >.>
 
BESW
BESW
@Lord_Gareth I imply many things.
3
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
8:11 AM
> Oh, yes sir, I can google
But I need a certain song
I can google, google-woogle
All night long
 
BESW
BESW
Yesterday up in the Cloud,
I met a man who lurked and prowled.
He only lurked again today;
I think he's with the CIA.
 
Alex P
Alex P
Hey folks.
 
BESW
BESW
Hay.
 
Alex P
Alex P
8:28 AM
My parents have the Russian TV cable package. So after the ball-drop thing they flipped to it. Russian New Year's programming is the clock on the Kremlin chiming 12, then a speech by the president, then the national anthem (all around that is like 10 hours of variety shows, but that's not important right now).
Putin was rolling his eyes super-hard during the stand-around-waiting-for-the-anthem part.
It was hilarious.
 
BESW
BESW
8:39 AM
Heh.
 
Alex P
Alex P
I hate that stupid anthem, too, Mr. Putin.
Only one of us has any power to change it.
 
SevenSidedDie
SevenSidedDie
9:13 AM
Happy New Year!
Okay, I'm a bit late, even for PST.
I blame a rockin' game of Pandemic and the tastiness of Jasmine cocktails.
...
Last!
Oh man, Dungeon World is so great. I wish I could drunk-text it.
Wait, I can drunk-text its authors! BRB
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@SevenSidedDie Heh.
 
SevenSidedDie
SevenSidedDie
@lisardggY Done:
.@skinnyghost @olde_fortran This is me drunk-texting Dungeon World because yeah. Happy New Year!
Tweeted by sevensideddie on January 1, 2014 at 9:22 AM
2
Seriously, for those who imbibe, Jasmine cocktail. It's maagical.
 
SevenSidedDie
SevenSidedDie
9:40 AM
Drunk spelling, I rock you. Good night everybody! mic drop
Dammit, I failed the formatting.
 
BESW
BESW
Sweet Luna on a stick, are people really using the Sisterhood of Karn to justify the idea that the Doctor has a secret past as woman?
 
trogdor
trogdor
lol
@lisardggY lol, I don't need to, he is vocal enough already
 
 
2 hours later…
BESW
BESW
11:33 AM
Netflix is on the fritz again.
Because you watched Pirates of the Caribbean, you would like... Family Guy and Happy Gilmore.
3
 
trogdor
trogdor
tears will be drunk this day
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@BESW Could be worse. It could have suggested you'd watch the Pirates of the Caribbean sequels.
 
trogdor
trogdor
well
that would make sense
they aren't particularly good
 
BESW
BESW
@lisardggY I dunno. Brainless Johnny Depp vehicle vs anything with Adam Sandler in it.
 
trogdor
trogdor
but at least they are similar
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
11:40 AM
@BESW Good point.
 
BESW
BESW
But yes, as @trogdor points out, at least it would make sense.
 
trogdor
trogdor
mmhmm
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
The fourth one was so bland I forgot everything in it within 20 minutes of leaving the cinema.
I hope Tim Powers got a lot of money for it.
 
BESW
BESW
There was a fourth one?
...oh, right.
I suspect Netflix bases its "because you watched" recommendations on whether the films share a camera guy or a makeup artist.
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@BESW I don't think much of Family Guy's camera work or makeup. :)
 
BESW
BESW
11:42 AM
@lisardggY I don't think much of Family Guy at all, to be honest.
 
trogdor
trogdor
same
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@BESW I think it was an excellent show, groundbreaking in a lot of ways and downright hilarious, for about 4 seasons.
Ever since then, it's been terrible.
 
