« first day (2000 days earlier)      last day (2651 days later) » 

9:00 PM
ooo you have my interest
 
Good. Glad that's been settled.
...And I got a ping when either of you commented. It was driving me crazy.
 
@Mithrandir lol, fair concern
Now I need someone to bring me either chocolate or coffee to make it all fine ;)
 
@AnkitSharma how about both
 
@Skooba nice
 
I will kiss the hands who bring me both in real
 
9:06 PM
@Hamlet Any interest in a nomination for mod?
 
Sorry, don't want to have deal with * ahem * extra traffic at the airports....
 
@AnkitSharma maybe when I'm rich i'll come visit you ;-)
 
@Gallifreyan This blog post is obsolete (it was written in the early days of the first SE betas when nobody had any experience) and misleading (the “7 questions” aren't 7 questions, but 7 types of questions). Read meta.stackexchange.com/questions/223674/… instead.
85
Q: The Real Essential Questions of Every Beta

AsheeshRThe blog post Seven Essential Meta Questions of Every Beta gets linked to prominently from every beta's meta. However, this blog post is somewhat inaccurate and misdirects new users. In almost every beta, the site design question, for example, gets asked and undergoes a fair bit of discussion eve...

6
@b_jonas I think I shouldn't have committed. I'm a reader, not a literature professor. I'm not what this site needs.
2
Admittedly, neither are most of the participants here — but that doesn't bode well for the site.
 
@Gilles thanks, that's actually more useful!
 
@Skooba lol
@DForck42 fair enough
 
9:10 PM
One problem I have with the site is that the tags are useless. I can't find questions that I would be interested in.
3
 
@Gilles sounds like something to be taken to meta - that'll draw some fire from the comments under the election post
 
@Gallifreyan Others had already exposed positions similar to mine and got shot down by Robert Cartaino. I'm tired of fighting against him.
3
 
@Gilles or suggest a one tag cleanup post like this after election :
12
Q: The one tag cleanup post to rule them all

Ankit SharmaI was going through our tags and I found some inconsistency and non-standardization and might need cleaning up. Few already raised and fix by individual meta posts, and I did few by my own-self, which were quite obvious ones but I think we all can contribute to this tag standardization together....

 
@Gilles hence the 11 starred and pinned post
 
@Gilles in what way are they useless?
 
9:15 PM
His position is to let tags evolve naturally, but on some sites that just doesn't work. On language sites, we get almost every post tagged [grammar]. On this site, we get posts tagged with the easiest thing people can think of: titles and authors, which are mostly not very useful since they're easily searchable.
@DForck42 Expertise and interest tends to go by genre and body of literature. We don't have tags for that and the meta discussions explicitly discourage any effort to introduce them.
I want a way to filter questions that are about French literature. That's the job of tags — but we don't have a or tag.
 
@Gilles ahh
i'll ultimately blame it on the limited capacity of tags and the outright refusal to let us create tag relationships
because it'd be nice to have those on movies as well
 
7
Q: Should we have language-specific tags (excluding one for English)?

fi12Before you downvote this, hear me out. What I'm proposing is a system of language-specific tags that will allow users of our site to sort questions by the language the literature being discussed is written in. Since the vast majority of the literature in questions on our site is written in Englis...

 
@Skooba Yes, and the answer says “ok but don't use the tag for what it would primarily be useful for”
 
as such, we're kinda stuck with tags that describe what the question's about
 
@Gilles I am going to post a opposing answer based on your comment because i gree with them, if you don't mind
 
9:19 PM
@Skooba sure, go ahead
@DForck42 A question about Dostoievsky is a question about Russian literature.
Oh, hell. I don't want to get into this argument. Save my energy for more important fights that I have a chance to win.
 
@Gilles no, a question about Dostoievsky is a question about a piece of Russian literature (that's the way tags were intended to be used at least)
the real problem, honestly, is that literature, movies, etc. are way more nuanced than programming languages
 
This seems like the place to address this issue: Do we need such broad tags on questions about specific works?
I tried in comments but it doesn't seem to have made a difference.
 
> I can appreciate that folks have various areas of interest; it's just not a great way to divvy up a site.
 
because people don't go to SO to answer analysis questions about c-based languages, they go to get answers for problems in x language, or maybe they have an issue with x feature.
 
If areas of interest are not a way to divvy up a site, what's the point of tags?
shrug me against Robert, I know who's going to win. No use debating it.
 
9:24 PM
@Nathaniel ah that is a better post than the one i found
 
@Nathaniel I left a comment too, but I have no hopes of it doing any good.
The site is now firmly entrenched in using unhelpful tags.
@DForck42 SO uses programming languages as tags, not just individual keywords or library functions.
 
@Gilles yes. I'd argue that a literary work is about the same scope as a programming language, more or less
 
@DForck42 this is insane.
not the same scale at all.
 
oh?
 
