Christian Lee

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Discussion on answer by Richard U: Ho…

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Christian Lee

Aug 1, 2018 19:22

Obvious solution is to use a pseudonym. I don't know why that didn't occur to the OP himself, honestly. Everyone I know uses a pseudonym online for things as uncontroversial as a cat pictures blog. This guy is writing politics under his real name.

Discussion on answer by brhans: Boss …

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Christian Lee

Jul 22, 2017 15:48

@Kevin Precisely, my employers have all checked my passport. However, they didn't take it. HR personnel (NOT my manager!) looked at it and compared it to their records. Took 5 minutes and I was right next to them the whole time.

Discussion on question by Tango Foxtr…

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Tango Foxtrot

Jul 12, 2017 21:03

@Erik "The" US court? There are a lot more than 1 court in the US. And calling me an "extremist" doesn't make it so. I don't drive trucks into people or bomb buildings.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 11, 2017 21:58

@Erik Dragged in front of a court? The courts are stocked with leftists, too, so that's not going to happen.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 11, 2017 02:07

@HorusKol "And would HR be "leftist" if they took action against someone talking sh@t and insulting someone who enjoys hunting because their religious belief is that killing animals is wrong?" Our HR wouldn't do that. That's how their bias shows.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 22:57

I see all the leftists are getting triggered by my statement. All I'm saying is that our HR has a clear leftist bias, so they are going to take the side of the homosexual and opposite the Christian. It happens to be the right position in this case. But it won't always be.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 21:38

@BSMP Helen is also a good employee, outside of this. Taking Mark's side over hers is a leftist move, even if it's the right one in this case.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 21:37

@DavidK Thanks for your comment. As @JoeStrazzere says, something I learned only today from HR, that harassment is a different issue from discrimination. So even if it's legal to discriminate against gay employees, which it is in my state, harassment is still not legal. That is interesting, and it changes my read of the situation.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 21:36

@Magisch You must have missed the part of the OP where I wrote "Mark is a good employee with strong work ethic and integrity. That's all that matters to me as his manager" and the comment where I referred to Mark as a good employee. I have nothing against Mark. I'm not taking Helen's side at all, if I were I wouldn't even have posted here. Helen's behavior is completely unprofessional, as I wrote in the OP.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 02:23

@DevNull What "human rights" have been violated here?

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@JoeStrazzere Your document literally says "Harassment is illegal only if it is based on some protected characteristic of the employee, such as his or her age, race, national origin, sex, religion or disability." and sexual orientation is NOT a protected characteristic in my state. Thus, Helen's harassment of Mark is legal. (Not OK, not good, but legal.)

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@SJuan76 That doesn't say Harassment is illegal. It only says "In 1964, the United States Congress passed Title VII of the Civil Rights Act which prohibited discrimination at work on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin and sex" which is true, but says nothing about harassment. I already said I'm going to HR tomorrow, so that's a given. Of course our leftist HR is going to take Mark's side.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@SJuan76 "Insulting and harassing other people is also illegal" - No, it's absolutely not. In the US, it's speech, and speech is protected (freedom of speech). And I would not be OK with that, but using the N-word is legal, which is my point. My point is not that it's OK or good, but that it's legal.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@SJuan76 Beheading is illegal. It's murder. We are talking about comparatively minor discrimination, here. Please don't make over-the-top comparisons in order to push your agenda.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@RaduMurzea "How much of a "pain-in-the-ass" would it be to separate Helen and Mark and have them work on unrelated tasks" - I can't do anything about their projects for the next few months, due to the current projects that need completed. They are both highly specialized so no one can replace either of them on the current projects.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@JoeStrazzere I am not saying "her religion teaches her to insult and talk shit to others at work". SHE is saying that. And because I'm from a different denomination, I don't know hers well enough to have a theological debate and win. Not that I should have to have a theological debate with an employee to get her to behave professionally.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 01:25

@JoeStrazzere She claims her religion teaches that, and she is not "keeping your homophobic thoughts to yourself" - quite the opposite - so that's a moot point. I will talk to HR tomorrow.

The Water Cooler

General chit-chat for workplace.stackexchange.com. Feel free t...