BESW
BESW
I was the perfect demographic for the show when it was at its peak, and at best I found it culturally important but not something I'd go out of my way to watch.
(Well, not the perfect demographic, since I was sober at 2 in the morning.)
 
trogdor
trogdor
HAHAHA
anyway
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
nice glasses BESW ;D
 
trogdor
trogdor
11:45 AM
I never got what the appeal was, to be fair I have not seen so much as one full episode
but it seemed like the humor was way too immature for my tastes, from clips and such
 
BESW
BESW
@JonathanHobbs Thank you.
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@trogdor There's a lot of that, yes. But there's a lot of very off-the-wall stuff, non-sequiturs, and random stuff that can be really funny when done right.
 
trogdor
trogdor
yeah, most of that also doesn't appeal to me
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
@trogdor the humour was the appeal so i guess it's not for you x)
 
trogdor
trogdor
yeah
that is my point
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
11:54 AM
that said though the context of an episode (even if the jokes often aren't in the context of that episode) helps
 
trogdor
trogdor
just another thing then
I do prefer jokes to be in context
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
they are totally in context
to the extent that "hey louis, remember that time i did something entirely unrelated to what's happening now" is in context
 
BESW
BESW
Aside from the humor style (which I can get behind a little more than Trogdor, but it's still not my favorite thing), the show was too cynical and misanthropic for me to enjoy.
 
trogdor
trogdor
I also hear that they sometimes just wasted time,
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
(they are not in context ;D)
 
Metool
Metool
11:57 AM
@JonathanHobbs That typo gives me an idea...
But I must away.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
oh. xD Lois...
 
trogdor
trogdor
like at least a few of their jokes just sat there after or before delivering the punchline for inexplicable amounts of time
 
BESW
BESW
I felt like I was watching someone try to turn Monty Python into a soap opera.
 
trogdor
trogdor
strangely enough, I did like The Simpsons, at least for a little while
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
@trogdor that's a very, very different beast, so that's not too strange
@trogdor probably how having it in the episode helps
 
trogdor
trogdor
12:02 PM
mm
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
the jokes aren't made for being there on their own
 
trogdor
trogdor
yeah
thing is, I don't have much to compare between them
not having seen much of Family Guy
mostly all I know is stuff they have in common.
animated show focused mostly on humor
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
@trogdor they have pretty different focuses
 
trogdor
trogdor
I don't doubt it
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
Simpsons is a show that's about life, family, or other things above humour sometimes
Family Guy just uses the family thing as a medium for jokes it seems
 
BESW
BESW
12:07 PM
Yeah. I haven't watched much of the Simpsons, but from what I can tell it's interested in telling stories whereas Family Guy is interested in telling jokes.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
major distinction: The Simpsons has an episode all about Bart and Lisa's relationship, with Bart finding a little spiritual journey and singing a beautiful song for Lisa's birthday. It's moving and touching.
 
BESW
BESW
Stories and characters in Family Guy are simply vehicles for jokes, or for heavy-handed moralizing.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
Family Guy doesn't really do stuff like that I think.
@BESW Sounds about right
 
trogdor
trogdor
mm
again, I prefer stories to exist
so if Family Guy didn't care as much about the stories, or the characters beyond their humor elements,...
I don't feel like I missed much
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
you haven't then :)
 
 
1 hour later…
Zachiel
Zachiel
1:20 PM
2
Q: What feats expand the set of weapons one can use weapon finesse with?

Jeff FryI know that Dervish Dance adds scimitar to the list. Are there other feats that expand the set of weapons one can use finesse with? I'm particularly curious I'd there are ways to get a bastard sword or 2H weapon to be a finesse weapon, but interested in other options too. (Feel free to mention n...

