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12:00 AM
Try matching filenames with bzip2 with less than 3 as in front
No variable length lookbehinds or \K in Python
 
@Dennis only extensions, not full file name
 
Sorry I meant more. But you get the point
 
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Python's re is vastly inferior to PCRE.
 
dammit, someone make a new module
 
I'm sure there is one.
 
12:03 AM
pip install python-pcre
 
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Huh?
 
There is a new module, and it's been at least 4 years in the making from memory
 
re is best because 2 byte name
 
It's weird in many ways though. Starting with re.match only matching prefixes.
 
12:23 AM
@Dennis the regex only matches file extensions, it should match the full file name
@DestructibleWatermelon import regex as re
very, VERY fun video. ^^
Just animation of maps, year by year. Very fun.
 
Mentioning how it's relevant to our interests may be more useful than advertising it with "VERY fun video"
 
@trichoplax ok den
It inspires discovery about interesting patterns.
Interesting things you never heard of.
Puts things into context.
Kurzgesagt: youtube.com/user/Kurzgesagt. Good and interesting science videos with memes. Hired by the EU, UN, Audi, and Siemens to make videos.
3 mil subscribers
 
12:41 AM
Sounds interesting :)
 
@trichoplax which?
 
> discovery about interesting patterns
> Puts things into context
 
Just out of dumb curiosity I took a peek at 4chan's /sci/. Big mistake.
 
@trichoplax :D
 
@quartata Why would looking at 4Chan ever be a good idea?
 
12:49 AM
Do you guys watch CGP Grey?
 
yes
 
What about Extra Credits?
 
capslock.............
@Qwerp-Derp never heard of em
 
@DJMcMayhem I browse /tg/ (traditional games) and /ck/ (food) occasionally and aside from the typical reddit/4chan name-calling shit they're not that bad. This was far worse than what I was expecting though
 
Search it up on Youtube
 
12:55 AM
This would get me called an idiot on both 4chan and reddit but I actually don't see a whole lot of difference between the culture of the two. Reddit is just more tame usually because the off topic stuff is spread out across a lot of related subreddits while 4chan only has one board for a thing
 
@quartata Oh, OK. My only experience with 4chan is /b/ because of morbid curiosity.
And poor decisions
 
/b/ and /pol/ were literally designed so that the trolls had a place to go.
 
And /s4s/ iirc
 
You're not supposed to go there you're just supposed to be happy that the bad people are far away from your thread
 
Wait, so what is traditional games about?
 
12:59 AM
DND mostly.
 
Ah, OK.
 
@Qwerp-Derp kurzgesagt is like cgp grey but quirkier
 
Probably wouldn't interest me because my one experience with DND was terrible
 
Uh-oh. What happened?
If it was traumatic you don't have to say anything I understand
 
Haha, no not traumatic
They were potheads (which I did not know going into it)
 
1:02 AM
Yikes. OK.
 
They "played" (goofed off and smoked) for like 3 hours and the game went literally nowhere
 
That probably made for a pretty strange game
 
FWIW pot is legal here, but still not the kind of people I'd hang out with
 
@DJMcMayhem where do you live?
 
Colorado
 
1:05 AM
oh
 
The "mile high state" lol
 
only pans are allowed where I live
@DJMcMayhem I'm USA too
 
@DJMcMayhem figuratively ;)
 
@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC I feel dumb asking this, but what do you mean "pans"?
 
@DJMcMayhem pot legal, pan legal?
@DJMcMayhem is technically an adult.
 
1:08 AM
Oh my gosh, I can't believe how far over my head that was. Woosh
 
It's OK it took me a few seconds too.
 
1:20 AM
@DJMcMayhem pls halp :%s|foo|bar|g not working
oh
ik why it bork but idk how to fix
 
@Downgoat \|
No wait nvmd
 
stil bork
 
Where's the slash?
 
slash?
I wanna do like equivilent of sed 's|foo|bar|g'
meaning no regex, just plain text
 
So you want to remove all Foo or bar?
 
1:26 AM
i wanna replace all foo with bar
 
:%s/foo/bar/g
 
DJ beat me to it
 
And :h :s
 
@DJMcMayhem I hav enabled magic however
 
Shouldn't matter. Just escape what you need to
 
1:27 AM
anyway, regarding a hello world in seed, has anyone tried anything besides brute forcing it?
 
