RishX

@SK so you want to say allah=jehova=ishwara?

@SK that's why I asked you to read Ram Swarup who was more spiritual and personally studies Ramakrishna and Aurobindo. Elst is more interested in political/social aspect. Either way what about these incidents being absent in early talks by Ramakrishna himself?

@SK nothing negative about Ramakrishna but what about RKM??

@SK plz read this archive.org/details/Identity_201605/mode/1up?view=theater this is by Ram Swarup who had less blunt/political views than Elst. I don't think it's an issue to divide Hindus-muslims, but this issue started with RKM trying to legally seprate themselves from Hinduism even claiming their beliefs in muhammad/koran and jesus/bible.. showing how Ramakrishna practiced both religions and how they even celebrate xmas etc

@SK the practice of islam and christianity by Ramakrishna has always intrigued me, since a bigger question is if the realization of both is in line with actual beliefs of islam/christianity. If the response of this question is such by other Ramakrishna devotees too, i think i will act accordingly.

@sv. I wanted to summarise two articles in one post...maybe that's why.

@SK i beg your forgiveness if anything offended you or any other Ramakrishna devotee. My intention were never to offend anyone here. Infact one of the first questions I asked here was about Ramakrishna books recommendations only. And If I remember, it was you who replied too. Since then I have been studying Ramakrishna. If anything is wrong with my question plz tell me so I can improve it.

@SK what do you mean?

@SK internet nitpick nonsense? Do you even know who is Konoerad Elst and Ram Swarup? There's a reason former PM Atal Bihari Vajpayee called Ram Swarup "Modern Rishi". He studied Ramakrishna and other saints thoroughly. Just because this question doubts if RKM changed Ramakrishna biographies doesn't mean it's defaming Ramakrishna. Further questioning maths and organisations is done all the time here. Your vote for closing the question is more personal/emotion than logical one

@SK so? How is he defaming Ramakrishna? Both Elst and Ram Swarup respect Ramakrishna utmost. If you really bothered by this question you should answer it quoting other early bengali biographies thus proving them wrong. That's what I want. Closing a question is just because it questions a particular math while others are questioned, is not a good thing.

@SK how did it defame Ramakrishna? It's about his life sadhna. How can it be defaming?

@TheLittleNaruto that's my own question :) I even linked that here in this question.

@Vivikta i am not talking about you Vivikta Ji. It happened with my past questions too. One was closed until it was reopened. It's just that if people downvote they should also clarify why they did so I can change my question accordingly.

@Vivikta I still don't know why you consider this offtopic. It's asking about a Hindu saint's sadhna. Yes it even include other religions tag but there have been many such questions and it's clearly related to Hinduism. I guess you might have different views though.

@Vivikta why do you think there is a seperate tag for other religions then? Similarly Hindu architecture might be influenced by islamic or Hindu art by buddhist/jain. Buddhists also use Sanskrit. But I don't think those examples are needed here. Since Ramakrishna clearly preached Yato Mat Tato Path after analysing and practicing all sects including non Hindu one. So this question belongs here. Ramakrishna preached it. It's not just something he did just for sake of doing.

Whenever I ask a genuine question about Ramakrishna Mission, it gets downvoted or if some sensible people see it, it get upvoted again but people here claim it to be "off topic" for no reason at all and even close it sometimes. I think question will be no exception. But at least people should tell why they are downvoting.

@Vivikta why ? Aren't Ramakrishna and his Sadhna part of Hinduism? Just search for tag of 'Ramakrishna' there are countless questions regarding his sadhna of Tantra/Advaita etc. Also this site is not just dedicated to Hindu theology, afaik even questions about Sanskrit,Hindu architecture and art are allowed here. So it certainly belongs here :)

@Rickross ISKCON doesn't preach that non-belivers are doomed. Infact its much more a Madhava belif of eternal hell which almost resonants with abrahamic religion. ISKCON only believes that non Vaishnavas do go the deity they worship but sooner or later they will return to earth and keep doing so until they realize Sri Krishna is only Reality. I think this belief is common in Vaishnavas isn't it?

@Rickross never heard about it. Do post if it's from agamas I don't think anyone will be offended. I m really interested.

@Carmensandiego really? I never read about ISKCON claiming non-followers to be "doomed". Sure they do believe only goloka/vaikuntha is eternal those who worship other deities return to take birth again but isn't that a belief all Vaishnavas sects have?

I think this question has already been posted many times.