pathfinder feats
I know this is 3.5 but I can remember there's a weapon enchantment that lets you consider your weapon as if it was a weapon of the type you'd need to make your feats work. Any of you remember where this wwas from, or if it could work with class features too?
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@Zachiel What, is that like the enchantments that make swords like this usable, not to mention wieldable?
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
there's a suggested edit in the review queue atm
I... think it's vandalising the post through word changes that are disrupting the originally intended meaning, so double check the content before you approve
just a heads up to reviewers
I might be wrong though
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
oh, no, not that one.
I'm talking about something that lets you use feats tought for an unarmed strike with a mace. Or swing a mace that counts as an unarmed strike when a feat tells you to hit with a punch
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@JonathanHobbs The long long one? LordVreeg's answer? I went over it and didn't actually find any problems. It's mostly fixing typos and some issues of tense.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
One famous application of the weapon enchantment I'm talking about is a feat that lets you attack again every time you roll a critical with a mace... using a rapier that counts as "whatever weapon you feat talks about"
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
1:28 PM
@lisardggY i checked through and saw that some of the changes were good, but others weren't I think
but I am sick and my brain is really not working as well as it could, so maybe i was misinterpreting stuff
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
Which ones do you think were bad?
(so we can tell you if it's you or him)
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
@Zachiel BESM D20 had that.
@Zachiel Well, it had a central Power Attack feat that did the same damage regardless of what your signature weapon really was.
I think you should either accept that different weapons are good for different things and not try to have whatever powers you have fit whatever weapon you find,
or, (better yet), dispense with the attempt at quasi-realistic simulation and let you do the thing you want to do with the weapon you have, and not penalize you with a feat slot for it.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
@Zachiel ... i just gave it another read through and it was just me misinterpreting the original and corrections badly. the edit seems pretty good actually
bother
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
well, no. The feat was intended to work with a mace, which has a bad critical range. But the weapon counted as a mace (and as an unarmed strike, which allowed you to use the rapier to make the free unarmed strike another feat gave you with the rapier) so you had a 30% chance of scoring a crit and you made 2 more attacks with the same weapon if you did.
without the weapon ench you would have needed to score a crit with a mace and you'd have rolled one more mace attack and one extra unarmed strike, with only a 10% chance of triggering again (with the same feats)
This had a 0.3+(0.7*0.3) chance of triggering at every iteration
(checking my math now)
And a 0.3*0.3 chance of triggering twice
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
2:06 PM
Aptitude weapon only works with feats :(
Anyone here has Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade in HD? I need a high quality screenshot from it.
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
'fraid not.
Not at work, anyway.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
2:24 PM
I'm not in a real hurry
 
lisardggY
lisardggY
A high quality screenshot from a 25 year old movie? How can it not be an emergency? :)
 
Inbar Rose
Inbar Rose
@Zachiel I am extremely curious now.
@Zachiel What screenshot exactly do you need?
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
I need a screenshot of Indy pointing at the big X on the floor
also, I don't think that link is legal
thiss, but bigger
 
Inbar Rose
Inbar Rose
2:39 PM
@Zachiel "legal" is a relative term. Depends what country you are in.
Posting the link here is no illegal.
Browsing to that link is not illegal
Watching the video on that link is not illegal.
Profiting from displaying that video is illegal.
Hosting that site is illegal. (in some countries - read USA)
That's why it is not hosted in the USA.
Anyway - nothing to worry about.
Here you go.
Best I could get it.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
 
Inbar Rose
Inbar Rose
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
might wanna upload that to our hosting.
 
Inbar Rose
Inbar Rose
@JonathanHobbs "our" hosting?
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
there's an upload button right beside the chat box
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
2:46 PM
oh, no need to.
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
that uses the i.stack.imgur.com CDN hosting
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
Thank you
mh wait, you diidn't just scale the image I posted, right?
 
doppelgreener
doppelgreener
but i guess this works fine!
 
Inbar Rose
Inbar Rose
@JonathanHobbs damn - never noticed that :P
@Zachiel no.
I used the se image upload now
 
C. Ross
C. Ross
3:39 PM
Happy new year, morning all
@InbarRose use that because the i.stack.imgur.com CDN doesn't expire like regular imgur and other things.
 