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 23:20

@Nofel Can you get a doctor's note? You shouldn't have to, your manager sounds like a piece of work, but at least it would lay to rest his accusations of dishonesty.

Discussion on answer by jcmack: Confl…

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Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 12:38

Difference is, sports team affiliation and political affiliation are not protected classes. Religious affiliation is.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 12:38

@CaptainEmacs How do I keep religion out of it when Helen's entire argument is based on her religion?

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 12:38

@HorusKol "but what happens when someone else falls foul of her personal judgment?" - Same thing that happens when someone else starts insulting Mark in Helen's absence. We cross that bridge when we come to it.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 12:38

@Dukeling Helen is only "toxic" to Mark. If she were that "toxic" she's also harass others and she doesn't.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 10, 2017 12:38

@jcmack Helen isn't toxic to my team, only to Mark. If I got rid of Mark, it'd solve the problem just as well. That's not a good justification. Ironically, your example "Let's say in my religion I don't believe in divorce. I learn that my co-worker has been divorced before and just insult him for it." is taking place in another team (I don't manage that team, so I can't do anything there, and it's not strictly religious; but basically a newly divorced coworker is being harassed about his divorce and it's awful).

Discussion between Erik and Tango Fox…

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Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 22:06

Thanks for moving to chat, Erik.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 22:06

And I'm sorry but if you have Christ in your name, you were named by Christian parents. I am a Christian myself and I've literally never heard of a non-Christian naming their children after Christ.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 22:05

OK, but parents of a certain class tend to name their child a certain way. For example, upper class educated parents whose children are also likely to be upper class and educated, are more likely to name their child Katherine, William, etc. (the examples I gave).

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

@Erik "unless you got lucky and the best candidate just HAPPENED to have the right name" Doesn't require much luck. Names are associated with characteristics for a reason. Of course I don't use this in actual hiring - at least not consciously, which is the whole point of this thread.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

@Erik Sure, they'd not be true all the time, but on average, they would bias you towards the best candidate. Not 100% of the time. But sometimes.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

@Erik There are obvious examples: Theodore, Katherine, Mary, William, which point to highly educated, classy, and professional applicant. Christopher/Christina/Christa etc. indicate the applicant is a Christian or was at least raised so (as a Christian myself, I'd guess it's on average a good thing in the US). A name can also indicate age: Dorothy is likely older than Kaylee, which can be good if you're looking for experience.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

@Erik Huh, I actually agree WRT "Wrong approach, right conclusion by luck"... Guess I just don't see the problem with the rest, though.

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

@Erik 100% of the time? What if your biases bias you towards the best candidate, just by chance?

Tango Foxtrot

Jul 9, 2017 21:57

It's silly to deny we all have unconscious biases (I can't believe people still deny that lol), but why is unconscious bias a bad thing? It's the gift of fear. Your body and mind have certain emotional and visceral reactions to certain names etc. and that can be a good warning sign against hiring certain employees. Don't ignore your biases, they can save your life!

Discussion on question by raxacoricof…

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Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Jun 4, 2017 21:23

Personally I'm very interested in such information as well and I track it for every flight take. I think it's common among "aviation enthusiast" types (similar to railfans who do this for trains). I would ask on aviation.SE btw.

Discussion on answer by anongoodnurse…

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Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Oct 27, 2016 16:36

This discussion is a bit strange and irrelevant, strange because it's readily available information that trans people can have biological children even post-transition (for instance, the famous pregnant man Thomas Beatie) and it's also irrelevant because a 14 year old is unlikely to be able to freeze sperm anyway. That's more relevant to trans adults who transition later in life.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Oct 27, 2016 16:36

My GF may come around eventually, I share that hope. So far she has rejected reading materials as "biased" and she won't even consider going to therapy. But Emily's safety is what I'm most concerned with atm. And I'm sorry, but someone who makes threats toward her own child does not need my support just as much as the child herself. Also, I mentioned legal guardianship and not legal custody because without legal guardianship I cannot take her to the oft-recommended therapy, especially sincr she has seemed depressed to me for quite a while...