;_; exactly, i dont wanna have to escape huge string
 
Just add \M then
 
ok thanks
 
@Zwei I answered that a couple days ago. No explanation as of yet
 
oh
 
1:30 AM
I should be able to golf off a couple thousand bytes
 
that makes me think you used the same thing I'm just about to investigate
 
Which thing?
 
Random number generators are functions that are secretly pure, right?
er
I'm having a hard time mapping this to words
 
does anyone want to play minecraft?
 
I think that the random string is generated in several "chunks". That is, the output of the mersenne twister algo each time it is run includes a chunk of characters (output) and a "generator" that acts for the seed of the next chunk
 
1:40 AM
Zwei: Generally, a pseudorandom number generator just generates output that "appears random". PRNG's do tend to generate numbers based on a stored state, and some function. Not sure what you mean by "secretly pure"...
 
I really don't want us to get a site design for a while
 
the pure thing was I don't know
 
But let's say I have a PRNG. I could use that to encrypt a message--simply generate numbers using the PRNG, and xor it to a message. This may or may not be a hard to crack encryption scheme, depending on the PRNG. Roughly if it is, this is a "cryptographically secure PRNG" or CSPRNG. If not, it's not.
 
I don't think mersenne twister is cryptographically secure
 
Certainly not.
 
1:42 AM
otherwise I assume whatever you did to get this hello world would not have worked
 
Right; my point being not all PRNG's are CSPRNG's
 
anyways, I think the idea is to go from last character to first character
find a seed that generates the last character you want, then find a seed that generates that seed/character combination, and repeat until you get to the front of the string
how far off am I, feersum?
 
Very.
 
oh ok
 
2:13 AM
@trichoplax Meta post finally posted.
 
sorry, my internet just went down for half an hour
I assume that the method I posted either relies on incorrect assumptions about mersenne twiser or would be just as hard as trivial brute-force?
I'm really interested in how you pulled this off
 
2:32 AM
I'm considering putting a bounty for making any Turtlèd answer, or maybe one I can't beat by a certain margin or something
But I like my rep so much...
Hi @DJMcMayhem!
 
for what challenge?
 
Any
@DJMcMayhem is probably going to get it at this rate
Well, for any non-trivial challenge anyway
 
ah
 
I'm going to say that as long as it is of reasonable size, not too low because of an inappropriate challenge, or too large because they weren't even trying, and not obviously the result of a bitfuck to Turtlèd translator someone made, I will award 50 rep
 
2:40 AM
would reverse a string work?
 
also if it isn't a copy or modification of my answer
@DJMcMayhem are you actually in chat?
I want to know how you are going with Turtlèd
 
1
Q: Proposal to lock the Language Showcase as historically significant

PhiNotPiI recently revisited the following classic challenge: Showcase your language one vote at a time. The gist of the challenge is as follows: An answer is a set of program snippets, each with a unique length. The maximum length and maximum number of snippets are given by the answer's current vote ...

 
@DestructibleWatermelon I'll take you up on that
 
I'm confused as to how strings work
 
2:46 AM
please include some documentation next time :P
 
The readme gives me something to work with, but hardly anything
 
@DestructibleWatermelon I can't do it right now, but I was still planning on it.
I haven't worked on it yet
 
I think my answer on showcase your language might have helped, but I deleted it
 
@ConorO'Brien ok the dynamic STL items stuff is on leading branch so you can get the new changes using git fetch origin && git rebase origin/develop -X theirs
then you'll be able to use them the way I described earlier
 
the what items
 
2:49 AM
the this thing:
# printGoat
func main() {
    print "goat"
}
dynamic STL stuff is only setup for strings & array rn
 
oic
@DestructibleWatermelon is turte`d on TIO?
 
@Downgoat STL == stdlib?
 
yea
 
coolio
 
2:54 AM
@Dennis Can you update cheddar on TIO? (npm i -g cheddar-lang)
 
0
A: Trick or Treat polyglot

Conor O'Brienreticular + Turtlèd "trick"oll"eat"; Try reticular online! Try Turtlèd online! reticular explanation: "trick"oll"eat"; "trick" push the string "trick" to the stack o output it l push length of stack (0) l push length of stack (1) ...