 
4 hours later…
Alex P
Alex P
7:38 PM
Anyone here really good with AnyDice?
I have this object: B:{0,0,0,1,1,1} (a d6 where 1-3 is a failure and 4-6 is a success).
I want to approximate "exploding" 6s by making it more like this: BX:{0,0,0,1,1,1.5}
It doesn't like that 1.5
OH I KNOW!
BX:{0,0,0,1,1,1+1dB}
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
7:54 PM
So, WoD:{0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1+1dWoD} ?
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel You can't recurse.
But you can define "regular die" and "exploding die."
Well, you can probably figure out some other recursive trick.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
heh
exploding die.
so why don't you want to explode?
 
Alex P
Alex P
What I mean is you can define an exploding die as "and then roll a regular die if you get a 6/10" and it won't be recursive.
But you can't define a die as "and then roll the same die if you get a 6/10" because it's self-referential.
You need other tricks, then. With the functions or something. Which I haven't been able to make work without hitting the application's limit on recursion/computation.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
8:12 PM
what if A calls B and B calls A?
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel Depends on the language, but I think AnyDice won't let you do that. It needs each structure to be perfectly defined in order.
I mean, you can try all kinds of things. That's why I floated the question.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
8:30 PM
Uh give me a suggestion @AlexP
I've once been criticized because I'm too egocentric when roleplaying, was this true do you think RPing an egocentric character would help me by making a feature out of a bug or further impair me?
Anyone can chime in with an opinion
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel "Egocentric" in what ways? Can you think of an example?
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
mmmh it once happpened because I ruined immersion during a RP session chiming in to ask if anyone wanted to play with me later
 
Alex P
Alex P
Generally speaking, I'd say that, the more "annoying" a character trait is (this is subjective, of course), the more I expect a character to actually change.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
I apparently manifest the same qualities while RPing
 
Alex P
Alex P
I mean, it could be a passive-aggressive thing someone is just saying to you.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
8:44 PM
@AlexP It heavily dpends on the environment. If a character does something "annoying" and that is met with "go away and never ever come again", it's a little bit too late to change, isn't it? (of course this is extremization)
 
Alex P
Alex P
And it's possible to make "egocentric" a part of your character specifically for passive-aggressive purposes. There are a lot of groups in which "I'm just playing my guy!" is an excuse for a lot of stuff.
@Zachiel What I mean is that I'll only put up with it if I think it's a temporary thing, and likely to drive drama and character development.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@AlexP to expand on that, I've been accused of being too lazy to actually use another way to express my needs, choosing the easy one, which caused immersion problems in some other players
 
Alex P
Alex P
The game you're talking about is prone to both in-character and out-of-character cliques, right?
Like, it's a big deal to some players that their characters have a defined friend group that they always hang out with, so to speak?
And they might avoid other players they don't like as much?
If so, I think playing a character who's pushy or egocentric is going to invite them to avoid you more.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@AlexP playing with the same 2 people can became boring. Travel between cities takes long and if you happen to have the same time slots and the same zone as only 2 other players... yeah, big deal
@AlexP or maybe someone else could praise me for being able to play so well that character and actually want to play with me just because of that. But I see your point. So, if I'm really egoist, how do I play a non-egoist character?
 
Alex P
Alex P
9:01 PM
I think a lot of characters can be self-centered in ways that aren't terribly annoying.
I think part of that is a bit of an author-stance thing. Knowing when to play up the selfish side and when to downplay it. Letting your desires drive story forward but avoiding conflicts that come off as petty or irrelevant.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
By the way: I'm looking at someone else playing in a similar but different game. A drow fighter female just enetered her tavern room and found his archnemesis in it. She gestures towards her spiked chain and he says "it's futile, don't even try it". Her reaction is recognizing she's unable to beat him and later let the stress out by being impossible with a weaker character.
If it was me I'd find it a bad thing to do to ruin the other character's day and really frustrating to listen to the archnemesis. Am I just unable to play evil characters?
 
