Are they following the policy of making things clearer and more coherent? Do they exert their own style?

Or do they follow some other things too (like the commonest practices)?

I think the Shorter Oxford English Dictionary is focused upon following more common practices.

:/

@Færd Why do you want to write like the majority so strongly?

There is nothing wrong with being part of a minority.

I'm assuming that face means he doesn't.

Conformism the end of art and self-expression.

Incidentally, in this room we write noöne.

Interesting. Why?

@Mitch A novel that's screaming to get out, but hasn't (yet)?

@Færd Because it sucks to have to choose between no one and noone and no-one.

@Cerberus I don't. But I don't want to give a horrifying first impression to my reader either.

And because it's nice to be different.

It's not horrifying to belong to a minority of 10,000,000 people.

What should matter is the intrinsic merit or demerit of the form.

I don't want to be different just for the sake of it.

And perhaps if no good writers whatsoever use it, then you probably don't want to do so either.

@Cerberus Yes. That's the ultimate factor.

Not for the sake of it: whatever the majority does should just not be one's primary concern; that should be the merit inherent in the form.

@Cerberus the title of mine will be 'Smooth Move'

Because you like to move smooth things?

Friction irks you?

No because the paper products are a natural laxative

How lovely.

But some things are too arbitrary to have merits or demerits in any of their variations. Language and linguistic things are to a large extent like that.

Sometimes, yes. But you may discover merits in competing forms after some research.

For example, no one does not conform with everyone, anyone, someone, etc.

Noöne has a trema/diaeresis.

So you come up with noöne. Ha!

Opinions can be formed on those aspects.

I have opinions!

I have tenets. =P

@Cerberus So do you use umlauts in English writing to solve other problems too? That's like introducing a new tool. It's not worth it unless you have general rules for how to use it.

And use it in a considerable number of cases.

I think Cerberus was suggesting that adding a new form was a bit of an in-joke for E.L.U. in particular.

That is, instead of an actual solution to any writing advice problems.

They say every joke is half-meant.

@Mitch Did you mean to refer to this: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/95?m=29543475#29543475 ?

How many inside jokes you have here.

Inside-joke is an uncountable noun. It's defined as: You had to be there to know. Don't worry though, I'm just as lost as you. XP

Is it? oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/…

@Færd Never umlauts, only diaereses/tremata.

Tremata are commonly used on a few words in English by many people, such as naïve.

This is not new.

They are fixed uses.

@Cerberus Why?

Because it's not German.

An umlaut is the name of 1.) a vowel shift in German, and 2.) the sign that indicates this vowel shift.

The sign used to indicate that two vowels should be read as two syllables is called a trema or diaeresis.

Oh. Thanks. Confusion on my part.

I would call the Turkish sign an umlaut too, for they use it to distinguish between u and ü, pronounced /u/ and /y/, just as in German.

So if it denotes a change in the voice it's an umlaut? Or only some specific changes?

In voice?

Yes.

What does that mean?

I know two meanings of voice.

In how something is pronounced.

Passive voice, active voice, middle voice; and voiced consonants.

The " sign should be called an umlaut only if the quality of the vowel changes.

So not in the voice; in the pronunciation.

So if you would use a different IPA signs.

I don't know what you mean by voice.

a = /a/

ä = /æ/ (ish)

o = /o/

ö = /ø/ (ish)

u = /u/

ü = /y/

I see.

au = /au/

äu = /oʲ/

So the trema is merely used to indicate that you shouldn't read two vowels as a digraph, but as two separate syllables.

A different use of the sign.

The penny dropped.

And I think the umlaut is traditionally drawn as two short, diagonal lines; I don't think the trema is ever drawn that way.

Cool.

Are there tremata in German too?

(Was it the correct plural form?)

Correct!

I'm not sure.

I think not.

Dutch has tremata in native words, and umlauts in borrowed German words.

I guess Dutch and German are quite close? If not anything, this one's English name is like that one's German name!

Haha, yes!

Although the word "Dutch" is only used in English.

Dutch Duits means German.

Yeah, I guessed so. Proper names get crucified in translation.

We do have Diets, I think for the old family of lower-German dialects that existed here and in German.

Yup.

Dutch and German are quite close.

But there is no major language closer to English than Dutch is.

Except if you count Frisian.

Cool. Then maybe I will be able to use my scant knowledge of German in Holland too.

(after acquiring the knowledge, of course)

If you know some English and German, you will be able to understand some Dutch.

Though not enough to have a conversation or read a newspaper.

> Een lamp geeft licht.

@Færd No, not strictly, hence the emoticon. However it's an often proffered explanation as to why inside jokes aren't gotten. Here's some example text.

Can you guess what this means?

@Cerberus A lamp gives light?

Ding!

Yay!

> Jij leest al goed Nederlands.

You read Dutch well?

Ding again!

Are you joking me?

Except that you haven't translated al.

Hint: in older Dutch, I might have written alreeds.

Mmm...

Which resembles...

already?

Ding!

You're such a trip Cerb! Thanks.

Realizes that 'trip' is not what he meant to say

Sorry. You're such a good teacher. :)

Haha.

A trip, as in an LSD trip?

I'm afraid Persian would be rather more difficult for me.

If only for the alphabet.

It's not that bad a word though:

At least Greek letters resemble the Latin alphabet quite a lot.

> An exciting or stimulating experience

And that LSD thing you said.

@Cerberus I don't know. I never had the chance to teach Persian to someone.

The alphabet is almost completely the same as Arabic alphabet.

I know.

It's always written attached, isn't it?

And each one has two or more forms, so yes, probably the alphabet is not the easiest part.

@Cerberus They can be written attached or separated, with different forms.

Oh, OK.

But it's probably written attached in print, normally?

The letters in each word are kinda attached, and between adjacent words separated.

So the letters in a word are interconnected, and words are separated from each other.

And there are exceptions too. :)

Enjoyed our conversation Cerb. It's past my bedtime.

Good local time, and bye.

So like European handwriting.

Which is harder to read that unattached letters.

Sleep well!