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Oct 27, 2016 16:36

However, overall I agree with the other commenters. If she were merely unaccepting, had concerns about the family line, was worried about discrimination Emily might face, etc, I would completely understand. I agree 5 days is not a long time and she might eventually come around. But this is not "Periods of denial, anger, bargaining, and depression". She has gone so far as to call her own child a "degenerate" and threaten to send her to an abusive camp or disown her. This is a threat to Emily's physical safety at the least.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Oct 27, 2016 16:36

Yes, she was expecting blowback. I do give her a lot of credit for her strength and courage, and her overall maturity and levelheadedness, sorry if I didn't make that clear. I think she is a great kid tbh

Discussion on answer by coteyr: My gi…

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Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

OK, "stable and adjusted" is not the same as "He needs to accept that he is a he." TBH I'm having a hard time understanding what you're actually saying, every time I ask for a clarification I'm just more confused. Lol. So I'm going to have to leave it here.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

@coteyr, Sorry to keep posting. Every time I read your post I'm a little more confused. For instance, Emily already knows this all too well - "Try to emphasis that this undertaking is a long and hard process that will take several decades. It's not an afternoon under the knife and some pills." I don't need to emphasize that to her, instead, she is emphasizing it to me.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

@coteyr Gotcha, that's a completely different interpretation than what I was thinking! // Can I ask what the "job" is in this sentence? "Explain that until the "job is done", he is still a boy." I'm sure you're not referring to surgery still. // Btw, no counselor is going to tell a trans child that "He needs to accept that he is a he." I know a number of counselors through my religious community and I can assure you any of them would not say anything like this. IDK what counselors you know...

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

@coteyr I need her mom's consent to get her into therapy, though. You yourself noted I have no legal status. I do agree my GF could have those misconceptions though. I just thought you were accusing me of suggesting surgery, etc.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

Also, coteyr: My girlfriend isn't religious so this has nothing to do with God. I'm the religious one in the relationship. (This religious conflict is the reason we haven't gotten married...but that's another post.) And to be honest, if Emily asked me, I would adopt her in a heartbeat. But I don't want to seem like I'm forcing it on her by suggesting it to her. I rather she bring it up. // "but if the mom want to send her to some "horrible camp" then you should go pick up brochures." -- You're asking me to aid in child abuse, and I can't do that.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

@IMSoP Thanks that's a great point, approaching it with basically name/pronouns/clothing/accessories is a good start..

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 30, 2016 10:05

coteyr: Heh, up until about 4 years ago I would have been much less "liberal" than you are. ;) Yes, it's her mother's call whether or not she is able to go to therapy or to the doctor. I don't have any legal say. However, this - "To the mother, the son is talking about self mutilation, destroying their body, causing massive self harm, and going down a path that will make them an "outsider" in almost every situation. And you, her boyfriend, are coming off like, "sure let me go find a chain saw and we'll get started". - is a gross misrepresentation as no one is thinking about surgery.

Discussion on question by Charlie: My…

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Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 28, 2016 21:27

@Jeff Y Right, I'm not married to Emily's mother, but we still refer to each other as step-parent/step-child. It's a social term, not a legal one. I didn't know it was illegal or legally precarious to date a single parent. If so, that's alarming. I'll consult with an attorney...

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 28, 2016 21:27

@the_lotus No, I never heard of a cisgender boy bawling his eyes out over getting a haircut or not being allowed to wear a watch. As I said, I don't deny it can be a rebellion or a phase. That's up to her future therapist though, not y'all armchair therapists

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 28, 2016 21:27

@the_lotus I was not surprised at all tbh. I left out the signs I'd noticed for the sake of brevity. But she would cry and sink into despair over "little things" like my GF forcing her to get haircuts and wear overtly masculine clothing, not letting her wear any jewelry (even the types of watches or chains common for men - which I wear!). I don't deny it can be a rebellion (common even among families with no "problems") or a phase, although I have no reason to think that. But that's why Emily will be going to therapy anyway.

Elliott Tango Foxtrot

Sep 28, 2016 21:27

Understood. Afaik, all the clinics for trans people in our area work with mental health professionals and won't allow adult or teen patients to transition without counseling before and during transition. She will definitely have counseling. Plus, she's talking about T blockers, which are reversible unlike HRT.