Alex P
Alex P
9:15 PM
hmm
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
and the frustration would manifest in my character starting to try not to cry and telling the archnemesis to stop, without any real power to keep him from doing what he pleases
(just to elaborate on the "I ruin my characters" concept)
http://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/31185/can-someone-suggest-me-happy-games
I think this needs some VTCs. Judge for yourselves.
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel Good call about "Hmm, are you asking about video games?"
@Zachiel I see what you mean. So, I've done this a number of times: I'll make a character who seems strong, including in my own conception of that character, but is so wrapped up in status and self-image that she (it's usually been "she," to be honest) turns out to be unable to actually do stuff.
Risk-averse because risk reveals weakness.
Rather than risk-averse because you need your arms to be intact in order to pursue your chosen career. Which is a different kind of risk-averse.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
anyway, risk-averse means close to no adventuring, which is why I'm playing D&D instead of a urban setting freeform
that's the current problem I'm in with my other character, even if it's becuse she's weak
 
Alex P
Alex P
There's different kinds of risk, really. D&D makes it easy to play characters who bravely face death (it would be a much harder game to play, otherwise) but still end up totally paralyzed in the face of other situations.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
Do you seriously think D&D makes it easy to bravely face death?
 
Alex P
Alex P
9:28 PM
Yes.
You can get a res.
More importantly! The dragon isn't going to leave you crippled.
You're not likely to die of infection, screaming in a tent.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
Oh yeah, spending lots of resources and lagging behind everyone else. And it's more economic to just roll another character
that thing about crippling is true. you either come out alive or dead
 
Alex P
Alex P
You can make a heroic last stand to the final hit point.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
which lead to a TPK in my group
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel See? Because death is easier and cleaner than running away. :)
 
BESW
BESW
And 'dead' is temporary.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
9:30 PM
Next time they met the dragon they one-rounded him. And any other dragon encounter was a joke for them
 
BESW
BESW
Whether because of rez or reroll, death doesn't impinge player agency.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@BESW not in my game, since I don't have a party that's interested in resurrecting me. Unless I happen to be friend with some rich and good PC whose player doesn't think that "resurrection should not be a thing in D&D, we need consequences to prevent murderhoboing"
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel Every group I've played with assumed resurrection came out of shared funds, not your own share of the loot or whatever. It was "We all risked it, you got the short straw, let's get you back on your feet."
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
reroll is only good in a "you seem trustworthy, join our party" model
 
BESW
BESW
Again, your game is.... Not exactly D&D.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
9:33 PM
@AlexP in my last group we were lucky the PCs had too much money and I forbid them to overequip
@BESW It's a problem even in P&P to me
and hello BESW and happy new year to you
 
BESW
BESW
Back atcha.
 
Alex P
Alex P
I'm not saying death is always easy and painless in D&D. But I'm saying that it looks painless enough -- and the road to get there is both gradual enough and relatively free of horrors -- that D&D heroes routinely risk their lives in pretty-much-to-the-death battles (like multiple times a session, across dozens of sessions) without a lot of player hesitation or emotional trauma for the PCs.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
And in a heavy immersion game that is bad, because it means that I can't play a character that behaves like expected.
 
Alex P
Alex P
Wait, what?
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
since I want to show that the character is not a numb-minded suicide/murderhobo, I'm going to have my character do things that go against the game premise, which is "let's all go adventuring"
 
Alex P
Alex P
9:43 PM
Sounds like a "Vreeg's Laws" problem.
How do other people handle it?
(There's an answer I keep dancing around in my head but haven't written yet. It boils down to "character immersion is actually a pretty tricky concept, because RPG characters are fictional protagonists -- often in an environment loaded with genre expectations -- rather than real people." I haven't been able to make useful hay out of that yet, though.)
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
Uhm, I might play a "I mignt not be as strong as ___ but don't understimate me" character.
@AlexP I've been reading them today
@AlexP I guess it depends on who. Some try to play their character no matter what, and who cares about character advocacy. I do what my character would do, beneficial or not, and I accept the consequences.
That's what I'd like to be able to do but I've some moral qualms about some instances of that
Like, I care about what happens to weaker characters, even when my character shouldn't
 
trogdor
trogdor
I generally don't make characters who do tons of things I wouldn't do in the same situation
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel What does it really mean to play a 12th-level half-orc fighter who has literally murdered 200 people in his life, though? And been dead once, but he got better.
 