Compare the number of programming languages with the number of authors.
And compare the amount of specialized expertise in a programming language vs in an author.
 
9:30 PM
<comments removed> This is where we move on. The issue was raised and relevant points made. Engaging in protracted debate to prove your point is devolving into a meta-discussion about how those points are being made. Let's call both sides of this conversation closed. It is time to move on. — Robert Cartaino ♦ 1 min ago
Finally
...Except that they're still there.
 
@Mithrandir probably posted it then gonna do cleanup
 
@Mithrandir Manual deletion can be a pain sometimes. Especially with that many comments.
 
There's a literature site?
2
 
@Gilles I see.
 
@Zizouz212 Nope, it's all an elaborate prank on you.
 
9:34 PM
@Zizouz212 lol
 
How on earth did I not know this?
 
@Zizouz212 Yes, recently launched, currently in private beta. See area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/93238/literature
 
@Zizouz212 There's a site called “Literature”, but it isn't really about literature.
 
Haha, I know. I found it on Area 51. I was just surprised I hadn't noticed it until now
 
@Gilles Then what might it be about? *props chin up on hand*
 
9:36 PM
@Mithrandir reader fandom
Not enough serious literature discussion going on
And no attempt to appeal to literature experts
 
For what it's worth, I'd like Rand al'Thor be a moderator on Lit, based on my experience on Sci Fi and because he seems to have an idea of how to steer this site as well.
3
 
@Zizouz212 you must be under a mountain rock
 
@Gilles That discussion has come and gone.
 
I just live in a cave, covered by mountains of exam notes :P
 
@HDE226868 I know.
People were wondering why I'm not participating — well, you're doing it wrong.
 
9:38 PM
@Gilles ...then post some?
 
I know, I'm not going to change your mind.
 
I mean, you get the site you make, that's the point of a private beta
 
@Gilles you can try to change things
 
So many things I haven't heard of here...
 
30 mins ago, by Gilles
@b_jonas I think I shouldn't have committed. I'm a reader, not a literature professor. I'm not what this site needs.
 
9:39 PM
@Zizouz212 lol, far enough
 
@Gilles Tagging by author still helps, because there are people who are experts in reading a particular author, and they can put that tag into their favourites.
 
@AnkitSharma Been there, done that, left the site because I didn't make any difference.
 
But you're right that it's hard to find the right tags here, and we'd need tags other than author tags.
 
@Gilles You are the mod literature deserves, but not the one it needs right now ;;)
 
I'm going to try and skip meta... Literature is just books, or is it other things too?
 
9:42 PM
@Zizouz212 other things
 
Such as?
 
Operas, poems, plays...
 
Oh fun. So almost anything written in a published context?
 
pottery
 
Yes.
 
9:42 PM
but most of what's been asked has covered: fiction, poems, plays, song lyrics
 
@Himarm ...Nah
 
@Gilles see if this is what you are aiming for....
0
A: Do we need such broad tags on questions about specific works?

SkoobaAs a counter to Robert's post, I am of the counter argument crowd. Many fans of literature (and dare I say "experts") will be interested in a particular language-of-origin. To me a first time or casual visitor will be interested in russian-literature and use that as a starting point for search...

 
0
Q: Should we be tagging questions with the names of specific books?

Beastly GerbilI can't help but notice that already, we have a lot of tags. I've gone through them and seen quite a few tags with a specific name of a book, with maybe 1 or 2 posts on it. I'm thinking that okay, there are a few pieces of literature that a lot of questions have been asked about, but if we cont...

 
@AnkitSharma lol that just made my day :D
 
9:43 PM
@AnkitSharma meme stealing!!!!
 
History could be good inspiration for tags here. They don't use individual people (heads of state, war leaders and such) as their main tags. They use major events ([world-war-two], [napoleonic-war], [reformation], …), periods of time ([nth-century], [1920s], …), geographical location ([belgium], [united-states]), broad topics ([religion], [economy], …)
3
 
@Skooba where is the proof
 
@AnkitSharma working on it
 
I'm not a literature professor either. Someone posted a question I could answer, but there's no need for this site for that, because that question would have worked in Sci Fi too.
 
eyyy zizouz came
welcome zizouz
 
9:45 PM
Welcome @Riker
To this humble paperful abode.
You beat me by a long shot.
 
lol
is that a haiku
no
 
napolean is my fav haiku writer
 
@Gilles when I am elected supreme leader we'll use you to direct our tagging ;-)
 
This is a haiku
I can't write poetry at all
See what I mean here?
 
@AnkitSharma the se one?
 