@DestructibleWatermelon
 
To be honest seems semi trivial
 
@Downgoat Done.
 
thank you! :)
 
given the fact you annotated ; with something...
 
2:59 AM
:O I think I might be able to write STDLIB class for cheddar in cheddar
this is so exciting :D
 
Fairly sure @DJMcMayhem could have done that, but was probably actually going to post to something less trivial
 
@DestructibleWatermelon I'm not claiming the bounty, I agree--it's decently trivial. I thought you might wish to see it, is all.
 
ok then
thanks
 
3:14 AM
@DestructibleWatermelon how does one check for end of input?
 
the J essay on brevity has many quotes that could also be considered fit for code-golf
 
@quartata also, sorry that I couldn't help you finish your contract. I was at a haunted trail thingy
 
"Good things, when short, are twice as good"
 
@miles whoa, I had no idea this existed
 
"I strive to be brief, and I become obscure."
that one fits so many of the code-page golflangs
 
3:20 AM
CMC: What does puts(){printf("trick");}main(){printf("treat\n");} print in C?
 
@LuisMendo I was looking over the "Functions arising by coin flipping" paper, and realized that, in the case of finite events, matrices are really useful in describing the relationship between the coefficients of the target polynomial and the coefficients of the coin-flipping polynomial.
 
C:\Users\Conor O'Brien\Documents\Programming\J\essays
λ type test.c&gcc test.c 2>nul&a
puts(){printf("trick");}main(){printf("treat\n");}
trick
 
Running the program is cheating. :P
 
whoa do you have a mirror of the J site locally or are you just extracting snippets into your documents
 
3:24 AM
I thought you were trying to get us to do it because you didn't want to compile C
 
No, I just wrote an answer for the trick or treat challenge with a neat and rather obscure (imo, anyway) to generate different output.
 
@ConorO'Brien _
 
@Mego remember when we were talking about marching band screwing up your body?
 
@miles have you seen that googol challenge? I've been thinking about doing it in J, but I don't know if there's a way to avoid using an explicit verb to use for.. Thoughts?
 
I'm in the hospital rn with a collapsed lung and a tube in my chest :/
 
3:29 AM
@Maltysen Jeez. From marching band?!
 
here is how it works. You have string var, #Foo#, and string pointer. if the pointer points to the very last char of string var, the char var, initially *, set with @ Will be written to the current cell. Otherwise, a space will be writetn
 
@Maltysen I hope you recover quickly, incidentally.
 
@El'endiaStarman yeah, guess I blew too hard
 
0
Q: I Don't Have Enough Reputation to Comment

nedla2004I am not very good at golfing by myself, but once in a while, I dome across something small that I notice that could help. These are typically tricks I have found while looking at tips. Some users would not think of these, as some are very strange. I would like to comment, but I do not have 50 re...

 
@LuisMendo For example, let's say that you wanted to create the function x - x^2 + x^4, then the relevant coin-flipping polynomial is 0*x^0*(1-x)^4 + 1*x^1*(1-x)^3 + 2*x^2*(1-x)^2 + 1*x^3*(1-x)^1 + 1*x^4*(1-x)^0. This is given by the following matrix multiplication:
1 0 0 0 0      0     0
4 1 0 0 0      1     1
6 3 1 0 0  *  -1  =  2
4 3 2 1 0      0     1
1 1 1 1 1      1     1
 
3:35 AM
Any new fun challenges I can try to get my most off the pain?
 
there's that googol challenge
 
@ConorO'Brien but someone already did pyth
I left a comment on the pyth answer
 
@Dennis thanks for deleting that old question
 
np
You could have deleted it yourself though.
 
it didn't allow me to
 
3:40 AM
And so the question becomes: how large do we have to make the Pascal-triangle-matrix so that the result is valid for the given size.
 
@miles Because it had an answer with a positive score. But since that was your post as well...
 
oh I had to delete both? I didn't know
 
I have a lizard on my shoulder
 
@PhiNotPi Does that work in general? Take example 4.4 in the paper, i.e. target polynomial 1−8x+20x^2−13x^3. That one requires a coin-flipping polynomial of degree 46
 
Yeah, it's a security measure so that question authors can't delete other users' answers, causing them to lose reputation.
 