trogdor
trogdor
yeah, that is hard to measure
 
Alex P
Alex P
You're fundamentally not playing a real person. Genre rules and fictional structure are embedded in the very idea of the player character being a "character."
I don't think that means immersion is a fool's errand or anything. I just think what's actually going on is kinda ill-defined.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
10:06 PM
Well, as BESW said it's a social game with D&D rules. The main concern of most players is roleplaying a believable character. And by believable I mean with the assumption that there are unspoken rules like "you can't use an artisan domain spell to instantly craft and resell buttloads of armors". So, yeah, we try to RP adventurers with good reasons for adventuring
 
BESW
BESW
10:18 PM
I would love to see a party where all but one are pretty ordinary guys with the right priorities, except for the one dude who is absolutely insane, but he's their best friend and he's saved their lives a lot, so when he bangs on their doors demanding they help him rob tombs, they go.
4
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
heh, story of my life (except for him asking me to rob tombs of course)
 
BESW
BESW
"Yes, he's mad as a bouncy castle of hatters, but when my mother in law turned out to be an actual slavering hellbeast, he was there for me. What's a little graverobbing after that?"
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
...that weird moment where you realize you'd like to describe a situation you've gotten into while RPing and why you can't get out of it without ruining your character but it's too embarassing to just tell to strangers what's actually happening.
 
trogdor
trogdor
@BESW I felt the opposite of that sometimes
everyone in my party but me has been that guy
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
@BESW Run this game now.
2
 
Alex P
Alex P
10:29 PM
I suppose if the thing that defines the game is characters who get really wrapped up in their personal drama and the main attribute of good play is revealing that personal drama through character-POV prose, then it makes sense to create very "self-centered" characters.
 
trogdor
trogdor
then again, one or two of my lizardfolk characters was prolly that guy too
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@AlexP what do you mean with drama, exactly?
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
Death's never been cheap in campaigns I run, partially because my players learned very quickly that most of my bad guys are very interested in having a spare corpse on hand. They've run from fights where someone died only to find a wight with the fallen dude's memories and class levels coming after them
So dying is a fairly big deal and the scramble to grab the body and get the hell out of there is very tense.
 
Alex P
Alex P
@Zachiel Your archnemesis showing up to taunt you at a tavern. ;)
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@AlexP well, that didn't exactly happen because the player wanted it. There's basically... are you familiar with Planescape factions?
 
Alex P
Alex P
10:35 PM
Yes, very much so.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@Lord_Gareth In my games, when this happenss it's usually "Oh, so I need to change character? But I liked how this one came out. Well, ok". They're not involved in the in-character story, they're more tied to discovering what comes next in the adventure I guess
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
@Zachiel Sounds like you need to start slapping people and never stop.
Though I may be biased by the bit where I hate my players
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@AlexP So we have a Harmonium trying not to take the evil drow to their rehab camps (OOC). He just shows up and orders her to do things that are useful to the good/lawful guys. And he's stronger than she is, so she doesn't really have a say.
 