9:48 PM
@Riker yes my co-mod from movies.se
 
@Gilles Every single tag I see is either 1) Book title or 2) Book author. Nothing else around genre or time or anything
 
that took wayyyyy tooo long
2
but i was committed
 
lol
 
lol
 
9:50 PM
lol
i just wanted to join in the fun
2
 
hey haikus are fun
this is still a haiku right
I didn't screw up
 
You were all committed in lolling.
 
fixed
 
@Skooba you could have picked easiest one as proof - chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/35104110#35104110
 
@Zizouz212 kek
@AnkitSharma hahaha rekt
 
9:51 PM
@AnkitSharma ah but i wanted to keep continuity with this room
 
literature.stackexchange.com/a/112/139 "Did Arthur Conan Doyle code Holmes and Watson as a gay couple?" => Watson is married three times? I didn't know that.
 
@Skooba valid point
 
I want to think of a question, but I'm not sure what I should ask...
 
@Gilles Gilles, in response to that comment. We can create our own experts... nice meta post here
21
Q: Who are the experts? Not us. We've grown a philosophical bezoar - let's work this through!

EmrakulBuckle up, this is gonna be a journey. We're pretty early into the site's existence. Things are rolling along nicely. We're hanging around a whopping 45 questions a day, and we've got the rocky foundations of a meta going. But we're going to run face-first into a deep, structural problem with t...

 
9:52 PM
 
What are the last books I've read?
 
(AKA my areas of expertise :P)
 
so mith gets free rep
2
 
@Zizouz212 George RR Martin / A Song of Ice and Fire
 
Never really read that much potter or riordan. And never heard of Martin either.
Okay. The God of Small Things, The Trial, Catch 22...
 
9:53 PM
@Mithrandir or save it for latter HP= HNQ. SO wait till public beta
 
Wow, I'm in 3rd place...
@Zizouz212 ?
 
ye
@Zizouz212 you've never heard of grrm?
 
Never heard of it.
 
@AnkitSharma hehe
 
9:54 PM
@Zizouz212 holy moly, don't you have TV in your cave
 
@Riker oh not free, look who has answered the HP question so far :P
 
lol, I'm just about the least tv/video game person you'll meet
 
@Skooba lol
 
Wow, what has happened here?
 
9:54 PM
@Zizouz212 yeah don't you guys watch the moose for entertainment? :P
/s
 
....Since that happens to not exist, don't bother looking it up.
@Benjamin I'm controversial.
 
@Zizouz212 so we can never be friends :P
 
@Riker he answered the DV posts and I got the UV ones lol
 
::Burning friendship bands with Zizouz212's name::
 
@Mithrandir Yes, I saw and was confused.
 
9:55 PM
@Benjamin @Gilles wants to burn all the tags to let them arise, phoenix-like, from the ashes to form a better tag ecosystem
 
@Riker More, the Canadian goose.
 
@Skooba lol
@Zizouz212 ah ok we have those in CA
 
My nomination is at +18/-10. Rand is at +24/-17.
 
they migrate and live in our pool every december
 
@DForck42 Oh man, @Gilles I can see why that would work better, but the amount of work required would be huge.
 
9:56 PM
@Mithrandir Those differences do not give me hope for the site.
 
@Mithrandir lel mine is stuck at +10/-6
 
@HDE226868 :( At least Emrak is at 17.
 
doens't get any attention
 
@Benjamin Oh noes! We can't have a free lunch!
 
9:57 PM
...+23/-6, but they're tied for first.
 
@Mithrandir I'm the popular kid apparently, +21/-4
 
yeah all our nominations are pretty controversial except emrakul and dforck
3
 
@HDE226868 I think I could've been something like +16/-11 at one point for OS.
 
“These people have been found guilty of treason and revolt against the Imperial family. For these crimes, the punishment is death. We hope that this will disillusion any other people who may plot against the Imperial City.”
The young new emperor - his father having been killed in the revolt - had no idea of what a proper execution should sound like. He looked at the blood-splattered traitors, three men and a woman, standing on top of the wall, proud and defiant even with the noose literally around their necks.
 
O_o
 
9:58 PM
#DforckForPresident
 
oh noes, @Emrakul has caught up with me
 
@Mithrandir that was really freakign dark
 
@Zizouz212 Can you please cut down on the memes? Especially animated images.
(Book-related memes get a pass.)
 
I think we're fine
 
@Riker that's the first paragraph of the chapter
 
9:58 PM
That was my first one!!! But okay :)
 
I've posted a rant against titles as tags.
 
Ooh Ooh.
 
We'll see if it has any effect.
 
it's not that many memes
@Mithrandir what book?
 
@Gilles Well, do you have a fast way to do it?
 
9:59 PM
Mine
Want the second paragraph? :P
 
@Gilles linky?
 
@Gilles titles as tags are still good, if not necessary.....
 
0
A: Should we be tagging questions with the names of specific books?

GillesWith a few exceptions, no, we shouldn't use book title as tags. These are far too specific. Stack Overflow has tags like [c#] and [html], not tags for every single C# method and HTML tag attribute. Science Fiction & Fantasy has tags for individual authors, but not for individual books except for ...

 

« first day (2000 days earlier)      last day (2651 days later) »