3:45 AM
@LuisMendo I should be more clear in that the size of the matrix could be bigger than the degree of the polynomial.
 
@ConorO'Brien maybe iteration $>([:<@;10&#)^:2<10#'a' where the power just changes from 2 to 99 and it represents the number of zeros + 1
actually the golf of that is 100(10&#])'a' so 13 bytes maybe
 
but there's memory requirements--4GB in use at max
 
oh then there's no way without being explicit
actually maybe echo might work
 
hm, okay
thanks
 
@HelkaHomba: Flying over an explosion does give you a kick, but it won't really help you extend your range.
 
3:57 AM
@LuisMendo I think I found something interesting... give me a second.
...or a lot longer
 
:D Cheddar operator overloading works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This + Custom Ops = Awesome
 
@ConorO'Brien a script with ([echo)^:10^:100]0 will output 10^100 lines each containing 0
 
wow cheddar is getting places
 
1 0 0 0      0     0
3 1 0 0  *   1  =  1
3 2 1 0     -3    -1
1 1 1 1      3     1
start by considering this example...
 
@PhiNotPi Finding the coin-flipping polynomial from the targer polynomial is an open problem. It would be an interesting discovery
 
4:09 AM
(since it's the first one I could actually attempt to work out by hand)
 
wow I think my strategy works
So now we have [0 1 -1 1] as the coefficients, but these are obviously invalid for size 4.
So, we apply 1 round of "Pascalization" (operating by the same rules as the Pascal triangle) to get [0 1 0 0 1] which is valid for size 5.
0*x^0*(1-x)^4 + 1*x^1*(1-x)^3 + 0*x^2*(1-x)^2 + 0*x^3*(1-x)^1 + 1*x^4*(1-x)^0 == x - 3*x^2 + 3*x^3 it works
 
But this can't work for all polynomials? Some polynomials don't have a coin-flipping polynomial (i.e. are not realizable as the probability of a finite coin-flipping event)
 
(oops, by "size 4" I mean 3 coin flips and "size 5" 4 coin flips, off by one error)
That's the thing... by repeatedly applying Pascal, you can get higher-and-higher degrees, but there's no guarantee that it will ever become valid.
 
Ah, I see
 
4:16 AM
@HelkaHomba: I just managed to fly through the tunnel and then fly back to its entry point without landing or cheating.
 
And, in many cases it is clear that it will never become valid (because there's enough negative numbers that they never die out). But in other cases (I believe in exactly the cases in which a solution exists), eventually a valid state will be reached.
 
@El'endiaStarman If you can hit yourself with an arrow or snowball while flying you might stay up
 
@HelkaHomba Oooh, indeed!
 
I think I saw a macro-glitch thing of that
 
Hi. How can I join the minecraft server?
 
4:23 AM
@DestructibleWatermelon Just log on. IP is helkahomba.mcserver.ws
 
cool!
I'll be there in a minute
 
The polynomial 1−8x+20x^2−13x^3 gives a matrix multiplication result of [1 -5 7 0]
 
@PhiNotPi That's interesting, in connection with the open problem (well, I think it's still open) mentioned on page 21, right before the ackonolwegments
 
I assume (I would like to test it, but I can't by hand) that after 40-something applications of Pascal, [1 -5 7 0] will become a valid state.
 
I'm just gonna change my MC username
 
4:26 AM
> Example 4.4 raises the question how large the coin flipping degree of a polynomial can be, in terms of the degree.
That one, right?
 
@PhiNotPi Yes, and
> This shows that it must be possible to give a bound on the coin flipping degree of a polynomial in terms of its degree
@PhiNotPi How does each Pascalization increase degree?
 
wait how do I change my username...
 
@LuisMendo The vectors gets 1 element longer, which represents the coefficients of the correspondingly-sized coin-flipping polynomial.
 