BESW
BESW
[BANGBANGBANG] "Gerry, get up!"
"Karl, it's 2am. What now?"
"The fairy prince needs us to defeat a goat!"
"...a goat? Sounds like you can handle that yourself."
"But Get, it's a--" [loud whisper] "*spider* goat!"
[sigh] "Okay, Karl, but only if Richard agrees too. And can it wait 'til morning?"
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
And then it's a Tauric Creature
<.<
Because all of Karl's crap being level-appropriate only makes it so much worse.
"Guys, has anyone else noticed that every time Karl has us go kill something it's gotten more and more terrifying?" "Y'know, Gerry, I have." "That kinda worries me." "Frankly I'm starting to wonder why we even have a civilization left, Gerry."
4
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
10:47 PM
@Lord_Gareth I feel you.
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
@Zachiel My players inspire me...to learn the harmful applications of sympathetic magic.
 
BESW
BESW
10:58 PM
I'm imagining that the world seems totally normal and mundane, and only Karl can show you the magical and insanely dangerous hidden things, which anyone else would assume are simply the product of an overactive imagination.
4
It's possible that Karl's the only magical thing in the world, and his talent is making his imaginary stories come true.
But, ah. Don't tell him that.
 
trogdor
trogdor
lol
 
BESW
BESW
TONIGHT on SHERLOCK, Benedict CUMBERBATCH will SURVIVE the FALL by REGENERATING into PETER CAPALDI. #SherlockLives
Tweeted by DalekThay on January 1, 2014 at 8:27 PM
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
I don't really know how much of this is because of my players and how much is me not willing to get dirt on my hands, customiziong the gaming experience to their characters
 
BESW
BESW
@Zachiel I suspect the answer is "yes."
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@BESW Like my English teacher once said: "It's like if someone asked you "What's the weather like today?", and you replied: "Yes, I like chocolate.".".
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
11:06 PM
@BESW #plottwist
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@BESW #plottwist
 
BESW
BESW
@Zachiel #plottwist
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@BESW uhm, no. But #excessivepunctuation, if you really want
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
I feel like I should watch Sherlock.
But it's hard to find a legal means of doing so. :(
 
BESW
BESW
 
Metool
Metool
11:09 PM
@RedRiderX That reminds me of a quote from a wise man.
"There are no good reasons. Only legal ones." - Ross Scott
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
3 mins ago, by RedRiderX
@BESW #plottwist
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
So, @BESW, Hunter update
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
The fact is: as long as what I really want from my D&D sessions is having their characters explore those pre-made adventures I really like, I can't really expect them to also get involved.
 
Lord_Gareth
Lord_Gareth
Ran prologue for wife!character since she's playing a more experienced Hunter tasked with leading the team (this is to make it easier to teach the new people)
She had a team before, but they died rather horribly
In a completely unplanned bit of irony, 100% of the other players have characters from the same organizations as her dead teammates
2
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@Lord_Gareth Say hello to Lady_Gareth and wish her a good 2014 on my part
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
11:10 PM
WAIT STEVEN MOFFAT WRITES FOR SHERLOCK!?
 
BESW
BESW
@RedRiderX ...yes, it's his baby too.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
I didn't know this
 
BESW
BESW
He did Jekyll too.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
I should maybe watch Sherlock
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
SO many starrable things tonight
 
BESW
BESW
11:11 PM
They've all got his hot fingersmudges all over them.
@Lord_Gareth Delicious.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
@Lord_Gareth which game and which organization?
 
BESW
BESW
@Zachiel The game is Hunter.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
never heard of it. I tought it was the theme or the campaign name when you said it before
uhm, unless it's hunter the vigil
which has been mentioned before in my presence but I don't really know which kind of game it is
 
BESW
BESW
I think so. It's a World of Darkness thing.
 
Zachiel
Zachiel
I played a WoD game and I had fun with it, even if it ended in a TPK. I think I could enjoy it because I don't really know the system so I was unable to discern when the ST was just saving us because he felt like it.
 
BESW
BESW
11:27 PM
I had a bad experience with my only WoD game; the group was in the process of breaking up messily when I joined, and the ST used our characters as puppets to tell his stories.
 
RedRiderX
RedRiderX
Oh my gosh I need to watch this show
 
Metool
Metool
 

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