Anyway from what I know they consider themselves as Sanatana Dharma and other sects Shaivas,Shaktas as having different interpretation for Sanatana Dharma. It's not "proselytize" per se they belive in sankirtan in public. As for second point all Vaishnavas are some what exclusive with Madhavas being the most exclusive of them. I don't think Hinduism as a whole is inclusive or exclusive as you say. Its just how different sects beliefs are.

Also if Prabhupada really meant to connect with western audience,even then "Deva" can't be related to demigods. Further referring Shiva and Durga as "demigod" make it more confusing. Because in reality, ISKCON treats Shiva tattva almost equivalent to Vishnu tattva( curd to milk analogy). But some beginners in ISKCON who don't know this relation make blunders by insulting Shiva Himself!

This doesn't answer my question. I know that Vishnu,Rama and other avtars of Vishnu are worshipped in ISKCON temples. I want to know if one can worship them as their Ishta instead of Krishna.

@Wikash_ yes they have their own "shuddh" manu smriti where they have removed the verses which doesn't suit their philosophy. Not only Manu Smriti,they even did the same with epics and Gita.

@Ikshvaku yes.Arya samaj is perhaps the only reformist Hindu sect which openly praises "their" Manu Smriti. I think Vaishnava organizations like ISKCON and BAPS follow it too. Not really sure though.

@sv. Except arya samaj doesn't reject Manu smriti. Infact they glorify it. Though they have their own versions for scriptures like Manu Smriti and even Gita.

@Ikshvaku yep and I thought the conspiracy of lizard ppl was already dead lol

@Ikshvaku just check his bio though. He believes that kali yuga is age of lizard people/ chipkali and jesus warned again"corrupt" Brahmins and jews.

@Partha ur wlcm dear :)

@Partha Awwww..plz don't make me look so cruel...tbh if u consider purana part which contradicts the veda true and Vedas false then ur nastik..If u r a hindu or not..i m not antatyamin so i cant tell ;) its upto u to call urself Hindu like it's RKM s choice to be called Hindu or not ..

@Partha what about them?

@Partha Ask your RKM not me..But seeing ur helpless state I m melted so .. traditional Hindus believe in Vedas and only Vedas Unlike RKM who clearly claimed in the affidavit that they believe in other religions holy books as well.There you go...

@D.Chatterjee I am not maligning RKM's image.Infact it was shocking for me to read about their legal case.Also just because they follow Hindu rituals doesn't necessarily means they are Hindus i.e if they have philosophical differences with Hinduism.

@D.Chatterjee I too want to know if RKM officially consider themselves as Hindu now.No doubt their followers are majorly Hindus.But the philosophical differences they claimed are sadly some what true... That's why I wanted to know if RKM now considers themselves as Hindus or not

@Partha you were blaming me for choosing wrong answer. Pradip clearly answered my question.

@Partha you are more concerned with the second part of his answer.

@Partha Pradip answered my question in the very first part of his answer through his first hand account of swami swahananda 's statement.

@Partha Just knowing isn't sufficient. As far as I know, RKM was granted minority status thats how their schools survived in authoritarian rule. Correct me if I am wrong here. Also plz give some proof to justify your claim.

@Partha So,do you have any proof that's RKM doesn't have minority status? How can be you so sure if you don't have such "proof"?

Thanks for your answer. You clarified my doubts regarding their status.At least someone answered.. I thought the question is offensive for some extreme RKM followers so it won't be answered..

@SuryaKantaBoseChowdhury Nevermind.I asked a separate question regarding this.

@SuryaKantaBoseChowdhury this makes me wonder...RKM considers itself a Hindu organisation now?

@VivekAditya ISKCON is wrongly criticized by many including so called Hindus by birth. I just don't understand why so much hatred is thrown at ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada.

@Partha What did I say about Ramakrishna? My question was more concerned with his followers

@TheLittleNaruto true.its really saddening.

@TheLittleNaruto read this plz archive.org/stream/Identity_201605/Identity_djvu.txt

@TheLittleNaruto By the way,It is true that Ramakrishna Mission tried legally to become a separate religion from Hinduism.Its disheartening,as Ramakrishna considered himself Hindu till his last breath.

Buddha never denied Vedas in Their Original form..crap? Against Ramakrishna? i think you are confused between Ramakrishna and Ramakrishna Mission

@TheLittleNaruto so was Buddha...These distinction are drawn by fanatic followers not by saint themselves..I remember few years back RKM tried to reach legal conclusions for being separate from Hinduism..Their justification being Ramakrishna also practiced islam and christianity (which i highly doubt)