I mean, here the vector is not 1 element longer
6 mins ago, by PhiNotPi
The polynomial 1−8x+20x^2−13x^3 gives a matrix multiplication result of [1 -5 7 0]
 
don't tell me I can't play online because I changed my name...
fucking hell minecraft
well... looks like I can't play
 
4:33 AM
Here's the steps of my "algorithm:" (1) take the polynomial 1-8x+20x^2-13x^3 and represent it as [1 -8 20 -13]. (2) multiply it by the corresponding 4x4 pascal-triangle-matrix. (3) Take the result [1 -5 7 0] and apply pascalization until it is valid (which may never happen).
 
@miles Good one :-) The original is in Spanish: "Lo bueno, si breve, dos veces bueno". Literally: "Good, if brief, twice (as) good"
 
Bloody hell
 
1 0 0 0
3 1 0 0
3 2 1 0
1 1 1 1
That is the corresponding 4x4 pascal matrix.
 
Yes, that gives [1 -5 7 0]
 
ok now minecraft is working
 
4:35 AM
So next you add a final 0 to that vector and increase the matrix size?
 
No.... let me try a more worked-out example.
Polynomial is x - 3*x^2 + 3*x^3 AKA [0 1 -3 3]
1 0 0 0      0     0
3 1 0 0  *   1  =  1
3 2 1 0     -3    -1
1 1 1 1      3     1
then we take [0 1 -1 1] and can transform it like so: [0 0+1 1+-1 -1+1 1] = [0 1 0 0 1]
that is the other type of pascalization I'm talking about.
you treat it like a row of the triangle and compute the next rows
 
I see. Convolution with [1 1] (add a 1-shifted version of the vector to itself)
That's how you increase degree
And then multiply by the next matrix, right?
 
no... only 1 matrix multiplication, at the start
 
Ah. So from [0 1 0 0 1], if necessary, how would you go on?
 
[0 1 0 0 1] -> [0 1 1 0 1 1] convolution again
 
4:40 AM
So one matrix multiplication and then repeated convolution
 
yes
 
That's easy to program, to see for example if the computation for [1 -8 20 -13] finishes at degree 46
Off to sleep now. Talk to you later!
 
Bye!
I'm surprised that I've made any progress with this problem.
 
:-)
 
4:57 AM
@LuisMendo thanks I didn't know it was originally in Spanish
 
Oh, so J's source code is concise. Got it.
 
5:20 AM
@PhiNotPi Can I see this paper? This is fascinating but I'm quite lost :D
 
Thank you very much :D
 
Anonymous
@Maltysen That blows. Hope you get better soon!
 
5:35 AM
I don't even understand how someone can begin to contribute to J with their source code
 
6:14 AM
Yeah, my initial idea was to implement Jelly in C, building on J. One brief look at the source code gave me a better idea.
5
 
6:43 AM
Better than CSS. It's OSS, you can brag about being OSS, but no one can read.
 
 
1 hour later…
I kinda want to make an extension of Oasis
IDK what to call it though
 
maybe Oases?
 
:(
TBH, I don't even know if it's going to be an extension
It's just going to be a lang that works on sequences
And it's more powerful than Oasis (probably)
a(n)->1,1
      (n-1)+(n-2)
a(10)
Fibonacci
Actually hang on
 
But that's bc+11 in Oasis
 
Waitaminnit I'm not done yet
Wait hang on what's the ackermann function again
 
8:03 AM
is there a challenge to make a function that generates lucas sequence functions?
 
No wait that example's bad
Hang on
A(m,n)->m=0:n+1
        n=0:A(m-1,1)
        A(m-1,A(m,n-1))
Ackermann!
@ASCII-only How do you get the n-th term of an Oasis sequence again
 
@betseg Is that your BF transpiler?
 
yup
 
Wait, so which character corresponds to which BF symbol?
 
8:15 AM
upper letter + upper letter, difference modulo 2 is 0: "-" 1: +
lower + upper 0: "." 1: ","
u + l 0: "<" 1: ">"
u+u 0: "[" 1: "]"
 
Use Java
 
:/
 
@betseg you mean lower+lower for the last one?
 
Is anyone on the MC server?
 
I'll join probably
also I am highly unamused at the lack of decent username length on minecraft
DestructiblMelon
-_-
 
8:25 AM
@DestructibleWatermelon first one is l+l sorry
 

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